₦airaland Forum

halalMACburger: The fact that following certain practices can lead them to starvation

like vedaxcool clearly stated,there's always alternative.if haram food is the only food availave for them to eat,there's no sin.
Shikena. Its no problem at all.heheheheheheheheh

Delafruita: the foundation of modern day christianity is corrupt so its not suprise that christianity is corrupt.pastors use the bible to fleece their followers.churches are established by individuals probably from a tiny apartment.net thing is "lets build a befitting edifice for the lord".next thing is "lets make the lord's house fully air-conditioned",then "its time to start "planting" churches to win souls for the lord".
this is not to absolve muslim clerics of corruption.there have been reports of imams who "borrowed" mosque money.but the foundation of islam doesnt include "give 10% otherwise heaven is closed".it doesnt make it compulsory to give offerings.sometimes a mosque might be in construction for years because donation isnt made mandatory and members arent told "if you want to own your own house,build a house for allah".
corruption exists both ways,but christianity has sewn it into its fabric by giving pastors biblical backing to fleece their "sheep"

seriously i admire ur comments,i would really like to know you.

yommyuk: Matthew 7: 6
“Don’t waste what is holy on people who are unholy. Don’t throw your pearls to pigs. They will trample the pearls, then turn and attack you.”
What good is it to a farmer to plant his seeds on an infertile ground? It is a waste of time to bathe a pig on a daily basis knowing that at any given time, it will throw itself back inside the dirt at any given opportunity. What use is it in washing a car that will go thru a muddy road, knowing full well that it will get soiled again?
There are some people that have consciously with evil intent, decided in their heart not to accept the gospel. They are the kind that will require physical evidence and proof. But the Gospel is not about what we can see or feel. For we walk by faith and not by sight. Even Jesus Christ decided to leave his hometown because of their unbelief. So why waste your time on those who have been created specifically for destruction.
Life is too short. Don’t waste it. Sow your seeds on a fertile ground.
PRAYER
May the spirit of God continue to lead us along the paths of righteousness IJMN – Amen!!!!!!!

was jesus on codeine when he instructed his followers to preach to the world(Mark 16:15)
when you fail theologically,rationally and scientifically to prove ur belief,u resort to cheap tactics.
Is the holy spirit afraid of over 4 billion people that doesnt believe in jesus?
Thrash.the same bible is used daily to debunk ur faith,yet u yell spirit.mstchew

halalMACburger: The rational thinking ones among them will start thinking about the practicality of it all

like

halalMACburger: Yawn.

As usual, when your religious arguments hold no water, you claim that you have answered the questions and then run away.

Islam is not for poor people. Poor people can not pay Zakat or Travel to Mecca. A starving man will choose pork over starvation. A jobless man will choose a job in a haraam company over unemployment and inability to feed himself and his family in a recession.


There are things that are not practical. Do you think any muslim that works in a company that works in a beer factory or wine company or and investment company takes you seriously? Millions of muslims engage in riba through investment companies and also work in alcoholic beverage selling companies. They look at you as a backwards muslim.

So, who is more practical?

Keep burying your head in the sand.

and what will happen to them if they dont partake in any of those?

mayans predicted the end of the world in 2012.
Now christians are predicting end of world in 2013.
Abeg all of una christians way get land for garki,asokoro,maitama,before the end of 2012 contact me i go buy.heheheheheheheheheheh

MacDaddy01: If Jesus comes, I will call 911 to arrest him. The guy is a terrorist that wants to destroy the world with a spiritual bomb called rapture.

hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe.macdaddy01 u got me rolling on this.
Hehehehehehehehe

Ishilove: Oya na,ngwanu beibay,bia wa la kai n rock life!!

hehehehehehehehehehe

logicboy01: Ishilove and Justaqad, una don craze finish.


When did I become your child?

hehehehehehehehehehehehehehe.
I am an overtaker,ishi and i.hehehehehehehehehehe

Ishilove: Ahh, THAT famous nwa baby...

Ehn yes , na me

haba aint fair ooooo.
Anyhow sha we are both religious,i could take his position abi?i am free like a bird.hehehehehehehehehehehehehehe

isaiah 43:10 “You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord, “and my servant whom I have chosen, that
you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was
formed, nor shall there be any after me.

Give your lives to God.

hmmmmmmmmmmm,quite touching.
Though we are always drawn at cross fires, i have esteem respect for you.yess respect.
Though sometimes u can be annoying but it makes the fun worthwhile.
Just be good to yourself and people around u might probably get a mansion in heaven avenue,heaven state.hehehehehehehehehehe

Ishilove: Logicboy is my sweetie,and one must chastise those one cares for

so u were that nwa baby that left him cos he's an atheist abi?

