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FEGEITOK's Posts

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Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 12:15am On Apr 23, 2023
Dam5reey:
Your expectations is too High,

Your panels are doing fine for the grade, you can't get 100% of solar rating expect around 60% to 75% at peak.

What's kind of batteries are you using, you might also me limiting the power with your connected loads.

What's the daily power generation in KWH, does your inverter logs the daily harvest?
Instaneous production has hit 970 watts.

I have just 2 470 Jinko Panels.

Between 7 and 8 degrees tilt.

Most of the time though I see between 400 and 700 watts production.

Mine don't stay on the roof there is a lot of room for air to flow around them.
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 12:06am On Apr 23, 2023
Born2conquer:
Reached out, she said she can't travel out of lagos unless it's a huge contract grin grin
She does good work that is why I mentioned her.

Thanks for the feedback.
Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 12:34pm On Apr 22, 2023
Between Morningstar TS-MPPT-60-600V-48 TriStar MPPT 600V Charge Controller and Conext MPPT 100 600 Solar Charge Controller
which one would you for?

I am curating my shopping list for my mid-year PV system upgrade.

Thanks.
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 11:52am On Apr 22, 2023
topsy23:
Might be somehow difficult to see electrician that can handle such issue because he might not have the type of equipment needed to deploy to carry out the proper testing and also give proper analysis of what the issue is.

I can send two of my engineer down to your to carry out the audit for you.

The equipment they will come with are
KEWTECH
This equipment can do:
-Cable insulation
-Loop impedance test
-Phase sequence
Inspection of outgoing breakers from the DB and check the cable size

FLUKE
This equipment can do
-Voltage reading
-Current per phase and circuit

EARTH METER
-For earth testing
An engineer (craftsman) is only as good as his tools.

You rock Sir.

I have taken note of your details for future business.
Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 2:10am On Apr 21, 2023
jonescosmo:
Thanks a whole lot Bros.
Just for people who might want to setup something similar, the space is 8ft x 8ft sha. I have ordered a 16Inch Extraction Fan from the USA, The fan is Temperature and Humidity Controlled, also has a mobile App for remote control and mmonitoring.

The "Tubular Gang" are meant to be decommisioned and sold off after fully testing the Lithium batteries and their capabilities. Those Tubular Batteries is going to be replaced by a 3rd 9.5KW Lithium Battery and the 2x 5KW inverters will be put in Parallel Mode (Teste this method already though) Or I would simply grab another inverter with 2 MMPT input Strings for my 10x 540W Panels and 8x 350W Panels, Felicity now has a New Model that has 2 MPPT Inputs , this:
https://www.felicitysolar.com/600v-10000-watt-3-phase-solar-hybrid-inverter-dc-to-ac-in-parallel_p129.html
and this:
https://www.felicitysolar.com/best-48v-5kw-hybrid-grid-tie-pure-sine-wave-inverter-for-home_p128.html

Hehehehe, That my Generator is a 3Phase 6.5Kva Birtoli Gen and was retired since almost 4 years now by my 4 Years old former Inverter (3Kva iPowerPlus) Which I have now installed for my mom in Lagos (Picture Attached Below). So the small Gen is just there rusting out.

This new setup is aimed at retiring my 20kva Mikano Generator for good. And ofcourse Nepa People are not happy with me ooo. They came last week to inspect my meter and I showed them the panels on the roof. Hehehehe. I told them the I had to sum up the monthly 100k I used to recharge for 3yrs and yet the electricity will still not be available when you need it most times. so i decided to demote Nepa Supply on my Priority list and go for solar energy.
The two Genertaors might be auctioned out after a year of fully testing this my potential off grid Installation.
Please share your extractor fan model?

I have found myself having to import this as well don't have what I want locally.

Thanks please.

Also share why you went for that particular brand and model.

Thanks again
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 6:32pm On Apr 20, 2023
Born2conquer:
who is that sir
Nairalander

Please go to nairaland.com/naijacreativeha to make contact
Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 3:54pm On Apr 20, 2023
FEGEITOK:
Based on the attached at 12.2V it seems you are at 60% DOD.

You would be at 50% DOD if the battery level got to 12.06V.

Hope this helps.

I would have preferred a 1.5kva 24v system to a 1.5kva 12v system.

So please consider upgrading in the near future and please listen to my able brother samir.101ng's suggestions above.
It seems that the maths is a little bit different with AGM batteries.

