₦airaland Forum

kimco:
Is he omnipotent though? If yes, then the bible contradicts itself. If he is not, then he is no God.

Lol. What are the criteria of being a god?
Your little self is in no position to describe what qualities of God should be.

Lukuluku69:
Read. Read. Read
That Kingdom will be given to his "Saints" Read the whole of Daniel 7 and use the history of the ancients as it commentaries. Don't allow those guys in Warwick be the one to to tell you what Daniel saw for Daniel himself gave the interpretations.
The cold hard facts of history says it was the Muslims that ended Persia and Grecian Empires till date. Just as Persia ended Babylon. The Romans are wounded but it's time is coming too.
A Kingdom is what it is. People, Laws/Codes. Don't let any one fill your head with an utopian idea of it. A
This is the same Kingdom that Jesus told you that it will break into pieces any one that it falls on.
And yes Muslims do believe in the Bible. But not the Part written by men

Lol.
So you guys are planning wars against the Romans?

Which part of the Bible wasn't written by men?
Guy na men write the Bible.

You've to prove from the Qur'an where Allah/Mohammed predicted Islam as a Kingdom that would defeat other kingdoms.

Lukuluku69:
Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces. READ HISTORY OF THE ROMAN EMPIRE ANS YOU WILL UNDERSTAND THIS VERSE BETTER
And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings. THAT WAS CONSTATINE. THE SO CALLED FIRST CHRISTIAN EMPEROR. HE WAS DIVERSE BECAUSE HE CLAIMED CHRISTIANITY UNLIKE OTHER PAGANS
And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. GREAT THINGS: BLASPHEMY. THE TRINITY. DURING HIS REIGN CHRISTIANS CHANGED THE SABATH TO SUNDAY THE DAY THE ROMANS WORSHIP THE SUN GOD. ROMAN CODES BECAME LAW IM PLACE OF THE BIBLICAL LAWS. A TIME AND A TIME AND DIVISING OF TIME? A TIME IS A HUNDRED YEARS. SO A TIME AND A TIME AND DIVIDING TIME IS 250 YEARS EXACTLY THE TIME PROPHET MUHAMMAD MISSION BEGINS IN ARABIA
But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end. THE ROMANS TIME IS COMING....
-- Daniel 7:23-26
KJV Holy Bible

No problem na.
Shebi na mohammed wey don decay inside grave go still fulfill the rest of the missions Abi?
Since when have Muslims start believing in the Bible? Interesting!

Jesus is the head of God's government/kingdom.
He's coming back in the future to judge the earth and restore peace on it.

You haven't answered my question:
Is islam (Muslims) the kingdom God promise or the political one Mohammed established in Mecca?

funkmrflexx:
The Bible says God knows the end from the beginning. Isn't That omniscience?
So when He created adam and Eve, He knew their end from the moment he created them. If you say otherwise that means the Bible isn't correct

If he really knew their end, he wouldn't have created them.

See the fact is that God can choose to know or do otherwise.
He can know about everything but does he knows everything or does he choose to know about everything?
No!

funkmrflexx:
O LORD, you have [b]searched me and known me[/b]. You know when I sit down and when I rise up; you discern my thoughts from far away. You search out my path and my lying down, and are acquainted with all my ways. Even before a word is on my tongue, O LORD, you know it completely. You hem me in, behind and before, and lay your hand upon me. Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is so high that I cannot attain it (Psalm 139:1-6).

Yet God never said that he knows the outcome of everything.

Study those bolded phrases well. You'd see that God only choose to know about whomever he likes, the righteous ones probably.

You think God would want to know about the wicked thoughts in every wicked human on earth?

Lukuluku69:
The above is the position of JW but what is the position of Daniel and the Angel who gave Daniel the interpretations to the vision of Nebuchadnezzar and Daniel himself ( Daniel had a similar vision as stated in Daniel 7)
You see to locate or properly identified that coming Kingdom of God, you need to stop posting Daniel 2:44! Do you know why? It is just a verse out 45 other verses in Daniel Chapter 2!
But the gist of the matter is 4 distinct Kingdoms were mentioned/described in Nebuchadnezzar and Daniel vision.
Can you identify them? Let me help us.
They are Babylonia, Persia, Grecian and the Roman Empires.
The vision says all these Kingdoms will be destroyed and their remnants given to the saints of the Most High.
Which Kingdom ended Babylonia? The Persians. Remember MENE, MENE, TEKEL, UPHARSIN.?
-- Daniel 5:25
That was Persia taking out Babylonia forever!
Who took out the Persians and the Grecian Empires?
Persia were taken out and we're CONSUME. Exactly as the vision says in Daniel 7.
Grecian? Go to present day Turkey and learn about the conquest of that Land by who?

