₦airaland Forum

What Positive Effect Has Your Religion/Belief Had In Your Life?

https://www.nairaland.com/2247616/what-positive-effect-religion-belief

OP how do you feel about dying and staying dead?

Since people have been able to overlook all of God's fxck ups so far, they will easily disregard not being told about something like that by God. Religion will march on. Faith is not so much about what's on the outside.

I heard you the first time. The issue is that your pain and suffering in the wilderness might be arbitrary, serving no real purpose.

Which wilderness did Gabriel, Lucifer or Adam pass through?

After what happened to Mary, wise people would be wary of harbouring the holy spirit in their temples.

The bible does need the publicity stunt.

Maybe the curse will be more effective at causing sorrow than his prophecies.

jnrbayano:
Can you now find out the infinite mind of God in Jesus's words?

With God's infinite mind, even if you lived forever, you could not know the smallest fraction of it. You can only be certain that you can never know all of it.

Jesus himself does not know the date of judgment, among other things, and some might say Jesus is practically God.

You can only be certain of what God will do if God cannot do anything that you won't condone, in which case God is you.

The sad part is that when the prophecy becomes unrealized the OP will still count that as a win for God.

Jesus. You can lie o.

Please go to bed.

Hiswordxray:
Christ is the reality.
Christ is the reality of race.
Christ is the realty of gender.
Christ is the reality of religion.
Christ is the reality of sex.
Christ is the reality of marriage.
Christ is the reality of money.
Christ is the reality of knowledge and science.
You have been chasing shadows, for Christ is the reality.

Christ Is All

Arise, O compatriots,
Nigeria's call obey
To serve our Fatherland
With love and strength and faith.
The labour of our heroes past
Shall never be in vain,
To serve with heart and might
One nation bound in freedom, peace and unity.

I pledge to Nigeria my country
To be faithful, loyal and honest
To serve Nigeria with all my strength
To defend her unity, and uphold her honour and glory
So, help me God.

Redoil:
Life is harsh and difficult and people tend to mostly do things base on what they believe is right as long as they are not stepping on any body toe and the law.
I will suggest you do some serious soul searching about God again maybe you will find him maybe not. For if you seek him you will surely find him. If you find him i will say wellcome home brother but if not then it is well
Note i am not forcing you to do it it is just a matter of choice for freedom to chose whether there is God or not is ur rght.
I will encourage you to think for ur self and allow others the priveldge to do so too.

The issue is how one can be certain that he has found God. I agree that people should be allowed to think for themselves and, further, to share their thoughts. Anyone is free to go ahead and believe in God but you're encouraged to examine that belief from time to time.

Redoil:
since you will still hold on to ur hard believe then i see no need for God to reveal himself to you.

Hopefully God sees the matter differently.

Redoil:
if God should come down a say chop knockle you will still doubt him.

That's what makes me agnostic. How can you be sure that he is in fact "God"?

davien:
Finofya nothing can be said to be proof of "god/gods" because we don't know or have anything to show to be a product or result of "god/gods"...(even religious books admit to be "inspired works" of which the inspiration is claimed to be "god/gods"


And all theists present are either presuppositions(pre-concluded statements)....like "the bible claims it's true, therefore I presuppose it to be true"


arguments from ignorance....like "If you don't know how the earth formed, then that means "god/gods" did it"


special pleading....like "everything that begins to exist has a cause, except "god/gods"... "

or one or more other fallacies....

True, what theists offer as proof is quite far from it. I asked myself what I'd offer as proof (to myself and others) if I decided to embrace theism today. If God existed and it could be proven, the proof could be right in your face. What would it look like?

Granted, the question only works on the assumption that there could be a provable God.

And that's why I usually say when you can't know something or show it to be true/factual nor show it to be wrong,then it's of 0 value to you because you can't make anything out of it....

It's inseparable from imaginary friends and make-believe tales.

