₦airaland Forum

OlaoChi:
do you have any evidence at all to rival the submissions of Historians and archaeologists on Yoruba origin/Ife history?
the submissions I mean to be, Ife being occupied as early as 350BC, 13 communities with each having its own Ruler, oduduwa's ties with Oke-ora?
I want to see what makes you hold on to an israel connection

Yes I do but you know I can't divulge deep info here because I am a writer and specifically to write about my ancestors. It's a divine call because my eyes were opened to it since the age of four(4).
And a full grown man by the Grace of the REAL ASHEDA, OLOFI, ELERUN AND ELEDUMARE THROUGH HIS DIVINE WORD CALLED EL-A (JESUS)
I can't go further than this but on commentary, I will always open the eyes of the people of this great ANCESTRY.

nisai:
Why? Ok I am sorry for being too forward.

But even if you delete it and operates another handle, you are still going to be discovered! Remember knowledge is light that does not necessarily
require advertisement.

therefore, I am pleading with you with utmost humility to stay and keep on educating the likes of me.

I admire your humility in pleading with the person you quoted. However, that man is something else from whom you think you can get some heavy concrete info from because he will tell you things from the surface but not too deep as you desire. Please don't get me wrong. I don't mean negative things but the knowledge you seek can't be got from him unless......... And if you do, You simply become mastery in the sphere but you won't be able to divulge beyond the surface...Though he that see curiosity and call it foolishness, what will he call a shadow behind a man? But he that sees foolishness and call it curiosity, what will he call a man looking back at his own shadow? Be, rest assured, he will always come back because I know, he will always come back. He that belongs to the service of humanity cannot shade himself in darkness but shot forth ray of light.

Long live the Great king and spiritual leader of ILE KAARO OO JI IRÈ

O0ni:
This is why Bini, Ijebu & a number of different groups never take Yoruba history serious.

It is 90+ kings before Oduduwa.

Comparative study of cultures find similarities in cultural systems every time - some very deep, some on the surface but in most cases no shared history or contact.

The scholars you read have mostly been debunked. The theory you are basing your thoughts on is a struggle between Christians & Muslims.

Christian scholars try to attach to Egypt or Israel by looking for similarities to back up their claims.

Muslim scholars look to Mecca/Arabia for similarities to back up their claims too.

And there are not international scholars only 1 person whose name I cannot recall right now and his work has been thrown in the dustbin of the academia. His work is what other pro-religious scholars use as the basis of their research. The nonsense is all over the internet and was wide spread on nairaland around 2010-2013.

Let me discombobulate your egypt/israel/mecca connection for a minute. If you have an open mind, read about the Etruscans and the very intricae similarities they share with rhe Yoruba which cut across the socio-political and socio-cultural systems, it is not just language here but how the family system, the state, kingship, burial ceremony, naming ceremony, art patterns etc.

Does this mean Yoruba migrated from Italy to the present location?

Look at the Greeks & Amerindians. Like the Yoruba, they have patheon of deities with each deity being associated with each natural phenomenon then the ritual patterns all the same with Ife/Yoruba.



The Greeks, Romans & Amerindians used the same motifs on burial sites, does this make Yoruba a part of these 3 civilizations?



In what Yoruba practice is skull worshipped?



They were 90+ in total. They ruled in Ife & they were not out right kings per-se but head of a loose confederacy. All 13 hamlets had their own kings but the position of overall head was rotated. The 13 communities are still in Ife with each having its ruler. The kings you mentioned ruled in Africa, present day ife.



Ela is the name of a leaf mostly used in preparing aseje for aje or sales for business. '...gbogbo ori igi ni ela nlaa le, ela ki de ori igi ko mo la' - ela spreads on all trees, ela spreads whenever it gets to the top of the tree. That is a minor part of the incantation said when activating the aseje before use.

The literal meaning of Quran is word of God/Allah

The literal meaning of Bible/Torah is word of God.

The literal meaning of Ifa is word of God/Olodumare.

Ba,Abba, Baba is a word found across all cultures meaning the same thing father.

Baale/Baale: One is Baba Ile (Father of the family compound/house) usually the oldest man in the clan while the other is Baba Ile (Father of the land) a junior chief usually under the thumb of a king.

Ba'al: originally a greek word that is applied to all figures or images but during reformation became applied to 'false gods' according to christian standards. Read: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baal

How does this baale & baal situation concern Yoruba exactly?



Olu orun (king of heaven) is a term that came into existence with emergence of Nigerian nationalism in the church. That is, during the nationalist movement there was the movement to break away from the Catholic and British protestant way of worship - this led to the Cele & C&S movements. In developing their terms for Yorubanized christianity they developed Oluorun as a word for God. Olu orun was not the actual term used for God in Yoruba land, Olu orun came with nationalism in Christianity.

