₦airaland Forum

chukwudi44: Jesus is not the son of david.Jesus's divine nature preceded david but his human nature is descended from David's bloodline through Mary thus making I'm a descendant of david by is earthly life.

Now over to you my questions goes thus;

Do you believe in Isaiah's prophecy that the messiah would be a descendant of david?

If yes how was that prophecy fulfilled.
If no thus it that Isaiah got it wrong or that God later changed his mind

Jesus said He's not the son of David,though He came through the lineage of David,how can He then be the son of Mary?
The Word which is God became flesh..Jhn1:14 in the womb of Mary.
He came in the LIKENESS of the human body..Rom8:3.
He came through them(David's lineage) and they rejected Him..Jhn1:11.because He was not of them..Jhn1:4-5.
How can your God have a Mother?

chukwudi44: @ I chuka

When I see you disputing Jesus's human davidic ancestry,I even get more perplexed.The are myriads of biblical passages which affirms Jesus's davidic roots.This verses are so explicit that I begin to suspect you are just being mischievous.

Posting a few of them here will suffice.

Revelation 5:5

New International Version (NIV)

5 Then one of the elders said to me, “Do not weep! See, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has triumphed. He is able to open the scroll and its seven seals.”

my question to you is,"is Jesus the son of David"?.......Matt22:43-45.

italo: @I.chuka, this just goes to show how dubious you are. Of course, I'm not surprised. Light and dark cannot mix, so anyone who tries to counter Catholic teachings must resort to terrible distortions like this. I'd like to see all your fellow anti-Catholics defend this; where are they now?

LUKE 1
41 Now it happened that as soon as Elizabeth heard Mary's greeting, the child leapt in her womb and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit.
42 She gave a loud cry and said, 'Of all women you are the most blessed, and blessed is the fruit of your womb.
43 Why should I be honoured with a visit from the mother of my Lord?
44 Look, the moment your greeting reached my ears, the child in my womb leapt for joy.
45 Yes, blessed is she who believed that the promise made her by the Lord would be fulfilled.'

Ye do ERR, 1,not knowing the scriptures,2,nor the power of God....Matt22:29.
I counsel you to study the Bible with your spirit.

chukwudi44: The holy spirit says if anyone lies against the son of man,he might be forgiven but if anyone lies against the holy spirit he would never be forgiven.Young man I would advise in theological arguments if you are confused or not sure of anything kindly ignore or walk away and not to incure a curse upon you for mischieviously twisting the scriptures all in an attempt to justify your dogma.

The gospel of luke makes it clear Elizabeth was inspired by the holy spirit to call Mary the Lord's mother yet you have twisted it to say she said it on her own volition.how mischievous can a bible misinterpretation be?

seriously thats the problem with you guys.if you can't DISCERN words spoken by the Holy Spirit and words spoken by the human spirit,i wonder how you educate the youth in your congregation.

We should try and discern the Word spoken by the Holy Spirit through Elizabeth and her own word.
Luke1:41,says......and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit.in a LOUD voice she exclaimed:"Blessed are you among women,and Blessed is the child you will bear"(thats the Holy Spirit speaking through her).
In verse43,she said on her own accord "But why am i so favoured,that the mother of my Lord should come to me?

chukwudi44: Yes the divine nature preceded david not his humanity.The verse says by his human nature a descendant of david.

Are you by any means trying to disclaim God's prophecy that the christ would be a descendant of david?

The bible did not tell us Jesus did not call Mary his mother.There is no where in the bible such is mentioned.Even the holy spirit which is part of the trinity moved elizabeth to call her mother of my Lord.stop making unsubstantiated claims.

just as the Pharisees claim of Christ been the son of David..Matt22:42,likewise Elizabeth on her ascentainment.
How can your God have a mother?meaning your God have a begining.

chukwudi44: << Romans 1:3 >>



New International Version (©1984)
regarding his Son, who as to his human nature was a descendant of David,

New Living Translation (©2007)
The Good News is about his Son. In his earthly life he was born into King David's family line,

English Standard Version (©2001)
concerning his Son, who was descended from David according to the flesh

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
concerning His Son, who was born of a descendant of David according to the flesh,

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;

International Standard Version (©2008)
regarding his Son. He was a descendant of David with respect to his humanity

Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010)
About his Son, who is begotten in the flesh from the seed of the house of David,

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
This Good News is about his Son, our Lord Jesus Christ. In his human nature he was a descendant of David.