Ishilove: I know you are bit on the slow side so i'll take it real slow. . .

Deep Sight. . .said in his post. . .that you. . .are . . .daft. . .
Puerile

Infantile

That you are attempting to break a record. . .record for "awesome silliness".

He also mentioned "baboon scrotal sweat" in relation to your post . . .

Do. . . you. . .undERstand. . .?

kai what has logicboy done to deserve this from u?hmmm not fair ooooooo.
If na me eh,i go ban myself from nairaland.hehehehehehehehehehe

190: They should switch off MTN netwrk tomorrow too

seconded
thirded
forthed
fifthed
sixteth
seventhed
eighted
ninethed
tenthed

tobechi74: Hunger...u no chop b4 u sleep

i prefer dinner in my dreams,i often invite obama for dinner,allison madueke is my chef,hehehehehehehehehehehe
life can never go wrong in dreams.hehehehehehehe

[quote author=tpia@]Interesting topic.

@ op

What do you think an angel is?

A huge being with wings who appears and disappears magically?


That's the general perception but is that the only form an angel is limited to?[/quote]whatever form an angel may be,cant he,or probably u command an angel to win my soul for your jesus.hehehehehehehehehehehehe

MacDaddy01: I did not bother to read your stories. I am not asking for justification for these rules or pillars. I am stating a fact that there are fundamental rules in islam that makes it difficult for a poor person to be muslim.

what facts?ur arguments are weak and shallow

after vedaxcool explanation you need to hide your head.

vedaxcool: @mcdaddy, ur argument has many holes and lacks merits'! Would u then say Islam is not meant for the sick? Because certain cases might leave one only performing one of the pillars of Islam. In essence what Islam did is to provide flexibility to perform the religious rites, thereby eliminating undue burden from adherents who for one reason or the other cannot perform the pillars of Islam. Yet all 5 pillars of Islam provide great benefits to the society, zakat will go along way in providing social services for the poor thereby improving their condition which can in the long run remove them from poverty. Fasting has brought the rich to expreince the condition of the poor hence making them wanting to do more in helping the poor. Hajj re-emphasis the equality of humanity and the brotherhood of mankind this made Malcom X remarked "this represents the true UN" again in our country people have aided the "poor" to go for hajj. Of this 3 only two can be rightfully not practiced by the "poor". This brings us to the role of muslims govt, uplifting the conditions of the Muslim to eradicating poverty, this throws up the story of caliph Abd' Aziz whom is a descendant of the second caliph Umar r.a, it was during his reign that poverty had been reduced that no one accepted Zakat from the authorities. Honest and purposeful leadership can re-create such scenario. Islam removing the compulsion to practice certain rites DOES NOT mean Islam is not for the poor, but that it recognizes the situation mankind and adequately made provisions to make the religion practicable reminding me of what the prophet said pertaining religion that if given between a hard and easy practice to do choose in religion he would go for the easy one. If disagree would you then say Nigeria is not meant for the poor? Given that certain provision like taxation etc only applies to the rich? I hope u get my drift.

i wouldn't have said it better

The Purpose of Hajj The ritual of hajj is not any different from any other ritual of Islam. These rituals are acts of worship and must be dedicated to the name of God alone (6:162). The Quran stresses in a number of verses that the only purpose of hajj is to commemorate the name of God. As a result, every precious hour and day of the Hajj should be spent in commemorating the name of God Almighty alone: "And proclaim that the people shall observe Hajj pilgrimage …… they shall commemorate God’s name during the specified days for providing them with the livestock" 22:27-28 "You shall commemorate God for a number of days" 2:203 "While you file from ‘Arafat’ you shall commemorate God " 2:198 "As you complete your rites, you shall continue to commemorate God " 2:200

