₦airaland Forum

Explore2xmore:
You are fighting to deny that despite a claimed belief in Jesus killing and fighting still occurs among the so called adherents.

Good!

So called adherents just as an atheist will take you the same way he takes ògún and ṣàngó worshipers after all you're all THEISTS to him claiming you believe in God/Gods.

GothamCities:
Lol.
He promised to be where two or more gathered in His name. He also promised to be with us individually till the end of the age.
Mathew 28:20
"And be sure of this: I am with you always, even to the end of the age.”
Where did He command that you must gather in order to have eternal life? Lol.

Are you sure the "YOU" here is individually or reminding them what he said at Matthew 18:20?

GothamCities:
Give me your Bible reference that defined religion this way.

The word "RELIGION" is new what people call it in ancient times is "WORSHIP" that's why you can't find any name of a religion in the Bible as for the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob there is rules guiding His worshipers as in those practicing that RELIGION!

GothamCities:
Yeah, that's man's method - Religion. Hence, you'll find religions before Christ, during Christ and after Christ in any book of World Religions you may lay your hands on. God didn't institute any religion, He only instituted a WAY which is JESUS. Man applied his own method and turned the WAY into a religion. God didn't create religion. All what God wants from you is to fulfil THE WHOLE DUTY OF MAN AS outlined in the Scriptures!

RELIGION is GATHERING TOGETHER, PRAYING, SINGING and DOING what Jesus commanded as a GROUP!

GothamCities:
That's not the question I asked you!

If you like ignore what God's only begotten son said, as for me and my household we will take what Jesus said seriously.
He said:

"For where there are two or three GATHERED TOGETHER in my name, there I am in their midst.” Matthew 18:20

So we must GATHER with fellow believers if we expect Jesus in our midst! Hebrews 10:24-25

Explore2xmore:
The truth is they are still fighting.

WHO?

GothamCities:
Can you prove that gathering together takes anyone to heaven or makes anyone escape eternal damnation? Can you prove that EVERYONE who has gathered with others and are now dead are now undoubtedly assured of their eternity with God on the basis of their gatherings while alive?

Whether you gather or not, everything boils down to what the Bible calls THE WHOLE DUTY OF MAN. Don't add anything to it! If you think otherwise, answer the questions I asked you in my first paragraph above. Then, also tell us the fate of several people who found themselves in situations whereby the could not even afford to gather together with a gathering. If you're talking about gathering, even Satan's people also gather but they cannot fulfil the WHOLE DUTY OF MAN as outlined in the Scriptures.


Can you show me where the scriptures have said that having the same line of thoughts is what you need to have eternal peace with God? Eve. Satan's people also do have the same line of thoughts but they cannot fulfil THE WHOLE DUTY OF MAN as outlined in the Bible.



There are many same groups teaching different things. At the end of the day, what matters is who is fulfilling the WHOLE DUTY OF MAN according to the scriptures.

Jesus won't be with those who refused to GATHER with other worshipers! Matthew 18:20

GothamCities:
And I am telling you that they did identify themselves under different religions names!
Go find a book of World Religions and study.

There is no book of world religion that will not mention CHRISTIANITY as one of the religions nah!
So why referring to what you yourself disagree with? l

Explore2xmore:
You mean the cases I listed were before Jesus came?

After Jesus anyone fighting to kill people is not a worshiper of the true God!

GothamCities:
As far as God is concerned, you can praise God anyhow, anywhere and in any position as long as you're doing it in spirit and in truth.

This is a lie!

If people can do what you're saying then there is no reason why people must gather together to take instructions from few ones who are taking the lead! Act 2:42; Hebrews 10:24-25; 13:7,17

According to God's word all worshipers of the true God must have the same line of thought regarding worship {John 17:22; 1Corinthians 1:10; Ephesians 4:3

This can only be possible if we are been taught by the same group! Matthew 28:18-20

GothamCities:
I don't consider it a logical demand. Is the Bible a book created for listing religions? Religions existed before Christ was born. It doesn't matter whether they were mentioned in the Bible or not.

Your argument that there was no religion until Christ established His own religion before Satan started creating religions is false.

The religions you claimed Satan created, are they in the Bible that you're telling me to name religions in the Bible before Christ?


Religions existed and had names. Please go find a book of World Religions to educated yourself. For example, the Buddhists and Hindus identified themselves as Buddhists and Hindus long before Christ was born!

