₦airaland Forum

Purist: If he has tested it on himself, do you think he would be here?

Uyi Iredia: But FOLYKAZE have you tested this thing on both animals and yrself ?

aManFromMars: Like I've always maintained, no man-made institution is ever perfect despite the originators's best motives. There's nothing wrong with appreciating the good aspects though, same way most would welcome Jesus into their house and kick Yahweh out the front door.

Purist: I tire o!

Purist: Oga, go and sit down somewhere.

I don't know why none of the Naija-based atheists on this forum haven't taken you up on your challenge yet. I thought I'd be in Nigeria this December, but plans changed. But next year for sure. I just have to find where to get a proper shakabula and blow your jazz-infested brains off.

Uyi Iredia: Meaning you have suffered from atheists buthurting u over ur belief in jazz and Ifa stuff, my kniwledge and admiration is superficial compared to urs.

aManFromMars: Na wa ok no be u tok Yoruba Christians?

Uyi Iredia: FOLYKAZE don hear wen.

Purist: I was already agnostic when I left Nigeria. Now I'm an atheist.

But you're right, it's much more difficult to denounce religion as a Nigerian living in Nigeria. That is why I have the utmost admiration for Nigerian-based atheists. Here in Europe, you don't exactly need much convincing to see religion for the fraud that it is, especially when you observe the way most people go about their daily business without God playing any role in it whatsoever. In Northern Europe where I'm based, God is virtually a non-issue. Yet, these countries are doing excellently in virtually all areas you can think of.

There seems to be something about the Nigerian society that makes it extremely difficult for even die hard skeptics to break away completely from those shackles. Before I left Nigeria, I had two really good female friends who were almost as agnostic as I was before I left. I recently had a phone chat with one of them after a long time, and I couldn't believe that she was practically preaching to me. She claimed to have experienced "certain things" that changed her mind about God. I guess this is what Nigeria does to people. I have seen skeptical folks here in Europe travel back home for a few weeks, only to return even more religious than they used to be. I recently became acquainted with a US-based Nigerian lady. She was born in Nigeria but has lived practically all her years in the US. She traveled to Nigeria two months ago and has now changed from agnostic to an ecumenical Christian, although she claims to still have issues with many aspects of the bible. I just don't get it.

On the other hand, I have at least 2 Nigerian friends here who have completely abandoned religion since they arrived here. I've heard of a 3rd guy but I haven't met him yet. I started to suspect one of them just about 2 or 3 weeks ago when he called me on phone and the discussion drifted to him telling me about some Christopher Hitchens video he watched on YouTube. He sounded really excited as he narrated how Hitchens basically hitch-slapped his opponent to a pulp. I then asked when he started watching such kinds of videos and if he was now an atheist or what. He gave a typical Nigerian response: "O boy, na so we see am o. But I still dey keep low profile for now because I no want make anybody know, especially for my church." He attends JW where he also met his current girlfriend.

Religiousity and superstitious beliefs in Nigeria are particularly overwhelming, that it's only in Nigeria you will see an atheist that believes in "Jazz".

Beretta92: Esu means devil in yoruba xtianity. Satani is used for satan.I guess Ajayi Crowther wanted different yoruba variants for both names,hence the use of esu.I wonder why he didnt think of defili or something like that.The damage has been done already;xtians believe the ancient deities were/are all demons.Hence,they'll forever justify the wrong translation.

okeyxyz:
I agree, But this phenomenon is no where to be found in my christian doctrine. You are simply barking up the wrong tree here.

Alwaystrue: Sex is meant to be between man and wife. That is how ordained it from the very beginning. Not man and fiancee so premarital sex is WRONG and is Fornication. You join yourself only to your wife or husband. God makes two people one. Sex is marital duty within only husband and wife. People who are comfortable to sleep with those they are not (yet) married to are termed prostitutes. Even those who are bethrothed to marry someone in the bible did not have sex for virginity is priced.

