₦airaland Forum

Richirich713:
People disagree over whether God exists, whether there is an afterlife, whether the universe is a simulation, whether humans evolved, whether reality is an illusion, yet we don’t conclude from this that there is no objective truth about these matters. It may be difficult to know whether God exists. But whether he exists is not simply a matter of opinion. The mere fact that there's disagreement over an issue doesn't mean there's no objective truth regarding that issue. Humans are not infallible, we disagree over tons of things.

If there was absolute morality and god has actually given the absolute laws of morality, then there should be no disagreement about what the laws are. If I asked u what is god's law about slavery, what would be your response?

Richirich713:
As I said we disagree over when killings is justified, but the fact that we disagree doesn't mean there no objective truth.

No, we don't agree when my killings are justified. That's why I used the Norway and Nigeria analogy. In Nigeria it's justifiable to kill a murderer after conviction, in Norway it's not.
And, yes, the fact that we disagree rubbishes the notion of an objective truth. If the disagreement was born out of dishonesty and we actually believed the same thing maybe u could be right... But our honest beliefs are actually different, if there was an objective truth, our beliefs about morality would be the same

DangotePikin:
Same here. I just love the winners family. There is this togetherness that you don't get anywhere else. I also read this in the Winners facebook group.

There's a thin line between actual togetherness and blind loyalty to a charismatic leadership. Most Pentecostal churches in Nigeria revolve around the person of the general overseer.

Richirich713:
U talking about legal definitions, I'm talking in general - murder is the unjustified killing of another human being.

He's asking what are the possible justifications of killing. These justifications vary by place and time. For example, a firing squad killing a convicted murderer is justified in Nigeria. But in Norway, they have scrapped capital punishment because its considered unjustifiable.

jonbellion:
if morality was absolute things that were a sin in the old testament would have remained sins in the new testament

Bless you!! Morality changes over time and place. That's essentially the meaning of subjectivity.

felixomor:
Morality is absolute.
There is nothing like subjective morality.
Thats why u couldnt answer the question of DoctorAlien because if i form a country with like people like me and decide to sacrifice children to gods for the prosperity of the nation, it will never be right.
Likewise, Rape will never be right.

If its not absolute, forget it.
Even criminals have a context for everything they do that is correct inside their mind.

If morality was absolute, there would be no controversy as to right or wrong. Morality goes beyond murder and rape, it includes things like pre-marital sex, drinking of alcohol, wearing of mini skirts, smoking... The controversy as regards morality far outweighs the consensus about morality.

WRAKE:
I have no imaginary friend

What are you talking about?

Is god not your friend?

Kaycee7:
How smart you are? Let's all take a minute to blame all legislatures around the world for the suffering of the unjustly punished. It was definitely not the fault of the person that set them up. KingEbukasBlog ,Felixomor, come and follow me and see what I'm seeing

The legislatures around the world are made up of humans, who are flawed and imperfect. U claim god is perfect yet he still created laws that are so blatantly barbaric and evil, ordinary men have discarded them and created something better for themselves.
Besides, the legislatures around the world are regularly and rightly criticized when they create laws with serious loopholes. If u create a law that's unconscionable and yet could be easily manipulated, then, yes, u should be blamed...

That's the flaw of religion. It presupposes that humans are incapable of being or doing good without the threat or fear created by religion. But that has been shown to be wrong. Christians are more likely to be imprisoned than atheists. They are more likely to be racists, and children raised in religious homes are less compassionate than their counterparts in secular homes....
All these point to the fact that religion has failed to make people better... So without hell or heaven the good people will be good and the bad will be bad

Image123:
Cure your ignorance.

Deu 34:1 And Moses went up from the plains of Moab unto the mountain of Nebo, to the top of Pisgah, that is over against Jericho. And the LORD showed him all the land of Gilead, unto Dan,
Deu 34:2 And all Naphtali, and the land of Ephraim, and Manasseh, and all the land of Judah, unto the utmost sea,
Deu 34:3 And the south, and the plain of the valley of Jericho, the city of palm trees, unto Zoar.
Deu 34:4 And the LORD said unto him, This is the land which I swore unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, saying, I will give it unto thy seed: I have caused thee to see it with thine eyes, but thou shalt not go over thither.

So your god promised an occupied land to someone without making provision for the people already there... If someone entered a land occupied by you and killed everyone on it and took over it... What would you say?? ... But here, your god does the exact same thing and it's suddenly okay... Christians ehn!!

Kaycee7:
If a husband accuses a woman he deflowered and she is executed, this evil is upon the man's conscience and God will make him pay

Oh... So the husband is to blame but the god who created a rule where the husband can easily orchestrate the stoning of a woman has absolutely no fault..
Nice one

Kaycee7:
The laws on sexuality does its best to be fair. Non-virgins had the option to remain single or get married with less dowry. The stoning was a sentence passed on non-virgins who tried to pass themselves off as virgin brides and were discovered. It was akin to fraud. Is fraud right?

