₦airaland Forum

LagosShia: Muslim inventions that shaped the modern world

January 29, 2010|By Olivia Sterns for CNN

Think of the origins of that staple of modern life, the cup of coffee, and Italy often springs to mind.

But in fact, Yemen is where the ubiquitous brew has its true origins.

Along with the first university, and even the toothbrush, it is among surprising Muslim inventions that have shaped the world we live in today.

The origins of these fundamental ideas and objects -- the basis of everything from the bicycle to musical scales -- are the focus of "1001 Inventions," a book celebrating "the forgotten" history of 1,000 years of Muslim heritage.

"There's a hole in our knowledge, we leap frog from the Renaissance to the Greeks," professor Salim al-Hassani, Chairman of the Foundation for Science, Technology and Civilisation, and editor of the book told CNN.

"1001 Inventions" is now an exhibition at London's Science Museum. Hassani hopes the exhibition will highlight the contributions of non-Western cultures -- like the Muslim empire that once covered Spain and Portugal, Southern Italy and stretched as far as parts of China -- to present day civilization.

Here Hassani shares his top 10 outstanding Muslim inventions:

1. Surgery

Around the year 1,000, the celebrated doctor Al Zahrawi published a 1,500 page illustrated encyclopedia of surgery that was used in Europe as a medical reference for the next 500 years. Among his many inventions, Zahrawi discovered the use of dissolving cat gut to stitch wounds -- beforehand a second surgery had to be performed to remove sutures. He also reportedly performed the first caesarean operation and created the first pair of forceps.

2. Coffee

Now the Western world's drink du jour, coffee was first brewed in Yemen around the 9th century. In its earliest days, coffee helped Sufis stay up during late nights of devotion. Later brought to Cairo by a group of students, the coffee buzz soon caught on around the empire. By the 13th century it reached Turkey, but not until the 16th century did the beans start boiling in Europe, brought to Italy by a Venetian trader.

3. Flying machine

"Abbas ibn Firnas was the first person to make a real attempt to construct a flying machine and fly," said Hassani. In the 9th century he designed a winged apparatus, roughly resembling a bird costume. In his most famous trial near Cordoba in Spain, Firnas flew upward for a few moments, before falling to the ground and partially breaking his back. His designs would undoubtedly have been an inspiration for famed Italian artist and inventor Leonardo da Vinci's hundreds of years later, said Hassani.

4. University

In 859 a young princess named Fatima al-Firhi founded the first degree-granting university in Fez, Morocco. Her sister Miriam founded an adjacent mosque and together the complex became the al-Qarawiyyin Mosque and University. Still operating almost 1,200 years later, Hassani says he hopes the center will remind people that learning is at the core of the Islamic tradition and that the story of the al-Firhi sisters will inspire young Muslim women around the world today.

5. Algebra

The word algebra comes from the title of a Persian mathematician's famous 9th century treatise "Kitab al-Jabr Wa l-Mugabala" which translates roughly as "The Book of Reasoning and Balancing." Built on the roots of Greek and Hindu systems, the new algebraic order was a unifying system for rational numbers, irrational numbers and geometrical magnitudes. The same mathematician, Al-Khwarizmi, was also the first to introduce the concept of raising a number to a power.

6. Optics

"Many of the most important advances in the study of optics come from the Muslim world," says Hassani. Around the year 1000 Ibn al-Haitham proved that humans see objects by light reflecting off of them and entering the eye, dismissing Euclid and Ptolemy's theories that light was emitted from the eye itself. This great Muslim physicist also discovered the camera obscura phenomenon, which explains how the eye sees images upright due to the connection between the optic nerve and the brain.

7. Music

Muslim musicians have had a profound impact on Europe, dating back to Charlemagne tried to compete with the music of Baghdad and Cordoba, according to Hassani. Among many instruments that arrived in Europe through the Middle East are the lute and the rahab, an ancestor of the violin. Modern musical scales are also said to derive from the Arabic alphabet.

8. Toothbrush

According to Hassani, the Prophet Mohammed popularized the use of the first toothbrush in around 600. Using a twig from the Meswak tree, he cleaned his teeth and freshened his breath. Substances similar to Meswak are used in modern toothpaste.

9. The crank

Many of the basics of modern automatics were first put to use in the Muslim world, including the revolutionary crank-connecting rod system. By converting rotary motion to linear motion, the crank enables the lifting of heavy objects with relative ease. This technology, discovered by Al-Jazari in the 12th century, exploded across the globe, leading to everything from the bicycle to the internal combustion engine.

10. Hospitals

"Hospitals as we know them today, with wards and teaching centers, come from 9th century Egypt," explained Hassani. The first such medical center was the Ahmad ibn Tulun Hospital, founded in 872 in Cairo. Tulun hospital provided free care for anyone who needed it -- a policy based on the Muslim tradition of caring for all who are sick. From Cairo, such hospitals spread around the Muslim world.

For more information on muslim inventions go to: muslimheritage.com. For more information about the exhibition at London's Science Museum go to: science museum.org.uk

http://articles.cnn.com/2010-01-29/world/muslim.inventions_1_hassani-inventions-muslim/3?_s=PM:WORLD

You need to know that there is a very BIG difference between islamic contribution and the contribution of muslims. . . .I asked for the contributions of islam. . .Let me give you examples of islamic contributions, most of you have been just running around chasing shadows. . .The islamic laws of inheritance is an islamic contribution. . .Jihad is an islamic contribution. . .Coffee is not an islamic contribution. . .Sweet orange fruit was first cultivated in china does that mean its a contribution of buddhism?. . .Is Newtown's law of motion a contribution of christianity? What about the Mendel's law of hereditary? Is the airplane a christian contribution?. . .What about cars and cameras?. . . Hospitals are not islamic contributions just as aspirins and chloro-quine and not christian inventions or contributions. . .Non of what the writer wrote is an islamic contribution, muslim contribution, yes but islamic contribution, no. . .As for science the greatest scientist that ever lived and the greatest scientist alive today are all non muslims. . .So don't even go there. . .

This title is very misleading. . .

LagosShia: let me also add that the muslims have so far succeeded to demonstrate that Islam contributed to the sciences and to humanity at large in many positive ways.that was the purpose of this thread and it has been fulfilled.so for the detractors,you can dwell in your ignorance and keep spinning round your heads.case closed as this thread is concerned.

It is very easy to claim that islam has contributed to science. . .What specific scientific invention has islam brought?. . .Let me name one scientific invention of non muslims. . .electricity. . .Name one scientific invention of the muslims that can match that?. . .Sure, islam contributed by bringing war and strife. . .

deols: The laws of inheritance- ensure that everyone deserving of it, gets from it. not the I am the legal wife tussle or we are his brothers wahala

Laws of inheritance for women is a good contribution. . . .Finally one positive contribution of islam. . .

Decency and modesty- Like you'll find no where else. thanks to Islam, Our society is still considerably sane.

