₦airaland Forum

omonnakoda:
It is not my habit to "KNOW" things without EVIDENCE . I am talking SPECIFICALLY about 27 books . Please redirect your remarks to that and stop spouting vague and obscure generalities .


Finally we reach the point where you realize your argument is feeble and so you have to undermine or impeach me personally . So you say my work is not of God ( therefore it must be of the devil discussion closed) I am only interested facts. There are two kinds of folk ; Those who can be brow beaten to pay tithes ad those who CANNOT . I am of the latter. I asked specific questions and you are talking of angels .What does that have to do with what I asked?
That is like me asking an 18 year old why he failed and he tells me 3 wise men gave Jesus Gold Frankincense and . What is the nexus

That shows you are a student of theory, not faith. Inasmuch you are not following after faith you will continue to argue, but it's a pity my contribution is limited to space and communicating device.

omonnakoda:
You have not told me anything new.You have not answered my question. Paul was a Jew he never stopped bein a Jew. He also received Grace according to his epiphany no one is arguing that.
You say the leadership of the church had to take a decision on collation of the scriptures What is the basis for this ?
Does this mean Leadership of today's churches can promulgate additional scriptures e.g TB Joshua
Why there were ALREADY SCRIPTURES IN EXISTENCE. Jesus himself read from these scriptures and quoted them even to the devil after his forty day fast.He did not find it necessary to mention any NEW SCRIPTURES and even said that he had not come to change the law and that not one iota of it shall change.
What do you mean by "spiritual process" with specific reference to this decision.
More importantly WHO were this LEADERSHIP that took this decision? Do they have NAMES??

Do you know angels at the birth of Jesus and Jesus himself made reference to the New Testament? Do you know New Testament couldn't have come down without the ascension? Do you know Church began after the spiritual empowerment. You may not understand all these because your argument is based on history, not after the work of God.

"spiritual process" Church then - highly spiritual had to follow spiritual direction before making decision.

k

omonnakoda:
I am not interested in the circumstance so you are just diverting attention.

What "scriptures" was Paul referring to ?

My question is did Paul instruct anyone to ELEVATE his EPISTLES to scripture

I have not come across any authority on HOW or WHY Paul's epistles became scripture.

Also why is an epistle of Paul a scripture and Not an epistle of the current Pope or of Chris Oyakhilome

Paul was an Apostle of the early Church and co-worker with the the Disciples of Christ, his contribution could not have been underrated. As the Church expanded the leadership had to take decision on collation of the scriptures, you might not know what transpired around that, once decision made had to follow spiritual process.

omonnakoda:
Okay if they were inspired by God the question is did THEY SAY so ? I am not a Muslim and do not subscribe to the Quran but we have a basis to start our analysis i.e Mohammed CLAIMS that he was given or inspired or whatever the correct verb is.

Now in the case of the New Testament do we have a similar provenance of who was inspired and when. This is not so. We can only guess and so we must ask Who edited/Compiled the New Testament and when(it is not a secret)

It is NOT CLEAR who the authors are of all the 27 books of the New testament are so we cannot even say who it is that was inspired and who he told that he was inspired and when.

For you to say it was inspired at least you must know what the level of inspiration was. Also was there any place where there was an injunction to elevate that inspiration TO THE STATUS OF A CANON or SCRIPTURE>

Yes Paul Wrote letters to his companions just like I am sure Enoch Adeboye writes letters to his Parishes or the Present day Pope does so who took the decision to make Paul's letters scripture and why is it CLOSED. Why can't current Popes add to the New Testament.

Paul never said his letters were SCRIPTURE in fact quite often he would say this "is me speaking". WHO DECIDED that Paul's letters were SCRIPTURE

don't let's us go to circumstances surrounding Paul's conversation, Paul himself stated in one of his epistles that scriptures were written by inspiration. Read

omonnakoda:
I am talking about the 27 books of the NEW TESTAMENT Please answer the VERY SPECIFIC QUESTIONS I asked and stop this diversionary speeches.
Did Jesus ask anyone to write those 27 books, were there any other books written at the time those 27 books were written and WHO CHOSE those 27

If you do not know try and research the matter .Save the speeches.

The answer will lead to asking another question. It will be like who asked writers of old testament to do so. But the right answer is they were inspired by God's Spirit to do so. Christ was fully spiritual in his actions, his disciples couldn't have been told to document his activities. That's reason well educated Paul was specifically chosen and converted for impressive and spiritual activities that had to do with much writing. You know Islam met Christians as people of book. That should mean something to you. The Bible made it known that scriptures were written by inspiration. If you are walking and working with someone, you must know you are duty bound to deliver any time the need arises.

