₦airaland Forum

truthislight: i hope you are not deceiving us with this smiling faces?

I some how imagine that you are not smiling right now!!!

i hope you are not deceiving us with this smiling faces?

I some how imagine that you are not smiling right now!!!

If you ASK me, na who I go ASK naw

truthislight: funny guy.

Are you sure you are still laughing?

My dear brother......am still laughing oooooo, see what I wrote to Frosbel,

Goshen360: Frosbel, Frosbel. The Apostle who Jesus Goshen360 loves ......no be small crusade you don start o..... . Okay so, no more tithe , no more speaking in tongues, no more trinity, no more miracles, no more manifestation of the Holy Spirit, no more gifts of the Spirit etc.....wetin come remain for inside the body of Christ naw Na to dey read and study bible TILL Jesus returns right . I tire for you o

That's why am still laughing my brother.

frosbel: It depends on what speaking in tongues means to you, if it is 'gibberish' which no one can understand then we have a problem, but if it can be interpreted and is a genuine language spoken but foreign to the speaker then we are in order.

If we look at this verse below, it clearly shows that the disciples spoke in different languages which were correctly understood by others in amazement.

"When they heard this sound, a crowd came together in bewilderment, because each one heard them speaking in his own language." - Acts 2:6

It was not all this crazy stuff going on where we hear people saying, mamamama, papapaa, giigigigigigi , gagagagaga , bababababa, nananana and all that nonsense.

Frosbel, Frosbel. The Apostle who Jesus Goshen360 loves ......no be small crusade you don start o..... . Okay so, no more tithe , no more speaking in tongues, no more trinity, no more miracles, no more manifestation of the Holy Spirit, no more gifts of the Spirit etc.....wetin come remain for inside the body of Christ naw Na to dey read and study bible TILL Jesus returns right . I tire for you o

@ Frosbel,

Is tongues also a PAGAN doctrine or teaching......because as you see me, your brother laughing in tongues, you didn't rebuke me o. ....in tongues....

Question: Should Pastors be PAID for performing miracles?

Answer: NO!

Question-for-question: Who does the miracle? God or Man .......

Pastor Kun: It's today come one come all and if possible bring your pastors along with you

Hahahahahaha......no be small thing o. We dey wait for report after the meeting sha. Glory to God.

......in tongues. Abi tongues sef na pagan ni

......a kind of ministry/work I desire to do in the kingdom of our dear God. Glory to God. May the Lord bless them for the work of the kingdom.

.....laughing in tongues......Abi tongues sef na pagan teaching ni

Literalist .....It is so required where the context says.

Good morning brother......Enjoy the weekend in the loving Grace of our dearest Father.

frosbel: You might as well be a catholic since you have very similar doctrines starting with the Trinity and then it goes downhill to an immortal soul, eternal hell etc.

May God open your eyes.

Nothing do you bros....absolutely, you are my man any day, any time. Glory to God!

frosbel: I used NLT , NIV , NASB , NKJV , KJV , I even went to consult codex sinaiticus (http://codexsinaiticus.org/en/manuscript.aspx) one of the hand written ancient Greek versions of the bible and they are all aligned in meaning.

Okay my brother.....we will always disagree to agree and leave room for our imperfection to the interpretation of scriptures. What am saying is, showing you guys that SOME translations (Amplified, GWT and Message) EXPLICITLY says JESUS is the TRUE GOD according to 1 John 5:20. It shouldn't border us if some translation didn't clarify "WHO" the TRUE GOD is according to our text for this thread BUT why should it also border us when SOME translations EXPLICITLY make it clear, calling JESUS the TRUE. Should be now discard those translations that explicitly calls Jesus the TRUE God just because it doesn't go with us? I had to consult ALL of the available translation to be clear and here we have it. It's okay if you don't believe in Trinity, but I believe it's NOT a pagan teaching.

Enjoy your weekend bro. It is well.

BARRISTERS: Goshen 360,

pls drop that pagan belief,if you are attached to it and because of that you want to continue in the mess you will be hard pressed on this page as you will be faced with loads of evidences that will swallow your claims!and it will be a riddicle,we have not started now you have given me a defination that will knock you down already, can we?

.....because you say it is pagan belief? I have said openly.....God is ONE! 1 x 1 x 1 = 1, NOT 1 + 1 + 1 = 1. Glory to God.

frosbel: Good , an acceptable statement.



What !!

Husband , wife and children are ONE as God is ONE but 3, Goshen you go kill me ooooo .


And you keep asking the same questions over and over again , maybe if you had taken the time to respond to my answer to the question on the 'LORD is the SPIRIT ' we will be expatiating on the detail , and not redefining the concept.