Exactly. People bristle at the mention of the FSM or IPU because they recognise the truth of this. They just don't agree that it might apply to their deity.

benodic:
first enlighten me on the methods being currently used now

I believe we can only either experience a thing or discover it by reason. It's in the OP. I tried to explain why I don't believe that you can get certainty through either means. I can understand substituting a spiritual body for a physical one, but I don't understand what you intend to substitute experience and reason with.

benodic:
the reason why God does not bother about proving itself to any human being is that it is just a matter of time when the individual sheds the physical body in the process of death, the person will clearly see all the prove that he/she needs.

it is just a matter of time

I think obtaining proof of God is more than an issue of shedding a physical body. It borders on the more fundamental issue of how we understand things. Can you think of a way by which we can (attempt to) know things other than the method we currently use?

It occurred to me that God, if it exists, could walk up to me and deliver a resounding slap to my rosy cheeks and I'd still be in the dark about its existence.

What form should proof of a God take? What does God have to do to convince everyone that it exists?

If God exists and can be proven, the proof (however inconclusive) may be around us. God here includes one who is uncreated/uncaused or one who has a cause but is powerful enough to have created this universe or one who has a cause within this universe but is powerful enough to create life forms like we have.

We are convinced of things either by experience, testimony or logic. God would therefore have to make us experience it or find it by logic, to convince us of its existence.

Logic is unreliable for absolute conviction. For example, I could make the logically sound argument that:

A cell is invisible to the naked eye.
The human body is a collection of cells.
Therefore, the human body is invisible to the naked eye.

This is obviously not a valid argument. We know this because we can see the human body with an unaided eye. However, for someone who has never seen a human body the argument is correct. To know that the argument is invalid, one has to see a human body with the naked eye. Logically valid arguments, then, have to be confirmed by experience.

Unfortunately for experience, one can only make sense of it by logic. Imagine that you were at a party at which you drank only water and from which you left feeling intoxicated. You might reason that your drink was spiked while you left it unattended, but until you see the results of a blood test you don't know if the cause was that you inhaled fumes from a psychoactive plant burnt in the vicinity or that your brain was oxygen starved due to some physiological cause or even that you had been envenomated.

The only thing an experience can prove is that you had the experience. If you experience intoxication, logic alone cannot confirm what caused the experience.

We are compelled to work with assumptions and probabilities in order to get on with the business of living. I find this a telling fact against God, since I assume/find it probable that God (at the very least a personal one) would not have made it so that we could not know conclusively that it exists. As it is, we don't even have to assume that God exists in order to get on with life.

Perversely, if we know as a fact that we cannot know anything conclusively except this fact, then the only way that God can show itself to us is as this fact. God, if it exists, would be the fact that we cannot know anything. Haha.

I might be horribly wrong, of course. What would you consider as proof of God?

You noticed that demon in Man City too?

Dream on

I feel relaxed afterwards. If anything, I have reduced awareness. I think what you are mistaking for awareness is that slight revulsion you sometimes feel afterwards. If it were awareness, you'd have a difficult job explaining how you can keep becoming aware of the same thing over and over, sometimes two or more times a day, on top of the fact that you are constantly aware that you keep becoming aware of it.

Perhaps God is not a friendly being. Perhaps it had become psychopathic and schizophrenic to an infinite degree.

Alternatively, everything is for the best and you cannot understand God so don't ask such questions. It is noteworthy that you cannot understand a mad person either.

FOLYKAZE:
I, Killer troll, people who value their time are running away from.

Agentoflallah https://www.nairaland.com/2190740/atheists-religion/7#31780680


Wiegraf

https://www.nairaland.com/2190740/atheists-religion/8#31806638


Finofaya https://www.nairaland.com/2190740/atheists-religion/8#31820608



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I will troll you guys with Jesus/Mohammad next time.

Trollykaze!

Don't celebrate yet if you're still alive on April 1. You know Yahweh and his sense of humour.

FOLYKAZE:
You getting me wrong bro.

You agree with me that god has different meaning but like other atheists, you want to hold unto a meaning while others are dismissed.

If "god" has many meanings, most of which are unrelated to atheism, we can only engage in meaningful discussion by dismissing the unrelated meanings.

I understand that atheists like I am do not believe in any supernatural being living in the sky. But we do understand that man is also a deity. Different culture in the world acknowledge this. Many religion concept acknowledge this. And note, this men are not just considered as god but they are worshipped as god. So will an atheist disbelieve in this god (define as influencial person)? This is the question ya all fail to answer.

I'm not here to quarrel with the dictionary. Do I believe that an influential person may be called a "god"? Yes.

