₦airaland Forum

Anyway, for the records, I don't bend facts. What I don't accept is marchiavellianism. If Gowon stopped the killings in the north (after the third wave of massacre against Igbos), the conflict could never have reached the civil war stage. There was a lot of restraint by eastern leadership then. The lie is that Ojukwu simply rushed off and declared Biafra after Gowon took over. There were series of events that preceded Biafra. The liars are those who discount those events.

^^^

Enter the great Katsumoto! lol!

biina:
You didnt answer the question of why they were removed?
what about ken Nnamani, how did he become senate president under Obasanjos watch?

Obasanjo couldn't change the zoning formula of the PDP then. He was a beneficiary of that zoning and knew that changing it could undermine his own presidency. That is what those who are kicking against the PDP zoning today don't understand.
So OBASANJO HAD NO CHOICE THEN.

Obasanjo must dislike Igbos so much that he made Soludo CBN governor and iweala minister of finance

Obasanjo is the most selfish Nigerian leader ever. He appointed those people out of his desire to achieve something which could sell his life presidency schemes. He had no choice than to pick the BEST the country had.
He is a narcissistic fellow.

biina:
deputy senate president? typical lies and trying to rewrite history.
So where were Enwerem and Okadigbo from and why were they removed?
Its people like you that hold Nigeria back with your tribalism

The Senate presidency controlled by Igbo in the 1999-2003 dispensation was actually negotiated by the northern controlled government of Adulsalami Abubakar and was the same arrangement that produced Obasanjo. So don't credit that to Obasanjo!
As soon as Obasanjo took over, he started killing people all over the country (including Bola Ige from the same west), and did everything he could to undermine the Chuba Okadigbo's leadership of the Senate. As soon as Obasanjo settled in, he launched a war against Igbo leadership of the Senate and anyone who stood against him was neutralized.
When he "won" (actually stole it ) a re-election in 2003, he continued. When he was severally called out by the Igbo, he played a "God father" on Igbo by ensuring Igbo was completely schemed out in the new government of Yar adua.
You guys must think Igbo people are blind to these things. I'm glad that it was an Igbo Senate president -Ken Nnamani that killed Obasanjo's third (and life term) project. That muderfkcer will meet his waterloo soon.

superboi:
While i hate commenting on all this tribal treads and think that anybody asking for a fair war is c, razy,I think what ignited the killing in the north in 1966 was the song the Igbos were singing after the 1st coup(something about a slaugthered cow/ram crying meei-meei,(refering to the hausa)sang in igbo)in the north,i bet if the suituation was reversed and the hausas did the 1st coup and sang similar songs in Aba or Onitsha and they were 100,000 hausa men there the same thing(pogrom,massacre,genocide or watever u call it)would have taken place in the east knowing the way the world was in 1966.

The Igbo believed in Nigeria in 1966 and so could never have embarked on a genocide against northerners living in the east at that time. Even Ojukwu opened up a free passage to all northern army personnel living in the east and allowed them to return to the north with their arms, something Gowon never allowed easterners to do. Gowon disarmed all eastern officers returning to the east.

If you are talking of today (when our eyes have opened to Nigeria's genocidal tendencies) you might have a point. 
There has never been a time in Nigeria's history that Igbos embarked on a killing spree on foreigners living in Igboland, except currently when we have learned to retaliate in kind -genocide for genocide- not genocide for coup.

metal-gong:
IBB will surely win the presidential elections in 2011 if he decides to contest. Infact, he is the best amomgst all the names that are flying around as potential presidential candidtates in 2011.

You and I appear to be seeing the same things some of these guys cannot see. I think some of these people are forgetting WHAT Nigeria is. Also they are forgetting we have a history, socio-political culture and structure. Even Jonathan appears to be holding the forte for Yar adua. He doesn't appear to be "taking over". Until he takes over, I remain skeptical of his ability to contest or win next year's election. Like someone pointed out, he is an "acting president" for a reason. This is Nigeria.

@ Azuka.O

You sound new to nairaland. Believe me we've been through this same issue multiple times here and the same folks from the west always justified the killing of innocent Igbo children both in the pogrom and the civil war itself.

Because they lack real rationale for their support of the evil acts, they always sound like a broken record (by implication): Igbos killed northerners and others first (at my count, about 12 politicians), therefore one dead corrupt politician from the north and west is equal to 5000 dead Igbo civilians and children, leading to 50,000 dead Igbo.
In their warped mindset, Igbo had to be dealt with enough for them not to retaliate! Do these people understand anything about human mind at all? 

