₦airaland Forum

Katsumoto:
Hmmmmm

1. Zik got his tip from Ifeajuna (leader of the 66 coup) months before the coup. Zik left Nigeria in late 1965. Balewa got his tip from Bello who got the tip from Akintola who had driven to see Bello two days before the coup. There is a big difference in the sources of the coup. Did Akintola/Bello/Balewa get their tips from Ifeajuna? If they didn't then it is an attempt at revision to simply suggest that they both got tips. It is a fact that Ifeajuna went to see Okpara right after killing Balewa before escaping to Ghana. Seriously, what was the leader of a coup which had eliminated the PM, the premier's of the North and West as well as other senior political and military leaders discussing with the premier of the East before escaping?

2. Did Awo really send Akintola and Rosiji to Bello or Akintola/Rosiji had their game plan? I find that episode really strange for two reasons.
a) Did Awo really need to make deals with Zik and Bello on the same day? Why did Awo not simply go to Bello on a different day and negotiate himself? Wouldn't Awo have known Bello (considering his god-like status in the North) would have felt slighted that he (Awo) did not come to make the deal himself?
b) Isn't it curious that while Awo was supposedly negotiating with Zik, a call came from Bello to Zik informing him that Awo's people (Akintola and Rosiji) were there with Bello. Why did Bello need to call Zik to inform him about Awo's offer if he didn't know Awo was there? Why did Akintola not refuse to go on the phone to confirm to Zik that he was indeed in Kaduna to negotiate a political alliance with NPC knowing fully well that Awo was with Zik?

Your postulations in question #1 are tools of joke for an avid crowed of conjecturers and propagandists. 

As for question #2, I have the below submissions to add.

Pointing to the political expeditions of the two figures after the incident, I would unequivocally say Akintola/Rosiji had their game plan.

There are few things which remain impossible under the sun. The mind is very tricky and politics is game of chance where every minute not day is valuable time to strike a deal that will leave political opponents in a position of awkward predicament.

This very assumption had swayed me toward Awolowo's side and compelled me to believe that Akintola and Rosiji had serious plans to truncate the political ambitions of Awo. It must be recall that Awolowo and DS Adegbenro were in Onitsha to meet with Zik.

There should be no iota of curiousness surrounding who was responsible for placing the phone call. It has been alleged that Akintola placed the aforementioned phone call to Zik not Bello.

When Awo was handed the receiver by Zik, it has been alleged that Awo was surprised and queried Akintola about his mission in Kaduna. This instance, among other transgressions, led to the expulsion of Akintola from AG for anti-party activity.

However, it will be a negligence of hindsight and display of political naiveté to levy accusation of selfishness on Zik without taken into considerations of political treachery of 1951 in Ibadan and the Awolowo’s brazen fiscal policy towards Ndigbo in 1970.

Having read many political scriptures of the era and regurgitated actions and reactions that followed, I concluded that it was a matter of political treachery and indulgence of “once beaten shy twice”.

Becomrichn:
the north figure out the only way to keep the river state, akwa ibom and cross river is to remove from igbo control. , Now it is a major problem for nigeria.  but the truth is the shout of niger delta looks like some of them are actor or government agent. The north have been using it to checkmate Igbo people bring up Biafra.

It is a way to work with the brain of Igbo people. so anytime the Igbo shout biafra, the north uses the media to shout Niger delta at the same time.  so when Igbos hear that, since they know they have no oil, The igbos keep quiet.

This is what is going on. And the northerner leaders needs to explain to thier people the truth.

We have to remove edo,delta, bayelsa and Yorubas into benin republic to keep everybody safe.   Sorry the north cant be minority. it would lead to violent.

With considerable amount of time and level of technological advancement inserted into satellite imagery, you still can not discern crude oil deposit in Igbo land.