Decency and modesty like you will find no where?. . .Not true. . .The is subjective. . . .

Banking and Finance- how better can it be. Not only the rich might access loans.Ideas can as well.

The best banks in the world are NOT islamic banks, so far the islamic banking system has been a failure, its impact are not felt even in the islamic societies. . . conventional banks have impacted the lives of people and lifted more people out of poverty than islamic banks. . .Fact!. . . .

charity- Zakaat to the poor. If everyon eliable to pay in the world does so, there'll be no poor person alive. Islam brings social justice. like you would not find elsewhere.

False. . .The biggest charity organizations in the world are NOT muslim owned or muslim runned. . .There is more social justice to be found in Denmark, Finland,Norway, Sweden, Switzerland and USA than there is to be found in islamic countries like Iraq, Syria, Jordan,Iran, Somalia, Sudan, Afghanistan, Yemen and in Northern Nigeria. . . .

A life of bliss- A true Muslim doesnt worry too much about what they have or dont. the promise of an after-life, waiting to have the promised paradise just keeps you from the aggressive, selfish look out for the world and its goodies.

What could be more meaningless than the mythical heaven or afterlife believers strive towards? No future, because in eternity there can be no future and no past. no goal to strive towards, no purpose, no progress. . . .And the fact that they see the present life as only a stepping stone to that pointless afterlife robs this life of all meaning, too. It becomes something that has to be endured for the sake of the afterlife rather than something to be lived and enjoyed or suffered on its own terms, and for its own purposes. What could be more meaningless than the religious postulation that this life is just a way to get to the after life which is the main target?

scientific- Islam provides scientific basis to most of the discoveries of later years. the Qur'an speaks of a walk on the moon. Honey as a medicine. the embryological development.

Not true, how did Islam provide the scientific basis for the construction of the space shuttle or the Apollo mission to the moon?. . .What are the significant scientific discoveries that came about as a result of islam?. . .

GEnder issues- Islam unlike christianity doesnt portray a woman as the evil one who made Adam eat the forbidden fruit. they ate it the Qur'an says. The Qur'an emphasises the need to do good by both parties and the one with the best of deeds gets the higher state. these from the Quran have been used as a basis for the rights of women especially in communities where cultures have over ridden the true religious teachings.

Not true, women in the islamic world are the most suppressed in the world today, there is gender apartheid in most parts of the islamic world, in the middle east women are not allowed to contest political office in some countries, many and not allowed to be educated like in Afghanistan, women are not allowed to drive in places like Saudi Arabia, not allowed to move around on their own, not allowed to work, not empowered etc. . .It is a myth that muslim women have rights, it is yet to be seen. . .

Islam puts Jesus in the most logical position[/b], the one befitting him and the only true one- a messenger rather than a god. that is one great contribution. Imagine generations on end being misinformed of the true status of a prophet of God?

Islam gives you the opportunity to have a good life [/b]here and a [b]wonderful eternal life.

Good life with all the wars, death, violence and destruction in majority muslims countries today?. . .

seguun: Why can't you simply find out if it is true or not?
If it's actually true, that's a scientific discovery from islam no matter how insignificant it is to you.

It is not true, flies MAINLY carry diseases on their legs and saliva. . .They carry millions of bacteria on their feet alone. Why is Mohammed talking about the wings of flies, when the main source of infection are the feet of flies and their saliva?. . .The prophet of islam says you are to deep the fly into your drink when it falls it it because one if its wings carries disease while the other carries the cure . . .What is this nonsense . . .

Flies DO NOT carry diseases on one wing and cure on the other wing, that is a LIE. . .If a fly drops into your drink its best you throw the drink away than dip the fly into your drink. . . The stress you put on a fly by drowning it into your drink, would only cause it to vomit and defecate even more, releasing an extra portion of germs into your drink. . . .On going research shows that flies do carry antibiotic materials on their surface which can be chemically synthesised. The antibiotic is not found one one of the wings of the fly but on its surface. . .

" Diseases, e.g., malaria, dysentery, sleeping sickness, onchocerciasis, elephantiasis and yellow fever are carried or transmitted from man to man by bloodsucking dipterous flies. Many other diseases are transmitted mechanically by flies due to the habit exhibited by many species of sucking liquid from excreta and other decaying organic matter and then settling on and vomiting on your food.

The fly was made to distribute quantities of pathogenic disease organisms. Its 6 feet are equipped with bristles and sticky pads and its proboscis is hairy. A sticky liquid comes out of the hollow hairs on their feet allowing them to walk upside down and on glass, etc. The fly's digestive tract is an incubator for germs! My mother began to teach me IPM control when I was a very young boy. She said, "Shut the door you are letting in the flies!" This is still good advice - even better is to have a second entry door as an extra barrier against fly invasion.

A well fed fly defecates at least once every 5 minutes!"

(Source: http://www.thebestcontrol.com/bugstop/control_flies.htm)

Sweetnecta: From National Geographic: 1001 of Inventions.
The enduring legacy of muslim civilization; third edition.

No religion on earth ever birth any civilization; Only Islam.
It raised the Arabs to the highest esteem.

Read about the Greek, Roman, Egyptian civilizations and how their religions helped them in creating their various civilizations. . .Arabs are raised to the highest esteem by who?. . . .

Even the Hausa/Fulani are honored based on Islam, and nothing else.

Hausa/fulani are honored by who?

Sweetnecta: 6 Ancient Muslim Inventions We Still Use Today. First Posted: 03/23/2012 10:57 am Updated: 03/23/2012 10:57 am

Read more
National Geographic , National Geographic Photos , Ancient Muslims , Book News , Muslim Book , Muslim Inventions , Muslim Photos , National Geographic Book , Slidepollajax , Books News

Imagine that you're on a camping trip. Are you jaunting through the Rockies, an earth-toned REI tent in tow?

Imagine that you're in a garden. Are you admiring the symmetry and scrupulousness of Versailles? Or getting your hands dirty in a community plot with rows of tomatos and kale?

It may be our tendency to assume our past times and modern luxuries are all thanks to earlier Western civilizations, but in fact, much of American culture is rooted in the Muslim world. Tents, gardens, libraries, herbal medicine, chess and jewels are all Eastern developments that we reap the benefits of today.

In the third edition of "1001 Inventions: The Enduring Legacy of Muslim Civilization" [National Geographic Society, $28.00], we learn about the origins and evolution of these apparatuses via a combination of ancient drawings and current photographs.

Did you read where it says eastern inventions?. . .Chess for example is NOT a muslim invention, it was invented in india in the 6th century before the advent of islam. . . .eastern inventions aren't islamic inventions, no?. . .

vedaxcool: Lol! My thread not only enranged mazaje but serve as a whip that suceeded in discreting atheist and its proponents.

How did you discredit the atheist?. . .

To answer the weak attempt by a confused mind to retaliate against xcool, I start by saying praise be to Allah the lord of the worlds the source of guidance for humanity and the one whose mercy made Islam prevail against the designs of the kafiroons.

