₦airaland Forum

greenpasture:
Blue prints are out there my man and you don't do orders to the Libyan government based on non standard processes. I mean there is a war there for goodness sake.

A lot of people may not know this but the government is indigenizing the defence industry. Innoson fixed up the rocket system of Alpha jets and believe me the Ara is using an international process for design and ballistics testing.

I know it's fashionable and easy thinking to knock everything that comes out of Nigeria but the reality is more nuanced. Great things are happening and we need to have an open mind.

I've harped so many times on this: our ongoing military industrial complex under the present administration which they have actually taken as an item of national survival. But u get eaten by ur own.

You know I've had a hard time finding such brilliant minds on here, they are few as u'd soon find. But this! This is it. The narrative on Nigeria keep folks (including ours - Henry actually told me that about the low self esteem on here) thinking we don't or can't measure up. There's no one nation however industrialized without shortcomings. In the end is a race to measure up and excel. This we are doing and whose to stop us.

I looked at it a second time and said no! That wasn't enough. This is not just beautiful, T'is Pretty! I kiss!

Good One! Proud! Proforce Would Have Specific Requirements From The Army To Produce This Behemoth. Still, I Know We All Excited But First We Buy Some (which I presume the First Orders are for), See How It Performs In The Field And Troop Feedback, Then Know How Many Orders To Make. In Any Case Domestic Orders Should Follow For This Feat By Proforce.

tdayof:
HERE COMES PROFORCE ARA

tdayof for living up to your word u need more than 3 Gbooza! U need some spoiling

Nok234:
When smart people talking about The Nigerian Military ... Im more and more confident the A-29 are coming

Quite Some Validation There On The Nigerian Armed Forces. Now, Mr. Hank Cohen Said It...

jakeporeshenko:
Okay buddy I wasn’t going to do this but it’s confirmed you are indeed the one they call Agbubuu

Thrilled! U just proved COVERT right. Intelligence can be condescending. Covert knows how to hide in plain sight. It is silent enough. No no not u, u'd never understand that in a thousand years. I rest my case.

jakeporeshenko:
yea open source info that is usually factual and true not made form his wild imagination which is exactly what you do.

dude you are really a delusional guy. If you believe all that "covert" crap you type here then really i feel sorry for you.

like i said when guys in the know make comments we can point them out easily, not you, you will never be one of those people let that sink in.
i know its painful, lol this guy. "covert comments"

very soon you would tell us you're are an undercover government agent working from a secret outpost in the highlands.

Painful my foot! I have more important things to grite at nonsense.

Every Covert post here has validation. If u learnt to be humble and ask questions u wouldn't be running blind. Obviously u think something of urself that u're not, that's being delusional.

Mind your business. I can pay my tickets. Need no bragging about that. That u think so shows ur insecurity.

Steer clear! Would Ya! After all the posts are crap to u, guess that's enough to massage ur ego.

jakeporeshenko:
Hahaha my friend you are one stubborn individual and it appears you’re also struggling to understand simple English, I never did the bolded.

There’s nothing “covert” about your posts sir, you usually talk long talk straight out of your imagination, serious people drop one paragraph and we know them already, guys like nemesis, SSBN, airborne360 and Oga Zachary999 come to mind.


Please you are wasting my time, take my advice and stop bragging about what you don’t know.

Oshey covert poster.

I'm not your friend. Can't be. I know ur profile reason I told u to steer clear of my posts which if u didn't have time u'd have done. You lack the intelligence to comprehend them. Not surprised seeing one of the names u tout here who brainwashes you to think less of yourself.

Ur resident Indian impresses u with open source info anyone can pick off the internet save of course for u which is why u ululate This is a guy that just told u congressional review will throw military secret out the window and u believed him. Shocking! If u had stopped to think "why do they have closed door hearings"? It even goes beyond that but sry, use ur head to think. U'd have called him out but no u come here and rant ur ignorance in public glare. The ignorance here stinks!

How can u know my posts are covert? U can't! Who has got the time for a non-entity. Steer clear of my posts whose imagination is beyond u. Ok. Not too much to ask.

iblawi:
I was reading a post on a Pakistani site, though the post was posted last year. How true do you think this information is? Now that the super mushaks have been commissioned, it's clear that the Russian news wasn't true but might contain some message. I still want to see the su30 in Nigeria.