Seems you've already figured everything out.
Gods kingdom is not Islam or any human government for that matter.

Lukuluku69:
cornelboy
Please let us see what Daniel 2:44 says about the coming Kingdom of God.

1. Sir, what is God's Will.

Gods ultimate will is to restore the earth to what he wanted it to be initially.

2. What is the Kingdom of God.

God's kingdom is the means through which he would restore the earth.
The kingdom will be led by Jesus and the 144000 co rulers. Isaiah 9:6
The kingdom will first destroy every kind of government when it comes to earth.
Daniel 2;44

bobestman:
What is that?

Are you a real Christian?

Sixfiguresmart:
Do not go there with him. He is trying to take you to a dark spot.
Stay here. Stick to your decision. He should be the one to bend.
He knows why he is running away from here.
I know why too.
He asked the question here. do it here. The other guy asked him to go to another thread, he declined. He has a plan.

Calm down bro.
No harm is coming nah. We'll still be discussing on nairaland.

funkmrflexx:
I thought He's omniscient

No. He never said he is.

bobestman:
Asking for from a blind folks like JWs. When the time comes even the founder of your brainwashed organization will sit learn. He will cry for decieving you all
Many are also doing what you see as work as they believe but don't bite. Continue doing your work when the time comes we go see the result.

You be real Christian?

Lukuluku69:
Let us do it somewhere else. I have picked one of your brothers thread. You must have seen the mention?

Alright. You can mention me there.

funkmrflexx:
Me and my wife had an argument this morning.
God is all knowing and before creating Adam and even, He know what they would do. He knew they would be Tempted and they would eat the fruit and bring Sin to the world and He also knows that His son would have to die in order to save us from the sin caused by the fruit
Why didn't He just make the fruit inaccessible to them so they don't eat it.
But instead He Allowed them to get access to the fruit, eat and bring sin to the world.
Mind you, He's all knowing and He knows all this would happen before they did. He knew Satan would tempt them and they will fall, He also knew that He would have to curse them when they eat the fruit.
Why not just prevent this by making the fruit inaccessible to them. That's the logical thing to do

Is God all knowing?
No!
He never claimed that.

Nothing will burn dear famozine1.
God never threatened anybody with fire.

Death is the punishment for sin.

Lukuluku69:
Good.
Can we move over to another thread while you do justice to this?
Let us start with Daniel. Then we move to Isaiah?

We can do it here low-key.
I don't want to open any thread.

Lukuluku69:
Can you reference where that Kingdom of God was mentioned in the Bible?
Please do and let us take it up from there.
On a second thought, why not open another thread and this one to the raving loony that opened it?
Mention me while you do that.

Daniel 2;44 and Isaiah 9:6.

Lukuluku69:
Of course the Fruits!
When the time comes we will check out the fruits.
Meanwhile your people came to knock on my Door today oooo. Lol
I was thinking I will see your face. They gave me Tract, was told to read it and that they will come back by 5pm tomorrow to tell me about the coming Kingdom of God. I said no problem but in my mind I dey reason am say that Kingdom came about 1440 years ago.

If you think the Kingdom that came 1440 years ago is Islam, you're wrong bro.

The kingdom God of Abraham promised mankind will restore righteousness peace to earth, eliminate wicked and evil people and the Messiah will reign the remaining righteous ones directly.

From what we see in the Koran and things happening in Islamic states, Islam or the kingdom established by Mohammed in Mecca is definitely not the kingdom.

Jerryhare:
Seems u get comprehensive disorder

Show us from the Bible na. What's God and Jesus opinion on taking medicinal herbs and drugs for our health?

