₦airaland Forum

muafrika:
To quote Solomon, a lot of vanity. One generation comes up, dies, but not after introducing another to the same vain existence.

Life is a huge crowd of people who find meaning by usury of fellow men to find satisfaction in it, and die never achieving it.

It is like a huge flock of sheep, all doing exactly what the mischevous ones at the fore are. And making it their purpose.

My point exactly. Life is full of crisis,and a confused maze for most. this however NEVER justifies an opting out. The point is on plaetton.

timmy2409:
life
noun
1. the condition that distinguishes animals and plants from inorganic matter, including the capacity for growth, reproduction, functional activity, and continual change preceding death. "the origins of life"
synonyms: existence, being, living, animation; More
antonyms: death, nonexistence

living things and their activity. "some sort of life existed on Mars"
synonyms: living things, living beings, living creatures, the living;

vitality, vigor, or energy. "she was beautiful and full of life"
synonyms: vivacity, animation, liveliness, vitality, verve, high spirits, exuberance, zest, buoyancy, enthusiasm, energy, vigor, dynamism, elan, gusto, brio, bounce, spirit, fire; More

2. the existence of an individual human being or animal. "a disaster that claimed the lives of 266 Americans"
synonyms: person, human being, individual, soul

No need to thank me

thank you, you have being very kind.

Bidam:
Ok, i know you love running away from question that are difficult for your paygrade.Here is a teaser...What do you understand by weightier matters of the Law in mat 23:23? Are christians obligated to keep or neglect them?

Why is it you never condemned apostle paul when he used the mosaic law in 1cor 9:13-14. To teach christian doctrine on giving to ministers of the gospel?

Ayam waiting!

Goshen360:
Open another thread and lemme slowly school you in the Spirit.....If you will learn anyway. I had wanted to do this kind of teaching to you in my mind but time does permit me to teach it intensively. Although I mentioned in faintly in some comments, even when you often quote: Does the Law not say the same thing? We uphold the law etc. You are always holding these scripture to teach the law to Christians but you don't investigate the text and you just jumping.....slow down dude, slow down....

Jay Jay Okocha! Yes, the man is in our midst. See him turning 360.

Luk 4:17 And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Isaiah. And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written,
Luk 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor;

The good news is the gospel to the poor. There is good news for the poor, there is hope, there is a way out. God will make a way. What is good news to the poor? What is news to the poor? Poverty is not good news. Divine provision is good news. My God shall supply all your needs according to His RICHES, this is good news. God wants His people to be free from sin, living in victory, and not bound by their circumstances. the Master is Master over the storm, the silver and gold are still His. #the Good News

MarkMiwerds:
Hebrews does say that Jesus is after the order of Melchizedek. I am not blind to that. But is Jesus on the Earth today in person to receive tithes of the brethren? Of course not!

But notice also in Hebrews 7:5, that it is the sons of Levi who God says are to receive the tithes... Levites are to take God's holy tithes, not pastors who are not of the lineage and dscendancy of Levi.

It is not I who is displaying the blindness you speak of. You have three of your own fingers pointing back at you.

Is Jesus the Christian's High Priest? Are christians priests? If Melchisedek received tithe 'without commandment', what hinders others? Are we under commandment (the law).?
I trust you would answer these questions straight and plainly before shifting the goal.

Goshen360:
No, put it this way:

Melchi rained and threaten Abraham with curse of Malachi in order for Abraham to give pay tithe. Mechi promised Abraham open heaven in so much that there will not be room to contain it. All of these Melchi did "in the order of Jesus" or as if it was Jesus doing it to those he died to take away their curses and redeem, those he blessed in Him in His finished works.

Oh, I just remember now, God must receive His tithe with a representative on earth, no wonder these Pastors like you are "representative of Christ as High priest" and they are threatening with curse from God....Just the Melchi in the order of Christ did to Abraham.

The goal post was that only Levites can take tithes (with an hint on even the present day). I scored that goal post using Melchisedek as top striker. Stop the callous attempt to shift the goal post.

Bidam:
Gombs, who God has blessed no man can curse, i wonder why his paranoia.