Neither Jesus nor His disciples established any religion.

Paul said "I worship the God of my fathers through the WAY which you call heresy." If he was practising religion, he would have said "I worship the God of my fathers through the RELIGION which you call heresy.'

Please let's abide by the Truth.

Don't misquote me!

I never said there was no religion before Jesus what i'm telling you is that they don't identify themselves with different religious names!

The world has singled them out as the only group that's not flowing along with their confusion! Matthew 5:14-16

gohf:
Look what about you who follow them?
Who gives excuses for them?
Do you believe following the blind will lead you to salvation?

Going by God's word mankind in general is blind to the truth that's why we have the Bible God always use humans to lead His people {Matthew 16:18-19} and these men were imperfect {John 18:25-27} so they will make mistakes that's obvious to one and all {Galatians 2:11-14} yet faithful servants of God will continue to OBEY them. Act 2:42

WHY?

Because there must be orderliness in pure worship so someone must take the lead {Hebrews 13:7, 17} God never promised us that such ones won't make mistakes.

So how can we be sure that God is still with the congregation?

By observing the progress of God's work as it's found written in the Bible {Act 17:11} if those taking the lead are fulfilling what God promised then there is no reason to doubt them as you can never ever find a better replacement for them and God will not stop using imperfect humans to lead His people till Christ come to establish his kingdom on earth!

Wives should submit to their own husbands so that there may be ORDERLINESS in Christian homes even if the husband is not a believer he can be won over by the chastity of his wife! 1Peter 3:1-2

Explore2xmore:
Ignore your history like St. Bartholomew's Day Massacre, Cromwellian conquest and the
the Ku Klux Klan that has used Christian language to rationalize their violent actions against Catholics and other non-Protestant communities. Besides why does your god turn a blind eye to your alleged people of light being killed by the dark?

You're mixing things up Mr Muslim after Jesus of Nazareth has come to establish preaching and teaching globally any religion supporting war is no longer on God's side. So if you know any religion whose members are part of the worldly forces such ones aren't followers of the Christ who commanded his disciples to love and pray for their enemies! Luke 6:27-28

According to your Islam there was a time your Allah have nothing against some things but due to misuse of privileges your god will send words to your prophet telling Muslims to stop such things so don't be hypocritical now the Bible God supported wars to protect the Holy city (Jerusalem) and the temple which is the representation of pure worship back then but from the very day Jesus declared that pure worship is no longer about a geographical location {John 4:24} worshipers of the true God knew that there is no reason to pick up weapons against their neighbors.
WHY?
There is nothing to protect again using weapons {Matthew 26:52} even their very life is safe in the hands of the God who promised them a resurrection {Matthew 10:28} but as for those thinking weapons will save them let's see how long they will protect it from death! Matthew 10:39

GothamCities:
The Jews didn't call their religion Judahism because God didn't give them a religion. They were the ones who finally made it a religion.
What God gave the Israelites was this:
"This a way to please me. Just obey my commandments. If you sin, this is how you can appease me, and I'll forgive you. In exchange for pleasing me, I'll bless you and fight your battles."
That's all. Apart from that, God didn't give the Israelites any religion. The people were the ones who created a religion out of what God gave them.

Perhaps you should define the word RELIGION at least to help you grasp that when people gather, sing, pray, and someone takes the lead in other activities while others respond positively it's RELIGION.
That's what God gave the Israelites, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob never practiced such yet they believe the same God so what is the purpose of such arrangement if it's not a RELIGION?

GothamCities:
Can you tell me why they must be mentioned in the Bible for them to be recognized as religions that existed before Jesus was born?

At least to prove that RELIGIONS have names just as you claimed so go ahead and mention just one RELIGION as found in God's word the ultimate truth!

RELIGIONS existed but they don't have names it's after Jesus' disciples began taking their own RELIGION to people's homes that these people began calling their RELIGIONS different names to claim they also worship GOD and that Jesus' disciples shouldn't think they are the only group that knows GOD.
Then Satan and his demons began disguising using the Abrahamic faith as cover up to claim they are also worshiping the same God! 2 Corinthians 11:14

GothamCities:
Please tell us the name of the religion God created. Give us reference for where God announced that He has created a religion. Let us know the name God called it. You're yet to tell us the religion Jesus created and the name Jesus gave His religion.

