₦airaland Forum

ogajim:
Joe,
A real Christian ought to have the anointment of God upon him/her and if not, something is wrong. God's anointment is not reserved only for the so called MOGs,
"He who have ears, let him hear", we Server God through our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, serve no man. Our father is in Heaven and not in Nigeria, USA, UK or any other place.

aletheia:
1. I have noticed that you are very evasive when challenged on your views.
Question: So who is a priest of the order of Melchisedec? Hint: Hebrews 6:20
Is there now another set of priests over the body of Christ to whom we must render tithes.

The answer is simple . The pastors, prophets etc are the priests to recieve on the behalf of Christ our highpriest. They are the 5fold ministry gift given to perfect the body of christ

Numbers 18:7
Therefore thou and thy sons with thee shall keep your priest's office for every thing of the altar, and within the vail; and ye shall serve: I have given your priest's office unto you as a service of gift: and the stranger that cometh nigh shall be put to death.

Ephes. 4:8
Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men. , vs 12
And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; [12] For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

you may say "but we are all priests in the new testament, Yes we are, but there are priests over priests. we are all anointed but some are anointed over the anointed. Everybody in israel were priests too but some were anointed priest over others.

Exodus 19:6
[b]And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel. [/b]

That is why Paul could recieve money sent to him as a burnt offering. Money is our medium of exchange now.

Philip. 4:18
But I have all, and abound: I am full, having received of Epaphroditus the things which were sent from you, [b]an odour of a sweet smell, a sacrifice acceptable, wellpleasing to God. [/b]

The pastors are the priests .

@ KunleOshob and his disciples
my concerns for you goes beyond the issue of tithing, we are free to hold different opinions.it is not a new thing. The early church had doctrinal differences.
Romans 14:3
   Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.

But to now enter into name calling and judgementalism is wrong.You are free to hold your opinion. you are free to present it but not to condemn others for refusing to see from your point of veiw.if you feel you are right just pray and leave the matter to God

Romans 14:4-5
   Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand. [5] One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

Paul had doctrinal differences with James and peter. it didnt result into abuses and name calling. theif crook, scam etc.
The most pathetic of all is the gut to insult pastors. Kai! what on earth.

Matthew 22:29
   Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.
You really err in this area. Even Paul when he was provoked and he insulted the highpriest repented.even though the highpriest was in error

Acts 23:2-5
   And the high priest Ananias commanded them that stood by him to smite him on the mouth. [3] Then said Paul unto him, God shall smite thee, thou whited wall: for sittest thou to judge me after the law, and commandest me to be smitten contrary to the law? [4] And they that stood by said, Revilest thou God's high priest? [5] Then said Paul, I wist not, brethren, that he was the high priest: for it is written, Thou shalt not speak evil of the ruler of thy people.

A man of God may make a mistake as human but it is not our place to judge him but rather pray for him. Moaes once made a mistake by marrying a black woman as against the law. His Elder brother Aaron (highriest ) and his elder sister Myriam(prophetess) mumured and gossiped

Numbers 12:1-
   And Miriam and Aaron spake against Moses because of the Ethiopian woman whom he had married: for he had married an Ethiopian woman. ,
   , And the Lord spake suddenly unto Moses, and unto Aaron, and unto Miriam, Come out ye three unto the tabernacle of the congregation. And they three came out, and he said ,  wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses? [9] And the anger of the Lord was kindled against them,

im sure we know the judgement that followed after. Miriam became leprous!. Till today the same thing goes for anyone that speak against Gods anointed

1 Chron. 16:22
   Saying, Touch not mine anointed, and do my prophets no harm.

even angel micheal knew better

Jude 1:8-10
   Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities. [9] Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee. [10] But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.

2 Peter 2:10-11
   But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities. [11] Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation against them before the Lord.

Angels knows better by respecting authority .So if youre having a hay day insulting men of God , think of the effect.

