₦airaland Forum

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Seun:
If God existed, why would he enjoy listening to his children begging him to do things for them repeatedly for more than 10 minutes? I can’t stand more than 30 seconds of that shit. I fail to understand how God would not only tolerate it, but actually enjoy it to the point of deliberately not answering most of his childrens’ prayers so he could continue to listen to their endless begging.


If God existed, I fail to see why it would please him to see his children voluntarily starving themselves of the sustenance he so graciously provided them. What manner of parent would enjoy watching their kids starve? What manner of parent would favor children who regularly starved themselves in order to get their way?


We believe the Bible because these men told us that it is the word of God. If they are not truthful, how can we be sure that the Bible is the word of God as they said, and not what it objectively looks like?

Seun, you can't just design your own concept of who God is, and assume it all to be true.
First, who told you that when Christians spend long moments in prayers, what they're doing is begging, and how could you tell that the God you don't even know enjoys seeing them beg. You haven't met any mature Christian who would ever beg God for anything, and you never will. Now there may be a whole lot of religious or confused folks who do, only cos they don't know better, but someday they may realize just how ignorant about faith they've been.
Now you would ask, if Christians don't beg God when they pray, then what is it exactly they do spending so much time in prayer? Well basically, Worship, Thanksgiving, chat and sorts. They'd tell God everything from what they're thinking about the next investment decision, to why they're choosing a particular meal for breakfast. Don't you think it would be shallow for anyone who sees you spending much time talking with your dad (while you were little) to just conclude that your dad is either not a Dad or is heartless, because he thinks all you're asking your dad for is your school fees, and if he existed he should have given it to you all this while, why should he enjoy your constant begging? may be he's not a dad after all. To such a fellow, nothing about his assumption could be wrong, he just must be right about what he thinks of you and your dad. Isn't that just shallow?

Now, about fasting, it's not starving. Starving would be if God hadn't made provisions for you-meal and otherwise. But since He's done, your fasting hence isn't starving but discipline. If you had a Dad who thinks you need moderation in some things- food, sleep, sex- it is only wise if he advises you to limit your indulgence in such every once a while, he's not starving you. Man is not just a body, it would be demeaning to think of yourself as such. As a man you're basically a spirit living in a body, so fasting is one of the things that helps you keep tabs on the fact of your spiritual being, and see it grow, which is what God wants. When God ends vegetation or animal breeding, then you can start saying He wants to starve us, but until then, just realize you don't know all yet, and just as you think Christians are wrong in their faith, you could be the one who's wrong, and that's is more probable.

Trying to go wild with you in imaginations. If the bible is false, and I've believed it my whole life, what do I stand to lose. If God should cancel His standards today and declare that nothing could be sinful any more. it wouldn't make me any difference. would I then in wanting to take advantage choose to have sex with every girl/lady or woman I fancy, of course not, that would not be a path to be treaded, because it'd lead to an end worse than a lunatic's.
If on the other hand, the Bible is true and I have chosen not to believe. well the losses are clearly spelt. however they are even more than you may have heard. Do you know there are people who can't just die, people who can fix their own date to die. people who have life "insurance" policies for themselves and family which actually prevents untimely death rather than just try to compensate for it?
Guess how much premium is charged on that- zero. Now you think those who enjoy such policy need any further motivation to pay tithe?

Seun, if you would spend this much time interacting on talks on religion/faith, why not just do it to your own eternal benefit. I love you, I'll keep praying for you.

Seun:
Pastor Adeyemi is one of the better pastors. At least he teaches his members useful secular lessons that can help them in life such as financial planning, entrepreneurship, leadership and relationship tips, sprinkled with bible verses, before collecting their tithes. 10% of your income is a steep price for the information he provides, which is probably available online, but at least it is very useful.

Seun, you know it can be quite difficult trying to understand you. I am God's son, and my whole life is based on faith. Now you're the atheist, yet you know several verses of the scriptures, and you know pastor Sam's messages so well and how it ranks among other Pastors'. You even know enough to judge the choir's performance, you must really be paying much attention to these things, which you like to claim are meaningless. Meanwhile if others are paying tithe on THEIR money, why should you be the one complaining? Remember an illiterate can rant all he wants about how schooling (to him) is just such a waste of time, but the people who go to school know better right?

