₦airaland Forum

ifeness:
I cannot proof shongo did not create the world, I cannot proof Zeus did not create the world, I cannot proof Hitler did not create the world neither can you proof i did not create the world. The bible is secondary evidence just as Mythology in general is secondary evidence/referencing.

You idea about god is two faced. You claim your god is no superman who can rescue people. You also said your life is governed by principles of: sowing and reaping,labor and reward etc.... Now to burst your bubbles,your bible claimed your god visited Abraham,eat with Abraham,destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah and even demanded human scarifies from Abraham.Your god was busy killing first borns of Egyptians and now cannot predict a simple barca vs madrid match ? I guess your god was very busy at some point and suddenly evaporated into history. My point is,your god is not consistent,seems more of a bipolar who hides under what primitive men wrote.

What activities has your small god been doing lately,nothing! He created the world but cannot control global warming and natural disasters? hmmmm

asalimpo:
a "myth" tht billions find relevant today. A "myth" tht is changing lives and circumstances in present time. So much for a "myth".
Foolishness,is wasting resources only to find out the waste was avoidable cuz sombody else word on the was ignored.

Columbus set sail around the world, only to discover tht the bible was righr afterall. The earth is round not flat as popular believed then.

SETI project has been running for years , wasting taxpayers money in the end they'll either get decieved or find out the truth the hard way.

Ufo's are phenomenan the scientifc world has been suched into but it has been observed tht the alien creatures in d ufo are antagonostic to d name of Jesus!

While the bible said the earth was circular, did it interfere with the quest of explorers to investigate this?
How exactly, does free will to explore,investigate a matter get
shackled by religion?

Atheists on d other hand are getting aggressively militant and intolerant pushg their agenda like islamist on those who dont believe as the do.

pesty100:
this issues are spiritual... Just learn from my sermon... May the invisible pink unicorn bless you

LordReed:
Stem cell research, cloning, etc were banned because of ethical concerns and not because of theism so go figure. In all the schools I went to creationism was not taught in class so if in your locality creationism is being taught maybe you should be addressing that matter not making a sweeping statement of no effect.

LordReed:
If the right to dissent any position is offensive to you then are you not the one living in a bronze age? Besides lobbying against what you don't want is an acceptable tactic that even skeptics use so I still fail to see how your or my appreciation for the universe has been killed by theism.

LordReed:
Amazing how online comments jump out and shout in your ear while you are using your telescope or maybe they jump up and down in front of it.

Macelliot:
The Bible is the most controversial. No other book can compete with it.
The Bible is a collections of books and scriptures...
The bible contains the Old and New testament. The Old testaments contain the five books of the
Jewish Torah or Pentateuch("teaching" or "law", the Nevi'im ("prophets", and
the Ketuvim ("writings".
Bible was coined from a greek word "biblia" which means books.

mesoade:
the evidences available are more spiritually oriented than physical or logical . . And since you don't believe in spirituallity,it's of no use explaining to you

asalimpo:
eye witnesses existed at the time the final canons of the bible were being composed but you know it was millenia ago.
Eye witness accounts would not carry more weight than God's word.

The bible is reliable because it first and foremost the inspired word of God.

You either accept this or not. The koran is'nt the inspired word of God.

They're other bases but they don't fall in importance to the first stand.
Again, the issue boils down to materiality over spirit.

You say,not the bible, that a conclusive claim must b material. The bible doesnt take that stance.

Neither will it take that stance. God may prove himself to a person but so can the devil because the senses can b deceived . But God's word rightly interpreted is truth.

On the NDIC example, you dont do that. U accept many things based on belief tht the spoken/written assertion is tru.

You do this on a lot of matters. You accept a word. Based on the weight and authority of the issuer
Faith in God and his word is similar. because Human beings were created with a capacity to believe first.

Science knows enuff. Yeah,it's come a long way.

thank you for again proving the topic the second time...

But it still operates in the materialisic/sense realm. That doesnt qualify it to make sweeping statements about the scope of reality.

The bible states that there is a spirit world.

its good you know it asserts and states things ……whether they are true is the question

You and science are not qualified or in a position to counter this claim.
No logic you've put up can negate the bibles position.