@POST

All these Igbo press releases and conferences are self indictment of clueless bunch of people. This dormant behavior of Ndigbo is what informed me that Ndigbo could be at receiving end again if Nigeria should gravitated towards unrecoverable state of chaos. The so-called traders and big-time transporters of Igbo extraction in Jos could not clandestinely equip themselves with serious weapons to deal with these delusional Islamic youths.

Until Ndigbo show they can play the game too, the threats of mayhem from the Islamic jackasses will not cease.

[[quote author=ndu_chucks link=topic=586376.msg7538414#msg7538414 date=1295101829]The only way to stop GEJ from winning the 2011 presidential election is for Buhari to selflessly withdraw from the race, throw his weight and resources behind Ribadu and campaign with Ribadu, in the best interest of the nation. My personal view is that, Buhari will not step down just as Zik refused to work with Awo. If Zik had accepted Awo’s advances, NPN would not have won the election.


The selfish act of Zik’s is one of the main reasons Nigeria is in its current rotten position – Buhari is getting ready to make the same mistake. Read the excerpt below, watch history repeat itself. Congratulations in advance, President Goodluck Jonathan.


Bid for the presidency (1978-79)


cont’d[/quote]Were you drunk and in a deep slumber as you impugn the personality of great Zik by comparing him with a product of nepotism such as Buhari?   The accusation of selfishness you leveled against Zik is a literary crime punishable by flogging. If all the post-independent leaders of Nigeria had slight resemblance of Zik’s political stigma, Nigeria would have not degenerated into the basket of tribalism it is today.

[quote author=PROUD-IGBO link=topic=583162.msg7535056#msg7535056 date=1295045438]Honestly,nothing best attracts tribalist scum to come crawling out from their maggot infested rat hole than a topic on the great resilient Igbos.

Only someone with a deep-seated,all consuming hatred for a people can invest time and energy trying to convince others that a people who were relegated to the back of the queue since the end of the civil war and have been marginalised ever since -yet are managing to survive against all odds- are not deserving of a round of applause.The merits or otherwise of engaging in the civil war notwithstanding.

Any unbiased observer will notice when positions are sought based on merit and sheer hardwork,without recourse to quota-system; federal character and unfair assistance/support from the federal government (whose composition and control is skewed in favour of certain sections of the country to the detriment of others),you will find the great Igbos either on top or there abouts.If in doubt,check where the Igbos were in the scheme of things nationally pre the civil war.What has let us down (and continues to) are the so called Igbo leaders that are supposed to put the interests of Alaigbo first,b/4 this contraption called Nigeria.Nigeria has held us back as a people.

I'm a proud Igbo son (from Ndoni in Rivers state),and all this Igbo bashing and hatred -from the usual suspects- only serves to deepen the love i have for my people.

Igbo haters,what exactly is your fear?

Igbo kwenu!!![/quote]You should see the old age as your forebears did.

Katsumoto:
You miss the point; Nigerian politicians are rogues. There are rogues in other countries but the level of criminality in Nigeria is quite high; consequently, only the dirty and uncouth are able to play. Can you argue that there are no Nigerians with a better grasp of English grammar than GEJ, Atiku, Akala, OBJ?

Like my dad used to say, politics is not a dirty game; the level of dirt in it is determined by it players. We are not asking for Obama or Clinton; speakers such as Kofi Annan, Ojukwu Akintola will do. Can you compare the oratorical skills of the politicians of the 60s with the area boys we have today.

I am not discounting that fact Nigerian political landscape is populated with rogues masquerading as politicians. My argument is based on eloquence or not. Most of the con dudes are eloquently endowed and can mesmerize with oratorical skills. We must look at the cross-section of Nigerian society before handing down our indictments. I bet you that a candidate who is grounded in eloquence can not even win a dog catcher position in your village if such candidate is not a brown-bag carrier.

Katsumoto:
It is because they are products of a system that does not support meritocracy; a system to which they are now part and parcel of. No one can do more than his ability; expecting an eloquent political speaker in Nigeria is akin to expecting a cat to swim through an ocean.

