₦airaland Forum

guys please lets try and put this thing into perspective, first of all lets take a look at the people who make up the cameron clegg cabinet -  a large number of them are privately educated and oxbridge  who have gone on to have successful careers in the city either as bankers, corporate lawyers or top executives,  many of them are millionaires, not one of these people have any understanding or interest in the lives of ordinary working people in this country.  When you have no understanding of a person's situation you have no empathy for that person.  

Now lets go back to the root cause of this huge budget deficit that britain is saddled with.  where did it come from and who created it?  was it caused by new labour spending too much money on the public sector or was it caused by the irresponsible, reckless and greedy behaviour of the deregulated banking institutions?  

To my mind the answer is the latter, if that is indeed the case why is it that the people who had nothing to do with the deficit are now being asked to foot the bill to pay for it by way of cuts in jobs, public service expenditure, etc

also why were the banks given £850 billion in british tax payers money after triggering this financial problem that we are now saddled with ?

I cant see the british people tolerating these huge cuts because they are so devastating and will impoverish so many people, i think we are going to see a lot of mass protest on the streets of london in the coming months.

perhaps isha's many critics would have preferred if she had adopted this style of interviewing:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUXN-cTSkLw

Ivynwa:
Alright Baby, me and Saga did disagree some here before we became Paddies. One love!
Not to worry I am going to help you get Aunty Isha's contact and may even talk to her for you.

thats cool, but why the jab at the end now?

anyway glad we're now back on speaking terms - its all good

[quote author=isale_gan2 link=topic=557181.msg7235789#msg7235789 date=1290985136]And that's the crux of it for you, isn't it? Really.   

Anyway, I confess, I didn't watch the video.  I just wanted to rant against CNN.  Felt much better afterward.   

Edited to add: 
Crud!  I just watched it.  I'm only 1/3 of the way through.  Very condescending aggressive in-your-face body language.  Interrupting him?  WTH!
Oh, well. . . .[/quote]Hey Isale, no that wasnt the crux of it for me at all  - it was just an observation, i did comment on the entire interview and to my mind i didnt really see anything disrespectful about it, she was rigorous but not disrespectful, let me show you a clip of a british news anchor interviewing condoleeza rice in which i think the anchor was definitely being disrespectful (and i can't even stand condoleeza rice):


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BI6Z7W14PGs

Ivynwa:
It amazes me endlessly when some Nairalanders I revere and respect are quick to match on others in a bid to be taken more serious while expressing their opinions. Sycophants , now I wonder where that sprang from. Can't we express our opinions here without calling names and bickering. I thought it's amateur NLs that call names but have just realized that some people have their smooth yet suave ways too. I don't do politicking and arguments in this forum and I know that that is the turn the thread is about to take.
All that is being said is that this sweetlooking young lady was disrespectful while throwing the questions. Nobody disagrees with the questions and the topic is not that  "Jo and wify are such big thieves and all of you saying Isha was disrespectful are unreasonable, sentimental and sycophants".
I am not even rooting for Jo, I can't see past this zoning thing yet to be able to see clearly into the politics going on in Nigeria. My stand is all about a good leader for Nigeria irrespective of his tribe. If they have agreed on zoning let them all give the zones their dues and timing and if they have awoken and decided on real "unity beyond the zones" and transparent democracy let them allow the masses to choose a good leader which is what the other worlds are doing.

Ivynwa ah beg no vex oh, it looks like ive upset you - ndo oh - sorry, i was just emphasising my point and did not mean to come across as abusive - if i did i apologise, shall we agree to disagree on this one?

All i was trying to say was that we should not let sentimentality cloud our judgement when dealing with our leaders, Jonathan is a public office holder who should be held to account for his actions however  his track record leaves much to be desired, i think that it was with this in mind that Ms Sesay interviewed him with such rigour.

no vex sis - can we still be friends? 

Ivynwa said:
You seem to be tripping for her little wonder you are all these protective of her. I agree that she is a beautiful lady too.
Why don't you open up to her     and while you are at it do get me her contacts so that I can remind her to maintain her level-headedness on
her way reaching for the sky. She seems to have forgotten that elders must be respected, that one must allow others to finish their statements in a conversation and not cut them off rudely as if they are s-t-u-pid and that in whatever situation that one mustn't tackle an elder from such offensive sides that she did. I mean those questions can be phrased better with an unbiased mind and without sounding abrasive, confrontational and disrespectful.
Is it not our goodly-two-shoes Jonathan that could not find it in him enough to put her in her place like OBJ did in his own interview.

Ivynwa its not so much about me tripping for her as you said but that i just cant see how she disrespected GEJ.

She was doing her job, perhaps she is appalled by what she has seen in nigeria, she actually commented about the fact that nigeria is a rich country and yet the level of poverty is so extreme, she probably could not reconcile how there could be so much poverty coexisting with so much wealth, as a CNN journalist she probably has had access to some of the wealthiest people in nigeria and is simply staggered at the blatant and callous disregard that those with such huge wealth can have for their own people.

I can not defend or support a man  who has done nothing to distinguish himself since his brief tenure in office, can you tell me one tangible thing that this man has done for the nigerian people?  Is anyone talking about the millions he and his wife stole from the bayelsa state treasury, why should i protest if i see such a man being rigorously quizzed by a foreign journalist.  Isha is asking questions that no nigerian journalist dare ask.   This is not the time to get sentimental and bring up issues about disrespect - Jonathan and his cronies do not deserve any respect because they are theifs who are on a mission to impoverish and destroy the nigerian people, lets put sentimentality and emotions to one side and face up to the reality of the situation.  If we want to move forward as a nation we have to learn to stand up for the truth, sycophancy will only condemn us to a life of enslavement.

Sagamite:
Lay down the tin foil hat!

saggy - you can't handle the truth, but its about to come back and bite you in the butt, dont say i didnt warn you!!!!

You think GEJ is your messiah - i give this your love affair with him 2 months!!!then e go clear you for eye!!!

its just a matter of time.

Sagamite:
Oh, yeah!!! Now there it is.

It is white conspiracy.

They are after us. They want to take over. They want to bring back slavery.

The whites are at fault for everything.

better believe it saggy

redsun:
One would have expected concerned nigerians to be happy with courageous and honest people like her that are able to confront our rogue leaders with their ills.

i have discovered (belatedly) that our people are a bunch of pathetic sycophants, here we have a man whose wife was indicted on money laundering charges, who has done absolutely nothing for anyone since he has been in the corridors of power and yet what you have are sycophants rushing to defend him and for what

Was it wrong for Isha to ask him what he stands for? because lets face it - what exactly DOES HE STAND FOR APART FROM THE USUAL LOOTING AND CORRUPTION.

