₦airaland Forum

@Poster

Pray for your friend and commit to Christ's hands. Pray unceasingly. Make sure that you are also a true Christian. One that lives by the commandments of God and shows love to God and his neighbours and enemies.

Sometimes quoting Bible verses does not move people to believe. Actions do. By your good example he will "see" the goodness of God. We may not be able to physically "see" God, but people can see God in us. That is the most powerful way to lead people to God. Telling them one thing and doing another does not lead them to God. Living the life of a faithful and truthful Christian, will show your friend that God is real, and he is love, even in time of adveristy, he is the one that will stand by us when others forsake us. It may not be in our time, but it will be at God's time and God's time is the best.

Remember all things work out for the best for those who love God. Not some things, but all things, whether good or bad. It works out for the best.

The best example of this is the sacrifice of Christ. He was falsely accused, and hung to die byt hose who did not want to hear the truth and did not want to stand for justice, but the end result, salvation came to the world, not just a select few, but to all of us. We all can be saved, we need to believe and follow.
The best thing that ever happened to makind is the sacrifice of Christ.

Encourage him to know that no matter what he is going through it will work out for the best as long as he trusts in the Lord.
He needs to let go of his anger, it only gives way to the devil.

Did you read the above or you were told? You are beginning that to show that you lacked knowledge when it comes to your false post up. You may still back your post with proof

I have backed it up above. Any history book will back it up. Stop being lazy go and read on your history. I don't have to post anything, I will just wait for you to rebut my post.
Show me where the Christians attacked the Muslims first.

In the Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.

All praise and thanks are due to Allah, and peace and blessings be upon His Messenger.

Dear brother, thanks a lot for your good question. We commend your efforts in pursuit of knowledge.

First of all, it should be clear that Islam maintains the protection of life and does not sanction any violation against it, irrespective of the people’s religion, race, sect, etc, The Qur’an says about the prohibition of murder, “…Take not life, which Allah hath made sacred, except by way of justice and law: thus does He command you, that ye may learn wisdom.” (Al-An`am: 151) “Nor take life, which Allah has made sacred, except for just cause. And if anyone is slain wrongfully, We have given his heir authority (to demand Qisas or to forgive): but let him not exceed bounds in the matter of taking life; for he is helped (by the law)” (Al-Isra’: 33)

According to the Qur’an, killing any person without a just cause is as big a sin as killing the whole humanity and saving the life of one person is as good deed as saving the whole humanity. (See Al-Ma’idah: 32) Muslims do not hate – let alone kill - non-Muslims, be they Christians, Jews, Hindus, Buddhist or followers of any religion or no religion. Our religion does not allow killing any innocent person regardless of his or her religion. The life of all human beings is sacrosanct according to the teachings of the Qur’an and the guidance of our blessed Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him and upon all the Prophets and Messengers of Allah.

When we Muslims state that Islam is a religion of peace, we are not trying to prove something unreasonable or solve a crossword puzzle. Rather, we are just stating a fact backed by clear-cut evidence and unquestionable proofs. Even we don’t need to state this fact, for Islam, in itself, is self-explanatory, in terms of its meaning, its noble teachings and the core of its message conveyed by the Prophets Allah sent to mankind.

With that statement, we don’t intend to sound apologetic, for Islamic concept of peace is very clear. It does not mean weakness, slavishness or surrendering to aggression and injustice. The Islamic concept of peace aims at securing security and harmony for the whole world, without any discrimination as to religion, race or color. Thus, Islam, right from its inception, waged a total war against injustice and oppression. It has made it clear that people should not be deprived of having access to the light of guidance. But throughout its history you can never find any trace of infringing upon people’s right to self expression, even at times that such right was misused. The cogent example to be mentioned here is the way the Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, received the two envoys sent by Musailamah Al-Kazzab (the Liar). His fine remarks always ring in mind whenever the issue of diplomatic immunity comes to fore. He, peace and blessings be upon him, told the envoys when they addressed him in a very provocative way: “If not that the envoys should not be killed, I’d have ordered for you to be beheaded”, thus laying down the rule that was later codified as one of the principles of the modern international law.

The point here is, it’s not of the Islamic teachings to kill people just because they happen to be non-Muslims or happen to disagree with Muslims on some points. What attests to this is the fact that the first war in the Islamic history would have never occurred if not that the enemies of Islam could not be satisfied with expelling Muslims from their home (Makkah), rather they planned to carry the aggression to Madinah in order to exterminate Muslims once and for all. So the question that should have been asked is: why do opponents are always on the trail of Muslims?

Focusing more on your question, Sheikh Ahmad Kutty, a senior lecturer and an Islamic scholar at the Islamic Institute of Toronto, Ontario, Canada, states[/b]:

“Islam is indeed a religion of love and peace. Islam does not teach people to kill all those who disagree with them simply because they disagree with them. If certain bigoted Muslims did so that is not the fault of Islam. How unjust would it be to say that Christianity is a religion that teaches violence and blood shed by looking at the historical performance of some so-called Christians: After all, Hitler who committed genocide against the Jews, the white supremacists in South America who practiced barbarities against the blacks, the Serbs who committed genocide against the Muslims in Bosnia, those who systematically practiced mass slaughter of Muslims and Jews in Spain, and burned heretics, etc. all claimed to be Christians. What about the Christians still killing each other in Ireland? So why use double standards in judging Islam? Stereotyping is wrong regardless of against whom we use it.