I agree the leaders of men should pass through some kind of meritorious strata. But quality of a leader should not be appraised through the prism of oratorical skills especial when the mode of communication is not a mother tongue.

Atreides:
@Dede,i do agree that not every Nigerian can speak/understand standard English. If you're saying that politicians should should speak in pidgin,then that's a different thing entirely. I personally think that pidgin is so widely used it should be made a national language. However,you didn't say 'pidgin';you said 'mother tongue',by which you mean indigenious languages. I still say that politicians speaking in their mother tongue is not feasible. Nigeria is waay too diverse for that. Speaking in a mother tongue would limit you to a certain group/tribe,while speaking in English would cut across tribal boundaries. And again,we have been speaking English for the past 50 years. It is not too much to expect that we develop some proficiency in it. English does unite us,not just as Nigerians but as humans. In an international forum,could our president speak Yoruba and be understood by people who are not Nigerian natives? If he spoke in English,everybody,both Nigerians and foreigners would stand a better chance of understanding him.

If you are not troubled by Nigerian politicians making speeches in Pidgin English, I am also for it. However, I do not subscribe to the plank of international forum because leaders whose languages are not English Language address international community through interpreters. Again due to the diverse nature of Nigeria, both in culture and tradition, I tend not hold Nigerians or the politicians to unadulterated standards of spoken English Language. Nigeria is not my ideal country but have to make do for now.

Atreides:
Which mother tongue? Nigeria is too diverse for that idea to fly. There are too many indigenous languages/ethnic groups in the country for that idea to be practical. There is no common mother tongue. Say Atiku speaks in Hausa. I'm not Hausa,so i won't understand him,and i don't think he can speak in Bini. English is our common language. It's what unites us,despite the different cultures and tribes in Nigeria. We've been speaking English for the past 50 years. Is it too much to ask that we develop some proficiency in it?

Did you take into consideration that grammar (English Language) is not their mother tongue before you lampooned them on linguistic prowess or lack therefore in your previous post? We must appreciate the efforts of Nigerian politicians on the oratorical level because Nigeria is a disjointed entity. I guess Nigerians from northern region enjoy listening to the speeches of political operatives from the region. The same scenario applies to other region except for such purists such as you. As you posited that “English Language” is what unifies us in Nigeria, I hope it includes the grade spoken on the streets and in market squares.

T9ksy:
Posted by: Dede1 Today at 08:04:32 PM
when these so-called "fellow nigerians" decided to truncate the union "peacefully" by invading their region then they were left with no choice but to return the favour. They "peacefully" sent them packing!!!

Even you also indulge in this despicable act of intellectual dishonesty. I guess you need a sustainable perusal of the chronicle order of events which led to the Nigeria/Biafra war.

Eko Ile:
You and your d/umb and ignorant utterances sha. People swore oaths to defend and fight for their country and they did, they did not fight for Hausa people, they fought for their country and it doesn't matter how many times you repeat that irrelevant garbage, your leaders from ZIK to Ekwueme, Ojukwu and now Soludo are all Hausa boy boy.

This is reality and your faith, boy boy is part of your DNA and your own boy boy days are coming,

And please get off that cry baby war nonsense, you mumu were foolishly sent to war to fight a foolish man's war and got dumped on the battle field by the same foolish man who is now doing boy boy for the same people he sacrificed you and your people's lives for.



Shameless people, Abeg clear road jare.

Whoever let you out of the psychiatric cage should be severely flogged. Even the nitwits who beard arms for the so-called One-Nigeria have publicly denounced their participation in the war. I met handful of them while they were exiled all over the place. There is no doubt a douche bag such as you have never belonged to any regimental group. The swearing of the oath you imbecilely cited in your previous post is to "defend Nigeria". The oath was not to fight fellow Nigerians who had decided to end the union peacefully. olodo

JomoGbomo2:
Really, i am surprise with the level of hatred shown on this thread.

