₦airaland Forum

DUNKA:
Goodday please do you have an idea on Xpert hybrid inverter as advertised on The Solar Shop?

Dunka The Solar Shop has discontinued them. What would you like to know? I have about 6 of them installed for customers and my own consumption. 4 in Lagos and 2 in Port Harcourt.

TheBestGovernor:
Please, in as much as I know you mean no harm, change the notion that the knowledge of yourself or chris81964 is greater than mine in this regard.

I don't doubt the fact that PWMs would work, in fact many people use them, all I'm saying is that the best choice remains MPPT in terms flexibility, maximum power extraction, future expansion, driving of low voltage applications from higher voltage applications,DC to DC conversion e.t.c

I also stated that MPPTs are quite expensive but solar solutions is not just about adding more panels, it is more than that.

Most solar panel installations I have seen do not also take orientation to sun's ray into cognizance. Solar panel performance can also be optimized based on orientation to the sun's ray.

Brother or Sister @thebestgovernor

Nobody is a sole repository of knowledge.
Each application demands a unique solution. PWM were the game in town until the MPPT resolved their reliability issues. On some applications like street lighting a PWM makes better sense. If your system is less than 400 Watts a PWM may make sense because you want to save money. I wrote something earlier on why an MPPT out performs a PWM.
Regarding orientation. That is something that most installers are unaware of. They tell you the panels should face east. They install panels under a tree or have the panels covered or shaded by something. All these things are critical.

Please take no offense. Each person is trying in their way to impart knowledge.

gbigbega:
Thanks for this useful info.
I will like to install a 5kva Inverter that's hybrid (uses solar panel and PHCN), please what will be the cost of this?

You are setting yourself up big time. 5 kva inverter does not convey any information to us. How do you know 5 va is adequate or too much?
Start by calculating your loads and how long you want to power them and then someone can design a system and give you a quote.
A generator runs on fuel and you can buy fuel when it runs out. Solar runs on the sun and you have to wait till the sun shines to replenish. PHCN will allow for us to give you slightly less panel capacity by stretching the amount of daily irradiance you get.
I hope this helps. Send a message to either one of us and we will be happy to help you.

TheBestGovernor:
Most Nigerian inverter application is usually >=800VA (600W , using P.F of 0.75). From extensive observations and current usage of an MPPT charge controller, MPPT is the way to go.

In as much as would not like a controversy on this, you could loose up to 35% of charging power when you use PWM charge controllers in whatever application.

Another important point I did not mention is that MPPT charge controllers give greater flexiblity when you need to expand you solar grid in the future.

PWM or MPPT which is best has been resolved. For very small systems a good PWM works fine. If you can afford to buy more panels a PWM would work just as well. Fewer things do so it theoretically should be more reliable.
Why PWM or MPPT? Your system is comprised of panels and batteries. Your panels are fixed in what they can produce under ideal conditions. Your batteries vary based on state of charge. So your PWM will use the voltage of the battery and multiply that by the amps coming from your panels to give you productions or watts. If your battery is 23 V (discharged) you are not getting the full production from your panels.
Example. Your battery is at 23 V and your panels are sending in 20 amps on your pwm your system is making 460 watts. An MPPT will use the same voltage but can boost the amps by up to two times so now you have the same system 23 v x 30 making 690 watts. An improvement of 230 Watts from the same set up. That is the equivalent of increasing your system by 1 panel.
I hope that shows you why people use MPPT controllers. In the picture you see the amps out is double the amps in

Xmen149:
well said men.......besides all that......their also exist HYBRID INVERTERS,.....but only few makes have confirmed high efficiency for now.
with setting you get to choose to either go on-grid or off-grid and choose which setup takes the with high priority.......

