₦airaland Forum

I think what he has been trying to do is differentiate between players that have simply shown promise from those who are actually clocking minutes and performing. Osimhen has shown promise and could come better than Onomah etc. But he has a case that Onomah is ahead, for now.
I just put out a list from fourfourtwo. Dennis Bonaventure was rated ahead of Ejaria and Tomori.

Humility017:
I am not against him talking of his players...but pulling down other players just to promote his own like kind of players is what I don't like....

I patiently watch were he was heading to..when he began to berates oshimen...and I believed because he wanted promote onomah.....because that was the conclusion

ur welcome!

Toylove:
TNx bruv

dem talk say na begging/opening shop

Humility017:
I have said this severally nothing wrong inviting players like deji, omijiii and any home groom talent to come train with the SE...just to give them exposure...and instill in them...the need to work hard to play for the team in future...and feel wanted...

the nff really are bereft of ideas...
things like this should be introduced....at least to keep this foreign lads who have openly declared for us...

komekn I must commend your patriotic gesture. I want to assume you are not paid to go out and watch these boys. Neither are you an agent. I want to say I respect your contributions. If we all could do the same, this thread would be so rich. And I'm sure coaches would come here to scout. So next time when we go out there, let's take pictures or make videos. Just an idea. We need to start doing something different for Nigeria. We love our country pass other countries abi? No be just for mouth oh

@bolded. were you talking about Tayo Edun?
He is also English groomed

Modified
Let's respect Komekn 's positions. He is our eyes over there. Those who are in Nigeria should educate us what's going on with Nigerian talents in Nigeria. Saying they are on the streets, is different from someone who goes to watch these teenagers. He can only speak on what he knows.
So please let's be a little more patriotic and go watch these boys in the streets and talk about them here.. maybe post videos.

sidenote: Most of these players are automatically citizens of Nigeria through their parents. Passport is just a document. Even many in Nigeria don't have a Nigerian passport. That does not make them less Nigerian.

Humility017:
who is tega onomah please...
please this is super eagles thread and not 3 lions thread...
stop using the English football system as a yardstick to judge our players...
those players you mentioning have every thing working for them...good and organised football system...unlike us here in Nigeria I doubt if tega had gone through what oshimen experienced while growing up....

over hyped English groomed players...if England was that England....they would have been edging Germany all this while om world cup tournaments.....



not everyone will be opportuened to.play in England even at that you should not expect a teenager who just changed an environment, football culture and vibes to get so well and smooth in Europe though some can....but definetely the lad is on a gradual progress....I believe if at 18 he could get few minutes under his belt I believe as time goes by...he will definetely get hours provided he keep working hard..

you're so swift to pull down other players just to promote your English groomed players which I wont want to call average....

only God knows if those guys you're mentioning even have a Nigeria passport

yes the world has always been unfair to Mikel.

Mickael2:
wait, are you missing the point here? I am to believe that we are the highest scorers, we have the meanest defence and we beat the best teams around, then you are telling me that the guy that is EASILY our own best player does not deserve to be in the team? It does not make any sense, you have players there who barely had 2-3 good games, Mikel was very good(atleast) in every game and once he leaves the pitch the entire team suffered, and he added goals and preassists too

One word. System.

tbaba1234:
19 year old, Tayo Edun (Adetayo Oluwatosin Olusegun Edun) was invited to train with England. England is trying to make these young men of dual nationalities feel wanted.

That's 6 new starters.

tbaba1234:
Based on reports, i suspect that this could be the starting line up

Ezenwa
Aina
Shehu
Ekong
Balogun
Ogu
Ndidi
Etebo
Iwobi
Nwakaeme
Iheanacho

FOURFOURTWO'S 100 BEST TEENAGERS -- NIGERIANS WHO MADE THE LIST

---

74. Fikayo Tomori (19)
Need to know: Arsenal and Manchester United hopelessly failed to tame Marcus Rashford in March 2016 – but a Canada U20 defender showed them how it was done that month in a shock victory away to the Young Lions.
Tomori, born in Calgary but brought up in Kent, was eventually wooed by England and before long had helped them win the U20 World Cup.
The defender thrived as Chelsea conquered the FA Youth Cup and UEFA Youth League, and is now on loan at Hull after a spell in Brighton last season.