[b]Vast majority of Muslims have nothing to do with such violence or bloodshed that may or may not have been committed by those who claim to be Muslims. According to the strict verdict of the Qur’an, taking life of a single human being unjustly is akin to taking the life of all humanity. A good Muslim, therefore, is one who believes in sanctity of all life. The Prophet, peace be upon him, taught us that if a person were to kill even a single little sparrow, it would appear before the Lord of the worlds seeking God’s justice against the person!” (Source: www.islam.ca)

You all are so quick to try to blind the rest of us. Sacred life is only muslim life. Peace is only for muslims. No one is judging Islam, we're just asking you to acknowledge the truth of your religion. I cannot understand for the life of me, why muslims keep quoting verses that have been abrogated by Allah. See at one point Allah accepted all people Jews and Christians included, until the Jews and Christians dismissed Muhammad and his religion and refused to follow him so he received these revelations.

Sura 9:5 Slay the unbelievers whereever you find them.
Sura 2:256 Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme
Sura 8:39 Make war on them until idolatry shall cease and Allah's religion shall reign supreme

There are plenty more. I USED to accept the peaceful suras when I heard them, until I read of the hateful suras, and then I asked why does the Quran contradict itself, and was told that those allah can chage his mind and I was shown the abrogation theory, then I realised that under the abrogation theory those suras that were revealed later abrogated the former. The peacefl ones are the former and the hateful one are the latter. Allah abrogated the peaceful ones.
I didn't want to believe it, all this while I have been defending muslims, saying only the radicals are twisting the quran to teir benefit and that the quran didn't even state those, until I read tem myself and learnt more about the religion itself.

I realise that the muslims who are ignorant of their religion are the ones that tell me it is peaceful. But here's the difficult part, how can I differentiate the ones who are ignorant about their religion and those who are just plain lying to me to try to woo me over (well except for olabowale, he has been caught lying too many times by me). So now I don't feel safe around my muslim friends anymore. I'm afraid that if tomorrow is judgment day and I were shopping with one of them, I might be the Christian given to him/her to kill so that they can get into heaven.

Where are did you get your story, had jerusalem not conquered before muslims took over. Muslims took over jerusalem and everybody were living in peace, both christians and jews were accorded right to practice their religion. until christian came with their terror, killed both jews and muslims as well as pagans. All subsequent crusades were much all persecution against muslims and Jews.

I'm sorry but your history is a whole lotta wrong.
Go and do your research and then come and tell me who invaded and conquered first. Islam was nothing to Christians, Islam did not exist in Jerusalem, incase you don't know your history but Christians and Jews and lived in Jerusalem until the Muslims decided to claim the "holy land" remember Muhammad didn't receive revelations until well into the 5th century, so when did the muslims start inhabiting Jerusalem before the Jews and Christians?

So, that was the begining of their terrorism?

No terrorism in Christianity thank you. That is the reason why we are not viewed as terrorists. Because guess what we don't go around bombing people in the name of a god.

Then explain clearly what happen during the crusades and of what terror has muslims commited. Saudi Arabia is one of the most peacefull country in the world, of what terror have they commited against any nation. Can't you ever think of separating state from religion and see who is more terrorist. I don't know why peoples are narrowminded  because of what they hear from the media. Can't yourelf think of Niger delta issues where we have much christians, if niger delta is position in the north, can you think of media captions.

1) There's always a separation of Church and State but in Islam there isn't one. Infact the Islamic law is the law in muslim lands with a few exceptions, but you know very well that in ISlam secularism is not welcome.
2) You are so uneducated when it comes to the terror that Islam has started since its inception, so I will take it upon myself to educate you. Make sure you pay attention to the dates.

Byzantine-Arab wars 634-750
Conquest of Persia 633-651
Conquest of Transoxiana: 662-709
Conquest of Sindh: 664-712
Conquest of Hispania: 711-718
Conquest of the Caucasus: 711-750
End of the Umayyad conquests: 718-750
Conquest of Nubia: 700-1606
Incursions into Southern Italy: 831-902
Conquest of Anatolia: 1060-1360
First crusade 1095-1099

Notice that all those muslim invasions happened before the crusades started. So dear it is not I but you who are very ignorant of history. You think I am lying, go and look it up yourself. Find out the first muslim invasion and then find out the first crusade, then come back and tell me who invaded who first.

Saudi Arabia is peaceful because muslims live there. I bet you the Christians don't find it peaceful. Peace in Islam is only to muslims not to the Christians and Jews or non muslims. It is a hard truth, but it is the truth.
Don't forget Saudi Arabia did not start existing today, but before Muhammad, and after Muhammad ARABIA launched a war against the infidels.
I guess there's peace when the ubeleivers subdue and pay the jizyah. But what freedom is that. They also cannot practice their belief or pray.

Muslims on the other hand are permitted to pray and have mosques and live freely in non muslim nations, but non muslims are not permitted to do so, even in lands that once belonged to them, and first belonged to them, not the muslims.

You may not be paying attention to the media, but they are not in support of the Niger Deltans, they condemn them and because of them discourage people from going to Nigeria limiting our investors. They view the Niger eltans as barbaric. SO open your eyes my dear.

I don't condone any kind of war, but I cannot stand people who don't know their history. Go and learn. Thanks.

Now tell me if the early wars muslims fought you equate to terrorist acts.

Yes they invaded people's lands and claimed it as their own. They raped women and put children into slavery, killed the men, and then told them to "choose Islam or choose death". That is not a choice. That is not freedom, that is not peace.

Yes I agree if religious is politics with christian being the first player follows by others. However, you stereotype to name individual commiting crime after their religion; abi!

Um no Christians are not the first, if  Christians are the first, abortion would be banned, gay mariage would be banned, but we know that they are not. There is a separation in Church and State, go and read the constitution of the USA, Britain, France , and other Western Countries. Not all western countries are Christian. Infact none of them are. None of them are governed by the Bible, they are goverened by the people.
Get educated.