Seun:
The story of Melchizedek is fishy. He came from nowhere to collect Abraham's tithes, and was never heard from again. Very convenient.

First, he didn't "come to collect", he came to bless Abraham. It was a willing gesture Abraham made in offering tithe to him.
So the fact, that he wasn't mentioned again in Genesis makes the story fishy? Come on, that's a little shallow now.
You should know, that if the writers of the scriptures were out to " scam" people as you often tend to insinuate, they'd be smart enough to proofread their writings for all the perceived "contradictions and faults" that you think those writings have. People who would come up with such a big scam as inventing a bible would be smart enough to omit "contradictions and inaccuracies"

Now, I have been where you are-not paying tithe. Now I tithe, and I can clearly see the difference. So your opinion on my tithing decision is not any more material than that of an illiterate who thinks education is a scam.

I should add that a god who needs 10% of your income truly may not exist as you've said. But you know just as I do that the LORD God Almighty, creator of the ends of the earth has forever been, and will forvever be, and he surely cannot need eveb a zillion percent of whatever you have. As you know, there's a scripture to that effect in the Bible.
Seun, please what do you consider to be the greatest tragedy a man can have. Well I'll tell you. it's either dying with no afterlife, or dying with an afterlife in hell. if the human life was only meant for this earth alone, it couldn't be worthwhile for me, even if the average lifespan was a thousand years. The only thing that adds meaning to my existence for me is the fact that it's eternal. How can one really live a life that ends forever in just a hundred years? it'd be too sad.

Seun:
Maybe they just assumed she was AS because your mother was AS. Maybe the person who first tested her made a mistake.

Why did your sister request prayer for the change of her genotype, though? People with AS genotype are more resistant to malaria, you know.

Or maybe being the one who witnessed this in person, she would know whether there's been a mistake. Someone is telling you something he/she witnessed. The fact that some people don't believe in happiness doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
I was to go for Youth service, a while back, my name was missing from the list sent to the school containing call up numbers, someone told me with every assurance that it was impossible to get call up letter without first having a call up number, I prayed, I went. My final year project supervisor swore I wouldn't graduate because I refused to do something he requested which I considered sinful. I prayed, I got an A.
I work only 18 hours per week, I should be broke, I tithe, I'm comfortable.
Seun, if you ever meet a true Christian, two things are certain:
1. you'd have a higher chance at convincing him, he doesn't exist, than convince him against God's existence.
2. You'd want to become like him if you'd listen to him with an open mind.
I LOVE YOU, WON'T GIVE UP YET.

Seun:
Liberalism and morality are not opposed to each other. We only think they are because religion has given us a very warped view of morality. Liberals fight for the rights of the oppressed, such as the poor, the enslaved, victims of racism/sexism, (and gays). This is a very moral cause.

I can't support any gayness in Nigeria at this time because it is against the law, but in my view, the gay law is immoral and should be repealed.

First off, what makes you think your own judgement on the morality of the gay law is what should hold. in your opinion you're wiser than the vast majority of legislators who debated on it, or you assume they were blinded by religion whereas you're not.
Now, what makes the law immoral? The fact that people are punished for satisfying their sexual whims, their "natural" sexual passions? So now, if we have people obsessed with assassination, it means we should repeal our law against murder, because in your opinion, that law prevents people from doing their job, or for those who do drugs, we should cancel all our laws regarding drug abuse, because after all, it's their own body.
It is only wise to realize that the "freedom" to live your life as you want, which you think religion robs you of, is actually more limited by common sense than by Faith.

Seun:
It makes no sense that God would give us amazing intellectual capabilities and then choose to condemn those of us who make use of them.

Who says God condemns you for using your wisdom?
One thing that's yet a dream is for me to know why exactly you do not believe in God. I know you to be very smart, so why? You know I think even Einstein did believe in creation. Please I'd be willing to answer any questions you need answered to make you know that life was meaningfully created for us by God. please find the time to ask them.

