It's a welcome development judging by the fact this Imam made his initial declaration of Shia being heretic public.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1VDPMPFTb8

Empiree:
Interesting...

This is why I keep telling our Sunni brothers to take chill pill. See Saudi Imam backtracked and left you cold. If you too retract it means you have showers been blind followers...


https://www.alaraby.co.uk/english/amp/news/2019/3/25/saudi-ex-imam-of-mecca-no-longer-considers-shia-heretics#click=https:///yz2HdtzUCh

Its a welcome development judging by the fact this Imam made his initial declaration of Shia being heretic public


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1VDPMPFTb8

When sheik (Dr) Yasir Qadhi retracted on the same opinion (that Shia are heretics) years back, he was excommunicated from "salafism" and labeled with a lots of unpleasant title.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLvsQA1oaCg&t=358s

We will see how the salafi world (especially their footsoldiers in Pakistan, Nigeria) will react to their Imam' s decision. All in all, it's a welcome development. Unfortunately many lives had lost as a result of this satanic declaration of wahabi scholars that Shia are heretics.

The cleric and former imam of the Grand Mosque said despite his previous opinion on Shia scholars being apostates, he changed his mind after reading a book.


A prominent Saudi cleric has publically backtracked on his view which considered Shia Muslim scholars non-Muslims, going against a mainstream belief peddled by many clerics in the conservative kingdom.
Adel al-Kalbani, former imam of the Grand Mosque in Mecca, revealed his newly-polished views during an interview with Saudi broadcaster MBC.

The cleric said despite his previous opinion on Shia scholars being 'heretics', he changed his mind after reading a book by a former Shura Council member and a professor of Sharia at Umm al-Qura University, Hatem al-Awni, which discussed the issue of 'heresy'.

Kalbani reportedly intended to publish an article in which he announced his view of Shia scholars but failed to do so after government pressure.

"I no longer declare apostasy on those who believe in one God, eat our [halal] meat and prostrate toward our Qibla [direction of Mecca],” he said.

"This is what I owe God today - no one forced me to say anything and no one spoke to me,” he added.

The remarks comes as Riyadh continues its mission to to adopt a "moderate" state-sanctioned interpretation of Islam, with women recently being granted the right to drive.

In 2017, the kingdom said it would establish an authority to monitor interpretations of the Prophet Mohammed's teachings to prevent them being used to justify violence or terrorism.

Despite the efforts to modernise, senior Wahhabi clerics - who strongly influence the royal family - endorse execution by beheading for offences that include apostasy, adultery and sorcery. They also often describe Shia Muslims as heretics.

While activists online hailed the cleric for his newfound enlightment, many questioned whether it would be enough to fix the damage already caused by years of anti-Shia narrative that has inspired large-scale attacks against the community worldwide.

https://www.alaraby.co.uk/english/amp/news/2019/3/25/saudi-ex-imam-of-mecca-no-longer-considers-shia-heretics

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vWulcZcdDE


http://islamicpulse.tv/videos/series/dangerous-islamophobia-exposed-ben-shapiro-is-a-liar-milo-yiannopoulos-paul-joseph-watson-alex-jones-pewdiepie?fbclid=IwAR0snCl_-dU7QEX53PX1h5j5W5YjLVkQsR_IwNfGv0KyXrm2R4W0BFk7huU

spiritualmubi:
When Saƴyidah Fatimah As. enters where the prophet sits, he Rasul himself sawa stands up and sings praises for her. 2. why does Rasuul sawa mentions her among the leaders of the women of both worlds? 3.she is the root of the honorable descendants of the apostle pbuh, the wife of the best man on earth after rasuul.... I can keep going on and on and on. Your arguement seems irrational man, considering all this facts, do you still think she isnt a role model hmm. Am not even sure I did the right thing by giving you those points.

Note, the mentality of these people in the subject of taking some personalities as role model is never on "morality, righteousness and spirituality".

Empiree:
New Zealand Mosques Massacre. This is act of terrorism. The sick shooter "Brenton Tarrant" wrote a crazy manifesto and published it online.

https://www.scribd.com/document/401945007/Brenton-Tarrant-Great-Replacement-Manifesto?fbclid=IwAR1o56-AyjwYyxVJkNcI0VCFiajxdmBnjn7q2P1-2gyiqBlzA6BMPx8OLFY


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KW5ldz52pwQ

https://www.cnn.com/asia/live-news/new-zealand-christchurch-shooting-intl/index.html

Those evil media will never labeled it a terrorist attack. Wait for them until they played the "mental illness " as an excuse

ORIGIN OF LIFE

Why is it alien to some skeptics that Adam was created from "clay"? We are not giving the idea of molding clay into human form blah blah blah blah blah. Anyway, watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xyhZcEY5PCQ&t=245s

true2god:
How is Fatima a role model? What and what did she do that what emulating? Is it because her father is the prophet?

You don't learn, do you? First, you alleged we are "mourning". You were corrected of that immature thought, yet you still arrogantly want to go further in what does not concern you. Why do you people like pokenosing into matters that doesn't concern you?