To be honest, I think the Hausa is more understanding and sophisticated than the Yoruba on this issue. They know that there can never be peace in Nigeria until the Igbo is assuaged. Guess who tried most to marginalize the Igbo in the political leadership and standing in Nigeria? It wasn't a northerner. It was Obasanjo! Under him, Ndigbo could only be the deputy senate president. I believe the Yoruba is the main enemy politically speaking in Nigeria. So don't be shocked by views from people like Biina and his kid brother called bk/babe97 whose Igbo father fled after impregnating his mother, so now he lives to hate Igbo people.

Nigeria is such a funny country! Mind you, same people are today calling for "revolution", "restructuring", "true federalism", "national conference" and all other similar terms .
I cannot laugh again.

Azuka.O:
@ Biina, I guess you are from the North.  For the first time in Nigerian history, I ve seen a Northerner that agreed that there was a 'pogrom' in the North against Igbo people in 1966/67. Unfortunately, rather than condemn the killing of about 50,000 civilians in cold blood as mindless and wicked, you are trying to justify it. I hope such fate does not befall you and your family in future so you will understand the pain and horror of it.

No, he is from the west.

biina:
I think the first main seed of distrust between the North and Igbos was sowed when Azikwe tried to impeach the Sardauna/Balewa led NPC in 1964. Coupled with subsequent allegations (by Ejoor and Gowon) of Banjo and Ojukwu planning a coup, the January 1966 coup, and the subsequent events of an Igbo senate president handing over power to an Igbo military officers, all seem to confirm the suspicions of the Hausas that the Igbos were intent on seizing power.

Did it really matter what the Hausas thought? What did the Yorubas think of the whole thing? Were they not the other major tribe in Nigeria? That is the main question. If the Yorubas didn't share the same thoughts, there is nothing the Hausas could have done about the situation. You can't kill 50,000 on mere hunch or suspicion or thought. And if Yorubas were at least neutral, the Hausa could not have fought and won the war alone.

Ironsi's not prosecuting nor punishing the coup plotters simply wiped out any element of doubt that was left in the northerners and they decided to carry out their own justice. They simply wanted revenge and seem they didnt want the possibility of the Igbos retaliating and thus they tried to wipe out as many of the Igbos as possible. The  excuse given by the northerners was that if they didnt act quickly enough, the Igbos would finish the job that they started in January 1966.

Like I said before, WHAT DID THE YORUBAS THINK? WHAT DID THEY DO? [/b]Don't make this look like Hausa only thinggy.

Gowon didnt lead the coup. Murtala ([b]always irritates me to see his face on a currency like if ws a national hero )and danjuma were more prominent actors. The coup plotters wanted to secede and the need to keep Nigeria one was mostly in the interest of outsiders. Gowon's ascension was supposed to be a concession on the part of the core northerners, who felt that Gowon being from the middle belt and a christian provided a middle ground. they were not willing to accept a pure southerner talk less of an Igbo. But there was a  problem right from the start, Ojukwu refused to recognize Gowon as being the head of state and supreme commander in chief on the grounds that Gowon was a junior officer to him.

You almost fooled the gullible with your indignation about Murtala's face on our currency after committing mass murder against same so-called "fellow Nigerians". God has already paid him in kind. As for Ojukwu and his refusal to turn Nigeria upside down by allowing a less qualified officer than himself to take over, where have we been for the past 43 years? Answer: in the gutter! For the very same reason. A cart does not pull a horse. It doesn't work that way. That is why other countries that were peers with Nigeria 40 years ago have all dusted Nigeria. Malaysia and Asian tigers come to mind.

The lack of coherence in government, and likely complicity on the part of the northern soldiers, led to continued killing of the Igbos. The Aburi accord failed to resolve the issues, as Gowon reneged on the agreement (claiming he had implemented everything in the 'spirit of the agreement' and accused Ojukwu of using the media to further his ulterior motives). Gowon created the 12 states, said to be a bid to undermine Ojukwu, and Ojukwu subsequently declared biafra. Gowon initiated a police action into biafra annd Ojukwu responded in kind, and the civil war began.

The ONLY TRUTH in your whole piece! Gowon created 12 states to undermine Biafra and the East. Food for thought. At the end, state creation brought unprecedented division in Nigeria and destroyed the nation. Today, a Yorubaman from Ogun state will struggle to get a job in Ondo state.

My issues with Ojukwu stem primarily from my evaluation of him being intelligent and not one to make too many mistakes
1. Ojukwu should have known the consequence of refusing to recognize Gowon and not resigning from the Army
2. During the first round of pogrom, the Igbos ran back to the east, but Ojukwu sent them back to the north guaranteeing their safety. There was no basis for the guarantee. If he hadnt sent them back, the second round of pogrom would have likely been avoided
3. After the second round of pogrom, the Igbos that had returned were more or less safe in the south east. Declaring Biafra was more in response to the creation of the 12 states than the pogrom.
4. He must have known that the declaration of an independent state within a sovereign nation was an implicit declaration of war, and that Biafra was in no position to win the war. The amount of ground they lost in the first few weeks was testament to this. Ojukwu knew where the war was headed.