But in ur ego u want to arbitrate on this matter even to extent of disputing in the existence of God using the tool of science.

the claim of "god"....again try to understand...that its because of claim you think you know "god" exists not that it really was a fact

okay. Science is still conjecturing.
So, the higgs field will create new materiality outta nathing.
Like wen oil fields run dry, it cud b manipulated to create new oil-if thats needed.
Like i said science is still searchg.

asalimpo First,logically speakg,it's impossible for materiality of any mass
to hav occured on it's own . Out of nothing.

davien it is very possible upon interaction with the higgs field....discovered
not too long away
if you were learned on scientific matters you'd know that questions
like those have been solved...

Any book about God has to address these questions squarely.
Assuming the Higgs field created materiality outta nothing.
The question then looms,
1.) the constituent property of a thing wud be "nothing". Then materiality can b deconverted into partial or complete "nothing".
If the higgs field creates materiality from "nothing" and "nothing" (by watever definition we settle on ) isnt an integral property of the by product. Then it means it was removed in d creation process. Then it begins to seem like randomness has a mind.

The question begs anoda question, the higgs is a thing(a type of materiality) hence it created anoda materiality- but it cannot create new mass.
Even in atomic/nuclear reaction new mass isnt created. Energy is constant neither created nor destroyed. If new mass is created then new energy has entered the system.
I'm not a scientist but this is common knowledge.

congrats you sheepishly dishonestly said i claimed the higgs gives materials mass out of "nothing" when i said no such thing but that material can gain mass upon interaction with the higgs ......you then built an argument based on what i never implied..... a.k.a straw man

The bible speaks on a narrow timeless subject. It is not an all purpose book.
I'v said this bf. So correct your misconception on the scope of the bible.
If you want to perform a surgery, you dont open the bible for surgical instructions,
you consult the relevant text.a
Christians know this.

really? are you sure christians do know this?! because ken ham a bible believing christian has built an organisation and movement based on using the bible to answer biology...history... and everything else estimated at over $13 million dollars... all supported by Christians that you claim should know this

Though the bible would command tht a christian do his best work and commit his endeavour to God bf strtg out.

asalimpo:
smart atheist . Which approximation of pie wudve sufficed using that era's number system? 3.1,3.14,3.149 ... ?
Dyu u see the measuring instrument used - cubits - not centimetre or s.i units?
Hand spans which were inaccurate cuz they differed.
Besides tht account was a report.
Have u seen decimal measurements in d bible?
Like 11.5 feet.
99.99 sheckels?
You, have no case.

lol you are giving excuses after excuses…………from "hand spans" to "it was a report" and then claiming that decimals aren't used in the bible....

Age decays philosophies bro ?
The 2000 year age of d bible affects its relevance?
That's the reason for ur question.
So u answer it first.

now i believe its either you are re.tarded mentally or just avoiding my question.....i made no mention of "prophecy"....why are 2000 year old desert unvalidate-able tales relevant to you was the question...

The bible gives enough ansers to why there is disunity in the body.
You can research it.
And they cannot b tht large a number of denominations.
It's logically impossible. You are inflatg tht data. Dyu know what a denomination is?

Evil acts in d body?
The basis of atheism is tht there is no God, not really on his character.

Questions on the character of God is no more a proof of his non-existence.

Trying to malign a person shows u believe in him. Two, it cripples ur atheistic thrust and watever logical justifcation u try to muster.

how more stu.pid a statement can you make...."god" by definition is not a person....but a character in a book....and just like any other character can be critiqued...
Using your re.tarded thinking you trying to malign allah means you believe it exists

If God is supposedly wicked, then the question is wat criteria stipulates how the true God shud be?

your bible gives the criteria of what it should be.....reality goes against it....mercy and justice are two abstract things but your version of "god" is both merciful and just at the same time space-less and omnipresent are two very contradictory terms... its like saying i am nowhere and everywhere at once

How did you get this criteria. Wat makes ur criteria admissible, considering ur general short lifespan against the infinite,immemorial lifespan of the being you try to judge?

Fact is if u want to judge God uve not lived long enough to be qualified.

"god" is a mythical character and as all....are judged by the character they portray in the mythology and the lives they influence in real life....needless to say...your pick of "god" is a racist homophobic tyrant

Som decisions tht seem right to u and the world now, may look foolish many years later.

asalimpo:
you're skirtg issues.
First, do all principles get obsolete with time?
If so wat is the shelf life of a life principle and in this case a spiritual principle?
Was the bible more relevant in its 10th year?
Wat of in it's first 100yrs?