What do you know about Fatima Zahra and not to mention why she was a role model for the Muslims? Obviously NOTHING; for that was what gave you the thought to think "perhaps her father was a Prophet". And what is your definition of "role model"? Why do Muslims (especially the Shia) take Bibi Fatima Zahra a role model?

true2god:
Guy, allow Fatimah to rest in peace. Which kain wahala be this? Stop mourning a woman dead over 1000 years ago who is not even in your family tree. What is wrong with African people?

Mourning? Where does that comes from? How's commemorating a great leader and role model a "mourning" in your thinking?

And must a "role model" and "religious icon" come from your family tree?

It seems to me you simply want to comment. Obviously you are either into something (irrational criticism) or you simply wanna be nuisance. Please try to be a gentleman.

AL-BARI - THE EVOLVER

Allah has said,

"He is Allah the Creator, the Evolver, the One Who bestows forms (or colors) upon what He creates. To Him belong the Attributes" (Qur’an, 59:24).

There are viewpoints regarding the explanation of "al-Bari": One says it refers to the One Who brings about something out of nothing, the One Who creates something which was never there before. It is said that Allah is al-Bari of creation, the One Who brought about all things into existence out of nonexistence.

The other meaning conveys the cutting off or severing of something. The root verb of this word means cutting and shaping something such as a twig or a pencil. One may say that illness has parted from him, or that he is free of a claim put forth by another. It can also be applied metaphorically such as one person severing his partnership with another, or a woman separating from her husband. Allah has bara'a, created or initiated, the creation without a model; bariyyah means those whom He has created. Another meaning is curing or healing.

A wise saying states that one who is cured should express gratitude to the One Who cured him. Ja`fer ibn Sulayman is quoted as having said that he passed once by a blind old woman grieving over herself and wailing, so he asked her, "What does it take to sustain you?" She answered him saying, "Stop sticking your nose where it does not belong; I have reached this stage of life without needing you or others." Then she added, "Have you not heard the statement made by the Friend of Allah who said, `[Allah] Who created me then showed me the way, and He provides me with food to eat and with water to drink, and when I am sick, He restores my health to me' (26:78-80)?"

 It is also said that He is the One Who has dissociated Himself from everyone else, the One Who is never surprised by whatever events take place. It is also said that anyone who recognizes Him as al-Bari will dissociate himself from committing anything prohibitive, seeking refuge with the King, the Most Forgiving One.

One who knows the real meaning of "al-Bari", therefore, is one whose heart is not affected by events, nor can momentous events overtake him by surprise. It is also said that anyone who comes to know Who al-Bari really is will dissociate himself from claiming to have anything to do with his own form or shape, fearing his Creator's Might, knowing that he is not doing Him a favour by worshipping and obeying Him.


Source: Allah: the concept of God in Islam p. 30
By Yasin T. Al-Jibouri

true2god:

The Bible is not a book science. Can you provide, from the Bible, where science was discussed? I am not talking about crude geographical knowlegde available to the Jewish people then.

I've never alleged that Bible is a book of science. I said it talks about certain aspects of science. Anyway, you can read online: "The Bible, the Quran and Science" by Dr. Maurice Buccaile.

true2god:

'Divine religion' has a role to provide the spiritual and the moral need of the society. Religion can never guide scientific thought and/or experiments. I don't know where you are getting this stuff from.

Sometimes you find things difficult to comprehend. If I say religion should be a guide for science, how on earth would you think my thoughts is on "laboratory experimental practices"?! Chai! That's a low thought man. It really show you do not even know the role of religion. That's why you quickly put aside Albert Einstein's quote. You do not equally grab what his quote meant. Do yourself a service by reading books on "religion and science".

Note, there are various field of science and religion could indeed be a guide in all of them.

true2god:

Yes, Islam in an Islamic society, is both the state and the religion that covers both the moral, economic, military, sanitary and even educational life of the society. And if I say Islam is an intolerant religion, I mean the relationship between Islam and other faith/belief. Islam divides the world into the Ummah and the kafir, just as the Jews divide the world into 'the Jews' and 'the Gentiles'.

Another polemic thought. Islam as a religion tolerate religious freedom. There were Christians and Jews in Madina at the time of the Prophet. Only those Prophet fought were those out of hatred of Islam joined hands with the polytheists of Makkah and bridged their agreement of peace with the Prophet.

Islam never takes it light with those who chose to cause oppression and corruption on the earth.

That is Islam. The story might change and indeed did changed when certain Muslim rulers launched their barbaric jihad or passed their fatawa. Their case is so serious that they can't even tolerate their fellow Muslims of another ideology as them. Then how can they tolerate other faith? Do not miscrue Muslim rulers with Islam.

true2god:

"Church immorality" is synonymous to "Christian immorality". You can't call one a bad name and tell him you are refer to his dog. Use a better adjective.

If the word "Church" is used especially referring to the Christian history, it refers to the Roman Catholic Church history. It was later that the Protestant distinguished and separated themselves out of "the Church".

Interestingly, you yourself have used it in your above reply. So I wonder why you try to defend it again. "The church" is different from "The Christian" for the later encompasses all denominations of christiandom.

true2god:

Iranians are leaving for the west, in their millions, as a result of the Ayatolla's policy against religious view, especially Islam. Most anti-Islam activist on the internet are either atheist or agnoist who have to leave Iran for fear of being killed. Stop leaving in denial; an apostate Muslim will not come out openly in Iran. There is no religious freedom in Iran bro.

