₦airaland Forum

@naijababe

Its Alex Song, Diaby didn't make the trip.

proudly9ja:
lool, Ild have been happy if the league was called Manchester Premierleague not English Premier league. As it is, whatever ManCity is doing (and wateva they do in future) will also affect us. Considering that we are the ones who are shy to spend money, Id rather the arabs take their money back to Asia!

Its good jare, they need derbies of the class we have with clubs like Chelsea and Tottenham, I'm sure City will soon get considerable following like Chelsea and we've never competed in terms of spending anyway. The worst that can happen is that we remain where we are. He that is down needs fear no fall. 

debosky:
With Traore, Gibbs and Jenkinson going on tour with Arsenal, I begin to suspect we will not replace Clichy. That would be a mistake in my book for two reasons - the injury problems of Gibbs are catalogued already and he is highly inexperienced in the EPL to boot. I'd even prefer Traore to him - at least he's fit and has played at various clubs - Portsmouth and Juventus included.

Actually we won't, Arsene already said it, he's been sold to give Gibbs his chance. I hope the money is spent in some other area of the team, don't mind Gibbs getting his chance though a player like Izaguirre would have been nice  but that money should not be banked.

proudly9ja:
Last time I was there, there had this circus thingy going on in front of the stadium plus lots of clearing going on too. Is that part of what they are spending their money on

I'd guess so, arab oil money is very good, Etihad Campus they are calling it and I've forgotten how many jobs they say it'll create. There is a new kid on the block meen and they have the backing of Manchester city council, about time someone does to Manure what Chelsea did to us and give them a challenging derby. I'm sure coogar's people are peeing their pants already.

proudly9ja:
£150 million spread over the next 10 years.

It might end up being even more than that, the project is huge and goes beyond the stadium itself. They intend to invest over 1billion pounds into that area of manchester over the next 10 years. How much of that they'll divert towards bypassing FFP remains to be seen, there are already rumors that the naming rights contract will be scrutinised to check if it goes over the fair value of such contracts

I wonder how some arsenal fans dey think sef, do you cut your nose off to spite your face?

How Fabregas becomes responsible for Alves' jibes and Nasri responsible for the media's unfounded rumors beats me, There is nothing that any of those two have ever personally said that indicates disrespect for the club in any way, the last 2 main points I recollect Nasri saying is that people shouldn't believe everything they read in the press and that his decision wouldn't be based on money.  

Rooney put in a tranfer request and still had the audacity to say f*%ck you to everyone who watched the match against City and dem never kill am for OT, Ribery wanted to go to RM, was forced to stay and then later renewed his contract with DK's perverted lot but he is still revered at the Allianz. There is nothing I demand from any player who stays than 100% commitment on the pitch, it is what they are paid for, they are not even paid to love Arsenal. If the love of Arsenal is what they get paid for and not their footballing ability then some of us here should be the highest earners at Arsenal.

Anyone who decides to go should buzz off and anyone who decides to stay should not be booed because they had differences with the club , they should be booed for their performances or lack of performance on the green grass of the emirates and whenever they put on the jersey.

coogar:
yes, you built yours and it's called the emirates? when did arsenal and the uae become blood brothers? mumu!

That doesn't alter the fact that you are factually wrong dadandidi.

coogar:
what is there to worry about? it's their bloody stadium and if they decide to name it etihad, whose business? arsenal did the same with the emirates - what did y'all do with the money?

Point of correction, it is not theirs, it belongs to Manchester City Council, they are just leaseholders. We built our own and don't pay anybody to use it. 

@Debo

That is already FFP circumvention at work as Etihad airlines also belongs to the Abu Dhabi group but there is a limit to how far they can go with it. They can't announce naming deals every year so that is 120m for 10 years, I think we got 100m for 10 years on the emirates.

O ga o, Arsenal sells naming rights to build stadium, money miss road people sell naming rights to an existing stadium to buy players, I wonder why Manchester City council allowed them rename it in the first instance?    if you hear a scandal of councillors taking arab money in the future don't be too surprised. 
Anyway, I'm happy cos those people's plan for Manchester is da shiznit so I aint complaining as I also enjoy the good things of life. People from Abu Dhabi should be allowed to come and develop Manchester if they so choose to spend their money.