In Nigeria all the Inverters you use are off grid. You can tie a grid tied unit to another inverter or a generator that gets expensive and makes no sense in most applications. I have seen them in Nigeria and intend to do them. High frequency Inverters have higher efficiency than low frequency inverters. High frequency hydbrids will be more efficient than lower frequency units. The HF claim 95 to 98 % efficiency because they have no transformers in the traditional sense. They give up surge capability and tend to have lower AC to DC charge capability relative to lower frequency units.
Thank you for the compliment.

dozymars:
Check out this Company. They offer good Inverter and Solar Installation Service. www.inverternigeria.com

I visited the site and they sell the same thing everyone else is selling in Nigeria. Sukam and Luminous.

onelife97:
@op,pls I'd like to know how much can one spend on solar energy to power let's say up to 8 bedrooms,3 large living rooms,3 kitchens,all include up to 5 air conditioners,4 refrigerators,let's say 3 microwave ovens,and other small electrical appliances for a up to 24 hours uninterrupted power supply.

Thx in advance

Once you looking to power AC be prepared to spend money. Your question does not provide enough detail. I would say budget between 8 and 10 million naira on the minimum.

elmajor:
I appreciate the information ur have provided to someone like me without an electrical background. Geesam, I've got a question.
If I have a freezer, pressing iron, TV set, water-heater and about 20 energy-saving bulbs, all powered on, how many kva solar power is required?
Again, how many 'ah' and 'w' make 1kva?

I would not put a water heater on solar. There are formulas you can use to determine what you will need. I will give you a simple one. Write down all your loads one after the other. Then write the watts in front of each then write the number of hours you will use each. example 20 energy savings bulbs are 25 watts each. I will have them on for 8 hours a day. It will be 20 x 25 x 8.
Add up every thing (total watt hours) and divide by the system voltage. So if you will use a 24V system divide by 24. That will give you how much battery you use daily. Multiple that result by two to ensure that you don't exceed a 50$ state of discharge.
To calculate the solar side. Divide the watt hours by 4.5 if you are in Lagos. In the North by 5.5. The result is the total watts in panels you need. Email me for more details or a calculation sheet I use for my clients

Obeenah:
Good you identified some key issues. However you mentioned KVa and not KW. The difference being that generators use KVA while solar uses KW.

The difference being that KW is of a higher rating compared to KVA. Simple reason why a 2kw solar energy system would require a Generator of about 3.5 to 4kva to match up to.

Another thing you identified are the batteries. Standard issues for my company is 2 x 120v 200ah batteries per kilowatts so basically you multiply the batteries who's us 2 x the amount of kilowatts. So example a 1kw system would come with 2 x 120v x 200ah batteries which is 400ah.

The components come with the solar panels, charge controller, inverter, battery pack and rack. That's the real deal anything less us a sham.


Thank you

KW or KVA a both units of measuring the same thing. 1 kva is .8 kw. You were going in the right direction as far as generator relative to an inverter and then you took a left turn.
The simple answer is surge. A generator can't surge. When a load like a fridge or pumping machine starts they draw up to 3 or 4 times their rated capacity. A generator needs to be sized for the surge. Most inverters can surge two to three times their ratings. So a 2 kw inverter can temporarily be 4 or 6 kw to allow the surge.
There are hybrid Inverters that have everything built in. They are not a sham. They do exist and many people in Lagos have them.

Thank you for telling people what we have been saying for a long time.

1. Quality matters. There are a lots of Chinese and Indian brands out there. Some are good and most are crap. They won't back up their products with a meaningful guaranty. Spend the money and buy a good quality inverter. I will buy a Toyota before I buy a Geely. If I can afford a Mercedes I will buy the Mercedes. Your inverter selection should be no different

2. Batteries. This is as critical as the inverter. People in Nigeria have come to accept that batteries have to be replaced every year or two. That is wrong. Get a good quality battery. They should have at least 1200 or more cycle life ratings. If they don't move on. Pay extra at the beginning and and get 5 years or more, that is much better than saving N10 k per battery and replacing them every other year.