Those birds are coming to Nigeria. It is the Tucano, JF-17 & Su-30. Some powerful forces are rooting for the Full-back. The assessment is for a high & low mix of Air Assets for COIN, Counter-Air, Counter-Surface & Long Range strategic Air Ops. The Sukhoi's would fulfill NAFs long range/maritime strike ambitions. Delivery is segmented which raises a whole lot of "when" questions for the Sukhoi's. Some may appear 2018.

overhypedsteve:
exactly what I am talking about. You keep trying to convince yourself that the alpha jet is the best thing for us. The successes made so far have not been because the platform is too good, but cus of the skill and dedication of the men flying it. These men will perform even better on a much better platform.

Impressing! Nice! Good point. Quite surprised coming from u. Great points for reason. No one is saying the Alpha Jets are the best things for us, I don't need convincing on that. But still they have been a good thing for us. If we can get the F22, Su-30,34,35, A-10 + Tucano, C-17 and everything sure would be wow! But reality speaks different as I'm sure u'd agree. For some reasons I won't state here some nations just won't sell to us especially with the specifications we need. We would rather buy with the kill capability from China and Pakistan than buy fancy toys with use restrictions. Nigeria is not finding it easy in the high-end Arms market for geo-political reasons especially in the west whose platforms mostly are cost effective and easy to maintain.

The Alpha Jet a Franco-German Fast Jet has proven an effective platform in the NAF for some of the reasons u mentioned. Those pilots even flew the Alphas at night in Freetown when it's avionics lacked night-time capability. It is a beautiful and great platform for advanced training and the attack role. The under-rating is quite unnecessary–the bird deserves it's due. Surely with newer birds we can do much more but the Alpha Jet still fulfills an important role in the NAF. Not going away soon. Some countries still fly vintage MiG-21 even with their newer birds.

jakeporeshenko:
what light, enlighten me buddy?
post pictures please not propaganda pieces.

Pictures! Ah! Not to worry, I didn't forget Psy-Ops has it's victims. Reason u'd even contemplate the idea of BIR in same class with SBS. I'll take the bait to enlighten u.

For one moment just try hard to decipher between the lines of my Covert posts. The answers are hidden behind the veil. You have to look behind the words to understand it's meaning. When you do, it won't be propaganda. There's a gentleman here who does that so well.

There are actually firsts and bests in Africa. Everyone has his area of strength. Just that some do better in more areas than others. Some have more resources. Intelligence a critical factor is also not equal. If it is everyone would be on same level. But we are not.

jakeporeshenko:
Hahaha funny man.
I Can’t help you reason, imagine chikll came here to boast about Algeria and their defense procurements it’ll just piss everyone off and that exactly what you’re doing.

Statements like “best in Africa” only start arguments end of story.

Not people like me. Maybe you. U fail to see the light. Again I advice u to not see my posts.

iblawi:
I like this reply. Many countries haven't achieved any meaningful thing with their fighters jets. The Ugandan have many troops in Somalia but only Kenyans fly attack aircrafts in Somalia not because theirs is better.

I like this guy. I take u for an assorted gentleman with counter-intelligence potential.

Exactly why I don't notice the broad sides of our friend from the east of the continent. Actually the Kenyans have a military with professional military tradition. They may not have Sukhoi's but they actually have an Air Force with strike Capabilites. They have not done badly in Somalia. It's a difficult place. It's takedown of Kismayo was impressive.

The merits of the Nigerian military in Somalia is that -- the Nigerian Air Force in particular --that can bring to bear the huge amount of sorties & real-time on-the-spot-intelligence strike capability needed to decimate Al Shabaab into a marauding bandit militia. And beyond that pay for our combat operations, something hardly anyone here mentions. That is power.

jakeporeshenko:
Your posts will provoke and argument that’ll wreck the thread so no I won’t ignore them.

Ok then mr. thread protector, no wahala, u're welcome. I'm only asking u to be a good citizen.

jakeporeshenko:
Like I am so confused? Why is bro so mad at me ?
I was only telling covert not to start another argument with one of his long bragging stories.

Jake I'd appreciate u avoid my posts. Pls! Ok! Thanks.

Nigeria Has Bragging Rights.

overhypedsteve:
it's in response to that dude claiming he invaded another country with alpha jets when other countries with better platforms exists.