All i will say is may the nigerian populace continue to enjoy many more years of suffering, poverty and misery at the hands of this man and his cronies, this is just the beginning - you think OBJ was bad - you just wait and see what GEJ has in store for you once he starts implementing part 2 of the washington consensus.

Sagamite:
Absolutely wrong.

Yes, an interviewer needs to control the interview but her demeanor was unnecessarily aggressive and rude in tone.

She only needed that level of aggression IF (1) her questions are being avoided/not answered or (2) she is dealing with a notorious criminal leader/personality.

I did not spot either of the 2 before she chose her stance, she just moronically delivered her questions in that manner because she stupidly thought that is the style that it should be. This is common amongst most headline-seeking, foolish western journalists nowadays.

Are you telling me you would accept if she interviewed Mandela or even Gani that way?

first of all dont EVER compare this ijaw thief to Mandela or Gani because they are NOT IN THE SAME CATEGORY OKAY.

When did the nigerian people elect Jonathan as their president?

this ijaw crook should first of all explain to the bayelsa state people what he and his wife did with N101 million and $35 m which they stole from the bayelsa state treasury.

This Jonathan of a man is not even fit to be a permanent secretary in bayelsa state  talk less of a president of a nation  so he should swallow whatever insult you think he has been given because he thoroughly deserves it.

redsun:
U are just a nuisance that never seems to have outright stands.What is moronic about her altitude?At a point she was even scared of agbero,jonathan that got spontaneously angry when he was asked about the endemic corruption in nigeria.

preach it bro

Princek12:
Poster,
I watched the entire interview and did not see where Isha Sesay disrespected GEJ. Do you want her to kneel down before asking him questions? Do you want her to call GEJ daddy as a sign of respect? She is the interviewer and, as a result, must control the interview, which is what experienced journalists do, for they have limited times within which to get the interviewee to answer all their questions.

Sadly, the problem with people like you, like many Nigerians, is that you are used to having your speech restricted for so long, and you are not used to seeing journalists who freely challenge authority. So when you now see a Western journalist who is challenging authority by asking difficult questions, in an attempt to elicit an answer, you call that disrespect.

Maybe you should point to the specific time that the alleged disrespect occurred. You are probably one of those villagers who thinks women should unreasonably subordinate themselves to a man to show him respect. Get a friggin life!

at last - the voice of reason - thank you sir

whichever party IBB decides to allign himself to makes no difference, his objective remains the same and his backers objectives remain the same. IBB intends to make himself Nigeria's Mobutu Sese Seko and i can see it happening. Why even bother counting the votes when the outcome has already been predetermined.

ROSSIKE:
cap28 said:

You are wrong.

What exactly do you expect the Nigerian army to do for the people that would be ''worth celebrating''? As far as I know we've not been attacked by any nation, so what is our military supposed to do? Invent an ''enemy'' and start a shooting war just to please you?

No but what the nigerian govt could do is trim the bloated army and spend those billions of dollars that it wastes on "defence" on adequate housing, constant electricity, running water, health care and the construction of a comprehensive transportation system in the country, that would definitely be worth celebrating.


I dont know if you are aware of this but nations that spend vast sums of money on military defence tend to be either imperialist nations ie with expansionist objectives like the US or repressive ones  - ie with the objective of crushing dissent or opposition within their own countries like nigeria.  Other developed nations like britain, germany, france can AFFORD to allocate huge sums on military defence because they do not have the same type of socio economic problems that nigeria has such as mass poverty, unemployment, inadequate housing, inadequate health care etc
Does it make sense to you that despite not being at war with any nation we allocate huge sums of money towards the purchase of military hardware - can you justify for me why this is important?

Do you suggest we send emails round to various nations seeking a combat opponent?

Funny!!!! but the jokes on you who does not seem to think that there is something wrong with spending huge sums of money on defence while 70% of the population live on $1 a day.
 

Or are you suggesting we attack neighbouring territories in order to fulfill your condition of having ''fought and defeated an external enemy''?

My point was this : nigeria has never fought or defeated an external enemy, neither has it been under threat of invasion therefore it makes no sense allocate huge sums of money on defence when that revenue could be put to better use.

Aside from brutalising, maiming and killing innocent civilians within their own country  and committing genocide against the igbos during the nigeria/biafra civil war i do not recall any time that the nigerian military's "greatness"  or courage has ever actually been tested. 

Before you mention ECOMOG please remember that nigeria were performing a peace keeping role only and were not engaged in protracted combat also nigeria was instructed to send troops to liberia and sierra leone by the US who did not want to comitt their own troops to these areas, i would therefore describe the ECOMOG project as nigeria doing america's dirty work.

The US army could not guarantee the safety of its citizens on 9/11. The US army cannot guarantee the safety of citizens in its major cities, each of whose murder rate is in the thousands per year!

have you ever heard of americans being massacred by rampaging lynch mobs on american soil with the american military standing helplessly by and doing nothing? It beggars beleif that you would compare a plane being flown into the world trade centre by alleged terrorists with a rampaging lynch mob. 

Lesson: Shhit happens. No country's military on earth can ''guarantee'' anything!

Try telling that to the indigenes of Odi, Gbamaratu and Zaki Biam where soldiers rampaged through their villages ra.ping, shooting, maiming and brutalising innocent unarmed civilians before burning entire villages to the ground, have you ever heard of western soldiers perpertrating such atrocities on their own people?

And why exactly does the govt need hundreds of jet fighters, warships and tanks for protection against an unarmed civilian population

That's the strangest thing you've written.

I see  you are  yet to awaken from your deep slumber, okay this is how it works - when you run a dictatorship like nigeria you keep people in line by way of violence, terror and repression, that is what all those unmanned drones, militarised police , JTF , automatic weapons, tanks, are for - to kill, maim and brutalise any potential threat, to crush any form of opposition from the nigerian populace  - do you get it now?

I see. So NOW that IBB has been rejected by his northern constituency in favour of Atiku, are we to expect the Nigerian military to launch attacks against Nigerians soon in defence of IBB's ambition?

IBB is not out of the race yet and i am pretty sure that if he wins the presidential ticket come 2011 there will be mass protest, do you think he will go quietly the way he did on June 12?? or do you think he will stamp his authority down using various arms of the nigerian police state?  take a guess?