The Yoruba ancient and actual word for Supreme creator is Olodumare. You will never hear an Ifa or Orisa chant or Yoruba history where Olorun is used, it is always Olodumare; go figure.



Oyo account has been thrashed already. Like I said, it is muslims trying to validate their belief in Allah and Yoruba idol worship.

I was back home in January during my family festival. Of course, we had a conference and Ooni was there. He did a project on a CD that was based on tracing & connecting sound patterns and drawing inferences. I was miffed in my seat and was vibrating with disgust, he came with and shared the CDs in the hall and I flatly rejected the one offered to me.

Saying Odua was Adura, prayer LOL.

And a deity Katokakakakiki is the name from which Catholic was gotten from, boy I broke into a bout of laughter in the hall.

I do not blame the Ooni, he is a christian and also bound by secrecy not to say anything at all. Even though the shabby documentary put together tried to separate Ife/Yoruba from others, it still turned around to put Ife achievements under Islam & Jews as if Ife/Yoruba could not have come this far alone except they compulsorily derive from Arabs or Jews - very sad thought.

My mind is not closed to this but it is funny because evidenced and material history says otherwise. Linguists do not support these claims so why should I accept this hypothesis that can be twisted by anyone. Did people not recently say Yoruba and Ibo were the same by drawing similar words with similar meanings, if you agree that by words we came from Israel do you then agree Yoruba and Ibo are related then considering we have a lot of closely sounding words with similar meanings? If you don't then dump the Israel & Egypt hypothesis quickly.



- Every civilization claims the beginning of mankind. Read across all cultures, they claim mankind, it is nothing special. Every culture that evolves independently without a known source of influence claims to be the beginning of mankind since it is the beginning they know.
- Living around water or mountains os all a matter of geography but mostly farming for water and mountains for military strategy. There's no big deal here, it cuts across all places on earth.
- How come they knew Guerrilla warfare? Is guerrilla warfare peculiar to and the brainwork of one group now? Isn't guerrilla warfare a military strategy implemented in the face of superior firepower in most cases?
- Dread lock: it was invented in east Africa by people who protested against colonialist by refusing to eat, shower or trim their hairs. The hairs grew out long and locked and pf course the Europeans did not like it, they dreaded it. There you have it, dread(ed) locks. It is a recent phenomenon that has grown into fashion, it has nothing to do with your Israel.
Finally, are you even aware most of the tales in the bible about Israel are incorrect? I believe the Bible is your source for all of these. For an in-depth understanding of Jewish history, study Persian history. Israel vanished in 721 and never existed again. It was Juda that survived untill it was destroyed in 586. The babylonian exile lasted only two generations. In these exile the jews were able to preserve its ethnical identity by introducing a radical, segregating religion, that made them different from the other ethnics.

While Israel existed before vanishing in 721, Ife was in existence as far back as 350BCE. In other words, Ife and Israel existed side by side independently of each other without any form of contact.

Again, dump your theory. Ife is as old as Israel, none migrated to found the other and none transferred culture to the other.

The problem is everyone thinks they can write history but lack the rigorous training to needed to decipher what is what when it comes to structuring proper history.

Do not bother stretching your theory with me sir. First, ditch the biblical accounts and read Persian records of Israel then we can take it from there.

Rendition of words is not history, it is childish. It is not scholarly, it is something anybody can pull off.

I have seen the real blood of Yoruba in YOU. I wouldn't want to go further on it with you because of conflict of interest but to let you know certain thing which sharpens human development is practically evident in Yoruba history which is interrelationship with some other groups. There is not part of human history that is outrightly independent without influence from one group or the other. Though you have made your point as this case stand but you didn't see things I see differently according to the Rendition/Eulogy which you did disagreed with though it is far from the fact/documents before me. And rendition truly doesn't have scientific proof but is a link to the past even if it has its flaws. I have read about Persians, Elamites,Thebes-Egypt, kittites Assyrians and Babylonians account kingdoms/Empires. And even small settlement that their languages have even gone into extinction. I'm not attached to Israel but account of 627BC of destruction of Jerusalem and Israel changed the surface of migration in the Middle East towards African. And from 1000AD during heavy movement of Islam through 18th century account testified to emigration of people from one location to another. I sum up my writing most time because there is a book in the offing about Yoruba Ethnicity

Here are two Yoruba offshoot who claimed JUDAISM WAS PART OF THEIR TRADITION
RABBI MATTHEW ARTHUR WENTFORTH
RABBI ARNOLD JOSIAH FORD

WHY DO THESE MEN CLAIMED JUDAISM ?
FOOD FOR THOUGHT


HOW ARE YOU DOING MY BLOOD BRO?

