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Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 9:49pm On Feb 05, 2016

mzilakazi:
That notion exist only in your own crazy mind. South Africa has the largest and biggest defence industry. Why can't you just accept the truth for once?

The truth is :

Egypt has the largest sized defense industry in Africa

South Africa has the largest defense products export sales

Nigeria has the largest shipyard in Africa
.

1 Like

Foreign Affairs › Re: African Militaries/ Security Services Strictly Photos Only And Videos Thread by agaugust: 5:28pm On Feb 05, 2016

africaken:
what is going on in somalia !

Al-Shabab retakes key Somalia port city of Merca

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-35502016

I raised lots of issues and suggestions here about Somalia, AU, and AMISOM in the last 30 days, but nobody took me seriously. Now it's one setback or loss after the other for our side in this war. Anyway I have decided to keep quiet about Somalia war and mind my own business. I am safe in my house and winter snow is funtime with snowmobile speed machines.

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 4:58pm On Feb 05, 2016

Henry240:
Patches, do you guys in South-Africa even know what an IPV is at all?

This was what heitman was complaining about months back. Your Navy ends up buying boats which cannot go offshore to sea and simply cannot patrol inshore. More or less a waste and a Turkey.

The average length of an IPV is 25m. Look at the shadlags, NNS Dorina, Andoni class, Burutu. Class, Ocea class. All designed to effectively carry out littoral warfare.

Fools have taken over South African navy, incompetent Zulus-Xhosas-Bantus-Cape Colony Coloreds, a total combination of born fools.

The aparthied whiteman era navy purchased 22m T-Craft as IPV, the Zulus want to purchase 50m to 60m IPV.....LOL 60m is almost a corvette, LOL the slow speed will make pirates twin engined speed boats to outrun their navy boats...a LOL 60m will run aground to sea bed patrolling shallow coastal waters as inshore, he even said the IPV will be dragging undership towed array sonar around shallow waters, that one will get hooked to shallow seabed mud and sea weed !!!

Mad people all over South Africa !!!

Patchesagain:
More or less an MPV with IPV characteristics.

Officially according to South African navy, your current IPV is T-Craft 22m speed boats.

Project Biro plan of 50m is an MPV technically. An IPV needs small size, super speed. Helmod Heittman your defence expert says the 50m-60m boats are a bad choice of size for IPV role. Why won't your navy make mistakes in procurement when your past and current navy chiefs of staff were declared not to be qualified sailors, why won't they buy the wrong boats? grin

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Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 4:52pm On Feb 05, 2016*

Patchesagain:
Little speed boats like the Shaldag are useless in our vast and rough waters!

So why does your navy sail around the sea in so many little speed boats? 3 units of 22m T-Crafts classified as SAN IPVs and 26 units of 10m Namacurra classified as patrol boats that are all even smaller in size than Nigerian Shaldags? So your navy bought about 30 USELESS speed boats?

Either you or your navy, one is a fool grin

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Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 10:02pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
Egypt builds abrams tanks?

Yes

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 10:01pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
IPV to be a minimum length of 50m armed with 30mm cannon
http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=6141:navy-needs-survey-ship-pvs-by-2015-&catid=51:Sea&Itemid=106

Towed sonar array tested for Biro as well as VTOL drone testing has been well documented in this thread and the other one.

Why would we come to you to look at speed boats?

...because you have none, or you have Shaldag interceptor class of boats?

Your source says OPV and IPV, no MPV, means the 50m vessel is actually an MPV, almost a small corvette size, tbat's not an IPV by standard classification even NATO countries use 47m as MPV not IPV.

VTOL craft? You never even got any OPV yet ! The drone will land on empty sea water?

Towed array sonar, for what? There is NOTHING like that in the source you posted, SHOW US SOURCE for your never-to-arrive 23 years on paper OPV and IPV having anti-submarine towed array sonar, show us sources to prove that !

I am waiting for your towed array sonar evidence.....now !!!!!