Car TalkRe: Karcher K2.360 High Pressure Washer Review - Wash Your Car at Home by FEGEITOK(op): 3:20pm On Apr 20, 2023
jorghor:
K7 is the top of the range for the home and garden pressure washers, it washes just about everything in the home.
It has 2 models, the Compact and Full control. The full control can be easily connected to the smartphone via Bluetooth. This means that the user is supported through the Kärcher Home & Garden app with practical tips, tricks and settings for many cleaning situations and cleaning objects. The app provides useful functions such as the application consultant for even better cleaning results, assembly instructions, maintenance and care instructions, as well as the Kärcher Service portal.

You can control the pressure to get the desired results and not ruin amongst other things, the paint of your car.

If interested, I can be reached for more information and purchase (08033900359). Karcher showroom is in V/Island
Thanks for this.

Do you happen to have any vacuum cleaners suitable for use in cleaning vehicle interiors?
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 2:56pm On Apr 20, 2023
Born2conquer:
We've gotten to the finishing stage of our project, please, I need the service of a very good Tiler In Abeokuta.

I've worked with several tilers here before but it seems they're always more in a hurry to conclude the work instead of focusing on the neatness and alignment of the tiles.

Please, if you have a very good and creative tiler, kindly recommend asap (could be in my.mail) for immediate contract
naijacreativeha?
Car TalkRe: Our Petrol Really Has Serious Impurities by FEGEITOK: 2:06pm On Apr 18, 2023
9icetoo:
grin grin at the bolded.
I do long distance regularly. Just came back from a[b] 450 mile round trip though not driven spiritedly[/b]. Now i am all about MPG not SPG.
Well, if i ever come to abuja, i will surely use that boroscope of yours to see whats going on in this engine of mine.
No performance issues at the moment but i can bet nigerian fuel has done a number on the pistons. How much is the liqui moly by the way?
Same day?

Several days?

Would you rather save MPG or arrive before nightfall?

There is something dangerous about allowing nightfall to catch you on Nigerian interstate routes unless you have a mind and heart of steel.

I love long distance drives but that we don't have the peace of mind one has driving interstate routes in a place like the USA is a big problem
Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 4:57pm On Apr 17, 2023
Hybrid600:
🤣🤣🤣.
You're a smart man.
That was very fast thinking. Many that are not savvy with connections wont attempt this out of fear and while the savvy ones may not think to this direction of waking the battery up.
Good thing the battery showed itself while you was still home.

Has the battery misbehaved since after you panelled its life? 😁
No it hasn't. I think the battery got issues from being stuck in traffic for 2 hours with full AC and headlamps. I maybe wrong
Car TalkRe: Our Petrol Really Has Serious Impurities by FEGEITOK: 1:46pm On Apr 17, 2023
Piyke:
Lol. Even in Abuja it's not as easy. I was doing those spirited stuff Saturday mornings. I leave at 6am. By 730 - 8am my preferred stretch would become clogged. At that point I shift to a different lonelier road to finish.
Come to Abuja and pull the head, then I can send you the pistons. Lol

On 5 treatments, I guess it's to do with the level of build up in the first place. Also I think if I were doing like a 500km trip, it wouldn't have taken 5 tanks.
On the bolded. I found a kindred spirit.
Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 12:48pm On Apr 17, 2023
bigrovar:
Around Q4 last year. I upgraded my solar panels from 9x 335 Yingli panels to 9x 600w Canadian Hiku7 solar panels. Bought panel from techland.

Here is a short performance review.

Installation. The panels are roof mounted with a 21 degree tilt. They face South East at 123 degree Azimuth.

The panels are paired with a 100A / 150v Victron smart solar charge controller. Total capacity is 5.4kw.
9 panels are connected in a 3SP3 arrangements. There is a 10mm2 shielded and UL listed cable between PV and charge controller. Cable length is about 10 meters.

Overall the system performance has been really good. I get an average of 4.5kw output which represents over 80% of panel PMAX.

One thing the panel is really good at is how it handles heat. It has a heat co efficiency of 0.34% and this shows in the performance. Yesterday ambient temperature (as pulled from my personal weather station) was as high as 43C, yet the panel was able to produce (consistently) north of 4400w.

During cloud edge events the panel has produced close to 110% of output which is 5.8kw of 5.4kw PMAX.

I attached 2 centrifugal fans to the Victron solar charge controller to help handle heat since I am using the controller close to it's limits.
Beautiful.

When I grow up I want to be like you.

Take home lessons.

You didn't wait until you could buy top of the line of equipment before setting up.

You started with what you have and upgraded along the way.

I plan upgrades to my setup by June 2023 and stories like this are very helpful.

I use Jinko panels by the way and I agree that if you have top of the line panels you can exceed nameplate in certain conditions
Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 12:45pm On Apr 17, 2023
The other day my car died on me. It read 12.2 V on the multimeter.