Ayatullah's policy against religious view? What is that? Many Iranians before the "Ayatullah's" Islamic revolution have been in the west. So why would you peg your polemic thought that it was "Ayatullah's policy" that is driving "Iranians in their millions " to the west?

Few people in every country go to the west for two reasons:

1. Greener pastures

2. "Western freedom"

Iranian economy is weak due to 40 years economic sanctions imposed on it. Therefore, it is natural for some Iranian youths to travel abroad. You know your countrymen better the way they also run to the west.
Besides, some Iranians also go to the west to study, return back home and help his/her country. I am also a Nigeria in diaspora in the field of learning.

And on the other hand, those who chose Western life of "freedom" leave for west to live their lives to the fullest. It's a free world. Those who chose to remain at home and are contended with "The Ayatullah's policy" are at home leaving their lives. Why is that an Armageddon of the brain for you bro? It's a free world.

Interestingly, there are many westerners coming to Iran to study those "Ayatullah's policy". Lobatan.

# For your information, Iran is the ONLY country in the Muslim world that allow freedom of religion despite being Muslim majority. Their are Christians, Jews, Zoroastrians in Iran worshipping in their respective places of worship. Besides, each of these religious denominations have representatives in Iran house of parliament.

To God who made me, some Iranian pastors came to my hawza (Islamic university) last month for a conference and I had the chance of speaking with them.

Islam and Iran did not stop you from choosing what you want so long you do not cause fitnah. Let me school you further: In Iran, there are cities predominantly of Sunni population with Shia minority. Iranian constitution is that there should be nothing like "Sunni mosque" or "Shia mosque". One mosque for all and the Imam will be from the majority in that particular environment. And to avoid religious violence, it is against the law to publicly preach what will incite the anger of either sect. For example, Ayatullah Kamal Haydari's program was banned from national Tv when it was "anti-Sunni". Iran believe such discussion is not meant for public consumption rather it is to be discussed in the classroom or research centers among learned.

Now, How can a country like that allow atheism with their weird ideas publicly? Such idea is gonna hurt feelings of some people. If any "Iranian atheists" wants discussion and debate with Islam, offices of maraji' are always open for such. Why chose to disturb others with your distant thought?

true2god:

Stop exaggerating the works of Muslim medival scientist. If they are so great most Muslim world will be great in science and technology today, but unfortunately the opposite is through. As a matter of fact, virtually all the scientist and engineers, whose laws and works are quoted in all schools worldwide, as from the christian west.

You are either very ignorant of history or you are being driving by sentiment.

Muslim cities were once the leading cities in various aspect of science and learning which brought them huge development. Their western counterparts were.still in abject ignorance with witchcraft and superstition dominating their environments. Islam ruled Spain for 950 years (If I am not mistaken) and then Spain was far on top of European countries.


Today, why reverse is the case in Muslim world? It was your Christian west that destroyed the Muslim's Ottoman Empire (the last Muslim Empire) that brought many development to the Muslim world. Your Christian west stole many Muslim inventions and looted Africans dried to bring about their industrial and science revolution. Nearly all Christian scientists of the western world only worked on existing achievements of the Muslim scientists. And they tried to suppress those Muslim's scientists. You never heard of the name Ibn Sina, Ibn Rushd, Farabi, Jabir ibn Hayan, Al-Qawarizmi (father of Algebra) etc. What you hear today is Michael Faraday, Isaac Newton, Etc.


And today, your Christian west are making sure Muslims don't go back to their past glory. They continue to create evil for the Muslim world while their media do the propaganda of all sort.

true2god:

I will read about this. Mind you black Africans were equally treating themselves of various ailment before the advent of Christianity and Islam

That's not a further mathematics to accept. What I am telling ya is that Muslims influenced by Islamic thought established the basis of modern MEDICINE. Your Christian west only "stole it" and make it theirs.

true2god:

You can't separate the hadith from Islam. Over 80% of Islam beliefs and practices are found in the hadith, not the quran.

When people like you thinks you know Islam more than Muslims, then we should be expecting such polemic thought as above.

Islam is on three stands:

1. Beliefs - Aqaeed, This is the fundamentals of Islam (Usul al-Din)

2. Practice - Principles of Islam (furu'u deen)

3. Muamalat

All Muslim beliefs are in the Quran not hadith. All Muslim practices (furu) are commanded by the Quran and Islamic fiqh demonstrated them. For your information, Prophet's Sunnah (NOT oral and writing saying - hadith) was practically passed from generation to generation till date. The testimony to this is that ALL muslim's practices had been in full existence and were being practiced ever before hadiths are writing down centuries after the demise of the Prophet. For example the supposedly author of sahih bukhari was born 200 years after the death of the Prophet. And interestingly his alleged book of hadith compilation was compiled 150 years after his own demise.

true2god:

That is the impact of religion and culture on any given society. Northern elders represents less than 1% of the entire population who control both the economic and the financial resources. It is a cultural thing in Islam for the Emirs, Ayatollas and the mullas to control the poor masses. This same game is being played out in the Arab gulf states. Most northern elders stole from the state resources and not through hardwork and innovation.