He's afraid because of the mbaemeka incidence, where he almost had an accident after insisting for long that mba cursed him. He doesn't know that as a man thinks in his heart, so is he, and that words are powerful. He thinks that is just old Testament and prosperity gospel junk.

vooks:
Image123 has the guts to joke about blindness with MarkMiwerds a physically blind man.

I wasn't joking, don't assume vaguely.

MarkMiwerds:
of men, it is the Levites who are to receice the tithes. They are the only representatives on Earth to whom God gave authority to take tithes for the House of God.

Blindness to the truth is more detrimental than blindness to color.

Again, Melchisedek wasn't levite. Jesus the High Priest of priests is of the order of Melchisedek not Aarons. Your blindness to this simple point is pitiable.

dorox:
The above statement is mean and insensitive. To take such a cheap shot at someone who is physically blind says a lot about the kind of person you really are.

No it isn't, and you will do well to not complain. Most of the antitithers here are blind in the sense that i used the word. Experience has taught that it really is no use telling them that the sky is blue.

Hahahahahahaha, na Jesus go come settle the thing oh, the way i dey see am.

debosky:
Hehehehe Jesus will come back before this tithe matter will be put to bed. Una well done!

plaetton:
Op,
Why do you automatically think that someone migrating away from Christianity has serious issues ?
I mean, by asking or suggesting that, are not yourself perpetuating the myth that religion is about magically solving human problems?

People migrate away from Christianity because Christianity suffers from a crisis of meaning.
J B Joshua Christianity is different from Pope Francis Christianity, which is different from cherubim and sarafim Christianity, which is different from Oyaks Christianity ( God needs your money Christianity ), which is different from the Christianity of the pastor kissing the naked asses of women on a beach in the name Christianity.

Crisis of meaning.
Christianity had its golden age when churchmen were the definers of reality to a blind and frightened humanity.
To the still blind and frightened, Christianity is still relevant.
But once a person recognizes the contradictions of stone age myths in an information age, the curtains come down, allowing individuals to have mental sovereignty.

So I reiterate, crisis of meaning is what Christianity suffers.

What is the meaning of life?

MarkMiwerds:
you are right... God's Word do not change. Now, tell us who God's Word says are to receive His holy tithes?

God, He receiveth them. Will a man rob God?
Oh, the nanny advice. No point telling a blind man that the sky is blue.

italo:
Pls can you answer the above? This is the third time I'm asking and you keep pretending you didnt see.

It will help me show how your doctrine is false.

Thanks.

you are calling my views on this thread doctrine, but when i call the catholic views out, you will say they are opinions and catholics can have personal opinion. you are one funny little Roman Catholic.

You would consider anyone who disagrees with you on any of those points above, not a member of the Church. Yes or no?

No, why should i? It's not my duty to be considering who is a member and who is not a member.

You're saying only disagreement with Image123's understanding of the "salient issues" disqualifies one from being part of The Church.

Again NO, i have never said that.

Because you still cant show where the Bible says what issues are "salient" and can keep you out ofthe Church and which issues cannot keep you out. Even the example you gave of Jesus rubbishes your position. Jesus says love of God and neighbour are the greatest commandments, yet you omitted these in your list of salient issues. Paul and Barnabas had no disagreement a doctrinal issue.

1Co 10:23 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not.

You are saying The Church can teach falsehood on non-salient issues? Yes or no.

No, i am saying two people might have differing understanding of the same issue. Do you have the same understanding that Ronaldo has about soccer? Is your position falsehood or his? Do you have the same opinion with Obama on health policies? Whose is the falsehood?

italo:
Why are you avoiding my question?

The hundreds of thousands of Protestant communities and the millions of "non-denominational Christians" in the world have different contradictory doctrines. Yes or no?

i'm not avoiding your question, i have answered it already. i have only tried and laboured to show you the big beam in your eye. The Catholics have different doctrines and teachings which you call opinions and which you claim that you are permitted to hold. Why are you permitted to hold differing opinions in your one denomination, but have a problem with other denominations having differing opinions/doctrines?