Why did the countries with better platforms not come and stop our invasion. Intelligence had it that before the invasion, countries like Sudan, Saudi Arabia, Morocco, Uganda etc lobbied hard to be in bed for protection with some of the 5 billion dollars His Excellency Prof. Dr. Alhaji Sheik Yahya Jammeh was believed to have salted away during his years in power. We know the history. U can't change it, sry for u. Well those same Alpha Jets you under-rate and NNS Unity made the difference. Besides some of those countries are in conflict and with their platforms does not even come close to what we have achieved in CT/COIN & Conventional warfare. U think warfare is just platforms. Where is the Ugandan Su-30 in Somalia. If Nigeria was in Somalia with it's Alpha Jets, the situation would be a whole lot better, it's a fact. We have proven history of getting the job done. Shoot! The ignorance on this page.

overhypedsteve:
sometimes when I see what you guys write, I shake my head. Gambian invasion, Seriously? That's what he call it? I am just looking at the guys that keep bringing up stupid facts about doctrine and necessity when the question of building a strong expeditionary Armed Forces is asked. I just hope we do not find reasons to regret soon. While you guys are online shouting we don't need this yet or we don't need that yet, the people that know the real reason why our Armed Forces have not moved forward from being a local law enforcement militia into a strong, standard force to recon with within sub Saharan Africa and beyond, this people are in their mansions laughing at your stupid attempts to put up a defense for them.


You can keep lying to yourselves that it's not yet time, but the truth is with the same budget and resources other countries have achieved more than we could ever dream of achieving. Other countries do not think threats should be visible, they believe national threats should be foreseeable and effort should be made to prepare for them.

But when someone raise the topic here some idiot who know nothing about the discussions that take place within the corrupts halls where defense plannings are made would shout, we are buying what we need, we know what we are doing. We don't need guided missiles, we don't need submarines, we don't need air superiority fighter jets. But the truth is this dolts know nothing.

You would be surprised if the GCFR is not thinking that our alpha jets are the latest technology out there due to the lies been fed to him, you would be surprised if the GCFR does not think that the T72 is the best main battle tank out there due to the ill advise he gets from his advisers.
Then somebody that knows nothing about this would now be defending the T72 that it is the best main battle tank there is. We ve gone through that circle over and over again and it's time for the Nigerian folks that keeps doing that to know that the people that make this decisions probably just googled up information's about main battle tanks available for sell at a cheap price and they chose the ones that best suits their nefarious interests.
If that's not the case then we would be have been seeing positive results from the delegations sent to defense Expo and shows. But nothing they probably do it to get their relatives in the Armed Forces to travel out on an all expense paid trip.

Preach us a new 'gospel'...

jakeporeshenko:
What’s the point of this bragging that you can’t even support with facts, statements like these only start arguments, don’t wreck this thread please.

Stop being apologetic. Shoot! Facts don't kill. If u have any platform these parts in that role to the contrary of ur bolded, state them. Reason don't wreck ok! Dont even get ur beef.

Adminisher:
Don't classify anything. The latest Super Tucano has side looking airborne radar for tracking ground forces at very high resolution. No Russian or Chinese aircraft on the African continent has that technology yet. You have to pay for this technology and Americans will also protect it from theft, these little things drive up the cost.

Dude that is open source. The exact configuration of NAF' proposed Tucanos is not public knowledge and won't be. Sry. What is clear is that wherever that bird is known to have shown up it's effectiveness is not in doubt. Exactly what we need for residual BHTs.

Let's cut to the chase, as much as I've advocated the use of that Tucano sum for initial investment in nascent domestic production of the JF-17s (especially cos of the Obama politics against Nigeria), the Tucanos are are no doubt a deadly 4th generation aircraft. Trump is now president and clearly kowtows to Nigeria as Africa's leader and wants this deal as a win-win for both countries. It is a done deal.

Reason for high sum is classified. Nigeria never discloses add-on's in it's military assets until the shooting starts. When those birds show up Nigeria it will be the most advanced and deadly COIN, CAS, AIR RECCE etcetera in Africa. We know how to kill more than one bird with one stone. That explains the amount.

The Alpha Jets fly at night. In The Gambia Invasion it first thundered over Gambian Air Space at Night sending Jammeh negotiating for escape in 24hrs.

jln115:
Dude he literally said the opposite than what you said!!!! How can you all of a sudden agree with him??

......................You have to look behind the words to understand the meaning.

Iblawi1:
This was a successful mission for the ISIS faction of boko haram. I guess they want their leader released.

I hope we remember the leader of this group was arrested alive some months back and everyone taught they were gone for good not knowing they were on the drawing board.

Heavy losses. Sad. Somebody didn't do his job.

Iblawi1:
That is the point I was making. The quietness/stealth of diesel electric submarines comes into play when it's electrically driven and AIP also help to increase the the time for which it can remain quiet/stealthy. I hope you get my point now. This was why I said it great adds to stealth of the D.E submarines.

If you say endurance is all AIP adds to D.E submarines, you should remember that they can endure thousands of miles while snorkeling.

Lastly, AIP can drive electric generators either for propulsion OR to charge batteries.

A great job u do trying to make him understand. Hope he does cos so far all I see is a guy who "sees no bad in us". Everything is on the up and up for him in SA Lol. Btw their subs don't even have the AIP speaking of.

