₦airaland Forum

jln115:
Well going by what you said 0 African countries will survive such an attack.

France has Reunion, they can stage attacks from there. What France lacks is good logistics.

SuperSixSeven:
I am talking about Amphibious Capability.

You can't see the number of ships?

Surface ships - 35 for Russia, 19 for UK.

Russia has more landing ships than the UK.

SuperSixSeven:
Look at the numbers Russia doesnt have a sizeable amphibious force (ships) even the UK amphibious abilities are is bigger. And France did good in Mali they where present in all parts of the country within 10 days they even flew long range strikes from France to Mali. And we should not overestimate China which has only little experience in war.

Please always conduct research before making claims that are unsubstantiated.

How can you possibly claim the UK has more ships than Russia?

SuperSixSeven:
Look at the numbers Russia doesnt have a sizeable amphibious force (ships) even the UK amphibious abilities are is bigger. And France did good in Mali they where present in all parts of the country within 10 days they even flew long range strikes from France to Mali. And we should not overestimate China which has only little experience in war.

France enlisted the support of America, England, Belgium, Russian Airplanes, Canada to move their equipment to Mali.

For a country that has multiple bases in West-Africa, that's really poor.

Russia can use Angola, Mozambique, including Zimbabwe for attacks on South-Africa.

China fought in WW2, they fought in Korea, they also fought in Vietnam. These are considerable large wars.

China has the ships, manpower and economy to conduct continuous military operations far away from home.

China also regularly conducts large scale military exercises involving thousands of men and hundreds of vehicles and aircrafts.

jln115:
Not all bro we are all good, I respect your opinion

However I think you focused alot on Air defence(maybe ignoring other factors?) on this reply so I think I'll do the same!!

Firstly I do agree in terms of quantity SA with 26 Gripen SA is shortlegged and obviously also doesn't have a long range air defence system.

But what South Africa does have is a massive radar network(mobile and static) which is linked with LinkZA, meaning Our fighters can see an enemy on their screens even if they are on the other side of the country, another advantage of this is,is our fighters can fly with their radars completely turned of and rely soly on information from ground based radar platforms to search, target and engage the enemy.... Thus with their radar switch off it makes our Gripen near invisible to enemy Radar, hence our Gripen( if equipped with the marlin BVR missile by that time) can engage the enemy before they even know what is going on.....this is what I mean being more effective through our communication systems.

Also with all our platforms interlinked with linkza our weapons systems can be designated by different platforms be it air or ground, thus for example a Rooivalk attack helicopter or Hawk/Gripen can target an enemy which it can't even see given for example that target is designated by a small recce team near enemy lines...or any other platform for that matter.
Our Artillery for example can hit moving targets, that's how effective they are thanks to linkza.

With LinkZA it takes only a single platform to see an enemy then the whole defence force sees that enemy as well in real time.

South Africa currently is the only country in Africa and one of only a few in the world that possess an integrated tactical data link!

And its hence for the above mentioned that imo even with a smaller force than Algeria, Morocco and Egypt, SA somewhat makes up for it by being able to more effectively deploy its systems,thanks to superior communication systems.

The advantage South-Africa has is location. Only the US, Russia and China can conduct a full scale invasion on South-Africa.

France could use Reunion as a staging area, but as we have seen in Mali, France lacks the logistical capacity to invade a country that is far away.

Link-ZA is not the advantage.

lionel4power:
let
the South African case is even more better when compared to say Nigeria with zero air denial technology beyond guns.

that's why militarily weak countries like Nigeria pursues diplomatic means before it escalates even to the detriment of the country.

To say the Nigerian military is weak is arrant nonsense.

When faced with a larger stronger foe, a smaller country plays to the weakness of the larger attacking one.

Tactics would change. Conventional tactics would not be used.

The point is to make sure the losses on the larger nation would be such that the cost of victory would be much the attacking/larger force would rethink it's invasion.