Then show me a Catholic doctrine that is contradictory to the one I stated

i just did. The teaching on gay marriage. Different catholics hold different views on it and hence would teach differently on it.

I never said there are no contradictory views among Catholics. Infact I said the Church permits us to hold personal opinions on issues not definitively taught by the Church. The issue I raised, and which PastorAIO tried to set you straight on, is CHURCH DOCTRINE, not personal views or opinions. You are just deliberately dishonestly trying to blur the line between the two...and flip-flopping.
I have shown you how you Protestants hold contradictory Church doctrines.

You cannot show me two contradictory Catholic doctrines. Because you can't find any.

You call yours views and opinions, but other denominations own are doctrines. Its all the same. Your doctrine is basically your teaching, your view on a subject. i prefer to dwell on the unity, while you choose to enlarge the separation. i'm not interested in tearing down the Catholic church or pointing out your doctrines. However, even a casual search would show differing doctrines and views. Watch this video for instance, it's short about 5mins. It shows contradictory and contradicting popes. Your popes, from the same denomination, hving differing doctrines. Yet, you are all over because different denomination A has different opinion/doctrine from denomination B.

Everyone, even Atheists and Satanists can hold any opinions they like.

But God's Church cannot teach contradictory doctrines.

Why not? The church is made up of BRETHREN. Brethren can hold different understanding, likes and dislikes. It doesn't make them not of the same blood. i may never in my life marry the kind of wife my brother married or do the kind of career or treat my money the way he treats his etc. He is still my brother. God is not asking for uniformity on paper but for unity.
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ:
Eph 4:13 This will continue until we are united by our faith and by our understanding of the Son of God. Then we will be mature, just as Christ is, and we will be completely like him.

There is not yet unity of the faith, understanding, or knowledge. We do not all know the same thing or have equal revelation. If you cannot understand this simple and straight fact, i might need to pray for you, and perhaps wash you at the river or something.

E.g If Martin Luther claimed to teach by the Holy Spirit that Mary was a perpetual virgin and majority of protestant communities claim to teach by the Holy Spirit that Mary was not, they cannot both be correct. Somebody is lying against the Spirit.

Catholic teaching is one...all over the world.

On paper. What is your relationship with the virgin Mary. Do you worship Virgin Mary?

I have not said Christ Embassy is not Church yet. I only asked you by what Spirit the "Church" teaches contradictions. Holy or Evil?

Not everything is done by Spirit, else there would be no point exhorting people to Walk in the Spirit or not be carnal.

It is about prayer...and prayer cannot be divorced from eternal life.

So, should women cover their heads then? If they don't, are they endangering their eternal life status?

Yes. Not all THINGS are expedient. But it doesn't say "not all (Christian doctrines) are expedient. In fact, Paul elsewhere commanded the Philippians (Phil 4:9) to do all they had seen and heard him do and teach. He didn't distinguish between salient and non-salient. You cant find a backing for this your heresy that the Church guided by the Holy Spirit can teach lies when the issue is non salient.

Phi 1:9 And this I pray, that your love may abound yet more and more in knowledge and in all judgment;
The Philippians would have to grow to that stage. In that period of growth, there will still be a gap or difference.

You can find them anywhere. Even if you find them in the Church, it wouldn't mean their false teaching is Church teaching.

If my Parish Priest teaches that Jesus is not God and insists on it, that would make him, not the Catholic Church false.

If the visible church can be false then how can we identify the true Church...since we all learnt what "Church" is from a visible entity...which could be false.

It is not your duty to go about identifying the true church. Do the best you can with the help of God's Spirit. You may never find the true church(if what you seem to refer to is denomination).

italo:
Acts 15:7 After there had been much debate, Peter stood up and said to them, “My brothers, you know that in the early days God made a choice among you, that I should be the one through whom the Gentiles would hear the message of the good news and become believers. 8 And God, who knows the human heart, testified to them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as he did to us; 9 and in cleansing their hearts by faith he has made no distinction between them and us. 10 Now therefore why are you putting God to the test by placing on the neck of the disciples a yoke that neither our ancestors nor we have been able to bear? 11 On the contrary, we believe that we will be saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, just as they will.”