Highlight so far: Athletic and excellent in one-on-one situations with strikers, Tomori was a paramount performer as England kept four clean sheets en route to U20 glory in Suwon.

70. Oviemuno Ejaria (19)
Need to know: Born in the same London borough as Rio Ferdinand, Duncan Goodhew and David Haye, Ejaria was thrilled to join his beloved Arsenal as a seven-year-old.
His sadness at being released by the Gunners nine years later didn’t last long, though, as esteemed clubs hoyed apprenticeship forms at him. The attacking midfielder reportedly rejected PSG to join Liverpool, and has since made a splash for their reserves after putting in extra hours to improve his goals return.

Though part of a Nigeria U17 training camp in 2013, Ejaria played a bit-part role in England’s FIFA U20 World Cup triumph.

Highlight so far: Ejaria’s distribution caught the eye on his first Liverpool start, when he held his own against Eric Dier & Co. in a 2-1 win over Tottenham in the League Cup in October 2016.

27. Dennis Bonaventure (19)
Need to know:
Bonaventure was, even in his native Nigeria, unknown when Zorya Luhansk discovered him at the Abuja Academy in March 2016.
Fast-forward 18 months and the unpredictable forward has been dubbed ‘The Nigerian Neymar’, forced the Super Eagles selectors to answer repeated questions about overlooking him, and been scouted by Manchester City, Manchester United, Borussia Dortmund and Monaco.
Bonaventure, a master at entrapping fouls, propelled Zorya to third place in the 2016/17 Ukrainian Premier League, and has made a sterling start in the black-and-blue striped No.42 shirt of Club Brugge.

Highlight so far: Five minutes into his Brugge bow, Bonaventure cut inside his man and rifled the ball into the bottom corner to give the Belgians a flying start to their Champions League qualifier against Istanbul Basaksehir. MW

you mean go to the world cup?
Well, as first choice, it's not impossible. If he gets more games for Deportivo, he would have a good case.

Icon79:
Something tells me that Uzoho might be our World Cup goalkeeper though.


O pari

WORLD: Club Friendly

---

Torino (Ita) 3-0 Chieri (Ita)
Sadiq Umar with the opener

EUROPE: Euro U21 - Qualification

---

Finished
Azerbaijan U21 0-7 Germany U21

Jordan Torunarigha in Germany's bench

OGN says Iwobi, Ihenacho and Nwakaeme to lead our front line against Algeria.

Ezenwa has been in goal since the Cameroon match. He has seen enough of the African test IMO.
I want to see what he can do for at least 45 minutes against Argentina.

I think we need to throw in Uzoho for Algeria. In this dead rubber, let's make some sacrifices for exposure. We are going to need one rookie goalkeeper in the World Cup. It's between Alampasu and Uzoho. At the moment Uzoho is ahead. Let's wait and see.

I personally won't take Akpeyi and Ezenwa to the World cup. They both have to fight it out. For now, Ezenwa is ahead. Let Akpeyi have another half against Argentina. We already know he is kind of shaky. But let's see if he can win our confidence back against Argentina. Both have seen enough of African oppositions.

Orkpekyandega:
Who would you want to start in goal for our game against Algeria and Argentina? state your reasons.

I would love to see Ezenwa in both contests.

I want to see him cement the starting spot in the goalkeeping department and these two matchhes will further provide a stern test for him to further prove his douters wrong.

Secondly, for goalies, the number of games one participates in makes him to grow more in confidence and experience. In the absence of Vincent Enyeama and Karl Ikeme, the next candidate on line is Ezenwa looking at what he has shown so far. Therefore, allowing Ezenwa to man the post for these two high profile matches will be to our advantage as we look forward to having better preparations for the World Cup proper.

The other goalkeepers can be tested in any of the friendly games after these two especialy Uzoho is coming in new. Akpeyi is not a new name to us.