When was Fasting first decreed and to whom? According to the Quran, fasting is very old and was decreed to the
people of Israel long before the Quran was revealed: "O you who believe, fasting is decreed for you, as it was decreed
for those before you, that you may attain salvation" 2:183 3- What is the meaning of "Siyaam" in the Quran? The word "Siyaam" is used in the Quran to mean abstention. Abstention could be from a number things. For example, the word "Sawm" as used in 19:26 is used to indicate an abstention from talking: "Eat and drink, and be happy. When you (Mary) see anyone, say, `I have made a vow of "Saum" to the Most Merciful; I am not talking today to anyone" 19:26 The word "somm" which is another derivative of the word, and as used in 2:18, means inability to hear: "Somm" (Deaf), dumb, and blind; they fail to return" 2:18 Then we have the word "Siyaam" as used in 2:187, which refers to the abstention from eating and drinking: "..You may eat and drink until the white thread of light becomes distinguishable from the dark thread of night at dawn. Then, you shall complete the "Siyaam" until Night..." 2:187 "O you who believe, "Siyaam" is decreed for you, as it was decreed for those before you, that you may attain salvation" 2:183 During the fasting hours (explained in 2:187), all sexual contact between married couples is also prohibited: " .... You may eat and drink until the white thread of light becomes distinguishable from the dark thread of night at dawn. Then, you shall fast until sunset. Sexual intercourse is prohibited if you decide to retreat to the masjid. These are God’s laws; you shall not transgress them. God thus clarifies His revelations for the people, that they may attain salvation" 2:187 Prior to the revelation of the Quran, sexual intercourse was prohibited throughout the fasting period. This rule has been alleviated with the revelation of the Quran (2:187) to allow intercourse between married couples during the nights of Ramadan. 4- Who is obliged to observe the fasting and who is reprieved ? Fasting in Ramadan is obligatory on those who can physically withstand it. Sick people and travellers on long or arduous travels are exempted from the fast but must make it up by fasting other days when they are no longer sick or travelling. "Those who are ill or travelling may substitute the same number of other days. God wishes for you convenience, not hardship" 2:185 5- The importance and benifits of fasting Fasting and the month of Ramadan are given great importance in the Quran. Ramadan is a Holy month because it is the month during which the Quran was revealed. As a result, this month is meant to be a time for inner reflection, devotion to God, and self- control. In many ways, the month of Ramadan serves as a kind of tune-up for the soul. The benefits of fasting are numerous. Undoubtedly the greatest of these is the fact that in fasting is a great expression of worshipping God. Moreover, the act of fasting is a great exercise in self-control and the development of will power. The intention is that the lack of preoccupation with the physical satisfactions of the body during the daylight hours of fasting, the human being is able to attain a measure of spiritual ascendancy. This leads to attaining closeness to God. Ramadan is also a time for reflection, reading the Quran, giving charity, purifying one's behaviour, and doing good deeds. For Muslims, Ramadan is an opportunity to gain by giving up, to prosper by going without and to grow stronger by conquering weakness. As a secondary goal, and through experiencing hunger, fasting is a means for developing compassion for the poor and less fortunate, and consequently learning to be more charitable and more thankful and appreciative of God's bounties. Fasting is also beneficial to the health and provides a break in the cycle of rigid habits and over indulgence.

MacDaddy01: Did I say that they will burn in hell? Is that my argument?


The point is that Islam is not for poor people in some of its doctrines. How can 3 out of the 5 pillars be problematic for poor people?

