₦airaland Forum

Greenarrow01:
next has a point to some extent. Some clients will want to cut corners by fire by force. If the contractor is not cutting corners they will fire him and opt for a cheaper alternative. Especially in Nigeria. Home owners will be moulding 60 blocks with a bag of cement. Home owners will engage different artisans just to cut cost, they will give block molding to every kamaru and Musa that is a Mallam good at digging wells only
Shebi it's just to mix sand and cement.
Musa can do it.

This happens daily.
Let ask our self.
How many home owners engage the services of structural engineers
How many.
We feel that's an extra spending. The bricklayer is enough he has Methuselah's experience in building.
You will see home owners building soooo close to roads.
When they know there is supposed to be a setback.
And let's not even say the engineers can decline the job
If he decline how he go take buy food for house.

This thing eeh
Everybody is responsible
Engineers, home owners, govt etc.
Everybody is cutting corners

Everybody, I agree completely.

Government is quick to blame every collapse on substandard materials and quackery but the question remains "Why is it that it's almost only during the rainy seasons that houses fall like pack of cards in Nigeria?" Why does it always happen in floodzones and not rampant in areas with solid ground like Abeokuta, Ibadan, Benin & Ondo? Abi, Abeokuta get more professional builders than Lagos?

We don't have to deny the obvious.

I have access the the list of registered contractors in Ogun State Contract Registry. More than 85% are from Lagos state.

________

Why is the government not talking about the Lagos State Drainage Masterplan. Or we think once water flood our streets and find its way into the ground, there are no consequences?

_________

Go and see many multi-million naira projects in Lagos sinking and already abandoned.

https://miro.medium.com/max/805/0*5Pmm93UFMfmf6IPc


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Eko Atlantic City

https://medium.com/@gokulullaskandanat/its-more-than-rising-seas-a-look-at-why-these-3-cities-are-sinking-7c57f1b6f19e

Climate change is changing the weather patterns throughout the world but a lot of the flooding issues faced by the country is due to lack of proper planning, illegal construction, and inadequate maintenance. Lagos isn’t so much sinking, but getting increasingly water-logged. The damp soil and improper construction are leading to buildings sinking, especially in poor neighborhoods where low lying mangroves and wetlands were reclaimed for construction.

Whenever I'm in the ancient city of Ibadan, I just want to visit the colonial masterpiece designed and built using mud by Sir Demas Nwoko in 1964.

In his words, "When we built with mud, everyone had a house." I think the major difference is that they built back in the days with common sense. There's better planning.

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Pics - Nwoko's Ibadan Home (1964). Just look at the amphitheater

Take a visit to this beautiful structure whenever you're in the south west city. He also designed the Dominican University, Samonda Ibadan.

Lucky Escape in Apapa (June 28): https://guardian.ng/news/occupants-escape-as-building-collapses-in-lagos/

Erring owners.... 99% of most owners here served by LASBCA would continue to build instead of stopping the work to do the right thing. Prove me wrong!

And we say we are not in a rush? Read what one of una did in Apapa

Like Miami, Like Lagos State.

We build on water and expect nothing to happen?


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Did Julius Build all those ancient mud houses in Ibadan that are still standing till date? All of us can't be mumu at the same time.

Just in: https://punchng.com/five-year-old-boy-die-in-lagos-building-collapse-lasema/

We are already in the season so it's no longer a surprise.

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I guess the age of the building should take the blame right now.

bixton:
Also not abiding to set back(s) be it 9m or 3m is not the reason behind building collapse. One of the purposes for setbacks is for utilities.

Just as I shared earlier, where there are no standards I become the standard.

Setbacks act as buffers and protection against flash floods in my personal abode. I have large space for utilities. My fish pond alone is over half plot of land so space is not an issue for me.

In my own land use ordinance , setback is the minimum distance which my building must recede from the street or road, river, flood plain, or any other place which is deemed to need protection.