HE THAT HATH AN EAR LET HIM HEAR

He asked simple questions that you all avoided

Even if it was part of the law it doesn't make a difference. Worship only one God was part of the law but did worship go away with the law? NO! Because this is beyond law . It's a fundamental principle.

@ KunleOshob, pastor AIO and their clique
What some of you guys dont realise is that you are being used of the enemy(satan) deliberately or indeliberately.This his era of economic meltdown also mark the era of economic meltdown is also the era of prosperity for Gods people.The only way satan can achieve his purpose in Gods children is to attack the foundation of our giving to God ,either tithe or offering etc. in history people of God always surfive financial crisis with testimonies.

Some of the Men of God that youre attacking today had warned us about this time as far back as 2002. bishop Oyedepo/ pastor Chris oyakhilome, Apostle Genga, etc. Someone also told me TB Joshua prophesied it. They warned that after 7 years there would be financial crisis world wide just as in the bible days

Acts 11:28
And there stood up one of them named Agabus, and signified by the spirit that there should be great dearth throughout all the world: which came to pass in the days of Claudius Caesar.

[b]Genesis 41:54
And the seven years of dearth began to come, according as Joseph had said: and the dearth was in all lands; but in all the land of Egypt there was bread. [/b]

according to their prophecies the7 years ended 2008. We were not suprised at all and for your information the crisis will go on for the next 7 years! dont believe what wallstreet is teeling you. it is not a new thing but God always reveal things to come.

Amos 3:7
Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets.

Now for those of you always attacking pastors You can see what spirit is moving you. What a world are we going to have without men of God.

All the era of crisis in our modern days , tithers always survive with testimony. I have a book of several testimony in and out of economic depression. I will just share few with you because of space.

, "Are you aware that many men who found some of today’s great companies were godly men who were faithful tithers? Let’s look at some of their inspiring stories.

QUAKER OATS COMPANY
Does the name Henry P Crowell sound familiar to you? How about the company he founded-Quaker Oats? While yet a young man, Crowell heard a sermon by Dwight L. Moody. He made a remarkable commitment to the Lord. He said ‘ I can’t be a preacher, but I can be a good businessman.’ He prayed ‘if you would let me make money, I will use it in your service.’ He bought a little run-down mill called Quaker Mill. Not only did he faithfully tithe but it is reported that he gave far beyond the tithe and funded the Lord’s work for over forty years.

COLGATE PALMOLIVE COMPANY
Who hasn’t heard of the Colgate Palmolive Company? Do you know that a tither found it? William Colgate left home when he was just a teenager. He felt that his father was too poor to keep him. With his only belongings tied in a bundle, he met an old canal boat captain. He confided to the captain that he was leaving home to lessen the financial burden on his parents. He explained to the old man that the only trade he knew was soap and candle making. The old captain knelt and prayed for the lad and then looked him in the eyes and said, someone will soon be the leading soap maker in New York. It can be you. Be a good man, give your heart to Christ, pay the Lord all that belongs to Him, make an honest soap, give a full pound and I’m certain you’ll be a prosperous and rich man. Those words apparently made a strong impression on him.
He tithed from the first dollar he made as an employee. Soon he was made partner of the company he worked for and ultimately became the owner of the business. He, like Henry Crowell gave far beyond the tithe. It is reported that his giving grew from 20% to 30% to 40% to 50% and finally he was giving all his income. He gave millions to the Lord’s work. Think about that.