You're yet to mention the name of a single religion in the Bible!

GothamCities:
There were many religions in the Bible. Baal, Queen of heaven, religion of Molech, Ashtoreth, Dragon,vetc.

This are names of Gods worshiped in ancient times not RELIGION.

GothamCities:
Jesus met the religion of the Romans on earth. They had different gods including emperor godhood. The Greecians had their own too. All nations had their religion. The Babylonians did everything to make Daniel a proselyte.

What did the Bible call the name of Roman RELIGION?

GothamCities:
Here are some of the major religions that existed before Jesus was born (approximately 4 BC):
1. Hinduism (circa 1500 BC): The Vedas, ancient Hindu scriptures, were composed around this time.
2. Zoroastrianism (circa 1200 BC): Founded by the Prophet Zoroaster in ancient Persia (modern-day Iran).
3. Buddhism (circa 563 BC): Founded by Siddhartha Gautama, known as the Buddha, in ancient India.
4. Taoism (circa 500 BC): Founded by Lao Tzu in ancient China.
5. Confucianism (circa 500 BC): Founded by Confucius in ancient China.
6. Shintoism (circa 500 BC): Indigenous spirituality of Japan.
7. Ancient Greek Religion (circa 800 BC): Polytheistic worship of gods like Zeus, Athena, and Apollo.
8. Roman Religion (circa 700 BC): Polytheistic worship of gods like Jupiter, Mars, and Venus.
9. Egyptian Religion (circa 3000 BC): Polytheistic worship of gods like Isis, Osiris, and Ra.
These religions had already established their own beliefs, practices, and scriptures before Jesus' birth. Please tell me how a person became a religion. Jesus said He is the WAY. Paul said he is a follower of the WAY. The WAY is a Person. How did a person become a religion? Also tell us how Jesus created His religion. The name He gave it and how He spoke about that religion.

Can you quote where any of these were mentioned in the Bible?
Ọmọ all of them began calling their RELIGIONS one name or another after the establishment of Christianity as the disciples of Jesus were taking their RELIGIONS to their homes! Matthew 28:19-20
Even the Jews in Jesus' day haven't called their RELIGION "Judaism" that's why you can't find such a name in the Bible!

It's also the choice of some to continue making sacrifices like God commanded in the old testament!

Explore2xmore:
Vain angle isn't this?
Your Bible talks of Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Zechariah, John the Baptist and other prophets killed or do we refer to the disciples/apostles of Jesus? What did the Biblical gods do about these?

So were worshipers of this God fighting and killing their fellow worshipers?
Of course that's ongoing dispute between light and darkness back then so there were people on God's side while there were those on Satan's side.
At least you can mention those on God's side in the Bible can you tell me those who are on God's side today?

GothamCities:
We can call it religion but God Himself never said He was establishing religion a religion. If you think otherwise, tell us the name God gave His religion.

Satan is the one who created false religions to confuse people like you the one and only true religion is what God established with the nation of Israel so if you think false religions just started without the original then you have lost it there is no fake thing without its original form. Satan initiated false religions and gave them different names!

GothamCities:
He assembled with both religionists and sinners since He was sent to all men. Did Jesus offer sacrifices? Did He obey the Sabbath? Did Her stone fornicators? Did He do any of the ritualistic purifications? The religionists had 10 commandments they followed. Why did Jesus establish a new commandment by saying "a new commandment I give unto you."
Please answer the questions if you really want to drive home your point about Jesus creating religion.

Jesus obeyed all that's why he told his friends that they should OBEY everything that's written in the law before the New Covenant is established! Matthew 23:2-3

GothamCities:
A religion is something done in the flesh. However, in Christ Jesus, we are in the Spirit, and spirits don't have no religion.
Now, tell me the name of the religion God established. Tell me the name of the religion Jesus established. We know that there's no creator of religion who doesn't give his religion a name.

Can you name a religion in the Bible in the old testament?
Come on!
It's after Jesus established a New Religion that Satan began multiplying false religions in the name of the God of Jacob! Matthew 13:25
So it's time you stop lying to your own souls.

GothamCities:
Paul called it a WAY. It is wrong for you to call it a RELIGION. If you think you're right, tell us the name Jesus called His religion. Yeah, it is a WAY. And a WAY is not a religion. A religion is not a WAY. The WAY provides direct access to God. Here, the WAY is a Person. That person is Jesus, and Jesus is not a religion. A follower of the WAY is a follower of Jesus and not a follower of some religion.