RichYoungRuler:
Hi bro, I’m not sure you got me concerning GTBank, the rate at which you bought from the CBN is what is used to buy you from less penalties and you have no business whatsoever with what rate they sell or who they sell to. Geddit? Or is there something I’m missing?

Oh I get you now, then try Stanbic now, maybe FBN too.
By the way, should you be here with us? Shouldn't you be out there on the streets giving away those massive riches to the poor. I volunteer my help on that. Happy Friday.

elpiro:
calendar for next NTB

Thanks elpiro.
1.09trn from 1.26trn just about 14% drop.
I think things won't be as bad as we fear. I yet expect yields on the 364-day papers to remain above 15% through Q1'18.

RichYoungRuler:
Hi, Nice but truth is GTBank does not allow you sell your TBills, they buy off from you.
What banks allow you sell your TBills Short t? My understanding with GT is that once you are ready to terminate they buy it off you.
No chance for errm the rates are lower now so u should be able to gimme something on top!!!
No short selling of TBills with GTBank in my understanding.
Please state the banks that allow this in Nigeria, so we can know where to go for such.

It's not who buys that counts, rather the discount at which it's bought. Getting your bills bought (by or through GTB) at a lower discount implies profit.
However, Whitechocolate mentioned that she sold hers through Stanbic.

Jejebaba:
Ok sir, please kindly let me know any MMF that still sustains 17% so i can move my matured Tbills there please. Thanks in anticipation of you response.

Stanbic MMF. Website says 17.65% for yield today.

Jejebaba:
Boss, have you forgotten that, those investment you mentioned track Tbills. They will always offer something lower than Tbills true yield. I stand to be corrected though.

Certainly so, but we can only count on their inertia. For instance T-bills discounts have been at 15% for about 2 months now, yet most MMFs still sustain 17%.

It's really too early to make conclusions on T-bills now, all we're seeing with rates are panic effects. Let's wait for the Jan 3rd auction first, it's only 20days away.

Meanwhile, if you absolutely have to invest your funds for those 20 days, and the only offers you see are for 7%, you can do a 365-day FD at 12.5%, then terminate prematurely in January. After the penal charge and WHT, you should still make 9% returns. Or you could do a MMF at 15%.

I know stanbic offered up to 12.5%.

Zamirikpo and Dandollar, I don't see any wrong info in what either of you has posted here, so there shouldn't be any ish.
As Zamirikpo mentioned, how can you have a 364 day paper on sale on a day when no auctions held? Who issued it? FG of Zimbabwe?
However, Dandollar has said he only shared what his bank sent him, which I know to be true, so I guess what the bank has quoted are only bid/offer rates for bills in the range of those stated tenors, and not for those exact tenors. In any case, it's just a communication error on the bank's part.

On the possibility of having rates that low, it's not out of place, as the news of no auction and a drastic reduction in the overall size of the FG's TBills debt portfolio is something that can cause a panic in the market. The Panic may be huge but it'll be short-lived.

Here are some things to watch out for to know what direction rates will head in the coming quarter:
1. Overall size of bills on offer when the Q1'18 calendar is released. Around 900bn is desirable.
2. MPC's decision at the January meeting. MPR at or above 13% is fine.
3. Frequency of OMO issuances as well as the discounts. 15% or more.
4. Yields in the bond market, as well as the movement of the NSE ASI. These are alternative vehicles for investors.

I however expect the CBN to want a bullish TBill market for exchange rate stability interests, and any other interests they may have.

I think for much of this coming quarter, yields on 364-day papers should remain above 15%.



By the way, nobody would want T-bills at 7%, they'd rather opt for Eurobonds. That's what I'd expect from those money market FPIs.

Now, if after 2 quarters of implementing this new plan, we yet have prime lending rates above 27%, and quoted companies still choose rights issues over corporate bonds and commercial papers, maybe we'll see a return to status quo.

And lest I forget, Fxuser, fxmanager, and all other fxmonikers, kindly reduce the length and frequency of your posts here.Thanks.