My dad loved Geography and he is well travelled. Even before I was 12 or so, I already knew over 95 percent of the countries in the world, and their capitals. I remember coming to Nigeria once, I travelled with a girl from Switzerland who was coming to see her boyfriend in Nigeria. I still remember our convo. She was surprised I knew the capital of her country. She told me many people she had met always thought it was Geneva.
Learning first starts with interest. If you are not interested, you will not dig dip, and you will not know. Bro I know you love to learn, and I've learned a lot from you without your knowing..lol Keep it up.

Mujtahida:
You killed it with the way we perceive ourselves here. Quite perceptive I must say.

Toylove e.g friendlies.
If he had played in any qualifier (at least), that would have ruled him out from making a switch to CIV.

tbaba1234:
He only played in non-competitive games..

I THINK Americans are brought up with that nationalist agenda. They are brought up to see America as the greatest country. Unless they care to explore the world or travel, they don't actually take time to learn more about other nations. Hence they rope Africa as one. Just a simplified approach to viewing a region they don't consider important because of all the negativity they've heard.

It's similar to how some -- if not many -- Nigerians are brought up to have the view that if one is not Hausa or Yoruba, they are Igbo. Don't they know there other tribes? They know, but they don't care. They don't care to learn or find out. They have been brought up to believe that those tribes are insignificant.

I think this might be a very good analogy.

Mujtahida:
Many Americans are are ignorant of the World oo. Many routinely think that Africa is a continent. I appreciate you position on this issue.

he meant country.

somehow:
But Africa is a continent na

well don't forget the context. I'm sure he didn't mean in terms of "settlement".
To many cultures out there, bribing for something, when you have actually demonstrated you deserve it, is ridiculous oh.

I can highlight our many forms of corruption in Nigeria as we have it now, that have become our culture.
Consider some:

1. Sorting which is actually bribes
2. Giving the police money to get away
3. You graduated in Lagos and you are serving as a youth corper in Lagos. How come? when you are neither married nor in a critical condition health-wise.
4. You bribe your way to skip the line. Why am I kept waiting when I came before many others in the hospital? I keep seeing people go through the door before me. People I came before. na magic?
5. The satellite TV installer does not want to his job diligently after I've been charged for installation. He tells me he needs cable, that he doesn't actually need, since my house is already wired -- satellite ready. He wants me to give him money for cable, else...
should I go on?
6. The carpenter has already gotten deposit to start his job. He promises it will be ready in a week time, when he is done, I'm to give him the balance, which is 50% of his charge. When the time comes, he asks for more money, but the job is not even half done.
Should I continue.
7. My painter uses the paint money I gave to buy a different paint, does a bad job and still makes away with the paint buckets I would have given him anyway.

My friend the way corruption smells from top to bottom here.. it's a culture..


Corruption, where I am based, is institutionalized. That is to say it is legal. But when you look at it from a moral standpoint, you know it is corruption. Two different things. While giving kickbacks take place, It is not widespread as we have it here. It is not anticipated. Over here in Nigeria almost everyone expects you to "see" them. If you don't they give those who "see" them preference. They frustrate you.. some of us are really used to these things, but it's normal oh among civilized people.

Mujtahida:
He didn't compare levels of corruption. He said corruption is alien to Aluko and co. And these are players who are in the inherently corrupt English football system. So how can settlement be alien to them. There's a difference between in saying there are not corrupt and saying corruption is alien to them.

Won't it sound incredulous to you if a Nigerian says corruption is alien to him?

Ehen.. now we are thinking together

chrisooblog:
yes you are right ''one size fits all'' approach will not serve us well. as you correctly stated marrying our different recruitment systems and fine tuning them is the way to go. my reply to komekn was just in response to his enquiries not saying we should solely rely on the u17 conveyor belt

(when I end a discussion with this. You know what that means)

goldfish80:
The solution is to run away from the responsibilities and leave them for our great grand children to fix?
The Nff should be relocated to Europe so we can convince players of Nigerian decent. I already gave you this solution.