First of all, i dont know if the igbo people on NL are different from my igbo friends out there, if they are, i will be very happy, if they are not i will start being careful cos my igbo friends out there and at work are marvellous set of people like everyone else and they have never felt insecure or complex about any thing.

I think the only set of people that lost the civil war are the NIGERIANS, everybody that died could have helped in one way or the other to build this country.

Lastly, to all my igbo folks on NL, you are not going to gain other tribes sympathy or adoration by trying to put up tribe-sensitive or tribe-centric issues here all the time. infact you are only going to make the distrust worse. ask yourselves do you want to solve the problems we have or do you want to add to it. topics like this only add to our tribal problems.

The past is for us to learn from and make corrections but what my igbo folks are doing here is like holding on to the past like their future.
Abeg make we change. biko nu.

Any Igbo person who consciously adopts you as a friend is infinitely delusional. The silly assumption that Igbo people should act in a manner to curry empathy from certain less unimportant groups in Nigeria borders on a thoughtless endeavor of epileptic proportion.

Most of the so-called Nigerians have done their worst to Biafrans and Ndigbo and no further acts of impunity could faze Ndigbo now or in the future. However, your empty drivel about Ndigbo “holding onto the past like their future” is akin to listening to road direction from a deranged fellow. The past very much dictates the future.

Atreides:
A little bit of both. A leader is supposed to be able to inspire the public by his/her words. Our political leaders make me sleep when they speak.

Have you insisted Nigerian politicians address the public in their mother tongue? Most leaders who could be termed as good orators usually address their audience in native language. Nigerian politicians of the 60s tried to emulate British colonialists and impress their people. However, things have changed as politicians of today are in politics to accumulate wealth.

@OP

Are you insinuating they are not wordsmiths? Or are you exasperated about their oratorical style?

Eko Ile:
Second fiddle = Boy Boy


Btw, don't attack me, I'm just the messenger, it was written by one of your ibo brothers, lol

The only regrettable second fiddlers or shameless porters Nigeria has ever produced were those loudmouths from southern Nigeria that put their lives in harm’s way while fighting for the commanders and politicians from northern region of Nigeria in 1967.

[quote author=alj-harem link=topic=583867.msg7511182#msg7511182 date=1294777625]my igbo brothers you have started again oooo

just talk about the issue and not about igbo and niger delta

please biko [/quote]I do not engage in a process that has a wrong primes. The attitude you displayed in this post with regard to previous posts is the major problem of Nigeria. We must try to get our priorities corrected from the beginning. I repeat Niger Delta is an oddity in the thread.

Original poster stated with ethnic groups or tribes and even included the “minority tribes” as the sequence remained educative but suddenly introduced Niger Delta which is neither an ethnic group nor a state but useless political lexicon found in hopeless Nigeria.

Katsumoto:
You have got to be joking. I presented information backed by evidence and you are suggesting something. You made a claim that Igbo representation was 87% as at 1966. I supplied data which states that Igbo representation was 30%. Instead of debunking my argument by presenting your own data you suggest that my argument is ethnically motivated. Surely, you can do better than that. What I expected from you is to log on to Amazon to buy Robin Luckham's book straightaway. Even if Luckham is non-Igbo (He is not even Nigerian) surely you can present data compiled by an Igbo son. I await your data to counter mine.

I know the North is not one tribe but we are not debating the composition of Northern ethnic groups in the military in 1966, we are debating the composition of Ndigbo in the armed forces in Jan 1966. If you posit that there were 100 Igbo officers in January 1966, then please supply their names. I know that number is greatly exaggerated. I know for a fact that there were only 25 officers in that coup including lieutenants and second lieutenants. Where did you get 100 Igbo officers in Jan 66 from?

My bad, I meant 37% of the officers in Nigerian army cadre were Igbo in 1966 as indicated on my previous post which you cited. I can reel off names close to 100 officers without thorough research but that is next to exposing industrial secret.