Wilgrea7:
Your analogy fails terribly here for several reasons.
1. You're making reference to a case where knowledge isn't being replaced. It's simply being updated. The idea that water boils at 100 degrees is still very much true. Only that it does that at a certain altitude, while it changes at higher or lower altitudes depending on factors like pressure. Knowledge got updated... not replaced.
2. You're trying to imply that since science regularly updates it's facts, then the current ones shouldn't be accepted. There's absolutely no logic behind that thought process. Plus, new knowledge in science is something we celebrate, not shun.
Did you actually bother to look up scholarly articles on both topics, or did you just come here to type this because you're bent on having a disagreement with "science"
If you're going to insist on regurgitating the same narrative despite my explanations as to why they are not mere "speculation", then have it your way.
Oh.. I didn't know you were referring to the one I sent you. I thought you were telling me a story about an article you read a while back, and not this one.
What if the people lied about the inspiration? How would you know? If God indeed spoke something to somebody, then their so called writings would not contradict reality. But in your situation, you want to dismiss science as mere speculation to protect your unsubstantiated beliefs. But shielding them from scientific verification won't automatically make them true.
No one said humans evolved from apes. No one said evolution has a "magical effect". Here's my advice to you. If you want to dismiss something on the grounds of not being true, at least know what it is you're dismissing.
If you're not willing to learn about what evolution and the big bang are, but insist on dismissing them based on what you think they are, then you're not doing yourself any service. If anything, you'll only appear more intellectually dishonest.
You seem not to have paid any attention to what I've been saying recently, so I won't bother.
What parts of the big bang or evolution are not "intelligent". A lot of theists agree with the data behind both the big bang and evolution, and accept that whatever or whoever created the universe, chose to do so through those means.
Your issue isn't about whether or not a God created the universe. It's that you want to believe that your specific God, created the universe in the specific way as described by the biblical narrative, that you choose to deny the very real science that contradicts it.
If a scientific theory agreed with the biblical creation narrative, you would be the one shouting it on the rooftops that science has found proof of "God". But when it contradicts, you're the first to discard it.

I don't need science before I believe that an intelligent being is behind creation.
Science deals with what we can see and experiment with it.
So there's no way science could prove that an invisible God (spirit) exist.

The lack of believe in God is not connected with science. Anybody can choose to believe whatever he likes.
We have many old and modern scientists that believe in the existence of God.

jeromestarks:
So what do you suggest a Christian guy in love with a muslim girl should do?

You fell in love with the wrong girl then.
Real Christians can't marry unbelievers.

[quote author=Wilgrea7 post=116768420][/quote]

You seem to be trying to eat your cake and have it at the same time.
You dismissed the evidence for the big bang and evolution on the grounds that you did not directly experience it, or at least measure the said findings by scientists.. but you accept the statement that water boils at 100°c even though you've not directly measured it with a thermometer (i assume).
Statements like these only prove my point further..
Science is not like religion, that requires you to accept anything on “faith". Claims in science are always subject to rigorous tests, and are either discarded or accepted based on the evidence. Being testable and falsifiable is one of the pillars of the scientific process.
When a scientific fact is asserted.. it is because it passed through these rigorous tests by multiple people, under multiple different circumstances.
And you know what else? Anyone with the proper knowledge and/or equipment, can test these things for themselves too. Including you. Scientific verification is not restricted to lab-coat wearing individuals.
Just as if you had a thermometer and a cup of water, you could verify the boiling point, that's the same way you can verify other things too.
For example.. the CMB photos aren't something scientists sneakily cooked up in a lab. It was detected by certain types of telescopes like the microwave or radio telescope.
If you had one, you could see the CMB for yourself. It's not some hidden thing. It's literally something that's detectable from any place on earth, as long as you have the necessary equipment

Before, it's believed that water boils at 100 °c.
It was later discovered that the boiling point of water changes at different altitude.

The fact is that science is not 100% reliable. New knowledge could be discovered tomorrow and the ones around would be replaced.

Have both the bigbang and the evolution theories been rigorously tested by many people and under different circumstances?
No!

The bigbang and evolution gibberish still remain a guess work from the scientists.
It has never be a fact.
And it only takes faith to believe their made up stories as facts.