You brought the example of Spain so as to argue that the economy does not impact La Liga, and vice versa (that they are independent entirely).
But you keep making a case that was never the argument. Did you get my earlier definition of Causative and correlated? How about my sarcastic question on what you were suggesting as regards brazil's economy and their league? How about the analogy? Did you get the explanation? It seems you are not actually reading, or you are intentionally ignoring the points. I did not insinuate from the start or even my last write-up that government policies immediately impact the development of Spanish players. Neither did anyone make a similar argument as regards Nigerian football and Nigeria's economy.

Read Mujtahida's last post, and see were I bolded. That has actually been the argument. How else can I put it to you? Because I've tried different ways. I'm sure others will benefit from this discussion anyway.

goldfish80:
How does the Spanish government's tax free grant to LA liga clubs help the development of Spanish players?
I want to get first hand information from the well in touch Joebie.
I'm all ears please.

hahaha.. very good question.

Modified
goldfish80 consider the bolded. If you still don't get it that what we have is a Nigerian problem, you MAY never get it.

Mujtahida:
To show the crassness of the idea that having institionalized modes of engaging these foreign born players cannot in the truest sense affect the development of our league let us take a review of the architecture, the developmental effort and structure that both enterprises would require

Formal engagement of players can require let's say at least two persons in France, England, Germany and Italy (as we are speaking it's possible say somebody fit dey our embassy wey him own na to just sit down, no work per se). Those are the hubs. They must personable, friendly, able to speak the local language need good social media presence, passion and consistency to make their efforts count. Imagine if you identify guys like forgiveness and give them that brief. Omo, let your imagination provide the answer.

Now let's look at what it takes in this era to have a decent league: we need good stadiums in all the states of the federation, we need good roads for travelling, we need good academies fairly spread out throughout the country, we need physiotherapy and medical sports facilities throughout the country, we might even need special courts to handle contractual disputes sharply without delays as is the case with regular courts, we need coaches, we need trainers, we need marketing and business executives to handle the business side of things, we need media executives and PR specialists, we need good network of scouts throughout Nigeria and possibly West Africa, we even need Web managers to maintain the social media presence of our local clubs, we need sponsorship deals and investments worth billions of dollars. We are looking at a whole industry.

So how does the 2% effort (comparatively speaking. Joebie help ooo, I no sabi maths) required to institutionalise how engagement with players of Nigerian descent born abroad affect the 70% effort required to develop our league? Please I want to be convinced how this is possible.

@bolded. Shows you are still not getting the point, or you are trying to distract from the original argument. You are making an argument as if someone ever said that it is causative.

If you still don't understand that what we have going on in our football administration is actually a Nigerian problem, then it's either you are deceiving yourself or you are simply just out of touch.

goldfish80:
The Spanish clubs were giving tax rebate when the country experienced a downturn economically. Not because they fear Spanish players won't make the grade rather they didn't want to loose the competitive edge and purchasing power to the Epl and other leagues.

Simply put, if the club's weren't operating at a tax heaven, couple with the economic downturn experienced at the time, top La liga players will be lost to more buoyant leagues and néw stars won't be attracted to come on board because the clubs lack the purchasing power.

The policy had nothing to do with the development of Spanish footballers.

My question to you is how many of these players have really had successful careers with the SE?
I'm not taking sides here, as I have also asked komekn how many players in diaspora have really come good for us?

Now let's marry our systems and you will see the wonderful thing we will keep assembling.
If we can get 5 players from our under-aged system, that will have long careers with SE eventually.
And we can find 5 outstanding players from the many in diaspora because of our thorough database and relationship building approach.
And also, we get 30 players from a solid domestic football structure. What we have here is the best from all fronts, continuously churning out talents after talents. Why abandon any of this system? The next Messi could have sprang from any of the 3 systems above. When you want excellence you go for the best wherever you can find them without sentiments. That's the right attitude to success. Find workable systems in all fronts and you will see how many talents will abound.