Sorry, is it your Dad that is controlling the wealth of Nigeria? Whether "In Islam" or any other government, there are some saddled with the responsibility of administration of public funds. What I am telling you is that northern elders do not discharge their responsibility truthfully and that is what led to the abject poverty of their environment not "bearing of excess children".

true2god:

If the 'scholars' today cannot get their theology right, it is either the religion itself is not self-explanatory or the founder did not provide adequate knowledge to guide the future adherants. Whichever way, a so-called perfect religion cannot, at the same time, be a very confusing religion among it members.

Another polemical thought. How many people followed Jesus Christ during his time? How many of his 12 disciples comprehend him? The thieves, 419ers, babalawos, con-artists of today calling themselves Pastors; do you blame Christianity and its teachings or you blame Jesus Christ for their atrocities?

Please think deep before you write.

true2god:
Yes, science and religion never mixed unless you can prove to me that Islam is both equally religious and scientific in nature. Islamic countries stifle scientific thought as well hence the stagnation in science and technology virtually in all the Muslim world. If free thinking and criticism of religious beliefs are encouraged in the Muslim world, most Muslims will apostatize.

"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." - Albert Einstein

If religion and science "never" in your thought, how come Bible and Quran talk about various aspect of science?

Those who are at fault are the interpreters of these "divine books". Some do not even comprehend the book or science itself yet want to talk about the two.

Anyway, I was not talking about religion vs science per se, I was talking about "the Church" and their crusade against science and scientists since their interpretation of certain aspects of religion (for example flatened unrotated world) were opposed by the scientists then. Many of the scientists were burnt alive, some hung for opposing "God" in the "church" interpretation.

I am of the opinion that divine religion are there to guide science in its theories and applications.


# There is an aspect of Islamic study called "kalam and falsafah islami - Theology and Islamic philosophy". It dealt with "isms": atheism, facism, communism etc. You can get a glimpse of my discussion with an atheist in one of my threads. In short, in Islam, there is no compulsion in religion. However, as much as Islam is ready to discuss and debate any "ism", it draws line. In an Islamic society, atheist or homosexuals who choose to propagate their ideas publicly are not tolerated. What you do within the 4 corners of your house is strictly your problem. The reason why Islam is intolerant to those mentioned above is about protecting the society (especially people with weaker minds) from their ideas.

true2god:

The word 'moral atrocities' is a big word to make any logical argument here. Before you accuse the Christian of 'moral atrocities', look into the muslims' MORAL ATROCITIES as well. The sunnis killed the entire family of the prophet of Islam, and the shia also believed that Mohammed was killed by Abu Bakr but used the Jewish people to cover-up their atrocities. Never throw a stone if you live in a glass house.

Kindly read through the lines. I didn't mention "Christian immorality". I only mentioned "Church immorality". And thst continues till date.

true2god:

Yes, older people moves towards religion as a result of the limited time they have left on earth and only natural to prepare for the life beyond. It is common in both religious and non-religious people. In the Muslim world, especially Iran and Egypt, young people hardly go to mosque and million are turning to atheism but have to stay in the closet for fear of 'apostasy' or 'blasphemy' punishment.

What do you know about Iran? Nothing. Who told you her young ones hardly go to mosques, and that millions are turning to atheism? I live in Iran for your information. I have first hand information based on what I see. Unfortunately, people like you only depend on propaganda and fake news you read on the internet.

Iran produced best of the best Muslim philosophers and theologians. There is no single matter that arise in the world today without their scholars cutting it into piece. Of recent, Sayyid Kamal Haydari (who is an Iraqi cleric but based in Iran) discussed and shred into pieces all the submission of Richard Dawkins and Stephen Hawking about Atheism. Iranian youths on the street will debate a grand master atheist. So, it is only on the page of fake news website that you are reading "Iranian and Egyptian" youths are turning atheists. That only happens in the western world since Christianity has not only lost its values but also cannot withstand atheist reasoning and submissions. For example there is absolutely nothing rational in 3 in 1 God that Christianity preaches. It is irrational.

true2god:

Islam is not a race but a religion. None of the scientist in the medieval Muslim world came from Saudi Arabia or Yemen (the traditional home of Islam). Most notable scientist during the early years of the caliphate are either Iranians, Jewish or Chaldeans living under the authority of the khalifa. The Iranians, the Jews and the Romans were not 'bushmen' or 'barbarians' before Islam. These people were already advanced in the scientific knowledge available to them then; it has nothing to do with Islam. The Islamic taught, both in terms of religious beliefs and tech development, have hardly changed for more than 900 years. Hence most Muslim countries became stagnated.

Give yourself a homework please and research into Muslim medieval scientists. Only then you will know whether their scientific knowledge was influenced by Islamic thought or not. Let me give you an example: Father of Chemistry, Jabir ibn Hayyan (known as Geber in the west) was a student of Imam Jafar Sadiq (the 6th Shia Imam) in Madina. It was the Imam that adviced and guide him to start research and studies into Chemistry. He discovered many things that are the basis and fundamentals of today's chemistry. Other western Chemists simply built on his work.