Ya. Agentofallah defined god as a supernatural being. I asked, does he believe in deva, there is a no supernatural attributes to this buddhism deity. Yet, it is mythical. I ask you too, if god is supernatural being, do you believe in deva?

The wiki definition of deva includes supernatural attributes. Which definition are you using?

You have actually not define what god is.

What is god?

A "god" whose existence I would dispute may either be supernatural or natural, must have a mind/capacity to act with purpose, and must be responsible for all of existence or directly/indirectly this universe or human existence. These are the basic attributes. Anything else is not a "god" for the purposes of my atheism.

Spiritual Atheism is the absence of belief in the existence of "God", defined as an entity external to the universe that created and rules the universe; but the presence of belief in the existence of "God", defined as the personification of the universe itself and everything therein.

So you're happy to adopt one definition of "god" when it comes to your own version of atheism. Lol. Please extend the courtesy to the rest of us.

There is a shrine dedicated for Fela, he is been idolized. Rituals are perform in this shrine. Prayers are been said. And from him comes an ideology and philosophy. Will an atheist disbelieve in existence of fela (a deity)? This is the question you guys should provide answer to.

You cannot pray to Fela, a dead man, under the honest belief that he can hear and answer your prayer, and claim that Fela is merely an influential person called "god".

Plaetton is an atheist that believe energy is the eternal conscious creator. He believes in veneration of sun and the planets (I dont know if he practice this). He leans to spiritualism like Sam Harris but throwns out the idea of religion dogmatism. Meanwhile Sam and Plaetton are atheists.

If you're not sure about who can be described as an atheist because you see people who you say believe in a "god" (conscious creator type, not Fela) describe themselves as atheists, you should take the issue up with them. At least you have an idea what kind of "god" atheism is about, otherwise you would not have been able to make this distinction.

atheism actively rejects belief in all possible definitions of the term "God"; while spiritual atheism actively rejects belief in only one very specific definition of the term "God" which is super-personal being.

So the burden is on you guys to tell us which god or concept of god you disbelieve in.

Do you disbelieve in definition of god as influencial person?

Do you disbelieve god in pantheist concept?

Do you disbelieve god in spinoza concept?

These are the question begging for answer.

@bolded, you've defined atheism then. Can we safely provide a different definition while remaining atheists?

Dude, as far as this topic is concerned, I've concluded that you're trolling. I dey go watch europa league.

Weah96:
He's a confirmed troll, or did you think I was joking? HAHAHA. Either that or he's a re)tard. I've been through this silly semantics business with him a while ago, only for him to resurface here and behave like a pinhead. I don tire for this person.

I knew you weren't joking. He's been at this English lesson for months now. It's just so difficult to ignore his mind numbingly dense argument.

DProDG:
I'll bet my left eye that he's just gonna repeat exactly the same sh#t, just like he's been doing in his previous posts.

Looks like you won your bet. Lol.

FOLYKAZE:
IPU is your own mental creation.


God does exist.

When I say God, I mean an influecial persons. Fela is one. . . .he is my god. He does exist.

You're so dogged.

It's a rather trivial point you're insisting on. "God" has several meanings, you know this. In a sentence, you usually only refer to one of its meanings or the other when you use the word. You rarely refer to all the meanings at once in a sentence.

If you ask for clarification and a person tells you which meaning of a word they are referring to, any further misunderstanding about the meaning of the word is your own problem.

For example, if I say "there are spirits in the kitchen" and after query from you I indicate that I'm referring to liquor, it is not my problem that you go on to claim that I'm also referring to a demon. Go and compute what is being said on your own.

Another example. Fela (PBUH), an influential person who used to exist, is a god to you. I agree. Note how I'm not going on to ask you if Fela is the gallery in your theatre, or insisting that he must also be the gallery in a theatre to you.

Why do you call yourself a spiritual atheist when you think that it's nonsensical to deny the existence of "god"?

This OP is confused sha. Are you a Jew or a Christian? The Jewish eschatology is radically different from the Christian one. For one, the Jews are still awaiting their messiah whereas the Christian one has come and has been dispatched. Jewish eschatology is contained in the part of the Bible known as the old testament, unlike the Christian one found in the less ancient testament. Are you now so impatient that you'd just make do with the nearest possible judgment day?