₦airaland Forum

Your are the one telling me sheet. Where did the bible say that?
Your only bringing unscriptural ideas here bro. You know little or nothing when if comes to the bible.

tctrills:
Like I always say, I respect your opinion but you need to state its your opinion and it has nothing to do with the bible.
The bible teaches that Abraham and all the prophets would be in the kingdom of God and yet you claim they are not born again. What else do you want the bible to tell you?

[quote author=cornelboy, tctrills post=109580113]I
[9]Then he said, “Look, I have come to do your will.” He cancels the first covenant in order to put the second into effect.
[10]For God’s will was for us to be made holy by the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ, once for all time.
[/quote]When was Christ body sacrificed and when did it take effect?

tctrills:
You just proved my point, the sins of the men of old were not forgiven because of animals but because of their faith in Christ. The sacrifice represented Christ's sacrifice. Read what you sent.[5]That is why, when Christ came into the world, he said to God,
“You did not want animal sacrifices or sin offerings.
God was never interested in animal blood. The faithful of old did it in similitude to Christ's. No one's sin was forgiven for killing a ram. Abrahams sins are forgiven by the sacrifice of Jesus Christ just like you and I

All the verses you presented are irrelevant. Go tell your doctrine to another person wey en head no get space for brain.

tctrills:
I have shown you verse upon verse that shows these men knew Christ and testified of him. Can you show a single verse that shows they did not know him?

Thanks so much for all your comments.

tctrills:
Yes he knew all he needs about Christ like all the prophets of old. What do you know about Christ that you think Abraham did not know? Clearly not in sango

They killed animal ad per Moses law which is not perfect for removal of sin. Christ sacrifice was perfect and once for all.
Old covenant is vividly different from new.

tctrills:
They killed animals as a shadow of Christ's sacrifice. they did this to represent the sacrifice of Christ. What greater faith do you want.

Seems you don't read your Hebrew very well. Well i quoted some verses for you.
Stop arguing blindly.

tctrills:
what are you saying? Their forgiveness was temporal? Where did you get that from? Quote the verse, please. Never you say what you don't know. Isaiah 43:25
“ I am he who blots out your transgressions for my own sake, and I will not remember your sins.

I know what faith is.
Hebrews 10:5-18
[5]That is why, when Christ came into the world, he said to God,
“You did not want animal sacrifices or sin offerings.
    But you have given me a body to offer.
[6]You were not pleased with burnt offerings
    or other offerings for sin.
[7]Then I said, ‘Look, I have come to do your will, O God—
    as is written about me in the Scriptures.’”
[8]First, Christ said, “You did not want animal sacrifices or sin offerings or burnt offerings or other offerings for sin, nor were you pleased with them” (though they are required by the law of Moses).
[9]Then he said, “Look, I have come to do your will.” He cancels the first covenant in order to put the second into effect.
[10]For God’s will was for us to be made holy by the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ, once for all time.
[11]Under the old covenant, the priest stands and ministers before the altar day after day, offering the same sacrifices again and again, which can never take away sins.
[12]But our High Priest offered himself to God as a single sacrifice for sins, good for all time. Then he sat down in the place of honor at God’s right hand.
[13]There he waits until his enemies are humbled and made a footstool under his feet.
[14]For by that one offering he forever made perfect those who are being made holy.
[15]And the Holy Spirit also testifies that this is so. For he says,
[16]“This is the new covenant I will make
    with my people on that day, says the lord:
I will put my laws in their hearts,
    and I will write them on their minds.”
[17]Then he says,
“I will never again remember
    their sins and lawless deeds.”
[18]And when sins have been forgiven, there is no need to offer any more sacrifices.

The new covenant took effect after Jesus' sacrifice in real life.

tctrills:
What is faith? Faith is believing in things not seen. It is believing in things yet to come.
Hebrew 11.13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

Lol your not coming anywhere.
The sacrifice Jesus made was effective after his death.