- The setback from my building to Lafarge Plant in Sagamu (where blasting activities occurs regularly) is about 1.8km.
- The setback from my building to the stream we recently dredged is over 50m
- The setback from my building to established beacons for the proposed Lagos-Calabar railway line (I heard there's realignment) is over 500m

One thing I can guarantee you is that if you dig my foundation this morning despite the heavy downpour in the week, you'll still find dry soil. I was intentional about my build. I don't have energy to fight and my mental health is important to me so I do what I got to do to prevent my kobokobo investment

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That's why I went for cheap land in area where I can do anything I like without crying when I was going to make my decision to build.

Just watch and understand how nature can cause a major building collapse.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xe8p2NhwxdU


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQzJCmxkHI8

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/video-house-collapse-manchester-floods-19674115


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5k0RTmmnq_Y

So if you like go and get JB to build your house and put it in a place without proper planning because JB built it....

bixton:
There's nothing wrong with "fix along as you build" approach......as long as it's done right using the necessary information. I say this most especially for flood prone areas.
Flooding and earth moving equipments are not the reason for building collapse. As far as nigeria is concerned building collapse among many factors is as a result of using inexperienced hands/heads and cutting corners.

Construction activities which includes but not limited to blasting, piling, compaction, deep excavations, and construction traffic can produce vibrations that can cause damage to neighbouring buildings and structures.

Read more:

https://guardian.ng/property/flooding-to-trigger-building-collapse-in-major-cities/

https://www.bbc.com/pidgin/tori-53097480

Regardless the quality of construction and the experience of the construction manager, I don't think it is advisable for anyone in his right senses to leave his/her building inside standing water. There are too many causes of building collapse that we pay little or no attention to especially in flood prone areas (especially Lagos) eg. weak soil, continuous dredging activities, vibration induced by construction activities can cause different types of structural damage.

Once again, regardless of the materials you use to build your house, extended exposure to vibration, prolonged flooding or dredging activities over a period of time can cause more densification resulting in more settlement of the soil. When the soil beneath the foundation fails, the structure will surely fall and there's absolutely nothing you can do about it.

Watch this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mH0XNrekP3U

n3xt:
Urgent!!!

[s]I need a sure plug for demolition permit in Oshodi area.

Pls dm me +234 80 234... 29122 if you have one.

Thanks.[/s]

Resolved.

How did you handle the SARS people working in LIRS?
My client pay Tax in FCT and LASG is pushing another XX million for ordinary small duplex.

For those who recently file for building permit/planning permission in Lagos, how did you handle double taxation?

Cutting corner is not an option here.

Thanks.

n3xt:
Urgent!!!

[s]I need a sure plug for demolition permit in Oshodi area.

Pls dm me +234 80 234... 29122 if you have one.

Thanks.[/s]

Resolved.

How did you handle the SARS people working in LIRS?
My client pay Tax in FCT and LASG is pushing another XX million for ordinary small duplex.

For those who recently file for building permit/planning permission in Lagos, how did you handle double taxation?

Cutting corner is not an option here.

Thanks.

SamuelLoch:
So I went to school to study Finance. With the many hardship attached to my four-year course, I'd graduate then spend 2 years doing military combat. 2years o!!! Upon graduation, I can't remember all I learnt at school because it's not in my working memory. Now, I'd for the next two years not practice or learn a skill, but doing military combat

What's good about this idea? If it's going to be optional, no problem

This simply means graduates will be missing the ideal time to consolidate their knowledge from school.
By the time they hit the job market and are ready to practice, they’d have completely forgotten all that they’ve learnt in school and their employers will not be getting the full benefit as it's almost as if they're learning it again from scratch.

#misplacedpriority if you ask me.

Got an offline msg that I should shed more light on subsoil investigation and the importance.

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We’ve actually done this many times here but I’d share something from the Test we carried out in 2011.

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No matter the size of your house, it is highly advisable to investigate the compaction characteristics of the soil you want to build on as this will tell you if the soil is a satisfactory foundation material.

Soil test is not just a means of enriching engineers/builders/town planners but a scientific way of confirming the suitability of soil for a proposed development.