JOHN D. ROCKEFELLER Sr
Some of today’s well known wealthy families initially gave their wealth when the patriarchs of the family committed to tithing. Take the Rockefellers as an example. Listen to John D Rockefeller Sr’s own words.
Yes, I tithe, and I would like to tell you how it all came about. I had to begin work as a small boy to help support my mother. My first wages amounted to $1.50 per week. The first week after I went to work, I took the $1.50 home to my mother and she held the money in her lap and explained to me that she would be happy if I would give a tenth of it to the Lord. I did, and from that week until this day I have tithed on every dollar God has entrusted to me. And I want to say, if I had not tithed on the first dollar I made, I would not have tithed on the first million dollars I made. Today’s the heirs of many of this great industrialist may have wondered far from the principles that created such enormous wealth and influence. Many of their companies are now publicly held and the stock holders don’t have a clue that they are still reaping the harvest of the righteous acts of their founders. To sustain such success and blessing, there need to be a rediscovering of the principle of putting God first and building a business as a way of seeking the kingdom of God.

R.G leTourneau  (INVENTOR OF CATERPILLER MACHINES)
My father was actually impressed by R.G leTourneau. R.G leTourneau was the creator and manufacturer of giant earth moving machinery. As my dad will receive the offerings at the church he pastured, he was fond of referring to R.G leTourneau as a man who could not out give God. Before the end of his illustrious career, this manufacturer will reverse the percentages and give God 90% and retain 10% for himself.
I remember that my parents receive regular publications from the charitable foundation R.G leTourneau started and funded with 90% of the stock of his corporation. Each month the publication will show pictures of the monster machines, some weighing as much as 200,000 pounds and each newsletter incorporated tithing because R.G leTourneau contributed his great success to it. Before his death in 1969, he had contributed millions and millions of dollars to the work of God worldwide.

OTHER NOTABLE TITHERS
We could go on and on and list names like J.L. Kraft Cheese Company, Wallace Johnson, the founder of holiday inns, or the founder of welchs grape juice. Each of these Godly businessmen was committed to tithing and I firmly believe that was the key to their outstanding success and legacy.
When the issue of tithing as applied to the small business is raised, many opinions abound. Often the small business operator is left in a dilemma. Should he or she tithe on gross revenues, net profit, salary taken or taxable gain?

Kenneth hagin once shared a testimony of the depression how a christian farmer went to his pastor because his coton farm refuse to bud even though it was ripe , they needed to harvest it before the rain that was coming.If it rains .the whole farm would be destroyed . it was like that allover the town but the pastor asked him " do you pay your tithe ? the man said yes, The pastor asked him for the tithe card, those days they use cards in churches and the pastor signs in when they pay. So the pastor went with him into the middle of the cotton farm he raised the tithe card up and said "lord you promise to rebuke the devourer, this card is the evidence that this man is a tither.the pastor was not done speaking when they began to hear cracking noise all over the farm! the whole farm turned white! . the cooton budded. other farms were destroyed by the rain.

Men of God are people to listen to in times like this. remember elijah and the widow (1king 17) .Pharaoh was wise to listen to joseph. whatever spirit that is moving you guys makes you attack every know pastor and discredit them. but we are wiser than that. if you guys are wise you had better join the band wagon of givers. so that you can survive this crisis. It will last for seven years. We were told 7 years ago ask anybody. i dont mean from your blind clique but those who attend living churches . they will tell you about the prophecy.

FEW YEARS FROM NOW SHALL PROVE WHO IS RIGHT

Worshiping God is not mandatory either. God gave you freewill.Not by force. Those who don't worship God should not be attacking those who are

You guys just talk like children , the bible says be slow to speak be quick to hear. You're dull of hearing but hasty to talk.I said I'm only with my iPhone which means I can't copy verses of scriptures or acess my bibles as I would with my tablet Pc or laptop . To be of a hasty spirit is character of critics!

@kunleOshob
I'm on a trip I'm only using my iPhone to type , I hope to help you out in few days when I get back . You need to know the dept of your error. It is not a tithe issue. You don't descern the body. Spiritual blindnesscis happened to you. That is why you can attack the body of christ so viciously and call men of God thieves , crooks etc. Even Archbishop benson idahosa!