Father of Medicine, Ibn Sina and Ibn Rushd. The former book, "Canon of Medicine" was used up till early 19th century in the west. According to his biography, he discovered many medical breakthroughs via reading Qur'an I can go on and on bro.

So your wish that it is not Islam that influenced those Muslim scientists per se is thrash.

true2god:

I don't get your point bro! Most of what you have in the hadith are also superstitions. In one of the hadith, it was narrated by the prophet that satan sleeps in the nose of Muslims and a special prayer must be made when one woke up and Muslims must watch their noses to remove the satan in the nose. In another hadith it was also narrated that the prophet does not allow pictures at home because angels dont visit such homes. Are these not superstition in your most trusted religious text? True, many churches are using 'kalamojay' to hoodwink their member, but you need to accept the fact that many Islamic sheik are also doing same. Just that the Christians seem to package their 'hustles' better and are more subtle in their trade.

Anyway, I am not discussing hadith here. Besides, I need to remind you that this very thread exposes some fallacies and fabrications called hadiths.

true2god:


If you say Islam is a religion of REALITY, CONVICTION and RATIONALITY I will only laugh. You are only over-patronizing your religion and all your claims cannot stand up to scrutiny. Can you tell me how and when Islam becomes the religion of REALITY, CONVICTION and RATIONALITY? These are subjective claims that have no place in reality bro! Only your fellow Muslims, who want their ego inflated, will believe such a thing.



Yes, 100% agreed. However, the high birth rate also contributed to the extreme poverty and ignorance prevalent in the northern part of Nigeria.



What do you mean by 'true Islam'? Is it ignorance, poverty, violence and intolerance? You are talking like a Jehovah's witness who is expecting the kingdom of God on earth, which is an illusion.

# If you think Islam is not rational, convincing and on reality, challenge any of its teachings and see if you can withstand its submission. Should we start about God by comparing the attributes of Christian God with Islam God? I bet you bro, you will run. Bring any topic.

Here's my debate with an atheist about "God":
https://www.nairaland.com/4641276/argument-possibility-necessity-does-god

I am a student of Islamic Philosophy by the way. Therefore, I will welcome any aspect of rationality, reality and conviction I boasted Islam is based on.

# The birth rate does not contribute to extreme poverty in the north. Society failed such population. Northern elders are the richest in Nigeria, in Africa and among those in the world. Yet, their region is ravaged by poverty. Stingyness, selfishness, feudal dominance are what is making the North poor not birth rate.


# By true Islam, I meant what the Prophet of Islam actually preached not the interpretation of today's scholars which they labeled "Islam". We.have various scholars with varying and opposing interpretations on a subject today. Could that be Islam? Two or more opposites cannot make right. Only Islam is right and true.

true2god:
How does Christianity fail the society? I would like you to throw more light on this.

The fact is that most western nations, where there is a separation between the church and state, are drifting towards materialism, atheism, liberalism and capitalism and I don't know why blame it on Christianity. The fruit of these changes are the increase in material possessions, acquisition of more knowledge and decay in the moral fabric of the society. And note that the Muslim world are migrating to the west to enjoy these changes and benefits. If Christianity has failed the society, what has Islam provided?

On the south west Nigerian Muslims, they are 1000% more tolerant than their northern counterpart. It is safer to stay among the Yoruba Muslims than the Hausa or Fulani Muslims (who has a very high propensities for bloodletting and violence). I don't know the criteria you used to come to the conclusion that the western Nigerian Muslims are fake. If western Nigerian Muslims are running towards Christianity, perhaps they see satisfaction and spiritual fulfilment in it.

People have different social behavior and tend to channel their religious beliefs towards a belief system that allow them express such behaviors more easily.

# Christianity started its failure since the time of the reign of the Church where the faith was antagonistic of science. The more science grew in the west, the more Christianity loses its bases. The two are not compatible.

# On the other hand, the Church moral atrocities also made people lost hope in faith. If not for the revolution of Martin Luther which brought about Protestant, Christianity would have gone to its oblivion in the west.

All these and more paved way for other "ism" to establish their roots. Stats showed old people are adherents of Christianity today compare to the young folks in the western world.


# And when you talk about western material developments, it was NEVER EVER as a result of their Christian faith that paved way for such. Some of western earliest and today's scientists were/are not really believers. Some even faked to be believers to escape church persecution. Today with more freedom, it is far easier for them to reject Christian faith.

# Interestingly, you dare ask "muslim's contributions" to the development of the "world". While the Western world were in abject ignorance, their Muslim counterparts were distinct with various form of technological and scientific inventions. The basis of western scientific and technical achievement today are traced back to the Muslims scholars/scientists. And of course, west tried her best to stole those inventions and plundered Africa of her wealth to actualized her stolen inventions.


# Coming back home. Nigeria or Africa Muslims are thousand of years behind. The kind of Christianity and Islam we embraced and practicing were fake to the fullest. Christianity of today is making wave in Africa owing to the superstition and abject poverty in this region. Same story in North America. Africans always see problems and challenges from spiritual perspectives. Church banked on that by introducing deceitful and magic "miracles". Some introduced wealth to entice and lure people and preach prosperity. Hence, the rising and increase of Christian population in the southwest Nigeria. Besides, Muslims are very weak in faith propagation than their Christian counterparts.