Mbeki:
The name Nigeria should be changed from what Lord Lugard's mistress gave the territory since inception; other African countries did that.
Gold Coast- Ghana
Upper Volta-Burkina Faso.
Nigeria was formerly called[b] slave coast [/b]before the Lord Lugard mistress renamed it Nigeria.

Other names that needs immediate change.

Lagos (Lagoon in Portuguese) Should be named[b] EKO[/b]

Escravos (Slave) should be renamed[b] Freedom city[/b]

Port Harcourt should be renamed[b] Port Jaja[/b]

Nigeria should be deleted and befitting name should be used, until then, the country is still not independent.

I am in total agreement with you, but the change should only happen when we become an emancipated nation ie free from the current puppet administrations that we have had since 1960. Failing that we might as well go back to calling ourselves the slave coast since we are still in chains (mental).

nigerian political analyst Chinweizu Ibekwe really got it right when he described nigerian leaders behaviour as similar to the behaviour of the crew of a ship which had just hit a massive iceberg. Instead of attending to the engine which had stalled and trying to find a way to restart it, the stupi.d crew started rearranging the deck chairs which had scattered all over the deck. This is the mentality of the average nigerian govt official - instead of focusing on the fact that the average nigerian lives in a permanent state of poverty, unemployment and despair caused by the evil greed, blatant wickedness and callous disregard for their own people they focus on penalising nigerians for disrespecting their so called national anthem, if the whole thing were not so tragic you would have to laugh.

here we have cecilia ibru making a complete fool of herself when being grilled on hardtalk and using the same excuses that GEJ used when asked why 70% of the nigerian population live on $1 a day :


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQ3QXZCRSp8&feature=related

Ive never had any respect for CNN as its just another propaganda machine designed to desseminate the usual half truths, omissions and distortions, however Isha Sesay did ask GEJ important questions that need to be answered. 

For example what has the nigerian govt done with all of its oil revenue which has been generated over a 50 year period and why is there still such grinding poverty in a country as rich as nigeria.  These are very important questions to which GEJ failed to give any coherent responses, on this basis i have no bone to pick with Ms Sesay.  With regard to her manner again i dont see anything wrong with the way in which she addressed GEJ, i think many of the negative comments directed towards her are mainly because she is - an attractive, well spoken, oxbridge  black woman.  Something tells me that this level of criticism would not have been leveled against her had she been a white man, after all OBJ was subjected to a severe grilling on hardtalk here:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9sLfCeKC-E

and i dont recall anyone getting angry at the hardtalk presenter , i wonder why.

Martinosi i agree with your comments regarding western anchors , many of their questions are scripted and you are right the higher up you go the more restrained you have to become with regard to the questions that you ask western politicians. 

Many news anchors are connected with intelligence services and tend to be handpicked by the owners of these corporations, they earn huge salaries and are very very mindful of not stepping on the toes of their paymasters.  This immunity from rigorous interrogation accorded to western politicians does not however, extend to african dictators and other "leaders" of third world countries like nigeria and i think it is for this reason that they are subjected to a slightly more rigorous and intense interview style whenever they venture anywhere near western news media.

Beleive me the nigerian politicians are getting a very easy ride now, if they were ever to fall foul of the western media and actually do something beneficial for their own people like Chavez or Gadaffi then you would see what a disrespectful news interview is really like.

i dont have any sympathy for them when they are mauled and grilled by foreign journalists (which was not the case here), if they were honest leaders i would jump to their defence , but again i think Ms Sesay was fine - she's also very hot 

[quote author=isale_gan2 link=topic=547753.msg7204788#msg7204788 date=1290557845]I said I'd tackle this later.  I'm not sure how to start.  It'll have to be stream of consciousness.

What's making you feel this way?[/quote]i feel this way because nothing ever seems to change in nigeria, we are still recycling the same old thiefs who destroyed nigeria in the past , IBB who was recently endorsed by the US state department, GEJ - who despite not being a member of the old brigade was involved in a corruption scandal along with his wife in which both of them looted the Bayelsa state treasury of N101 million and $35 million respectively.

Then you have all the other hangers on cronies and sychophants who remain in the corridors of power - these people have nothing positive in store for nigeria, on this basis i think we are still a long way away from an emancipated nation, in full control of our destiny.

All day, reading about the planning and political maneuverings leading up to the presidential election, it just kind of hit me: Wow, the Ibos haven't had one of their own as Head of State in eons.  It kind of made me understand a little better what may be contributing to why some express feelings of being marginalized.  Or maybe it's just the ones on NL.  Honestly, Nigerians used to get along better in the old days.  A non-Nigerian or even a Nigerian who hasn't lived in the country in years, reading Nairaland and some of the internet stuff,  would think all the tribes are at each others throats 24/7.  Another Rwanda.  God forbid it!  That'll not happen in my generation, I resolve.   Even the Rwandans didn't expect that.  They got along great too, until the usual suspects worked their evil magic.  I digress.   

To be honest with you i dont really care about the ethnicity of nigeria's head of state , i m more concerned about what is in his heart, what his intentions are towards the nigerian people and what his vision and long term goals are for the country, none of the current contenders have shown that they have anything to offer the nigerian people other than more poverty, more mass unemployment, more police brutality more inflated food prices and more overall despair. 

So, yeah.  Am not sure how it's all gonna turn out, but I'm not giving up hope.  I know life for most in Naija is unreal.  Who'd have thought we'd be looking back in 2010, and still NEPA continues to take light.  Generators became a permanent household appliance.   

Still, I just don't feel hopeless or disillusioned.  Yet.  Not permanently anyway.
There's some progress being made.  There's ongoing investigations of corrupt politicians, the ones going into public service simply to go chop money will be weeded out.  Then they'll go for the big guys.  Maybe that'll keep people like IBB and OBJ out of it so we can move forward.   Retire them for good.  After 8 years each, stay the heck out! 

We'll see.   

-Isale Gangan

I wish i could share your optimism, a corrupt system will remain corrupt until the architects of that system are brought to book and punished for their crimes, there is no way that the likes of GEJ, Buhari or IBB can reform a system that they are part of and have created.  IBB appropiated over $12 billion USD during his tenure - to date he has not accounted to the nigerian people as to what he did with the money, various retired generals have millions of stolen money sitting in various bank accounts aroudn the world and these people are the power brokers in nigeria today.   The existing system as it stands is rotten from top to bottom and therefore i dont expect anything constructive from such a system - the only  solution is a grass roots movement which will bring to book all corrupt leaders - past and present, a system that will introduce harsh penalties for all nigerian public officials who choose to appropriate nigeria's oil revenue.