3. Charge controllers: You want to destroy a battery buy a cheap or bad one. PWM controllers work very well. They just can't harvest as much as an MPPT on a cloudy day. A lot of controllers advertised as MPPT are not. If your MPPT controller does not weigh at least 4 kg keep looking. I would rather buy a good quality PWM than a crappy MPPT. Morningstar makes a great PWM controller.

4. All in one units. They do exist and they do work. They tend to be high frequency inverters and there are many manufacturers that offer them. They have a PWM or MPPT controller, charger and inverter all in one unit. I have a few running in Lagos. I like to separate the solar charger from the rest of the system. I have also run the panels directly through them and there are videos of many people doing just that. The most common brand in Nigeria is the Axpert sold by everyone because they allow you to slap your name on the equipment

5. Number of panels and batteries. That should not be what sells you. The total watts and total AH should be what you are buying. You can buy 4 batteries that are 410 AH each or 6 that are 1000 AH each. A 12V equivalent would be 4, 8 batteries or more. Ditto for the panels. At the end of the day your loads will determine your needs.

Keep the discussion alive. Thank you for starting the thread.

durodee:
Hello house, I am in trouble o! The glass of one of my panels cracked badly; any hope of redemption? There are screws at the side of the panel and i am thinking of openning it and replacing the glass but needs the advice of house members. Advice needed urgently please!!

Unfortunately, this happens quite a bit. Opening it will compromise it some have the glass bonded to the cells. if the crack is not impacting the performance of the panel try sealing the crack with clear epoxy.

valdetino:
A female student of Godfrey Okoye University produced this Automobile.

Way to go. The people who knock it buzz off or build yours. I am impressed by the use of the change overs. I wish they gave more details about the vehicle m

tolexee:
Hello House

trying to recover my batteries (2 x 12v 200Ah Amaron Quanta) not holding charge. I've got a Kevin Inverter that seems to charge my battery through the 4-stage charging cycle; I would like answers to the ff;

a. Can i desulfate my batteries using my inverter and solar 60a MPPT Morningstar CC (i.e using two sources of charging at the same time)

b. I've read about desulfator on the thread, i see various brands on amazon (bls, batterytender, batteryminder, pulsetech, wizbang) can someone advice on the best tested with proven result.

@Nomoretrolling can you also share which brand of desulfator you are using.

br

br

It is like snake oil. Some swear by its properties.
Why do you think you need to desulphate your non flooded batteries?
Simple reason I buy flooded batteries is that I can accomplish this by overcharging it periodically to move the liquids at the bottom to the top. In a Gel or AGM how do you intend to accomplish that?
My 2 cents. Sorry my 2 kobo

Pakingzzz:
Guess we've all heard Solar tracker, a vital device in solar system, i don't know if it's already been
mentioned in one of the numerous pages;
Haven't heard of a company nor individual installing it.
I bet it's a nice investment to make considering the fact it can recover from 40%-60% of the energy from the sun.
To practically test this assertion, I've tried measuring the amps on an 80w solar panel that i pointed directly to the sun. I got around 6.8A.
When pointed at 30 degrees away from the sun I got around 3.5A.
But at 45 degrees to the sun the meter reads 1.8A.
Suffice to say this experiment was done around 2.00pm with the sun clearly visible and no obstructing clouds.
You might try that on your own and you would be amazed at the energy that is being wasted using fixed solar panel.
I want to commence building these solar trackers at affordable prices and selling them here in Nigeria. I have already ordered all the parts I would be needing to build it from Aliexpress and Ebay.

Build and I will buy. We should patronize our own. Why are you being from Alibaba and Ebay? Are you not able to find what you need in Nigeria? A majority of the people who sell these items on Ebay purchase from China.

IbnSultaan:
Saw this Made in Kaduna APC Lamborghini earlier Today in Kaduna http:///ymD7Y6j7Lx
credited to @murtalaibin

The link did not work. I would love to see more pictures.