Tithing is not a law matter. It is our worship to God. Jesus fulfiled the law of Moses because they pointed to christ. thereby indirectly abolish the law. But tithe was not a shadow of messiah. So law or no law , our devotion to God continues.
If you don't believe in tithing it's ok. But the insults and name callings are against scriptures . Those who believe in tithing have their biblical reason. Don't call it a scam. Don't call pastors crook. There are several things we may not agree in the bible. It is a sign of immaturity to attack spiritual leaders to proove your points.

in pauls day there are several things they didn't agree. Paul had a different message of liberty. While James , peter believed in works and circumcicion etc. You won't find Paul attacking them on their belief.Calling James juju man and peter Ogboni . At the Jerusalem council he had opportunity to lambast everybody. He only presented his doctrine to them and left. But he had to rebuke peter when peter for hypocricy when they came to his church and tried to impose bondage over them because he has responsibility to protect his sheep.

Going after another mans sheep to polute them is unscripural. More so when you're wrong. Even if you're right. Go and win souls preach the gospel. We have over a thousand issues that we may not agree on now. but one day " We will come in the unity of the faith"

You are dodging the truth. It is not God's reponsibility to do such even though God can do all things. The power of God works with our faith. someone may have just enough faith to heal headache and may not have enough faith to heal H.I.V. . Another may have enough faith to heal H.I.V may not have enough strong faith to raise the dead. or grow out amputated limb. Its not on Gods part. He has given us the name of Jesus to exercise our faith in.
Faith is required on the minster side and faith is required on the recipient of the miacle. That is why in a crusade many may get healed an yet few folks may not receive.
thats what babaijesha was trying to tell you too. that even Jesus could not do mighty miracles in his own hometown,because of the umbelief of his people

Mark 6:5-6
And he could there do no mighty work, save that he laid his hands upon a few sick folk, and healed them. [6] And he marvelled because of their unbelief. And he went round about the villages, teaching.

So where are all the accusers of Pastor Chris now? come back and speak.

akered:
There is a group of people whose diseases have never been cured by any miracle! Maybe God hates this group of people! There has never been any report of any miracle in this group of people. I challenge any 'miracle worker', 'true believer' or 'men of God' to show one case. Just one case is enough! I will become the most ardent follower of that 'man of God' Which group of people? ---AMPUTEES!!!!

You dont need to give a condition for following God or a man God . You follow God because you love him.You follow a man of God because he teaches the word of God.
@ akered
You cant say "if God raise ma grandpa from the dead thats when i will serve him".

An amputee does not need cure of desease. It is a creative miracle they need. Im not aware Jesus recorded such miracle in his ministry on earth. But he promised that we will do greater works than he did.
John 14:12
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

so you may be the guy to "cure the amputees since you have so much passion for them. You dont need a special man of God. Jesus said "he that believeth" So have faith let the amputee have faith too but first ,the two of you must be born again and recieve the holy spirit.

Read the book "gods generals" William marion braham recorded such miracles in his ministry

@tbaba83. You need this brainwashing I tell you.

The guy has answered your question now? God does not hate amputees. Was it God that amputated them? Jesus did not heal everybody in his day. It is those who believe. Tell the Amputees to come to God and seek him by faith.

I am not against prosperity .The gospel is a gospel of prosperity. Poverty is a spirit. God has set us free from bondage of poverty. A poor christian cant help anyone not even himself.  
Salvation is a total package " well being, health deliverance, etc.
Luke 4:18
   The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
The word gospel means Good news. What is Good news to a poor man ? He can be rich. What is good news to the blind He can have sight, To the sick , he can be healed.
The gospel is about fulness of  life , well being .Prosperity .inheritance.

God is in the business of making men rich.The purpose is for us to be a blessing. Not for personal greed.
Genesis 12:2
   And , I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing:

Psalm 35:27
   Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the Lord be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.