You speak not out of ignorance now exposes the ignorant in you, because you are confident and likewise arrogant

yes see very confident, why? because I know the history of the crusades and the invasion of muslims before the retaliation of christians.
Am I condoning the crusades, no, I don't like war, especially the one in Iraq, I cannot stand Bush, he invaded for no reason, I am still waiting on the weapons of mass destruction.

ARROGANT? NAH, I JUST HAPPEN TO KNOW THE TRUTH. And guess what? i can back it up with historical facts.

Says who?

Jesus, I already posted it above go and read, hopefully you will be wise enough to learn.

Na lie. Dont give me that because I have shed light on that in one of threads. Jesus is God and he cried to himself for forsaken himself. He also prayed to himself to save him from death and said to himself that let your will be done. Common, enough of this blasphemy.

1) You never shed any light all you did was jump and shout "na lie" you weren't expecting to find what you asked for, you found it and couldn't believe it, and so you resorted to the same old thing, they corrupted the books, which you still have not proven.

Na lie, I have rebuffed this in that thread on trinity, you have no explanation with regards to trinity

Lol it's amazing how in the beginning of your post you said this.

Thank God admitting the fact that he is subject to God and it shows that he couldnt be on the same level with God.

Now if you accpet that, how can you not accept the next, because they show the same thing. Oh wait that's right, the thing you always said didn't make sense actually made sense, and that scared you. so you resorted to your usual "na lie"

Jesus and God are not same and if they are, please who did he pray to and who did he shout that why has thou forsaken him and why could he had been forsaken?

Jesus prayed to his Father, our Father. The one who sent him, the one whom is not mutilated till date, since Jesus is his right hand.
Um it was the prophecy? and God doesn't abrogate (you recognise that don't you) his word.

Do all christians believe in your trinity and did early christians believe in such? Did Jesus call himself God?

No not all those who call themselves Christians believe, those are whom we call heretics. AND YES THE EARLY CHRISTIANS BELIEVED IT TOO. Infact that is the sole reason why the Trinity had to be defined. You had those who stayed true to the teachings of Christ as passed down to us from the Apostles (Peter, James, John, Matthew, and more), and then there are those who just like you have little understanding of the teachings of Jesus and wanted to use the flesh to understand the teachings of Jesus, so those who stayed true to the teachings, decided to put an end to the madness and clearly define the Trinity as revealed to us from God himself through his Word.
Nope and he didn't have to, others did and he never rebuked them.

Na lie, proof please.

I promise this is like playing ring around the rosy or you just plainly have amnesia, you will do well to remember these next passages so as not to ask it again.

John 3:12-18

12 If I tell you about earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you about heavenly things?
13 No one has gone up to heaven except the one who has come down from heaven, the Son of Man.
14 And just as Moses lifted up the serpent in the desert, so must the Son of Man be lifted up
15 so that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life
16 For God so loved the world that he sent his only begotten Son, so that everyone who believes in him might not perish but might have eternal life
17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world but that the world might be saved through him
18 Whoever believes in him will not be condemned but whoever does not believe in him has already been condemned, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.

Na lie and do you care if we verify your above statement?

Go ahead dismiss it. Show proof that the books were not written at different times and at different places. I am waiting, I will put this to rest. Go ahead.

I thought the bible was inspired, so why the contradictions?

To your understanding there are, but to mine and billions of people's understanding there are no contradictions to the message of Jesus Christ.

Are you sure of what you said about Paul?

Very sure. Infact you will do well to show me the message preached by Jesus and his apostles and then the ones preached by Paul, if they are different.

Do you read your bible at all? I am sure we will soon expose Paul as we proceed.

Go ahead, expose him.

Do you care to share that with me?

Very well.

Roman Historian Tacitus wrote:

Nero fastened the guilt . . . on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of . . . Pontius Pilatus, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judaea, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome

This was of the fire that broke out in A.D. 64 that Emperor Nero blamed the Christians for, even though he set the fire himself.
What can we make of this?

Notice, first, that Tacitus reports Christians derived their name from a historical person called Christus (from the Latin), or Christ. He is said to have "suffered the extreme penalty," obviously alluding to the Roman method of execution known as crucifixion. This is said to have occurred during the reign of Tiberius and by the sentence of Pontius Pilatus. This confirms much of what the Gospels tell us about the death of Jesus.

Source: Tacitus, Annals 15.44, cited in Strobel, The Case for Christ, 82


Pliny the Younger to Emperor Trajan, seeking advice as to how he should handle those guilty of being Christians:


They were in the habit of meeting on a certain fixed day before it was light, when they sang in alternate verses a hymn to Christ, as to a god, and bound themselves by a solemn oath, not to any wicked deeds, but never to commit any fraud, theft or adultery, never to falsify their word, nor deny a trust when they should be called upon to deliver it up; after which it was their custom to separate, and then reassemble to partake of food--but food of an ordinary and innocent kind

What can we get from this?