O0ni:
Bro, I just posted the actual history backed up by excavated materials some in the hands of British.

What you have up there is fable, nothing more.

And he did not come with Ade Are.

Ade Are belonged to Osangangan Obamakin, Obalufon & Obatala.

This is why every new Ooni gets the are crown around Obatala's temple, in the presence of Obalufon.

Do not let me say too much sir just dispel that thought you hold.

The Egyptian & Mecca connections have been thrashed severally and severely on nairaland many years back already.

I wasn't referring to Odua as owning the Crown of Obatala but the to the concept of them having that crown itself was what I was trying to emphasis on and Adimuela and his armor dressing with head which is not at time. related to west Africa. Secondly, I am widely read and I have seen a lot of books written by Yoruba scholars as well as international scholars of repute too that have tried so deep to analyze Yoruba tradition from the way it was in the beginning. Take for instance, the Antelope, Elephant within the burial area of one group and appreciation and usage of plants/ flowers and the other group of Odua had Ram and elephants on their burial sites. The record of worship of skull? where do they get it from? The forty six(46) kings before Odua, and their presence not in Africa, how can you explain this?, El-A as Yoruba word of God VS Eli(God of Israel) Ba/Abba/Baalè/Baalé VS Ba'al(Isreal) meaning father and Owner. Can you explain it? Olorun VS Elyion (Creator and owner of heaven ).can you explain all these resemblance? Part of Oyo account mentioned Medina, even Ooni mentioned it recently that Odua is a word used in Middle East for Audra. And Semitic people developed around Canaan which is Israel land. It is not about Yoruba tradition in Israel but the other way round. Do you know Ancient had a word like Ashé meaning the same thing? Don't close your mind to this but study it carefully. Yoruba language isn't one of the oldest, how come we claim the beginning of mankind? How come they lived around water? how come they lived within mountainous environment? How come they lived in deep forested environs?How come they knew Guerrilla warfare? Israel had it all. Every time Israelite fought war openly ,they lost nearly all. Check their history account. I know we aren't Arabs but dreadlocks was partly our tradition. Israel were known of dread locked hairs? Give me the answers to these with your defence against these things mentioned. Cheers.


Note: Those whom you referred to didn't study these things I mentioned. I have more

9jakool:
You know another dreaded Yoruba kingdom was Owo (Ogho), literally founded on the border with Bini. Even with the close proximity, they were never conquered. They produced realistic sculptures similarly to that of Ife too. Bini imported some of their artworks and employed their craftsmen in their court because they valued their ivory carving skills. They even have the largest palace in all of Africa in the middle of the city.

I have actually been to Eko Onde a number of times. It's a nice town by a large lake. Many of the people there are skilled fishermen. My hometown is situated next to the town. I'm Ibolo-Yoruba from Osun. We were once part of the Oyo empire.

MO ki é o Omo olalomi OluAkin Olofagangan....

9jakool:
You know another dreaded Yoruba kingdom was Owo (Ogho), literally founded on the border with Bini. Even with the close proximity, they were never conquered. They produced realistic sculptures similarly to that of Ife too. Bini imported some of their artworks and employed their craftsmen in their court because they valued their ivory carving skills. They even have the largest palace in all of Africa in the middle of the city.

I have actually been to Eko Onde a number of times. It's a nice town by a large lake. Many of the people there are skilled fishermen. My hometown is situated next to the town. I'm Ibolo-Yoruba from Osun. We were once part of the Oyo empire.

MO ki é O Omo Olalomi OluAkin olofagangan....,That's a nice one though for Visiting places as such bring back memories and historical account of these great men and their supportive women who had fought and stood affirm when need arises to wade away enemies. God bless Yoruba kingdoms....

O0ni:
Bro, I just posted the actual history backed up by excavated materials some in the hands of British.

What you have up there is fable, nothing more.

And he did not come with Ade Are.

Ade Are belonged to Osangangan Obamakin, Obalufon & Obatala.

This is why every new Ooni gets the are crown around Obatala's temple, in the presence of Obalufon.

Do not let me say too much sir just dispel that thought you hold.

The Egyptian & Mecca connections have been thrashed severally and severely on nairaland many years back already.

Good morning to you my dear bro, I can't find the post you referred me. I would like you do me a favour by quoting me on it. Yes, of course, I don't expect your usage of coded term .But general terms

buchibrand:
Yes you said the right thing, but i know that only time will tell what becomes of such people. We know them, we see them but a time will come when it will boomerang on them. You just continue to turn ON those little-little light here and there, soon it will altogether become a very mighty light that will chase all the darkness away from our political sphere.