chrisooblog:
yes you are right you are only as good as your last game that said what you did in the past should also count for something

speaking specifically about Omeruo if he peaked at u17 level which was 2009 how come he bust into the scene in 2013? yes he hasn't progressed as well as expected of him but for the national team he was/is been quite good especially the period between 13/14. yes his club form wasn't great during that 14/15 timeline but you can't solely judge him on his club performance alone he was still doing well for nigeria before his terrible game for us against SA in uyo. since his decline in output for the super eagles he has been rightly left out. he was even placed on standby this time. if not for injuries he wouldn't have gotten recalled he also knows this is his last chance saloon

since 14/15 has dominic iorfa been outstanding? if he's consistently been good since then it would be madness to ignore him but he hasn't posted those kind of MOTM to my knowledge.

historically u17 has always been a good breeding ground for the super eagles hence the tendency to give them a chance to show case themselves. from ugbade to akpoborie to kanu to oruma to babayaro to opabunmi to rabiu ibrahim to iheanacho to alampasu and now osimhen cadet players have always been considered. if they are good enough they stay if not they are dropped and we move on

one more thing i'm not disputing that the NFF can do better in it's recruit of exceptional foreign born nigerian origin players but let's give them some slack they have done well in some regard. vicmo, ikeme, iwobi, ola aina, leon balogun, ekong just a few that were brought into the fold that have achieved great things for us

This is what i've been trying to make forumites understand oh. Hopefully you have just nailed it finally.

Mujtahida:
Your problem is not fb players, playing for us but the suggestion that we have an institutionalised mode of engagement.
Pray tell me how formalising the mode of approaching fb players affects the development of our league or will be at the expense of our local league. Is this not a lazy man's excuse? Just like saying having embassies abroad will prevent building of government houses in Nigeria. Imagine how ridiculous a man would look if we want to establish diplomatic relations with another country and he begins to cry 'hooooo hoooo we cannot do this ooo. It will affect our domestic relations'.

If your league was developed prior to now and having fb players began to affect it then I'd see your points. But your league has been floundering for years. Having modes of engagement with fb players has no relationship with developing your league. Just stick with the fact that you don't like us 'begging'. I will understand.

Well, but you are repeating the points i've already made. In the process, you just reiterate, and say nothing new.

Let me help you.
Just an analogy: Smoking and Drinking as bad habits

Does it follow that a smoker is always a drinker as well? No.
But consider this scenario. A man who is a smoker who happens to be a drinker as well, decides to stop smoking.
After several attempts, he finally overcame his tobacco addiction after 12 months.
My question: What are the chances that he will as well overcome alcoholism?

You see, these habits are correlated. How we handle affairs as a people. The systems we use, and our culture of doing things for that matter will determine many of our affairs.

READ ON
Let me take you on one of your examples -- Spain. How do you choose to measure the rise of their football? Let me restrict this to the club level, because we are talking league development.

Is it a coincidence that between 2012 and now Spain was represented 6 times out of a possible 8 as UEFA Champions league finalists?

3 SOURCES for you as regards SPAIN. When you are done, ask yourself if football and the economy are ENTIRELY independent of each other.

1. A 2012 report on LaLiga club challenges:
Gay, who has produced several studies on Spanish clubs' sorry finances, estimates their debt at 6 billion euros ($7.4 billion).

"The 20 teams in La Liga, the elite first division that includes powerhouses Barcelona and Real Madrid, owe more than half that amount. Gay believes at least 10 teams are at risk of going under. Several are already under bankruptcy protection.

The government says teams in the top two divisions owed 752 million euros ($921 million) in unpaid taxes alone last spring, on top of around 600 million euros ($735 million) in missed contributions to the social security system.

The authorities have long tolerated clubs' traditionally loose finances because of the prestige and popularity they bring to a country where passion for the game runs deep.