As regards who or why scriptures were selected, that has to do with the decision of the Church. You know Jesus Stated that he would build his Church. The Church means the body having having Christ's vision and sharing his message.

Jesus didn't just picked those who worked with him or his disciples; he gave them roles to play.

These boko haram fighters are the representation of ISIS in Nigeria and the countries around us.

omonnakoda:
Please answer the Very specific questions I asked so I won't be confused as you claim. No speeches or platitudes Just answer the questions and say so if you do not have answers.

Christ never talked about old testament WHO was it that CHRISTENED it OLD that is one of my questions.

He went into the Temple and read from the "scriptures"

Who was it that elevated the 27 books of the "NEW" testament to SCRIPTURE status AFTER JESUS HAD DIED and when did that happen ? If you do not know say so stop trying to bluff

In WHAT YEAR DID THE NEW TESTAMENT START CIRCULATING ? DO YOU KNOW? YES OR NO

I suggest you research the CHRISTIAN CANON

As you know Jesus started his ministry with the old testament, but you might not know that close to the time of his departure he completed it and sent disciples forth with new testament, directly spoken by him.


JESUS HIMSELF MENTIONED NEW TESTAMENT AND COMMISSIONED DISCIPLES TO SPREAD IT

omonnakoda:
I think you need to do a lot more reading and research into the ORIGIN of the BIBLE. The claim that there is a NEW TESTAMENT or an OLD one is superficial and BOGUS. There are 27 books in the bible new testament and some debate about who wrote each one. Leaving that debate to one side we know they were NOT written by one person so the question is this.

WHEN( in what year) did those 27 books get collected into one volume and by

WHOM also

WHO was it that first introduced the term NEW TESTAMENT and

WHEN

There is no internal validity to the concept of NEW TESTAMENT or NEW COVENANT without provoking contradictions

God in the Bible says he does NOT change. Malachi 3.6
Jesus himself said
Matthew5.18 For verily I say unto you, till heaven and earth pass away, not one jot or one tittle shall in any wise pass from the law till all be fulfilled.

So this Christian Idea of a new or reformed or Born again God is inconsistent.

The real question I ask most so called Christian is this which none can answer.

Is the so called old Testament old and to be discarded or are its contents a part of Christianity. In the latter case hhow do we know what to use and what not to use or do we go "as the spirit guides".

Both the old and new testament made the Bible. You cant live purely on one without making reference to the other. Why are you confused? New Testament was not smuggled into the Old Testament or vice versa. The renewed covenant didn't just come into being. God has spoken in several books of Old Testament through his prophets concerning it. Study and understand Christ's response when asked if he came to destroy the old testament. He stated that he came to fulfill it, and that's why he summarized whole commandments to simpler one which reflects true love of God and human kind and genuine worship of him.

dragan:
http://www.islam101.com/terror/verse8_12.htm

Others have made sites to address your issues with the Quran so if you really wanted to know you could have easily went there. What more do you want me to say?

Although im gonna guess most of you rather choose to follow what sites like these say - http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm. You know since the ldiot that made the site is such an expert on Islam not just a hateful ldiot that goes as far as to create a site to express his 'opinions' while presenting them as facts.

simple question I asked. Just do justice with interpretation of Quran 8:12;29

helpee:
Until quaran is properly edited, i am afraid these people are practising proper islam

iamord:
same to the bible

You mean the scriptures should be edited to suite modern life and fit the trend of times? Bible has passed that over 2000 years ago. Bible wasn't about editing the contents, it is about a renewed covenant of Almighty God. That's is why you see the contrasting past (Old Testament) and the hopeful presence (New Testament) reconciled through sacrificial death of Christ, thus giving the world the book of life - Holy Bible.

dragan:
And you say that as someone who is a Muslim that read and understood the Quran huh? Not even all Muslims understand the verses in the Qur'an (i.e these terrorists) so you cant just go about quoting direct verses without knowing what they mean, how they were revealed, and why they were revealed. That is why there are people that study and interpret verses for Fiqh before they are applied to everyday life.

Just as I would like anyone to challenge me about
my faith. Pls and pls interpret those two verses - Quran 8:12;29. We must know why the Islamists are not justified in their deeds.

Atigba:
They re the true Muslim

All the Muslim that died are not true Muslim

Isis is the soldier of Allah

Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"


Quran (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

The people of the book here mean christian and the Jews

No that can't be! How come you want peace reciting and adding those verses to a scriptural booklet?