The men of old killed animal for their forgiveness of sin which was temporal.

tctrills:
Now you are coming. Is it not the very same thing expected of us? Like them, we are saved by our faith in Christ. What is the difference? What is your point?

Wow how does this prove your point?
It's still bout foreseeing, prophecy, future tense and all that.
Yes we gentiles are justified through faith just like Abraham walked with God by faith and it was accounted to him as righteousness.
Did Abraham know anything bout Christ?
Who did he have faith in?

tctrills:
I have read the book of Hebrew. What's your point.

Galatians 3.8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

I would like to rephrase your words.
"He like the other prophets had Faith in the coming of Christ and the sacrifice he would make".

tctrills:
Did Isaiah tell you this? What did Isaiah say that made you think this? He like all other prophets had faith in the coming and sacrifice of Jesus Christ. that is all that matters. Every other thing is assumtion

Which verse of the Bible says the men of old are going to the kingdom of God or that say every believer is going to the kingdom of God?

tctrills:
What's your point? are you saying these men would not go to the kingdom of God?
No verse in the entire bible said 144000 people would go to the kingdom of God

Read the book of Hebrews well bro.
I want to see that verse that says Abraham was saved by grace

tctrills:
That is the definition of faith. Do you believe Jesus is coming again? Has it happened already? Why do you think of Revelations 13.8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
The scripture speaks of Christ's death before the foundation of the world was.
Salvation through grace from Christ started after his death in real.

Are you saying that the prophets of old are not saved?
Yes, they practiced the old covenant as a shadow of things to come. The sacrifices of old were performed in the similitude of Christ's eternal sacrifice. These men knew what they were doing. And in case you don't know, the bible clearly taught that Abraham was saved by grace.

Wow i love questions. They didn't go to the kingdom of God after death. Note kingdom of God literally doesn't mean heaven.
John 5:28-29
[28]Don’t be so surprised! Indeed, the time is coming when all the dead in their graves will hear the voice of God’s Son,
[29]and they will rise again. Those who have done good will rise to experience eternal life, and those who have continued in evil will rise to experience judgment.

Those men of old are in their grave bro sleeping deep in death.

Daniel 2:44
[44]“During the reigns of those kings, the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed or conquered. It will crush all these kingdoms into nothingness, and it will stand forever.

Isaiah 9:6
[6]For a child is born to us,
    a son is given to us.
The government will rest on his shoulders.
   The government is the same as the kingdom in Daniel 2:44 cos Jesus will be the king of the kingdom, the king of kings. Only choosen few will be in God's kingdom. Those are the 144000 mentioned in revelation.

tctrills:
Christ taught in John 3, 3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
If these men of old were not born again, how come they make the kingdom of God?

Wetin you de talk na?
They believed in sacrifice wey never even happen and the sacrifice was working for them to have eternal life and remission of sin before Dem even born Jesus?
The old covenant was active till Jesus death.
Salvation through grace from Christ started after his death in real.
I don't follow your line of reasoning. It's not what the bible teaches. Bye

tctrills:
You cant testify about what you don't know. You have not quoted a single verse to prove your point so don't tell me to go to the scripture because you have none to show me. Probably, they did not know about he turning water to wine but they knew him unto salvation. They accepted him and believed in his sacrifice. what more do you want them to do. like what more?

He believed that God will send the messiah at the appointed time. Of he would have faith in the messiah that he'll accomplish God's mission.
But Isaiah didn't believe the messiah to be the same God of Israel Who is giving him prophecy via the holy spirit. Thus Isaiah didn't know about Jesus' identity or who he was to God before he came to earth but he knew the roles he would play when he comes.

tctrills:
What are you saying. he believed God's word but did not believe the messiah? Whats this. Maybe we have to call on Isaiah and ask if he was drunk when he was speaking. How else do you want Isaiah to show you that he knew what he was saying? Haba

These are Paul's word bro and they were baptized to Moses not Christ bro.
Moses no even have idea about Christ.
The rock that gives them spiritual water is a comparison to Christ.