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 9:11pm On Feb 04, 2016*

Patchesagain:
8 vessels equals half the fleet

Project Biro was not set into motion by them... or else we would have got them in 1998

Where did Heitman say we have no money? Does Heitman work for the Navy or Treasury?

NNS Okpabana is obsolete in every sense of the term

Half our fleet is obsolete because it is old, and is being replaced.

Do you want me to list the obsolete vessels of your fleet? ok!

NNS Aradu (F89) -obsolete
NNS Thunder (F90) -obsolete
NNS Andoni (P100) -obsolete
NNS Ekpe (P178) -obsolete
NNS Damisa (P179) -obsolete
NNS Agu (P180) -obsolete
NNS Siri (P181) -obsolete
NNS Ayam (P182) -obsolete
NNS Ekun (P183) -obsolete
NNS Burutu (P174) -obsolete
NNS Zaria (P173) -obsolete
NNS Kyanwa (A 501) -obsolete
NNS Ologbo (A 502) -obsolete
NNS Nwamba (A 503) -obsolete
NNS Obula (A 504) -obsolete
NNS Ohue (M371) -obsolete
NNS Barama (M372) -obsolete
NNS Ambe (LST1312) -obsolete

henry, why is 90% of your fleet obsolete? Why is 50% of that non-operational?

You posted old fleet. We have a huge brand new fleet.

● NNS Centenary brand new stealth

● NNS Unity brand new stealth, delivery 2016

● NNS Zaria brand new stealth

● NNS Burutu brand new stealth

● NNS Dorina brand new

● NNS Andoni I brand new

● NNS Andoni II brand new, delivery 2016

● 1 Survey ship, construction starts 2016

● 1 Landing Ship Tank, construction starts 2016

● 9 Shaldag Interceptors, brand new

● 6 OCEA FAB, brand new

● 60 X-38 Stealth combat catamarans, brand new

● 300 IPVs and amphibious landing crafts, brand new purchased year 2006-2012

● 100 IPVs all brand new purchased 2016 Jan-Feb-Mar.

Even NATO envies the size of our new fleet....and Indian navy cannot resist signing the long term joint maritime patrol operations with Nigerian navy, they cannot find any other navy like that in Africa.

Please remind your SAN sailors not to overstay their one week visiting visa to India, tbey do not want you there more than those few days after which South African navy becomes useless to them. Don't follow Nigerian navy men around in India, we are staying long term, our level is higher than yours.
.

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Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 8:54pm On Feb 04, 2016

jln115:
LinkZA,Chaka C2,Valours,Heroines,Badger,Umkhonto,A-Darter,Gripen,Hawk,Rooivalk,Rooikat,G6,G5,Batuluer,Seeker400,EW suits ect ect ect

Largest Defence industry in Africa, and one of the Largest in the world.

Egypt has the largest and heaviest defence industry in Africa, they produce thousands of Abrams tanks, thousands of missiles and artillery, they also produce vehicle and aircraft engines, and tens of thousands of heavy calibre munitions like howitzer and mortar shells, tens of thiusands.

South Africa is overhyped.

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 8:08pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
Cubans are cheaper than private sector

About a total of 2 billiion Rands to be paid by SANDF to the team of 100 mechanics from tiny Cuba that teaches your army engineers how to repair vehicles your overhyped South African defence industry built inside your own backyard !!! Shame !!!

100 Cuban mechanics X 360,000 Rands X 3 years...add free house, free transport, free mobile phones = about 2 billion Rands total project cost of Cuban mechanics team.

Show me a Zulu mechanic that earns that much in his life time !!!!!

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 7:56pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
lol, maybe in Nigeria an IPV is a speed boat

Not in RSA - ours will be 50-60m with a 30mm cannon, VTOL-UAV's and dragged sonar array... you got anything like that?

No?

Ok

60m IPV ? Even the great Shaldag Ocean Interceptor is abiut 24m only ? When standard MPVs measure about 40m ? IPV with towed array sonar that ASW Frigates struggle to carry ? Are you cräzy ?

Okay SAN has not bought IPV in 30 years so you need to travel to Nigeria to see what a standard IPV looks like.

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Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 6:28pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
So thats what you are going to do?