This passage provides us with a number of interesting insights into the beliefs and practices of early Christians. First, we see that Christians regularly met on a certain fixed day for worship. Second, their worship was directed to Christ, demonstrating that they firmly believed in His divinity.
Not only does Pliny's letter help us understand what early Christians believed about Jesus' person, it also reveals the high esteem to which they held His teachings. For instance, Pliny notes that Christians bound themselves by a solemn oath not to violate various moral standards, which find their source in the ethical teachings of Jesus

Source: Pliny, Letters, transl. by William Melmoth, rev. by W.M.L. Hutchinson (Cambridge: Harvard Univ. Press, 1935), vol. II, X:96, cited in Habermas, The Historical Jesus, 199

Lucian:

The Christians . . . worship a man to this day--the distinguished personage who introduced their novel rites, and was crucified on that account. . . . [It] was impressed on them by their original lawgiver that they are all brothers, from the moment that they are converted, and deny the gods of Greece, and worship the crucified sage, and live after his laws

Although Lucian is jesting here at the early Christians, he does make some significant comments about their founder. For instance, he says the Christians worshipped a man, "who introduced their novel rites." And though this man's followers clearly thought quite highly of Him, He so angered many of His contemporaries with His teaching that He "was crucified on that account."
Although Lucian does not mention his name, he is clearly referring to Jesus. But what did Jesus teach to arouse such wrath? According to Lucian, he taught that all men are brothers from the moment of their conversion. That's harmless enough. But what did this conversion involve? It involved denying the Greek gods, worshipping Jesus, and living according to His teachings. It's not too difficult to imagine someone being killed for teaching that. Though Lucian doesn't say so explicitly, the Christian denial of other gods combined with their worship of Jesus implies the belief that Jesus was more than human. Since they denied other gods in order to worship Him, they apparently thought Jesus a greater God than any that Greece had to offer!


I sriously hope you took your time to read all that, if indeed you ruly are on the search for truth. If you really do want to gain knowledge you will do well to research these authors. Your motivation can be to disprove Christianity, yup that should be enough motivation for you. So go ahead, research and disprove Christianity.

I've never found any evidence to indicate that Jesus saw himself as God.

You may not have found it, but the rest of us have.

John 8: 24
For if you do not believe that I AM, you will die in your sins

John 8:28
So Jesus said to them "When you lift up the Son of Man, then you will realise that I AM, and that I do nothing on my own, but I say only what the Father taught me."

John 8:57 - 58
57 So the Jews said to him, you ae not yet fifty years old and you have seen Abraham?
58 Jesus said to them, "Amen, Amen, I say to you, before Abraham came to be I AM"

The "I AM" Jesus uses to identify himself, is the I AM Moses uses to Identify God to the Isrealites, so that they may come to believe that he was sent from God.

In fact just this morning I was reading from John where Jesus is praying to God "Sanctify them through thy truth; they word is truth. As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world. , And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one; I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me." The Bible do not teach that Jesus was God in the flesh. In the Gospels, Jesus refers to himself as the Son of God, not as God, and he frequently mentions and speaks with his Father, God.

Jesus (Son of God) is the Word of God in the flesh, now please tell me who came first, God or his Word?

Jesus is always very clear that he is not God. In fact he rebukes Peter when Peter calls him "good", saying "there is none good but the Father."

The Father, Son, Spirit = God. The Son and the Spirit are the hands of the Father. You'll have to show me where God mutilated himself since his Son (hand) are not a part of him.

It was God who raised Jesus from the dead and exalted him to his right hand. Acts 2:32, 33 says: "This Jesus God resurrected, of which fact we are all witnesses. Therefore because he was exalted to the right hand of God."

Again, I ask when did God mutilate himself.

Also, the bible says that God has no beginning and no ending. Jesus had both, so he can't be God

I am so glad you brought this up.

John 1:1-4
1. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 He was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made through him, and without him nothing came to be. What came to be
4 through him was life, and this life was the light of the human race

John 1:29-30
29 The next day he (John the Baptist) saw Jesus coming toward him and said, "Behold the Lamb of God, who takes away the sins of the world.
30 He is the one of whom I said, "A man is coming after me who ranks ahead of me because he existed before me."

John was older than Jesus physically.

John 5:21 -23
21 For just as the Father raises the dead and gives life, so also does the Son give life to whomever he wishes.
22 Nor deos the Father judge anyone, but has given all judgment to his Son
23 so that all may honour the Son just as they honour the Father. Whoever does not honour the Son does not honour the Father who sent him.

That was Jesus speaking.

I am also very glad you brought up that passage in John (John 17), you must have missed this part: John 17: 5 "Now glorify me Father, with you, with the glory that I had with you before the world began."

Yeah that was Jesus speaking too.

The only one who existed in he beginning was God, and now we know that Jesus existed in the beginning and that he will come to earth again in the end, even the muslims believe that he is still alive and that he was taken up to heaven, so what does that make him?

Hey Pam

The hate of muslims is not condoned by the Bible. The Bible calls us to love our enemies, which includes those who want to kill us or whose religion calls for our death, i.e. muslims.

You may be angry at the them, but you must not act on that anger and you will have to forgive and forget soon enough. Let the anger go, love is much more powerful. Especially love for God.

A de same ting wid Jesus. Because he said "[i]Therefore no one can come to the Father except through Him. We accept Him as our Father. If Jesus is God, why did he say My God, My God, why have thou forsaken me? Why Jesus kept praying to God?

Because he is subject to the Father. He is the Word and can do nothing without the Father. But along with the Father he existed from the beginning. The Word/law spoken to the prophets is who Jesus the Christ is. He is the Word of God in the flesh. The law that God gave to man is whom we call Jesus. He is the right hand of God. Separating him from God the Father is mutilating God. Just as if I were to separate you from your right hand I will be mutilating you. But still just as your hand is a part of you, it cannot do anything without your command.
In simplest terms, the Father is "the brain" that sends out the command, and the Son is "the hand" that carries it out.

Just as your hand is subject to you, so is the Son subject to the Father, and just as your hand is not separate from you so is the Son not separate from the Father.
Your hand may be called Cayon's hand, but in essence it is still Cayon and no one else.

Your mother left you with your aunt or grandmother when you were a baby
Even though you know you have a mother, you still say to people she (aunt/grandmother) is like a mother to me.