The error is when a man receives and refuse to give. It is called covetousness. Giving is a law, especially for the work of God.
David said he would build God a house God said just for that thinking alone ,he would build for David an everlasting house.
God gives special attention to givers in the Kingdom. especially those who sponsor church projects
Luke 7:3-6
   And when he heard of Jesus, he sent unto him the elders of the Jews, beseeching him that he would come and heal his servant. [4] And when they came to Jesus, they besought him instantly, saying, That he was worthy for whom he should do this: [5] For he loveth our nation, and he hath built us a synagogue. [6] Then Jesus went with them,
This man didnt deserve anything because he was gentile, but Jesus changed his mind because the man built a house of worship.
What did God demand for building project even in the wilderness.
Exodus 25:2-3
   Speak unto the children of Israel, that they bring me an offering: of every man that giveth it willingly with his heart ye shall take my offering. [3] And this is the offering which ye shall take of them; gold, and silver, and brass,
Are we going to call Moses thief here for demanding gold? from refugees!

Church money does not belong to Pastor. People give willlingly out of love for God. No pastor forces anybody to give
He only teach what the bible says.
Jesus died for us to prosper.
2 Cor. 8:9
   For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich.

Acts 26:18
   To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

Ephes. 1:18
   The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

Acts 20:32
   And now, brethren, I commend you to God, and to the word of his grace, which is able to build you up, and to give you an inheritance among all them which are sanctified.
The gospel message makes a man rich if he believe.The poor man does not need pity, but teaching .

Luke 4:18
   The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor;
Luke 7:22
   Then Jesus answering said unto them, Go your way, and tell John what things ye have seen and heard; how that the blind see, the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, to the poor the gospel is preached.

One the the things to teach a poor man is ,He must learn to give, To God and to others.
Ephes. 4:28
   Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.

@KunleOshob

Joagbaje:
[/quote][quote author=KunleOshob link=topic=366875.msg5265722#msg5265722 date=1262857042]Mr Agbaje you might learn a thing or two from the scriptures below, peace.

Amplified Bible (AMP)

Passage 1 Timothy 6:3-11:
3But if anyone teaches otherwise and does not assent to the sound and wholesome messages of our Lord Jesus Christ (the Messiah) and the teaching which is in agreement with godliness (piety toward God),

4He is puffed up with pride and stupefied with conceit, [although he is] woefully ignorant. He has a morbid fondness for controversy and disputes and strife about words, which result in (produce) envy and jealousy, quarrels and dissension, abuse and insults and slander, and base suspicions,

5And protracted wrangling and wearing discussion and perpetual friction among men who are corrupted in mind and bereft of the truth, who imagine that godliness or righteousness is a source of profit [a moneymaking business, a means of livelihood]. From such withdraw.

6[And it is, indeed, a source of immense profit, for] godliness accompanied with contentment (that contentment which is a sense of [d]inward sufficiency) is great and abundant gain.

7For we brought nothing into the world, and obviously we cannot take anything out of the world;

8But if we have food and clothing, with these we shall be content (satisfied).

9But those who crave to be rich fall into temptation and a snare and into many foolish (useless, godless) and hurtful desires that plunge men into ruin and destruction and miserable perishing.

10For the love of money is a root of all evils; it is through this craving that some have been led astray and have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves through with many [e]acute [mental] pangs.

11But as for you, O man of God, flee from all these things; aim at and pursue righteousness (right standing with God and true goodness), godliness (which is the loving fear of God and being Christlike), faith, love, steadfastness (patience), and gentleness of heart.

The begginning of the chapter is clear   on who Paul was making reference to "unruling servants" the only verse I know could sumarise your pionts is verse 6-11

KunleOshob:
6[And it is, indeed, a source of immense profit, for] godliness accompanied with contentment (that contentment which is a sense of [d]inward sufficiency) is great and abundant gain.

7For we brought nothing into the world, and obviously we cannot take anything out of the world;

8But if we have food and clothing, with these we shall be content (satisfied).