You called me a liar

When I told you the info had been posted again you called me a liar again

When you realized I had posted it before you quickly changed topics.

Apologize faggit

For what? I proved you wrong.

You are a known liar all over Nairaland

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 6:26pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
Why did SAAB buy Grintek? For fun?

To export more into your market like they sold Gripen to you and make money from you by overpriced stuff

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 6:23pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
Nigeria bough 100 speed boats

India bypassed us? Really? So is that why we are on our way to India and China for exercises and you are not?

IPVs are usually like speed boats dummy, or you use Frigate as IPV for inshore shallow waters patrol? Fool.

Nigeria bought 100 IPVs in 3 months , South Africa is still seeking to buy 3 IPVs in 23 years grin

India signed a long term joint operation deal with Nigerian navy, but for you, they gave 1 week visiting visas grin

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 6:19pm On Feb 04, 2016

Henry240:
Inside NNS Okpabana

Bang ! Super !

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 6:13pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
Project Biro seeks 3 IPV's and 3 OPV's as well as 1 Survey vessel.

Nigeria is buying 1 new Survey vessel and building 1 news Landing Ship 2016.

Nigeria just bought brand new 100 IPVs in 3 months of 2016, Jan-Feb-Mar 2016....you have not bought 3 IPVs after 23 years of struggle on project Biro....your navy is dead, that is why India bypassed you to sign maritime security working deal with Nigeria.

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 6:08pm On Feb 04, 2016*

Thiza:
SOUTH AFRICAN PRIVATE MILITARY COMPANIES

THALES
COMPANY PROFILE
AMD is the Aerospace, Maritime and Defence Industries Association of South Africa. Its primary objectives are the representation of the industry in matters of mutual interest, and the promotion of a profitable, sustainable and responsible industry. The association is acknowledged as the only trade association of South Africa's defence industry (SADI), and is mandated by its members to promote and champion the collective interests of the industry. It comprises a cluster of leading companies in the South African private and public sector that supply defence materiel, products and services.
http://www.google.co.za/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjQv9e11N3KAhUH6xoKHdLhCKUQFggaMAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.amd.org.za%2Fdirectory%2Fcompany%2F69%2FThales_South_Africa_Systems_(Pty)_Ltd.jma&usg=AFQjCNFaTxjv3DvBC4R5hlkrwBIjvSHP5w

ZEBRA ARMOUR

COMPANY PROFILE
South Africa has a first world infrastructure with skilled labor and high quality suppliers of raw materials used in the ballistic and body armour industry.The directors of the company have over 20 years of experience in the body armour business. Our strength lies in the engineering and development of efficient production processes resulting in highest quality products at very competitive prices. Due to our investment into high-Tec plant and the expertise of our research team, our weight /performance ratios beat other manufacturers.

http://www.google.co.za/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwj1mpie1d3KAhUBUhoKHd2SBwAQFggcMAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.zebraarmour.com%2F&usg=AFQjCNEwVth5ffHaj61SkiyuOw1mhfo9cQ

Dude, THALES is an European company owned by France. They only opened branch in South Africa. They own you actually. If France withdraws the technology you import from them, THALES South Africa will collapse totally.

Your long list of SA defence industries is mostly full of those producing police batons, uniforms, kit, etc

The only strong companies are Denel, German Rheinmetall, French THALES, Swedish SAAB Grintech, British BAE, The rest are too tiny.

Meanwhile, check out Nigeria's shipyards where we make IPVs, MPVs and soon to build a Landing Ship LST !!!

I am sure you never expected such huge defence manufacturing and maintenance industry to be in Nigeria. Shock you !!!
.