Tactically Speaking:

We can write from now to tmrw, fact is Nuclear subs are of greater advantage, period. Modern Nuke subs are basically built to be a hole in the water. It's reactor machinery noise is isolated. It is silent. It is nigh impossible to detect (some have said can't be detected). Their positions in a global ocean is an unknown. It's one weakness being very fast, is the heat it leaves on the surface while diving to depth and that mostly is negated by the hydrodynamics of the Sea. This same jin115 won't let us hear word if they get one - in a dream.

Diesel Electric Subs are great and deadly but it's touted stealthiness is remaining still at depth in contested waters. That's a fact. For the sake of saying they are great, the Gotland class is better. In fact the swedes are building subs that can survive torpedo hits but questionably yet in service. Still at that how many hits can it survive? It is limited in range by a whole host of factors not least it's need to breath. In a concentrated ADMI with Air-borne, Satellite, Ship, Submarine search and track sensors it is toast.

Submarines above all else hate search from up there, it almost always gives it away. T'is why range and survivability (need to stay submerged) matters so ur position is hardly compromised. The Heroine Class subs don't have that capability.

Nigeria is still in business.

jln115:
-never said they are better, quieter yes, because all modern d.e subs are quieter than Nuclear subs....look it !!

- if NATO couldn't detect them the Nigerian Navy with much much more inferior systems will definitely not detect them......unless you are telling me the Nigerian Fleet is more advanced than NATO??



- Do you know how an AIP engine works?? Obviously not!!!

- I asked you which regional powers operate nuclear subs!! I also explicitly said are subs are for defensive purposes!! You have the fvcking memory of a gold fish!!

Hope ur catfish memory(u chose this path) reminds you that u knew nothing of AIP till I told u. Likewise the fact I also taught u ur subs are best suited for "littoral defence".

I'm a leave it here or noble talk?

jln115:
What makes you more qualified than them..... simple question answer it!!

You have vivid imaginations...

Answer: I don't massage ego.

jln115:
- What? Did you even bother to simply Google what our Heroine class subs are all about..... If you did you won't be using your fly/bird metaphor!

-HOW!!! HOW are nuclear subs quieter.....you just proved you are extremely ill informed about submarines in general......modern D.E subs are much quieter than Nuclear subs that's a fact mate, look it up

- dude AIP does not reduce noise, it simply continues charging the batteries while the sub is submerged, hence a d.e sub can run longer on battery power and thus extend under water indurance!!

-please provide a citation that states the HEROINE CLASS must surface every 24 hours.

-Which regional power operates a nuclear submarine? Oh yes none, so your argument is irrelevant!

- how can it sink an entire NATO fleet and not get detected during an exercise but not in a real life scenario?? Exercise simulate real life situations other wise what would the point be to even hold exercises?

- stop an envision from who exactly?

- yes you are agubugu

Dude quit this, would ya? Ok u want to be able to sleep, alright I'll give it to u ... your heroine class subs in SA are better, quieter, more powerful than US Ohio class submarines Oh sry ur subs in SA are better and more powerful than all NATO naval capabilities combined as they would sink them all if they showed up

Ah! Not to forget they can't be detected even un-submerged (snorting pipes/periscope, radar mast and all) by Nigeria's radar evasive warships with it's sophisticated processing and guidance systems. In fact they are ghosts in plain sight from ur submissions and according to ur resident "I too know", did u say from India.

By the way so u know the Stirling AIP engines on the Gotland subs are near quiet, so much so for not contributing to stealth.

Nuclear subs are for global strategic effect. But anyway in fact ur subs excel them all

Sure u'd love this Agaugust.

Dream On, Sweetly

jln115:
@Ibwali a Nigerian agrees you are talking sh1t

@nemesis2u an Indian agrees you are talking sh1t

@MikeCZA a South Africa soldier(if memory is correct) agrees you are talking sh1t


What makes you more knowledgeable about submarines than not just the three men above but the entire world......are you a military researcher??

Alice in wonderland story

MikeCZA:
Besides prior surfacing the submarine will conduct surveillance or check any radar activity with it's ESM or the radar warning receiver system mounted on different antennas.

1. Charging batteries will be done outside the patrol or operational area.

2. So the sub will go into operational to hunt for targets or do whatever it is there to do. Then leave the area to recharge it's batteries.

Lol...just look at what u wrote C'mon now believe it especially with the help of ur resident "I too know" which is one sided relief.

jln115:
- it was either you or the other guy I mentioned, regardless endurance is literally the only advantage a nuclear submarine has over a d.e sub.