let me clear things for u,hope u will learn and stop arguing baselessly.
(Zakat) The Quran defines the concept of the Zakat (Obligatory Charity) and outlines all the guidelines related to its payment. This page presents all related aspects of this religious duty. 1- When was the Zakat first decreed and to whom? According to the Quran, the Zakat was decreed from as far back as the time of Abraham: "We made them (Abraham and his sons) imams who guided in accordance with our commandments, and we taught them how to work righteousness, and how to observe the Salat and the Zakat. To us, they were devoted worshipers" 21:73 2- What is the Quranic definition of the Zakat? The Zakat is an obligatory payment on all believers who have an income. This payment is to be paid to in accordance to God's instructions (see section 6). "They ask you what to spend, say: ‘al-affwoo’. God thus clarifies the revelations for you that you may reflect " 2:219 The Key word in this verse is the word "al-affwoo". To be able to determine what is exactly meant by this word we should look at other Quranic verses that employ the same word. The following are some Quranic verses that are of special significance to our inquiry: "Additionally, they worshiped the calf, after all the miracles they had seen. 'fa afawna aan zalika' (We pardoned all this)" 4:153 "Who give to charity during the good times, as well as the bad times. They are suppressors of anger, and 'al-aafeen aan al- naas' (pardoners of the people). God loves the charitable" 3:134 "O you who believe, do not ask about matters which, if revealed to you prematurely, would hurt you. If you ask about them in light of the Quran, they will become obvious to you. God has 'AAFA ANHA' (deliberately overlooked them).God is Forgiver, Clement" 5:101 " ........... 'aafa Allah aamma salaf' (God has pardoned past offenses). But if anyone returns to such an offense, God will avenge it. God is Almighty, Avenger" 5:95 According to the above verse, we can see that the word "al- affwoo" (and its derivatives) has been used to mean : that which has been pardoned or overlooked. If we apply this to the word "al-affwoo" which is used in 2:219 and which is related to the payment of Zakat, we can see that God is telling us that we should pay Zakat (charity) from that part of our income which we can afford to give away without the need to ask for it back, or in other words what we can afford to overlook and pardon without incurring any hardship. It is significant that God did not define or quantize the exact portion of our incomes which we are able to give to charity and be able to overlook it (not ask for it back). God knows that this will be different for each individual and directly dependant on each's income and circumstances. It is also dependant on each person's desire to do righteousness. Consequently, God left it to each indivual to assess his/her own needs and obligations, and then decide what portion of one's excess income that can be given away and overlooked without incurring any hardship. 3- When should the Zakat be paid? According to 6:141, Zakat must be given away "on the day of harvest" "Eat from their fruits, and give the due alms on the day of harvest" 6:141 This Quranic verse makes it necessary that we should pay the Zakat whenever we receive income. The Muslims who follow corrupt un-Quranic laws have lost this most important commandment; they calculate and give Zakat only once a year on the total annual income, which may have been generated through wages, interest, dividends .... etc). In this Quranic command to pay Zakat whenever there is an income (harvest) lies a very beneficial economic wisdom. One of the factors that contribute to the economic prosperity of any community is the circulation of money. Higher circulation of money is much more productive than slower circulation. If Zakat is paid whenever income is generated the economy will benefit much more than if Zakat is paid only once a year on the year's total earnings. 4- Who should pay the Zakat? Is the Zakat compulsory on all believers, even if they are poor and cannot afford to give away any of their income? As usual, the Quran gives us the clear answer. Zakat is payable
only by those who have excess after fulfilling their basic needs
(food, clothes, housing, medicine, etc). Therefore if paying a zakat
would cause genuine hardship to a person or his family, then they
are not obliged to pay it: "They ask you what to spend, say: ‘al-affwoo’. God thus clarifies the revelations for you that you may reflect " 2:219 This means that for those who receive an income that is only enough to feed and clothe their families, but with nothing to spare,
are not required to pay zakat.
This is also confirmed in 22:78 where God tells us that He does not want us to experience hardship in practicing the religion: “You shall strive for the cause of God as you ought to strive. He has chosen you and has placed no hardship on you in practicing your religion” 22:78 5- Who should the Zakat be paid to? The Quran outlines the recipients of the Zakat as follows: "You shall give the relatives, the needy and the homeless their ‘haqahu’ (decreed right), but do not be excessive, extravagant.” 17:26 The use of the word ‘haqahu’ indicates that God is speaking of the obligatory Zakat and not about voluntary charities. Some scholars have indicated that the Zakat should only be paid to Muslim recipients, however this restriction has no Quranic reference. The recipients of the Zakat (outlined in 17:26) could be of any faith or creed.

MacDaddy01: How many poor Nigerians have been on hajj? I can point to millions of Nigerians who live on less that $10 a day. How many poor Nigerians can give Zakat? How can a hungry man fast?

Ur whole argument is baseless.the poor will not burn in hell for not paying zakat,fasting or going to hajj.hehehehehehehehehe

ifymarthy: I had an arguement wit my frnds yesterday about pple eating in dreams, and they all claimed dat anyone who eats in a dream is possessed, pls how true is dis.

superstiton. Sometime when i sleep without dinner,i often go to Mcdonalds to make up for dinner in my dreams.hehehehehehehehehe.
I love Mcdonalds

gbadexy: @justaqad
My brother, the verse you quoted sounds like something out of the Quran.
That is the major emphasis God made most in the Quran, that there is no God except Him and only Him can save.
The Quran and indeed Islam says that part of articles of faith is to believe in the Holy books, and Gospel (the unadulterated and original one) is mentioned amongst the Books prescribed for us to believe.
The only difference between Islam and christianity is that Islam insists that there is only one God and He has no child( He could have gotten a billion children if He so wishes) while christianity preaches a God in three phases and Jesus is divine Son and only path to Salvation.
So, the misunderstanding of the true status of Jesus is the only difference between Islam and christianity.

hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe
no offence bro,have u seen a bible?
Look up isaiah 45:21 again. Its not from the quran.its enshrined in the bible.
Hehehehehehehehehe

MacDaddy01: I named 3 pillars of Islam that poor people would have problems partaking in. If the pillars of a building have problems the building as a whole has problems.


Now, if 3 out of 5 pillars arent for poor people, is Islam really fair?

Poor man can not do Zakat
Poor man can not travel to mecca
Poor, starving man can not fast (ulcer)

hehehehehheehehehehe.
And will the God admonish them for not being able to perform those acts?
Poor people can give zakat
poor people can fast
poor people can perform hajj..