It appears the DMO has actually pulled through with this refinancing plan they had. Papers maturing in December will most likely be outrightly paid off, rather than get rolled over. So I don't expect anymore t-bills auction this year.
If you've debited upfront expect a refund by Thursday, and if you're still waiting on an auction, then be ready to wait till 2018, or just shift plans to the secondary market where you may actually get better deals.

Many thanks, skydiver for the info.

meetchandus:
Please need an answer if someone here can help with this question..Thanks

Q1'2018 NTB schedule:
First two auction dates should be Dec13, and Dec 20th.

TONY56:
Well done brother for the explanations you have offered Aliko.

My pleasure sir.

Alikote:
i been trying to design a short -selling model for my investment in tb, so that other can also key in. but after 3 hours of using several maths models all i see is that short selling is ONLY profitable if your capital is only available for 91 days or less. compared to an investor that can lock in for 356 days and reinvest the profit immediately in the secondary markets while u can only short sell in 4-6 times yearly and once you short sell and attempt to buy again rate would have felled so u can start at 18percent in january and end up with 15 percent i December...am yet to understand how a tb bought at 17.3 and sold at 15.6 will result in a profit of 1.7 this should be a loss for not holding to maturity ??need more info on this

It's easy.
If I buy 1m bills at 15% discount. I will be debited 850k. So my actual principal is 850k, will should become 1m if the investment matures.
Now if I decide immediately to terminate for whatever reason, and you want to buy from me at 18% you will only give me 820k, and collect the 1m on maturity, so I'll be losing 30k.
But if the prevailing market rates implies that I sell to you at 12%, then what you'll pay me will be 880k, which to me will be a 30k profit.

Basically, there's a profit when you sell at at a lower discount. And there's a loss when you sell at a higher discount.

To put things in another perspective, let's say you want to retail an item at your local store in Lagos. Item costs $100 per unit. It's year end promo, and Walmart is giving you a 10% discount.
Now when the goods reach Lagos, which will earn you profit-Offering a 5% discount or offering a 15% discount?. Obviously the latter has you selling at $85 while the former implies a $95 retail price. Cost to you is $90. So it's selling at a lower discount (5%) that brings the bucks.

C4Ltd:
Bro you making sense o.

but why did you calculate rate on 8m instead of 10m

"He got 460,000 on 8.265m in 63days. Guess what yield that represents a whopping 32.25% p.a. If in doubt, please do the math, and let's see what comes up."

Her investment was 10m and that should represent a whopping 26.6% abi?

10m was just the face value. The actual amount that was lent out was 8.265m. That's how much she was debited right?

Happy Sunday everyone.

One of the main purposes of our interaction here would be to identify available opportunities for getting maximum returns on our investments.
Now for a while after we had the talk on true yield, there has been a number of people who now choose to reinvest their upfront interest.
But this WhiteChocolate's investment has brought something to my attention, and that is the fact that one can "SHORT SELL" this t-bills market to make some more bucks.

He got 460,000 on 8.265m in 63days. Guess what yield that represents a whopping 32.25% p.a. If in doubt, please do the math, and let's see what comes up.

Now, "short selling" in this market is only a once in a while thing, and it will only make sense to investors who do short term bills.

So whenever rates start taking a dip, and you're sure that over the next quarter, there could be up to a 2% cut in rates, then rather than buying a 91-day paper at 14%, you could buy a 364-day paper, and resell after 91 days at lower discount and thus push your returns to about 30% or more.

If any 91-day investor had tried this in q4'15, when rates dipped by about 7% The returns would have been about 40% p.a and peak discount for 91-day bills at that time was about 10.5%

perhaps this is one significant way banks make a portion of their t-bills profit.

So I hope we see the opportunity present in this strategy, and adopt it may be.

P.S By "short selling" I mean taking a bet that yield on t-bills will decline considerably in the near future.

eniorisha:
Hi everyone, i need your advice. i'm currently a FBN fixed deposit acc holder. It is halfway to its maturity, precisely to mature first week of february. i av a mind of terminating it for a more profitable TB. If i apply for termination, how long will it take to be effected? Or i shld see FD to its maturity 3 months away from now? D FD is 180 days @ 7% on a principal well over 500k.