Lionel, you have a very limited knowledge of how wars are fought.

I implore you to go read Soviet invasion of Finland in World War 2.

Please endeavor to conduct basic research before commenting.

Xbee007:
A type of bullet that light up after firing them. They contain pyrotechnic charge that trail the bullet which aid in guiding bullet firing at night.

Thank you.

Xbee007:
Tracer rounds.

What is a tracer round?

jln115:
South Africa is the only accredited MRO Centre for C130 in Africa and 1 of only 9 across the globe thus Nigeria is not an MRO for C130s neither is it for Eurocopter or Dauphin. Its also the only accredited MRO for Aérospatiale(now airbus) and Russian helicopter:

"The company is now one of only nine accredited Hercules C-130 service centres in the world and the only one in Africa."

"Denel Aviation is now the only company accredited to perform maintenance, repair and overhaul (MRO) work on Russian helicopters in Africa."

Secondly I posted a snippet from Denels website were it clearly states that they are the original component manufacturer for Oryx and Rooivalk helicopters.

Also I see you have not responded to me on Atlantic desiel engineering so I assume you agree with that statement.

Stop spreading lies please.

From your own link.

"Denel Aeronautics delivers complete aviation solutions including maintenance, repair and overhaul (MRO) upgrades and system integration solutions, with innovation, quality and value added services, through worldwide partnerships."

jln115:
South Africa is the only accredited MRO Centre for C130 in Africa and 1 of only 9 across the globe thus Nigeria is not an MRO for C130s neither is it for Eurocopter or Dauphin. Its also the only accredited MRO for Aérospatiale(now airbus) and Russian helicopter:

"The company is now one of only nine accredited Hercules C-130 service centres in the world and the only one in Africa."

"Denel Aviation is now the only company accredited to perform maintenance, repair and overhaul (MRO) work on Russian helicopters in Africa."

Secondly I posted a snippet from Denels website were it clearly states that they are the original component manufacturer for Oryx and Rooivalk helicopters.

Also I see you have not responded to me on Atlantic desiel engineering so I assume you agree with that statement.

You're not very bright.

Nigeria carries out MRO on C-130s this is a fact.

A maintenance center does not mean you produce components.

A maintenance center is a maintenance center, it is not a components manufacturer.

Stop peddling falsehood.

Your link states Denel is the OEM, it does not state Denel is the Original component manufacturer.

The fact is Denel is heavily dependent on European suppliers. Components for South-African defence equipment are imported from Europe. This is a fact!

jln115:
Bro you do realise Denel an MRO for Aérospatiale, hence all the parts for the Rooivalk and Oryx are manufactured from scratch in SA

"Denel Aeronautics is the original equipment manufacturer for the Rooivalk Combat support helicopter "
http://www.denelaviation.co.za/

My brother, an MRO doesn't mean you manufacture weapons parts and components, that's a lie.

MRO simply means Maintenance Repair and Overhaul.

Jeez!!!

Nigeria is an MRO for the C-130, Eurocopter and Dauphin.

So this means we manufacture all the weapon components.

GeneralFarouq:
Is there any world power willing to support Nigeria if we'd go to war...(obviously not France)
I don't see that we are loyal to any big ally

We don't have any, we're not buying enough weapons to have any leverage. The only thing going for us would be the explosion of migrants to Europe if a full blown war breaks out.

All our neighbours are very weak, so going to war against Nigeria is unlikely.

jln115:
Now I'm not so clued up on the industries of Algeria, Egypt and Morocco but how much of the ammunition from small caliber bullets, tank rounds, artillery shells, Rockets ect ect do these countries actually need to import? South Africa on the other hand produces all of its ammunition from small caliber bullets to missiles for its fighters...... South Africa also has the means to produce everything from IFVs to Attack helicopters and even fighters and has so in the past.

This is a blatant lie. South-African defence companies depend a lot on European supplies for the components used in making South-African manufactured weapons.