Except my grandmother or aunt is not the same as my mother in essence and in person. They have their own different identities. Jesus and the Father are the same. Ok in simplest terms. If Jesus was to be found and a DNA was to be done it would show God's DNA (note: I am not saying that God is physical, but I wanted to use that to show you that Jesus is God)

Christians refer to Jesus as my Lord and my God b/c again

He said "Therefore no one can come to the Father except through Him (Jesus)."

No, Christians refer to Jesus as God because he let us know so. When he was called God by his apostles he never disputed it and when he spoke he identified himself as God with the name for God.
He also let us know that he is he saviour of mankind.

And no the Christians did not corrupt the Bible, the books were written by different witnesses at different times and they still tell the same story. It would have been absolutely impossible for the "corruption" to take place, because transportation was not as advanced as it is today, and because all of the apostles were undergoing persecution, they were not staying in one place and it was higly difficult for them to be around each other all the time. Take St. John for example, he was imprisoned on the Island of Patmos, far far away from the other apostles. Yet he had the same message as the others.
As for St. Paul he did not contradict anything that the other apostles wrote, neither did he change anything, or enter into Christianity to destroy it from the inside. Don't forget that the Christians were already being killed for the same message that Paul preached. If he was trying to destroy it, the message being taught then won't be the same message today, but it is. It is impossible for Paul to have changed the message, because the message being taught is the message he persecuted. He didn't change it. The message changed him.

But it's not just the Bible that suppots it, the history of others support it. Those who hated Christianity spoke of the same message and they hated the message.

Hopefully a better way, or at least the same way the Christian tackled their Terrorist Crusaders, Polgromists, etc in Europe, and other places

Um I really didn't want to comment on this, but this caught my eye and I will just like to let you know that the Crusades were not terrorists. The only reason the crusades started was because the muslims invaded Christian lands, killed the men, raped the women, and forced them to convert "choose islam or choose death"

The Christians were standing up for themselves and claiming back their homes. It was in no means a "let's go kill the infidels"

Don't for one minute equate the crusades to the terrorism of Islam.


Now with that being said. I really think some of you just want to turn a blind eye to your history and your present and you future. Because you see, terrorism has always existed in Islam. Go check your history. If it all began in recent times, I would understand, but the fact that it has been going on since the inception and introduction of Islam to the world? It is hard to believe so.

And to the young lady who said that terrorism is just for political purpose? You may not have realised it but Islam is also religious and political. There is no separation of religion and politics in Islam. Not as there is a separation of Church and State.
So I guess Islam is terrorism, and no it is not out of ignorance that I speak. If you seriously believe that your religion is about peace, then you are very ignorant of your religion.

@ify
In Mathew 16:15, Jesus put it this way, 'But who do you say that I am?' One of His disciples, Simon Peter, replied: 'You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.' Tell me, did Jesus corrected Simon Peter and said No, I am God?

there's only one Master and thats God. God is Holy, He can't dwell in sin. In order for us to have a relationship with Him we must except Christ and overcome sin, He is to Holy to communictae with us as sinners. So, Jesus is like a bridge that connects the gap between us and God. Therefore no one can come to the Father except through Him (Jesus).

John 20:28-29
Thomas answered and said "My Lord and My God"
Jesus said to him, "Have you come to believe because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and have believed"

Tell me did Jesus correct Thomas and said No, I am not God?

Matthew 7:15,16

15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. 16 You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?

Lolol so you recognise yourself.
Honey that is the Christian belief, it has never been contested but by the heretics.
ALL DENOMINATIONS IN CHRISTIANITY BELIEVE IN THAT, EXCEPT THE HERETICS, AND THERE IS A CONSENSUS ON THE HERETICS, SO DEAR WHAT DOES THAT MAKE YOU?


Don't come quoting the Bible to me to prove yourself, even the devil, and muslims, and Jews quote the Bible. Come with something better, the truth, but then again you don't know it.

Oh, dear God, Father in heaven, you are the most high and worthy of praise and respect. I prayer from the bottom of the being, dear Father, that I may not and never win the grand million-pound lottery. In Jesus name, I prayer. Amen.

"You shall not put the Lord thy God to the test." Matthew 4:7

@~Lady~: Instead of trying to guess, we can ask the poster, if he/she is a christian? That will settle it, wouldn'y you agree with me?

I have no interest in whether the poster is muslim, Christian, buddhist or whatever, it has nothing to do with the topic. Instead of being mature and discussing the topic, you shift it to bashing the Christians. That is what is so upsetting especially after the poster did not state whether or not he or she is Christian.
You are supposed to be an elderly man, yet you result too such low and immature tactics. It's really stupid.

There was no need in mentioning Christians or muslims or atheists or witches, point is "do you carry amulets?" u could have answered the question or ignored it, rather than turning it into a find a fault in Christianity parade.
Grow Up. Act your age for a change.

No one says that a muslim will change color. But there is a shine or a glow to the face of a muslim, after salah. I will show it to you, when I see you.

No thanks, you might think I am the Christian that allah gives to you to kill so that you will make it to heaven. So if you will please excuse me I will stick to the religion that doesn't think killing is the "in" thing to do or that killing will lead you to heaven.

You will observe the faces of muslim women, immediately they come out of salah. The dull is only your own opinion.

I have and they look just the same. I know you want to see shine shine iyawos so you can have your pick on which one to marry now or fantasize if they will resemble the ones allah will give you in heaven so that you can ravage them and they will still remain a virgin.

Your memory of the Nigerian muslims have faded some. Remember you were young then. What is shine/glow to you then is more of bleaching the skin

Please recognise that I am not one of your "less intelligent" muslim sisters. Don't come here telling me something about me when you don't know me. I know what a woman's glow looks like I am a woman and I have a glow, and every woamn's glow is uniquely hers. Bleaching of the skin makes a woman look less human. Don't insult my memories.