INTROVERT:
So according to reports these girls stole from their madam who owns a bar. Unfortunately for them, Madame husband/boyfriend is a soldier and decided to punish them together with their manager seen kneeling in the background.


Rather unfortunate and bad.

They look to be underage.

temizeee:
thanks buddy Actually he is already using d inverter setup with phcn.he only needs to implement solar..i know abt all d calculation u give i was just asking if d panel will be fine with d setup in real world you know

temizee I will issue a disclaimer. Without knowing the loads I can't give you an answer.

Now for my educated guess. 24 V system will need an 80 amp charge controller with 2 kw in panels.
Based on some of the smaller systems I have installed if you manage it well, it should be more than adequate

ceejay80s:
Thank u so much, So u are saying I should get a good battery charger for the battery? After charging I shot circuit the 40amp battery with a flexible wire and it sparks very well, so u mean my own local made charger won't go through those three stages of charging? That means I need to get a brand new original quality charger for it. The battery still looks ok to me its just that it dosn't take charge, probably because of those local made charger, i'm right? Pls reply my guy I will really appreciate it, thanks

Apologies for the late reply. I have never intentionally short circuited a battery before. The manufacturers frown on it for a variety of reasons. I have accidentally shorted batteries that had 10.5 V in them and it sparked. So I am not too sure what shorting means or does. I have no clue what your locally made charger does so I can't give a qualified opinion. A visual inspection can't give you clues as to the state of your batteries. People have recovered batteries by keeping them on a charger for weeks at a time. Others have charged introduced a huge load to discharge and then repeated the process for weeks to get the battery back. I am not expert in bringing batteries back
You can never go wrong with a good quality charger. We lost a few batteries earlier on and made the decision to invest in quality. Cost you less in the long run.

temizeee:
please house i need guide for a friend,he uses 24v system @800ah power of battery so he wants my help on solar package.with my calculations i suggest 175/200 watt panel of 10 pieces....i want your observation to my calculation if am wrong please thanks

I am sure you based your conclusion on some information you did not supply.
What loads does he intend to power?
How many hours for each load.
Multiply the load by the hours.
Add up your totals and that gives you your watt hours.
Divide that number by the hours of peak sunshine (anywhere from 4 to 6 hours)
That will give you how many watts you need in panels.
Now the calculation for the batteries will be taken off your total watt hours and then factor in your depth of discharge.
I hope this helped

life707:
Its amazing how people apply theory with out practical.
We all know that a 16mm cable can take up to a 100A if its pure copper.
Please I don't think you should say more as you promised.

Every one is learning. rather than chastise teach. They come to this forum seeking knowledge or correction of long held notions. The American wire chart is correct if you use awg as your size which some people do.
Brothers and sisters don't be afraid to ask for clarification. I prefer to be called stupid than be quiet and smart and burn my house down. We all can contribute to improving our community and society.

I would use propane because it is cleaner than diesel. However you get more from diesel that you would get from an equivalent amount of propane. How much does propane cost? What is the comparative cost to diesel. If the difference is more than 50% I would go with propane. If less I would stick to diesel.

ceejay80s:
Hi, I have a fullriver HGL40-12 battery which I bought brand new 2 months ago, after charging to full capacity and I connect it to my lcd TV via ups it dosent even last upto 20seconds , I took the battery to a battery charger and he said the battery is fine and there nothing wrong with it and he charged it again and same thing keeps happening, but I have a 12v 18ah battery which powers my lcd for atleast 5hrs , pls what's the problem o!!!

What is full capacity? A battery charger is not the person to take a deep cycle battery to. Take us through your charge regimen. There are three stages that the battery has to go through. Bulk absorb and float.