Same goes for the data on evolution. The photos that show the phenomena known as evolution is something that's readily available for you, or anyone else to observe. The archeological findings are very real things that do point to something.
These are not “speculations" .. these are solid data. The theories we invent around them aren't speculations. They are derived from the very solid data that exists everywhere.

The theories are nothing but speculation na

I don't know how true that statement, or article is.. but If an evolutionary biologist for example makes a statement like that.. it isn't because some God of evolution “inspired" them to do so.

Why would you even cite article you're not sure of it reliability?
What if God was the creator and he really inspired some people to write some books, how would you know?

For example, they could observe older fossils, and see that as they go back in time the thumb size gets progressively smaller (I'm talking by the hundreds of thousands, or even millions of years)

Lol. Why would the thumbs become progressively bigger?
Is evolution some kind of magical effect
The scientists assumed the thumbs evolved in homo sapiens because it fits in their other assumption that humans evolved from apes.

The data on the thumb size is as clear as can be. To explain why something like this would happen, and having an idea about the nature of life as hunter gatherers, they can speculate that tool making, or some other factor led to the increase in the thumb size as time went on.

Fairytale!

And of course, it's a speculation.. but not a baseless one. The solid data on the thumb size from the archeological findings would be very much real.. and the speculation or hypothesis is made based on that.

Technically not 100% reliable.

Before such statement graduates to become any sort of popularly accepted theory, there's a lot of rigorous testing it would have to undergo. That's how the scientific method works.

Not every scientists believe in both theories.

I'm not necessarily saying the article you saw was true or false. I neither know it's origins or authors. I'm just giving an example on how someone would arrive at such a statement, based on evidence available.

So it might be false after all.

It is only in the absence of any supporting evidence, that the claim remains a claim, and nothing more

They are enough evidences for me that an intelligent being designed the universe and started life on earth.

Dear Wilgrea7,
Water boils at 100°c at sea level. That's absolutely correct. I can put some water on fire, boil it and confirm it myself.

Science can tell us how things work, what they are made of, mode of operation etc.

But when scientists start making up stories about what happened billions of millions of thousands of years ago, it would only remain speculations based on their personal observations and not a proven "facts".

For example, I read an article that explains that the first humans in Savannah Africa started evolving the thumb in order to make tools and survive in his harsh environment. It's crazy. They were never there to witness how and when it happened.
It takes nothing but faith to believe their stories.

You should stick with your belief and I stick with mine.

FOLYKAZE:
That is why we have archaeology

So how would archeology prove that biblical character like Moses and Aaron his brother existed?
What exactly do you have in mind?

[quote author=Wilgrea7 post=116742506][/quote]

We were talking about the big bang vs the biblical creation story. If we want to talk of the origin of all that we know, it would be impossible to not reference it.

The bigbang is a theory about the creation of the universe while the Bible creation story focus on how life started on earth. That's two different things.
What's the scientific explanation of how life started on earth?

Secondly, saying the big bang is a speculation or a fairy tale, shows you don't understand what a fairy tale is.

The bigbang still remains a guess work or a theory. It's never been a proven fact.

A fairy tale is a story with no sort of empirical data or evidence behind it. Both the big bang and evolution have evidence behind them.

Sorry they don't have any evidence.
Both evolution and bigbang theories are speculations from the scientists.

The fact fhat you're saying something like this shows you didn't actually go through the links I sent.

I did go through the links.
Scientists explaining what happened billions of years ago is like a prophet predicting the future.
In a nutshell, scientists predict the past while prophets predict the future

Sure, according to the very real DATA, they made certain speculations as to how some things occured.. But that does not in any way invalidate the very solid data which they have. Your point fails here.

Where's the solid data?

I shared a link to give you an idea about what evolution and the big bang are.. and your biggest concern is a quote that mentioned that kids can also learn from it??

It says the article was designed for children. You can bring the adult ones.

You're the one making the claims about the biblical creation story. Feel free to start from wherever you'd like.

Okay.
So after God created everything, he blessed his creatures and told them to multiply and dominate the earth.
How would they multiply?
By using the reproductive organs he made in them.
You see everything was already planned. It didn't happen by chance.

The parts that contradict scientific knowledge... Which is basically like ... 90% of it. Here are a few
Earth before the sun
Earth before the stars
Plants before the sun
Differentiating the sun from the stars
Two great “lights" even though one reflects the other
The whole firmament thing and separation of “waters"
The list goes on.

