₦airaland Forum

KingAlabi:
So that's not a comeback?, Is Barcelona vs PSG when they did a 6:1 abi 5:1 win not a comeback, what is wrong with you?

Sometimes it's best to keep shvt, talking too much leads to rubbish.

Mourinho came back 2 goals down against City under 45 minutes and you are comparing that to Ole that had a whole 90 mins to erase a 2 goal deficit.

Have some shame, pal.

BARAJ92:
So reaching 2 final in 3 years is consider a failure while not reaching the final for almost a decade is called what. Abeg this your analogy is highly faulty.

Did United get what they wanted in 2009 & 2011?

It’s a theory of actual result and expected result.

If the actual result matches the expected result = success

If the actual results falls short of expect from result = failure.

Not reaching a final in a decade is a disaster but that’s another story entirely.

nitrogen:
I agree that Fergie no try at all. He was a local champion. 2 UCLs in over two decades despite staying at the top (of English football) no make sense.

One wey burst my brain na two UCL final losses against same team in 3 years.

Abeg abeg!

To be fair to him, English clubs were banned in Europe between 1985-1990 and by the time they rejoined European football, they had lagged behind considerably and this coincided with when Fergie arrived from Scotland.

Be that as it may, he should still have won at least 4 or 5 UCL trophies in 20 years.

elampiro:
Carlos Queiroz was Manchester United assistant coach :
2002
2003
left briefly for Madrid in 2003
2004
2005
2006
2007
2008

He was there when the so-called aged AC Milan and mediocre teams defeated United. Do you assume he was there for only one year?

Summary:

You no know ball

You are a big olodo.

2008 was the only time he was able to convince Alex Ferguson not to go cavalier against Barcelona. Everything was explicitly stated in Ferguson’s book and Neville confirmed it later that he had not seen such a drill before in his career at Old Trafford with sit-up mats on the pitch and tape rule measurement strictly insisting which positions defenders must take and blah blah blah.

You won’t find this on Wikipedia so I am sorry for your lack of knowledge. Anybody that says Ronaldo was vastly superior to Messi in 2008 shouldn’t even be having a football discussion or pointing fingers that someone else doesn’t know football. People with such opinions should be locked up for 9 months with spiritualists for a deliverance bath.

KingAlabi:
Is PSG not a comeback?
And by the way you made it sound like a historical win at Turin because they were unbeaten blah blah blah, hence I
mentioned both PSG and mancity.

Well okaaaaaayyy.

How’s PSG a comeback when Lukaku scored twice in Paris before PSG could even score a goal?

Do you even know the definition of comeback or what has gone wrong with your thinking faculty?

elampiro:
If CQ was the one who produced the tactics against Barca in 2008, then he did a very bad job.

In 2008, Manchester United team was more feared in Europe than Barcelona. Ronaldo was vastly superior to Messi in 2008. In the first leg in Spain, if Ronaldo scored the early penalty, United would have done to Barca what it did to teams like Roma. After the early penalty missed, Ronaldo and United were low in confidence which led to some poor decision making in the final third. United had the upper hand into half time.Second proved that Barca got the better tactics as United parked the bus throughout 2nd half. This no away goal at Barcelona put the team under pressure ahead of the second leg.

This is a silly take.

CQ didn’t ask Ronaldo to miss his penalty. That was on Ronaldo. All CQ did was to ensure United navigate the semifinal tie without conceding silly goals that had eliminated Ferguson’s team in the previous seasons of the CL.

Man Utd weren’t more feared than Barcelona in Europe in 2008. Man Utd lost to Milan 3-0 in the previous season. United hadn’t won CL 9 years prior to 2008 while Barcelona won it 2 years prior in 2006. It was a masterclass from CQ considering United had no Vidic in both legs.

Ronaldo wasn’t vastly superior to Messi in 2008, you probably have forgotten Messi was 2nd to Kaka in FIFA player of the year in 2007 while Ronaldo came 3rd. The only reason Messi was a bit underwhelming(he was still the MOTM in both legs) was because he was still recovering from injury and Rijkaard couldn’t even play him for 90 mins in the first leg.

elampiro:
In nutshell, the coaching team couldn't bring United out of the shock of the penalty miss by Ronaldo.