Bros....I don tire for you sef ooo . You also seems to avoid the other translations that translated Jesus as TRUE GOD and another says the Lord (Jesus) is the Spirit......If you don't go with the teaching of trinity, that's fine as we both agree that there is ONE GOD. I brought up the 1 John 5:20 in order for you guys to explain especially from the translations that says Jesus is the TRUE GOD but you don't like those translations also but stick to your NIV. I don't have problem with that but let us not dispute other translations that makes some bible verse clearer.

Lo ba tan......

BARRISTERS: @Goshen360
john knew that jesus is not God Almighty, but the son of God.! jesus was addressed using a title God or mighty God in the bible,[size=14pt] but jesus was never-and-ever reffered to as Almighty God![/size] that title 'Almighty differentiates jesus from his father! if you can prove anywhere Almighty was used for jesus pls bring them on! Mighty is not same as Almighty!

My brother, GOD is ONE! ......not three. The same You as father (if you have kids), as husband (if married) and as son (from a parent). Picture this and you will understand. It is the nature of God as DIVINE being, not MAN. It is the same ONE GOD who manifest Himself as Father, Son and Holy Spirit.......scripture says the LORD is THE Spirit. How do we explain Jesus (Lord) being Spirit? if it is NOT same person?

Besisde, Kindly address the TRANSLATIONS that TRANSLATED 1 John 5:20 as Jesus being TRUE GOD. This is what I want you to address......afterall, you and I didn't write the Bible.

truthislight: while your effort is appreciated, it is better to show every one the truth,

the law given to Israel was hinge on the ABrahamic covent of which moses was the mediator and Aron as priest.
The head of the family and the main man of the covanant is what we are talking here,

the bible is very clear about this.

The mediator and high priest of the new covanant is Jesus.

In the former covanant it was men that were dying that officated as priest.

In the new one the high priest is Jesus.

It was in the former that "men" who are "dying" received tith.

Anybody that calls himself a pastor and does not know that the law/tith was operative in the ABrahamic covanant has nothing to do with being a pastor.
Hebrew 7 is written with this full understanding in mind.

Hebrew 7: did not even mention moses that receive the law on mount sinai but talked about Abraham and the priest and shows that tith collecting was in the former arrange when we had men as priest. Hebrew 7:8

in referring to the livitical priest hood (befor christ priest hood) it says, "here, men that are dying received tith".

It is same Abraham that Hebrews 7 refered to the family head.

It is this same Abraham that the Jews told Jesus that they have Abraham as father.

[size=15pt]Such argument of tithe before the law is base on a false teaching.[/size]

Exactly my point! Heb. 7 place both the pre-law and the law tithing together and CHANGED/DIS-ANNULLED BOTH.

@ BARRISTERS and Frosbel,

Am not closing my eyes to the context.....The same context as shown from MANY translation that this same God is Jesus Christ. You guys don't seems to understand the ONE GOD, NOT Three manifest Himself as the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit. I have asked two question to you the anti-trinitarians,

What does the Bible meant when it says......"the LORD is THE Spirit"?

Two. What audacity does other translation have to EXPLICTLY call JESUS the TRUE GOD? Abi make we no use other translations ni How do you guys explain these other translations that says JESUS is TRUE GOD......

The "know" ἵνα (Jina) introduces a purpose clause which gives the purpose of the preceding affirmation: “we know that the Son of God has come and has given us insight (so that we may) know him who is true.” The pronoun This one (οὗτος, Joutos) refers to a person, but it is far from clear whether it should be understood as a reference (1) to God the Father or (2) to Jesus Christ.

R. E. Brown (Epistles of John [AB], 625) comments, “I John, which began with an example of stunning grammatical obscurity in the prologue, continues to the end to offer us examples of unclear grammar.” The nearest previous antecedent is Jesus Christ, immediately preceding, but on some occasions when this has been true the pronoun still refers to God (see 1 John 2:3). The first predicate which follows This one in 5:20, the true God, is a description of God the Father used by Jesus in John 17:3, and was used in the preceding clause of the present verse to refer to God the Father (him who is true).