I'll assume that your principal is 1m.
The interest due on the investment is circa 35,000. Applying a 10% withholding tax brings it to about 31,500. If you hold to maturity, that's how much you'll earn.
If however you decide to terminate now, giving that you've only held for half the tenor, what you should earn becomes 15,750 approximately. As is common with most banks, a 20% penal charge of 3150 is deducted, bringing your returns to 12600.
If you now buy an 80-90 day secondary market t-bill at 14% to cover the rest of this investment tenor, the returns on the t-bill will be about 33,000 bringing your total returns to about 45,600 as against the original 31,500.
So clearly for every 1mill, there's about a 14,000(or 44%) advantage in terminating now and switching to tbills.
I should add that the FD termination request will be processed within 24hours. Try submitting the request early in the morning, and ignore the details regarding your intention to swap for tbills.

emmanuelewumi:
The 25% penal charge is for the interest ad found in your proof of investment letter. If you are experiencing an interest of 40000 for a 182 day investment.

If you terminate after 91 days, you will first of all lose 10k, then the interest will be prorated for 91 days which is 20k.

The investor will end up losing over 30k for premature termination of his investment.

Pa Emma, this is what the investor wrote: "On the terms and condition for the proof of investment I got it says( Termination of investment before maturity attracts 25% flat penalty on interest earned ) "
It is stated that the penalty will be on the interest earned which in the case of premature termination, cannot be the same as interest accruable on the full investment.
However, I do not mean to raise an opinion contrary to yours for while I yet toddled, you were already an investor. I salute sir.

[q

TONY56:
It appears you still haven't understood what myself and few others on this forum have been explaining.

Let's assume that the N68,000 upfront paid to him is still intact in his account.

1.For defaulting, Union bank will debit his account with 25% of N68,000 = N17,000.

2.for collecting (in his account) N68,000 for an investment of 170-day tenor instead of N2,400 for 6days (because he is terminating after 6days), Union bank will equally remove N65,600(excess interest paid to his account) also from his account.

3.Assuming the investment is sold at same rate, and that other sundry deductions like tax, C.O.T, commissions, etc amount to N10,000 (may be less).

Total deductions will be N17,000 + N65,600 + N10,000 = N92,000.

4.So What he will get at the end of the day is {N980,000 which is amount invested + N68,000 upfront interest} - (N65,600 which is excess up front interest resulting from his termination after 6days - N17,000 which is penalty for terminating the investment - N10,000 which is the assumed sundry charges which could be less) =

{N980,000 +N68,000} - (N65,600 - N17,000 - N10,000)
=
N1,048,000 - N92,600 = N955,400

There his loss would be N980000 - N955,400 = N24,600.

But if the sundry charges is less, his loss will equally be reduced by the difference, but there is no way he would not lose even if he is paying N0.00 as sundry charges.

If after this very detailed explanation, you're still not convinced, then let's just await a feedback from the concerned person to prove either of us right.

Sir, with regards to point 1, As with all investments, the 25% penal charge will be applied on only the earned portion of the interest, which in this case is about 2400 (68000*6/170). So the 25% penalty will only amount to about 600, and not 17000.
Also the custodian and transaction fees are about 0.1%(980) and 0.125%(1225), commission is perhaps a max of 500, so even with the VAT, All the charges on this transaction should be under 3,000.00

Now, it is certain this investor will lose a little portion of his funds, but it will be due to the bank buying at a higher discount, and not due to the 25% penal charge.
Happy weekend sir great engr.

Matinho:
OP has disappeared after being busted......I need a word from him. What a shame man! Verbal diarrhea and mental constipation guy.

I think he resurfaced as catchwindfrmkd.
Meanwhile, the first bank account type that has a 500 operating balance also has a daily transaction limit of NGN 20,000. Some lies aren't so difficult to spot.