Thank you o UEFA for FFP, at least some books now need to be balanced, I expect to hear something similar soon from Chelsea if they intend to continue buying. I was laughing listening to Bobby Charlton saying Manure will never rename OT, yu've got no say in it Pops, the Glazers own the damned place and can sell it to Saddam Hussein in hell if they so desire, the worst you can do is to go wave some green and yellow scarves in the stadium. rejoice in your trophies and stop speaking like an authority on what you know nothing about. 

proudly9ja:
dudu seriously,


Simple logic. When it was Arsene and SAF, we came first or second. Then the big boys brought in money to the other london team and then we dropped down one notch (we started struggling for 2nd or third).
SAF started spending money and City got a sugar daddy too and last season we had to be contented with 4th position. Considering that Liverpool has strengthened their side (as far as I know, they haven't lost any core member and they have just signed Adams and will prolly make one or more signings), do you not think that the fight for top four will not be as 'easy' as it used to be? Consider that even for two seasons now, top four hasn't been that easy?

In short, to even maintain that top four position, we need to spend relatively more money than we have been spending in seasons past.

Interesting trend with good insight, to be honest I didn't think along those lines and we'll find out soon enof the answer to that
I'm still sure we'll be in the mix though, but primarily becos of the simple reason that Arsene is at the helm, other secondary reasons are that we really are better off financially  and that Arsene is still adept at bringing in quality when he has the money to do so and when some really basic expectations at Arsenal are being threatened.
I expect a good number of our young players to step up as well, imagine if we needed to buy Wilshere and Ramsey at this point in time and at this stage of their development? 

coogar:
leave man utd out of your rants. . . .concentrate on chelsea and man city. man utd are a different kettle of fish. . . .

the debt has been reduced from £800 million to about £490 million as at the last time i checked. . . .

let arsenal adopt united's model if they can. . . .and if they cannot, why not get a benefactor like their rivals instead of coming here to tell[b] porkies.[/b]
this time last season, united in debt was your mantra. . . .12 months later, man utd have spent £50 million even before the transfer window opened and they are hoping to spend more without a sugar-daddy. . . .sit back and admire.

Was about saying someone should give you a cigar for your honesty, and that I made a £10m mistake, then I saw £800m and wondered where the hell that came from? . Keep getting stuffed on your porkies, I don't recall ever mentioning £800m
Don't see no porkies in what I wrote, if you see any kindly point them out or accept that they might just be your nightmares becoming reality.

proudly9ja:
The point is not about what Arsene is happy with or not happy with. Like you said, he has stated the reality on ground. I was only pointing to the fact that even the top four position we seem to be taking for granted is no more assured going by the trend in the EPL for 6 years now.

Secondly, I think its not totally true the way we brandish this financial issue whenever we bring up the issue of our ambition as a club. Would it have cost us outrageous money to keep Nasri for one more season? Would we have gone bankrupt bringing in Samba and Gervinho and maybe one more goalkeeper? Especially if we end up selling Bendtner and Denilson?

Inter got Alvarez for only 12 million euros and they are evn paying installmentally! What is our excuse? I think there's more to this financial thingy. I don't buy it one bit. BTW, how much would we LOSE if we don't make the top four next season? If we don't make the top four and hence lose money, would we continue to work the same way?

Food for thot Proudly, in each individual instances I'll agree with you but as a general principle though, it would be a slippery ground as the sum of the individual instances can lead to a dangerous trend (from a financial perspective). You really shouldn't be worried about our top 4 aspirations we've done that consistently for 14 years now even through a period when our financial situation was more precarious, the one time it looked like happening produced the club record signing of Arshavin.

I was particularly irritated in the way the Alvarez issue panned out, with the little I saw of that guy, I think he is one we'll be hearing more about very soon injuries permitting I don't think the club should be haggling over the 1.7m some papers reported, some other info I got was that it was actually a dispute over sell on fees percentages that caused a breakdown in negotiations and there is some credibility to that because the detals released in the press suggest Inter only own 90% of the player at present which would suggest possibility of sell on fees cuts. We should be closing off such a deal though no matter what,  particularly when the player had come out so openly that he wanted to come.

v3:
Please. .what has Kroaker don since becoming the new Arsenal owner?

He stated clearly what his stewardship would be about in his mandatory offer:

1. No leveraged buyout to distrupt the club's finances
2. A commitment to the existing self sustaining model of the club

He further underlined it by retaining the old board.

In short he never intended to become a sugar daddy, what were you doing when all hell broke loose on the thread when he was taking over and some people were telling us Arsene was about to get sacked? You be my mod, don't let me start questioning your literary abilities o. 

@ Proudly

That statement is as realistic as you can get, nowhere in there does he suggest that he is happy with the situation? he is only being realistic with the way the club is structured and the decisions taken at the board level (of which he is a part anyway), making the best of a situation that is far from ideal and questioning why those principles are ridiculed in the press and by the less discerning.