Yet the second predicate of This one in 5:20, eternal life, appears to refer to Jesus, because although the Father possesses “life” (John 5:26, 6:57) just as Jesus does (John 1:4, 6:57, 1 John 5:11), “life” is never predicated of the Father elsewhere, while it is predicated of Jesus in John 11:25 and 14:6 (a self-predication by Jesus). If This one in 5:20 is understood as referring to Jesus, it forms an inclusion with the prologue, which introduced the reader to “the eternal life which was with the Father and was manifested to us.” Thus it appears best to understand the pronoun This one in 5:20 as a reference to Jesus Christ. The christological affirmation which results is striking, but certainly not beyond the capabilities of the author (see John 1:1 and 20:28): This One [Jesus Christ] is the true God and eternal life.

frosbel: My goodness, Pastor Goshen you have started using the message bible , lol

What happened to KJV , NKJV , NASB etc.

I do not rely on the bibles you quoted from.

Let us stick with more reliable bibles like the NIV, NLT , NASB, NKJV etc.

We try first one of the best phrase for phrase bibles out there, the NLT and then follow up with the NKJV.

NLT
"20 And we know that the Son of God has come, and he has given us understanding so that we can know the true God.[e] And now we live in fellowship with the true God because we live in fellowship with his Son, Jesus Christ. He is the only true God, and he is eternal life."

NKJV
20 And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us an understanding, that we may know Him who is true; and we are in Him who is true, in His Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and eternal life.

Notice in both cases we have the first statement and then a FULL STOP. The next sentence as mentioned earlier , corroborates the previous statement that says Yahweh is the only true GOD revealed through his SON Christ Jesus.

So these other translations has become NON-RELIABLE because you said so or because you don't see Jesus as the TRUE GOD?

frosbel: My goodness, Pastor Goshen you have become so desperate , you have started using the message bible , lol

What happened to KJV , NKJV , NASB etc.

Oga Frosbel......no mind me jare.....I betrayed and backslided from KJV ONLY...... .

On a serious note, I did a study and come to conclusion that, I will keep using KJV AND do comparison with MANY other translations. Even the KJV that the article of Olaadegbu quoted from was clearer than others......

"Of course, the text for the day also links "eternal life" with Jesus, but note that the phrase, "the true God," is sandwiched between "his Son Jesus Christ" and "eternal life." If Jesus is the subject before and after, then the phrase, "the true God," applies to Him as well. It is not saying that the Lord Jesus Christ is a god (diminutive sense), but that He is "the true God" (emphatic sense). Modern-day cultists set themselves up as experts, pretending to know more about Jesus than the apostles who walked with Him, but John wrote about being "in Him that is true" (first part of today’s text). The important lesson for us is to connect personally with this true God, Jesus Christ—to be "in" Him".

Oga Frosbel......now, let's discuss OUTSIDE your own NIV too.......What do you have to say for those translations that says JESUS is the TRUE GOD?

@ Frosbel,

Can you address the THREE translations the EXPLICITLY said JESUS is THE TRUE GOD......Quoting from many translation most times will clear the air on some difficult scriptures:

Goshen360: Goshen360:

The Message (MSG)
18-21 We know that none of the God-begotten makes a practice of sin—fatal sin. The God-begotten are also the God-protected. The Evil One can’t lay a hand on them. We know that we are held firm by God; it’s only the people of the world who continue in the grip of the Evil One. And we know that the Son of God came so we could recognize and understand the truth of God—what a gift!—and we are living in the Truth itself, in God’s Son, Jesus Christ. [size=20pt]This Jesus is both True God and Real Life.[/size] Dear children, be on guard against all clever facsimiles.


GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)
20 We know that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding so that we know the real God. We are in the one who is real, his Son Jesus Christ. [size=20pt]This Jesus Christ is the real God and eternal life.[/size]

AND THIS,

Goshen360: Amplified Bible (AMP)
20 And we [have seen and] know [positively] that the Son of God has [actually] come to this world and has given us understanding and insight [progressively] to perceive (recognize) and come to know better and more clearly Him Who is true; and we are in Him Who is true—in His Son Jesus Christ (the Messiah). [b][size=20pt]This [Man] is the true God[/size] [/b]and Life eternal.

It is the necessary and important for ALL bible teachers to consider from many translation in order to come to a conclusion on a subject matter. You (Frosbel) are ONLY sticking to one translation, the NIV or whatever the translation you love to use. I have left KJV out of this so that we can come to a solid conclusion. Now, how do you address these translations that EXPLICITLY, in the face of scriptures calls JESUS the TRUE GOD?

truthislight: i think you are really confuse, if you cant understand that simple scripture then your case is worst than i thought.

Cheers anyway,
please yourself.
Peace

So "the LORD is THE Spirit" is TOO HARD for you to explain . See, keep your beef away when it comes to the things of God. TRINITY IS NOT A PAGAN TEACHING, IT IS BIBLICAL. I can understand if it's bigger than your "senses".