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, who was made of the descendants of David according to the flesh;

American King James Version
Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;

American Standard Version
concerning his Son, who was born of the seed of David according to the flesh,

Douay-Rheims Bible
Concerning his Son, who was made to him of the seed of David, according to the flesh,

Darby Bible Translation
concerning his Son (come of David's seed according to flesh,

English Revised Version
concerning his Son, who was born of the seed of David according to the flesh,

Webster's Bible Translation
Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, who was born of the seed of David according to the flesh.

Weymouth New Testament
who, as regards His human descent, belonged to the posterity of David,

World English Bible
concerning his Son, who was born of the seed of David according to the flesh,

Young's Literal Translation
concerning His Son, (who is come of the seed of David according to the flesh,

This bible verse makes it explicitly certain that Jesus was a descendant of david by the flesh.It means that his humanity was entirely sourced from david's descendant which happens to be Mary.



I wonder where you got this trash from.Where did you read that Jesus never called him mother? The holy spirit inspired Elizabeth to call her "the mother of my Lord" ,even the angel told Joseph take the "child and his mother and flee to egypt".Mary is adreesed as the mother of Jesus in several bible passages.I wonder where you got this heresy from?

Matt22:42-45;Jesus asked them,"what do you think about the Christ?Whose SON is He?"
"the Son of David" they replied.
He said to them,"How is it then that David,speaking by the Spirit,calls Him 'Lord'?For he says, 'The Lord said to my Lord:
"sit at my right hand until i put your enemies under your feet"
if then David calls Him 'Lord'how can He be his son?.
My question to you,if then David calls Him Lord,how can He be from his natural descent?.
Jhn1:11says"He came to that which was His own,but His own did not recieve Him.
Though He came through them(David linage) they did not recieve Him because He was "not of them".
Did Jesus ever called Mary "Mother"? Yes or No simple.

Thats the reason Christ never for once called her "Mother" because God had no mother.
She was just a vessel,like the rest.

chukwudi44: I am in agreement with your statement that Mary was a vessel.The big question now is whether Mary was an active or passive vessel in the incarnation process? Where did Jesus get his fresh and blood from?

The books of acts 2:30 says

30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne.

This verse explicitly states that the messiah would a FRUIT OF DAVID'S LOINS ACCORDING TO THE FLESH.Do you mind interpreting this biblical statement and explaining how it was fulfilled in the incarnation.

Romans8:3,says For what the law could not do,in that it was weak through the flesh,God sending His Son "IN THE LIKENESS OF SINFUL FLESH"and for sin,condemned sin inthe flesh.
He was like us(blood and flesh) but not of us,for His blood and flesh was divine.
Only Adam in Genesis and Christ had no natural descent,Mary was never mentioned.

Thank you my Father,my Lord and my God,for you are my Salvation,my Deliverance and my Redemption these day.in Jesus name Amen.

chukwudi44: I know all these but it does not answer my questions.What is the role of Mary in the incarnation?why did Jesus come through Mary?since you claim Mary played no role in the word becomming flesh why didn't Jesus just descend from heaven?

Mary was a vessel prepared by God,just like the prophets and the apostles where all vessels prepared for there various ministries here on earth.
Why is it so hard to understand?

chukwudi44: Can anyone answer this simple question for me.Why was it necessary for the christ to be born of a woman? Why didn't christ just descend from heaven?

when man sins against God,he has to bear the consequence of sin,which is death.but because God loves and wants to save us(Jhn3:16).He took on the body of a man.prepared for Him by the Father(Hebws10:5).

chukwudi44: Can anyone answer this simple question for me.Why was it necessary for the christ to be born of a woman? Why didn't christ just descend from heaven?

Philip2:6-8,Who,being in the form of God,did not consider equality with God something to be grasped,but made Himself nothing,taking the very nature of a SERVANT,being made in HUMAN LIKENESS,and being found in appearance as a man,He Humbled Himself and became obedient to death even death on a cross.
Like i said earlier,whosoever is born of the will of a man,of blood and of flesh inherited the Adamic nature,and is a servant to sin.
For Christ to serve He have to come through the Adamic race. for Him to be qualify to serve.
Secondly,1Tim6:16 says that God is immortal;He cannot die.
for Him to be able to die,He emptied Himself of all the glory and power of His divinity..phil2:7-8.
He emptied Himself and at the same time have to pass through a woman,inorder to be qualify to serve and to die for us.