Were the scientists there when everything happened?
If we should go along with the big bang story, anything can come before anything since everything happened by chance.

God did everything to make the earth habitable for living things.

You've failed to show me any sort of proof that the people who you claimed to have been inspired were indeed inspired.

God inspired them about things that would happen in the future and it did happened.
Ordinarily, those people couldn't know what would happen in the future but God has the power to know the future and he inspired them.

If 3 people come to you and tell you the creator of a car told them how it was created.. how would you determine if they were lying or not other than studying the car for yourself?
And even if you don't understand the car.. it still makes no sense to just believe the claim of the other person. I've said it multiple times. A claim that cannot be substantiated is nothing more than a claim, and we are under no obligation to believe it.

Everyone has the right to believe whatever he wants. That's why you believe in the evolution and bigbang theories and I believe in the Bible's creation story.

It was a human, who claimed that your God told him this thing. Neither the story, nor the claim of inspiration have been proven

It has been proven through fulfilled prophecies.
It's been proven in a lot of ways.

Why “A".. why not many? And what gives you the impression that the said supreme being, if it exists.. is your God . And not the muslim or Hindu one?

It could be millions. But it's one creator.
The Muslims claims to worship the Jewish and Christian God.

MaxInDHouse:
Which you success in your endeavor!

Clowns full here o.

FOLYKAZE:
All those tales are not substantial. Had it been your dad told you that your grandfather, ofakunja flew about town or that he parted the sea..... Then we can scrutinise those substantive claims.
The bible told us about Pharaoh.... That is not substantial. But when he told us Israelites were enslaved, Moses parted sea, wandered in the wilderness for 40yrs and gave lot more not wild tales, it calls for nothing but investigation. However, the decades of fact findings have exposes those claims as fiction. Nothing but moonlight tale

It's very unreasonable to wake up one day and start investigating what happened 4000 years ago.
Like what exactly do you want to investigate?

The fact that you don't see any substantial evidence about events that happened hundreds of years ago doesn't automatically proves that the stories are fictional.
They are real.

FOLYKAZE:
This isn't about beLIEve but facts, reality and existential records

My dad told me that 'my great grandfather's name is "Ofakunja", he was a chief and a powerful ifá priest'.

Do you think it's unreasonable for me to believe him even without seeing my grandfather's statues or pics?

The existential records for the origin of the nation of Israel is in the Bible.

[quote author=Wilgrea7 post=116722504][/quote]

Oh.. my bad.... If you wanted links, you could've just asked for them.

Why would you quote someone's article without referencing it?

This one talks about the big bang
https://www.space.com/13347-big-bang-origins-universe-birth.html

"Our universe was born about 13.7 billion years ago in a massive expansion that blew space up like a gigantic balloon."
The year the universe was born according to scientists might be right. It might be 14 billions years ago as proposed.
I think we should focus on earth and how life started on it rather than arguing what is beyond us.
You and I haven't travelled outside earth. It actually takes faith to believe the speculations of some scientists about events that took place 14 billions years ago.
If you study the article well, you would see many "coulds" "maybes" and "mays". The bigbang theory is a fairy tale from the scientists.

And this one talks about evolution
https://necsi.edu/evolution

The purpose of this web site is to teach and explain what evolution is and how it works. This web site is designed for children, but can be used by teachers or by anyone who wants to learn about this amazing process of life.

What makes you think I'm a child?

This is as illogical as me asking you for video proof of the creation story.
And how exactly do you know this? What proof do you have that the author wasn't lying about the inspiration? Or rather, what proof do you have that the author was indeed inspired?

What proof exactly are you asking for about the Bible's creation stories.

You're missing the point. It's not about comparing different stories to see which is "better". It's about facing reality. If you want to verify if a story is true, compare it with reality, not with other stories.

Which part of the creation story in the Bible is not real?

Superman may be more powerful than other mythical superheroes.. That doesn't make him real.

Nobody says he's real.
He's just a movie character.

If someone doesn't know something, it is perfectly ok to say "I don't know". That is intellectual honesty. The problem is claiming to know and failing to prove it.