tctrills:
Really, what more do you want them to say to show that they knew Christ? Just like his modern followers, they ate his flesh and drank from him. How else could they have written it for you to understand?
Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;

2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;

3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;

4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

Isaiah believed God for his words and he had Faith that when the messiah comes he would fulfill God's assignment for him. He didn't believe the messiah as the Almighty God that gave him the prophecy.

tctrills:
My guy let me advise you. in your Journey to God, Do not assume what you do not know. Rely on scripture to teach you.
Isaiah testified about the birth of Christ, About his life and death, He taught us the names of Jesus Christ. what more do you want him to do to show you that he knew of Christ?
You ask, Where are the verses which proved that the prophet knew Jesus in person Do you know Christ in person? what more would they have said to show you they know him?

See it's not about what they know it bout what God inspired them to know and tell the people.
God inspired them to know that a Messiah is coming. He also told them about the life he would live and what message he would bring. He also told them about his forerunner and his sacrificial death. The prophets sure believed what God told them and they were expecting the Messiah. They haven't known him yet.
If you can't understand go back to your bible. It's more than clear.

tctrills:
Do you declare what you don't know? THESE MEN TESTIFIED ABOUT WHAT THEY KNEW. we don't know if they knew he would be named Jesus. But let's assume it's true, That counts for nothing. They knew and testified about his birth and sacrifice. They had faith Just as you do. The same way you have not seen Jesus and you believe by faith. Please unless you are sure that the men of old did not know anything about Christ, I think you should let people know that this is your personal opinion.And its not at all scriptural.

Omo see wahala o.
Where are the verses which proved that the prophet knew Jesus in person or worshipped him or know when he would come to the word?
Even Jews in his time when he finally came to them, they didn't believe him as the Messiah rather they wanted to kill him.

tctrills:
My brother, I feel safer believing what the bible says than your personal opinion. Did David not clearly testify of Jesus Christ in the psalms?

read some of what Isaiah said about him.
And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:

2 And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the Lord;

3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the Lord: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears:

4 But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth: with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.

5 And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faithfulness the girdle of his reins.

6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.

7 And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.

8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.

9 They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea.

10 And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious.

11 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea.

12 And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.

13 The envy also of Ephraim shall depart, and the adversaries of Judah shall be cut off: Ephraim shall not envy Judah, and Judah shall not vex Ephraim.

14 But they shall fly upon the shoulders of the Philistines toward the west; they shall spoil them of the east together: they shall lay their hand upon Edom and Moab; and the children of Ammon shall obey them.

15 And the Lord shall utterly destroy the tongue of the Egyptian sea; and with his mighty wind shall he shake his hand over the river, and shall smite it in the seven streams, and make men go over dryshod.

16 And there shall be an highway for the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria; like as it was to Israel in the day that he came up out of the land of Egypt.

Your comments make me feel your a 10 years old kid.

All the prophet testified of him as what or of what or how did they testify of him?

Simeon knew about the law and the prophecies (every Jews were expecting the Messiah) bout the Messiah and God promised him he would not taste death untill he saw the Messiah.

Testify; To make a declaration, or give evidence, under oath.
To make a statement based on personal knowledge or faith.
Testifying of him doesn't mean they knew him or his identity. They don't even know he would be named Jesus.

tctrills:
purely your opinion not what any single scripture teaches. I just showed you where the bible says that the testimony of Jesus Christ is the spirit of prophecy. All the prophets testified of him. So where did you get the idea that they did not know him? What about simoen that blessed baby Jesus. Really where do you get these from clearly not from the bible

I'm not forcing the truth on anyone. But the seed has been sown. It's left for you you to make it germinate if your heart is really yearning for the truth.

The fact is that the passage you quoted reference two distinct persons, LORD and Lord that's Jehovah and Jesus.

Rosement:
Jesus is God, apart from God no other immortal being was referenced by Godly people. Why did David not refer to seven spirits and twenty-elders anywhere in Psalms? You guys (jws) are fond of looking for unrealistic way of twisting the Bible. Even a primary one pupil will be amazed if he sees this comment. Guy, why did you do this to yourself, you have just exposed yourself, a lot of people must have noticed the level IQ by time. You know what I can't do these any more, I won't fetch water into a basket. Believe whatever makes you sleep well at night.