In a nutshell, United went into a lion’s den without Vidic and didn’t concede a goal. They came back to Old Trafford with a clean sheet and finished the job there. In previous seasons, United were eliminated by mediocre teams like Porto, aging Milan, Leverkusen and other shitty teams.

elampiro:
In 2008 United team was the strongest in Europe after growing from the experience of 2007.

Barca and Chelsea(Avram Grant) were stronger than United. Without the tactical acumen of CQ, United would never have won 2008 CL - even SAF admitted it in his book.

elampiro:
In 2009, Barca team was the strongest in Europe and Messi had grown into a man. But one major factor was that Darren Flercher was playing the football of his life in 2009, he was in a beast mode, but we didn't have him for the final match. His absence suddenly left a big hole in the team that no one else could fill. It was like if Leicester missed Kante in their quest to win the league that year. Fletcher covered so much ground, very useful in attacking play as well and posed a threat to opponents from set pieces

In 2009, United could have won the final even in the absence of Darren Fletcher but SAF had no CQ to hold his hand to navigate the threat posed by Barcelona’s midfield and attack.

SAF left Tevez on the bench and played Giggs & Carrick in the midfield to contain the trio of Busquets, Iniesta and Xavi. One of the most idiotic decisions any manager has taken in the final of CL. It was a mismatch as Barcelona controlled the game from the moment Eto’o scored till the last kick of the game.

A season later, Mourinho(another Portuguese) proved Barcelona can be beaten by letting them have the ball while putting plenty of men at the back. Mourinho proved you can control possession without actually having the ball. Just let your opponents have the ball in the areas they can’t hurt you and they would suicide themselves.

In conclusion, SAF is not a tactician. He’s not reactive. He doesn’t worry about where he can be hurt. He only focused on where he can hurt his opponents. Pep taught him bitter lessons in the finals of 2009 and 2011.

KingAlabi:
Wow !!!!
What about man City or PSG win

You want to start?

City/PSG wins?

Were they comebacks or you have forgotten your own argument again?

You mean beating Man City 2-0 is a comeback?

SyIvalord:
Elamps you admit that Ole has performed better than Moyes, Gaal and Mourinho yet you say you don’t know if he is a good coach. Are you scared of what people will say or what? You know he is a good coach, a bad coach wouldn’t stabilize the team as much as he has done.

Elampiro can’t make up his mind.

He likes the rudderless attacking football that leaves us vulnerable at the back. Attack wins games, defence wins titles. If we are solid at the back, one could understand.

We have two slow CBs that are positionally fraudulent and yet Ole is so tactically naive to the point that he cannot close games out when leading by a goal margin at the death.

This is why some of us know Ole will never win a trophy.

KingAlabi:
Should I mention ole's own?

Look at the teams I listed before mentioning Ole’s own.

Don’t go and be mentioning teams that aren’t in the top 6 or teams that no one gives a shit about in Europe.

Juventus hadn’t lost a UCL group game in Turin for more than 9 years when Mourinho went there to get a rare victory.

benji93:
How many of them were as a Manchester United manager?

If you don’t know all these games were when he was at United, you don’t even deserve to have a conversation with me.

elampiro:
He managed good clubs in small leagues. He manged Madrid and won community shield like Nwoye. He coached South Africa, Iran, Colombia, Portugal (twice)

You can say anything you want but legend has it that CQ’s tactical acumen against Barcelona got Manchester United to the final.

It was even more heroic considering Vidic was absent in both legs and we prevented the attacking trio of Messi, Henry & Eto’o from scoring in 180 minutes of football.

elampiro:
I guess you are joking. How many trophies does he have in his over 30 years as a manager? Was he there when SAF won the UCL 1999?

How many teams with the status of United has he managed?

CQ’s tactical acumen of marking out talented players for United past Barcelona in 2007/8 semifinals & then took United to CL victory and you are speaking Swahili.