Allah guides humanity, really?. . .You are a kafir according to another man's religion, so what exactly are you saying?. . .

Without much ado, Islam contribution to mankind is what I call the Great Transformation, the arabs were a coarce race who sacrifice their female daughter for no reasons, Islam brought an unceremonious end to such practice. That is just one. Islam brought to the arabs an egalitarian society and abolished class war, it re - emphasis the equality of all, the rich, the poor, the black, the white etc. Again we see the Great Transformation, united the warring factions of the arabs, take medinah for example, the major clans there ended their centuary old strife on the emigration of the prophet pbuh, the prophet pbuh brought an acceptable solution to their troubles. Again Islam did not stop there, the whole of arabia became one united group as a result of Islam

Really?. . . .If this LIE were true then we would expect islamic countries to be less violent that non islamic countries, we would expect the standard or living of islamic countries to be higher than non islamic countries, we would expect to see egalitarian muslim societies, we will expect islamic countries to have the lowest income disparities among its citizens. . .But when we drop vexdacool's LIES and look around what do we find? We find that islamic countries are the most violent countries in the world(Somalia, Afghanistan,Pakistan, Syria, Yemen,Iraq, Libya), Even in our own Nigeria, the muslim north remains the most violent and under developed part of the country. . . .So where is the elusive peace that islam has brought?. . .If vexdacool has any idea of what he is saying you would expect islamic countries to be egalitarian, have the lowest income disparity, highest standard of living and rank the highest based on human development index. . .Where is the unity that vexdacool is talking about when we know that islam only reduces its followers to brainless hate mongers. . . . Hate is the essence of this religion. . . hate of the non-believers(you even used that word kafir, which is a derogatory term that means denier of truth), hate of the believers who interpret Islam differently, hate of those who leave Islam, hate of women, hate of homosexuals, hate of freethinkers, hate of the Jews, and the list goes on. . . .So where is the elusive peace that islam has brought to the world?. . .Even a mad man can not put islam and peace in the same sentence. . .Where is the peace between the waring shites and sunnis in the world today that islam has brought?. . . . . .I laugh in arabic, try another lie pls, this one is a very big fail. . .

We again talk of the abolishment of unhelpful practices such as the alcohol consumption, gambling etc .

So muslims don't drink and gamble?. .What is this deluded man saying?. . .

Islam the light which Allah perfects again encouraged charity, thereby promoting compassion and kindness. Many medicine practitioners have spoken well on how Fasting helps the health of those that practice it. Again Islam brought a consistent practice of this Fasting to its adherents, again it is during this practice that the muslims also nourishes his soul. Again we see prayers the muslim engange in, 5 times a day we pray, the benefit are immense as troubled souls are able to have a sense of peace and tranquility that allows them to undergo very difficult situation with committing suicide as most atheist would.

You have not provided any evidence to show that atheist commit more suicides than muslims. . .Firstly people have been praying long before mohammed and his cronies invented islam. . .How has the muslim 5 daily prayers contributed anything to humanity?. . .Where is the evidence that muslims that pray 5 tines daily are better protected from harm and misfortune for example than non muslims that do not pray 5 times daily to Allah?. . . .

We see again the practice of Hajj where Muslims of diverse background mingle together, this agaon promotes brotherliness and a reduction in the tendency to be racist, this is another great transformation Islam added to muslims and the world, it reminds me of congregational prayer off course every day muslims are required to pray in group, hence this allows again bonding of people of diverse background,from this small congregation, the Muslims are again required to make a bigger congregation once every friday Muslims again prayer in a larger more diverse congregation, then twice a year Muslims during the two Eids celebrations make an even greater congregation comprising a more diverse from different places of the town then Hajj then added this a more diverse people converging at Mecca to worship the Master of the Universe . Islam attacks the root of racism.

Islam attacks racism? Really?. . .The only country that still practices slavery is Mauritania, a majority muslim nation. . .If islam has contributed to reducing racism then you would expect black and whites to coexist freely and equally in arab nations, but that is not the case. . .racism is still alive in arabia. . .

But wait is this all, not at all, when the whole world was in need of a scientific advancement, it was Islam who provided the light during the period known as the Golden age, then Europe was still battling with darkness, while muslims were slugging it out making head way in their research, they took science from its greek theoretical phase to a more experimental and practical application of Science. This occured because Allah in different verses of the Qur'an called upon mankind to ponder on creation, to look, to understand etc. At creation as Islam didnot say have faith, rather it called on people to reason and think for themselves

And the research of the muslims helped in creating or inventing what precisely?. . .I will just list a few things that the research of non muslims has contributed and helped mankind with. . .Electricity, light bulb, cars, airplanes, telephone, television, drugs like aspirin, guns, tooth brush, tooth paste just to mention a few. . .Name one scientific invention that was made by the muslims that benefited the whole of humanity like electricity for example. .Just one. . .The greatest scientist of all time both in the past and present are non muslims so what the heck is this deluded slave of Allah saying?. . .

So much to say, again in personal hygine Islam promoted clean and healthy living amongst its adherents, take for example using the conveince, muslims are required to wash off impurities from their bodies this we know elements filthiness which are a bases for diseases.

So many things I can say but I will stop here.

Another lie, here is a list of the 10 cleanest cities in the world,(http://www.rediff.com/business/slide-show/slide-show-1-worlds-10-cleanest-cities/20110325.htm) no islamic city appears in the list. . .When it comes to personal hygiene muslims can not claim to lay monopoly on that. . .

How can rational, educated and enlightened people truly believe in this nonsense?. . . .Very mind boggling. . .Rivers of wine, rivers of honey, streets of gold, diamonds which happen to be the most precious substance on earth are not mentioned because they were not discovered yet by the ancients. . .beautiful women creatures, beautiful garment, etc. . .If a child dies at the age of 5 will he remain a baby for ever in heaven?. . . .Crazy fantasies. . .

Martian: Don't be deceived, there's only one explanation.

ALIENS.

From Saturn. . .Be warned you son of Mars. . .They will soon come for you. . .

JeSoul: Maz, this topic really belongs in the Islam section...but because you're such a stand up guy & member of the section no problemo. Hows everything with you by the way? Take care.

Thanks a lot for leaving it here, am good, thank you. . .Hope you are good as well?. . .Best wishes. . .Cheers. .

^^

knock it off guys. . .Kiss and make up. . .No need for that. . .

Yahweh's Decalogue. . . . Exodus 34:11–26

1. Observe what I command you today. See, I will drive out before you the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Hittites, the Perizzites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites.
Take care not to make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land to which you are going, or it will become a snare among you.

2. You shall tear down their altars, break their pillars, and cut down their sacred poles
(for you shall worship no other god, because the Lord, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God).

3. You shall not make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land, for when they prostitute themselves to their gods and sacrifice to their gods, someone among them will invite you, and you will eat of the sacrifice.
And you will take wives from among their daughters for your sons, and their daughters who prostitute themselves to their gods will make your sons also prostitute themselves to their gods.