Kemade2007:
Unbelievable!! I redeemed online yesterday and my account credited today. Just a day so easy

If I remember correctly, sometime in May, I placed a redemption request around 10a.m for about 75% of my investment, and the funds hit my account the same day. Stanbic is really cool.

What I don't understand now is the fact that the interest on my funds from the last quarter is about 18% more than I expected, there have been some extra additions that I don't understand. Anyone has an explanation for this please?

katamo:
You do make a lot of valid points, sir, much of which I agree with. Having a balanced portfolio with mix of short-term T Bill and longer term government bonds is good as you can take advantage of the currently high T Bill rates and also lock in rates for longer terms in the bond market.
I beg to differ on a few things though. The point I made is more specific to the offered interest rate on the 2-year savings bond. I will not speculate on anything more than two years as that is too far out for anyone to predict where rates will go by then.
My view on investing is from a total return perspective so I am less concerned about frequency of interest payments versus my overall return when I compare investment options. As you probably know, total return will take into account different interest payment profiles and allow you compare oranges with oranges.
As I mentioned previously, the true yield on 1-year T Bills will need to about to almost 6.2% when you reinvest on one year for you as an investor to better off from a total return perspective. As you rightly pointed out, you have to go back as far as 2009 and 2010 (the period with the lowest T Bill rates in recent history) to find T Bill true yields below 6%. However, it is important to put this in the context of the economic environment prevailing at the time. The world was witnessing the worst financial crisis of our times which started in 2008 but really reach full scale in 2009 and 2010 and started to ease after that.
As you probably know, deposit and lending rates track the CBN monetary policy rate. Many countries across the globe engaged in large cuts to their benchmark interest rates in order stimulate their economies and keep themselves out of recession. This included us as well. CBN dropped the benchmark monetary policy rate from 10.25% in June 2008 to 6% by July 2009. This type of radical cuts to interest rates only happen in extreme situations. Typically the rates will change by 0.25% to 0.5% every couple of months when the monetary policy team meets. So I take any economic and financial analysis that relies on data from 2008 to 2010 with a grain of salt just given the situation at the time.
Currently, we are not in a period of economic shock so I certainly do not see 1-year T Bill rates going to 6% by this time next year. The benchmark MPR is currently at 14% since July of last year. Even though we were technically in a recession CBN has not cut the rates (likely because inflation is so high). The likelihood of a large cut between now and next year is very, very low.
My point is that I do not view the offered rate on the 2-year savings bong of 13.817% as attractive. I will take my chance with investing in 1-year T Bill because I view the reinvestment risk associated with T Bill rates as low as 6% one year from now as minimal.

It just excites me to read great analysis from brilliant minds such as this. Kudos sir.

chyima:
TB is a short term monetary instrument,hence it can't exceed 1 year

As stated by chyima, T-bills are short term debt instruments, and so the tenors remain 91, 182, and 364 days.
One of the things we need to be clear about as per this new policy is that the finance minister is only trying to adjust some of the nation's FISCAL policies, but as money market investors, what affect us more are the MONETARY policies which the CBN's MPC fixes.
If Emefiele had been the one who mentioned this, I would have been more bothered.
The nations sells about 5 trillion naira worth T-bills annually.
Now what the minister intends doing is cancelling about 1 trillion naira of these bills and replacing them with longer-tenor foreign currency bonds. so when some of the currently running bills mature, they won't be rolled over, instead proceeds from the bond subscriptions will be used to settle the holders of the treasury bills. Now, if the finance ministry was the one responsible for issuing T-bills, or if the sole aim of issuing the bills were to be for just fiscal purposes, then one would automatically anticipate a reduction of about 20% (about 1 trillion naira) in the amount of bills that get issued. But since the bills are an important tool through which the CBN achieves a significant portion of its monetary objectives, there are no guarantees that T-bills issues will reduce by up to 20%.

If this plan gets ratified by the National Assembly, I don't think the values of T-bills issued will reduce by more than 10%, and for FOREX stability reasons, the CBN is likely to yet keep rates at about16% for the longest tenor bills, and they'll probably consider a 100 basis points cut in the MPR at the next meeting. These will be to help reduce to some extent the private sector crowding out concern that the minister mentioned.