Initially wanted to borrow or pay for another battery to jump start the car. Was too early for that.

So I switched off my solar panels, disconected the inverter batteries from the charge controller.

Connected the car battery to the charge controller. Switched the connection of the solar panels to the charge controller back on.

After about 10 to 15 minutes disconnected the setup took the battery to the car and it started right up.

Of course I had to reconnect the inverter battery back after I had returned.

Just sharing a story from the trenches.
Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 9:38pm On Apr 15, 2023
Kabawhat:
Good evening house am trying to buy PowMr 60 Ah MPPT solar controller from this my OGA =odimbannamdi and making an upfront payment


Abegi who has done business with him in the past ooooh
Go ahead.
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 11:07pm On Apr 14, 2023
EgunMogaji2:
https://www.facebook.com/reel/675238407692695?fs=e&s=TIeQ9V&mibextid=0NULKw
The comments are something else.

Thanks for sharing.

We all need to be safety conscious all the time
Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 9:19pm On Apr 11, 2023
ubreeze:
Thank you so much for this project. It is almost impossible to read through the entire thread and asking questions that have already been asked will meet with being ignored. Your project will be a great help. Please start a thread for it.
I will make time to answer you.

Gotta balance stepping in to help with making a living and taking breaks from the exertion at work.

I sympathize with how you feel.
Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 1:47pm On Apr 11, 2023
dollarnaira:
True to 1000w limitations
But the truth is our energy need differs. For example I run freezer( major 4 to 6hrs daily) , tv, bulbs, fans, charging,etc all not up to 500w. All appliances still not running at the same time.Remember too that 24v is not cheap. Battery price is not dropping anytime soon. Those who run applications beyond 1000w are welcome. Lastly, 12v is very easy to maintain.
Valid points

See the last paragraph of my picture again.
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 8:25pm On Apr 10, 2023
rotecch77:
Thanks for your comment

About painting of curb or Kerbs I can see that there is no strict standardization of colours used on pavements for road safety globally But brighter colour like, white,yellow red, can be used for safety on road.
This lead me to think outside the box 5 year ago in one of our project ( pics attached) by using matching brighter colour for the said project and the client love it,
Ever since then I don’t use black and white regular colour again.
Police kerbs use three colors: blue, yellow and green and they look good

Army kerbs use two colors: red and black

I found those a refreshing change from the standard black and white

I like this.

I hope others are noticing and will copy.

It need not be white and black all the time
Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 7:56pm On Apr 10, 2023
EduTechTainMent:
If I may ask, why would you prefer a 24v to a 12v system? 24v means he would need to connect his battery (at least 2) in series. He is using 1 battery for now. So his 12v inverter is in order. He could look at the possibility of upgrading in the future though.
Agreed.

But he is condemned to less than 1,000 watts draw.

With 24 volts, he can exceed the 1000 watt draw.

Let me refer to a quote online that has put it more elegantly than I am ready to find the words at the moment.

Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 4:50pm On Apr 10, 2023
osayuwamwen:
Installer, sofar it serve me all through the night from 4pm till presently, use TV for some hours with all my surrounding lights ON and a DC fan ON all tru the night, just 1bar out from a full battery bar it's already charging this morning and my refrigerator, TV and DC fan is on the battery voltage is at 12.2v but I was advised not to use the battery below 50%, how do I know when the battery bar is at 50% as the battery is not reading in percentage
Based on the attached at 12.2V it seems you are at 60% DOD.

You would be at 50% DOD if the battery level got to 12.06V.

Hope this helps.

I would have preferred a 1.5kva 24v system to a 1.5kva 12v system.

So please consider upgrading in the near future and please listen to my able brother samir.101ng's suggestions above.

PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 5:12am On Apr 09, 2023
dapotemi:
You and Erico submission fully captured my thought..This issue has been discussed here more than twice .. I have worked as an asst Facility mgr with a monthly budget of #60M and no one would approved a Kobo for anyone, whether you're Julius berger or baba lati to come and check a job and get paid transport...it's a form of 419 if you present such.

99% of guys here does B2C. But, from my pocket, I do give tips to workmen when I call them for an emergency work or sometime to quickly check and submit a quote and that is because getting those things done affect my KPI..The truth is, it's an individual thing. Not a rule of thumb..