9But those who crave to be rich fall into temptation and a snare and into many foolish (useless, godless) and hurtful desires that plunge men into ruin and destruction and miserable perishing.

10For the love of money is a root of all evils; it is through this craving that some have been led astray and have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves through with many [e]acute [mental] pangs.

11But as for you, O man of God, flee from all these things; aim at and pursue righteousness (right standing with God and true goodness), godliness (which is the loving fear of God and being Christlike), faith, love, steadfastness (patience), and gentleness of heart.

The first thing we need to understand is that God is against worldliness and I am against worldliness too , but there is difference between prosperity and worldliness . The prosperity of the Christian is having more than enough to reach out to others , Not for gratifying the flesh.

Philip. 3:18-19
(For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ: [19] Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.)

I have several people whos education i am responsible for, nursery,secondary and university. If im just living an average life how will I get to do this? money is merely a servant in our hand. I have empowered some others to start business and be financialy indpendent. Money is a tool.

Many Churches have their different visionss that God gave them. Some are into Prison ministry, Hospital ministry, Tv ministry, Radio ministry and internet ministry, which cost millions . through this outreaches ,they are able to bring the gospel to their homes and offices. Lives are touched. We must support Christian ministries.

Now the problem is a misunderstanding of verse 6.
1 Tim. 6:6
But godliness with contentment is great gain.

contentment is not poverty . It is a state of being . A man that is contented is not moved by either he has or not, just like Paul

Philip. 4:12
I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound: every where and in all things I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need.

But a man that lacks contentment. if You give him millions, he will still not be satisfied.

Eccles. 5:10
He that loveth silver shall not be satisfied with silver; nor he that loveth abundance with increase: this is also vanity.

The bible didnt say "money is the root of evil" as some claim . But it says "the LOVE of money is the root of evil"

People gave to churches that sent missionaries to africa. There is no true pastor that will use church money for himself. There is different between pastor's money and church account. A pastor recieves gifts from people. You cant do anything about that. Most pastors that drives big carss didnt buy them. they were gifts. I have given jeep to my pastor. How will i not appreciate the man that has built my life when the bible clearly taught this.

Gal 6:6 TLB
Those who are taught the word of God should help their teachers by paying them.
Galatians 6:6 KJV
Let him that is taught in the word communicate unto him that teacheth in all good things.

So nobody should be mad at the prosperity of a pastor. They are busy labouring day and night for others if a pastor is a giver he must recieve. It is not every pastor that is recieving money. If he doesnt give he wont receive. It is a law.

But if theres any pastor that misapropriate church funds . It is between him and God . But i can gurantee you ,he wont last long. People's seed to God is holy sacrifice which he prays over. but if he attend to it irrreverently he will die before his time. That was what happened to Eli sons. They saw the meat people offered as "suya" God ended the entire family in one day. It is not your duty or mine to judge such matters .they are too high for you. You dont know the motive of a pastor to judge his action.

Romans 14:4
Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

ofcourse there are false apostle or prophets and teachers. But you cant change them through Nairaland. You only end up distabilizing inocent souls and ridicle the church of christ in the sight of the world and the unconverted. Youre not figthing a just fight. Jesus knows how to purge his church.

Matthew 13:24-30
Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field: [25] But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way. [26] But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also. [27] So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares? [28] He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up? [29] But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. [30] Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Matthew 7:19-22
Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. [20] Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
[21] Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. [22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?


you mostly dwell on verse 22 and 23 of this scripture. but look at the begining of it verse 19.

Matthew 7:19
Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

It is Jesus that does it ,not KunleOshob. You are attacking Christ indirectly without knowing it. If you are born again go out there and win souls to Christ. not attacking those who are spending day and night praying for men to be saved.

John 15:2
Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

Jesus received money from partners , Paul recived money .it is not an sin.We must continualy support church projects.