Without CQ, SAF would have naively go pound with pound with Barcelona and lose 5-0 in aggregate after 2 legs.

hoopLA:
Crystal Palace at Selhurst Park with a 90th minute Matic winner.
Lol.

These clowns think that if they lie to themselves hard enough, the lie will stick.

Don’t mind them.

Selective Amnesia is the number one disease of Olesexuals.

elampiro:
Carlos Tevez ko Carlos Queiroz ni

How many trophies does he have?

He would have won it all if his teams have as much talents as the United team that failed time and time again in Europe under Sir Alex.

This was how Gary Neville recalled Carlos Queiroz’s input in the 2 legs against Barcelona.

www.nairaland.com/attachments/13361503_623ba76f17d348a1b1c4bc891929d0b7_jpeg_jpeg3b19b598a428842fd1a7393bfeb1559d

elampiro:
Those days we won against small teams only because Fellaini was a 3rd central defender. And we analysed how the coach was a tactical genius for bringing in Fellaini at 79th minute to help see the game through.

We won big games when Herrera took out the opposition best midfielder or Ashley Young taking care of opposition best wing forward. Today our players play their own game instead of marking out an opponent

And what have our players won today by playing their own game?

This same naivety was why Alex Ferguson suffered plenty of times on European nights until Carlos Queiroz put him straight that in some certain games, tactical acumen is required instead of going philosophical.

Soon as Queiroz left United, SAF reverted back to his old character and lost 2 UCL finals within 3 years. Ole has turned United into Spurs. Play attractive football, win nothing but pat each other at the back that next season will be better.

elampiro:
I don't know if Ole is a good coach, but I see the most stable team since Ferguson.

Under Moyes, Gaal, Mourinho, it was always panic when I have to watch our league matches. If Fellaini is not available to help see out a game by heading away balls in our box, we were very likely to concede a late goal to draw or lose a match. It was devastating.

Stable teams win a trophy. This is actually the worst team since Fergie left.

Since Ole arrived, he has lost like 5 semifinal ties against teams like Wolves, Leicester, etc.

Under Ole, we dropped gazillion of points in the last minute. Calvert-Lewin bullied Maguire the other time. Obafemi of Southampton bullied Lindelof. I remember Vardy also scoring a late goal in the 2-2 draw at Leicester earlier in the season.

elampiro:
I meant if we had VDS on his peak. VDS making a mistake in one match can not be compared to a goalkeeper who was nervous for 5 months and had to be benched in January 2012.

You can spin it anyhow you want it, DDG is better than VDS.

elampiro:
When you mentioned losing the league on goals difference, it makes me think more that if DDG was more consistent, we could have won it and City had no chance to chase in the run in.

VDS also lost it by a point in 2009/10. It makes me think more that if VDS wasn’t out of his depth, we could have won it and Chelsea had no chance to chase in the run in.

elampiro:
League is a marathon, you lose concentration as a team in some games of briefly in the race. City lost concentration and we managed to overtake them. It didn't mean we had to win 12 matches out of 12.

If we have VDS, we would have been champions since April.

So De Gea was the reason the team lost concentration? United lost the league via goals difference in 11/12. It’a so ridiculous to blame it on De Gea when it wasn’t De Gea that was responsible for the 4-4 draw at Everton or the 0-1 loss at relegation bound Wigan.

If we had VDS yen yen yen, how come United didn’t win it in 2009/10 when VDS was the goalkeeper? United had an unassailable league until VDS acted like a bïtch against Chelsea and cost United 3 points.

KingAlabi:
So we have never started a game on the front foot?

You had already spelled doom from the first half, I remained calm because I saw that what was just our problem was to get the shot on target, I knew we would win if we can get shots on target more, we did and we won.

What ifs doesn't determine games, again we have been 2 down and we still won !!

Tell me does Liverpool or mancity always start the game on the front foot.

If there is something OGS has given me is the believe that even if we concede first we can win a game, I can't say the same under mou or gaal honestly.