Of course yes, each candle light in thousands bring forth up brightness. And I hope the right thinking will do the needful but I fear for this Country called Nigeria. If only the foundation can be restructured, then greatness await her. Imagine, repetition of nearly everything on paper, Nigeria's archive and government policies but nothing to show for it concrete development. It is such a pity case.

9jakool:
On point! It's good to question the validity of some these historical claims. I'm not even sure about the validity of the origin of "Eko". There is a town in Osun State in the heart of Yorubaland called Eko-Ende. I often wonder how much influence The Benin had on Lagos. The so called subjects didn't even adopt their language. And how do you skip Ijebu and go conquer Isale Eko? The Ijebu people are literally on the buffer between Ondo people and Lagos and they swore that they were never conquered by the Benin, partly due to their massive Sungbo Eredo fortress.

In regards to the Oyo empire, they had one of the greatest influence in West Africa spanning four countries (Nigeria, Benin, Togo, Ghana). Many Fon, Ewe, and Many Gbe claim that their origin traces back to the Oyo. Even the Ga who are native to Accra share this claim.
And don't take my words for it , check this out from a Ghanaian. https://www.nairaland.com/950471/ewe-people-ghana-same-yoruba . This is what I like to call true influence.

Also, Who cares where the origin of the name "Yoruba" came from. We've made it ours and we've reclaimed it. I think it's remarkable that different people with varying customs and dialects can unify under a common banner. That's what I call human progress. A person from Atakpame in Togo can identify with a person from Ifon in the easternmost region even though they are two countries apart. Our lineage, culture, and most importantly history is what bound us together. Our identity transcend beyond artificial political boundaries. Yoruba blood is thicker than water. When many slaves in the Americas were being stripped of their identity, Yoruba culture prevailed. The culture is well and alive in Brazil, Cuba, Trinidad and Tobago and many others. They practiced ifa, the religion, songs, and traditions. They even eat our beloved akara in Brazil, they called it acaraje from the words "akara" and "je." Even people with the littlest amount of Yoruba blood still embrace the culture. Our kinship and lineage span three continents. That's influence like no other.

I have heard about Eko Tedo in Osun State. But I haven't been there. Historical places are worth visiting. Conquer Ijebu ke?, One of the most dreaded Yoruba enclave, just like ILE IFE on the primacy of Yoruba traditions. Let Children of Edo who have no respect for Yoruba tradition because civilisation has taken over everything and exposed them to lies through the combination of British Colonialist, else, they would have tasted a bitter pill of punishment. They know Lagos isn't a child's play. KING Kosoko was so bitter and iron fisted When he ruled briefly. He was hated because he was a brutal man that he was throwing his maternal family lineage of his father's whom are Edo/Bini extraction loyal to Bini kingdom into lagoon.
Of course yes, I have seen many Yoruba extractions who are of diaspora in South and North America clinging so badly to Yoruba tradition. Yoruba tradition has a follower of more than 10,000,000 despite the fact that many of us are either Christians or Muslims. It is quite interesting to see the doggedness of that tradition. There is a strong reason Yoruba religion survived in those countries. You find these people so changed in Complexion due to their intermarriages with Caucasians/white yet they hold to their Tradition as Fish hold on to water( EJA LO NI BU) . YORUBA BLOOD ALWAYS SYNC....

O0ni:
The emboldened had me like:

https://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/shivers.gif

That there was the reason I asked if you were a christian to which you answered yes.

Oduduwa's original source had been a thing of secret since time immemorial and as a result, the traditionalist who are not ife orogin, the christians and muslims have tried to fill the void by concocting different types of theories.

The chain from the sky theory, the Mecca theory and the Egypt theory. You applied the latter in your post which to me is unfounded and a wild guess.

Ife had 13 communities, some were in the valley while some were up the hill; there were 2 groups of Ife.

Oduduwa and his clan were part of those settled on the hill known as Oke Ora.

They up the hill had limited access to water and fertile lands for farming that they had to come down the hill to get these needs; it led to life long generational conflict between hil dwellers and the valley settlers.

The clash only came to a head during Oduduwa's time.

Where Oduduwa's and his generation lived before him is some sort of holy site and its location is obfuscated to prevent people from going there. With the tourism oriented background of the present Ooni he may decide to open it up but I doubt it much because it is the place where every Ooni's coronation starts from. Every Ooni elect goes up the hill, wears certain stuff from that place, comes down the hill into Ife then heads first to Obatala's house.

The only persons who have gone there who were not part of the Idio clan (Oduduwa's clan) were Prof Eluyemi Omotoso and his European colleagues who went up there for excavations (of course they had to be initiated into stuff prior). During the excavation, they discovered different artifacts dating further cementing the 350BCE dating other excavations in other places in Ife gave. And the excavated materials also proved that the place was well inhabited and there was a working village system there.