How can it be an implicit declaration of war when the north was the first to threaten secession a year earlier, but only turned after it completely seized power? Who declared war on the north for threatening secession? If the north seceded, would there have been war? So, how could Biafran secession imply war? Your twists and turns are typical! Na wa o!

5. Even when the war had gone south, he was inviting journalists and trying to use the suffering of the people to get political sympathy from the international community
6. At the end, he ran away. He wasnt man enough to die for the cause he had sent so many to an early grave for.

There goes the typical signature of the group of people who handed over Nigeria to mass murder and mediocrity for 43 years! Today they are yapping all over the place for "restructuring". Idiots!

7. His execution of Banjo & co hints to key officers disagreeing with the way things were going.

Some feel that Ojukwu was carrying out the wishes of his people, I suspect he used the opportunity to try and achieve his personal ambition and simply played the other leaders.

Hear it loud and clear: OJUKWU WAS CARRYING OUT THE WISHES OF HIS PEOPLE - THE EASTERNERS!  If you don't like that historical fact, go hang! No amount of twists and turns can change that.

igbo-smoka:
Some google shots

From the google shots, it shows that the city is WELL PLANNED. All it needs now is fixing the roads and the buildings, it'll just transform into a beautiful city. Abia state can do this. Just throw Orji and his team out next year.

Abagworo:
nde awusa abiala ozor.ha ewerekwala asusu ha bia imebi nairaland seun osewa tara ahuhu mepee.Chi okike a ga ekwe[b] kama okpo ha nile oku[/b].

lol!

This is actually the second time I'm reading about something like that. I remember reading from a Nigerian newspaper last year that most of the kidnappers in the east are actually trained militants who broke off from Massob (those who don't share the non-violence agenda of Uwazurike). The modus operandi of these kidnappers and their heavy military equipment and fatigues suggest something along that line.

Nigeria's power sector is a network of political landmines. I would first think that Jonathan has not found a suitable hand yet. I don't think he would like this intractable albatross around his neck. . unless of course he knows something that the rest of us don't. Just hope the latter is the case.

Just seeing this woman's face makes me very sad.
How can a beautiful young woman endanger her unborn child so thoughtlessly? Is Nigeria that bad?

Sometimes I HATE Nigeria just because of Hausa people. Other times I LOVE Nigeria because of them as well. What can I say! Nigeria is quite confusing!
Right now I'm indifferent to Hausa issues so long as they are not planning to kill inyamiri.  

CILondon:
But why does it have to be a civil war? Why can't it be a peaceful referendum where the people get to determine their own destiny without a single drop of blood shed. It worked for Czechoslovakia and the Soviet union. Why does Nigeria have to be so violent about everything?

Because contemporary Nigeria was shaped by the first civil war of 1967-70, and the stench of idiocy from its unresolved aftermath is becoming unbearable. The place is like a zoo and everybody claims the same thing. Why can't we have a proper census, boundaries, sensible electoral districts and other basic sensible things enjoyed by other progressive countries?
Let me be clear -if we cannot even say the truth about the last civil war (the true cause and the roles played by tribes in it), and have not successfully conducted a FULL census of tribes in Nigeria (ie count everyone and identify their tribes), what gives you the impression that Nigerians can resolve the country's issues peacefully?
I'm gradually beginning to feel that peaceful solution to Nigeria's problems may be unrealistic. The law of the jungle -survival of the fittest- might be the only solution. You have folks making idiotic statements all over the place, just because we don't know who is who in Nigeria.
There is simply too much idiocy going on. Nigerians don't even understand concessions and consensus. It's all about undermining the next tribe. Why can't simple sanity prevail in Nigeria? Sickening.

Now that is one ugly chic! Damn!
Don't tell me that is the best chic eko can put on a poster. Chineke ekwena ife ojoo!

^^^
The day oil finishes or Nigeria divides, only then shall we know the truth. That day, everybody go answer im papa name. No need to argue then!  Igbo people in the so called core Igboland sell land too. So your view is too simplistic.

^^^
slowpoke! you can't live or breath without oil.

CILondon:
Here we go with the Oil again.
Can you not think outside of oil just for 2 minutes
Oil - the false god of Nigeria. The fixtaion/obsession is frightening.

lol! that mosquito can never even breath without oil talk less of thinking. For anyone to simple say that Nigeria lags "only" South Africa and Ghana is like saying they are comfortable suffering from "only" Malaria because others have AIDS and Cancer.
How about being completely disease free? Fcking morons. I want my country to be the BEST in Africa and competing with the BEST in the world. Placing 3rd in a third world continent is humiliating.  
Oil is a curse on Nigeria -but then again that is no secret.