MacDaddy01: 24:58 "O ye who believe! Let your slaves, and those of you who have not come to puberty, ask leave of you at three times (before they come into your presence)."

hehehehehehehehehehehehe. Bro look read the history of pagan arabs.
Quran was revealed at a time of
extreme ignorance, where burying your daughters alive was
acceptable, where son would marry the wives of their father,
people who had money and power would have 100s of slaves men and women and having limitless wives was a norm of the
society (who could afford it). According to the customs of that
ignorant period, sex or prostitution using the slave girls was
allowed and acceptable. Another argument that people make is
that no Nikah is required to have extra marital relations with a
slave woman. Plus people do believe there is no contradiction is Quran... then how can something like this be mentioned as
allowed in one place and not allowed in another place. The answer
is fairly simple for those to seek guidance. Quran was revealed to
Hazrat Muhammad PBUH in 23 years. Allah knew that changing
the customs of any society takes years and hence slow and steady
approach was taken,so the later Surah was revealed, it would be closer to the Islam as it was
finalized (remember the last Khutba of our Prophet PBUH) at the
time of last Hajj of our prophet PBUH. Hence it is logical to assume
that Ayahs which were revealed in Madina will hold more value when a conflict arises within Quran

MacDaddy01: No one is saying that Zakat is an evil thing. As a non-muslim, I even practice Zakat. The fact just remains that a poor man can not partake in Zakat.

that is the essence of zakat. Its aim is creating social balance,.its obligatory on the rich to give the poor,its an act of piety.
How is it a bad thing?

MacDaddy01: Yawn.

Who was Rayahna? A slave or a free person.


Did Muhammad have slaves, yes or no?

hehehehehehehehehe,diversionary tactics.
Where in the quran is slavery sanctioned?

MacDaddy01: Who said it is a burden on the poor? Two pillars of Islam that the poor can not partake in. Face it, your religion is not for the poor.

the etiquettes of zakat is creating social balance,salvation does not lie in zakat,it is a kind gestures of rich muslims towards the poorer muslims.
The basic and essential objective of Zakat is purification of the soul. It cures the lust for wealth, infuses the feat Allah in man’s heart and makes one amenable to good deeds. The Holy Qur’an says: “And away from it (Hell) shall be kept the most pious one, who gives away his wealth in order to purify himself.” (XCIL:17-18) On another occasion Allah addresses and exhorts the Holy Prophet (Pbuh) in these words: “Take alms of their wealth, wherewith you may cleanse and purify them.” (9: 103) These verses make the real importance of Zakat quite clear: it aims to emancipate the heart from temporal preoccupations and purifies the soul. It is an acknowledged fact that the love of material things is the real enemy of prayer. It turns a man away from Allah and the After-life. The Holy Prophet once said: “The root of all evil is the love of worldly things.” (Mishkat) Although temporal love includes many things the most powerful and dangerous of all is the love of material wealth. The Holy Prophet has, therefore, regarded it as the greatest of all evils for the Muslims: “The trial for my Ummah is wealth.” (Tirmidhi) If a Muslim can save himself from the lure of wealth, he will be able to protect himself from many other vices. Because of its basic aim and purpose, poor- due is known as zakat in Islam. Literally it means both purification and growth. To give a portion of one’s income to the needy for the pleasure of Allah is called Zakat because it purifies the soul. It must, however, be remembered that the aim of zakat is achieved only when its payment is motivated by sincere desire and practical effort. The pleasure of Allah should be the first and foremost consideration while paying Zakat. It must be free from every other motive. Zakat should be paid out of the income earned only by fair and honest means. Whatever is paid should be respectable. If cheap and worthless stuff is given in zakat it will go in vain. It will be no better than a hypocritical gesture. Zakat’s beneficiary should neither be made to feel grateful for it, nor should his feelings
and self-respect be hurt. Otherwise, Zakat will cease to have any meaning. One secondary objective of the poor-due is to provide basic necessities to poor Muslims. The Holy Prophet said: “Verily Allah has ordained the payment of Zakat on them (Muslims). It will be taken from the rich and returned to the poor.” (Muslim) These Traditions make it quite obvious that there is also a social and economic aspect of the poor-due without which its Islamic concept remains incomplete. The other secondary objective of Zakat is the help and support of Islam. While giving the details of the beneficiaries of Zakat the Holy Qur’an says: “The alms are only for the poor and the needy, and for those who collect them, and those whose hearts are to be reconciled, and to free the captives and the debtors and for the cause of Allah, and for the wayfarers.” (9:60)