So, it is painful to many of us who know where Oduduwa came from but we are bound to keep quiet in the face of infuriating jargons like the Bini history of Oduduwa.

What brought Oduduwa & his people down the hill was the need to have share of fertile grounds. This forever reshaped Ife settlement & politics.

He managed to command the respect and support of other Ife kings who were under Obatala. He built his place in Ife (now the palace) not too far from Obatala's palace. Then there were two palaces and the same group who would go to greet Oduduwa would go to greet Obatala and vice versa until Obameri decided to crush Obatala's kingship and subjugate him under Oduduwa. He sacked Obatala's palace (now a temple) and made sure he exiled Obatala who was later appeased to return to Ife.

Obatala became the spiritual head in Ife and Oduduwa became the political/military head. Ife was practically restructured.

The Idio Family in Ife is a conglomerate of those who lived up the hill but came down with Oduduwa and they are settled in Ife somewhere close to the palace.

The Ideta family (mine) are Obatala's offsprings, they have massive lands in Ife - Itapa & Mokuro.

This civil war led to Ugbo's migration to present day Ondo state.

The war also led to Ugbo's attacks on Ife that brought Moremi into the limelight.

-----------

I purposely left some sacred terms, places & names out.

The three theories I have applied. The real oral history was that he came down via chain...while he wore Armor on his body and The Aare crown..In those ancient times, Armour can only be known and used or worn by warriors or kings. Then the mention of Mecca wasn't the original but Modina which is a place situated in ancient Middle East/Canaan/Israel called MODI'IN. Furthermore, in Arab world ,they do what is called genealogical recording as well in a written form which is equivalent to oriki but ours is mentally memorise which Arabic called Tariq. There has been study of language comparison with Arab-Egypt-Israel. Yoruba tradition is different from other Africans... In one odu- IFA, Yoruba Eledumare was identified as having gray hair, ageless and even said he(almighty can't die). That's exceptional. It is only in the Bible I see such thing. If you check my post on EL,-A you will understand. Yet, Yoruba people care less about all these things. But research by western world kept going on the tradition of Yoruba. Even if they are initiated,they will still write about it until death do them apart.





I am yet to get to the striking point but soon

O0ni:
Yes sir.

God bless you sir

O0ni:
Olu317

Wait, Owa Luusi is the same as Owalusin that emigrated from Ife, correct?

If that is correct then pardon my ignorance, yes I know of Owalusin (Owa Luusi).

I think the Modakeke war during Ekiti parapo was during Ajamaiye's time?

Ojaja I, present Ooni's grandfather was the Ooni at this time. Sadly, it was the Ibadan who imposed him on us and well, he didn't sell his loyalty because of that, he didn't hesitate to let the Modakeke know who the boss was.

So your grand father was Ajamaiye?

You must be a Prince then.

Do you ever attend the Owalusin festival in your home town? I guess not, you are a Christian

Bro, ypu better come back and hug the system that sustained our fore fathers and leave the christianity that has done us more damage than good.

In addition, I think the founder of your town was part of Giesi house. The present Ooni's house; I'm related to the house by blood but a bit distant.

My father, Prince Ajamaiye married many wives and his first wife was my grandfather's mother. That's should tells you more. I am my father's first born.....

O0ni:
I already unravelled it!

If I said too much about your ancestry in my post, I can take it down.

please please don't go further.... Please I plead again with humility

O0ni:
Nice.

Kaare, omo Owa luusi. I greet you very much my brother.

Wow!

Since your second hometown (ife is your first home town) is in the eastern parts of Yoruba land then you must have records of Bini activities there then.

I I salute you with humility my brother. But kindly don't mention the place of our second abode. My home town is forever in my heart and his descendants hearts. Edo came in the ancient and they were killed. Even the Nupes were not spared...The Edo on this platform just run their mouth because they have access to internet and by so doing want to manipulate history. But leave them to their woes and sorrow

O0ni:
Olu317

Wait, Owa Luusi is the same as Owalusin that emigrated from Ife, correct?

If that is correct then pardon my ignorance, yes I know of Owalusin (Owa Luusi).

I think the Modakeke war during Ekiti parapo was during Ajamaiye's time?

Ojaja I, present Ooni's grandfather was the Ooni at this time. Sadly, it was the Ibadan who imposed him on us and well, he didn't sell his loyalty because of that, he didn't hesitate to let the Modakeke know who the boss was.

So your grand father was Ajamaiye?

You must be a Prince then.

Do you ever attend the Owalusin festival in your home town? I guess not, you are a Christian

Bro, ypu better come back and hug the system that sustained our fore fathers and leave the christianity that has done us more damage than good.

That is my father.....