12 The whole assembly kept silence, and listened to Barnabas and Paul as they told of all the signs and wonders that God had done through them among the Gentiles. 13 After they finished speaking, James replied, “My brothers, listen to me. 14 Simeon has related how God first looked favorably on the Gentiles, to take from among them a people for his name. 15 This agrees with the words of the prophets, as it is written,

16 ‘After this I will return,
and I will rebuild the dwelling of David, which has fallen;
from its ruins I will rebuild it,
and I will set it up,
17 so that all other peoples may seek the Lord—
even all the Gentiles over whom my name has been called.
Thus says the Lord, who has been making these things 18 known from long ago.’
19 Therefore I have reached the decision that we should not trouble those Gentiles who are turning to God, 20 but we should write to them to abstain only from things polluted by idols and from fornication and from whatever has been strangled and from blood. 21 For in every city, for generations past, Moses has had those who proclaim him, for he has been read aloud every sabbath in the synagogues.”

The Council’s Letter to Gentile Believers
22 Then the apostles and the elders, with the consent of the whole church, decided to choose men from among their members and to send them to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas. They sent Judas called Barsabbas, and Silas, leaders among the brothers, 23 with the following letter: “The brothers, both the apostles and the elders, to the believers of Gentile origin in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia, greetings. 24 Since we have heard that certain persons who have gone out from us, though with no instructions from us, have said things to disturb you and have unsettled your minds, 25 we have decided unanimously to choose representatives and send them to you, along with our beloved Barnabas and Paul, 26 who have risked their lives for the sake of our Lord Jesus Christ. 27 We have therefore sent Judas and Silas, who themselves will tell you the same things by word of mouth. 28 For it has seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to impose on you no further burden than these essentials: 29 that you abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols and from blood and from what is strangled and from fornication. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell.”

Was any opposition to this Church teaching tolerated?

Act 16:3 Him would Paul have to go forth with him; and took and circumcised him because of the Jews which were in those quarters: for they knew all that his father was a Greek.

Was Timothy told no further burden than the essentials?

Hiswordxray:
You two still sees things carnally, you are not seeing things through God's eyes.
The church in Corinth was filled with gossiping, strife, incest, conflict, disagreement, adultery, gluten, jealousy, disorder etc. But look at what Paul said "some of you were once like that. But you were cleansed; you were made holy; you were made right with God by calling on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of God." (1Cor 6:11).

So, you call us carnal for discussing, then afterwards you throw in your own part of the discuss? Anyway, read these.
Act 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.
Act 17:17 Therefore disputed he in the synagogue with the Jews, and with the devout persons, and in the market daily with them that met with him.

Paul called this sinful people holy, that is outrageous. But that is not all, in the verses before verse 11 Paul listed all kind of sinful people like adulterers etc. OK tell me who is an adulterer, of cause someone who commit adultery and the church in Corinth commit adultery (if you don't believe me read the rest of that same chapter 6) but yet Paul went on to say they were once like that.
A right minded person will say this people are terrible sinners and Paul is a fool who doesn't know what he is saying. How can Paul see sinners and called them holy people? The answer is that Paul saw them through God's eyes.

Oh duhhh, you just said it yourself. They WERE, past tense.

"Even before he made the world, God loved us and chose us in Christ to be holy and without fault in his eyes." (Eph 1:4).
In God's eyes they are holy, blameless, faultless and perfect. And the is how Paul saw them because God is true and he never lies.

Yep, and Jesus paid the price for our forgiveness more than 2000years ago. When did you receive it, was it not after you repented? The gift is GIVEN by God, and RECEIVED by man. Don't mix it.

Therefore the Church is holy, God created the Church without sin and sin has never existed in the Church. There is nothing false or evil in the Church for she is pure. The Church has no doctrine because she is a body that simply expresses the life of Christ. A body does not need doctrine to function.

Should i laugh or cry?

I know these statement seems confusing and you may not understand it but God is true and it is wise to trust the judgment of God.
If you could see the Church through God's eyes you will see are true beauty,glory and victory.