[quote author=isale_gan2 link=topic=547753.msg7199130#msg7199130 date=1290499754]Okay, so this is where it gets dicey.  We're at a crossroads here, because I couldn't disagree more.  I never expect any Nigerian who was around or who has heard first-hand retelling of the war and the fear engendered in people and everything else a civil war entails to ever think that a "secession" or a violent overthrow, (because trust me, there is no revolution without violence) would be our way to resolving the problem of Nigeria.

Honestly, that has been tried.  And it failed.  Woefully.[/quote]Isale you have to remember that Ojukwu did not set out to start a war - he merely wanted secession which he believed he could achieve through non violent means, unfortunately his inexperience prevented him from seeing the bigger picture and it also prevented him from understanding that former colonial powers such as britain had a greater interest in keeping nigeria "united" , not because they were interested in the development of the country as one entity but because this would be the only way they could ensure they retained control over the vast oil reserves located in the south east.  The british had already appointed the northerners as their stooges who were to run nigeria in accordance with the economic policies set out by them, they did not trust an igbo or yoruba leader in that role hence their decision to jail Awo on trumped up charges and relegate Zik to a powerless political position after "independence".

Therefore it is wrong to conclude that the secession movement was a failure as it was brutally and violently crushed by a puppet govt who were acting under instructions from britain.

It's been done!  Why go back to an experiment that failed?  Do you not think a lot of the problems we continue to face: the division, the paranoia, the unrelenting tribalism - "oh, they have more than we do, oh the Hausa have this and that" and all that nonsense - is us still paying for this hideous war?  All the people that died.  Look at any society that's suffered a civil war - how many decades later they're still trying to put themselves back together.  It's like a human being who has been traumatized (Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder, if you will), do they not continue to rebuild their lives decades later?  Talk less of a country made up of millions of parts?

This "experiment" as you describe it did not just occur out of the blue - the igbos were being massacred in the north by hausa lynch mobs, the nigerian head of state at the time - Gowon - did nothing to stop these massacres, as a result over 50,000 igbos were butchered in unprovoked attacks by hausas, the igbos were forced to flee to the south east to protect their lives and property, some igbos who tried to escape were butchered while trying to make their way east - the surviving igbos were completely traumatised by this situation and felt that the only option open to us was secession.  

Desperate times call for desperate solutions, but in this instance the call for secession by igbos was justified, the only other option was extermination at the hands of the northern oligarchy.

I just personally, without delving too much into the logistics of the war, am so not in favor anything close to even a suggestion of breaking away.  Who are you breaking away from?  You really think the Hausas are out to destroy Ibos, or Yorubas are trying to overthrow or overtake any other tribe?  Puh-leeze!  Let's even skip 1, 2, 3, 9 steps of what needs to take place to accomplish a "successful" secession, to predict conditions of a post-divided Nigeria?

Well the facts speak for themselves, today nigeria is run by the northern oligarchy in conjunction with some yoruba and igbo collaborators who have chosen personal advancement over national advancement.
You only have to look at the inequitable distribution of wealth, the fact that the niger delta region, despite contributing to the bulk of  nigeria's oil revenue suffers acute under development, inadequate infrastructure, environmental degradation, poverty and high crime rates.
nigeria is the only member state of OPEC whose citizens have never enjoyed a rise in their living standards since the discovery of oil

So, in Africa, after the Imperialists Invasions, Western Exploitation of our Natural Resources, Slavery, Colonization, Independence Struggles, Military Coups, Apartheid, Internecine wars, Border conflicts, Oil boom, Financial ruin and back to Rebuilding again, we are going to regress to a civil war in the giant of Africa?  How does this take place?  What influence do you think that will have on our neighbours, hanging tenuously onto democracy.  I mean.  Seriously!

-Isale Gangan

It's late here, so I'll pick this up after you reply.

Well as it stands most african nations remain under imperialist domination, however instead of these imperial nations being physically present in africa they use their financial institutions like the world bank and the imf to impose economic policies on african nations, thereby ensuring that we remain in perpetual debt, their multinational organisations also impose a range of economic trade agreements on african countries which stagnate our economies, undervalue our currencies and create an economic environment favourable for their own businesses whilst detrimental to the growth of our own economies.

MandingoII:



This nigga STAY NEGATIVE.

This mofo don't know the meaning of happiness.

so he pushes it all upon Nairaland.


sad a.r.s.e nigerian in the UK

uncle tom why do you insist on stalking me all over NL?  I thought you said you prefer being in the company of whites rather than africans because you have more in common with them -   remember these words:

MandingoII:
What Africans FAIL to realize


is that Black Americans have more in common with their OPPPRESSOR.  The White man, THAN WITH AFRICANS.


personally, I feel more comfortable around White People (who I ignore) Than Africans (whose culture -I Cannnot get with)

I just showed u above^^^^^^Black Culture in Amerikka.

Understand it.,

Allow it to sink in.

Get with it.



All Black people DO NOT have the same CULTURE.  S. African and Nigerians DO NOT MIX.  Why?

different cultures

and remember my response:

Just as i thought - you desperately crave to be a white man - so in effect you are a self hating black man trapped in a black man's body thanks for letting us know, now i ask you this - what the hell are you doing on nairaland? why arent you trading stocks on the NYSE (if you can understand how it works) and amassing more of your supposed wealth- could it be because you are just another miserable, underemployed african american man earning minimum wage in some dead end job?

Okay so we have now established that you secretely love and admire whitey and would love nothing better if you could wake up tomorrow, look in the mirror and discover that you are now a white man who no longer has to walk around with the burden of being a black man in america, surely that means that the only reason that you have beef with white america is that you are resentful of the fact that you were born a black man and not because you beleive that the white supremacist system is unjust - how tragic!!

So youve got more in common with the white man who according to you you choose to ignore  than africans - wow im so impressed!!!

according to you - you and whitey both have the same culture - thats funny because the last time i checked white americans opted for complete and total separation from your communities - why is it that after the brown v board of education decision which permitted blacks to attend schools with white children the majority of whites went on a crazy rampage threatenting to kill, maim or beat blacks who dared to venture into their schools or neighbourhods , also explain to me why Kennedy had to call out federal troops to escort your african american people into white schools for their own security and protection.