O0ni:
I will call my folks to find out more. I am sure he has an interesting history.

The emboldened, I heard that a lot.

I witnessed one of the wars. While vacationing in Ife with granny, war broke out and we were trapped. Parents freaked out as usual but we were sent back to Lagos after a few weeks.

Oh k. You know “Aja"is part of their names...... The name used in reference to former King of ILE IFE was part of his name as well. Let me stop bro. The bad belle peps are out there.... I wanted to send twenty points research on Yoruba finding on it semitic Connection but will do it another time...

O0ni:
I will call my folks to find out more. I am sure he has an interesting history.

The emboldened, I heard that a lot.

I witnessed one of the wars. While vacationing in Ife with granny, war broke out and we were trapped. Parents freaked out as usual but we were sent back to Lagos after a few weeks.

Oh k. You know “Aja"is part of their names...... The name used in reference to former King of ILE IFE was part of his name as well. Let me stop bro. The bad belle peps are out there.... I wanted to send twenty points research on Yoruba finding but will do it another time...

O0ni:
Ok bro.

I thought you were from Idio house.

Modakeke attacked us during Ekiti Parapo war using their bond with Ibadan as a charge.

I know about the story (Aroba) . My great grand father fought against that which was why he went back to fight prince Ajaimaye. from Oriki Ooni, present one, his name is there Owa Luusi That will be easy for you to locate if you go to ILE IFE once in awhile. And his great great grand son was Ajamaiye. His profile will always be there forever.
I. wouldn't want to mention another name of his because some people might want to be searching for my identity even if I am not popular

O0ni:
Ok bro.

I thought you were from Idio house.

Modakeke attacked us during Ekiti Parapo war using their bond with Ibadan as a charge.

I know about the story (Aroba ni baba itan) . My great grand father fought against that which was why he went back to fight prince Ajaimaye. He was one the pioneer of egg usage to strike. Then from the Oriki of the present Ooni,his name is there Owa Luusi . You can use that to identify him. That will be easy for you to locate his place if you go to ILE IFE once in awhile. And his great great grand son was Ajamaiye. His profile will always be there forever.
I wouldn't want to mention another name of his because some people might want to be searching for my identity even if I am not popular . Pardon me for now. I dish out that name because of your familiarity with ILE IFE and your lineage

BornStunner1:









Hahahahahahaha

Now it is obvious for everyone to see how DISORGANISED AND FAKE YOUR PEOPLE ARE

Eyah ibadan printing press nor dey again sorry you hear nor cry hahahaha

what do you know? wallow in shame and swallow the truth.....

BornStunner1:









Hahahahahahaha

Now it is obvious for everyone to see how DISORGANISED AND FAKE YOUR PEOPLE ARE

Eyah ibadan printing press nor dey again sorry you hear nor cry hahahaha

what do you know? wallow in shame and swallow the truth.....

O0ni:
Are you from Ife?

What is the name of your family compound or streer your compound is or at least your surname?

On sojourn but I am the Great great great etc son Owa luusi.....Omo omo Omo Ajamaiye(kiriji war) when Ile ife was attacked/ Ekiti Parapo, He went back home to fight... His record is there

O0ni:
The emboldened had me like:

https://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/shivers.gif

That there was the reason I asked if you were a christian to which you answered yes.

Oduduwa's original source had been a thing of secret since time immemorial and as a result, the traditionalist who are not ife orogin, the christians and muslims have tried to fill the void by concocting different types of theories.

The chain from the sky theory, the Mecca theory and the Egypt theory. You applied the latter in your post which to me is unfounded and a wild guess.

Ife had 13 communities, some were in the valley while some were up the hill; there were 2 groups of Ife.

Oduduwa and his clan were part of those settled on the hill known as Oke Ora.

They up the hill had limited access to water and fertile lands for farming that they had to come down the hill to get these needs; it led to life long generational conflict between hil dwellers and the valley settlers.

The clash only came to a head during Oduduwa's time.

Where Oduduwa's and his generation lived before him is some sort of holy site and its location is obfuscated to prevent people from going there. With the tourism oriented background of the present Ooni he may decide to open it up but I doubt it much because it is the place where every Ooni's coronation starts from. Every Ooni elect goes up the hill, wears certain stuff from that place, comes down the hill into Ife then heads first to Obatala's house.

The only persons who have gone there who were not part of the Idio clan (Oduduwa's clan) were Prof Eluyemi Omotoso and his European colleagues who went up there for excavations (of course they had to be initiated into stuff prior). During the excavation, they discovered different artifacts dating further cementing the 350BCE dating other excavations in other places in Ife gave. And the excavated materials also proved that the place was well inhabited and there was a working village system there.