@KunleOshob
I dont have any issue answering on those scriptures you raised. I asked first are you born again?. If youre born again my response will be different and you are born not born again I have another response. I cant be explainig spiritual things to a man that is not part of the church, what I owe him is explanation of steps to salvation. But i will respont to the scriptures in the next few minutes

@ akindolu
Where is the repport na? I thought youll post it here.

@ KunleOshob
I wish I always have time to attend to you. You're still dodging the question . what is your concept of salvation? Someone has rightly alleged that all you guys that are Anti-miracle ,anti-pastors ,Anti-prosperity on this Forum are Jehovahs witneses . If it's true then you have to get born again first. Because it takes the spirit of God to understand . You don't have the holyghost , you don't believe in the supernatural , you lack the power of the spirit. You mix scriptures together , either delibrately to confuse others so you could win argument. I don't argue . Because I can't argue a man into salvation. God didn't call us to be witnesses of Jehovah! But witneses of Christ resurrection.Jehovahs name can't save ! All power is given to the name of Jesus. Accept the the lordship of Jesus christ you will understand the purpose of his death. He died for our pain , poverty, etc
luke4:18 , " he has anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor,
What the poor need is gospel. You love the poor so much that you force them to by watchtower books. While others are giving gospel materials free. "For God so love the world that he GAVE, " Judas was like that, when they give expensive things to Jesus , will campaing for the poor and the bible has this to say of him
John 12:5,6 , "This he said , not that he cared for the poor but because he was a thief "
givers don't talk or have time to criticise , they give!!. What does your organisation do ? Gather you guys spend your whole day in business centre with bottle of minerals and start typing nonsense about the church of christ. if you're not born again you're not a Christian and you're not part of The church!. You guys planned to use this forum to propagate your false doctrines that has been termed occultic.
If you are genuinly seeking the truth I guaratee you , you will find it. But if you try to confuse maliciously , God will resist you.
" I will build my church and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

We are not complaining. . Ask yourself if everyone behave like you, will the gospel ever reach africa?.While some of you are still arguing over Ten percent to God others are giving all for the gospel. I don't give ten percent as tithe , I feel it's too small I give twenty or sometimes thirty percent. The inventor of Caterpiller machines attributed his success to his tithting. He started with 10% and later 20% before he died he was giving 90%! and only kept 10% for him self and this 10% was in billions! .These are men that were involved in sponsoring bibles all over the world. Let the the poor men be busy attacking the churches ,spend your whole day in business centres typing rubish . Campaingning for other poor people. There's no amount of money you give a poor man that will suffice. It is the gospel that will help the poor and THE POOR MUST GIVE TO GET OUT OF POVERTY!. Anybody busy doing something will not have time to criticise those who are busy.

I don't agree with you on that.
"No weapon formed against thee shall prosper"
BOMB NA WEAPON

@ KunleOshob
Hypocrite! So what's the meaning of your own name "Kunle"? It means something fills the house. You're aware it doesn't stand alone . Either it's OlaKunle ( wealth fills the house) can you see your hypocrisy . But since you hate prosperity I hope it's not. PovertyKunle or Deathkunle . If it is , I simpathise with you . Just change the name. To success or Agbaje !

By the way I want to know what your concept of salvation is
what do you understand by the gospel?
Are you born again.

Pastor AIO:
Mr Agbaje, your name has exposed you! And you will fail in your endeavour. You will not gain a single penny from us here.

childish nonsense. AGBAJE means profit maker. I make and give to God. if the name offend you what you make of Creflo DOLLAR. Im sure it will want to make you run mad. Money is my servant , money serves me. I use money recklessly for the gospel. I have because i give. if youre offended , join the wiining team . stabut get BORN AGAIN first.