4. You shall not make cast idols.

5. You shall keep the festival of unleavened bread. For seven days you shall eat unleavened bread, as I commanded you, at the time appointed in the month of Abib; for in the month of Abib you came out from Egypt.

6. All that first opens the womb is mine, all your male livestock, the firstborn of cow and sheep.
The firstborn of a donkey you shall redeem with a lamb, or if you will not redeem it you shall break its neck. All the firstborn of your sons you shall redeem.
No one shall appear before me empty-handed.

7. For six days you shall work, but on the seventh day you shall rest; even in ploughing time and in harvest time you shall rest.

8. You shall observe the festival of weeks, the first fruits of wheat harvest, and the festival of ingathering at the turn of the year.
Three times in the year all your males shall appear before the Lord God, the God of Israel.
For I will cast out nations before you, and enlarge your borders; no one shall covet your land when you go up to appear before the Lord your God three times in the year.

9. You shall not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leaven, and the sacrifice of the festival of the passover shall not be left until the morning.
The best of the first fruits of your ground you shall bring to the house of the Lord your Go

10.You shall not boil a kid in its mother’s milk.

Sweetnecta: In normal situation, I will take Deols advise that the best answer for a fool, is silence which must be acted but not spoken or typed out. I making exception here by typing it out because this idiot thinks he is hot, like boko haraam, they needed to be put in their places. Hindu book called for no idol worshiping you slowpoke while everything is god to them. Hence the Creator is not seen. Except people like you, even the pagans know that God Almighty is not what they worship on earth, but He is beyond the highest plain; the highest heaven; ask pagan9ja in Hausa language.

Idol worshiping?. . .Allah is an arabian invisible idol. . .Sure the creators are not seen, have you ever seen the pantheon of mayan and greek Gods that came together and created the universe?. . .+

Name some of those who came together to build the Universe, if you have evidence. Talk is cheap. The jumbo jet has Iron in it; who created Iron; give us a name if you are sincere.The people who built my house had a master; the architect. The architect even have a master; the owner of the house. There is one owner. I don't think blood gets to your brain, the reason you lack understanding of how the world works.

Zeus, Alectrona, Anemoi, these are the Gods that created iron. . .I perfectly understand how the world works, people come together to make things work and create things and systems. . .Just the way the Gods came together and created the universe. . .

Not true. . .Once many entities come together around a common purpose they can agree and create what ever the want and maintain it. . .The Gods agreed, It is not good enough to just say the Gods and think we will fall for your baseless coming together with common purpose lie. Pick up the Bibles and see how Jesus was trying to get out the jam. But the God that has higher power over him, according to the Bibles gets His way. Think. I dislike slowpoke quality.

. . .What has the bible got to do with anything?. . .Am talking about Gods like Phaethon creator of planet jupiter , Hesperus creator of planet venus, Phaenon creator of planet saturn, Pyroeis creator of planet mars. . . .These Gods created each planet. . .You better believe in them or their wrath shall fall upon you. . .

name them, otherwise you are just an empty barrel.

I have named them already. . .

]Idle hand and idle mind. God commands mercy and equity and right of self, including right of assembly; hence the places of worship are erected. Those who are angered sometimes repel the injustice by standing up to stop it. Is that s strange for your frozen brain. Many things are alive that you don't see with your naked eyes. Even under powerful microscope. God The Creator, you want Him to show you Himself when you ignore all the signs of His Existence, yet you believe so many microbes are around you? Misplaced priority.

I said there are many Gods, i even gave you their names, they are all invisible. . .They have given us signs for their existence and will not appear to you. . .They exist and they came together and created the universe. . .

]Name the Gods that are weary, etc and I will show you fake Gods. Your thinking is fake. shameful soul.

The Gods are not weary. . .Your God is fake. . .He is the imagination and creation of arab men. . .My Gods are real and the came together and created the universe. . .

Where is boko haram when you need them?. . .

Description of heaven in the bible. . .

"And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God [is] with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, [and be] their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
9. And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
11 Having the glory of God: and her light [was] like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;
12 And had a wall great and high, [and] had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are [the names] of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
13 On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.
14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
15 And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.
16 And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal.
17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred [and] forty [and] four cubits, [according to] the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.
18 And the building of the wall of it was [of] jasper: and the city [was] pure gold, like unto clear glass.
19 And the foundations of the wall of the city [were] garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation [was] jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;
20 The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.
21 And the twelve gates [were] twelve pearls; every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city [was] pure gold, as it were transparent glass.
22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.
23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb [is] the light thereof.
24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither [whatsoever] worketh abomination, or [maketh] a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life." (Revelation 21:1-27)

1. And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, [was there] the tree of life, which bare twelve [manner of] fruits, [and] yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree [were] for the healing of the nations.
3 And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:
4 And they shall see his face; and his name [shall be] in their foreheads.
5 And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever.

Description of paradise (heaven) in the koran. . . .

"The description of Paradise which the righteous have been promised is that in it are rivers of water, the taste and smell of which are never changed. Rivers of milk the taste of which will remain unchanged. Rivers of wine that will be delicious to those who drink from it and rivers of clear, pure honey. For them will be every kind of fruit and forgiveness form their Lord."
[ 47:15]

"And their recompense shall be Paradise, and silken garments, because they were patient. Reclining on raised thrones, they will see there neither the excessive heat of the sun, nor the excessive bitter cold, (as in Paradise there is no sun and no moon). The shade will be close upon them, and bunches of fruit will hang low within their reach. Vessels of silver and cups of crystal will be passed around amongst them, crystal-clear, made of silver. They will determine the measure of them according to their wishes. They will be given a cup (of wine) mixed with Zanjabeel, and a fountain called Salsabeel. Around them will (serve) boys of perpetual youth. If you see them, you would think they are scattered pearls. When you look there (in Paradise) you will see a delight (that cannot be imagined), and a Great Dominion. Their garments will be of fine green silk and gold embroidery. They will be adorned with bracelets of silver, and their Lord will give them a pure drink."
[76:12-21]

"And those foremost (In Tawheed and obedience to Allah and His Messenger in this life) will be foremost (in Paradise). They will be those nearest to Allah in the Gardens of Delight. A multitude of those (the foremost) will be from the first generation (who embraced Islam) and a few of those (the foremost) will be from the later (generations). They will be reclining, face to face, on thrones woven with gold and precious stones. They will be served by immortal boys, with cups and jugs, and a glass from the flowing wine, from which they will have neither any headache, nor any intoxication. They will have fruit from which they may choose, and the flesh of fowls that they desire. There will be Houris with wide, lovely eyes (as wives for the pious), like preserved pearls, a reward for deeds that they used to do. They will hear no vain or sinful speech (like backbiting, etc.) but only the saying of: Salam, Salam, (greetings of peace). And those on the Right Hand, who will be those on the Right Hand? They will be among thorn-less lote-trees among Talh (banana trees) with fruits piled one above another, in long-extended shade, by constantly flowing water, and fruit in plenty, whose season is not limited, and their supply will not be cut off. They will be on couches or thrones raised high. Verily, We have created for them (maidens) of equal age, loving (their husbands only). For those on the Right Hand."
[56:10-38]

"Verily, the dwellers of Paradise that Day, will be busy in joyful things. They and their wives will be in pleasant shade, reclining on thrones. They will have therein fruits (of all kinds), and all that they will ask for. (It will be said to them): "Salamun" (Peace be on you), a Word from the Lord, Most Merciful."
[36:55-58]

LagosShia: firstly,Islam gave us correct beliefs and the truth devoid of superstitions.