In the bush war South Africa still got most of the parts needed to manufacture weapons from Europe.

The Bush war was essentially democracy against communism.

vincentjk:
Omg! You mean all these are made in our Nigeria?

Yes, that are made in Nigeria. Nigeria has quite a number of companies building armoured vehicles.

See attached some of the other made in Nigeria armoured personnel carriers.

This are just some, there are more.

When the Tanks have eyes.

PrinxArthur1:
The thing is, for example Egypt have military equipment that is 70% US origin,if Donald trump wakes up one and say "due to human right abuses/blah blah ......I am imposing a military/economic sanction on Egypt, then in the next 1year+ ,Egypt goes to war with a neighbor like isreal how would they replenish their bombs for f-16,how would they replenish their Abrams tank ammunition etc .....some of these are considered during global fire power ranking!

When we had a proper military in Nigeria, we never bought from one source also. Czechoslovakia was our largest defence supplier at 30%.

PrinxArthur1:
The thing is, for example Egypt have military equipment that is 70% US origin,if Donald trump wakes up one and say "due to human right abuses/blah blah ......I am imposing a military/economic sanction on Egypt, then in the next 1year+ ,Egypt goes to war with a neighbor like isreal how would they replenish their bombs for f-16,how would they replenish their Abrams tank ammunition etc .....some of these are considered during global fire power ranking!

That's why Egypt is buying the MIG-29M, Rafale and SU-35.

Algerian2:
Well its a hudge subject that i dont have the pretention to talk about


Thats why you should first have the quantity . when you have only 20 grippen C fighters ,and 12 attack helicopters. ( like south african AF for exemple) .what will you do if you lose them in one day ? how will you sustain a war ?

I know you are referring to South-Africa here, but I felt this insult here also. It hurts.

That's the other thing, if Algeria goes to war with Morocco, there would be huge support from Russia. Equipment, advisers, special forces, intelligence etc

Same thing for Morocco. The US will support massively.

Syria is a good example.

CSTR2:
Manufactured or assembled?

Where is the factory and workers?

They are both the same thing.

They are manufactured in Nigeria.

Yesterday the Federal government bought 13 units for the Nigerian police.

Lurker4Long:
You do realise the ability to wage war does not depend only on the materiel a country possesses, right?
Do Egypt, Algeria, Morocco have the economic and industrial depth and sophistiscation to wage war independently for a lengthy period of time as Nigeria or South Africa?

For real, are you really asking this question?

I thought this would be obvious by now.

Off course they do.

Odunayaw:
And he simply proved that the weaponry of the Buyan is within the scope of a Corvette.

this your cover up of poor knowledge with E-fights cracks me up every time

Buyan-M is a very well armed Corvette. They struck targets in Syria from the black sea.

Knowledge is also continuous. We learn everyday.

My point is, ships are primarily classified by displacement, not weaponry.

Although one thing is certain, you cannot change government policy direction from Nairaland.

jln115:
You said it is armed like a destroyer......

Please read properly, I said if weaponry is the case, I did not call it a destroyer or a frigate.

Kindly do not quote me, as I won't respond to you any longer on this topic.

jln115:
Again fitted for but not with and you are comparing cold War era ships with modern integrated frigates!!

Bros, you have been boxed in. South-Korea faces a threat from North-Korea. They are technically still at war, so their ships and military equipments are manufactured so that they are easily upgradable.

Algerian2:
Even if this global fire ranking use demographic , geographic, economic stats for country ranking . for me this is a big mystery for why morocco is not 3rd in africa ranking . they have better equipments in number and quality in all sectors than south africcan , nigerian , angola , ethiopia and by far .