Girl, you are feisty. And Islam will liberate you from the curse of Genesis that is transferred and the original sin because of eating of the fruit of the apple tree.

Liberate me to where? To the less intelligent gender that gets blamed for the sins of men? Or the one who won't make it to heaven because of their gender? Or the one that can't express herself and have to adopt a new identity? Or the one who has to share her husband with other women? Or the one who can be raped and be blamed for being reaped? Or the one who can be divorced at the say of the phrase "I divorce you" meanwhile she can't do that to her husband? Or the one who gets killed because she decides to have a voice? Or the one who is a second class citizen? Or the one who's vote is half of a man's? Or the one who's witness is always considered to be less credible even if she saw it with her own two eyes and the man didn't?

To where I beg of you tell me? To bondage? GOD FORBID HIS BEAUTIFUL CREATION TO SUFFER AT THE HANDS OF EVIL!!!!

I am already liberated, thank you. I am already liberated by God himself, so I have no need for anything less than HIM!!!

Then how do you explain the Old Testament God, versus the New Testament God, if you are talking about "does'nt change His mind when He wants to prove how "human" he is and not devine?"

Please don't misquote me. I said proving how human he is and not divine and I was talking about allah, not Jesus Christ, go back and read.

sure, year 3000 sth.

LOLOLOL.

Well my mom told me that once Nigeria was suppose to hold Mrs. World, but unfortunatley being a mostly Islamic country, the northerners raided the area and all the ladies ran and said they would never come back.

OMG are you serious? What kind of idiocrisy is that?

absolute garbage!!!

Thank you.

then remove the cobweb from your pea size brain and enlighten me.

gladly, but first pay attention to what MissyB posted above in John.

Jesus is not just called the Son of God, but also the Word of God. He existed in the beginning as the Word of God, he is he law that was spoken through the prophets. HE IS ONE with the Father. The Word exists not without the Father, and through the Word the Father made his commands.

The Word and the Father may be separate in office but in essence are the same. God does not exist without his Word and the Word cannot exist without God. To separate them in essence is to dissect God.

However the Word is subject to the Father and does nothing unless the Father wills it.
So the Words out of the mouth of God is who we call Jesus the Christ (annointed one).
It's kinda like us humans we may have a thought, but only when we will it, will our words come out of our mouth and cary out our commands.
Your word is your own and your word is you. You are not separate from your word and neither is your word separated from you.

Huxley

Jesus does not stop being God in order to be Christ. Christ means annointed one. Neither does he stop being Christ to becoem God. Basically the Christ and God are the same.

The poster of this amulet thread is not muslim either. I am comfortable to say that he is Christian, because only Christians start wierd religious thread. The atheist and agnostics engage people, but not through a silly more diabolic thread like this one.

No ne made the assupmtion or claim that they were muslims. Then you are quite immature in your finding. For someone who handles millions of dollars, it is hard to believe that you make such an immature assumption. Not only Christians start weird religious threads, a lot of atheists do so and so do muslims.
There are also secular people too, thanks. Don't be quick to label anyone a Christian thanks.

The starter of this Amulet thread is Christian. Lets wager, if you are sure. lol.

You don't get it do you. It is about making assumptions, they did not in anyway post a banner that said that they are Christians. In case you forget we are in a forum, it is not like you can see them. You can't just jump to conclusions when you feel like it.

And I did not jump to conclusion in this case

Did they tell you that they are Christians in this thread?

A true muslim is known by the mark of prostrations, and the light or glow of the face, especially after Salah.

I know too many muslims who adhere to the rules in islam and they look he same before and after salah. a lot of them are in Nigeria. I grew up around muslims and knew when they were observig something. They had no glow, they were still as black as ever and dull too.

You should try it. Only if I can get you to relax, pretending to be a nun, but cover up more than do.

No thanks. I actually like my freedom rather than bondage. So nope thank you. Oh yeah I also like truth and not lies. I also like a Holy Book that doesn't contradict history and itself rather than one that does all the time. I also like worshipping a God that doesn't change his mind when he wants to proving how human he is and not divine.

so does anyone think Naija may one day host the Olympic games?

I was so sad when I saw it this morning.
He was one of my favorite Kings of Comedy.
I will miss his jokes.

Lord may he rest in your perfect peace.
Amen.

I missed the beginning, and also Nigeria marching in.
But the end was fantastic especially when the last torch carrier soared to the sky and was running in the air on the screen, that was beautiful.

I was pretty upset at the nations that refused women on their team, the Afghans even went so far as to send death threats to the only woman that was on he team that she had to hide for her life. Just for sports o, one has to die. I will keep her in my prayers, and I ask that you all do the same.

@ Poster

Congrats, and happy married life.

hey peeps,
hope y'all had a restful night. . .
today is the second day of the novena in preparation for the feast of Our Lady's Assumption. . . just a REMINDER!

Yeah I programmed it into my PDA. Daily reminder.

guys, see the interesting pix i found below of Pope Benedict XVI walking with his brother, Msgr. Georg Ratzinger, in Bressanone, Italy July 31. The pope was spending his summer holiday at a seminary where he used to vacation as a cardinal

Oh wow, they look alike so much.

hi lady, please come online more often if u can.

how is your mum and have u found another job yet? how's studies?

Hi Carl, I will try.
Mum is doing great. I haven't found a new job yet. I had an interview yesterday and I thank God that he was with me, because I don't know how I could have made it through that. I was so nervous, but as soon as I stepped into the conference room, I felt a peace that is hard to describe. I will find out on Monday. I would really like to work there, they do so much to help children, and I want to be a part of that.