Fraud? Really?? Christians make me laugh... It can only be construed as fraud if the husband was deceived that he was marrying a virgin... However what if the virginity was actually lost to the husband before marriage??
Even if we're to assume that it's fraud, so stoning to death is the best punishment for fraud?? Even the uneducated people in Yoruba land before the coming off the white man doesn't stone girls who lost their virginity before marriage, it only reduced the bride price and even that was demeaning to women but stoning them??... Interpret it any way u want and give any excuse that suits your conscience but stoning people is wrong in every way, that Christianity is making u contemplate stoning a human being to death as a right thing is just sad...

Ferruccio:
Can you provide evidence to refute my claim that no stillbirths has occured in church before?

U are the one claiming, u are the one who should prove. Do churches keep record of their unsuccessful deliveries??...

SirWere:



hahn said he has an idea for something like this.....

---

On a sidebar, Jack, if you want quick fame, you can easily just open a blog and say :

21 yr old ATHIEST turns Christian after 29 years professing atheism (if we can have an 80 year old young lady; this should be too hard ) . "God slapped me"; he claims.

Then you can write a book with an apt title like. "From knowing to believing" or "That Rationality of religion".
Of course, these books can be a newer version of the same old flawed arguments put forward by apologists to defend their faith. E no concern you.
Just spice it up with anecdotes. You know how humans love anecdotes!!
Create a Youtube page and come back on NL as a firebrand christian.
Persuade Nairaland atheists to help your ministry....and if they agree; they drop their reason and claim religion saved them.

By that time, you'll be famous and well known.

Your blogs will be getting a million views and your name will be used up an dan in debates.

Drop some juicy quotes too...

"When a man stop reasoning...only then he begins to see the truth for what it is"

"I used to believe in evolution. But one day I asked myself : How is it that my hands are the right length, shape and width; to scratch my balls It was then I realized : Nature cannot give me such a perfect tools to scratch my balls from randomness. Something must have given me a perfect scrotum toucher. Something......or someone

and other quotes like that.
They'll love it!!

If you want to go a step further, you can publish more books like "The Divine slap : 21 ways to make God hit your face with success" and other "inspiriationals".

They'll love it

---

P.S : I hope no one will use this thread to say Atheists need churches because they still believe God. I sincerely hope not

Pure gold!!

I volunteer for the post of church treasurer

Ferruccio:
Lol. If hospital deliveries are safer, why are there 2.8 million stillbirths every year!

And no stillbirths in churches!

Please what statistics are u relying on to show there are no still births in churches?

Ferruccio:
In other words, you have never heard that women gave birth to stillborn babies in Church?

One stillborn baby born in a Church would be better than 2.5 million stillborn babies born in hospital!

This is common sense... What are the things that facilitate quick and safe delivery?? Expertise of the medical personnel, facilities for surgery in case of complications e.t.c. these things are better found in the hospital, therefore hospital deliveries are safer... Again it's common sense

wirinet:
I am shocked beyond belief that I am reading this from a supposedly educated person in the 21st century. Religion really destroys ones humanity, no wonder some people see honour killings as a religious obligation.

A bride is supposed to be pure before her wedding night, but a groom is not. So it is virginity that make women honourable but not men? So what makes men honourable?
The mere fact that a girl lost her virginity is enough to justify capital punishment? So what happens if a girls loses her virginity in other ways other than sex? Women were usually raped as war booty in the event that of the city or town falling to enemies, and that happened a lot in the Bible. So what happens to all the raped girls after the enemies leave, they should be mass stoned?

Most men marry more than 1 wife in the Bible unmarried virgins must be scarce. No wonder men were marrying girls that barely reach puberty.

It is a surprise that Christians are critical of sharia law, but at the same time support the essence of the laws.

This passage of the Bible deals with how to deal with captured men and women as war booties;

So what happens to the virgins thereafter.

Christianity manages to bring the worst in people. U see Christians on this forum justify anything from rape to murder to genocide to slavery all in a bid to claim that their god is good and the bible is infallible. And when boko haram attacks a church and kill people, they complain...

Ferruccio:
How many stillborn babies were born in Church in 2016, Seun?

That's the problem, there are no reliable records because they are in church. But churches are not as safe as hospitals. Ergo, everyone should deliver their babies in hospitals

Ferruccio:
You claim women giving birth in church can lead to complications and death, but your ancestors gave birth in the bush back in 1906, not in hospital. Nor did they go for medical check-ups, and they never had complications. They lived till 100 even.

They never had complication... Do u know the amount of still births there were in the past?? Try to research before u post next time

Kaycee7:
A bride is supposed to be pure until her wedding night. The husband is deprived of a chaste and honorable woman that he believes he's marrying.
Most husbands don't even see the bride naked before the wedding night. So they can't know they they're not virgins until the marriage is consumated. Then it's up to the husband to decide whether to make a report to the elders. Proper investigation will then be carried out to determine if the girl really did lose her virginity before marriage. Upon which she will be sentenced. So if convincing proof is not discovered, the girl will be acquitted.