Is it wrong to operate within the earnings a club makes and run a club prudently? NO, that was the norm before Roman.
Is it guaranteeing success at this point in time? obviously NO
Is it in the best interest of the club in the long term? we agree to disagree but time will tell.

In the interim, the financial muscle of the big 3 continues to clear up the major trophies and now look to deprive us of our best players that we've laboured to develop, City and Chelsea live on their benefactor's funds without an iota of accountability and Manure is at the whim of the Glazers paying 40m in interest annually with the principal 500m bond due in the next 6 years or so without any suggestions that they are putting anything behind to pay it back, true they can always sell it on but then they'll have to find a buyer first who will be willing to pay back a debt of 500m after paying whatever is agreed as the cost of taking up 100% equity in the club.

proudly9ja:
We sold Hleb, Henry, Adebayo and Kolo in 3 seasons and you want to compare that to selling our two most influencial players in 1 season? especially considering that the general consensus is that our team from last season just isn't good enough?
And we all know that we have to wait one or two seasons for these new french boys to get used to the EPL before they show their stuff?
Anyways, personally, I don't think Nasri will be sold. Not too sure about Cesc but I hope at least, Nasri stays.

Its the seeming mass hysteria I question, if Arsene has no choice than to sell Nasri, (an event that is yet to happen despite all the noise). Then he has shown over time that he replaces such players with players good enough to maintain the status quo or to even be better.

What exactly is the lamentation about? is it that losing Nasri and Cesc will make us miss out on the PL title (something they've so far failed to win anyway, a fact which also indicts both players no matter how good anyone thinks they are) or is it that losing them means we're about to do a Liverpool? If it is the former I consider it misplaced as a PL title for Arsenal right now is far from a certainty, optimism? YES, certainty NO. If it is the latter then that is an unfounded fear, I fully expect Arsenal to be consistently in the top 4 yet again with the usual media will they? won't they? scenario reenacted all over again.

v3:
Won't believe any of this till i see Gervinho's picture on Arsenal.com. Reporters be fanning the flames these days abeg.

It is the same Sky source that said Alvarez has agreed a deal with Inter so why believe one and write off another?

Surprised we missed out on Ricky Alvarez, bloke said on twitter he wanted to go to Arsenal and I really thot that was a done deal, shows it is not over until the ink dries on the paper sha, bloke looked really explosive. Losing out on him might have to do with the Argentine contingent at Inter sha which brings up the question if we've ever had an argentine on our books. Those who asked for Melo all those seasons ago might still get their wish.

Now will all those slagging off the chances of the team in making top four next season be honorable enof to hold up their hands when we make the UCL yet again rather than letting all hell loose at a potential end of season collapse?  
If we survived selling Hleb, Henry, Adebayor, Kolo, within 3 seasons and didnt become a mid-table club we will definitely survive the sale of any players being mentioned at present so why the hysteria?  

Not sure about this recent rumor but if its from John Cross, then there is likely some truth in it, the degree to which the media has twisted it though should rightly be questioned. There has always been a rumor around those in the know at the emirates that Diaby's leg never really fully healed after the horrible tackle he suffered in the 06/07 season and that he's never been able to play for a consistently long period without some complaint flaring up on his ankle hence the reason for his frequent visit to the Physios and the reason for his furious reaction to Barton's tackle at the time as well as Arsene's disgust at Shawcross's tackle on Ramsey.
It is one of the reasons why I think Wenger is going for Ricky Alvarez as competition/Backup possibly with Ramsey also coming into the frame. If any of Cesc or Nasri leaves we should rightly expect like for like replacements.

proudly9ja:
Are we talking of the same Emirates cup?

No , haba pardon my ommision I was referring to Season tickets waiting list in the latter part of the sentence. Now fixed. 
but the emirates cup is already almost booked up as well. Most of the good seats are gone.

I like the current situation of things at Arsenal, it is right to be disatisfied cos if yu're not disatisfied with your current situation then you don't see any reason to improve or get better. I don't think even the board will come out to say they've got all things right.

I think it is also right that most people now understand what exactly the club faces in terms of competition and the resources it has to engage the competition and maybe individual and group expectations can be adjusted appropriately, there must be a way to compete in the environment we find ourselves in, maybe it will require going a considerable period without trophies like Dortmund, maybe it will require breaking some contracts like Debo suggests I do not know.

What I however do not want anyone telling me is that Arsenal is in crisis, it is untrue in every sense of the word, financially and in terms of the ability to compete we are not far away at all. I can understand the press' gloomy outlook about all things Arsenal, afterall no news sells as much as bad news. It is not by mistake that we've not slipped out of the top four for the past 14 years, as a fan when you look at the bad, never forget to also appreciate the good as well.