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A soil might be satisfactory for one type of construction but might require special treatment for other building. The test will confirm the suitability of soils for foundation based on strength, cohesion and consolidation characteristics of the soil.

Born2conquer:
I love this thread so much, check the threads i’ve created and now i feel so stupid

If to sey i dey this thread ni, i fhoor no create such threads.

Thank God i paused my building then, now i can now carefully make my choice

Glad you got value from here.

Learn from other people’s mistake. Don’t be the mistake

diordaves:
Hard wood can resist weather conditions for a considerable length of time beyond 28 days when truly dried.

There are two challenges roofing woods will have in this situation. One, the woods may not have dried properly before use, so there's the danger of warping before sheet installation if left for too long. A second challenge is the points at which nails penetrated the woods. The 'wounds' the nails created. Persistent rain water may penetrate the wounds leading to rot.

If you are having this challenge, look for a wood preservative and apply on the woods. You should be good for up to a year depending on the quality. A good quality wood preservative will prevent too rapid drying leading to warping and rain water resistant.

There should be wood preservative in Nigeria or talk to paint manufacturers like gbadexy. I'm sure they should be able to knock up something for a half decent price. Wood preservatives are bible for wooden structures in the US and UK even for raw untreated wood lasting for years in snow, rain and sun.

Very correct.

I’ve been trying to get old pics of the roofing woodwork. I actually applied wood preservatives and black motor oil on all the woods.

They were all painted while on the ground and after installation.

Dooooooo:
Here's one of the reasons why I didn't just jump into conclusion.
I expect woods used for roofing to last as long as 50 years while covered, therefore it can lasts some months without covering.
But I haven't seen where a smoothly going building project's roofing carcass stays 2 weeks without been covered.
Uncleteeh (OAKGroup)

#smoothlygoing

Tbh, I didn’t plan to keep the woodwork uncovered for more than a week.

Enyinne:
Talk joor

There was this project of mine I wanted to roof 10 years ago. It was 2 building and I have limited resource to take up the roof installation at the same time. So I decided to buy wood for both building with the hope that fund will come in to do the roofing at once.

Lo and behold, I was only able to raise fund for one of the units. So we roofed only one and we started working hard to raise fund for the other building. It took me almost 5 months to raise the fund and the woodwork has been done.

To my rudest shock (though I wasn't completely surprised because of the quality of wood I bought), nothing happened to the woodwork. I'd find time to visit the building and take pictures.

As much as I wont encourage you to do it my way, I dont really think anything will happen if you use quality woods for you roofing project. The problem is where to find such quality of wood.

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Attached below is one of the wood installed 10 years ago. It has been on the ground since 10 years ago and it hasnt shown any sign of rot.

Enyinne:
Lets wait to get more insight on this issue . Thanks

Make I tell you something? Promise not to laugh...

somehow:
While I don't know up to what he knows when it comes to construction, I still ask questions to understand why he's doing what he's doing.

That's a very good one sir. Continue to use your curiosity to understand what is happening and what is going to happen and not just what has happened.

The bottomline is to get more involved. Don't use your construction inexperience as an excuse!
Ask questions. Take charge!

Let everyone know you're in it together and there's a win for everyone.

somehow:
Because it's his line and also experienced in construction.

If i have such experience and knowledge, I wouldn't employ any "contractor" since I can do the job of the contractor.

On any of his project, there are over 30 contractors and subcontractors. Everyone from Civil Engineers to IPTV installers attend our meetings.

Even me mysef, I engage engineers for my personal build. As a matter of fact, most of my personal builds are done in my absence

Jasobry:
Thanks to this platform,also to dubemcapital.

I'm always called an engineer whenever i visit my site.
My neighbour asked if I'm a builder because every space in my house is functional.
I laughed,me wey no sabi.

But all thanks to the group.

My structure still stands out in the estate.

I go collect one room for that your house

somehow:
The set of homeowners I am talking for aren't those who turned contractors /engineers overnight o.

Not those who doubles as the architect and structural engineer.

Only talking for those who employed certified builders/contractors.

The set of homeowners I'm talking for are those who do more than writing cheques.