This is the nonsense people keep telling themselves to change a narrative. There were plenty of crucial comebacks under Mourinho. I could name 20 from the top of my head.

2-1 vs Chelsea(Willian, Lukaku, Lingard)
2-1 vs Spurs FA cup semis(Alli, Sanchez, Herrera)
3-2 vs Man City(Kompany, Gundogan, PogbaX2, Smalling).
2-1 vs Juventus(Ronaldo, Mata, Sandro OG)

I won’t even mention the ones against Middlesboro, Newcastle twice, Bournemouth and the other mid-table clubs.

elampiro:
The incidence above happened in the run in, which is not unusual. DDG had made many mistakes from the beginning of the season up to around new year which put United under pressure

That’s not true.

United were 6 points above after City lost to Arsenal in GW32. De Gea wasn’t the reason United lost to Wigan, Man City & then drew to Everton at Old Trafford.

handelex:
West Ham want to sign Jesse Lingard on a permanent deal, but are concerned with regards to the price tag #mufc will set. United are expected to ask for as much as £30m #mulive

They can have Jesse for £50m plus Declan Rice.

elampiro:
DDG actually cost us the league in 2011. Cost us to exit the league cup in 2014 under Moyes when he let a ball slip under him in about the last kick of the game. His error rates increased recently even with Spain. But still a great goalkeeper, just that we need to find another keeper who is more suitable in the EPL where balls are flying across the six yard box

How did DDG cost us the league in 11/12? Why do you people like changing the narrative to suit an agenda?

United lost the league in 11/12 for many many factors unrelated to DDG.

- Fergie deciding to punish Rooney for breaking a curfew on New Year’s day. We faced Blackburn that day and they beat us 3-2 at Old Trafford(3 points dropped)

- Conceding 2 late goals against Everton after leading 4-2 at Old Trafford. The score was 4-2 until the 82nd minute and the defence capitulated because everyone suddenly forgot to run the time down(2 points dropped)

- Having a stinker against the relegated bound Wigan. United needed to win this game to put a distance between themselves and Man City. Fergie decided to rest Scholes(the only midfielder with common sense) and Rooney and co. fluffed their lines.

If United had taken any of the chances listed above, the league would have been theirs. The Blackburn one was the most painful. Fergie could have fined Rooney instead of preventing him from playing against Blackburn.

Expert17:
Nice assist from Adama Traore

My guy don run edit post

Some people have no shame.

Joezinho:
Olesexuals like alabimumu and handedunce will tell us that Ole Gollum sent Lingard to West Ham to deny Chelsea and Liverpool Champions League football next season.

Sad reminder to the ole inners that Ole chose to keep Dan James at the club over Lingard because, unlike the former, the latter wasn't recommended by some sister-in-law shagging preeq..

Brilliant!

Joezinho:
So Riola want 30 mil a year salary for Haaland, plus 20 mil for him and 20 mil for Haalands dad.
Plus 150 mil transfer fee.Riola gets 20% of that
Omo!!!

Please football, just for once, tell them all to piss off and pretend none of them exist.

We wouldn’t be in this predicament had Ole convinced him enough to join United last year.

What sort of a manager can’t convince his former player to join him in a new club?

Almajirihunter:
Bros I no give you weapon for agenda o
But look at his contribution to the second goal, not a bad player at all

This is no agenda - the fact speaks for itself.

Lingard was doing this under Mourinho - he even got a world cup invitation as a result of his performance in 17/18 & then Ole arrived......

Almajirihunter:
Omo see Lingard

Olesexuals would disagree with you. Lingard is scoring worldies in every other game for the Hammers while we are saddled with liabilities like James & Martial.

Solskjaer is a lunatic.

Expert17:
Stop spreading false information.

In the last press conference, OLE told us he has two no 1s at the club.

The same OLE gave DDG 6 weeks leave, OLE wants him to leave don't push this on media.

The media play a part in these things. They control the narrative. When Romero was #2 and De Gea was making his silly mistakes, there was no push by the media to make Romero #1. You know why? Because they have no interest in Romero, he’s not British.