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Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 5:57pm On Feb 04, 2016

Henry240:
50% of SA navy vessels obsolete

Buhaahahahahaha

CC : Patches689, Agaugust, Iblawi, Jln115

Analysis:Sliding rand has serious implications for SANDF

Written by Helmoed Heitman, Wednesday, 03 February 2016

The steady slide in the value of the Rand since 2011 holds serious implications for the Defence Force, with the dramatic slide in December serving to underscore that. That recent slide may yet be reversed in the near term, but the longer-term trend will be more difficult to reverse.
The obvious risk is to equipment projects, and that faces the Defence Force with challenges it will find difficult to overcome. Government’s foot-dragging over equipment projects since the ‘Strategic Defence Packages’ has left the Defence Force very patchily-equipped: It has some modern equipment courtesy of those packages (frigates, submarines, Gripen, Hawk, Lynx) and 1990s projects (Rooikat, G6, Rooivalk, Oryx), and the is Badger entering production, but much else is obsolescent at best (Olifant, Casspir, Mamba, Samil, C-130) or totally obsolete (Dakota).

There are also critical capability gaps: The Navy has too few ships and half are obsolete; there are no maritime patrol aircraft; and the Army lacks real air defence capability. Assuming South Africa intends to play a regional role, there are also the lack of heavy/long-range airlift, tanker aircraft and sealift to consider.

Less obvious is the challenge of more expensive spare parts, which will limit the ability to keep existing equipment operational and hamper training. Even less obvious is the indirect impact of the sliding Rand, which will hit the economy and thus government revenue and the national budget.

Unless funds are reprogrammed from under-performing ministries to defence - hardly likely - there is little likelihood of even a small increase in defence funding.

If the Rand does not recover from its present parlous state against the major currencies, there is little chance of satisfying equipment requirements, and a budget that continues to limp along just below inflation will be fatal to efforts to implement the Defence Review, even those aspects that do not involve new equipment. And failure to at least begin implementation will see a rapid decline in capability.

South African NAVY is 50% obsolete....Oh my ! This comment makes me start my weekend fun today, can't wait till Friday o !
.

1 Like

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 5:52pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
South Africa built a tank. We built a MBT

Which tank did SA build? Used by which army? In service from what year? What is the NAME of the tank ? grin

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 5:49pm On Feb 04, 2016

jln115:
Dude just shutup....Drakensberg is the largest ship ever built in Africa.

30 year old obsolete ship, big metal junk grin

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 5:33pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
been posted before

Stop wasting my time.

Nope, you NEVER posted it !

Each Cuban mechanic is paid 360,000 Rands per year plus free house, free transport, and free mobile phone, How many Zulu mechanics earn that much? Even your senior army officers earn far less than that !

100 Cuban mechanics X 360,000 Rands X 3 years...add free house, free transport, free mobile phones....Show me a Zulu mechanic tat earns that much in his life time !!!!!

SANDF is paying Cuba heavily because South African defence industry CANNOT repair it's own Samil truck product, you need Cuban help grin

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 5:13pm On Feb 04, 2016*

Patchesagain:
We use cubans because they are cheaper than local mechanics

Show us proof that foreign expatriates are cheaper than Zulus.

Each Cuban mechanic is paid 30,000 Rands per month plus free house, free transport, and free mobile phone, How many Zulu mechanics earn that much? Even your senior army officers earn far less than that !

South Africa has NO mechanics capable of repairing the SAMIL trucks, your own home made defence products grin

Show us proof that the Cubans are cheaper, show us the salary scale evidence or a source that confirms it. Liar.

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 5:09pm On Feb 04, 2016

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 5:03pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
1. So says we import all engines?

You make Rooivalk engines? Badger engine is from Finland. REVA, Casspir and other MRAP engines are from Germany....and so on !

SA defence industry is NOT self sustaining, you are as exposed to risk of war time arms embargo as any other African country grin

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 4:53pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
1. Citation for Niger dock

http://www.nigerdock.com/operations/shipyardservices

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 4:39pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
SAAB BOUGHT GRINTEK BECAUSE SAAB WANTED SOUTH AFRICAN TECHNOLOGY

Nope, liar !

According to the official website of SAAB Grintek, the company is 100% SAAB of Sweden technology imported into South Africa, they have similar branches in Australia too !!!!

"Saab AB-Sweden serves the global market with world leading products, services and solutions ranging from military defense to civil security. Saab has operations and employees on all continents and constantly develops, adopts and improves new technology to meet customer’s changing needs. Research, development and production are carried out in Sweden, South Africa and Australia.