You see what you are doing here is exposing just how desperate and pathetic you are, cant you get it through your thick skull that these people dont want you?  why are you begging people who hate you to accept you into their communities?  Why are  you pretending to have the same "culture" as people who handed down a second hand culture to you which you glorify, praise and pretend was something created out of your own ingenuity?

American culture is empty, false and based on immorality,greed, hatred and empty materialism and this is what people like you praise and aspire to.

You know what?  you deserve the hellish existence that you have been condemned to in america.

Now i understand why you are so mad at me and continue stalking me all over NL 

personality traits of people who tend to be on the receiving end of abusers:

Intense need for love and affection. (See Love Addiction)
Low self esteem. (Belief that they can't have / don't deserve better treatment.)
Drug or Alcohol Dependence.
A background involving physical, emotional or sexual abuse.
ACOA issues (Adult Children of alcoholics / addicts.)
Codependent personality disorder and / or Love addiction.
Enforced isolation creating resentment.
Strong need for a relationship to validate them.
Gain a sense of worth by care taking the abuser.
Inability to set and enforce interpersonal boundaries.
Difficulty expressing anger, tendency to internalize it, act it out in other ways.
Loyalty to the abuser takes precedence over emotional or physical safety.
Belief that "it will change if I just try harder."
Repeated attempts to leave the relationship.
Inability to follow through with leaving - return to the abuser again and again. 
Clinical depression, self - medication.
Suicide attempts. 

personality traits of abusers:

[b]Uncontrolled temper.
Extreme Jealousy. (See Love Addiction.)
Intense fear of abandonment. 
A background involving physical, emotional or sexual abuse, abandonment, ACOA issues.
Unrealistic expectations of a relationship. (To "fix" them or solve their problems.)
Isolation and antisocial temperament. 
Recklessness. (dangerous sexual behavior, reckless driving, drug use etc.)
Inability to accept responsibility for their behavior and actions, even in the face of dire consequences.
Cruelty to children / animals.
Threats of violence.
Low self-esteem, shame. 
Codependent personality disorder and / or Love addiction.
Inability to respect interpersonal boundaries, a compulsion to violate boundaries.
Drug or Alcohol Dependence, self medication.
Emotional volatitily -  fear of being "out  of control".
Need for power and control to compensate for the above.
Bipolar disorder and / or Borderline Personality Disorder.
Abuse generally escalates when the partner leaves.[/b]

guys/girls if any of this is happening to you in yr relationship - you need to chill:


jealousy or possessiveness towards you.
(Jealousy is the primary symptom of abusive relationships; it is also a core component of Sexual Addictions and Love Addiction.)
Tries to control you by being very bossy or demanding.
Tries to isolate you by demanding you cut off social contacts and friendships.
Is violent and / or loses his or her temper quickly.
Pressures you sexually, demands sexual activities you are not comfortable with.
Abuses drugs or alcohol.
Claims you are responsible for his or her emotional state. (This is a core diagnostic criteria for Codependency.)
Blames you when he or she mistreats you.
Has a history of bad relationships.
Your family and friends have warned you about the person or told you that they are concerned for your safety or emotional well being.
You frequently worry about how he or she will react to things you say or do.
Makes "jokes" that shame, humiliate, demean or embarrass you, whether privately or around family and friends.
Your partner grew up witnessing an abusive parental relationship, and/or was abused as a child.
Your partner "rages" when they feel hurt, shame, fear or loss of control.
Both parties in abusive relationships may develop or progress in drug or alcohol dependence in a (dysfunctional) attempt to cope with the pain.
You leave and then return to your partner repeatedly, against the advice of your friends, family and loved ones.
You have trouble ending the relationship, even though you know inside it's the right thing to do.

dear isale sorry for not getting back to you sooner, how are you doing?

thanks again for your brief comments on the fashola thread, sometimes i get so incensed at the responses from some posters, i know it doesnt really look cool when one has to descend to the level of abuse but sometimes it just cant be helped with the kind of opinions and responses that fly back and forth on here!! oh well what can you do.

yeah you were talking about starting up a blog - that is definitely something i intend to do very soon, actually its a work in progress, your input will be appreciated.

with regard to your comments about some of my views on some previous posts - my point was that i do not regard ojukwu as a befitting igbo leader, in my view he started out with an honourable cause but somewhere along the line he failed us, if biafra had succeeded in seceding 40 years ago we would have become a beacon to the entire black race but the odds were severely stacked against us and i think if we had someone of greater vision and experience leading the secession movement it would have been a different story.

Right now i am totally dissillusioned with nigeria and the people running it, they have nothing to offer the nigerian people or future generations to come except unemployment, more crime, more poverty and more collapsed institutions. We are now entering the second and possibly final stage of enslavement and we will not get out from under it until the ordinary working masses revolt and overthrow the elite which is running nigeria.

I mentioned that the best thing for nigeria now is to split along ethnic lines because i do not see any viable future for it as one nation, we are just too divided and have too many conflicting interests at play. I think if we seperate along ethnicity it will engender a feeling of nationalistic pride amongst each respective ethnic group that in turn will create a willingness on the part of the people within those groups to work towards building and developing their own respective part of the country.

anyway take care and speak soon

martinosi:
^^^^^^^
THE PART IN BOLD BY CAP28 IS SOO PRICELSS LOL



Lawwd have mercy the way CAP28 tears you guys apart is soo PRICELESS!!!, I just enjoy reading his post as that what i do most on Nairaland now since most people here talk blindly.

I Just want to say "Congrats to the Zenith Bank Director" who has signed up to nairaland and has promised to contribute after i had a chat with him when we met in Nigeria in August"

I told him to read CAP28 post and he say he is very impressed and somewhat suprised that  a Nigerian like CAP28 exist that understands the Real issues facing Nigeria,

Hey bro thanks for your comments -  im going to finish watching those your links on william engdahl, you know the funny thing is that these american and european political commentators and analysts have a much more indepth understanding of why nigeria is in the mess that its in because many of them are privy to information that is beyond the reach of many people.  They are also in a position to see the bigger picture.  When you are part of a superpower your view on world issues is clearer and more precise than everyone else's.
my favourite political commentators are Michael Parenti (former professor of political science at Yale) Noam Chomsky (linguist and poltical scientist) these two are some of the most unbiased and outstanding academics in the US.  

Even when i discuss with people who are interested in politics here in the west they seem to be so much more clued up about the world compared to our own people, they  understand what is going on, obviously not all of them but the ones who are genuinely interested in politics show a much more comprehensive understanding of what is actually going on.

my favourite poltical analyst is Michael Parenti - former professor of poltical science at Yale University:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Parenti

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Parenti/World_Safe_Hypocrisy_MP.html

He is an outstanding political analyst

by the way which of my posts was the zenith bank guy impressed with? anyway look forward to speaking soon, im gonna watch those links and get back to you.