As soon as you have a British player as #2, the media cannot wait to start an agenda on how to push the #1 out. We have seen this time and time again. You need to see the vitriol coming from the media when Chelsea sacked Lampard for Tuchel.

British media will always back British talents. Nothing is Maguire’s fault. All we keep hearing is how he needs to be playing alongside another defender but if you think back - he was supposedly the £80m solution needed to solve the defensive crisis when he was bought.

They move the goalposts every time - they have no shame. This is why they don’t do well in international competitions. The urge to push bottom tier players to the forefront just because they are British or English is one reason they will never win any international trophy in decades to come.

handelex:
For the first time since Fergie, we'll finish consecutively in the top 4. We need CL every season, it's progress.

That has nothing to do with Ole, BTW. It’s the incremental addition of quality here and there & the partial collapse of many of our rivals that is giving Ole a bit of leeway.

The squad we have today should be doing better than when we had Jones/Smalling in the defence. Moyes, LVG, etc would have also achieved top 4 consecutively with this squad. Let’s stop giving undue credits to a PE teacher.

handelex:
Lol Arithmetic progression in football We should include mental and verbal reasoning too.
Community Shield is now a bragging right? Lol
Hopefully we go all the way and win the EL this season.
Where did all those rebuilding take us to?

Did United fans not celebrate this victory? Did United fans not travel to Wembley to watch this game? Why shouldn’t it be a bragging right especially when it was the champions of England we beat?

We can’t even participate in such events these days. One must win FA cup or PL to play for the community shield. How are we faring in that aspect? Ole’s best shot at it was losing woefully like a bïtch to Leicester and Wolves.

handelex:
I appreciate the cup wins though but they don't tell the whole story. To me it should come as an icing on the cake, not after a cup win, the said team goes into shit immediately. A team should have a solid base where it can compete strongly on all fronts every season, not those flash in a pan type of fluke cup wins.

Ole cannot deliver the PL, he cannot deliver any cup competitions. What exactly is he doing? Even the solid base you are asking from him looks beyond him. Liverpool will not remain the dark forever, City and Chelsea will strengthen. Leicester and West Ham aren’t far behind. Where does that leave Ole?

handelex:
And I'm not dropping any standard to accommodate anybody, Manchester United already dropped their standard.

I agree - United dropped their standard. However, as low as we have sunk, we can still do better than Ole. No club in the top 6 will hire Ole as their manager. Why should United renew his contract?

handelex:
Lol...

The point is are we still that BIG club that should be flogging the likes of PSG home and away when the reality is we getting fûcked by the likes of Sevilla and co?

There should be progress. Ole is pulling this team back.

I am sure you understand arithmetic progression. When Fergie left, we appointed the following managers.

Moyes - Community shield
Van Gaal - FA cup
Mourinho - Community Shield, Europa Cup, League Cup.

PE teacher - ..........................(After almost 3 years)

Arithmetic Progression dictates we should have won at least 3 different cups since the PE teacher was appointed. Even if we haven’t won the league, we should have repeated any of the trophies won by the last 3 managers.

However, we went from winning one or two trophies per season while rebuilding to winning nothing at all. That’s the major gripe with me. There’s no reason this Man Utd team shouldn’t be in the FA cup semis when Southampton FC are there.

Stop dropping your standards to accommodate this fraud.

olabode89:
Chief, you keep showing your lack of knowledge about what Ole achieved with Molde. Ole broke the strangle hold of Rosenberg to win the Norwegian league and the ground work he did when he was in charge is why Molde are a mainstay in Europe for the past 5 years. I hope you know that it is extremely difficult to break the monopoly of big teams in leagues such as the Norwegian league.

Monopoly in a league ranked 22nd in Europe.

You guys just eat whatever vomitus served to you on a plate. How many teams even make up that league you people are hyping?

Ole went back after destroying Cardiff - how did he fare in Norway between 2015 & when Ed Woodward appointed him as a caretaker?

Any takers?

chidexxy007:
So beating Arsenal now is a measure of success or how good the coach is?

It isn’t - losing to Basaksehir is.