If those verses are not rejected, people's lives will forever be at stake living among those keeping the religious ordinances.

That command to slaughter others like animals makes heart bleed.

Oh my God, destroy wicked people and their beliefs, because they are enemies of global peace. Is this the kind of treatment they want for the innocent whenever they are trapped in their nets.

SAY NO TO THE WICKED

SAY NO TO TERRORISM

SAY NO TO Nigerian Version of ISIS - boko haram

Oh my God, destroy wicked people and their beliefs, because they are enemies of global peace.

berem:
Nawao! Upon all the money Oledepo has,he's still collecting bribe? Or is he not part of the compromising pastors?

so you follow liars to feed your followers with lies. Amaechi quoted figure to N6b as a bribe for certain pastors, but he failed to mention the names. That is cheap lies and mere propaganda. Politics blinds, politics fools, politics endangers, politics breeds liars. I am afraid if you are a product of political lies.

sbaks:
[b]Amaechi will so suffer after this elections. That is a fact. I give him may 29th he would be busy crying his eyes out. Amaechi my advice for you. I was once like you, following hausa people until my eyes began to open. They would make sure you are enemies with your fellow christians, get necessary informations from you, use you like a fool, then they will DUMP YOU in such a way that your fellow christian brothers would not even use a 20m pole to touch you not to talk of helping you (because they must have seen you as a betrayer hence lost confidence in you). They would make you hated. Goodluck is soooooo wise to have ran to his fellow christians because this is what will make him win. FACT! Have you guys ever noticed(for those of you with hausa friends) that whenever you are together with them, when they see any of their fellow islamists, they so much abandon you to the extent you will feel like nothing. They are such fanatics.
Nigerians tell me if true true dem no wan islamize us, wetin be the meaning of that Arabic inscription for our naira note? Nigeria na Arabic nation?
Why is it that they always bite their teeth whenever a christian is in power (even though the christian is trying his best)? It was done to obasanjo, now goodluck
Mtcheeeeeew. Amaechi would be dumped no matter what. They are only using him in other to make him an enemy of christians and to get the secret of christianity (I.e how they can capture christians to vote for them) shikenan! After that, they will throw him into a THRASH CAN! I HAVE SAID SO. You guys will bear me witness GOD's Grace because I SAID SO [/b]

Amaechi should stop lying because he wants to be relevant at all costs. The country is far greater than him, he should not allow himself to be used as a scapegoat. He just made statement without telling the world which pastors are involved and how the collection took place. Anyone found wanting in the allegation should be dealt with to serve as deterrent to others, if found to be true. Christ's gospel can't be mocked and salvation is not built on worldly pleasure. It is about speaking the truth without fear and favour. It is about the reality and making sacrifice.

when we ask of membership of boko haram fighters, some Northern respondents will say they are either Niger delta militants or Chadian nationalities. Can Chadian troops now begin to destroy their own people in a country that is not there's? And Niger delta guys fighting to gain territories and institute caliphate dynasty

jpphilips:
I made no assumptions there, they are clear statements of facts that can be proven beyond reasonable doubt. I don't care what you think, we need to stop corruption in Nigeria and Jonathan is definitely not the man that will do it.
Most of you are so poorly informed that you don't know why a stadium will be filled to the brim because of a recruitment exercise, if you cannot narrow it down to corruption then why do you deserve an opinion.

All previous administrations were not free of corruption. We can't do justice by putting all blames on President Jonathan. Widespread unemployment is due to negligence of past administrations. They were a failure because they didn't make adequate provisions for subsequent generations from enormous resources. All of them mismanaged county's resources.

jpphilips:
Why will Jonathan not have saboteurs when he has refused to enthrone consequence management in his administration? we see what GEJ is not doing right we say, well, but when the consequence comes out we say it is not his fault, how many people have been jailed since this administration? how will someone not sabotage your efforts when he knows that the last person who ended up in jail got a presidential pardon?

You are now complaining about Sabotage but you don't blame the president for not enthroning consequence management.

You mentioned professionalism, let me start with the military, how do you expect them to be professional when "man know man" is the order of the day? is that not nepotism a sub set of corruption? even with over 13,000 Nigerian lives gone, the commander in chief is yet to wake up. Look at Chad, they celebrated Boko haram free, since Oct last year or so, today, they have 700 soldiers in Cameroon and 500 helping us, is that not shameful enough for Mr president to resign?