Shock:
what kind of dolt are you? overcrowding and fashola is to blame for that? how about this, let's blame him for divorce cases too.

You must be one of Fashola's unpaid groupies, i think i touched a nerve when i mentioned the contract thingy, sorry dear no amount of bowing, scraping and arse kissing will get you a govt contract.  

Fashola is not to blame for what went before however he is now the governor of the state and is therefore responsible for prioritising his workload.
As stu.pid and backward as you are you still cannot see that there is such a thing as prioritisation of tasks, where in the world apart from hell hole nigeria does a governor of a state receive commendation  for planting flowers at road junctions when the state he governs is a filthy, crime ridden , overcrowded slum.  I know you are not used to living in a civilised, clean well organised environment that is why you can not understand what i am talking about. You obviously feel very much at home living on top of a pile of garbage in a rat infested neighbourhood with putrid open drains filled with raw sewage.

Again i will drum it into your empty head, road safety, fire rescue services etc should not be the priority of a governor who is running a disaster zone like lagos -  those are minor services which can more adequately be administered by lower level govt departments, they should not be placed at the top of a state governor's to do list.
During IBB's regime we had the federal road safety corp which was operating quite well under wole soyinkas' administration, why would  a state governor take on such a low level task when he has more pressing things to be getting on with.

Your failure to comprehend and desseminate simple sentences in english exposes you for the ignorant i.diot that you are - you keep moaning on about blame - who is blaming fashola for anything? illiterate, learn how to read and understand english before you demonstrate your shocking lack of comprehension on a public forum.  Fashola is the current state governor he has been the lagos state governor for over 4 years and his only acheivement to date is planting flowers at road junctions - in civilised countries of the world he would be forced to hand in his resignation not parade around as if he's just come up with a cure for cancer.  

If you had any iota of sense, you should know that the government under Fashola is doing the best to address unemployment issues.  you are so quick to right off those public services listed as less priority without thinking of thousands of Lagosians that are employed by those services or do you think the Lagos state road maintenance agency and many others are manned by robots? To even think you just mentioned that road safety and fire emergency are misplaced priorities classifies you as a really really dumb person!

You talk about iq when you are clearly mentally retarded.  Fashola is doing his best at what? -"addressing" unemployment issues - does that even sound like an intelligent statement in your ears, fool "addressing" - why is he still "addressing" these problems - when is he going to stop addressing them and start actually implementing actual policies to alleviate these problems?

I find it surprising that anyone with an IQ supposedly above 24   will blame a state government for a problem which is largely national, common sense will tell even the dullest person that people will continue to migrate to Lagos state from every cardinal zones to take up every available employment positions, and no matter what the efforts of the state government are, there will always be a shortage of opportunity.

Again your limited understanding and ability to comprehend the english language prompts you to resort to the use of the word "blame" fool let me say it again - no one is blaming fashola - what we are saying however is that he is now the governor of lagos state and is therefore now RESPONSIBLE for coming up with policies to tackle the major problems afflicting ordinary lagosians.  

It's amazing how fast you type and how slow you think, you talk about dilapidated Lagos slums and you don't think of the government's effort to clear up Oshodi, Ajegunle, Yaba, etc etc . . .I am sure you have absolutely no idea of the services rendered by the Lagos state waste maintenance authority. . .the lots of you internet dullards living in the UK are so quick to cast stones and expect a government to fix a problem of over 40 years within 4 years.   You talk about clearing slums without taking into consideration how practical it is to relocate people from one place to another in a state that is already carrying more than its intended capacity. I find it difficult to believe that people can ever be this foolísh.

Really, I wouldnt  even extend the use of the verb "think" to someone like you as clearly you are completey devoid of the ability to do so, you merely react in the animalistic and primitive manner that many people who live in that disgusting overcrowded slum you call lagos do.  Your crude jungle mentality prevents you from conducting yourself in anyway remotely associated with decorum, class or reasoning.  I can see why the likes of Fashola have left the place in the state that he found, with residents like you in the place its better off being left as a giant slum.

What an ediot ! Is there anywhere in the western world that interviews are conducted in such crude manner? one would think the fact that you claim to live in the UK would have exposed you to civilized methods of journalism.  The governor spent close to ten minutes to answer Sowore's questions and the dude still went on to stalk him after the interview, screaming like a child whose mummy didn't like him very much.

Being a dumb sycophant who is only used to kissing the feet of charlatans and criminals like fashola you do not understand the meaning of accountability.  In civilised countries like the UK we hold our politicians to account, you should try watching a programme called question time (thats if you'll be able to understand it) and you will see how members of the public speak to their politicians.  Timid lowlifes like yourself can't beleive that it is possible for a politican to be held to account let alone a fraudulent and corrupt one like Fashola.

Oh yes, there are places in Lagos that are clean, well planned and crime free, what kind of transformation are you expecting under four years? have you considered the socio economic implications of rapid environmental changes? what? you want him to build sound government housing estates for those living in slums, construct massive infrastructures, pay civil service salaries, fund technology initiatives etc etc, at what cost?

Like i said you do not deserve to live in a clean environment because that is not what you are used to.  Most individuals with an iota of common sense would be on the streets lobbying their govt for proper housing, refuse free rat infested neighbourhoods, constant electricity and running water, but the likes of you are content to live in those dilapidated slums you call homes and feel grateful and even privileged for being in that position.

There are slums even in the finest places of the western world, and developing an already overfilled state is a gradual slow process, that is what the lots of you [i]i[/i]diots expecting an overnight miracle will never understand.

Yes thats true but they are no where as disgusting as the so called middle income neighbourhoods that many people in lagos live in.  the roads are not filled with giant potholes, there is no refuse on the streets and there are no giant rats and cockroaches  taking up residence alongside human inhabitants in those residences.

If you don't get excited about planting flowers, i suggest you enroll in a program that will bring you forward to reality, governments of every sane world is embracing a green initiative program to ensure that the environment is aesthetically desirable and pleasant to live in.