How can islam give you a religion that is devoid of superstition when islam is superstition. . .The sun setting in muddy waters, Allah loves sneezing but dislikes yawning, Mohammed dividing the moon into two and making it bow, meteorites or shooting stars are missiles thrown by angels to deter jinns from eavesdropping into paradise or heaven. . .What are all these myths and superstitionMuhammad believed that meteorites are missiles thrown by angels to deter jinns from eavesdropping?. . . .

Islam gave you "Algebra","Physics","Chemistry",use of "alcohol" in medicine,and contributed in many fields in the sciences.the quoted words are all gotten from arabic words.

Stop lying for mohammed, you are dealing with educated and very knowledgeable people here pls, physics has its origin from the greek work physis which means nature. . .From wikipedia. . . ."Elements of what became physics were drawn primarily from the fields of astronomy, optics, and mechanics, which were methodologically united through the study of geometry. These mathematical disciplines began in Antiquity with the Babylonians and with Hellenistic writers such as Archimedes and Ptolemy". . .

More from wikipedia. . .

"Ancient Egyptians pioneered the art of synthetic "wet" chemistry up to 4,000 years ago.[11] By 1000 BC ancient civilizations were using technologies that formed the basis of the various branches of chemistry such as; extracting metal from their ores, making pottery and glazes, fermenting beer and wine, making pigments for cosmetics and painting, extracting chemicals from plants for medicine and perfume, making cheese, dying cloth, tanning leather, rendering fat into soap, making glass, and making alloys like bronze.

Democritus' atomist philosophy was later adopted by Epicurus (341–270 BCE).
The genesis of chemistry can be traced to the widely observed phenomenon of burning that led to metallurgy—the art and science of processing ores to get metals (e.g. metallurgy in ancient India). The greed for gold led to the discovery of the process for its purification, even though the underlying principles were not well understood.". . . .

If i declare that christianity brought electricity, light bulb, television, cars, air plane etc will you accept that? I will accept if you say that some muslims contributed to the development of science as a whole just as atheist, christians, jews, hindus etc have contributed to the scientific process, cliaming that islam contributed to physics, chemistry is the same as me claiming that atheism or judaism also contributed to them. . .Hope you see how nonsensical your assertions are. . . .

Islam reformed the people of arabia from being savages in the desert feuding,killing themselves and priding themselves with how many graves their clan members have in the graveyard to a great civilization.that is what God promised in Genesis to make Ishmael a "great nation".before Islam in arabia,they were the worse nation on earth.when europe was in its dark age,the coming of Islam to arabia encouraged learning and research.the sciences were not only preserved but also expanded.cities like damascus and baghdad became great centeres of civilization and learning.

Ancient babylon was a great city of learning long before mohammed was born. . .Pre mohammed arabia was just as stable as any part of the world. . .Here is a link from an islamic websites that gives a detailed outlook on life in arabia before islam. . .It only states that the people were pagans and were worshiping idols, else nothing differentiated them from other societies. . .http://www.questionsonislam.com/question/how-was-life-arabian-peninsula-islam-could-you-please-give-information-about-belief-systems. . .Even the roman invaders attested to the peaceful nature of the people and their normal way of life which isn't much different from other. . ."We have before related how Aelius Gallus, when he invaded Arabia with a part of the army stationed in Egypt, exhibited a proof of the unwarlike disposition of the people; and if Syllaeus had not betrayed him, he would have conquered the whole of Arabia Felix."– Strabo, Geography, c. 22 AD.

i could go on narrating.one thing you need to know is Islam encourages learning as a religion and the impact was felt greatly in the initial period of Islamic rule in the middle east and beyond.

you can see this for an idea:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science_in_the_medieval_Islamic_world

The encouragement of learning isn't exclusively an islamic idea or contribution. . .From the link you gave it states that. . ."Scientists within the Islamic civilization were of diverse ethnicities. Most were Persian,[2][3][4][5] as well as a great number of Arabs,[4] Moors, Assyrians, and Egyptians. They were also from diverse religious backgrounds. Most were Muslims,[6][7][8] but there were also some Christians,[9] Jews[9][10] and irreligious.[11][12] "

It says a group of came together to develop science including Jews, christians, and atheist or irreligious under islamic leadership. . .This can hardly be said to be a contribution of islam. . .Since places like china, india etc were also adding to knowledge and encouraging it. . .

Whymee: Statistics shows that numbers of women in the world is higher than that of men, it's unfortunate, the western world condemned the practice of polygamy, but fail to bring an alternative except condom.

So?. . .There is nothing wrong with condemning a way of life you do not agree with. . . .

Islam is the only way of life that brings a solution to supplusity of women by preaching polygamy.
Unfortunately again from the west angle, the media, movie, prints, western education are always bias in presenting polygamy to the public, our brain and reasoning has been hijacked and adulterated that we hardly appreciate other way of life from other part of the world aside west.The widely present a movie supporting the life of monogamy while disparately damaging images og the practice of polygamy

I came about a book titled, Wicked stepmother, what message do you think this will bring to a primary school pupil.

This statement is false, polygamy has been in existence for thousands of years before mohammed was born and before he ever came up with the idea of islam. . .Polygamy is NOT an islamic idea or contribution. . .People in many societies that are not islamic still practice it. . .even christianity does not say its a sin or preaches against it. . .

In Nigeria the ratio of woman to man is 4:1. If we discourage polygamy and stick to one man one wife as advocated by west, what should happen to the other women without men.
If you have a sister amidst, be sincere which option will you push to her, forget about marriage or half bread is better.

Very false. . .According to the figures of the last census that was conducted in Nigeria, there were more men than women. . .Go figure. . .So your assertion is very false. . .

It is obvious in our society that girls of today don't care about the marital status of any man who come on her way, they ate disparate and need to be address as Mrs.
Not only in Nigeria but the entire world.
In doing this they are moving towards the teaching of Islam.

This is the truth and nothing but the truth
Other factors constant, ie economic, mentally okay, strength, social well fare, good governance, social amenities etc

There is no truth in anything you have written so far. . .So the question still remains, What has islam specifically contributed to humanity?. . .Still waiting. . .

wirinet: Oga Seun, don't mind vedaxcool, he is very angry and bitter that people are free from his dogma, they are free from his control and that of his church or pastor.