Saab in South Africa has capabilities ranging from electronic warfare, sensor technology, command & control systems, training systems, radio communication equipment, aviation, telecommunications and support solutions."

http://www.saabgrintek.com/about.php

Glory thieves, they want to steal Sweden's technology and call it proudly made in South Africa, later you will say you built Gripen jet and you built Volvo automobiles ! Thieves of Soweto !
.

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 3:26pm On Feb 04, 2016

jln115:
SA : Most technologically advanced and Self sustainable Force in Africa.

How is SA self sustainable? You import ALL vehicle engines for your MRAPs and IFV....you also import Cuban mechanics to teach SANDF how to repair your own SAMIL trucks that you claimed to have built locally, but need white Cuban boys to teach you how to repair and maintain your own product grin

# FVCKING WRECKED

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 3:23pm On Feb 04, 2016

DieVluit:
How is this better? It's backwardness. This is basically a large, dusty shack that you are working from!

Show us the factory workspace of Denel where they make armoured vehicles, show us your own photos, foolish boy-girl

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 3:21pm On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
And yet we spend X3 that Nigeria does

You spend most of your money buying huge quantities of expensive anti-HIV drugs for your 30 battalions of half-dead HIV infected soldiers and paying fat salaries and wages to idle soldiers who fight no war, 99% of SANDF sleeps at home jobless grin

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 2:40am On Feb 04, 2016

DieVluit:
So pathetic that they haven't even thought of withdrawing it if you will work in a workspace like what I posted.

Fool, you entered Proforce factory to measure their workspace size? You just google searched and grabbed a tiny photo of 3 vehicles under production in one corner of the factory.

Show us the factory workspace of Denel where they make armoured vehicles, show us your own photos, foolish boy-girl grin

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 2:28am On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
You produce lots because they are simple machines.

Why are you telling us about tracked vehicles that were built in your country by europeans and that is no longer manufacturing??

Your Mamba APC is a simple machine too, how many units does your factory produce in a year based on installed capacity? It's a simple machine, even Ethiopia makes MRAP more complex than your Mamba.

How is a tracked 4F APC simple? It runs on battle tank heavy steel tracks not rubber tyres, and you have no steel tracks APC production factory in the whole of South Africa.

Nigerians make the 4F APC as DICON has technology trsnsfer, we stopped production because we have fulfilled the 250 units ordered by NA, if we get a new order today, we produce more, or is your own RATEL IFV fsctory still producing RATELs today? Fool !

South African defence industry CANNOT produce tracked APC, Mortar Carrier, Command Post armoured vehicles like Nigerian defence industry. We bëåt you on this one shocked

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 12:42am On Feb 04, 2016

Patchesagain:
lol - SAS Drakensburg is 12,000t

SAAB-Grintek has BEE Level 3, which is the highest BEE rating

Nope SAS Drakensberg is a 6,000 ton ship empty weight. Nigerdock builds 10,000 ton ships empty weight.

Thanks for confirming that ANC governmwnt law forced SAAB to employ unqualified blacks as directors under BEE...well SAAB remains 100% Swedish technology imported from Europe, never mind who holds shares in South Africa. Sweden owns SAAB.

Foreign Affairs › Re: Who Has The Strongest Military In Africa? by agaugust: 9:41pm On Feb 03, 2016

mzilakazi:
Nope, 100 of those companies are big and produce equipments for our private security, police and military.

http://www.amd.org.za/

Okay, should I also add Nigerian companies that produce equipment for our private security and police too? We too have them aplenty.

Show us the production factory and sales revenue of those your tiny tiny 100 companies and let us see how many of them can build a 10,000 tonne ship like Nigerdock and produce almost 500 armoured vehicles a year like Proforce !!

....and your website of South African 100 defense companies is showing SAAB on the list, so South Africa owns SAAB of Sweden ? Thief. Sweden owns their technology, you feed under their table, don't come here and claim Swedish technology as your own. Thief !
.

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