So, it is painful to many of us who know where Oduduwa came from but we are bound to keep quiet in the face of infuriating jargons like the Bini history of Oduduwa.

What brought Oduduwa & his people down the hill was the need to have share of fertile grounds. This forever reshaped Ife settlement & politics.

He managed to command the respect and support of other Ife kings who were under Obatala. He built his place in Ife (now the palace) not too far from Obatala's palace. Then there were two palaces and the same group who would go to greet Oduduwa would go to greet Obatala and vice versa until Obameri decided to crush Obatala's kingship and subjugate him under Oduduwa. He sacked Obatala's palace (now a temple) and made sure he exiled Obatala who was later appeased to return to Ife.

Obatala became the spiritual head in Ife and Oduduwa became the political/military head. Ife was practically restructured.

The Idio Family in Ife is a conglomerate of those who lived up the hill but came down with Oduduwa and they are settled in Ife somewhere close to the palace.

The Ideta family (mine) are Obatala's offsprings, they have massive lands in Ife - Itapa & Mokuro.

This civil war led to Ugbo's migration to present day Ondo state.

The war also led to Ugbo's attacks on Ife that brought Moremi into the limelight.

-----------

I purposely left some sacred terms, places & names out.

I am odua's lineage.

O0ni:
I beg you in the name of Osanobua & Ogiso, please list the area Bini empire covered.

According to: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benin_Empire



Note that the page was clearly written and edited by Bini people.

Ondo - Akoko areas.

Ibo land - Onitsha area.

Lagos - Obalende & Island.

Are these all that mae up the 'great enpire'? Like seriously?

Please be civil.

Who in the western world know Bini's nitwit pseudo empire? The only thing they were appreciated for was their small neat road network and also because of their great Artwork which were derived from ILE IFE Artwork. Nothing else. Please don't mind those blatant liars...

THE FIRST COLOUR RABBI WHO KNEW ABOUT JUDAISM ACCORDING TO HIS TRADITION

RABBI ARNOLD JOSIAH FORD

AreaFada2:
Yes Benin did in most. Of course since 1897, several revisionists started gradually. But still in 1979 during coronation of Oba Erediauwa, I remember how many rulers from far and wide came to pay homage and proudly highlighted their traditional vassalage and alliance to Benin. Most of those rulers are gone and Nigeria has ethnically polarised far more since then. Power game & sharing national cake now supersedes everything.

Most of the first Ordjes, Ovies and Obas in many of these parts were Benin princes. Even Brass in Bayelsa. Some still quietly come to be confirmed by Oba of Benin. And when sucession disputes break out, many run to Oba's palace to arbitrate mostly on the ground that they are ancient Benin princes.

I will remind you that for that reason, Oba of Benin once chose a prince of Brass as the Iyase (traditional Prime Minister) of Benin. His family is the well-known Otokiti family in Benin today. As well as two from Eastern Yorubaland. Okoro-Otun being the best known Ado-Akure (Edo n'Ekue) Iyase who served three Obas of Benin. All these within the past 250 years.

The current Iyase is of Urhobo heritage. Iyase is the second position after the Oba. It is non-hereditary and all Edoid people and Benin diaspora people from Imperial times are technically eligible. So a large pool of current Yoruba (isaleko, Idanre, Okitipupa, Owo, much of Ekiti, parts of Ijebuland), Itsekheri nobility/royaltyl (of whom most are Benin descendants), Urhobo/Isoko, Degema (in Rivers State) and many others can be chosen.

Let me remind you that Iginuwa was the son of Oba Olua of Benin. He was sent to Ewere area along the coast to become the Ogiame (Lord/ruler of the seas). With a full reinue of courtiers similar to Oba's own. Hence Ogiame is the Olu's first title. The late Ogiame Atuwatse wanted to annul the Ogiame title years back. His family simply asked him to abdicate until Gov. Uduaghan & Itsekhiri nobility waded in. The Olu quickly ditched the idea. Go & read it.

You guys know very little about the imperial past of Benin. It is woven into the fabric of Benin life. In its diversity. Even in the morning greetings.

Much of what I know about history I learnt from people born around 1870/1875. Some were even nearly 20 years old in 1897 when Britain attacked Benin. They were well over 100 in the 1980s. All consistently telling us same story. I did not need modern historians to know as a child. Not much different from written version. I did not begin learning history just to argue online. There was no internet or mobile phone when I began.

As for killing Benin soldiers, remember that propaganda is the first tool of war. When Americans were about taking Baghdad, that funny Iraqi minister said life on TV that American soldiers were committing suicide outside Baghdad.

You can chose the propaganda version that panders to your primordial tribalistic instincts.