Your unworded assumption is wrong.

whoa! never did i make such a claim asalimpo....i can see now that your desperation has reached new heights...i said how are 2000 year old myths relevant to you...answer the question and stop hiding behind straw-men

As for the so many denominations in christianity - how is God responsible for that?
God is not the author of confusion.

They are many reason for wrong doctrine ranging from illiteracy,ignorance,

self-will,and half baked understandg of the scriptures. The bible stance is clear on many issues but man wants his way.

Aladuras , go bare footed because Moses was told to take off his shoes in the OT- did the bible say tht?
Catholics pray through mary even when the bible says prayer is to in Jesus name. That christians shud approach God personally etc.
Was the bible instruction on these thing complex to the catholic?

You know better than to raise this as a point.

"Evil intents of the bible"
- your pattern is soundg familiar. Leaving the realm of logc into blind mud slinging.
Evil like, "be fruitful and multiply"
,"Casting all your care upon Him for He cares for you",
"you are more more than conquerors through Christ",
"Be anxious for nothing but in everything through prayer and supplication make your request known unto Him" etc.
Those verses sound evil?

Provide evidence that pi is 3 in d bible.

asalimpo:
....
When archiologist excavate a site to to learn about the people tht once lived there, wat they get from sifting sand, and dating elements can only paint a calculated conjecture. There will still b pockets of error/ignorance in their reports. A more authentic report would b a documented eye-witness account of a person who lived there @ that time.

"Did you observe being given birth to ... "
no. I took my parents at words.
I couldnt hav observed this.
Likewise, the nature of som bible truths.

Man cudnt hav observed creation of the world - He takes God's word for it.
Physcal man cannot percieve the spirit realm - He takes God's word for it.
If you, practice som form of this principle then you are being unobjective ridiculing the bible on it.

When u go to a bank with an "insured by NDIC" logo. Dyu, ask for further proof from the cashier bf u deposit ur money or you take the bank's word for it without further questioning?

"Life is a mystery ... "
in other words, Science doesnt know how it began.
The collective secular knowledge of man, cannot point out how life began.
If science is lost about the origin of life,then how much does it not know?
Wat qualifies it to debunk the bible on creation? Logically,none.

First,logically speakg,it's impossible for materiality of any mass to hav occured on it's own . Out of nothing.

Padding, nothing by saying there were pre existent particles is a cop out.
Also, matter, non-living matter doesnt generate,multiply or increase. Only living things do.

Any honest person knows these questions cannot b answered with available scientific knowledge.

The bible insinuates the answer to these .

It hints that the Holy spirit is responsible for the manifestation of all legitimate life forms. A human being is a spirit, his dynamism comes from being a spirit. Autogeneration,cell mutation are all possible from a spiritual essence. That's y Adam was nothing but clay, until his clay body recieved a spirit.

That's y scientists cannot mix all the elements constituting d human body or any other organism and create another organism. They can't. They can clone but not create from scratch.
How this interplay occurs isn't expanded on in the bible.

...

asalimpo:
there's not one single instance of the bible giving a scientifcally wrong assertion.
The pi,ur talkg about, please giv scripture to backup ur claim.

wow! you really don't open your bible..lol
why not open 1st Kings, 7:23....take a pen and paper and sit comfortably...then read the verse below
" The sea was then cast; it was made with a circular rim, and
measured ten cubits across, five in height, and thirty in
circumference."
it is the part about the tank being ten cubits
across and thirty in circumference.
Every secondary school technical drawing student}
knows that the circumference of a circle divided by its diameter gives
you pi. In this case, we have a circumference of 30 and a diameter of
that implies that pi equals three. But, actually, pi doesn't equal
three. lmao!..

"So i need to observe something to confirm it"?
As a materialist and atheist. Yes.

nope...and whether you tag me as "materialist" or "atheist" you missed the point in my statement....things that cannot be observed can be re-traced using evidences or would you say crime scene investigators should give up trying to figure out crimes and use your re.tarded thinking?

because this is the yard stick,you use in debunking the bible and christianity- the five senses criteria.
Otherwise, your arguments fall flat in too many ways. You practice believg without physcal proof, but try to ridicule christians for believing God's word without proof.