I was discussing with a friend yesterday and was lamenting the fact that technology has refused to take off in Nigeria. He put forward a very concise and accurate reason why technology has not, and will never take off in Nigeria:
NIGERIA IS A FRAUD - A BIG ONE AT THAT. He argued that technology thrives on truth. There are no cutting of corners or short cuts.
So, Nigeria will remain a midget technologically speaking, and I guess in terms of general development until truth prevails.
Nigeria has never conducted an honest census. Since ethnicity is the single biggest determinant of political maneuvers in Nigeria, you would think that there should have been a census of the tribes to get the accurate picture of Nigeria's ethnic groups in order to give every tribe its due in terms of representation and clout (since the north will never allow true federalism) but no, it has never happened!
Suddenly every tribe is claiming marginalization and needs more states created for them. I have never been a fan of state creation. For instance, I would prefer one state for the Igbo in Nigeria. Other tribes can have 1000 states for all I care. What I hate is the fraud associated with state creation and the division it brings to Nigeria even within same tribes.
All these are part of the by-products of the last civil war. Sometimes I think only another civil war can resolve all these nonsense and put people in their proper place in Nigeria. The idiocy is getting out of hand!

I've just listened to it, there is NO VIRUS there. How wicked can people be. Useless naija people!
What the man is saying makes sense and he is from south south.

^^^

Thank you for that. I know that is true!

In fact I challenge Nigeria to let only Igboland leave even today, let's see what will happen within 20 years.
Just Igboland only. I challenge Nigeria to let us leave!

^^^

Could very well happen but I don't think it would have stopped Igbos leaving Nigeria. And if we succeeded in leaving Nigeria in 1967, we would today be saying a huge "I told you so" to all who didn't join Biafra. You think the Igbo spirit dies easily? By now Biafra would be like Hong Kong, keeping all the Chinese, Vietmanese, Thais and Loasians (Nigerians) out of our clean and decent cities. It would also be the most industrialized and democratic African country.

So I guess Abiola's trouble was a case of he who sows the wind reaps the whirlwind.

[size=18pt]2010: June 12 won’t hurt IBB – Owie[/size]



FORMER Chief whip of the Senate, Senator Rowland Owie, has said that the annulment of June 12,1993 presidential election win not affect the chances of the former military president, General Ibrahim Babangida, in the 2011 presidential race.

Owie, in an interview in Benin, said millions of Nigerians actually believe that Babangida would unite this nation should he decide to run for the presidency.

Said he: “The annulment of June 12 elections has nothing to do with IBB’s presidency because the matter was beyond IBB. Come to think of it, the first person that annulled election in this country was Chief Olusegun Obasanjo. People may not have known that in 1979, the transition decree had a provision for Electoral College when the presidential election is not finalized. And as the National Assembly was getting ready for the Electoral College between Awolowo and Shehu Shagari, Obasanjo went and removed the clause for the provision of that Electoral College from the decree, within the week that the electoral college was to take place.

“That was the first major annulment of election. People do not remember that. If Obasanjo could become a president for two terms and even tried to go for a third term, what do you talk about a man like IBB who conducted a free and fair election from council election to the presidency, somebody who established two-party system and brought peace to this nation through out his reign”.

Owie added, “The truth is that the so-called annulment of June 12 was Karmic law in operation because the word of God says that people reap what they sow. And there is no way you will plant cassava and go and reap yam. Nigerians should ask themselves why did the Maroko land came on board, two weeks or three weeks to the general election for Awolowo to be rubbished using the Concord . Nigerians must ask why there was a coup in 1983 after the late MKO Abiola lost out at the Kano NPN national convention where he wanted to be national chairman and where Umaru Dikko said the national chairman of the NPN is not for sale.

“People should find out who spearheaded the disqualification of the major contenders in the presidential election then, Yar’Adua, Adamu Ciroma and others. It was the disqualification of these people that enabled Abiola to emerge as the candidate of the SDP. If Yar’Adua was not disqualified, there is no way Abiola would have emerged as the candidate of the SDP. So, if at all the annulment happened, it is not the doing of IBB, it is a Karmic law in action.”

http://www.vanguardngr.com/2010/04/04/2010-june-12-wont-hurt-ibb-owie/

I'm taking note of countries that were carved out of other countries. I see that Eritrea is 36th while Ethiopia is 16th  
Eritrea is a whopping 20 points ahead of Ethiopia.  
So Ethiopia has been setting Eritrea back for many years. Na wa o. I wonder how countries carved out of a balkanized naija would fair.