So stop this argument it only shows how carnal you two are. But instead grow up, behave the children of God because that is who you are. I have never heard God arguing with somebody before but instead he only speaks when necessary. Behave like your father and stop acting like dead carnal people.

So, you gave us your opinion on the OP which should not be queried or questioned, else we are carnal. Then you depart, easy.

Candour:


I'm an engineer friend. a process engineer who works with process systems when everybody else has gone to sleep and i'm right at my duty post even now. I use people like you to keep awake actually. My colleagues unwind with booze and other vices, i make do with bible studies and discussions mostly online but also with colleagues here interested and NL falls into that category.

@the bolded. Keep sneaking up at night to sow tares while good men have gone to sleep, i'll be waiting

Hahahahahahahahaha, i can't shout.

WinsomeX:
Gombs, if you really want a discussion on tithes I can engage you. I will only request that you remain on the subject and reduce the theatrics. My answer:

can you engage moi, funny. i had this funny recall of you(or was it your other version) swearing with hands raised to heaven never to talk with me on tithes ever again. i do not recall it well well. Tithemalice.

Regardless what some may make of my position on tithes here, my position really is that of liberty. Tithe if you want to and don't tithe, if you care. I only insist that no one should teach it as a Christian doctrine and no one should be manipulated to tithe. The truth is that the moment tithes is exposed for it truly is, people quite naturally stop tithing. This is what tithers call stopping people from tithing; which we on the other hand simply call exposing the truth behind the biblical tithes.

Am i at liberty to tithe without your hassles and queries? Is any random brother or sister at liberty to tithe without your asking them trip questions that you refused to learn the answers and use to deliberately lure and MANIPULATE others?

Sometimes I think those who are for or against tithing get it wrong because what we casually call a "tithe" is not the bible tithe. The moment the true nature of the tithe is exposed, the whole practice begin to fall apart. Leviticus 27:30-33 reveal the biblical tithes:

Leviticus 27:30 And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the LORD's: it is holy unto the LORD.... 27:32 And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passeth under the rod, the tenth shall be holy unto the LORD.

The bible tithe is fruit of tree, seed of the ground and tenth of the herd. What you call tithes today, a tenth of your salary, is not the tithes of the bible.

Duhhhhhhhh, what of the Bible Adam, or the Bible meat, or the Bible bread. Rubbish.

If you however insist that tithes is 10% and 10% of anything is tithes, I will again have to point to you that that practice of tithing is obsolete according to the NT. If you must tithe, as some claim they imitate tithing before the law, then you must answer the reason behind some other pre-law practices that are no longer observed in church: Genesis 2, said God rested from his works, initiating the practice of the sabbath. When Jesus came, he showed clearly that he was the Lord of the sabbath and his disciples flouted sabbath rules with reckless abandon. Paul also warns against such defunct observance, Col 2:16:

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Obsolete where? What sabbath rules were flouted with reckless abandon? Do you just juggle words together?

Then there is circumcision. Clearly said to be an eternal covenant with God's people in Gen 17. Galatians 5:1-4 shows us that anyone finding acceptance with God through circumcision had fallen from grace. We have burnt offering and various rituals that preceded the law. All of this have no place in the NT. How come did Abram once and for all tithing of war spoil become a standard for Christians? The answer is simple: the tithing according to Abraham is a theological copout to legitimize fraud in the church. If it must be practised, Christians should tithe once and tithe only of war spoils.

There they go, once and for all. How many times did Abraham offer burnt offerings?

Tithing according to the law does not hold water and thankfully many tithers try not to go to the law to justify their tithing. Rom 10:4; Heb 8:13.

How does it not hold water, yet that is what you spend your time arguing that NT believers must do if they tithe? You want us to do stuff that do not hold water?

Now, I find it interesting that tithers are the ones playing the victim now, saying people are forcing them not to tithe. The truth is that it is people who do not tithe that are being insisted upon to tithe in real life. Many have been chased away from their local churches because of their position on tithe; many have been demonized and vilified for their bold position against this illegality; outside this faceless forum, very few people can speak up against tithes without being seen as accursed individuals; etc.