But the biz guys here should calm down, you are the one that wants to get a job and earned , you are the one that needs to be humble

...those of us bringing the job here will also be humble when we get to where we make that money we bring here..Abi nau, I go humble for my oga for 30 days collect salary, I go come humble for you too because I want to pay you to to supply wood or paint, no nau, you sef reason am. I can give someone else... imagine if everyone gives someone else and not you, na you go humble last .. Well, I thinks it's a faceless forum tho, most of you don't act like this in REAL LIFE, atleast the ones have met
rmx:
Well said , like the being humble part

Not a one size fits all situation . The truth is that in the b2c space some businesses are well established with good reputation and patronage hence can introduce conditions such as asking for transport etc , others are more desperate for customers . As long as both parties agree , don’t see the big deal , no be by force to deal nah . Not all business/transaction is for you

All this discussion does not happen in the b2b space , can’t even begin to articulate costs i have incurred in this space without closing

There is an element of risk in all business
As for the bolded

When my company lost a long running contract....

A contract that I was so sure of (revenue which I banked on)

A contract that gave my company the majority of its revenue

The work that I had to do to fill that void

The time it took to go back to that level of revenue and exceed it that I realized that any money that comes my way is a favor and not as of right.

It does not matter how skilled your are, there are others similarly skilled if not even more skilled.

That anyone who plays a role in making me earn money should receive VIP treatment.

Also, once you have a name and reputation, you can set rules that no new entrant can set

When you are starting out, your clients will set rules for you
Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 9:43am On Apr 07, 2023
sharks776:
Hello good people and Solar Pros in the house. Please I need advice on this issue. I have 6pcs of 430w panel and trying to expand with 6pcs 450w panels.

Q1: can I mix the two
Q2: can my fangpusun 60a handle it?

Note: the 430w panel has high Voc and low Isc, while the 450w has low Voc and higher Isc
How can I help you? I saw your attempt to connect with me ?
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 9:03am On Apr 07, 2023
gabbytabby:
It’s not a crime you fit take your mouth ask for anything when requested to provide a quote
1) Transportation
2) Stipend
3) Full day pay
4) Your children school fees
5) Your wife hair weave join.

We meet those who have no logical sense of reason and call people evil for not meeting their thief demands. The mature minds will not take request that they are unable to meet and keep it moving.


no
See the tweet below. Tweet above provided for context.

Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 9:14am On Apr 06, 2023
chris81964:
Thanks with Schneider it is hit or miss. It does not seem to matter where we buy them.
Go to their website, use their distributor locator tool or their live chat.

Buy only from the distributor and you should be good.

Mine works. My RCB even tripped when there was a fault at the local transformer and I was very pleased with that.
Satellite TV TechnologyRe: Solar Energy, A Complement To FTA by FEGEITOK: 9:12am On Apr 06, 2023
GloriousGbola:
as an aside, i am seeing multiple elements of poor support design here

1) there was no fire alarm system
2) the is too much flammable material used in the room . wood should not be part of a battery room. better for all these items to be on steel frames
the room should also have a see through door, maybe even be see through windows [all fire resistant] fire resistant wall paneling, and a fire resistant ceiling [that is called fire compartmentalization]

i would say there should be an fm200 fire suppression system put in place, but i have read that lithium -[not lipo4] batteries are extremely hard to put out when they catch fire

has a proper post mortem been conducted to confirm exactly what went wrong? from the picture it looks like the cable started burning. if so it means the dc breakers on the cable [assuming they were provided] simply started passing the current .

also what make is the actual cable?

we had a case yead back where for a month running we kept getting our fm 200 system in a server room triggered. after taking the whole place apart we found one ediat ac installer had joined the cables for an ac rather than do a straight run. so the joint kept heating up and burning the insulation.

we had an issue of this nature on a recent project. the installer ran cables to mppt direct from the panels. we advised that they get breakers. getting original breakers was another long story. but it was eventually sorted.

you also need to confirm if the manuacturer has a recommended spacing for safety.

YOU DID NOT GET LUCKY.THIS IS A WARNING

in investigations following major incidents, it always turns out there were precursor events. when you do not act on your precursor event, the next event is always larger= until you have death or significant asset loss.

i hope someone on your team is paranoid, and that the ogas at the top are willing to make the necessary financial commitments.
That was intense.

Thanks for sharing.

I hope others with large installations are following.
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 8:10pm On Apr 05, 2023
twinskenny:
For the lovers of wall lights

Lekki projects

# lighting

08035153923
Well done
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 7:36pm On Apr 05, 2023
FEGEITOK:
I even gave the last but one transport to come and work for me. I gave him several modus of rice (enough to feed his family twice a day for at least a week) when he was going in addition to paying him for his services. I also gave him one of my dress shirts I no longer felt like using. He had complained that he had no food to eat (and I happen to know that he is married) and did not have transportation. But to my chagrin this guy stole money from me. I kept some cash in a drawer and he touched that drawer and the money was gone. Can you imagine how I felt to have discovered that someone I did the above for did that to me? I know because I confronted him and he confessed after he had returned home. One more thing, this guy I allowed him to sleep over a couple of times in order to save some of the money he would have spent on transport back home and back to the site the next day.
By the way, the guy I said took money from me above is now asking for my account number to pay in the money that he doesn't wish to touch the money.