As for the spiritual side, please study the verse below:

Genesis 2:24
Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh

I Corinthians 6:15,16
15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.
16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh


I Cor. 7:2
2 Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband
3 Let the husband render unto the wife due benevolence: and likewise also the wife unto the husband
4 The wife hath not power of her own body, but the husband: and likewise also the husband hath not power of his own body, but the wife


Another spiritual side is to note that even when you look lustfully at a woman who is not your wife, sexual immorality has occured.
This is the simple law of the spirit Jesus gave....going ahead to physically carry it out has further placed that person 'under the law'.

ypeace: Its a pity the damage has already been done. Sincerely, i was shocked when i learnt about the true nature of esu and co. An average religious yoruba man is not likely to accept an explanation and may never follow you to read from ese Ifa to support your claim because these lies has been repeated from generation to generation to the point that it is the truth to many. It is just too sad.

Chaleeee: There is a lot of mis-interpretation in the yoruba bible. This can be attributed to the translator, late bishop Ajayi Crowther. Permit me to state that Crowther was kidnapped nd sold into slavery at a tender age of 14 and it can be assumed that his knowledge of yoruba language is limited. Or how do you explain Crowther interpreting "satan" as "esu"? Why didn't he interprete "manna" as "garri"?
In the academia, a previous work is open to upgrade and there are many intepretations of the english bible. Why hasn't any yoruba scholar offered a new interpretation of the bible in yoruba?

Back to the matter, intsilling fear in their congregation is the stock in trade of many Yoruba pastors. They are the most superstitous folks on earth.

Omexonomy: Op you don come again wentin you chop wey dey make you run ur mouth anyhow.

Heliesha: first of all how old ar you? @ o.p wait u said all through am still about to make sense of it

Uyi Iredia: Seconded.

Uyi Iredia: They might also use Col 2:8 as a cop-out where Paul says to avod philosophies and vain deciet. Forgetting that in Acts 17:16-18 Paul spoke to Stoics and Epicureans who were typically atheists. Allowing a fellow man hinder them from thinking past the Christian box.

PAGAN 9JA:
yeahh but for that guy to know, you have to tie him up to a seat with ropes and place him in an empty room and speak to him.

PAGAN 9JA:
that trash is not worth wasting time on.

PAGAN 9JA:
monster

striktlymi: Christian nominees:

1) Tobechi
2) Reyginus
3) ATMC
4) Divepen
5) Ishilove

Pagan nominees:

1) Macof
2) Paganja
3) Follykaze (I truly don't know where to place him)
4)
5)

Irreligious nominees:

1) Alfa seltzer
2) Logicboy
3) Mr. Troll
4) aManFromMars
5) Uyi Iredia

The blanks can be filled with anyone of the 'sects' choosing.


Please review and let me know your thoughts.

Thanks!

PAGAN 9JA:
as you wish..

PAGAN 9JA:
I consider only tribals as Pagans.

macof: The reason why I try to modernize the Yoruba belief is for non-Yoruba to understand and make sense out of it. It isn't as if am trying to perform some kind of Evangelism or westernize it.

I didn't create the term "aborisha"- high leveled babalawos did so as to make the world understand that the Orisha and Ifa is nt just Yoruba.but about the world. We have catholic, orthodox, pentecostal, Jehovah witness, Anglican Christians. But they all worship Jesus.

In that same sense Santeria, candomble and the rest are refered to as Aborisha. Because we all worship The Orishas.

It is left for the individual to have a good relationship with the Orisha of his choice, however in santeria, the orisha is the one dat makes the choice. But of course it has never been a must to honor any orisha. You choice to out of free will.

Tgirl4real: Sincerely, I am not knowledgeable enough on the subject to provide a counter.

Well, I see where you are coming from. I see Orisa as deities and aborisa will be someone who worships idols. Thatz the badic concept I have no thanks to primary school education and home video.

I still believe Ifa is a religion sha.

Don't they have rituals, a belief system and a kinda structure?

Tgirl4real: lol

Thanks for the post.

Well, I guess nollywood didn't do any justice to it, but they usually distinguish between the evil priests and the good one. The good ones are light bearers.

In a nutshell, there is no form of deity worship in Ifa? Is that what you saying. Cos doing incantations, the names of these deities are chanted.

If there is a form of deity worship, then it is a religion.

macof: all of the above, that is why some people refer to the collective combination of all these beliefs as Aborisha