Are you not forcing people not to tithe? Are you not the one asking that we MUST answer the reason? Is NL not real life, is it a game? Would you allow me to teach tithes in your new church? Have you not called us IRREDEEMABLE for tithing? What is the difference between being demonized and being pronounced irredeemable and condemned? Hypopo

The reality is that non tithers are vilified not because they insist that people shouldn't tithe; rather they are demonized because they insist that church people should have liberty to use their resources for whatever they wish, including not paying a tithe on it. However a clergy system that has benefitted from the tithes will have non of it.


Gombs, I am not insisting on anyone not to tithe; I am only insisting on the true biblical tithe be preached and that men be given the liberty scripture has given us to use our resources for whatever we wish to use it for, 2 Cor 9:7:

2 Corinthians 9:7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.

The same so called true biblical tithe that you just stated doesn't hold water? Habaaaaa. i will give my tithe after the 2Corinthians 9v7 order until Jesus comes. Lemme see you stop me from entering heaven for that.

BabaGnoni:
Whatever floats your boat

i don't have a boat. Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe, Gnoni.

Candour:
He has come again.....he has come again.....Father he has come again......Holy Ghost he has come again...

Image, Dem send you?

Oh, there he is AGAIN. Brother, do you live here?

Candour:
Quit posting nonsense in your desperate search for attention like someone with a broken Psyche. Wise men who have your problem seek for the professional help they need.......or contain themselves with proper attention at home.

i wasn't going to grace you with a reply but i pitied your condition yet again. You've got to be kidding or fooling around to accuse any other of searching for attention. Is it not the same Candour who walks up and down on NL looking for who will mention him? i sent in my post in the early a.m and there you were quick to reply. That has being the trend and you know it. So, we know who is not being attended to. Get professional help if you can, mba can help you if you can't afford one. i will help you ask him if you cannot. Wise men still seek Jesus.

BabaGnoni:
"I can't make sense of what you typed. Mind using plainer english? Be presentable. Be original" - © Gombs

In other words, you want me to teach you what to say a la candour stylee?

WinsomeX:
Based on these "charges", I plead GUILTY and
I have no apologies for them.

If, according to you, the above is WX attacking the liberty of people to tithe, then I agree with you and Bidam that I do attack people's liberty to tithe and still have no apologies for it.

You denied until caught black-handed as it were, apologies are worthless without repentance.

Gombs:
Provide me a more truer gospel, and I'd listen to you. Till then

talk about HITTING the NAIL on the HEAD. Are you a brother to the Son of the carpenter?

BabaGnoni:
Would you put a defective and loaded gun into the hands of a minor?
This is what WoF indoctrination(s) does and it leads many impressionable, unsuspecting, gullible, easily influenced, vulnerable old & young, into debts, bankruptcy, worse off financial mess, less prosperous, unfulfilled expectations etcetera
Only a wicked lying through their teeth person will not acknowledge this

Wetin i talk, wetin you talk? Did vooks just do the "Name it claim it" world famous(according to that u people's thread success dreams)?

muskeeto and co, where are you oh.

Gombs:

Name it and claim it shey?

Cc:
WinsomeX and the board members

Yes oh brother, name it claim it. When they do it, its nothing. When others do it, its WoF and heretic. They know not, neither do they understand.

vooks:
Luke 6:28 Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
28 bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you.

Just following Jesus Christ

You too are blessed my broda, and am sorry for calling you a woman. It was an honest mistake and I hope you found it in your heart to forgive me. I just learnt that the 'm' and 'f' behind monikers represent gender

It was the "not your portion" part i referred to. Apologies accepted though i wasn't offended, i just showed the inconsistency. I guess that was done harshly, sorry about that.

vooks:
I have not at any time mocked those who tithe.

And the graves were opened, and many bodies which slept arose, Amen.

vooks:
You are blessed my brother. Schizophrenia is not your portion

Is this positive confession? WoF admirer alert.

Bidam:
Reductio ad absurdum, looked it up not in my bible.

Lol