I can tell you the greatest contribution atheism has done for mankind, and that is giving humanity FREEDOM, freedom from tyrannical Gods, tyrannical, oppressive and exploitative social system and tyrannical priests, that prey on the ignorance, insecurity and fears of the masses. Atheisms is slowly freeing people from these ignorance and fears and replacing it with unselfish love and respect for every person, living thing and the planet as a whole.

as a final passing shot, predominantly atheist societies are far more peaceful and genuinely happy than Christian or Islamic societies where hypocrisy, social upheavals and denominational conflicts are the order of the day.

Our friend here claims he is rational but fails to see that he is asking an irrational question. . .Atheism is only a lack of belief in Gods, how that equates to a philosophical way of life is what I don't understand. . .His question is the same as saying, how has lack of belief in Jesus saved humanity. . .The person that says he does not believe in Jesus simply does not believe in Jesus, his lack of belief in Jesus does not equate to an alternative philosophy or culture. . .He just lacks belief in Jesus and that's all, so asking him how his lack of belief in Jesus has contributed to humanity is clearly a nonsense question. . .

^^

What has this got to do with islam?

I want vexdacool to tell me what islam has specifically or uniquely contributed to humanity or how islam has helped to advance the human race. . .I don't want the topic to be taken to the Islamic section pls. . .Moderators pls leave the topic here. . .

vedaxcool: ^
The irrational thirst to divert attention from the purpose of the thread re-state my earlier position, that atheism has made no contribution to humanity, that people like urself want to simply pass as rational thinking without reading any one would take u serious mr. I have a million dollars in my account u crack me up, this boy no go kill me, on a more serious note, the restating of your perious points that have been refuted for their lies and historic inaccuracies is to achieve what particularly? Or do u rational believe that the more u restate ur previous point the more likely it will be accepted?

No body is diverting attention from anything. . .You don't know me, you also don't know who I am so your opinion of me is of no value to me as a person and you are completely entitled to you beliefs about me, it doesn't stop me from being who I am or having what I have. . .Two people here no me in real life they can testify to what I have and what I don't which is really of no importance to this topic by the way. . .I stated that concepts like separation of church and state and founded on unbelief and skepticism. . .The person that actually lied in this thread is YOU, you claimed that Jesus fought the religious leaders without trying to create a new system until i called you out on and and showed you that he did actually try to create a new system. . . .

Come to think of it are u now fraudulently trying to attribute science as a product of atheism? Or the usual word games to play to decieve yourself

No where did I say that. . .All I said was that modern science(the one practiced) today is fueled by lack of belief in religious superstition, indoctrination and dogma. . .The greatest, prolific and most prestigious group of scientist today like the NAS and scientist that work at CERN are mostly atheist about 95% of them are atheist. . . .Most of their research and invention is based on their atheistic ideas that man is here on his own and everything that man needs to do for himself must be done by man. . . .Their quest for knowledge of the natural origin of man against the religious origin has fueled research in evolution, cosmology etc

Mr. Man act rational for once, the only reason I did not call u insane is because u have not attributed religion to being a product of atheism and from the way u are going this might be ur next big point. ;

Let me humor you. . .There are some religions that are atheistic e.g Buddhism. . .So what are you talking about?

D again on your forbes research u simply showed what I mean when I say atheist like yourself try to simply pass urself as being rational rather than actually being it, where did report say the people were happy as result of atheism? Or as a result of not believing in God? And how does this compare to my post on research that shows people have more peace of mind and are able to cope in difficult times because they believe in a higher power

Didn't you just lie that atheist are known to commit suicide after not finding peace? Do religious people also not commit suicide for lack of peace? Where is your evidence that shows that atheist commit more suicide than religious people because they do not find peace? I gave the link to show that a research was conducted and the people that say they are at peace, satisfied and happy with their lives are to be found in countries where its the citizen are mostly atheist. . . .

This ur behavior is no surprise to me remember I corrected ur ignorant laughter in a thread posted by thaba1234 on a debate between an atheist and muslim, rmember u simply laughted like a hyena without knowing what the utube video posted actually said?

Let me laugh again. . .I don't know who is more stup[i]i[/i]d between you and the deluded muslim debater that started by lying that religion brought clothing to the Irish people, he also said that islam brought justice and peace to the world and to the europeans, that was what he said go and have a look at the video again. . .And you expect me to listen to such a deluded liar?. . .

Get my drift, u do not surprise in your usual haste to attack religion while failing woefully to address this thread which has shown that COW DUNG has made more impact on humanity than the nothingness of atheism. U will do yourself a great deal of good if begin to ask your why are u really an atheist.

Just the same way that pig sh[i]i[/i]t has done more to humanity than Islam. . . .

The question remains a bewilderment for the atheist here to answer, I find very amusing that COW DUNG has changed lifes and humanity more than atheism has,

Many people have tried to give you answers to your question. . .Atheism is simply a lack of belief, it is NOT a way of life, it is not a philosophy, it is based on the lack of acceptance of religious superstition, indoctrination and dogma, and those have contributed a lot to the advancement of the human race. . .Ideologies and philosophies like secular humanism have been formed based on its principles. . .

the pathetic thing is that rather the atheist address the question they pose counter question, something that even idol worshippers would not do, I ask if I an atheist was to ask a christian show me trinity in the bible and rather than answer the question the Christian replies show me atheism in the bible, I ask those who still have a shred of pretense that they are rational to answer would the Christian action be considered sane or insane? If u want to discuss what religion have contributed or specifically what Islam has contributed why don't you go start a thread to answer that rather than slither around trying cunningly to derail the thread? Or am I addressing rational people . . .

And your Allah is better than the Idols that other men worship, how?. . . . . .I will open another thread in other not to derail this one and I will like you to tell us what Islam has contributed to humanity. . .

vedaxcool: It remains baffling that the simple question posed have gone unanswered or untenable answers have been proffered. Like I expected the atheist were hardly going to provide any tangible answer to the simple question what has atheism contributed to humanity? It queries common sense that the atheists with their false sense of over hyped rationality were replying a question back with a question, they began begging that the question should have read what has religion contributed to humanity, one typical with a swag that bretrays his ignorance began saying oh it does make sense asking the question by the conventional definition of atheism, he reminded me of when the simple question was posed to our ever "rational" atheist on between agnosticism and atheism which was more rational, again rather than answer the question the whole of atheism quivered with fear we assiciate with rats running from its mortal enemy the cat mr coventional definition on answer was to conceptualize agnostism, this sort of behavior is only common with men that should be labeled ignorant.

I have told you that atheism has freed people from baseless fear or dogma and religious superstition on a personal level since it is not a culture, you don't get to hear people talking about and believing in magic in atheistic societies, demons, witches, wizards and other superstitions beliefs that make people think like pre historic people have been wiped off by atheism. . . .skepticism, doubt and unbelief is what is fueling modern science today, rather than waste your time praying for cure, you do rigorous research to cure it. . .