[quote author=RipVanWink post=35189183]saying 10mm cable shud be ok, without asking him the distance he wants to run the cable isnt good advice....a chart has been posted on this issue, 10mm might work for less than 20ft..but same isnt suitable for 40ft....
let him scroll tru this thread, the chart has been posted b4, or he googles it.

this applies for panels - cc, and cc -- batt bank[/quote

Thank you for the observation. I still think that if he is running high voltage 10 mm cable will do. I have used it for 90 volts and 30 feet with very good performance. But to each his own. The amperage from your pv is less than 16 amps

JUO:
this will be a perfect match if you can get 25mm

I would not use the cable pictured. They are not flexible and have a nasty habit of coming loose. Use flexible cable. I have had nothing but trouble including shorting batteries and controllers when they pop out because you moved something and they worked their way loose. No matter how hard we tighten them they pop out of the controllers.

tolexee:
Thanks guys for your invaluable contribution. I would be making changes as advised (especially the array arrangement to 3x2 and the array direction towards the south). however i would also like to clarify which of this type of cable is most ideal 16mm for my cabling between the array - CC - battery.

You are in the southern hemisphere, your panels should face North. Always opposite to your part of the word. In the US we are in the Northern hemisphere our panels face south. Use a compass to determine true North.
10 mm should suffice. If you are doing 3 x 2 and are getting over 60 V you should be fine with 10 mm. The thicker the cable the more it costs.
The thick cable should be from the charge controller to the batteries.
I hope that helped

tolexee:
Kudos to all the DIY team and the pros in the house. Stumbling on this thread late but i had to go through from pg 1 - 99, indeed an interesting workbook. I've got a week installation made up of 6 x 200watts solar panel (all connected in parallel) , Morningstar MPPT 60, 2 x 12v 200Ah (connected in series) to a 1.5kva Kevin Inverter, i need advice on the following observations from logged data from CC;

1. Maximum Instantaneous output solar power (input to CC) not exceeded 720watts

2. Output power from CC (to battery) always lower than input power to CC (from array)

3. At near peak Array current it's always greater than battery current

4. When CC transit to night i observe a -ve current flow

5. Is my battery depletion normal in the night mode for a 250wh load for approx 5hrs.

Find attached yesterday's logged data for reference.

Your erudite suggestion/advice/comment by all would b much appreciated.

I will answer in the order you posted
1. 720 watts is not bad. They ask you to expect up to a 30% loss.
2. The controller will always step the voltage down to the the battery voltage. So it is doing as advertised
3. I did not understand what you meant by that. If you have an MPPT it will increase the amps coming from the panel. When the battery is in float mode the number you see coming from the panel could be higher than what is being sent to the battery if there is no load.
4. I have seen it with some cheap controllers. Never heard of it with the Morningstar. You need to put a directional breaker in.
5. Someone answered.
I did not look at your spreadsheet. I only answered based on my knowledge

Ygcygcygc:
Dear sir,
I had bought tripp lite inverter 2000 watt and 2 battery of 120 amp(120*2=240 amp) , every thing is working fine unless the usage time and charge time

Charge time take about 7 hours to fully charged with inverter current of 15 Amp per hour, this sound strange for me as it should take 16 hours not 7 hours(240÷15=16) why it take less?

Usage time for only samsung refrigeditor of rated 150 watt give me only 3.5 hours, is this normal?

Could you please assist me at both issues, is there any wrong as i use voltmeter to test my both battery and it give me these reads:
14.7v at last stage of charge starting from12v
Then decreased to 13.7v when it is fully charged

Please help

You should be getting more than 8 hours. Check the fridge has the thermostat been bypassed? 13.7 is the float voltage.

TSHIRT2:
Pls house,a friend brought this 2 my notice that his new 200ah battery only last 4 8hrs with a combined load of 169watt,my questn is,is d output okay put in mind d load or d battery is under performing?

What is the system voltage. 200 AH could be 12 24 and 48 Volts? Is the battery fully charged when he adds the load to it? 12 24 or 48 volts is not a fully charged battery.

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