Islam is more of a religion of reality that talks and argue on conviction and rationality. Naturally, in an environment of ignorance and poverty, such religion doesn't really work unlike academic environments. Hence, you could see Islam is the fastest growing religion in the western world. You can understand the need for the "western world orders" to fight it via propaganda and introduction of wahabism by the British.

Islam is growing in the northern part of Nigeria as a result of excessive child bearing and multiple marriage. When you see a man with 10, 20, 30, 40 etc children compare to the western Nigeria or esstern Christians. Thats something on its own. Besides, Islam is more or less been established as a culture in the north than being a religion.

Western Nigeria because of her education and enlightenment have prospect of being Muslim dominant (if not presently) by the time true Islamic teachings are more preached and propagated compare to the present distasteful propagation and emergence of useless scholars.

true2god:
The Western world, especially Europe, is abandoning their Christian root for multiculturalism, atheism, liberalism, LGBT rights, Islam, capitalism and 'democracy'. It will be very difficult to know where this changes, the current social engineering, will lead to. I think it won't end well in the long run.

Actually Christianity failed the society in different ways and naturally people seek "alternatives". The fake Islam we are preaching and practising in southwest Nigeria is also failing as people run more to Christianity since atheism is not prevalent in our society. Southwest Churches are far more smarter than mosques with various tactics while Muslim cleric's style of preaching and practising of Islam is irritating. If atheism comes, there is likelihood, southwest might become another western world.

Empiree:
This idiot is a big clown if this is true

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/02/22/saudi-crown-prince-defends-chinas-right-put-uighur-muslims-concentration/amp/

The clown is power thirsty. What he wants is support from superpowers. He cares not about anybody.

AlBaqir:
SUNDAY FOR CHRISTIANS

Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet (s) said, "We are the last (to come) but we will be the foremost on the Day of Resurrection, nations were given the Book (i.e. Scripture) before us, and we were given the Holy Book after them. This (i.e. Friday) is the day about which they differed. So the next day (i.e. Saturday) was prescribed for the Jews and the day after it (i.e. Sunday) for the Christians. It is incumbent on every Muslim to wash his head and body on a Day (i.e. Friday) (at least) in every seven days."


Reference : Sahih al-Bukhari 3486, 3487
In-book reference : Book 60, Hadith 153
USC-MSA web (English) reference : Vol. 4, Book 55, Hadith 693
 https://www.sunnah.com/bukhari/60/153


For a clear fact, early Christians do not worship on Sunday. They only observe the traditional Sabbath as the jew do. It was the Church that switched sabbath from Sarurday to Sunday. This was switched to correspond to the alleged rissen of Jesus from the dead on sunday.

Never prescribed by Allah.

Still on voting

Still on voting

IRAN STARTS ELECTRIC CAR MANUFACTURING AS FAR BACK AS 2017

https://www.presstv.com/Detail/2017/08/08/531090/Iran-auto-hybrid-Mitsubishi-pollution

abdulazeez1002:
This post is not suppose to make front page

Unfortunately it is in front page. You can add that to the list of your sorrows.

Excellent effort.

FALLACY OF THE INTERPRETATION OF 73 SECT HADITH

https://www.nairaland.com/5002458/fallacy-interpretation-73-sect-hadith

Empiree:
I only really want to address this. From where I do my research made no mention of Muawiya tied Abu Dhabi a to horse and dragged him out. Rather there are detailed explanation that is quite contrary to what you are saying. This is why it is very important to be careful of these historians.

For this reason, I have no reason to believe some stories cooked up to marginalized Uthman and Muawiya (rodiyaAllah anihum) in this case. I am not just trying to defend them for the sake of this topic rather for the fact that there are contrary stories which you and I can never be 100% certain of what truly happened except that we rely on historical data.

That is the reason you are afraid to read from the sources rather relying on friendly curry flavored submission who try to put everybody good and bad into same bus of goodness.

Sunni has the largest historians so I wonder what kind of sectarianism that might influence their documentation. I don't even know when last on public forum I used Sunni vs Shia references to establish facts. You are trying to present this issue as "Shia vs Sunni" when my presentation till kingdom come is nothing other than Sunni.

You see there are some issues you don't discuss if you don't want to hurt feelings. Evidences are bleeping too much against those you are trying hard to defend. You either not discuss or you discuss the issue with truthfulness. Covering up and playing with people's innocence is what I can't engage in. Information is on our fingertips and you have to gather differing information on a single matter and filter out fabrications and exaggeration to arrive at truth.

Empiree:

He was a great scholar of Islam. His main charges against Uthman(ra) are :

I will advice you read the book yourself than relying on SUMMARY of someone else who intend to defend.

Each of Abu A'la Mawdudi's criticism was well supported by undeniable evidences and facts.

Anyway, in addition to those "charges", corruption and embezzlement of public funds were on top of the list.