Whosoever was born of the flesh and by the will of natural decent was at Eden and in Adam when he sinned.
When Adam ate of the fruit of knowledge of good and evil.we are all in him.constituting us all a sinner in the sight of God.
Our Lord Jesus is the only one without that genealogy.because He was born not of the flesh,nor the will of a natural parents and of blood.

chukwudi44: Have you ever heard about the term immaculate conception?virgin Mary in preparation of her future role in the incarnation was miraculosly preserved from original sin.

Where do you think Jesus's humanity came from? Why didn,t Jesus just descend from heaven? Why didn't God clothe him with uman skin and just send him to earth? Why did he have to be born of a woman?

Jesus was only born of a woman because it was necessary for his human nature to suffer and die.His divine nature could not feel pain or suffer death hence the need for him to inherit humanity from a virgin mother.HOlY Spirit does not have flesh and blood and thus could not have given them to Jesus.The question now is where else is the source of Jesus's humanity if not Mary?

"immaculate conception" indeed can you back it up with scriptures?
You are still not getting it.
Jhn6:63says"the words which i have spoken to you are spirit"
The word of God is spirit and at the same time God Himself,that same word which is God that created the heavens and the earth became flesh in the womb of Mary..Jhn1:1-14.how is it so hard to understand.
Mary is a vessel just as Jeremiah,Isaiah or David are vessels unto the Lord

chukwudi44: The analogy of the cup and content does not apply here.Mary was not just an inert vessel in the incarnation process.The holy spirit does not have flesh and blood so it is very much evident that Jesus's humanity wholely came from Mary.Except you want to go with the muslims who claim Jesus was molded from dust in the womb of the blessed Virgin.While in Mary's womb Jesus was fed from Mary in the normal human conception process.Mary eventually breastfed him afterwards.She was an active and not a passive participant in the incarnation process.

Mary inherited the Adamic nature from her parents because she was born of the flesh,and whosoever is born of the will of his/her parents is a sinner already whether you commit sin or not.
She recognise the need of a Saviour in her life .....Luke1:47.

chukwudi44: This is ridiculous !!! Wonders shall never end.So by these statement you are implying the holy spirit deposited semen into the womb of Mary to get her pregnant?I can't believe people can get to these ridiculous extent all in an attempt to belittle the role of the Virgin Mary in the incarnation.Does the holy spirit have flesh or semen? How on earth do you reason?

Even for normal uman conception,the child formed is as a result of the comming together of the male sperm and female ova.The child cannot be formed from the sperm alone without the ova.The mother is still involved in the conception process and the child will end up inheriting traits from both parents.

Jesus christ is composed of 2 natures

1.Divine nature which have always existed from the begining.

2.Human nature_which was sourced from the Virgin Mary in the course of the incarnation

you are getting it all wrong.my last post deals on the physical aspect of conception.
In the case of our Lord Jesus Christ,the Bible said "the Word became flesh and made His dwellings among us"..Jhn1:14.
Mary was a vessel God choose to manifest Himself among us.DOES A CUP(VESSEL) MIX WITH THE CONTENT(e.g.Water) IN THE CUP?.it is impossible for Mary's blood to have mix with that of Our Lord Jesus Christ.it would not have had the power to redeem us.for Mary was born of the flesh,the will of her parents and of blood.

Even a medical doctor can ascertain to the fact that the sperm of a man constitute the blood/flesh of a child in the womb of a woman.

chukwudi44: Young man you are deluded,Mary carried Jesus PHYS0iCALLY in her womb and not just that she is also the source of his human life.His flesh and blood were sourced from Mary

.

point of correction Sir,our Lord Jesus was born not of the flesh,nor the will of a man or of blood,He was born of God..Jhn1:13.

According to the Gospel of God,the poor are those who have not recieved the Good news.so when we give to the Gospel,simultaneously the poor have been taken care off.