That is changing. With finances squeezed by the euro zone debt crisis, the government is slashing spending on hospitals, schools and public-sector jobs, and Spaniards are starting to ask whether football clubs should be able to continue to enjoy their free ride."
https://www.pri.org/stories/2012-07-11/spains-iconic-la-liga-soccer-teams-face-high-debt-and-unpaid-taxes

2. Next ,on Spain's economic reforms in 2012:

" What has been done?
Unlike some of its peers, Spain got stuck into labour market reforms in 2012. These now appear to be paying dividends.
Spain's unemployment rate has dropped like a stone as a result. However, it still remains high as the second highest in the euro area at 23.8pc in the first quarter.
Holger Sandte, of Nordea, said: "The reforms done in the economy begin to be visible in Spain, such as the tax reform that came into force in the beginning of the year."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11574536/How-Spain-became-the-Wests-superstar-economy.html

3. Next, the picture BELOW a snapshot of Spain's economy since 2012:
source: https://www.focus-economics.com/countries/spain


My friend, these two things are not entirely independent as you would like to think. Just as the La Liga can impact the Spanish economy. Economic reforms can also impact the La Liga. The impact may not be immediate, but on the long run a predictable trend can be observed. Still, I maintain they are correlated, although independent to some extent.

I want to learn from you, if I must continue.

goldfish80:
I try to identify the anchor point of your argument and clear it up. Every other point fall into place like dominos.

You keep missing the point. Because you don't read my entire comment. You just pick a line and run away with it. I'm not learning anything new by engaging you. It's no use

goldfish80:
Brazil had a thriving economy for years. They are part of the BRIC countries. Brazil didn't find themselves in this economic group that made up the BRIC countries by chance or without strategic planning which took years to harness by Lula da Silva.

If their economy could take a hit, then their football should have taken a hit too, since you're trying so hard to link the two.

They are correlated still.
They've had a strong football development structure for donkey years. And their economy have been growing. You can't expect a sudden downward trend in their economy to just reflect in their football right away. It's not causative, it's correlated.

The way we handle football which we have focused on over the years, to the detriment of other sports, is a reflection of how we do things.
Don't expect that we would have done well with our economy with its relative complexity.

goldfish80:
If their football isn't going downhill just like their economy, then it is safe to say football is independent of the economy which was my point in the first place.

(Photo) Breaking: Nigeria Int'l Signs Two-Year Deal Worth N14M To Remain At Enyimba
Published: November 09, 2017
https://www.allnigeriasoccer.com/football_pics/53159Joseph%20-%20Copy.jpg

(Photo) Breaking: Nigeria Int'l Signs Two-Year Deal Worth N14M To Remain At EnyimbaNigeria Professional Football League powerhouse Enyimba have finally secured the services of Joseph Osadiaye for another two years.

With the CAF Confederation Cup and the CHAN around the corner the two-cap Super Eagles winger will have the opportunity to showcase his talent to the world.

"The negotiation period was a tough one, because the player had several other offers we were considering, Al-Merrikh of Sudan, Rangers, Akwa United and two other European clubs who were eager to woo the player when they found out his previous contract with Enyimba expired,'' the player's intermediary Ogbemudia Endurance Iseri told allnigeriasoccer.com.

"I spoke with the Chairman of Enyimba International Football Club Chief Felix Anyasi Agwu and the football director Jude Anyadufu extensively before it was sealed.

''I see a better platform for the player to launch his career abroad with Enyimba FC, they are one of the professionally managed football club in the NPFL at the moment."

Joseph Osadiaye's new deal is worth N14,000,000.00 (Fourteen Million Naira) aside other bonuses and allowances, and begins from the 2017-18 season.

He was also part of the NPFL All-Star team to Spain in 2016.

Ifeanyi Emmanuel

--ANS

Dem for play for NPFL na.. we for see how their careers for develop.
Let's field home-based alone.. ehen!

These people shouting patriotism, ask them what brand of shoes they wear.
Their weaveon where dem make am? Be patriotic and patronize homemade goods. Patriotism is action.

komekn:
That means that the entire national, team is imported.

Not one of them plays in Nigeria, so all this talk of being born or not in Nigeria is really academic.

oga corruption get different level oh.

Mujtahida:
How can you say that the concept of settlement is alien to Aluko and others when you yourself often stress the point that English football is inherently corrupt? Abi they never experienced this inherent corruption in the course of their footballing career to the extent that our culture of settlement is now alien to them?