Back to the issue at hand, u see it remains a disater of calamic proportions that atheism has no attributed benefit that its proponents can claim imagine that cow dung has benefit to humanity yet atheism can not even boast of a cow dung benefit to mankind.

Unbelief, doubt and skepticism that is devoid of religious indoctrination, superstition and dogma is the back bone of modern science today. . . .

This is the simple implication of their compound failure as we know atheist are known to commit suicide after not finding peace yet we see studies after studies have shown that people who believe in the existence of the most mighty and glorious power, creator of the earth and the heavens experience peace of mind and are more able to cope with difficuly situations than those whose existence have been stripped of every logical justification.

False and a very big lie. . .A research was conducted by forbes magazine on countries where people feel they are most happy, satisfied and fulfilled with their lives and the top five countries for the past 5 years have been countries where majority of the population are atheist. . .Here is the link http://www.forbes.com/2010/07/14/world-happiest-countries-lifestyle-realestate-gallup-table.html . . . . Religious people experience peace of mind, really?. . .Pakistan, Iran, Yemen, Syria, Egypt, Afghanistan etc all have peace of mind more that the people living in majority atheist countries like Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Czech republic?. . . .

By the way, what could be more meaningless than the mythical heaven or afterlife believers strive towards? No future, because in eternity there can be no future and no past. no goal to strive towards, no purpose, no progress. . . .And the fact that they see the present life as only a stepping stone to that pointless afterlife robs this life of all meaning, too. It becomes something that has to be endured for the sake of the afterlife rather than something to be lived and enjoyed or suffered on its own terms, and for its own purposes. What could be more meaningless than the religious postulation that this life is just a way to get to the after life which is the main target?

The response so far only goes to give credence to the profound skepticism people have generally when atheist pass themselves as being ration.

If I ask you to mention what ISLAM SPECIFICALLY has contributed to humanity you WILL NOT be able to mention anything. . . I DARE you mention what ISLAM SPECIFICALLY has contributed to mankind. . .Go ahead lets see. . .

Sweetnecta: @Emofine; DO you think that an educated person can not be ignorant in something, considering the fact that knowledge is continuum and knowledge about us and our environment may just be at the infant stage?
Is it not possible that there is a Creator of what we see, in addition to what we do not see or know? Or did all of these happened without a causer, and we see such an order in all that we know, a repetition?

There are creators of what we see, go read the Hindu verders. . . .

If the causer is One can we all agree to say its a Higher Existence, a Being, our God? Or are there many true causers in this so wonderfully ordered existence that we are part of; human specie being just a small portion of the all? If there are more than one causer, the probability is that the interest of one may be sometimes different from the other[s], at a particular time. What such condition of different agenda may have on us and our environment will definitely be chaos. Is this not possible? Imagine 2 persons having independent control over a thing, both at the same time that each could do as he/she wishes to effect the dynamics and how it all ends. Do we think that one of these 2 overlords will not want to render the intention of the other useless?

False, your arguments are so childish like that of a baby. . .the cause of the universe are many and not one. . . .They all came together around a common purpose and created the universe. . .Take a look at the Air Bus A380 jumbo jet, many people with a purpose came and built it. . .They all came together around a purpose and built the air plane. . . .Same with the Gods, they came together and created the universe, when two people or entities come about for the same purpose they can not render the intention of the other useless. . .did the people that build your house render the intention of each other useless?

Such is the idea of God with multiple entity in the God head. No one of them can be truly in control; each with different agenda will rid the others or render them useless.

Not true. . .Once many entities come together around a common purpose they can agree and create what ever the want and maintain it. . .The Gods agreed, came together around a common purpose and created the universe. . .

Such in a sense is the mini God to True Single God Who is capable of acting alone, over the mini God and all that think highly of the mini God.

All the Gods are true Gods. . . .

Should we serve God that needs to be fed, clothed, protected from the elements? None of them is Truly The God worthy of worship, especially when we make it with our hands, tools, factories.

Neither should we serve any God that needs people to fight for it, tell people about him, build its temples, and tell people about it. . .he can do it himself if he is alive, no?. . .

God Almighty is One; Unique in every respect and Independent of us, while all depend on Him. Now that is the God I am inviting you to. Not what others can not present to be able to control all; My God does not get weary, tired, sleep, exhausted or fatigue. He was complete before the beginning and He has patiently appointed each his/her/its time.

Lie, the Gods are many and they came together around a common purpose and created the universe. . . .The Gods do not depend on humans, they get weary, tired, sleep, exhausted or fatigue.

Here are more of God's moral laws. . . . .

1. If a man is caught in the act of rap.ing a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her. Deuteronomy 22:28-29

2. If within the city a man comes upon a maiden who is betrothed, and has relations with her, you shall bring them both out of the gate of the city and there stone them to death: the girl because she did not cry out for help though she was in the city, and the man because he violated his neighbors wife.
Deuteronomy 22:23-24

3. "If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." Leviticus 20:13

4. A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. Leviticus 20:27

5.If a man commits adultery with another man's wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. Leviticus 20:10

6. A priest's daughter who loses her honor by committing fornication and thereby dishonors her father also, shall be burned to death. Leviticus 21:9

7. All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. Leviticus 20:9

8. They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. 2 Chronicles 15:12-13

9. 18If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother, and that, when they have chastened him, will not hearken unto them:Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city, and unto the gate of his place;And they shall say unto the elders of his city, This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton, and a drunkard.
And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear.Deuteronomy 21:18-21

10. Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed. Exodus 22:19

^^

sup man?. . . .emöfine2 is not a christian. . .

maclatunji: You are the most confused of the lot I think.

That's your opinion. . .

1. Are you saying you believe in several gods?

You claim that there is only one God or a single creator of the universe, others have also claimed that there are many Gods or creators of the universe. . .The key word here is CLAIM. . .Your evidence(since you are the one making the claim) to show that the universe is the handy work of a single entity is WHAT?. . .I just want you to provide evidence that establish your claims are true that's all. . . .There are competing claims, i just want to know which is real and which is not, the universe was created by only one entity and not many entities because of(insert evidence here). . .

2. Are you saying you don't believe in God because some other people say there are many gods?

Am saying that you claim that there is only one God, your evidence to show that there is only one God and not many Gods as proposed by others is what?. . .I just want you to substantiate your claims and provide evidence for them, simple. . .

3. Are you saying you don't believe in the Creator/Higher Being/God at all irrespective of what anybody else says?

I have gone past the level of relying or accepting what people say. Any body that makes such a claim should back it up with concrete evidence, extra ordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. . .Let me give you an example, we are told by some religions(yours inclusive) that we descended from one man and one woman, if that is claim is true, then there should be DNA evidence to back that assertion up, we can trace it and see how true the claim is. . .So far there is no evidence to back up that claim even though we have the ability to know that through DNA. . .If you make claims such as these then its up to you to provide evidence. . .If scientist can provide evidence for their claims, then why are the religionist and theist still telling us stories?. . . Why does their evidence lie only in he said she said talks and counter talks?. . .I don't believe in God irrespective of stories and statements. . .I will believe when you provide evidence, its that simple. . .