For airforce they have :
23 f16 block 52 15 F-16C / 8 F-16D ( that are upgraded to Block 70/72 . and they will receive 25 more last block 70/72. thats 48 F16 Viper ! and as US ally they got same technology and weapons than US on them .
27 Mirage F1/ MF2000 (upgraded)
28 Northrop F-5A/B/E/F ( upgraded to tiger III version)
24 Alphajet

Transport : 16 C130 / 4 Alenia C-27J Spartan / 7 CASA CN-235
They signed for 36 AH-64E Appach . they have 24 gazelle , 24 puma , 12 chinook , a hudge number of bell 205 .206. 202

Wich africcan air force (a part egypt ,algeria ) have better ?


For navy : they have . 1 FREMM , 3 sigma , 2 floreal . thats 6 frigates very well equiped

One Descubierta corvet and more than 20 different OPV and many other small patroller

For army : for tanks only the have :

384 M1A1 SA Abrams
148 T-72 B/V
453 M60-A3TTS upgraded to A3 version
54 MBT-2000 VT A1

Plus others artillery transport light armored vehicle ect...

For air defense they have

16 systems of the MIM-104 Patriot PAC 3 systems

32 systems of the chinese HQ9 long range defense system

48 MIM-72 Chaparral

+ the only true military spy satellite in africa with there Pléiades satelite


So realy i dont understand why moroccan army is not 3rd in africa

This is the truth.

jln115:
what? Bro it's not a game where you can just add what ever you like, those ships are specifically designed to carry only a set amount of Missiles and other weapon systems otherwise you need to reintegrate the whole combat management system and the deck layout by which point you are designing a new ship!

Unless it says fitted for but not with then you can't add additional missiles!

There are many instances were a missile is added to a ship.

In the picture below, a cutter, just like the same ship we have in Nigeria is armed and firing a missile.

You are out of your depth.

jln115:
stop reading Wikipedia bro and do actual research.

Yes the Buyan class has 8 SSMs which is more or less standard with most frigates however it only has 8 SAMs and those missiles are very short legged and meant for last ditch close air defence. Also only has 2 ciws and 2 7.62mm guns...... It's buy no means a frigate even less a destroyer

You seem you read with the intention of not to understand.

This post you quoted, go back and read it again. At no point did I say a Buyan-m is a Frigate.

Are you high?

jln115:
Incheon-class is a light frigate hence the price!!

Let's quickly compare NNS Aradu with the Incheon-class quickly:


Aradu. Vs Incheon class
Main gun: 127mm vs 127mm
SAMs: 24 vs 0
SSM: 8. Vs 2
Dual purpose guns: 8. Vs 1
Torpedo tubs: 6. Vs 6

Which looks stronger to you?

The Aradu is obviously stronger, however SAMs can be added to the Incheon. 2 ships that are brand new is better than having an old ship for 10 years only.

jln115:
Erc90s are recon vehicles, they are not armoured enough for fire support, even though they do occasionally fil that role!

Well, in Nigeria and France they are used in assault roles. We've seen that in Mali and in Nigeria.

jln115:
well if that's the case(which I highly doubt) then I seriously question the doctrine used by the Nigerian military!

You're entitled to your own opinion.

jln115:
the ERC-90 is first and foremost a recon vehicle!!

It's used as a tank fire support in the Nigerian army. Each country defines how they use their vehicles.

ERC-90 and Scorpion light tanks are used as Tank Fire Support/Infantry Support Vehicles. The Nigerian army can replace them with the FNSS Kaplan.

GeneralFarouq:
[s]You argue too much and almost blind only discover later that you were wrong..
He is saying the N.E been our present and most likely future challenge is better suited for wheeled and not track .. while u keep going out of context bringing in the south where of course tracked would be better suited[/s].

Read from the beginning, then come back and make a sensible comment.

Most of you hear just talk stupidly without reading.

Odunayaw:
You don't get what an Infantryman's war is don't you? The war in bakassi were mostly on foot. Ambushes and Skirmishes

I am not arguing about the suitability of wheels to marshy lands. Not at all.

Let's agree to disagree.