Funny you!
Jesus didn't mention a name but there are thousands of religions all claiming they are following Jesus with their contradicting teachings and conflicting doctrines you should know that something is wrong somewhere if Jesus did mention one which of the thousands of different religious groups won't claim that's the name of their religion?

Explore2xmore:
Fundamentally you have stated the existence of different gods for different places and people hence it's best to logically leave you to your beliefs. I believe in one God that created and sustains all things.

And that God approves worshipers killing one another while the do called one God watches shey?

Ọmọ if your religion can't help resolve issues causing division, disparities and killings among worshipers know today that it's not the God of Abraham but a demon pretending and lying to deceive you!

Daejumong:
The sins of David were more heinous and cruel than those of Saul! Why was he rejected even when he tried seeking God through a dead Samuel? Why was David forgiven without losing his crown? Are there people with special grace and special love from God?

David committed the sin that's peculiar to those in high positions but in his heart he was a humble person which God valued most!

Saul committed the sin that's unforgivable which is directly blaming God for his blunders.

When David sinned he was acting on impulse and seeking ways to cover up but after Nathan has exposed him David humbly admitted his errors.
Saul sinned but when Samuel God's prophet called him out Saul blamed God saying the things taken out of Amalek will be used as sacrifice to God after all this same God will soon ask for sacrifices.
So instead of admitting his errors Saul was justifying himself.
And as for visiting a witch he is turning his back on God by doing the worst thing God detests. Deuteronomy 18:11

epfa:
Well, the Watchtower leaders are involved in spiritism...

Madam, answer the OP!

GothamCities:
Did He keep the Sabbath? Did He sacrifice animals? Did He stone people to death for adultery? All these and more were the practices of the religion of His fathers. Jesus did none of these, so how then did He practice the religion of His father's?

Now you acknowledged there was a RELIGION God handed over to the Israelites through His prophets of old.
Did Jesus assemble with practicers of this RELIGION in the first century?
Did he condemn the RELIGION?
Jesus observered everything the law says so if you don't understand how he did just ask for more understanding! Matthew 5:17

GothamCities:
The religion was given until the new covenant as you said. After the new covenant was established what religion did God institute? Tell me explicitly where God established a religion in the new covenant.

The Old Covenant foreshadow the New Covenant so both comes with religious rites. According to God's word the Old Covenant was established based on written codes e.g "You must not do this, You must not do that" and forms of practices that separates the nation given this RELIGION from all other nations {Exodus 19:5} but the New Covenant is like something written in the hearts of adherents by considering the thoughts, words and actions of the mediator of this New Covenant.
So unlike the former religion where adherents quote written laws for one another the New religion is about one man Jesus who is Christ and all practicers of this RELIGION must have LOVE among themselves {John 13:34-35} as they keep on encouraging one another to stick to the thoughts, words and actions of their Master, Lord and King {Hebrews 10:24-25} this will make them have the same line of thought! John 17:22 compare to 1Corinthians 1:10; Ephesians 4:3

GothamCities:
Paul urged them not to forsake the gathering of brethren together. He never ever told them to stick to any religion.

When he was before Agrippa, Paul told Agrippa "After the WAY, which they call heresy worship I the God of my fathers."

Paul said he was in THE WAY. Not in the RELIGION. And who is the WAY? JESUS of course.

The Religion was called two names in the first century:
First century Jews used to call members of this RELIGION "The Way" {Act 9:2; 22:4} because the founder claimed that he is the Way {John 14:6} as the God of Israel promised His worshipers that when the New Covenant is established there will be a Way of holiness {Isaiah 35:8} so when Jesus said he is the Way Jews with sharp minds quickly recollected what is written in the book of Isaiah.
The second name this religion was called back then is "Christianity" because the disciples of it's founder kept telling everyone that their leader is the long awaited Christ! Act 11:26
But both names were temporary for a reason!

GothamCities:
Jesus didn't practice religion. What religion did Jesus practice?

Jesus PRACTICED the religion of his forefathers inside the temple in Jerusalem.
That's why he assembled with other Jews each time they want to do the passover which is the yearly religious rite God commanded Israelites to keep on doing but Samaritans can't do this because nobody recognize their nation or their temple so they don't practice passover.