@Tonye-t

Tonye-t:
Ttalks,

save us your nursery rhymes and tell us plainly what you can make up with this passage

Matt.23:23 - And Jesus said unto them practise mercy, practise Justice, practise Faithfulness and also do not neglect to practise Tithing (American paraphrased version)

Simple! I m open to learn from the wise-ttalks

I can assure you they wont answer, but rather pretend not to see it and then bring up another irrelivant issue

The bible is clear on how to know false teachers etc : it has to do with their doctrine of salvation what do they profess. Who is christ to you. You are the one acting like a false teacher. You don't have a pastor , You can't understand spiritual things until you're born again ,come out of whatever unspiritual religious organisation .join a living church and submit yourself to a pastor.

afamblondy:
God does not need money ,else he can be classified as a poor God.And if all wealth comes from God why do you have to give it back to him.Is it like recycling money or what?

We dont give to God because he has a need. We dont give to Man of God because he is poor. We give to God for our prosperity.

Psalm 50:9-15
I will take no bullock out of thy house, nor he goats out of thy folds. [10] For every beast of the forest is mine, and the cattle upon a thousand hills. [11] I know all the fowls of the mountains: and the wild beasts of the field are mine. [12] If I were hungry, I would not tell thee: for the world is mine, and the fulness thereof. [13] Will I eat the flesh of bulls, or drink the blood of goats? [14] Offer unto God thanksgiving; and pay thy vows unto the most High: [15] And call upon me in the day of trouble: I will deliver thee, and thou shalt glorify me.

Philip. 4:16-19
For even in Thessalonica ye sent once and again unto my necessity. [17] Not because I desire a gift: but I desire fruit that may abound to your account. [18] But I have all, and abound: I am full, having received of Epaphroditus the things which were sent from you, an odour of a sweet smell, a sacrifice acceptable, wellpleasing to God. [19] But my God shall supply all your need according to his riches in glory by Christ Jesus.

@ chukwudi44

chukwudi44:
in essence christ only came to abolish d non-lucrative parts of the law,while the lucrative parts like tithes were allowed to continue.


Even if I were to agree that tithe is still valid,could you please explain hw the frequency of tithing was increased from once in three years(deut 14:28,deut 26:12) to the now monthly,and weekly tithing practised today.

If you say today's tithe is in the order of melchizedek,we all know that Abraham only paid tithe to melchizedek once in his life time,either way it was never paid weekly or monthly besides Abraham left no instruction for it to continue.

Also Jesus,was here for 33 yrs and never asked anyone to pay tithes to him in the order of melchizedek.

Paul of tarsus never asked anyone to pay tithes for him as he fended for himself by building tenths.

Tithing did not originate under the law. Jesus was the fulfilment of the law.
Jesus could not ask for tithe because he was not yet highpriest while he was on the earth he encouraged people to tithe. remember he was not a levite while on earth.

Concerning the frequency of tithe. it is according as God prosper a man. They were predominantly farmers and in agriculture ,there are seasons. they have time of shearing sheep etc.

money is our medium of exchange. I am a gifted artist will i bring frames as tithe?  i make sales. my harvest is money, and i give cash. I am not bound by 10 percent i give God 20 or 30 Percent . some give more as their tithe . it is a thing of faith.  as God prospered me.
1 Cor. 16:2
   Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.

@kunleOshob
Pls stop twisting scriptures. Jesus was answering a Jewish question. And he's not making references to the church. The word "Christ" is a reference to the messiah that the Jews were waiting for. A born again person is anointed , ministers of God are anointed and this is different from the Jews "ANOINTED" which is false christ. You have to be a born again first to understand these terms

Pastor AIO:
Happy New Year everybody!!

Please I am looking for able bodied ministers with zeal for the word of the Lord to go to Saudi Arabia and spread the gospel. To mecca to be precise. It will have to be a covert mission since the Meccan authorities will not allow any religion outside of islam to be preached or practiced in that city. However remember that the lord said that the gospel will be preached to ends of the earth before the coming of the lord. Therefore we must leave no stone unturned.

Any volunteers?

I nominate Pastor AIO

Thanks , I didnt want to respond because the question is very imature.