There is a reason we call them senses...anything said to exist should atleast be in the range that we can either use these senses to detect....or is it not visually reading the bible you knew about the existence of "god's word"...eitherway if something interacts with the physical world we know then it can be observed either through well constructed experiments...the senses or logical or mathematical conjecturea(like black-holes)

That's hypocrisy.

"Evidence are accumulated to determine past events ... "
in matters of creation, beginning of the world science has only been able to make conjectures.
Many of these conjectures could turn out to be wrong or may need amendment later on.
...

so you mean general relativity...keplers laws...accretion...plate tectonics...and other planetary mechanics that are well substantiated facts and have always occured as predicted in light of observations could be wrong you do realise if they are wrong....it would mean planets....space and other exotic bodies do not exist right?

asalimpo:
a biblical book of over 2000 years means it is obsolete? Correct ur thinking.

A book narrating the history of creation, the old testament, God's dealing with His people in the old covenant. The new Covenant, the nature of the it, rights and priviledges in it, rules for christian living and a prophecy on how d world is going to end.

again....let me remind you....the bible is the claim....not the evidence....just like a spiderman comic is the claim not the evidence of spiderman………and its funny how reality itself contradicts you on your "rules for christian living" because there is a great confusion among most of the 41,000 denominations that claim to be christian....from self service to no self seevice to venerating mary to not venerating mary etc

Now,which of the subjects of d bible are ephemeral?
Is it a book of science or fashion where changes and adjustments with new discoveries is the norm?

Matter of fact, the bible is about man his relationship to God, God's plan and man's history from a spiritual perspective.

None of this is temporary.
Som of d english will b changed as languages change but the essense is timeless.

Again, there is no logic in such replies. Just emotional reactions.

LordReed:
Are theists stopping you from buying a telescope? or a Microscope? Going to school? Reading books? What dimension does this forced belief in God take?

No....but when you are observing a distant galaxy they put on their "god-did-it hats" and start spewing their favorite tales or as the case of ken ham...tell you to never bother looking at the stars....that "god's word" is the only star to look at ………or in the case of a microscope...instead of unravelling the mysteries of the krebs cycle performed by the mitochondrion...you are inhibited by "teach the controversy campaign" by theists because it involves evolution or because they believe in "intelligent design" they lobby for a domain in microbiology ………… and when going to school they'll rather want all kids to be educated on their "creationism" or rather enforce their beliefs on inquisitive kids...and you live in a society so any belief you take affects the society

LordReed:
No one is stopping you from investigating how the rollercoaster works, it is open to discovery, you're only creating an imaginary boogey man of being forced to believe. Rollercoaster rides bring about all sorts of reactions including people screaming, people praying, people puking, etc. still doesn't stop those who enjoy it from getting back on and having fun.

lol....how can i experience those reactions when a person(theist) claims to know it all and enforces that claim publicly to me ...can't prove it but keeps spewing it as true and then expect me to follow suit...

godofwar666:
the goat blood means a Craft trap it is used to call the demons or the angels it really depends on what you want to use it for, while the stars are the life of a being it depends, feel free to ask will tell you more

LordReed:
So the fact that people know who made a roller coaster ride makes it less thrilling? It does not detract from the experience neither does believing that God made the stars make the mechanism of solar power any less awesome.

lol....i'm glad you gave a rollercoaster analogy...
now lets say i take you to one....before boarding you start claiming ridiculous tales about it being wished into existence by a wizard....i merely laugh it off...but you don't stop there....you keep telling me where you think the rollercoaster would go without even yet boarding it....we finally do board it and you keep distracting the experience by loud mouthing tales of magic and contradictory stories regarding where its going.... we finally stop and get off... how much wonder would i have had when you kept spewing garbage that didn't make sense?!

how can you be bewildered by wonder when you claim to know everything.... can't prove it but expect everyone else to follow suit in your bias?

LordReed:
Are there no scientists that believe in God? I for one I'm entranced by many things in our universe I find fascinating.

yes....and when it comes to wonder and inquiry.... "god" is tagged to it....thus minimizing the wonder under an assumed "god-did-it" conclusion... so how can you be truly amazed about anything when you have concluded before hand that you know how...why and even what is responsible just by employing 2000 year old myths and legends?!

asalimpo:
how does knowing that the earth and creation is a master piece work of a deliberate being diminish One's sense of appreciation?
How?