John11:25-26;Jesus said unto her,"I am the Resurrection and the Life".
Chapter eleven of the Gospel of John deals mainly on how our Lord resurrected Lazarus from dead.He didn't say in the above verse that "I will resurrect Lazarus"instead,He said,"I am the resurrection"after He said these words Lazarus was resurrected.
To Martha and Mary,it would have been better for Him to say"I will resurrect your brother".we(Christains) love to hear such word.our desire and hope is that God will do something for us,we often pray,hope and wait before God for a word concerning what He will do for us.but,God rarely shows us what He can "do",He usually reveals what He "is" to us.because what He can "do" is based on what He "is".as Christains,we must see that everything God can do is included in what God is.
In Jhn11:25,our Lord was not saying that He can preserve a man's life,but that He Himself is Life.He was not telling us of His ability to resurrect men,but of the fact He Himself is Resurrection.
He was Resurrection to Lazarus(Jhn11:25) and,Lazarus resurrected(Jhn11:44).
I remember Him this day for been my Resurrection and my Life.

John11:25-26;Jesus said unto her,"I am the Resurrection and the Life".
Chapter eleven of the Gospel of John deals mainly on how our Lord resurrected Lazarus from dead.He didn't say in the above verse that "I will resurrect Lazarus"instead,He said,"I am the resurrection"after He said these words Lazarus was resurrected.
To Martha and Mary,it would have been better for Him to say"I will resurrect your brother".we(Christains) love to hear such word.our desire and hope is that God will do something for us,we often pray,hope and wait before God for a word concerning what He will do for us.but,God rarely shows us what He can "do",He usually reveals what He "is" to us.because what He can "do" is based on what He "is".as Christains,we must see that everything God can do is included in what God is.
In Jhn11:25,our Lord was not saying that He can preserve a man's life,but that He Himself is Life.He was not telling us of His ability to resurrect men,but of the fact He Himself is Resurrection.
He was Resurrection to Lazarus(Jhn11:25) and,Lazarus resurrected(Jhn11:44).
I remember Him this day for been my Resurrection and my Life.

John11:25-26;Jesus said unto her,"I am the Resurrection and the Life".
Chapter eleven of the Gospel of John deals mainly on how our Lord resurrected Lazarus from dead.He didn't say in the above verse that "I will resurrect Lazarus"instead,He said,"I am the resurrection"after He said these words Lazarus was resurrected.
To Martha and Mary,it would have been better for Him to say"I will resurrect your brother".we(Christains) love to hear such word.our desire and hope is that God will do something for us,we often pray,hope and wait before God for a word concerning what He will do for us.but,God rarely shows us what He can "do",He usually reveals what He "is" to us.because what He can "do" is based on what He "is".as Christains,we must see that everything God can do is included in what God is.
In Jhn11:25,our Lord was not saying that He can preserve a man's life,but that He Himself is Life.He was not telling us of His ability to resurrect men,but of the fact He Himself is Resurrection.
He was Resurrection to Lazarus(Jhn11:25) and,Lazarus resurrected(Jhn11:44).
I remember Him this day for been my Resurrection and my Life.

1John4:16;And we have known and believe the love that God hath to us,God is Love;and he that dwelleth in Love dwelleth in God,and God in him.
The grestest revelation of the Bible is that God is Love.this revelation is what man needs the most,because man has many conjectures and theories about God.
We ponder all the time about what kind of God our God is,what kind of heart our God has,what intentions God has toward man and what God Himself is like.we all have our different concept of who God is.our perceptive of Him is that He is a fierce or a severe God.inorder to correct the conjectures we have concerning God,He manifest Himself in the light of the Gospel and shows us that He's not an unapproachable or unfathomable God(Jhn1:1-14).
When we say that God is Love,it means that God Himself,His nature and His being is Love.if He has a subtance,that subtance is love.He is Love from inside to outside.
We must understand that it is impossible for God to "HATE".for God to hate someone He must first develop a problem with Himself,before He can or do anything in a way that's not in Love.
the life-essence of God,is just Love.He cannot do anything otherwise.He loves(Jhn3:16) because HE is "LOVE"...1jhn4:16.
Thats my Remembrance of HIM,who is Love!.

Thank you my FATHER,for you are my RESURRECTION and my LIFE.