Do have a good rest!

Don't let's drag unnecessarily.
Jesus the messiah was known after he came into the world. The wise men were first to see him except the shepherd and his parents and they worshipped (prostrated or pay homage to) him.

The prophet knew Christ would be coming through prophecy but they are not aware of his identity and they didn't worship him before he came to the world.

tctrills:
You really don't know that do you? You are just guessing. Every single person that had the spirit of prophecy had a testimony of Jesus Christ. For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy, Rev 19:9 -10
also, read 1 Corinthians 10

Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;

2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;

3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;

4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

Yes thank you.
Jesus was trying to explain that he's greater than David.

Luke 20:42, Psalm 110:1 KJV
[42]And David himself saith in the book of Psalms, The LORD (Jehovah) said unto my Lord (Jesus), Sit thou on my right hand,"
God inspired David through the holy spirit to write that. It's kind of a prophecy.

Rosement:
(Luke 20:41-44)
41. And he said unto them, How say they that Christ is David's son?
42. And David himself saith in the book of Psalms, The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
43. Till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
44. David therefore calleth him Lord, how is he then his son?

Yeah the prophets were aware that a Messiah would come. They spoke concerning him through prophecy. They they didn't know him in person or worshipped him before he came to the world.

tctrills:
Is that what the bible said or is it your opinion? The wise men that worshiped Jesus clearly knew something. Simeon that blessed baby Jesus knew something
Acts 10:43 : "All the prophets testify about him that everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name

Really could gimme the verses please?

Rosement:
Jesus said He was known and referenced. Are you trying to accuse Jesus of blaspheming like the pharisees always did?

Nobody knew the messiah before he came to the world.
The Jews whom Jehovah God gave the prophecy about the messiah only believe in one God YHWH. They only worship YHWH.

Rosement:
Were 24 elders or seven spirits ever worshipped? Why was Jesus worshipped even before He came into the world?

Is the Father an angel? The 24 elders, are they angels, the seven spirits of God, are they angels?
Jesus told his disciples, "God is spirit".
Definitetly Jesus is a spirit being too.

Rosement:
Are you admitting that Jesus is God? If you are not, then you haven't answered my question.

This people HATE JWs generally. So any small thing, they will make big deal of.
What's your truth which ona represent?

MaxInDHouse:
The government of Bulgaria was misinformed that JWs are restricting their members not to accept blood transfusion and military services.

Delegates were sent to confirm that it's not the organization that's forcing the faith on anyone, documents were given for them to sign and they did.

So it means those words found in the Bible book of Act 15:29 will disappear shey?

Walahi talahi you guys needs to see a doctor because i just don't understand why you're all agitating over the beliefs of a group whereas they're not forcing their beliefs on you!

Show me the truth bro

Nelidee:
Because you keep deceiving people that your organisation is the truth.

You keep lying to people that if they don't belong to an organisation runned by 7/8 men in Warwick they will all die.

And the worst of it all is you don't even know the hideous history of your organisation.

We are told to expose rather than participate in evil so I am obligated to expose your deceitful organisation so others don't become poor victims like you that is ready to watch his loved one die.

Well anyone could make mistake out of overzealousness just like Saul (Paul) who persecuted the church of God.

It's good to loom well before you leap.

Emusan:
We know it must be a rumour

I guess, you travel to USA to confirm the story of RCCG you created a thread for

I know if possible for you to delete that thread because of your hypocrisy you'll have done that since.

Devil himself will be so disappointed in you the way you're disappointing him.

Na you go give your love ones eternal life good. Your blood wey don short before. Just do proper test before you donate am.

Nelidee:
For me? Why?

I can go to any university I like.

I can attend any church that teaches the truth.

I can donate blood and watch my loved ones live.

Can you do any of that?

If the answer is no, then be sorry for yourself not me.