I'm talking about those who take up the role of supervising the big picture, getting the funds and managing the professionals as well (directly or indirectly) all stakeholders.

I'm actually representing those homeowners who understands that long before there is a contractor, he/she makes what may be the most vital decisions on the construction project: what contractor, architect, engineer, consultants... to use.

_________

This explains why I loved the man I learnt from.

Late Dr Alex Ekwueme despite his status and experience in construction would never go to sleep on any project. He meets every contractor every forthnight in a roundtable session to discuss deliverables, dependencies and change order requests. He never go to sleep assuming he has engaged professionals. He play his role as the project director (owner).

The difference here is that he's a professional who understands what it costs to build a solid house and the role of the owner.

Despite the multibillion naira projects handled for the late vice president and the former president of the Nigeria Institute of Architect, he will always visit the site every forthnight.

_________

Good night!

somehow:
Professionals that won't skip soil test, skip using the right materials or even changing the design of the building to fit the strength of the soil.

We can see that there are other houses around the collapsed Miami buildings.

It's the job of every professional to advise their client accurately and if such client won't listen, they should walk out!

If you accept to build in a place not worth building on, you as the professional must pay for it and be jailed forever!

This is why you're the professional and not the landowner.

What will happen to the owner who bought the land with his own money? Rent it out to tenants? Put his family members there?

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There's one person I will forever respect here. He paid over 1m to conduct soil test for a land in Ogombo in 2011 just to be sure it's worth it. When we gave him the soil report, he decided to walk away from the land and went to buy land in Agbowa where he does not need raft and Baba lati can successfully deliver a good house for him without breaking bank.

How many clients here will do this?

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I have a client who got 24m depth in his report. He still went ahead with the project.

Let me give you ideas of how deep 24m is, It's like 7 stories building or length of 2 and half Dangote Truck.

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If you say professional should walk out, may I ask at what point? At the beginning of the project, when he's just meeting the client?
Or when the building has gone up only to realize how stubborn his client is?

I believe you'd agree with me that no builder has x-ray vision to know difficult clients neither can he force him/her to pay for what he didnt plan for. He can only advice.

Born2conquer:
I dey gbadun you, i love this thread and everybody here, it’s a pity i joined this thread late

You guys are awesome! Greater heights to everyone

Learning is what most adults will do for living in the 21st century. This platform is our own school

somehow:
This is why professionals must be professionals and not try to push their responsibilities to their ignorant clients (If clients were pros in construction, they wouldn't need any professional to handle their builds.)

In summary, people should always take responsibility once they have been paid to carry out a project.

How come you're not getting the environmental factor part sir? This is a major reason for building collapse in recent times.

Do you mean I should blame my builder/engineer for waters percolating round my building as a result of my next door neighbours refusal to install proper drainage?

______

I recently cleared about 3 acres of land behind my plot. Just last week, I got a report that all my roof eaves have almost fallen off. Should I blame the roof installer for doing poor job? A roofing job that was done over 1 decade ago without issues until we cut off some trees

Even action has a consequence. You need to understand and play your part and stop looking for someone else to blame.

While we were clearing the land, it never occured to me I was removing the wind breakers and exposing the roof/building to extreme weather.

Na who I go blame bayi o! The person who cut the trees or the roofer who didnt think of when the trees would be cut down in the future or the owner who gave the order to remove the trees without considering the consequences.

If you host a 200 person party inside your building, will you still blame the contractor for any eventuality?

somehow:
How old is the building you're quoting?

You know the collapse we are talking about. We saw the images EgunMogaji2 posted a while back.

Buildings collapse everywhere in the world when they become old and fragile without necessary renovations.

When it becomes an issue is if the building is newly built or ongoing.

This construction stage is even more critical.

A number of factors might cause engineering to go south if you’re not paying attention to important stuffs.

Most times plain negligence or thinking about form over function is a major cause of building collapse.

I’ve seen a building collapsed in Lagos Mainland due to overloading (rooftop party).

Likewise, I’ve seen a building collapse due to roof design. It wasn’t well designed to handle extreme weather condition.