Our Lord told Nicodemus,"Truly,truly,i say to you,unless one is born of water and the Spirit,he cannot enter into the Kingdom of God(John3:5).
Paul wrote to the saints in Rome,"Or are you ignorant that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death?we have been buried therefore with Him through baptism into His death,in order that just as Christ was raised from the dead through the Glory of the Father,so also we might walk in the newness of life.for if we have grown together with Him in the likeness of His death,indeed we will also be in the likeness of His Resurrection"(Rom6:3-5).
Both our Lord Jesus and Paul spoke of the REALITY of BAPTISM.
However,some only view the aspect of baptism physically(their eyes only see water).while some tackle the subject with there mind(trying to understand spiritual things with the mind).
The baptism that our Lord mentioned to Nicodemus was a REALITY.the baptism that Paul saw was a burial with the Lord,with the result of one walking in newness of Life.
To the Colossns believers,he spoke of being"BURIED TOGETHER with HIM in BAPTISM"(Col.2:12).Paul saw that BAPTISM,BURIAL and RESURRECTION are one and the same thing.he knew what it meant to be buried with the Lord and to be raised up together with the Lord.
That is when Christ died,we(Christains) died with Him,when He Resurrected we resurrected with Him and now walk with the newness of His Ressurected Life here on earth.
The physical(water)aspect is just merely an acceptance of that which have already taken place spiritually.

Our Lord told Nicodemus,"Truly,truly,i say to you,unless one is born of water and the Spirit,he cannot enter into the Kingdom of God(John3:5).
Paul wrote to the saints in Rome,"Or are you ignorant that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death?we have been buried therefore with Him through baptism into His death,in order that just as Christ was raised from the dead through the Glory of the Father,so also we might walk in the newness of life.for if we have grown together with Him in the likeness of His death,indeed we will also be in the likeness of His Resurrection"(Rom6:3-5).
Both our Lord Jesus and Paul spoke of the REALITY of BAPTISM.
However,some only view the aspect of baptism physically(their eyes only see water).while some tackle the subject with there mind(trying to understand spiritual things with the mind).
The baptism that our Lord mentioned to Nicodemus was a REALITY.the baptism that Paul saw was a burial with the Lord,with the result of one walking in newness of Life.
To the Colossns believers,he spoke of being"BURIED TOGETHER with HIM in BAPTISM"(Col.2:12).Paul saw that BAPTISM,BURIAL and RESURRECTION are one and the same thing.he knew what it meant to be buried with the Lord and to be raised up together with the Lord.
That is when Christ died,we(Christains) died with Him,when He Resurrected we resurrected with Him and now walk with the newness of His Ressurected Life here on earth.
The physical(water)aspect is just merely an acceptance of that which have already taken place spiritually.

Lord Jesus,thanks for been my Life.

Many youth will be employ.Great move Sir,may God continue to bless you in Jesus name Amen.

2Sam23:10;he arose,and smote the Philippines until his hand was weary and his hand clave unto the sword.
When a band of philistines threatened to attack a plot of ground full of barley the rest of Israel fled before them,but Eleazar stood his ground and stuck down the philistines until his hand was weary and clave to his sword.which brought about a great victory in the name of the Lord.
"HIS HAND CLAVE TO THE SWORD" that is,he had held on so firmly and so persistently that he now could not let go when he wanted.his sword had almost become a part of his hand.he is in great weariness with the fight,bt he sees it through to the end.
We might take up things and start them with zest,but leaves a whole host of unfinished things all over the place.our lives marked with unfinished things,we begin in good spirit,but nothing is carried through to the end.when we get to a point of tedium,of weariness,a point where the cost or the danger increases,our hand slackens and the thing is not finished.
There's a lot in the NT. About enduring unto the end.
Spiritual stamina is a test of greatness.
We(Christains) do need Spiritual stamina to stick to a task,go through it and not give up.our hand cleaving to our sword(the Word of God).we have got into this thing,and we just can't let go,it's not even a question now of wether we want to let go,we have to be so committed to the task before us.a mark of greatness is that stamina which goes beyond the initial zest,beyond all the stimulus of a fresh challenge in any situation in our lives.
So Eleazar's hand clave to his sword.he was weary,but he finished the job.he was not put off half-way through.he proved his stamina.it may be all right to go down into a pit and slay a lion and get it over with in a few minutes or to go up to a giant and give him a blow and that's the end of the business(2Sam23:20-21) but it is another thing to Stand and Fight man after man,raid after raid,rush after rush,repelling constantly renewed attacks.
David's warriors never gave up untill the fight was finished.there stamina is remarkable.in like manner we find Paul continuing to the end.weary,heart sick,workout inthe battle,but he can yet say"i have finished the course"(2Tim4:7).
Brethren,there is no giving up.
May we finish our course in Jesus name,amen.

I,Thank you JESUS,my FATHER,my LORD and my GOD,for been my life and my life more abundantly.

Worship is giving glory to God,bow under the ways of God(Heb.11:21),the worship i give God is His glory.