Some people think fans are disatisfied enough to start voting with their feet yet I'm struggling to get 3 seats in a row for the Emirates cup Sunday which is almost a month away and the waiting list for season tickets is still as long as Methuselah's beard, you can try applying for one and maybe yu'll qualify for one in a decade's time as I know people who have been on the list for the past 3 years and still don't know when they'll get, infact I'm considering applying right away maybe I'll be able to raise the money in about 5 year's time when I might have sufficiently advanced up the waiting list. 

dayokanu:
And whats this success Real has achieved in Spain recently

Kindly refer to the latter portion of the post which you so ingeniously disregarded but is hereby repasted below. Please remember to pay particular attention to the portion in bold.
who else but DK would be so quick to forget that RM won the Copa Del Ray this season and missed out on the La Liga against a team being described in some quarters as the best ever by a single point in the last season.

duduspace:
Like most other things in life however, there comes a point when the impact of expenditure to benefit gains in terms of team quality begins to reduce (as evidenced by your Munschit club this past season) and infact if taken at a single instant in time as you are prone to do, the simple in mind might not notice any correlation whatsoever.

dayokanu:
In Europe based on spendings City, Chelsea and Madrid should be rotating the CL in between themselves

Even a deluge of money needs time to gel. What RM have done in Spain and the UCL as well as Bayern's dominance in the bundesliga are clear evidence of a link between money going into a club consistently and the success a club achieves relative to its peers who don't have access to such financial resources.
Like most other things in life however, there comes a point when the impact of expenditure to benefit gains in terms of team quality begins to reduce (as evidenced by your Munschit club this past season) and infact if taken at a single instant in time as you are prone to do, the simple in mind might not notice any correlation whatsoever. 

dayokanu:
Are you now agreeing with me that its not the signings that are the problem, Its the COACH who is the problem

Wrong interpretation, it means that the COACH is doing well with the financial resources at his disposal, it is well within the realm of reasoning to say that if Arsene had the money to revamp his squad at a go rather than the evolution the club has opted for he could have gotten 3 - 5 quality players in at a go rather than waiting for young players to step up yearly in most cases. Up till now, no one not even the press have accused Arsene's buys of not giving value for money, it is the perceived miserliness that is being criticised by even the worst of his critics.

dayokanu:
After Ballack left we have achieved more than we did with him even in CL and it has nothing to do with Bundesliga

So you havent explained why Arsenal cant tell their players to sit their contract to the end.

It has everything to do with it, if the PL is so lacking in competition that Arsenal is guaranteed to win it 95% of the time, will anyone be complaining of a 6 year drought?  
and if there was no 6 year drought, we could tell Nasri and his entire generation to go to hell even if it means missing out on silverware for a season. Is that not what LVG did with some of your top players that led to your poor season this year?

DK, look at it this way, no Bayern fans are complaining that Ballack left on a free but Arsenal fans are still lamenting 3 years after the event of Flamini leaving on a free and still chucking a few curses in Arsene's direction cos we haven't won anything since then, each club's situation is different. Bayern can afford to do it cos yu're superpowers in the Bundesliga, in the PL some money miss road people have upset the apple cart.
I think it is key that we keep Nasri though, losing Cesc and him at the same time will definitely tell on the team next season, we can't really afford to lose 2 players of that calibre at the same time.

dayokanu:
Bayern did it with Ribery and also with Ballack told them to run their contract that they are not interested in selling

I don tell you to stop comparing apples with agbalumo, which club ever spends more than Bayern in the Bundesliga. Una be local champion for there naa

Team Murray all the way jare, he is the arsenal of World Tennis right now, just needs to make it through that final stretch and get rid of the nearly man tag.

debosky:
So what? Is this new information or didn't we sign Chamakh in the same Fashion? Isn't that how we got Sol Campbell?

If that is what he wants to do now, I hereby offer to drive him all the way to city for 20m, they don't even need to give me petrol money. 

@Slim

I get your point about the fickleness of Arsenal fans but there must be some truth in the Nasri/Clichy rumors, its almost certain some kinda irreconcillable differences are creeping up in that scenario or else they should have renewed their contracts by now as Arsene was determined in saying he'll do anything to keep Nasri. I am also against players holding the club to ransom but that is the new world clubs now live in hence why Rooney can turn a living legend like Fergie into an incoherent babbler.  

I really hope the FFP brings this all under control as more of these money miss road people are turning up (there is some Quatari people who have taken PSG over and dem sef dey flex muscle for Ligue 1), just imagine we are offering Clichy 50k and City are offering him 90k almost double. Whatever happens I'll always stand behind my club but I might need to adjust my expectation (something a lot of other fans are loathe to do). The way things are going now is definitely not the stability to winning trophies, Arsene and the club have sweated over this lot for the past 4 years and when they should now repay the club they up and leave (at the same time) and to add some insult to that a club like Barca are so pompous as to start telling us what they want to pay.