I hope you are doing well. Stay blessed. Please pray for me.

Isn't this a Christian section and the Poster is a christian? I want to hear your voice, today. Unfailingly. Today and not tomorrow. You hear, woman. And don't bring that stubbornness on the phone. park it prior to dialling. lol. Nigeria woman.

Correction it is not a Christian section, it is a eligion section. The only religion that has it's own section is Islam. The rest of us share. Or maybe you haven't seen other postings that have nothing to do with Chrisitanity.

The posters did not say that they are Christians. Not only Christians post in the religion section, clearly you are posting, don't forget that the atheist are posting here too and starting topics.

So once again did the posters have a banner that said that they were Christians? No they did not. STOP JUMPING TO CONCLUSIONS.

Adedibu, Alao Akala, Arisekola Alao, Abacha(had 500 babalawos from across africa in his dais in asorock), you want more muslims involved with juju?

LOLOLOL, thanks jare. You can post more if you want, it's a free forum.

What Gospel are you referring to? Jews serve the same God with you if you believe in one God and not your so called trinity that has been nailed to the wall and in which Jews do not believe in.

Unfortunately for you, you just contradicted yourself, the Trinity is the same One God, whether you like it or not. Just like whether the atheist like it or not, God still exists.
So get over it.

Kai, I pray for your soul to see the truth before its late. I was like before realising the truth and the bible tells you that you prove all things and hold fast to which is the truth and you have not been able to explain the so called trinity you preach. What false one did Muhammad (saw) portrayed and we would see if really you worship  God as He ought to be worshipped

Are you ready for it, because I can take weeks pointing it out to you.

Here we go again, is there anywhere he told you to accept him as your personal saviour and that you would not be saved without accepting him as one?

Ok you really need to stop asking for things that you don't want to see. Because I will definitely give you an answer, so here it goes.

John 3:16-18

16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world might be saved through him.
18 Whoever believes in him will not be condemned, but whoever does not believe has already been condemned, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.

The above was Jesus speaking to Nicodemus, a rabbi.

I have questioned and provided rebuttal to the doctrines you have been preaching, giving you verses from your bible to nail you and I still wonder why people would still want to accept it having exposed it.

That's because everyone can see that you have not in anyway provided a rebuttal but only proven what the Trinity is. Are you frustrated? Sorry, keep wondering why people won't turn, it is because man does not win against God.
The Church will always stand, we are protected by God himself. We will stand till the end, no amount of false teachings from Islam will change that. You can scratch your head all you want, wondering why it is that the Christians stay true to the faith and are always successful in preaching the Gospel. I will tell you why.
It is because we speak the truth, it is because we are God's own people. It is because we serve a loving God. It is because God is the way, the truth, and the life. He does not lie and does no abrogate his word. He is all knowing and all powerful, he makes no mistakes. He gets it done right the first time and has no need for a newer model, so he does not need to come up with something better. God is not man, he gets it right the first time. He is not confined to time and space.
God does not subject people to bondage, he does not turn his back on his creation even when the creation turns their back on God. He does not prohibit anything on earth and allow it in heaven, he doesn't have a double standard.
God does not reason like man.
God is Love, God is Light, God is Truth, God is Wisdom.

Mind you, the thread on trinity is still on and you have my support for any issues in christianity you would want you and me to adress using probably the bible as the only support.

You haven't answered my questions.

That what please?

You know not what I was talking about with Olabowale, that was personal. Thank you.

A question which troubles some people and which is sometimes discussed openly is the following: How can we show kindness, affection, and good treatment to non-Muslims since Allah Ta'ala Himself prohibits Muslims to take non-believers as friends, allies, and supporters in such verses as the following:
"O you who believe, do not take the Jews and Christians as friends; they are the friends (only) of each other. And whoever among you turns to them (for friendship) is certainly one of them; indeed, Allah does not guide the people who do wrong, "
The answer to this is that these verses are not unconditional, to be applied to every Jews, Christian, or non-Muslims. Interpreting them in this manner contradicts the injunctions of the Qur'an which enjoins affection and kindness to the good and peace-loving people of every religion, as well as the verses which permit marriage to the women ot the people of the Book, with all that Allah says concerning marriage- "and He has put love and mercy between you" (30:21)- and the verse concerning the Christians:

The nice verses were abrogated when "Allah" decided to wage war against the Christians and Jews. Not because the Jews and Christians were a physical threat but because they did not buy into Muhammad infact they ignored him, and expected all to see through him. Basically brushing him aside. Muhammad became angry and resorted to calling them "apes and swine" and no it is not to some Jews, but to all Jews.
The nice verses were revealed before the Jews and Christians rejected Islam, the not so nice ones were revealed after the Jews and Christians rejected Islam. Allah changed his word, he abrogated the former and replaced it with the latter.

", And thou wilt find those who say, 'Surely we are Christians,' to be nearest to them (the Muslims) in affection,
The verses cited above were  revealed in connection with those people who were hostile to Islam and made war upon the Muslims. Accordingly, it is not permissible for the Muslims to support or assist them- that is,to be their ally- nor to entrust them with secrets at the expense of his own religion and community. This point is explained in other verses, in which Allah Ta'ala says;
They will spare nothing to ruin you; they yearn for what makes you suffer. Hatred has been expressed by their mouths, but what their hearts conceal is still greater. Thus have We made clear to you the revelations (or signs), if you possess understanding. Ah! You love them, but they do not love you, (3:118-119)

Sorry but no one was hostile to Islam, Islam was ignored. The hositility came when Islam desecrated the holy lands of the Jews and Christians and killed the Jews and Christians giving them the option of choose Islam or choose death.
The hostility began with Islam.