Pastor Kun: This was my kweshun

This is your answer.

FAIL!!!
Bros abeg answer the kweshun quoting scriptures that tell us God manifests himself in three divine nature. or is it so difficult?

Egbon mi, you are still NOT getting what am communicating to you. The issue is not quoting ONE explicit scripture to show that God manifest himself in THREE divine nature..........it's all over the scripture. God is ONE who manifest ALL THROUGH the scripture as the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. If this concept is hard for you to understand.....I don't know how else I should explain it. In other words, God doesn't just manifest Himself IN/AS the Father But also as Son and Holy Spirit.......Goshen is a Son, husband and father........BUT ONE and ONLY and TRUE GOSHEN especially when I add "360".......ki n ma jaye mi lo ni......

Pastor Kun: Bros if out of a hundred bible translations of the same verse only two ascribe Jesus to be the true God shouldn't that raise alarm bells? I maintain that you don't have any point, you are merely chasing shadows as the doctrine of trinity contradicts scripture and is not biblically sound. Meanwhile you have an outstanding kweshun to answer.

Read up there.....I have answered your question sir. And did you say ONLY translations ascribe Jesus to be the true God? Take a look at this, maybe this will even mean a different thing to you after you read this translation,

Goshen360: Amplified Bible (AMP)
20 And we [have seen and] know [positively] that the Son of God has [actually] come to this world and has given us understanding and insight [progressively] to perceive (recognize) and come to know better and more clearly Him Who is true; and we are in Him Who is true—in His Son Jesus Christ (the Messiah). [size=20pt]This [Man] is the true God[/size] and Life eternal.

Maybe Amplified Translation too na trinitarian.......

truthislight: as a bible student you shouknow this scripture:

"No man have come to know the mind of God, but we know the mind of christ"

but christ knows the mind of God.

Meaning?

That is how we have come to know the mind of God through knowing the mind of christ since christ knows the mind of God.
Peace

Thank God you are coming gently today. Glory to God.

Can you also explain this scripture......please?

Goshen360: New International Version (©1984)
Now [size=15pt]the Lord is the Spirit[/size], and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. 2 Cor. 3:17 NIV

According to this scripture.....Who is the Lord? .......and Who is the Spirit

Pastor Kun: Bros abeg i am still waiting for an answer to the highlighted.

Throughout the scripture......GOD is ONE. In the divine nature, (NOT human) GOD manifest himself through three divine nature and being.....is that too difficult for you to understand? Okay, let's start with this scripture and you tell me what it means.......

New International Version (©1984)
Now [size=15pt]the Lord is the Spirit[/size], and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. 2 Cor. 3:17 NIV

According to this scripture.....Who is the Lord? .......and Who is the Spirit

frosbel: Brother , now you adding a LIE to my stance, SMH.

Where did I say that Jesus is not Divine

My consistent statement all along is that Jesus is not Yahweh , period.

Despite hundreds of bible verses to back this perspective you seem to be prefer tradition to the word of GOD.

Let us tread carefully !

What was your explanation recently on John 1:1 E be like say this "Trinity" is bigger than you now ooo

frosbel: I don't think there is anything funny about [size=15pt]trying to twist scripture.[/size]

You mean am writing the scriptures by myself? The way you quote from NIV, I have also quoted from many translations and TWO of those translation......even more clearly says THIS Jesus is the TRUE GOD......Is that TWISTING SCRIPTURES?

frosbel: Stay with the bible and you will not miss road.

Off course, I am STAYING with the bible....that is the reason I gave many translation. Pastor Kun had been knocked OUT in this thread because the ONLY reason he gave was that, such translations were written by trinitarians.....So how do we know those who are not trinitarian translators and those who are not as if (anti)trinitarian is a criteria to bible translation.

frosbel: Besides your deeper life brother Ola believes that we are all going to hell because we do not agree with the tithe and trinity doctrines.

If this is what Ola is saying.....my response is, it is NOT Goshen that said it. I leave Ola to his words and if he truly said the above statement.....such words is error and I don't support it.

JeSoul: Na wa oh...Frost-belly vs. Ghost-sheng vs. Ola-Day-goo all over the section...this trinity matter don serious lol.

Yes, it's serious o...... because Frosbel is denying the deity of christ as GOD and this is unscriptural to biblical teachings. I want to laugh this weekend. Stay in house my sister.....you go laugh tire.

Pastor Kun: Those translatations were probably done by trinitarians trying to force their opinion on christianity. Bible history is full of several attempts by trinitarians twisting translations to suit the trinity doctrine.

[size=20pt]Pastor.......Is this YOU?[/size]