Baba I wan rest

New Topic Alert!!

Visit https://www.kobocity.com/blog/223-top-construction-technology-trends-in-2021/3

I’ll share a video later on this thread to buttress my point that owners should be jailed for building collapse.

We too dey rush!

To keep water away from my personal abode, I had to create stormwater drainage at almost 30m away from my building running about 1km away.

I know my structure is standing strong but I need to do more to keep it standing for many more years. So I’m not prepared to take chances.

That’s why I created my own estate where I have control over everything happening around me. I don’t wait on people or government to do what’s right. Neither do I look for people to blame for things I knew I can manage.

The 40 year old Miami structure that collapsed couldn’t have been a case of incompetent contractor but a complete disregard for professional advice/recommendations.

Stop the water before it stops you.

Dijita:
Thanks to you @Next, your guy seems to be ok. Already awarded him another #450k contract and considering him for another in that range.
You see, someone told me the borehole cost was #250k about 10 years ago. I told them to dig well instead. Last year they said it is dried up. they dig it again. This year they said it dried up again and that we need to add another ring. I said forget it.
When your guys show up the same person said I should have told him that I needed borehole because he has someone that can do it at reasonable price. I said you told me it cost about #250k 10 years ago. Today it will be over 2 millions if we consider inflation. 2million can't be more reasonable than #150k. The #150k is one of the cost I am most pleased to pay in the life of this project.

Thank you!

The guy is super good in plumbing and I've told him to do a very good job.

somehow:
Hopefully we will get to hear the main reason for the demolition.

As for collapse and flooding. I believe a competent contractor /builder should be able to handle any project that wouldn't lead to such.

I guess incompetent contractor built the miami collapsed building. Maybe he also used substandard materials from Nigeria

I always laugh when I read stuffs here. The only thing we know about is cutting corners, corruption, substandard materials blah blah. We often dont think of environmental influence as a major cause of collapse.

When building regulations request for 9m setback for certain building, we often half it or even do whatever we like on site. For us, it is a waste of space. Those who requested for it must be stupid. They don't know how much they sell land in Lekki....

I have nothing less than 9m setback on 3 sides in my personal abode. Do you think I'd suffer same catastrophe as someone who had lesser setback? If there's fire outbreak, would I have issues like someone who manage to fit his building in 10m plot. What about vibrations? Think about standing waters - it can never get to my building. What about land subsidence? Is that a case of lack of competence?

I think you should read up more on causes of building collapse sir.

Miami building collapse: What could have caused it? https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-57651025


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All I can say is that if my building collapse, hold me responsible because I don't take chances. Where there are no standards, I become the standard.

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Pics from The Contractor (Miami Building Collapse)

Thanks @dijita

Borehole Installation at Ibeju/Lekki

https://youtube.com/shorts/NGFSEzH--y0?feature=share

somehow:
Do you have the details of why they got demolished so that others can compare and see if they are heading that path or safe?

I can't really say more than I've shared above. Don't be in a rush to do anything in Lagos state (especially in all those mushroom estates).

I'm not happy sharing this anyway because it's still fresh and the affected owners are still in deep shock but one thing I can tell is I have first hand information about all that happened and the clients are to be blamed for listening to the omo-oniles and choosing not to do the right thing at the right time.

I designed one of the building that made the incident go viral on social media (instablog). I was also in Alausa while appealing the action. I did the remedial work on the partly demolished structures but all I can say is "Don't get yourself in a situation where you wished you have taken it slow."

This one is demolition. It could be flooding or partial collapse in other situations.

somehow:
They should let us know the stage at which this happened and the activities that went on before then if they see it fit for knowledge purposes.

Baba, remember I said don't take me too serious.

This is the way I'd just be sharing my stuff. You're not compelled to take me serious.

Some of us are shaped by the experience we gather from other people's mistake and then there are others who chose to be the other people we learn from. The owners of those demolished structures I shared above are here with us and I pray we never had to go through a situation where all we worked for will go down right in from of us and we will now be asked to come and explain how it happened for knowledge purpose.