[quote author=ndu_chucks link=topic=584318.msg7516435#msg7516435 date=1294847541]Scenario 1

GEJ wins the PDP primaries. Atiku files a lawsuit and GEJ is disqualified. Remember that a has already judge ruled that the violation of article seven sub section two of PDP "constitution" or by-laws, is grounds for disqualification. But that the violation has not yet happened because PDP has not yet presented a flagbearer. Clearly if GEJ cannot emerge as the flagbearer without the violation of article 7. Prediction: GEJ is disqualified

Scenario 2

Atiku wins the PDP primaries. GEJ and his cohorts file a lawsuit. Atiku is disqualified because of the waiver issue. PDP is forced to present another flagbearer. Sarah Jubril, IBB, or some other person becomes the PDP flagbearer.

Scenario 3

Atiku wins the PDP primaries. GEJ and his people accept the outcome.


Either way, PDP is in hot soup. [/quote]You posted very clever scenarios staring PDP in the face as election looms.

The scenario 1 could happen including kicking GEJ out of PDP for anti-party activities.

The scenario 2 is not possible because waiver issue is discretionary object of the party.

Katsumoto:
I could careless for your tribal chest beating but I do not like ridiculous claims being made. How do you reconcile the part in bold above with your post below? Surely, you are not suggesting that 87% of officers in the Armed forces were Igbo yet only 19% (3 out of 16) of the top echelon were Igbo. How did you come up with 87%? Do you care to share your list of the officers corp in January 1966? If I had the time, I could easily debunk most of the claims you made up there but it is not really relevant. What is important is that I debunk the most outlandish claim you made.

Like Babapupa said, most Ethnic Groups are first in one endeavour or another. It is mostly individuals who lack personal achievements of their own, that claim superiority through their ethnic group. The question is, what do you excel or hope to excel in; forget about the achievement of others. By virtue of high numbers, Igbo, Yoruba, and Hausa are bound to have more noticaeble achievements than other groups but we do not really know how well each group (including the minorities) is doing relative to population figures (which remain a controversy). Besides, does it really matter? It is this 'my group is superior to others' mindset that has kept Nigeria in the doldrums for the past 50 years.

As at January 1966, there were 330 officers in the Armed Forces.

Igbo (Other South) Yoruba North    Total
104     43                67        116    330

Using the numbers above, Igbo had approximately 30% in the armed forces.

Source: Robin Luckham, The Nigerian Military: A Sociological Analysis of Authority and Revolt, 1960-67 (Cambridge: At the University Press 1971):231. Grab yourself a copy

Pal, we tend to enjoy trading of historical facts on this forum eruditely. But sometimes, you seem to jettison the scholarly traits due to pressure from tribalism. In fact, I am impressed with your exploratory research on this issue. However, I shall plead with you to glance through you data again. I know you shall agree with me the north is not codified as a tribe or ethnic group in Nigeria. The same thing goes to (Other South)

As at January 1966, there were 330 officers in the Armed Forces.

Igbo   (Other South) Yoruba   North      Total
104       43                  67          116      330

Using the numbers above, Igbo had approximately 30% in the armed forces.

In fact, the above data you posted is immorally wrong and borderline criminality.  The mere number of young Igbo officers who participated in the January 15, 1966 coup almost numbered in 100. I am completely disappointed with you.

jason123:
Na wa for you guys ooo! Babapupa and dede1, what did you gain?

@igbo boy
Have I ever said I rep my people? All I said was I would prefer SN, ND REP, OR WITH YORUBAS not biafra! I repeat, I do not rep my people but myself. My people have their own mouths. We are individuals and its a free world!

I usually do not indulge in such loath and sadistic illogicality however it is imperative to show some love to lascivious and demented cage mates such as eko ile and Aigofa. The thread title in part as “don’t the Igbos deserve round applause” was created by presumably non-Igbo contributor to the forum who goes by Blackteeth. The aforementioned thread did not age for second from the period of its creation when the mortal enemies of the ethnic group bellicosely joined with incoherent posts.