Empiree:

But this isn't peculiar though. His predecessor(saw) also appointed relatives and others who are related one way or another. Example, Prophet Muhammad (SAW) appointed several of his relatives to high posts from among Banu Hashim, his own family: He appointed Hamzah b. Abdul Muttalib, Ali b. Abi Talib, Jafar b. Abi Talib

Subhan'Allah! This is a desperate and reckless comparism. Prophet's appointment of anyone was based on divine guidance, justice, and capability (of apppointee). It is like Allah's appointment of children of Ibrahim as Imam of mankind (Q2:124); the restriction is, "....my covenant will not reach the zaalimun".

# What moral, physical capability or spiritual rites did Uthman ibn Affan appointed Marwan ibn Hakam, Walid ibn Uqbah, Mu'awiyah ibn Abi Sufyan and the rest of his despotic cousins most of whom were cursed by the Prophet?

Dear brother, please when you read people's opinion, always try to filter it and vex before bringing it out. Such a comparism is reckless.

Empiree:

This is shia version but I actually welcome the fact that Shia believe Qur'an was compiled in the lifetime of the prophet. You said the same some 3-4 yrs ago during debates with Christians.

You mean this hadith is "Shia version"?

Imam Muslim

Hammam said:

I said to Anas b. Malik: Who GATHERED the Qur'an during the lifetime of Allah's Messenger (s)? He said: Four (persons), all of them belonging to Ansir: Ubayy b. Ka'b, Mu'adh b. Jabal, Zaid b. Thabit and a person from the Ansar whose Kunya was Abu Zaid.


Reference : Sahih Muslim 2465 b
In-book reference : Book 44, Hadith 171
USC-MSA web (English) reference : Book 31, Hadith 6030
https://www.sunnah.com/muslim/44/171

The "Jamaha" used in the hadith is translated as "collected" in the English translation above, but I see the word "GATHERED" more suitable and appropriate.

What happened to that Quran that was gathered during the lifetime of the Prophet? Why the need to compiled another one?

Empiree:

none issue. I am sure you have the same Quran I have, which means what Zayd ibn Thabit was tasked with is what you have too.

It is a serious issue. We are not accusing them of tampering with Quran if that's your fear. The question is why was only Zayd ibn Thabit appointed for the task with Abubakar saying to him, "you are a good boy because we do not suspect you"?

Why did Zayd ibn Thabit and his contractors refused to use the "Prophetic version" gathered already? There were far better reciters of the Qur'an than Zayd.

Empiree:

this is serious allegation. But at the same time they don't have to be Qaari to understand Qur'an. I am not a Qaari but I understand little I am given. But to say they don't comprehend is off. To be khalifah required elements of knowledge of Qur'an. Your allegations might be due to schism. But if you say INTERPRETATION on some issues I can understand th

Again they DO NOT KNOW Nada from the Qur'an. And they judged opposing Quran and Sunnah of the Prophet.

Prophet was articulated when he said, "follow my Khulafau - who are RASHIDUN and MAHDIYIN".

Rashid - he who knows and follow the truth
Mahdi - he who is guided by Allah.

When you see caliphs who constantly oppose Quran and Sunnah KNOWINGLY or deviant when told ....

Like I said, history do not favor them. We can start giving examples if you are in the mood of defending them.

Empiree:

You see, this was a simple issue just like we have today. Subtle disagreement btw Abu Darr and Muawiya during caliphate of Uthman was base on interpretation of Ayah just as we have btw Sufi and Salafi today.

Disagreement of verse of Quran? Who the hell was Mu'awiyah with Abu Darr al-Ghifari?! Mu'awiyah knew nothing from the Qur'an. Did he ever even follow Quran. This had nothing to do with Quranic verse disagreement o. Abu Darr was a staunch critics of Mu'awiyah's despotic ruling: embezzlement, corruption, lavishing of wealth among other serious crimes. Mu'awiyah got scared such constant criticism could lead to campaign against him. He had to deal with a wali of Allah.

I will advice you to please read historical facts about how my master Abu Dhar was exiled. Mu'awiyah tied him to a horse that dragged him from the former base to Madina. He was half dead upon arrival. Yet, Uthman exiled him from the city of Prophet. Please brother read SOURCES yourself. Stop following opinion of one eyed people that will sweep facts on the carpet and curry flavor issues.



[quote author=Empiree post=75695833]The soundest report about the story of Abu Dhar is that which was narrated by Bukhari in his Sahih from Zaid ibn Wahb radiya Llahu ‘anhu who said:
[/quote ]

Because it is in sahih bukhari, that makes it "soundest"

Please read meaningful SOURCES about the life account of Jundub (Abu Dharr, radiyallahu anhu).

true2god:
Stop calling people names; just make your point. Everybody can never have same opinion with you. Hassan and Hussein died at a very young age, you can prove me wrong with facts.

It is quite insane calling Al-baqir an extermist. You are amazing.

# Imam Hassan died at age 45 around 50 AH. Imam Husein was 55 years old when he died at 61 A.H. They were both at middle age when they died, and not that "very young".

United started well but could not maintain the tempo. If Naymar and Cavani played, the goals could be more

Empiree:
I certainly disagree with some of what is said here. The wordings self appeared to be inconsistently incoherently, and unbelievably incredibly.

# It is one thing to emotionally disagree with facts, it is another thing to disprove those facts.

When Abu A'la Mawdudi published his book "al-Khilafah wa Mulukiyah" (you can read the English version), he was criticized and labeled heretic and deviant with series of assassination attempts on his life. In the book, he exposed Caliph Uthman and Mu'awiyah with undeniable facts.