-AIP has nothing to do with stealth, it simply improves indurance, both Gotland and heroine use the same engines and are more or less the same length have almost same displacement.....it would be ignorant to assume one could possibly be more stealthy than the other. Also it only has to snorkel every couple of days, thus you would need sheer luck to even be within several hundred kilometres when it does snorkel.


- heroine class sub only has to snorkel every couple of days NOT for 2 hours every 24hours.

- yes that's why we bought them.....only superpowers have the means to project ample amount of equipment and troops to even consider building nuclear subs....our subs were bought for defensive purposes.

-So what you are telling me is that defence forces around the world train for fun and not for actual real life scenarios??

Why not use your original moniker Agugaust?

A great thing we can reason. But let's not turn the truth on it's head. Pls pls u have great submarines, I do not dispute that but don't call a fly a bird. That's a stretch. Everyone knows the difference.

Nuclear submarines have more than just endurance. They are faster, quieter (new tech in d. E arguably close). They have longer range (surfaced & submerged) and pack greater firepower etc.

It is ignorance to think AIP has nothing to do with stealth. Beyond endurance it contributes immensely to a subs quietness. Air Independent Propulsion is dissimilar engine configuration as a d. E sub. Gotland class can stay submerged for weeks not months like a Nuke sub. Heroine class must snorkel within a 24hr period. Those are the facts except u're furnishing us with 'alternative facts'.

Not only superpowers can project men and equipment. Regional powers do too. A submarine is only a factor in the equation of military arsenal not an indication of overall military capability.

Thank goodness you agree your subs are for defensive purposes. A task for which it was exactly built and for which it did well in exercises with Nato. In a war it possibly could sink a boat or two which potentially gives it away. Only thing is it can delay an invasion but it cannot stop an invasion.

Agaugust?

jakeporeshenko:
My concern is not with the outcome, I was only trying to point out to lionel that theres a highest possibility of a BIR SBS confrontation rather than BIR AFSF.

please enlighten me on what bases is BIR not comparable to SBS?

Cameroon has indeed built a lot of capacity around it's rapid intervention battalion (BIR) with SOME special forces skill set, well armed and remunerated unlike the rest of it's Armed Forces which makes up for much of the difference seen in it's operations based on French special forces doctrine. The BIR is some three battalions (quite huge for core elite operator units vis-a-vis the size of it's armed forces unlike the NNSBS, British SAS, US Navy Seals) with conventional capabilities. It is under it's army command and directly loyal to President Paul Biya.

Not so the NNSBS which is comparable to the British SBS or US Navy Seals whose selection process is above board. While some of it's training regime is known, much of it is still classified. The NNSBS is more than just your capable special forces like Nigeria's AFSF (drawn from all arms of the military) or 72nd Mobile strike force. It is a small Naval men only unit highly skilled in all art of combat on Air, Sea (under-water) & Land. It is answerable to the CNS. It's numbers are classified. It's covert missions are classified.

For hypothetical reasons as a war with Cameroon is decidedly unequal: the BIR may be comparable to the AFSF or 72MoSF. They won't see the SBS coming.

jln115:
Read and comprehend my post.....you said a nuclear submarine is more stealthy than a D.E sub.....I asked you how......you replay about how long it can stay submerged??

Oh and just FYI if it was easy to find a D.E sub......how come SAS Manthatisi sunk an entire NATO fleet during an exercise??

I don't recall saying anything about stealthy other than the advantages of Nuclear over Conventional subs. You may have read that meaning into my statement.

No doubt even diesel electric subs can be stealthy especially the newer ones being built like the Swedish Gotland class with AIP or even the newer A26. Yours is the heroine class which is good but not as stealthy. A lot of the stealth we speak of is attributed to it's quietness which is negated by it's need to Snorkel.

Yes, one wouldn't know exactly when within that 24hr period it would need recharge but it must and that's hardly stealth. You must realize in war that zone becomes an Area of Direct Military Interest (ADMI). There is not much room for maneuver. This is the point.

jin115 bottom line is your subs are only good for littoral defence. The Nuke subs have far greater advantage for high sea covert operations. And the exercise with NATO remains what it is an exercise, I want to be confident u don't think that would be the case in a real engagement.

overhypedsteve:
and the foolishness continues, you have no hope, plan or budget to buy even a coal powered submarine and here you are, here you are ranting nonsensical bullshit about those that have one.

Apparently English comprehension lessons are needed on Nairaland as faceless foolishness doth abound. And you sound pained or disappointed or both finding out the truth state of your Navy's incapacity especially that ur 'exalted' submarines can't save u.

But save the tears NN actually has PLANS for Submarines. You will see it with ur eyes, Relax! We ain't invading you just yet.