Fine, enjoy the flowers, I would have said enjoy the roads but they are only being constructed in the affluent areas which obviously the like of you cant afford to live in, so enjoy your rat infested slum hole and on your way to work stop by the road junctions where the flowers are and pick a few of them, then sell them to people in your work place, im sure they will help to augment your starvation wages!!!!

here's an advise, why don't you go and die, and save the world some space.  who cares if you are too dáft or purposefully too blind to see the efforts of the current government? you are just one of the many whose opinion gives little meaning anyways.

the funny thing is that you will probably end up  dying before me what with the unsanitary conditions that you live in, the armed robbers, the death trap roads, the non existent health care provision, the starvation wages and the overall grim and grinding poverty that you are currently condemned to living in.  Have a nice life.

Shock:
^^^

Your logic does not depict a well reasoned thought process and I'd tell you why.

First, this is totally not true, except of cos you are in the "paint-the-dog-black-just-to-hang-it" group. In all my experience in Lagos, i had no idea that public service groups such as :- Red cross, Search and Rescue, Fire emergency, First aid, Road safety, etc existed, not until the recent administration put in place a system that will ensure such groups function.

Your preoccupation is with the red cross, search and rescue first aid and road safety, you are not preoccupied with the dilapidated lagos slums , high unemployment, overcrowding, open sewers overflowing with putrid filth, police brutality no those are unimportant to you the thing that top your list of priorities is to see that the red cross, search and rescue, fire emergency and road safety are operational.  Isnt this a classic case of misplaced priorities, no wonder these nigerian politicians continue to run rings around you lot over there.

Besides that, Lagos about 10 years ago is a no go area for feeble minded individuals, thuggery, wallet snatching, public harassment, environmental pollution , etc, are carried out in the public with reckless abandon, all these things are now out-phased with a better and much more secured system in place.

No lagos was and still is a no go area for anyone who likes living in a clean, well planned, crime free environment  not everyone gets excited about a governor planting flowers at road junctions and building one or two roads in affluent neighbourhoods.
Surely Fashola's priority should be tackling lagos's more pressing problems such as high unemployment, crime, poor housing and unsanitary living conditions.  

Saying Fashola has only built few roads and done few cosmetic changes is totally unfair.

Again, this is a statement you can't substantiate.

Sycophants with low standards such as yourself are grateful for just about any crumbs that are thrown your way, tell me one tangible thing that this man has done for the average unemployed person in lagos, go on suprise me.

Quite true Sowore asked the right questions, but his questions were directed in a rude manner that does not demonstrate any form of professionalism, his tone was coarse, and he let his emotions cloud his sense of judgement.

Again because you are a sycophant with very low standards who refuses to hold your leaders to account you beleive that everyone else should be like you.  The fact that Sowore did not adopt a sycophantic tone of voice when speaking to your royal highness fashola should indicate to you that he refuses to jump on the bandwagon of professional arse licking which is the favourite past time of people like yourself.

In as much as I am a strong advocate that all public holders are to be held accountable for funds entrusted in their care, the logic in your argument in quotes above, assumes that all revenues generated had been used in building toll gates and laying out flower beds.  I find this line of thought quite pathetic and disturbing, something i wouldn't have expected from a well learned individual. I really don't know if i should be telling you this, but besides putting up infrastructures, the government invests and saves too.

You are not a strong advocate of anything other than to bow before your master with a pathetic smile on your face, hoping that you will be the next beneficiary of a govt contract, people like you are ruining the future of nigeria and nigerians, gutless parasites like yourself who couldnt stand up for the truth even if their lives depended on it.  Do i care what you expect from me? what am i doing with your expectations? Before you start doling out unwanted advice you better listen to the nonsense that you regurgitate.  Sowore is a man of courage - a man who dares to challenge the status quo and all people like you can come out with is that he didnt address his royal highness fashola with respect, what kind of way of reasoning is that!!!

Why dont you list for me tangible and constructive projects that have been implemented by fashola which benefit ordinary lagosians instead of rambling on incoherently.

You have no standards that is why the building of a few roads in affluent neighbourhoods of lagos state have got you genuflecting at fashola's feet.

May you continue to enjoy many more years of economic mismanagement under his tenure.

buzugee:
so you are equating greatness to how you are treated by white people or any prejudiced person ?   that kind of reasoning deserves a pulitzer price for stupidity.


and all those taxes you mentioned ? you dont think the govt in the west collects all those taxes too ? in addition to heavily taxing the people ? to keep a country going the way it should, especially a country the size of nigeria, you need trillions of dollars. you think you can get trillions of dollars from those lil things you mentioned ?

dummy please wake up and smell the coffee - which country currently is the most powerful? is it a black country asian country or white country?  

Which country's currency is the world reserve currency?

Which country spends the most amount of money on military hardware, training and defence?

which country's language, culture, music, film, literature, political structures and economic policies dominate and are found all over the world?

Now lets see if you can work out what the answer to the above are, if you answer correctly then you will know that whoever maintains that position in the world DICTATES TO AND CONTROLS THE BUSINESS OF EVERYONE ELSE .

As a result the way such a person treats you  is important because it is an indication of where you stand in the pyramid of power, so therefore it does matter.

Also if you are placed at the bottom of that pyramid that should demonstrate to you that in the scheme of things you are virtually powerless. 

Greatness is measured according to how much control you have over your destiny, how much right you have over your own self determination - WE AFRICANS RIGHT NOW HAVE PRACTICALLY NO CONTROL OVER OUR OWN DESTINIES, EVERYTHING WE DO IN AFRICA TODAY IS BEING DICTATED TO AND CONTROLLED FROM OUTSIDE THE CONTINENT.

You even demonstrate how you are a victim of such a system by referring to the "pulitzer prize" why didnt you say okoro prize, ade prize or musa prize Keep digging a hole for yourself.  

by the way petroleum tax is not a "lil thing" it accounts for 65% of nigeria's budgetary income, other major sources of FGN revenue are import and excise duties, mining rents and royalties.

How about import tax is that lil as well? are you trying to tell me that all the goods that nigerians import into the country are  imported tax free?

tensor says that most nigerians are self employed and therefore dont pay paye income tax, how about all the self employed traders and other business men in nigeria, do you think they will be able to set up their shops or businesses without paying tax?

Traders in the market - i suppose they trade without paying any licence fees to the local govt, the other day they showed a programme on the bbc about how the national union of road transport workers in lagos uses area boys to intimidate and shake down hundreds of traders in various markets all over lagos, why do you think they do this? where does  the money obtained from this extortion racket go?