In any case, why go to war if you are not prepared to die. Benin were never cowards.

shooooooooooooooooooT uuuup and keeeep quieeet . You are a generic Liar

MtuMsuper:
All of ancient Axum and all the Muslim kingdoms of NE Africa (with the exception of the Somali and Afar ones are all in modern day Ethiopia. So, yes.
Unlike you lot, Ethiopians value their "ethiopianess" more than their religions, you would be hard pressed to find widespread religious xtian Muslim violence which seems to be the standard fare in Nigeria. You sir, have ALOT to learn.

when did Christianity and the later advent of Islam in the course of Africa history in comparison to the present day Ethiopia begun ? They are explicitly far apart...History don't lie. Ethiopians are Hamitic Race... And I don't want to go deep but the Coptic Christians didn't have the complete Bible. Even Europeans didn't have it easy having the complete Bible apart from the translation from Hebrew-Greek-Latin in Vatican -then English language. German scholar spent over a century to get the Bible written to near perfect translation...Kudos To late Bishop Rev. Samuel Ajayi Crowther and his team.

buchibrand:
But we just cant seat back, fold our arms and expect a true change either. We cant leave politics to be played alone by those who have successfully turn it to being a dirty game. Clean people must be encouraged to go into politics, there is nothing wrong with politics itself, the problem is with the actors/players.

The politicians buys ammunition and guns for able mean men willing to defend their interest from any opposition. I have seen all of these play out and play out well. Killing for political reasons if opponents seems to be the loved by the society at large.

buchibrand:
But we just cant seat back, fold our arms and expect a true change either. We cant leave politics to be played alone by those who have successfully turn it to being a dirty game. Clean people must be encouraged to go into politics, there is nothing wrong with politics itself, the problem is with the actors/players.

Yes, you've well said but it is a difficult terrain to thread. I know a lot about Nigeria's politics and it is dirty. However, voting is a must for every single able Nigerians who is eligible to vote. But the North never keep amazing me with their subjugation still on the 21st century. They are indeed a problem.

O0ni:
You are a christian?

Yes I am. Why do you ask?

AreaFada2:
To begin, what is an empire & who is an emperor? In layman's terms?

Put simply an empire is a Kingdom that has vassal kingdoms/chiefdoms, whereby the emperor is the King over other Kings.
From 1440 Benin became an empire. Until 1897.

That Benin had many vassals is not disputable. The records are there. I do not know the problem you South-Westerners have with that.

Very soon somebody will be telling us that Modakeke or Ikorodu was a powerful Yoruba Kingdom. Una nor dey tire for propaganda?

Benin had many vassals in Eastern Yourbaland. Deal with it. Reality sucks sometimes. Even Lagos & Beyond. At a time when there were no cars, planes and marching on foot & using boats, and very occasionally horses (that died easily in tse-tse fly prone rain forest) the areas from Delta to Lagos & beyond that Benin Empire spanned and the various tribes & kings that were under Oba of Benin more than qualify to be an empire.

That you lot needed Hausa to tell you your history and even give you Yoruba name & kowtow to them till today is well-known. Please do not bring the writings of those Jahadists to attempt to prove any history on me. I poo on it 24/7. Because already we sent Jahadists packing from attempt to invade Edo North. We had no Afonja to betray us there. Something the "oh so mighty Oyo" cannot boast of.

So Because England was always called the Kingdom of England automatically means that they had no empire. Failed education alert again.
There is no pain on my part. Just amusement plus letting you guys know that a tribalistic & envious revisionist history remains a lie, no matter how many of you spew it or how many bogus academics you quote.

The records of contemporaries are there. I need no jihadists to tell me that.

it isn't true. Bini was NEVER A EMPIRE. THE PEOPLE OF WHITE BACKGROUND WHO WERE MERE EXPLORER THAT WROTE THAT DIDN'T KNOW PEOPLE OF FORESTED REGION. did Bini ever at anytime control MAHIN? IKALE? AKURE? IDANRE? OKE IGBO? ITSEKIRI?(yourbas) etc then others like URHOBO? IZON? all these claims were PAPER WORK and not in reality. Do you know a kingdom called OKA AKOKO? That's is the largest Yoruba settlement in Akoko. They killed Bini warriors like pigs.... Go and check your facts correctly.

MtuMsuper:
What a load of bull!! FYI Ethiopia was the first nation on earth after the Roman Empire to declare Christianity as its official religion. Menelik I, google him and learn more. Yorubaland and Ethiopia have no longstanding historical links, where did you get the fallacious claim about them revealing the falashas! And then i thought i had seen and heard it all! That's real history for you there and please don't troll this thread any further, Jeezuz!

Go and read about ARNOLD JOSIAH FORD. You will learn.....My problem with many Africans from South Africa, -East Africa is that they no nothing but want to proof A POINTLESS POINT....