Ordinary Chad whose Air force is not as big as our presidential fleet? Chad whose soldiers can not afford bullet proof vests? Chad who has 38,350 soldiers against Nigeria with 130,000? If you are objective you should know that corruption is a cancer with huge chain consequence, once you allow it to thrive, every other sector will collapse.

Where will professionalism come from? in the oil and gas after GEJ and his friends enthroned their Local content policy, his Nigerian friends stopped training their Nigerian workforce, gone are the days when you join an Italian company and tomorrow you are in Milan, the Nigerian content refused to do that, so even if you do a $5b project annually for 100yrs in the industry, you will still source man power and expertize abroad, how will professionalism come when that corrupt practice is allowed to thrive?

Bart Nnaji brought an idea that was about to transform the power sector, Balkanization and privatization of power assets, where is he today? if Barth a professional was not allowed to man our power assets, how is that sector going to attract technocrats and investors?
since he left, how many companies are still serious about our power assets?

Nigerians are begging for debate because they can afford to stand on the window of a viewing center but they forgot that GEJ organizing the debate could not provide any electricity for them.

Jonathan is ruthlessly corrupt.

Tell me any sector where you operate and i will give you facts where Jonathan has finished you, even the railway you guys are glorifying, with sub standard trains and non standard guages, if you know how General electric became Nigeria's largest locomotive vendor you will stone GEJ in the next rally, I know most people never knew that Schneider and Siemens actually wanted to buy the real trains for Nigeria.

Remove Ignorance from Nigerians and Jonathan will not win Otuoke LGA.

your assumptions are based on corruption as the reason Jonathan achievements should not be considered, even if he comes up with policies that will make the economy thrive in a short while.

Nigeria has continued to be a bigger country with bigger problems against all efforts to make her one of the biggest economies in Africa. Corruption in the country is more complex than what unilateral decision of only the President can successfully address and get rid of in Nigeria. It has to be resolved by a more complex means. Constitution's provision must be so harsh against corruption and more scientific approaches should be deployed to tackle it.

I don't think arresting people and locking them up as witnessed in the previous administrations has ever stopped corruption.

BlackBaron:
Aaah! Oh my goodness. 4-7 hours are you from Koma hills or your area just hit civilization?

Some people are suffering and don't know it...
No wonder people like Alams and Jonathan can rule over you.

How do you mean? I was making a point that electricity distribution and availability has improved steadily in my place, and that improvement is likely to continue until we finally get it for 24 hours. Rulers had been there before Jonathan, those ones messed the system up and opened up ways to poverty. We know the distribution is inadequate, but we believe we will soon get there with the ongoing work.

Image123:
God forbid that i should be jealous of at best a mediocre performance. It's not about My Ogun State, it is about my Nigeria. i have a Nigerian passport, Nigeria is not the exclusive property of PDP association. i mentioned Governors Akpabio and Ameachi as well, you didn't see that i guess. With all the might and money of the FG, if all they can show us are roads, GEJ inside car and promises on newspaper and CNN which are more a estimate due to our population than our policies, then that is a failure. Again, Amosun has better pictures than that despite not producing oil, not to mention Akpabio and Ameachi.

trying to compare Jonathan performance in office with performances of those State Governors. Unlike the State governments, the Federal Government under President Jonathan doesn't give much publicity to it's achievements. If the Federal Government were to package all its program/projects and publicise them as the States do, probably many would have been convinced that FG under Jonathan has performed.

MadCow1:
I don't see his achievements as anything worthy of mentioning.

I work in the oil and gas industry and have been fortunate to work directly with NNPC, DPR and NAPIMS and I have seen the issues caused by the Presidents inefficiency and corruption that comes from on high. What many Nigerians see as corruption is the 50 Naira bribe collected by the police at Checkpoints, what I see is when Contracts worth billions are given to incompetent aides of the President under the influence of NNPC and co.

If Jonathan had looked into the Brass LNG projects and the Samsung Heavy Duty yard in the South - South, that would easily have created over 25,000 jobs. But the corruption that has held those projects back have cost Nigeria Hundreds of Millions of Dollars without any progress made.

Most of the achievements of Jonathan are either projects that started before him and we're completed under his administration, poor quality over priced works or just too insignificant to be worthy of calling a federal project. Apart from the Second Niger Bridge, I can't see any project worth calling federal.

Most Nigerians are truly in the dark as to the corruption pit we currently find ourselves in. 20 Billion Dollars got missing under Diezani and she is still holding her office. 320 million plus were misappropriated under Stella and she gets fired without being charged to court. Alamiesigha that was Jonathan's former boss that cost the Federal Government millions of Naira to prosecute was granted a pardon by Jonathan and then he says he wants to fight corruption with technology. Lol.