Okay lets stay with your story that nigerians do not pay tax - if that is indeed the case why is it that the respective local  govts ask for tax clearance certificates before you can qualify for certain govt services?

buzugee:
there you go again on your midget pulpit trying to spar with giants like tensor777, invisible and myself. why cant you just get in where you fit in ? amongst the intellectual midgets like oviE   everything you regurgitated up there is absolute garbage. in this life in order to be recognized as a somebody you have to be part of a great nation ? ? ? ? ? ? where the heck did you pull that out from ? a cracker jack box ? the richest man in the world is from mexico, mandela, desmond tutu, dangote, emeagwali, are these all not great men ?

there is no doubt in anyone's mind that mandela and desmond tutu are great men - nobody is disputing that - these are black icons who fought courageously against white oppression.

dangote, emeagwali are most definitely NOT icons - they may have accomplished a lot as INDIVIDUALS however if dangote or emeagwali arrive at any western airport in the world -they will simply be faceless black men with nigerian passports and will be treated accordingly - if they walk through the streets of any western nation they may be unlucky enough to face discriminatory treatment from the police, or other members of white society, they will not automatically be accorded the type of treatment that a white person arriving in any foreign country in the world will be accorded - WHY? because in a white controlled world - the black race has no respect as a collective group - you can take it or leave it, it doesnt matter what you have acheived on an individual basis but as a collective group blacks are disrespected and given the worst treatment worldwide because there is no black nation that has risen to the rank of a G8 nation or even a G20 nation, if you want to test how respected you are go travelling around the world with your white friends - you will see how the treatment they will receive from authorities will differ from the treatment you will receive, oh and dont forget to use your nigerian passport!

this fool is crazy. how many britons and americans pass on anything at all to their offsprings ? less than 1 percent of the population. the rest of them get their kids to take out student loans etc because they cannot afford to send their kids to post-secondary education. i see you have been drinking that cheap manya again

they get their kids to take out student loans WHEN THEY ARE ALIVE, however WHEN THEY DIE , THEY USUALLY LEAVE INHERITANCES TO THEIR CHILDREN - the  average british person no matter how poor inherits a morgage free property from their parents or grandparents, this is why many whites have a head start on non white people.  they have had access to property and wealth at least 400 years ahead of us.  

i find this one laughable because you dont even know how nigeria works let alone the world. you fail to realize that the problem with nigeria is not the govt. the problem with nigeria is the people in it. ingrained corruption amongst the people means that they will try every way possible to avoid paying all the taxes that are needed to make the country run. without those taxes you cannot have roads, an effective police force, electricity, water etc. you fail to realize this yet you are grandioseing on being a world expert ? laughable

earlier on i made a list of various taxes that the nigerian govt realises revenue from - here they are again:

income tax, petroleum profit tax, capital gains tax, personal income tax from  foreigners residing in Nigeria.

custom and excise duties,  VAT,

oil pipeline license fees, rents for mining rights, mining fees, royalties on minerals, NNPC earnings from direct sales, penalties for gas flared, rents of oil well.

So you're saying to me that the govt finds it difficult to levy paye income tax which is deducted directly from salaries, how about petroleum profit tax which is levied directly at source from foreign oil companies operating in nigeria - they find it difficult collecting those as well?, customs and excise duties - same thing, oil pipelines fees - buzugee please can you stop making yourself look stu.pid and face up to the reality of what is actually going on in nigeria -  i will ask you again what is the federal govt of nigeria doing with the revenue realised from the abovementioned taxation?

the sychophantic attitude of that audience towards fashola turned my stomach upside down . the fact that all this man has done is just build roads using tax payers money and carry out a few cosmetic changes to the appearance of lagos is what makes it all the more depressing.

why is this man being hailed as some sort of revolutionary figure when he is still part and parcel of the same stable of corrupt politicians.

the average nigerian has extremely low mentality this is why we get excited over a governor carrying out a few superficial changes all in the name of development. I think Sowore asked very important questions which most sychophantic brainwashed nigerians are too dumb to understand. If Sowore made a mistake about the facts regarding a fire which broke out somewhere in nigeria, so what? thats not even the point - the issue here is that the likes of arrogant fashola should be held accountable for their actions, they have been entrusted with millions of naira in tax payers money and all they can show for it is building toll gates and laying out flower beds in public areas - is this how low are standards are ?

So we are getting excited and swooning before this supposed messiah simply because he built a few roads - god help us.

tensor777:
Cap you know you just talk the most amazing nonsense at times. Those investments you talk about were they not gotten from capitalism and the free market economy.
You are living in a country that has benefited from capitalism and whose wealth was founded on international mercantilism and enjoying the benefits therein and yet foolishly you are denigrating those Nigerians who are working hard for themselves and their families by the same buying and selling!!
As I have said just shut it if you have nothing sensible to contribute.

Yes europe and america built their wealth on capitalism however the working classes of those countries who today benefit from that system and who possess wealth and assets as a result of having a stake in those systems, are only in that position because they understood the importance of collective action and endeavour.

Do you think the ordinary man or woman in america or europe woke up one morning with access to jobs, employment, good housing,?  NO they had to fight the elite of their respective countries to obtain them, why didnt they sit around and do their own thing individually like invisible? Because they understood the futility of such an action. Instead they formed collective groups and they worked as a unit with a common agenda and objective.

It was from such collective action that the working man/woman in the west were able to fight and win concessions from their respective govts.  This sort of action enabled them to acquire workers rights, equal pay for women, aboliton of child labour, health and safety rights, social security provision.  the blacks in the US also had to fight for the abolition of segregation in education, employment, housing, health care and of course the right to vote.  Had the ordinary workers of these countries NOT fought for those rights they would be just like the likes of invisible in nigeria bragging about being able to buy a broken down old jalopy and build a house in the midst of a rat infested neighbourhood.

My point  is that they laid the foundation for a civilised society first, today they are reaping the benefits of what they fought for, in nigeria no foundation has been laid down and nobody has fought for anything, the igbos of eastern nigeria TRIED to fight for the right of self determination but were ruthlessly crushed by the hausa fulani and their cowardly collaborators and stooges.

the average nigerian is not prepared to make any type of sacrifice for the overall benefit of the majority and therefore nigeirans will continue to s uffer collectively under the current repressive system.  there is nothing hardworking about working for your own selfish gain and not caring about the plight of the majority. What does it matter if out of a population of 150 million people only a handful can afford to live like human beings.

This is where the europeans, asians, african americans  and arabs  are ahead of us and will remain ahead of us - they think and act collectively, collective endeavour is the secret of success, individual effort is nothing but a drop in the ocean.

so my suggestion to you is either start learning now to reeducate yourself or simply stay out of discussions or debates that are way out of your depth.