4. Are you saying you believe in God but don't want to associate with any religion because different religions have conflicting teachings about God and how he relates with us?

No, am saying that all religions and their claims are equally valid or invalid, since all the claims begin and end in stories, narratives and ideas that lack evidence to back them up. . .

When you have cleared your confusion by choosing one of the options, let us know.

I hope i have cleared my "confusion". . . .Now over to you, some people claim that the universe was created by many entities, you claim it is created by a single entity, your evidence to prove them wrong and prove that your claim is right is WHAT?. . .

maclatunji: For your mind, you think say you dey make sense. Keep deluding yourself, you case is worse than that of the Ostrich that buries its head when in danger whilst leaving its bulky frame exposed to danger. You are desperately trying to base your life on the negative. It won't work, you know you call out to God all the time so spare us the act. Find something else to form cool with not atheism.

Base my life on the negative?. . .You know exactly what am talking about, you can not just be making claims without any evidence and expect to get away with it. . .You dismiss the claims of the scientist and put forth your own ridiculous claims that are not better than theirs. . .Why is it wrong to believe that there are many creators of the universe as Hindus and other religions do? Where is your own evidence to show that the universe was created by a single entity? others have said it was created by many entities, why are they wrong? Why should any body believe you and your claims? where are your evidence to show that the universe was created and is maintained by a single entity and not many entities as told by many others. . .Why should any body believe your claims that have no evidence?. . .You are telling us that God is this, God is that, bla bla bla. . .Why are those that believe in many Gods wrong?. . .The scientist that believes in abiogenesis and evolution is wrong, how?. . .A single entity created the universe and he told you how, when, why and where he did it in a plagiarized book of ancient arabain mythology that was written by prehistoric arabian men?. . .You must be kidding. . .It is NOT always God or nothing as you are made to believe. . .

maclatunji: Yawns, long thing you are on.

At least I have shown you that everything is not black or white as religion will love to have you believe, it is not always God or nothing. . .You claim God but can not provide any evidence to back up the God hypothesis. . . I am not claiming anything, I disbelieve in the God hypothesis based on lack of any evidence, you are the one making the claim,so its up to you to provide evidence or just accept that your belief are not better than that of the scientist you try to ridicule. at least we have used some of the scientific beliefs (in evolution) to solve some of our problems(cure for diseases). . .We are yet to use your God did it hypothesis that lacks any evidence to do anything useful for humanity. . .It is not always God or nothing as religion always puts it. . .I do not know and I am not sure is an alternative. . . .

maclatunji: This sort of argument will lead you nowhere. You are nothing remember {grains of sand and stars) but God owns everything. By his very nature, even the concept of beginning and end cannot exist without him. The fact that you are asking this question shows that you have no understanding of God; beginning, time, space, end are all created concepts, they just aren't here by themselves, God created them.

Typical question begging from the theist. . .God owns everything in reality or in your beliefs?. . .Pls show how, when and where God created everything. . You are the one making the claim so pls back it up with evidence for once. . .You ascribe everything thing to God as if it explains anything. .what is the difference between your God hypothesis that was made without evidence and the scientist hypothesis of abiogenesis, evolution and big b[i]a[/i]ng that are also made without evidence, you ridicule their own assertions on the grounds that they lack evidence when your own assertion completely lacks evidence as well. There is much more evidence to show that species evolve or the universe began to expand at a certain time as proposed by the ideas of evolution and big ba[i]n[/i]g ,than there is evidence to show that Allah created the universe. . .Allah created the universe is just a claim which is no better than saying the Pantheon of Hindu Gods created the universe. . .its only a claim. . .It has no evidence. . .

Your question smacks of arrogance, God has given us the ultimate test; shall we believe in him through his signs and messages or shall we demand to "see him",for him to "talk directly to us" ask for his beginning when he has none (beginning, is a concept derived from him!).

Sign, message? Where is the sign or signature of your God any where in the universe and where is his message?. . .If there is a God and he has a message for all of humanity why not send it at once to all of humanity?. . .Why not make a loud voice address the whole world in a language every body can hear and understand clearly and drop his message assuming the universe has only one creator? Why are people relying on medieval messages, thoughts, concepts, mythologies, superstitions and ideas that project various Gods? Why are the Hindu verders not the words or message of the creator(s) of the universe but the Koran? why do you accept the Koran and not the Hindu verders?. . .Is ts because you were born into a family that accepts the Koran and indoctrinated you with its stories, claims and dogma?. . .

Many had asked the questions that you guys ask now in the past but their skepticism and disbelief did not serve them in anything than to misguide them. Today, they know the truth. Each individual has a responsibility upon himself, if you want to remain the skeptic with evidence of God slapping you from all angles (that is your business), ours is to give you adequate info. to guide you. If you fail to accept it, the consequence is yours.

You are jumping the gun my friend. . .You have not established that your version of God exist and you are talking of providing evidence. . .As I said earlier I can reason like you and also tell you that you are evidence that evolution is true. . .

One more point, it is a fallacy to think that the human brain can process and understand all concepts. Can your eyes see in the infrared spectrum? Can you smell fear? We have limits, the moment we accept those limits is when we will truly begin to reach our true potential.

Because we have limits that means everything should be ascribed to the God concept, eh?. . .When has the God concept ever answered anything?. . .

[quote author=Mai-suya]The Quran says "and We have not sent messengers except with the language of his own people, so that he might explain to them...." Quran- ibrahim

The above verse when construed with the previous ones in my earlier post gives us the understanding that, NOT ONLY ARE THERE PROPHETS OTHER THAN THE SEMITIC(jews and arabs) ONES, BUT ALSO MESSAGES CAME FROM ALLAH IN LANGUAGES OTHER THAN THE SEMITIC ONES (arabic, Hebrew, Amharic, Tigrinya, And Aramaic)

Thus if you critically analyse the Hindus and the bhudist religion there are traces of monotheism, a one supreme God called different names in different language. And these messages were brought by men of God (prophets) even though divinity was ascribed to some of them and their messages got mixed up, misunderstood or some times outrightly lost. I hope that answers you.[/quote]No it does NOT what you have written actually have nothing to do with reality, some of the religions you talked about do not even have the word prophets at all. .They also claim to have been sent down by their various Gods themselves and their messages are pure. How does monotheism equate to Allah sending messengers to people in India? The religions the people practice have NOTHING in common with Islam, what it Allah that sent people to the mayan to tell them to sacrifice human beings?. . .They seem to be doing that for thousands of years and claim their Gods told them to do it. . .Reality does NOT agree with your claims. . .