Ariwo ko o.

Empiree:

Uthman that compiled Qur'an would not abide by Hukm is something questionable. There is no way historians couod have been accurate. For a man to compile Quran that the entire ummah have been using for centuries is very commendable.

# Uthman compiled Quran? That's too much of a compliment to him.

# Quran was compiled during the lifetime of the Prophet supervised by him. For whatever reason known to them, Caliph Abubakar and Umar decided to compiled their own version of the Quran giving the task to ONLY Zayd ibn Thabit (neglecting other Qaari and scribes of the Qur'an during Prophet's time).

# According to Sunni history of Quran "compilation", Uthman only make copies from Abubakar's version and enforce that version for the Ummah.

# And for a fact, none of the first 3 Caliphs was a Qaari or knew Qur'an whether how to read or in comprehension. Ahadith and history did not favor them on this. I will be more than glad to furnish you undenial evidences should you oppose these facts.

# The worst of it all is that the 3 of them severally opposed Quran and Sunnah of the Prophet KNOWINGLY. Uthman ibn Affan was the worst as he used to suppress whoever try to correct or challenge his judgement. Abu Darr al-Ghifari was one of his victim.

# Lastly on this, even if you give him the credit of compiling Quran, that does not meant he can not violate orders of the Qur'an. Al-Saud are the "largest compiler and distributor" of Quran worldwide today, yet they violate Quran more than any common faasiq.

What the Khulafau and their supporters did after the Prophet are imaginable

Imam Malik ibn Anas documents in his al-Muwatta:

Yahya related to me from Malik from Abu'n-Nadr, the mawla of Umar ibn Ubaydullah that he had heard that the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, said over the martyrs of Uhud, "I testify for them." Abu Bakr as-Siddiq said, "Messenger of Allah! Are we not their brothers? We entered Islam as they entered Islam and we did jihad as they did jihad." The Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, said, "Yes, but I do not know what you will do after me." Abu Bakr wept profusely and said, "Are we really going to out-live you!"


USC-MSA web (English) reference : Book 21, Hadith 32
Arabic reference : Book 21, Hadith 993
 https://www.sunnah.com/urn/410140

And they did a lot after the Prophet.

Empiree:


And each Sahabi had their unique way they dealt with situations at their time. But to say that Sayyidina Ali (karamallahu wajia) would assumed that Sayyidina uthman (rodiyaAllah anihu) did not judge by what Allah revealed may be too good to be true.

Cc: Albaq.ir

You mean oppressive and favoritism ruling that characterized Uthman's regime was a "unique way he dealt with situation at his time"? Subhanallah.

His oppressive and unjust ruling got him killed. That was the first time the Muslim community will rise up against their Caliph. Uthman ibn Affan was killed by senior sahabah. He turned his Islamic government to his family ruling where his evil and despotic cousins were tyranically oppressing righteous sahabah and innocent citizens.

It is unimaginable to say Ali ASSUMED that Uthman did not judge by Allah's command. Uthman was a very weak individual who allowed his government to be hijacked by despotic individuals. Several times Imam Ali ibn Abi Taalib warned and cautioned him secretly and openly but he simply cannot control his despotic cousins and governors like Mu'awiyah, Walid ibn Uqbah etc.

Even Ibn Umar cannot hid it but try to downplay it:

Imam Nasai documents:

Hilal ibn al-Ala ibn Hilli narrated from Husayn (ibn Ayyash) from Zuhayr (ibn Muawiya) from Abu Isaac that al-Ala ibn Erar said:

Once I asked Abdullah ibn Umar ‘Would you talk to me about Ali and Uthman?’  He said ‘As for Ali, this is his house (close position) to the messenger of Allah (as) and I do not need to talk to you about anything else.  But as for Uthman, on the Day of Uhud, he committed a great sin and Allah forgave him and then he committed among you a small sin and you killed him.

Source: Sunan al-Kubra, vol. 7, p. 446, hadith no.7314 - 8526

https://books.google.com/books?id=2nBLCwAAQBAJ&pg=PT445&lpg=PT445&dq=%D8%B3%D8%A3%D9%84%D8%AA+%D8%B9%D8%A8%D8%AF

More photos

Pictures from the 40th Anniversary of 1979 Islamic Revolution of Iran

Empiree:
I

But the reason we can not meet their standards is simply because they met the prophet (saw) and struggled with him. This is something we can not attain. Because of this, regardless how great a waliy is in our time can never match standards of sahaba.

For this, they earned our respect. We should not speak ill of them nor curse them.

# That's a pack of exaggeration. You mean you can not surpass and do better than for example the hypocrites among the sahabah just because he saw the Prophet?


For your information, Prophet told some of them that some people of latter generation will surpass them in faith and righteousness because they will not see me (the Prophet) Yet they will believe in me.

# When you talk mutlaqan with no restrictions, you oppose Quran, hadith and aql which clearly prove that some sahabah are candidates of hell fire.

The righteous and wali among them were no doubt better than angels and some prophets of Allah. These were best people that deserves praises and emulation.