Meeting your husband as a non-virgin and drug trafficking are both considered heinous crimes by the respective societies that levied the death penalty on them

The husband doesn't have to tell the elders. If the girl is caught having sex, she's stoned to death. No one asks whether there is a man who would like to marry her inspite of that...
And the fact that society considers something wrong doesn't make it wrong.
I told u to show how drug trafficking is equal to losing your virginity

Kaycee7:
All females who lose their virginity before marriage should be stoned to death is a law. A section of the constitution. Females had a choice. Abstain from sex before marriage or suffer the consequences.
Hitler kills thousands of jews is a statement. The jews could not help being jews. They could not have stopped being jew or change to something else.

This is a terrible effort at distinguishing... Are you saying once something is the law, it's right? There was once a law that black people could be owned as property and used as slaves. Was that law right? In some countries there were laws that anyone who goes to church should be killed, is that law right? At least, u can make the choice NOT to go to church.

Kaycee7:
The man who marries the non-virgin.

Wow... I just like how u are churning out ridiculous statements.
So how is the mam a victim? What exactly is he deprived of? And why is that thing worth the gruesome murder of another human being?
Again, is it not the man who agrees to marry a deflowered lady that should be concerned? What if the man doesn't have a problem with his wife's lack of virginity? Why didn't god pronounce lighter punishment like fine?
Now let's compare with the evils of drug trafficking. More than 200,000 people die every year as a result of drug overdose. That's not counting the people who are victims of wars or gunfights between drug cartels. So compare this with losing your virginity and now tell me how they are equally evil.

Wilgrea7:
I'm not a Christian fundamentalist anymore..i apply logic to the things i do... the fundamentalists won't take me as a Christian because i dared question their doctrine and arrived at a conclusion different from theirs.. I'm still a die hard follower of Christ... so I'm still a Christian.. but to the fundamentalists I'm not

Well... I have to commend u although I don't totally agree with u. But at least u have decided to do something about those things that are disturbing about your beliefs...

dalaman:
The way you reason is ridiculous . The first book you ever heard about Mecca is the Koran. But you do not accept the Koran as real do you? The first book you ever heard about Madina is the Koran but to you the Koran is fake.
The Odyssey mentions a lot of the ancient Greek cities and how the people lived their lives. Does that mean that the Greek Gods mentioned in the Oddesy are real?

As in... Some times I just wonder how the guy reaches his own conclusions. Ridiculous is an understatement

Kaycee7:
Ok. Then it's right to stone virgins.

So dealing in drugs and losing your virginity are equally bad, right...
Who is the victim of loss of virginity??

Kaycee7:
That's just bonkers. The contexts don't match. Hitler caused the deaths of hundreds of thousands of jews and the few he kept alive bcoz of their usefulness doesn't negate that.
The Bible hasn't been proven to demean women and the prophetesses and judges are examples of that fact

Seriously??
All females who lose virginity before marriage should be stoned to death= Hitler kills thousands of Jews.
There are prophetesses and female judges in the bible= Hitler kept some Jews alive.
Get it now??

felixomor:
U cant be unsure and use words like "definitely" at the same time.
Stop being a bat.
Stay on one side.

Did Jesus exist?

U and your silly rules that are always against logic. I said it's possible it exists but he was definitely not god... Which one is stay on one side??

felixomor:
Hehehehe.
U have not see anything.
Is it not funny that u guys hate to be asked questions?
Just look at you.

You call jerusalem real but the book u first heard it from is now fake.
U call Egyptians real, but the book u first heard it from is now fake...
U call babylon real, yet the book where u first saw it is now fake.

Continue your selective reasoning.
When u r done, answer my question..

U never see anything.

1. U assume we first heard of Egypt and Jerusalem from the bible. Some people are actually good students of history. Don't use yourself as a benchmark for others
2. That Jerusalem is real makes every other thing in the bible real??.. Is that even logical? That means the Quran is also real. Hell, even the ifa oracle book most be real. I

dalaman:
You keep asking questions, but when they ask you, you start crying like a sheep. Baa Baa baaa, meh meh meh, I can't answer because baaa baaa baaa, meh meh meh.

felixomor:
Please did Jesus exist?

Am not sure... But I think he did and he was an influential and a wise man. But he definitely wasn't god and he didn't float into heaven through the sky.

wirinet:
Kingebuka, How do you justify this Biblical law against women;



In effect, if you buy a male servant, he is to serve 6 year and then allowed to go free. During the time of his slavery, his master can give him a wife, with or without the consent of the woman (probably a fellow slave), but when he leaves, his wife and children remain the property of his master.

Meanwhile, a female slave remain the property of her master forever.

Please tell me how this law protects women.

It's obvious that these laws are not to protect the female folk. They are just what obtained in the past, where most societies were male dominated. And the women were merely seen as extension of their husband or even as properties.
That's why it's unreasonable to say the laws were given or inspired by god. Those people didn't see anything wrong with those laws, but a perfect god should have. The fact that he didn't shows that god didn't in fact give those laws but they were man made.