LordReed:
That is what some atheists would have everyone believe. My sense of wonder and imagination is not diminished by one bit.

asalimpo

The bible is clear about how earth came to be.
A Being of infinite intelligence created it. Period.

asalimpo:
Earth formed from the acretion disc of the sun.
You were not there yet believe it.
Therefore the earth and life is all physcal.
The conditions can be recreated today, with modern tech,so y can't science re-create physcal life?

So i need to observe something to confirm it?...
Evidences are accumulated to determine events that happened in the past.....much like collecting evidences in a crime scene to determine the events that occurred....
Using your logic.....did you observe being given birth to?....so how do you know who your parents truly are.....
The origin of life is a mystery.....so how do you want scientists to create something they know little about?
say for the sake of argument they did know how to create life instead of modifying it..would that make desert tales anymore false than it already is...

I'm a jjc wen it comes to science so i wouldnt b able to venture into deep debate. Notwithstandg the truth is simple. Science cannot present a coherent logical answer about the origin of the earth or life - it's all conjecture and heavily debated in d scientific community.

The formation of the earth is well understood and everything in science is debated....the origin of life isn't well understood.....simple
And saying "since science can't come up with an answer" therefore "god-did-it" is not an argument for the proof of anything.... just an argument from ignorance...
just like....lets say if science didn't know how lightning formed.....is that a reason to believe a claim that a God like zeus was up in the sky throwing lightning bolts because it was angry?

The bible is clear about how earth came to be.
A Being of infinite intelligence created it. Period.

It some places it gives some details. Like the present earth was re-created. Meaning the first one was destroyed - wen? During the war that ousted lucifer out of heaven.
Again, the bible doesnt go into details at all - just a hint.

wow....besides the unvalidated claims.....with the full knowledge of the contradictory qualities and overpowering might of the alleged being called "god" with what hope in challenging this and succeeding did "lucifer" have?..,oh and with what knowledge did anyone know how to fight wars if no such knowledge existed nor weapons? …
and why is it that you are content with self-contradictory undetailed claims and then appalled by science saying it doesn't know how life began?

Mathematics is based on truth, physics uses mathematical tools.
But the bible is based on truth also, but it shows that truths have scopes . E.g jesus walked on water,
impossible physically , but it happened. Y? Because, physcal truth was subjugated by a higher power.

math isn't based on "truth" per say but rather symbols that can be represented through models in a certain number of ways to form predictable patterns and conjectures i.e proofs that may be applied to the real world....
And we hardly even know if "jesus" ever existed talk less of defying surface tension of water

Jesus rose to heaven,physcally, impossible physcally, the force of gravity shudve kept him earth bound. But no, it couldnt, physcal truth was subjugated.

i doubt you understand that truth implies no deviation....so how can something which has no deviation be subjugated....another paradox perhaps?

Over and over , the bible shows tht physcal truths and laws can b over-ridden.
You atheists mock at it and call it myth! But the truth is it's you guyz and science that is deficient and bankrupt . Having some catching up to do.

Please get your verbatim right...the bible "shows" nothing...it just claims......the same way a story book claims santa claus is real...
And it is hypocrisy at its highest order to be sending vast amounts of information non-physically through the application of science and then ridicule it for giving you facts that upset you....
and boyyo pi is a round number according to the bible...is that the "catching up" science needs to do?

AND WHAT YOU HAVE WRITTEN SO FAR IS JUST A CELEBRATION OF WILLFUL IGNORANCE....



SMH!

asalimpo:
Space time curvature, singularity .
If u can't say it in a way a layman can understand you're simply bluffing.
Mathemaics proves a bumblebee is incapable of flight! Is it right?

Answer the basic q's and stop bluffg.
How did life strt,
how did earth come to be?

asalimpo please investigate your sources before coming to spew long debunked myths.....
the myth that mathematics disproved bumblebee flight was an error done by a single aerodynamicists which his peers told him to correct but soon the story caught flight.....after examining the wing under a microscope he recognized his folly... science is a self-correcting process