Eko Ile:
Stop the silly and redundant nonsense about first to do this and first to do that. Every tribe in Nigeria have their first in many things. You want me to get into the childish game and start listing the first in other tribes?


Freeking childish, shallow, vain and inferiority complex people beating chest all over the place over nothing.

And the crap you listed amounted to nothing, the west was way way ahead of the rest of Nigeria developmentally.

The west was scoring first in Africa with major infrastructures when your so called fist Nigerian president was neglecting you and doing boy boy for Hausa people and many. Our gains are still out there in brick and mortar.

What do you people have to show for what ever silliness you are beating chest over? What's so laudable when you are absolutely irrelevant politically and economically? What's so laudable when your people are busy killing and kidnapping school kids, and your men and women for petty greed?


You people no get shame I wear. You should be selling your nonsense to folks outside Nigeria with little or no knowledge about you and Nigeria.


Yeye,

I guess childishness and inferior mentality drove you into a thread that Igbo deserve round of applause. Probably one of infrastructures was labeled Liberty Stadium and yet the kids from CKC Onitsha traveled to western region and thrashed the team from your best school.

Whatever you idiotically called achievement in the west is what the east regarded as painted sepulchral. I had wished that your forbearers were as wise you have given them credit. Giving your incoherent ranting, I wonder why your forbearers joined the fight against the very region that lacked every imaginable infrastructure.

[quote author=alj-harem link=topic=583971.msg7512470#msg7512470 date=1294793508]the answer is clear, a Villian [/quote]It is an abhorrent rascality for any human being to insinuate that Ojukwu is a Villian.

Eko Ile:
When are you people going to start applauding yourselves lying? Who dash you that nonsense? Go slap the pesin 1 thousand times.

You peolle can hide behind the war as much as you want, the fact is, the west was way way ahead of you and the rest of Nigeria before and after the war.



Awon delusional 419'ers buruku, lmao

In what instances were your people ahead of Igbo before the war? The Nigerian demographic sectors such as military officer’s cadre, civil service and academia showed significant Igbo presence which led to the mythical dominancy of this ethnic before the war.

Igbo was first speaker of Nigerian house of reps, the first senate pro tempore, first Governor-General, first president, the first two VCs of the four universities in Nigeria and it would have been three out of four until Akinjide introduced tribalism into Nigerian academia.  As of 1966, Igbo had 87% of Nigerian officer’s cadre. Igbo was the first African to seat in the world court.

The Igbo is the first foreign cadet to become brigade squad leader in RMA, Sandhurst and best record by foreign cadet till date.

@OP

Please remove the paragraph headed by Niger Delta because “Niger Delta” does not exist in the context of your post.

Must she work for NYSE as to be qualified to head or work for Nigerian Stock Exchange (NSE) and the Securities & Exchange Commission (SEC)? The level of inferior mentality constantly displayed by Nigerian is disgracefully alarming. The people who serve as directors at Japanese and Chinese stock exchange sectors never set feet in USA.

There is no bigger political clown that walked the surface of Nigeria than Anthony Enahoro. For those who perplexed and jolted into animalistic form because of the decently constructed eulogy given by parliamentarian from Edo State during his condolence visit to the family of late Anthony Enahoro, I say this is the reason dictionary was created.

There is no court in the land that will disqualify GEJ bid for presidency based entirely on the PDP constitution as referenced in section 7-2C. The section maintained zoning formula but was not unambiguously stated. The only way court can disqualify GEJ is by dismissal from the PDP for anti-party activities if such grounds for dismissal could sustain scrutiny of the court.

Zik was less visionary than Bello as shown in the alleged winded speech laden with constructive words. I am of the view that the speech accredited to Ahmadu Bello was more visionary than Zik’s and it came to pass six years later as he predicted.