Achievements are relative. How can China build 5000 megawatts with 5 Billion dollars and Nigeria build 800 megawatts with 20 billion be considered an achievement? How can Nigeria and Mexico take loans to build their trains.. Nigeria builds locomotives and Mexico builds speed trains..


Are we cursed as a people or just too lazy to care?

Forgive for not celebrating mediocrity.. I am well travelled and I have seen that we are too wealthy to be this useless.

You mean the recent federal federal projects are of poor quality... No I disagree with you on that

You mean the projects are over priced... May be I should take quality time to investigate that, compare and contrast the amounts our so called progressives are spending on similar projects. ordinary, if we were to explore that, those claiming to be the progressive might likewise end up being criminals.

On variance in the costs of improving electricity in Nigeria compared to China, China already operates industrialised economy with patriotic and home-based professionals, Nigeria has continued to struggle to develop in hands of saboteurs. Had it been we were able to boast of competent professionals, by this time we couldn't have incurred more costs on what we should have provided.

Image123:
Ordinary Governor Amosun of Ogun State will flog those pictures i saw on the first page hands down. Not to now talk of Governor Akpabio or Governor Ameachi, and others. If that is what the big FG has achieved, that is well below average. Let someone else try.

Hahaha na so you you jealous uncle jona achievements ni... If your Ogun State were to build 12 Universities, 7 Polytechnics, railways across Nigeria, reimburse millions if farmers across Nigeria to improve on farm production, construct 10 lanes of express way from Lagos-Ogun-Ibadan, not to talk of other places, your State Government were to pay the minimum salaries in it's full amounts, and many more I can't be mentioning, probably your State could have been a far better place for all Nigerians to live.

Obiagelli:
I have zero faith in this government

zero faith ke? that's is interesting! keep it up.

MadCow1:
Abuja express road was started before his administration..

The railway contract was awarded by Obasanjo.

I still dey wait.. Notice how the value of the contracts are never appended to the pictures?

Nobody seems to realise that the East West Road currently has two separate budgets.. Sure - and the Ministry of Works.

Let them keep fooling themselves.. I have seen better. I know where we can be. I know what we should be. Jonathan should leave..

your username sef... Nawao

it's like you like to sweep mr. jona achievements under the carpet. As much as you counted on his failures, won't you take some times to view his achievements and score him what you think you are worth if you carry his burden.

Obiagelli:
Not the same story everywhere

I think with the ongoing works in various locations everywhere will soon be connected. Available of electricity in Nigeria will soon be like that of GSM

Obiagelli:
Thunder fire your lies, how many megawatts did we generate in 1999, how many did gej meet there, how many are we generating today. Simple google search

sincerely speaking electricity distribution and availability is improving far better that what we used to have before. Like in my place I used to rely on power bank to charge my phones almost everyday, but the situation has changed now. For the past two months I don't remember to charge the power bank because electricity is now available for at least 4 -7 hours per day. This is an improvement on its previous availability of 0 - less than 2 hours per day. I think that is an improvement, and with time it can increase and become more stable.

To PDP.... CHANGE AND TRANSFORMATION

To APC.... CHANGE AND PROGRESS

TO GENERAL PUBLIC... GOOD GOVERNANCE & GENUINE DEVELOPMENT.

UP ALL GIVERS OF GOOD GOVERNANCE! Irrespective of their parties God bless those developing Nigeria.

I myself like the quality job being done in the ongoing 10 lanes Lagos/Ibadan Express way. I pray it will be completed on time.

boko haram membership and terrorism will soon be dead in Nigeria. May the military record huge and final success over them this time around.

All these in the hands of some powerful and wealthy leaders from the North, yet their followers are wrecked, wretched and very poor. Probably they deliberately conditioned them for poverty in order to take advantage of them.

PastorOla1:
In the Yoruba land of today Afenifere has No Electoral Value & Lack follower ship. If they like let them sleep in ASO ROCK, that is their cup of tea. What is the current position of Yoruba in GEJ's Government No. 10, ok. This is the first time in the history of nigeria that a Gov. Will so rubbish us, GEJ did. GEJ's 2nd term will be worse for the Yoruba race, No Yoruba man in his right mind should vote 4 GEJ again. With our Vote GEJ OUT.

and you think you have a point? Don't just follow others to heap falsehood on assumption. Read the speech of the man very well, if you care to understand you will know you are pushing yourself and the likes of you to the wrong side.