I just saw the SMS now.

I am sure he knows what he was going to miss and wants to forestall it.
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 7:33pm On Apr 05, 2023
erico2k2:
Im seriously struggling to understand your post
I am summarizing my post, the post that you quoted.

I am telling you that the bolded which was copied from the original post you quoted says the very same thing you are saying.
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 6:10pm On Apr 05, 2023
GloriousGbola:
Some people will be complaining when favor is knocking on their door because if the noise.
I was taught never to beg a rich person for money, but to instead show them how useful I could be to them.

You will get the money you wanted form such a person and much more.
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 5:57pm On Apr 05, 2023
erico2k2:
Bross I think you are missing the point here, Help is deferent but when one demands it's a claim of self entitlement. ofcos you can cook from home and give to your workers on site, I done that on my build, but note they never demanded for it.
This line above makes the point you are making.

Fourthly, no one owes you anything.


I included the rest of the story to show that one can refuse to agree to a claim of entitlement and yet kind enough to assist someone in the position of some who carry on with a sense of entitlement.

In short by being entitled, they may be missing out on more.

I am also making the point that someone can be favored who did not show signs of being entitled, but they can go ahead and scuttle the opportunity given to them and the opportunities that might have been given to others but for their mistakes.
PropertiesRe: General Topic Thread-To Discuss Anything And Everything in Building Construction by FEGEITOK: 8:54am On Apr 05, 2023
dangoteinlaw:
That is what they call wisdom in their book, wasting people’s time in the name of “getting a quote”. That’s how one fool made me mobilize a POP guy to his site at the end he didn’t get the job. What pained me was the pop guy left his tape rule at home and i had mine but i urge the pop guy to be a professional by getting his own tape and he spent 3k at that spot to buy a tape all because he relied on my word that the guy in question will surely award him the job. Honestly I wasn’t worried about myself becoz I knew the pop guy has been home for months because job traffic was slow. Inside my car his wife was even calling and praying for him that he will get the job and it all turned out he was just a pawn to one fool who thought he needed to “get a quote”. That is why illiteracy scares the shit out of me because for this life if you happen to be at the bottom of the food chain u go too suffer oh, your life will be used as a game of chess and you might be sacrificed as a pawn to save a knight.
First, business is not a charity.

Secondly, running business on sympathy is not the best way to go about business.

Thirdly, no one will win 100 percent of all the jobs he bids for. This is why we spread out tents very wide so that they will have a greater tendency to catch something.

Fourthly, no one owes you anything.

Now about your sob story.

I have been there. I understand the feeling. I treat my artisans well.

I even gave the last but one transport to come and work for me. I gave him several modus of rice (enough to feed his family twice a day for at least a week) when he was going in addition to paying him for his services. I also gave him one of my dress shirts I no longer felt like using. He had complained that he had no food to eat (and I happen to know that he is married) and did not have transportation. But to my chagrin this guy stole money from me. I kept some cash in a drawer and he touched that drawer and the money was gone. Can you imagine how I felt to have discovered that someone I did the above for did that to me? I know because I confronted him and he confessed after he had returned home. One more thing, this guy I allowed him to sleep over a couple of times in order to save some of the money he would have spent on transport back home and back to the site the next day.

My motto in life is that one must treat those he can gain nothing from as well as those he can gain something from. That to me is the true test of character.

The last one that came gave a quote I considered was too high. So I gave him 3 times the amount he spent on transportation to come and dismissed him.

I lent my plumber money when he was served court papers to pack out of his existing accommodation. He came back just last week to ask for more money to the tune of half a million to roof the house he is building, that one I am not willing to give though.

Some of us treat artisans this way because of the bad experiences we have had. But everyone is different and should be judged for who he or she is and not based on what others have done.

But you cannot blame us for refusing to act on sympathy all the time, it’s a dog-eat-dog world out there. And people are out to take advantage especially if they feel you are better situated than them.

They think, let me chop from him small, he get plenty. He no go feel am.
Opportunity will never be distributed equally, some people will do better in life than others.

Even Jesus said we will always have the poor with you at Matthew 26:11.

So if I can help someone, I will help someone. Like I have said above, several individuals liked me at some point in time and stepped in to help me make the money I have made, and the position I have attained, so if I can, I will be helpful because I know that everyone is fighting one challenge or the other.

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