GothamCities:
What's the name of the religion Jesus was talking about? What name did Jesus give that religion?

The religion God gave the descendants of Jacob (Israel) which they must continue practicing until the new covenant is established! Jeremiah 31:31-33

GothamCities:
Jesus said "Salvation is of the Jews", He didn't says "Judahism is of the Jews" or "The true religion is of the Jews" but "SALVATION is of the Jews". Religion does not bring Salvation, otherwise everyone who practices religion will be saved. But this isn't the case with salvation.

There is a true religion that's what the disciples of Jesus practiced in the first century as they assemble together {Act 2:1-3} and Paul urged them not to forsake this {Hebrew 10:24-25} because anyone who stop practicing this religion can not be saved! Hebrews 10:26

Explore2xmore:
When your done turning logic on its head?
So you confirm the truth that the Bible is of many fake gods ?
Good to see you show yourself.
We have nothing to discuss more so your colleague in discussion dissociate Christianity from a monotheist one God

Your Islam didn't teach you liberalism and how to discuss with patience so you're free to end the discussion anyhow you like but know today that the Bible's message isn't about one God rather there are many as in MANY GODS that people throughout the earth worship each God is being worshiped based on their attributes.
The Bible God claims to be the only true God that's why He is doing certain things to prove that all others are nothing before him.
As for your Allah it's just one of the MANY GODS but claiming to be the same as that of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.
It's not just claims we need to figure out the one and only true God rather the true God must do certain things that no other can do that's what the Bible God promised and all the false GODS including your Allah has been trying to hide that truth from you diverting your attention to lies.
When you care to know what the Bible God promised which no other gods can do i'm here to enlighten you!

Explore2xmore:
In your Acts 5:28 they filled Jerusalem with their teaching which includes Jesus is the Messiah?
Still the Jews don't accept Jesus as the Messiah or the Jews are not of Jerusalem?
God never said the whole world and you are surpassing this to take this message to the whole world? ? ?
Stop spinning please

The message must be taken to the whole world for a witness against them that they had the opportunity to know the only true religion {Matthew 24:14} but only humble people will accept it just as it happened in the days of Noah!

God wants everyone in the world to hear about His coming government and the goodies that will come with it but it's left to each person whether you will accept or not.
The lie Islam is telling you is that prophets in the Bible are just talking about one God but that's not the truth!

They have to pay uninvited visits to neighbors at their homes preaching and teaching them what Jesus taught about God's Kingdom! Matthew 10:11-13

Which religion is doing this today?

Explore2xmore:
What impact did the astrologers have on the people other than this singular incident at his birth? Who again referred to this astrologers in the 30+ years of Jesus life?

The visit of astrologers in Jerusalem shows that a foretold King has been born and since the king at that time wasn't pleased with the news himself and his cohorts buried the case even though it led to the death of many children in Bethlehem Ephrata! Matthew 2:16
When things happen in politics most of you will think it just happened but politicians know what they are trying to cover up from the masses.
So the birth and life of Jesus surely affected the Israelites even though politicians are bent on hiding it from the people. Act 4:18;5:28

Explore2xmore:
Jesus was never accepted as Messiah by the Jews yet the whole world should accept him? How?

NO! God's word never said the whole world should accept him because that is not possible it has always been only a few people that used to be saved! Luke 17:25-30
This is not Islam where people should be forced to accept what they don't understand Jesus sent his own disciples to go and visit neighbors in their homes PREACHING (PLEADING) with them to calmly listen in order to grasp what is happening {Matthew 28:19-20} he never expected people in large numbers to accept him that's why he said his disciples will be persecuted and of course minority can't persecute the majority nah it's only the majority that will persecute the minority! Matthew 24:9
So it's not by force that you accept the Christ as your King after all you don't know why but as for humble people they will understand! Matthew 5:5 compare to Zephaniah 2:2-3

And the only true religion will have love among themselves:

"I am giving you a new commandment, that you love one another; just as I have loved you, you also love one another. By this all will know that you are my disciples—if you have love among yourselves.” John 13:34-35

Study God's word with Jesus' real disciples today JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES!

So those who gladly accepted his word were baptized, and on that day about 3,000 people were added. And they continued devoting themselves to the teaching of the apostles, to associating together, to the taking of meals, and to prayers. Act 2:41-42

Which religion today is practicing what these people did in the first century?