@A-40

What is going on at Arsenal at present is beyond Arsene, it is even in a lot of instances beyond even the board in my opinion, at the end of the day reality is what it is, we are where we are cos the club chose to stand for certain things, if we have to suffer awhile for that so be it. The rumor is that City are offering Nasri 180k (and you know they can offer him that if they can afford to give Yaya Toure 250k), where exactly is Arsenal supposed to get that from when our highest earner is on 120k and we flogged Ade off ASAP once he went above 100k? and do you honestly think Ramsey and Wilshere's agent won't come knocking on Arsene's door for increases in their wages if we even go as high as 150k just to please him?

I also wouldn't mourn Clichy, he has been the weakest link in our defence for the past 3 seasons like Ifedisky said and something tells me even the club want him gone. Cesc's situation is a complex one further complicated by Barcelona's behaviour so I wont even go there, the boy has tried enough and leaves with my blessings if he goes, no one can say he hasnt respected the club enough. The only person I'll be really sad (and angry with him) at his leaving is Nasri but 20m could ease that a bit if invested wisely.

Its the combined effect of 2 players (who have been massively influential to the team over the past 2 seasons) leaving at the same time that gets to me, that is definitely not the way to progress particularly if yu're selling arguably your best player in the season to direct competition like City, even psychologically speaking how would people like Wishere feel taking to the pitch next season against city and lining up against Nasri who they all know was the best player this season? wouldn't the game be lost even before the ref blows? 

As things stand Arsene will have to find even more strength because he is the only one giving the whole structure at Arsenal a semblance of progression. In the same time that we are now about losing what you cld call the 2nd generation of players since we last won a trophy, Scholes is just retiring and Giggs will still play one more year, where the hell is the stability to build a platform to win trophies? 

Damn, staying at home glued to Sky Sports news is quite depressing, City to sign both Clichy and Nasri (for 20m) with Barcelona to buy Cesc. How exactly is the club expected to progress if we sell those 3 players?
Message to the board and Arsene, this is not the player turnover I was looking forward to abeg. How can you sell your 2 best players in the past 2 seasons both under 25 years of age and then expect to progress? Is this season going to be another 08/09 season? 1 step forward and then 10 steps backwards. Kilode gaan?

dayokanu:
Its a simple natural law.

More sponsors would move towards success than failures. The reason why your trophyless club is perpetually broke

If you are as succesful as barcelona, everyone would want to be associated with you.

Most lopsided league yet more clubs have won the La Liga in the last 20yrs than the EPL

More La Liga clubs have enjoyed European success in the last 20yrs than the EPL

Is lopsided what makes Atletico, Sevilla etc dominate the UEFA cup while your own midtable Tottenham, Aston Villa cant.

In what way exactly have the spanish clubs dominated the UEFA cup? yes they've won it more than English clubs but have not been dominant in the way Barcelona and RM have been dominant in the UCL. clubs from Russia, Ukraine, Portugal and Turkey have all won it in the past 10 years. Infact Russia have won it twice within the last 10 years whereas England havent but does that make them better than the PL? probably only in DK's world.
One factor which you've been clearly unable to spot in recent times is that the top 4 in England do not drop out of the UCL after the group stages while clubs like Sevilla and Athletico Madrid have dropped out and then gone on to win the UEFA cup.
As usual, yu're comparing apples with agbalumo.

There goes DK again without giving more thought to the wider issues. If they were in the PL would they have exclusive TV rights as they do now? would RM have had the royal patronage that allowed them to cheat all the other spanish clubs all those years ago? 

I once was told a story that at a certain time in Spain, they had a law that whoever was the highest goal scorer in the league had to play for real madrid the next season, how the hell was that supposed to encourage competition?

The La Liga is the most lopsided league that exists on this planet, it is structured at present in such a way as to keep the top 2 at the topmost level in Europe rather than give all the other clubs a level playing field and will remain so until the TV rights arrangement changes.

ritchboy:
^^ I'm just wondering if Coquelin or Frimpong would be the ones providing cover for Song this season cos i don't see Wenger signing Parker.

neither do I, some of our more expressive players will just have to find a defensive aspect to their game like Wilshere as we are already stacked in the MF, someone like Lansbury as well is available (can't be worse than the Denilson we saw last season and at least has considerable enthusiasm to hustle). If we get Ricky Alvarez (who looks explosive I must say) then we have good cover for Diaby on the physical side.