The forecast is for oil prices to remain under $70 for at least the next few years, and while it is true that there'll be dollar inflows from the bonds, there'll also be outflows from investors who would like to offset naira assets in preference for these dollar bonds. So the CBN will try to strike a balance.
What will eventually come out of this is that the CBN begins to bear more of the borrowing cost, while the FG bears less. This will however be a win-win for all. The CBN is able to maintain its forex stability, FG has less debt service burden, investors yet have enough incentives.
Please I'd like to get other viewpoints on this.

Investnow2017:
AwesomeJ,
You have been missing somewhat. You know as one of the Ogas when we have questions and we did not read from you and other Ogas the house seems to be at a loss somehow. Thanks for your contribution. I want the 364 days tenor, since i can't wait i will have to go for 300days+ tenor this week.

Thank you all.

Just another, who has had the experience of buying Tbills with Discount houses or licensed Brokers? Do they offer competitive discounts like stanbic and first bank?

Thanks for the kind words sir. I'm quite flattered.

There surely won't be any 364-day bills on offer at the next auction. The NTB calendar doesn't just show maturing bills. It also shows new issues the CBN intend making for a given quarter-that what's contained in the roll over section. one would expect things like a nations borrowings to be well scheduled right?

Remember before these huge deficits in the nation's budget, 364-day bills used to be on offer just once a month.

TONY56:
You goofed.
I am not a Banker,
I am a Mechanical Engineer,
I am a retired Civil Servant,
Not a single member of my family works with Stanbic.
My only account with Stanbic is a Savings account which I opened just on 7th of June this year specifically for Treasury Account because they are the BEST for Primary Market and are next to First Bank that i have been Banking with for about 30yrs.
I also have my Retirees Account with Stanbic
.
I am only in love with the Bank bacause of their services and performance with very robust returns on investments (ROI).

If you are not aware, Stanbic is an international Bank and it's the 2nd best performing Bank in Nigeria after GTB and their share holders smile home yearly while as PFA (Pension Fund Administrator), they are second to none in this country with the highest returns on Pension Contribution Savings and Retirees Pension Account.

So I can't but sing their praise because it's "7up" I.e "The difference is not only clear, but very clear"

Wow, I could almost swear you're a young working class man sir. Your posts are way different-albeit pleasantly so- from what a typical old retiree would put up. I also studied Mechanical Engineering, but I do Finance now instead.

mindtricks:
Nice one. But please we will appreciate if anyone can present us the calculations what will apply in a typical scenario where one wishes to pull out money before time, using hypothetical figures, tenor, etc.

Say you bought 364 day bills of #1,000,000 at 18% discount. Neglecting bank charges, you will be paid an upfront interest of 180k, in which case your actual investment is 820k. You could either profit or lose if you terminate before maturity.

Note if you sell the 1,000,000 tbill and you get credited with less than 1 million, it doesn't necessarily count as a loss, so long adding the upfront interest to the termination proceeds gives more than 1 million, then you've profited.

The only instance when you make a real loss on the investment is when you only hold for just a short while, and on termination, you have to rediscount at a significantly higher rate.

These are 2 possible scenarios:

1. You hold for more time in the tenor-say 200days, and you sell at a discount which is equal to or less than you bought at. The portion of the interest that goes to the new buyer (1,000,0000*164*18)/(365*100)=80,870. This sum will be discounted from the 1,000,000.00 that you should get upon maturity, and so what you get back is 919,130. So considering that you actually put in 820Gs, your profit is 99,130 for the 200-day period. No loss.

2. If you hold the investment for only a short while say 60 days and the new discount that's bidded for your bills is significantly higher-say rates begin rise significantly , and now your buyer wants a discount of 25%
The interest accruable to the new buyer =(1,000,000*304*25)/(365*100)=208,000 approx.
Now pulling that from the 1,000,000 that you should get leaves you with only 792,000. Given that you originally put in 820,000 you will be making a loss of about 28,000 on the investment.