The only one that knows how life begins is the source of life himself and he inspired someone to write about it.

That being said, the intricacy of the universe, down to the subatomic scale denotes an enormous level of complexity, which can be associated with intelligence. What exactly is your point here?

My points is there's a supreme intelligent being behind everything, the universe and life.

[quote author=Wilgrea7 post=116717789][/quote]

Billions

That's crazy. Claiming to know what happened 14 billions of years ago is like predicting the future.

I just made reference to the data we've seen that proves these things happened, and you're still saying they're just "speculations". Did you bother to read up on these things, or are you one of those science deniers too. You choosing not to engage with the data, or choosing to deny it, won't change the fact of reality.

Lol. Are you kidding me? What did you reference exactly?
You didn't even cite or referenced any source.
You should also bring some kind of video that shows how the bigbang happened.

Written record of what exactly? Did the person who wrote it down directly experience the creation process? What about other stories of creation found in other religions? What automatically makes theirs false and yours true?

The author didn't experience it but was inspired by the creator.
Bring the stories in other religions. We can examine them together.

That's a false dichotomy. It is not a "God" or "random explosion" scenario.

Here is my question again;
You as an intelligent human being, using the evidences of what you see around, how the earth is organised, did everything happen randomly or was it designed by an intelligent being?

Or do you have more options to the question? A "I don't know" answer wouldn't be relevant here.

Wilgrea7:
You seem to be a huge fan of CCTV footages.
Before I continue.. It's important to know what these theories actually say.
The big bang posits that the universe, as in space, matter and time as we know it, began about 14 billion years ago, from a point of infinite density.
What proofs do we have? We have the CMB, or cosmic microwave background, which shows the aftermath of the heat of the early hot and dense universe.
We also have information from our telescopes that show the galaxies are moving apart from each other. Turn back the arrow of time, and you bring the galaxies closer together.. till you get to the scenario similar to the big bang..
Evolution.. is the gradual adaptation of an organism to its environment. Not the idea that man came from apes... Even though evolution is a time intensive process, we've seen the gradual changes organisms undergo in response to their environment. And archeological data further confirms it.
Now... There's something else I'd like to point out. Something I've seen a lot of theists do.
When they don't want to accept these facts.. or find some flaw in their evaluation.. they automatically take it to mean that the biblical or Quranic creation stories are true. There is absolutely no correlation
Even if you were to be successfully disprove the big bang and evolution (good luck with that).. it does absolutely nothing, to show that your biblical creation story indeed happened. It would only show that we simply do not know that which we thought we knew.
In order to say your biblical creation story were true .. you would need to prove it. Disproving something else does not automatically prove your own argument.
And in a sarcastic attempt to flip your question back at you... I'll ask "Do you have CCTV footage of how your creation story happened"??

14 millions years ago is really like eternity.
Everything you say are just speculations. Nobody saw how the bigbang happened and no testable evidence for it today and there can never be.

About the creation story in the Bible, there's no CCTV footage for it but there's obviously a written record.

I'll ask you again;
This earth as it is, was it designed by someone intelligent, a God or everything happened randomly?

Wilgrea7:
I don't go by what sounds “reasonable".. i go by what can, or has been proven to be true.
The big bang and evolution are not things based on belief. They are things based on fact.. and they have a lot of proof behind them.
That being said, they don't answer everything. Their answers are limited to an extent. And we're still trying to understand things about our reality.
If you want to go by “reasonable"... you'll be misled... Greatly.
Seeing the sun rising from the east and setting in the west.. it seemed more reasonable to say that the sun revolved around the earth. That was proven to be wrong.
Merely looking straight ahead, or over the horizon, it seems “reasonable" to say that the earth was flat. Our early ancestors believed that. But they were wrong.
Don't seek for what is “reasonable" because that is highly subjective. Seek for what is true

How's the evolution theory and bigbang facts exactly?
Where are the testable evidences for them? You've got some CCTV footage of how it happened?

Wilgrea7:
I don't know. It's up to the person making the claim of creation to prove it. My job is to scrutinize the proof to make sure its authentic and not biased

Seems you have a lot of unanswered questions.

Before I proceed, I want to ask you a question;
Which sounds more reasonable, the big bang theory/evolution or a mastermind behind creation?