This Qur'anic statement gives the assurance that this bitter host hostility and deep hatred will pass way, as it is also stated in the hadith,
"Hate your enemy mildly; he may become your freind one day."

So how then will you explain this:

"Allah's Apostle said, 'The Hour will not be established until you fight all the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say, 'O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him." - Bukhari, vol 4, book 56, no. 2926.

Another Hadith proclaims "When judgment day arrives, Allah will give every Muslim, a Jew or a Christian to kill so that the Muslim will not enter into hell fire." - Mishkat Al-Messabih, vol 2, no. 5552.

Indeed there will be peace but only after all converts to Islam or dies in their "unbelieving faith"


Don't come here to try to paint Islam as a religion of peace, it is only peace for Muslims. If not why then are the Christians and Jews still persecuted in the muslims lands. They are not allowed to practice their faith openly. No one objects to muslims in America or in other nations that are not predominantly muslim. Muslims are allowed to practice their faith everywhere, but others cannot practice their faith in muslim lands. That is not peace my dear.

Universal jihad will not end until everyone dies or converts to Islam.

Verse 29 does not mean that the person is a destruction person. It means that the person has been earmarked for destruction. This is how it read on New Century Version;

earmarked by whom? everyone has a choice. To use your own word to tell the actual saying: the person earmarked himself for destruction, as in the person chooses to be destructive.
Don't put your owninterpretation into it thank you.

I would like to preface this post by stating that this is NOT an anti-Jewish, anti-Israeli post. I am very much in favour of having a state as it is now as Israel and would not wish any harm to come to Israel. Neither do I wish any harm to the Palestinian people. I think the Jews and Arabs states basically have what it takes to build peace in the Middle East, were it not for both sides attachment to bronze age dogmas.

You know what setting the Bible asides, those lands historically belong to the Jews. They have habitated that land for thousands of years, it has been acknowledged in historical books as well as literature as their lands. Palestine never belonged to muslims, a lot of the muslim lands never belonged to the muslims, Infact the only land that is sure to have been arabic is Saudi Arabia. The rest became occupied by the muslims from their quest of Jihad.

The only reason those this fight is going on because of Islam. Arabia did not try to acquire Jewish lands until Muhammad said that they are "apes and swine."

So historically those lands belonged to the Jews. They already compromised and given up a lot for peace, but the Arabs don't want peace, at least not for the Jews, because they believe that the Jews should not be allowed to exist.

@~Lady~: If you continue to deny Islam its rightful place in the Salvation plan, then it is either that you are wrong or your Catholic Church declaration of it is wrong. Now which one of it is it, , who is right, you or your church? Call me. lol.

Maybe you missed this, so I'll remind you of it.

You know what I will say Yes. After realising that the Jews also serve the same God even though they deny the Gospel, they do profess the same faith of Abraham. I don't see why it is I can't accept Muslims profession. I accept it and pray that they will see the true nature of God and not the false one that Muhammad portrayed

Oh yeah don't confuse plan of salvation to actually mean salvation.

So don't push it. I know you want to be a Christian, but this is not the way to go. Look up to Christ. He is your saviour.


and no I am not calling you, you have not apologised for yor lies. You have to apologise to all Christians.

Muslims are followers of Muhammad. Muhammad taught us all the things the custodians of Catholic faith evaluated before coming to the conclusions they documented in the Cathecism and in the NOSTRA AETATE quoted below. Muhammad taught us that Jesus teachings must be followed, laws of Moses must be followed etc,etc, etc. I hope Lady will educate us on exactly what Muhammad did to deserve the comment she made above about him.

The following official position of Catholic Church (NOSTRA AETATE ) was voted on by 2,309 Bishops on 28th of October, 1965. It was adopted by 96% of the this Bishops. We have to remember that these bishops dovote their lives to Catholicism.

Please tell me when it is I wrote that.

I think the above quote only goes further to clarify the Cathecism of Catholic Church that I referred to at the begining of this topic.To crown it all, the above was signed by Pope Paul VI. Visitations of Pope John Paul II to Mosques, his public favourable comments on Islam and kissing of Quoran were only indications that he wholeheartedly agrees with what his predecessors did.

Either you were sleeping in Sunday school class when they taught that Jesus dined with the sinners or you didn't go and still decided to skip the part in the Bible about Jesus dinning with the sinners.

I had no intension to discredit Catholics and can not. Why will I want to discredit people who say these beautiful things about my faith. Only Catholics who are not knowledgeable in the Faith of the Church, in the first place amongst whom is Lady; can be discredited by these posts.

You must not know about me, and don't for a second think that this was my first time encountering this quote in the Catechism or the sayings of Pope John Paul II.

Why I won't leave my Church?

Even if a Priest opens his mouth and blasphemes, I won't leave my Church, because it doesn't belong to him but to God. I can correct him and seek ways to correct his blasphemes, but no way will I denounce the unity that Christ asked for.

I won't leave the body of Christ to attend a Church owned by a man.

oh you also missed when I said this:

You know what I will say Yes. After realising that the Jews also serve the same God even though they deny the Gospel, they do profess the same faith of Abraham. I don't see why it is I can't accept Muslims profession. I accept it and pray that they will see the true nature of God and not the false one that Muhammad portrayed

@~Lady~: If the catholics believe that Muslims are Paradise bound, why will any muslim even bother to convert? Islam is already been confirmed to be paradise bound by you, regardless of what they do, as long as they believe as your classifications have indicated.

Do not confuse plan of salvation to be actual salvation. Plan of salvation includes all but only those who heed the call will be saved.
You can have a plan however not everyone will agree with it.

Do not confuse it.