₦airaland Forum

mrvitalis:
Sure we got lower wage, cheaper power, experience manpower

Bangladesh, Vietnam and Pakistan are beating them why can't we

Power isn't cheap.
But I agree wage is cheap and skillset is there.
Btw Vietnam and Bangladesh are very strong in textile.
Bangladesh is the 6th largest exporter of textiles and 2nd largest exporter of garment.

It won't cut it if u going to import all the materials from china and all U do is cut and sow.
U can't be competitive when it comes to export. U will still depend on govt protection.

mrvitalis:
For me 0 percentage import duty on fabric.. Zero net import duty no vat nothing

Zero percent import duty on garment factory equipments

Tax benefits to banks that give 50% loans to real sectors such as garment factory

2 trillion grants to garment factory or cooperative of tailors minimum of 50 to 500 to set up garment factory 2 billion to 50 billion zero interest loans to pay back after 10 years

300% import duty on finished clothing

And U actually think U can compete with china when it comes to garment industry.
Will your finished products be cheaper than Chinese garments that will be snuggled if they are banned?

mrvitalis:
Textile is gone we would never get back, for me we never really had any advantage from the start it only survived because of primitive protectionist economic policy and thats what killed it too

Today in other to protect a Dead textil industry that would never be competitive we are killing a potential 100 billion dollars per year garment industry.. Making same mistake again

In 50years or more we would then remember the garment industries

But we also import garments en masses. I don't think Nigeria has a competitive garment industry except if we go protectionist again.

Antichristian2:
Alhamdulillah you know your argument is useless!
You can't be a son and a slave at the same time.

End of discussion

Antichristian2:
No son worships his father!

The Father also worship the Son.
The Father called his Son God.
Both are divine

Antichristian2:
No son will obey the father 100% including killing himself on his order!

Well if U saying Allah isn't 100% perfect then his Son has every right to disobey him.

Antichristian2:
No son will thrash his will completely for his father's!

Again if Allah's will is imperfect, his Son has every right to follow his own will.

Antichristian2:
Are U saying the will of Jesus isn't perfect.

Jesus adopted the will of his Father. He felt no need to have another will because the will of the Father is perfect for him.

Antichristian2:
God created us all and everyone is His slave!
Allah says what means:
There is none in the heavens and the earth but comes unto the Most Beneficent (Allah) as a slave. (Qur'an - Maryam 19:93)

Muhammed said that. No previous scriptures called creation slaves. It makes no sense.

JESUS NEVER CALLED HIMSELF A SLAVE.

Antichristian2:
That's biology (sexual reproduction)!

Are you comparing me and my parents to Jesus and the Father? So the Father and Mary gave birth to Jesus!



My parents need offspring to continue their lineage and someone to inherit their legacy!
I guess the father too needs a son to continue his lineage and inherit him.
I agree with my father in many things and disagree with him also in some things! Did Jesus disagree with the father in anything?
There is no way a son will be perfectly obedient to his father like Jesus except he's a slave.

No father can send a son to go and die except the son is a metaphor for a slave!

I obey my dad most times! Some other times i don't.

Yeah we are to obey our parents in the Lord not in everything!

But according to same Paul, Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear and sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ. Ephesians 6:5. Jesus did obey his master this way!



There are two different things you confuse from your Bible!

Children are to obey their parents in the Lord!

Slaves on the other hand has no restrictions:

Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ. Ephesian 6:5

Slaves, obey your earthly masters in everything, not only to please them while they are watching, but with sincerity of heart and fear of the Lord. Colossians 3:22

Slaves are to submit to their own masters in everything, to be well-pleasing, not argumentative, Titus 2:9

You disagree with your Father because he's not perfect. He doesn't know everything so prone to mistakes.
Your father's will for you isn't without defect.

Jesus had no cause to disagree with his Father because he knows his Father his perfect. He knows it all. So he trust his father 100%.
Jesus had no cause to doubt his Father's will for him.

Paul told slaves to obey their masters as if they obey the Lord because the Lord will reward them. The servitude was for the Lord not their earthly masters.

The same way U do your work as if it's for Allah not because of some Oga who will punish U if U do nonsense.

Ephesians 6
5 Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ. 6 Obey them not only to win their favor when their eye is on you, but as slaves of Christ, doing the will of God from your heart. 7[b] Serve wholeheartedly, as if you were serving the Lord, [/b] not people, 8 because you know that the Lord will reward each one for whatever good they do, whether they are slave or free.



Finally I want to end this useless argument.
Is it possible to be a Son and a slave at the same time to One person?

I bought this gen 9700 in 2009. And yet we were complaining that things were expensive.
Annoying thing is while inflation has increased by over 10,000%, wages remain flat

Giving someone 10k in 2009 was good money, it's still the same today. This shows people are poorer now than in 2009.

Antichristian2:
Yeah, na only you i dey respond to here and online. Why do i need to research anything for you?

Yes, the sin part wasn't for Jesus but the obedience part is for him. He obeys the father as a slave obeys his master.

Paul Confirms the slavery!
Paul allegedly said in Romans 6:16:
Don’t you know that when you offer yourselves to someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey—

This means if you obey God then you are God's slaves according to Paul!

Jesus obeyed God by doing His will so he became a slave of God!

Why didn't Jesus give them to the father? It was the father that always give him everything! Just as a slave!

There's nothing wrong if master and slave are working!


This one is capping! Why didn't Jesus heal the canaanite woman's daughter at first? Why did Jesus had to pray to God to raise the dead?

Can the father worship Jesus like Jesus worshipped him?

It is still coming from the Master to the slave!

God granted him life. He can't grant himself life nor can he grant the father life! By himself he can do nothing! That's the definition of a slave.

Yes, he didn't call himself slave of God! And i never said Jesus called himself a slave. I am saying all his actions and words are that of a slave not son!

Jesus is a messenger of God - A messenger is a slave o
John 3:17: "For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world..."
John 5:36: "But I have a greater witness than John’s; for the works which the Father has given me to finish—the very works that I do—bear witness of me, that the Father has sent me."
John 7:29: "But I know him, for I am from him, and he sent me."

A slave does the will of others
John 4:34: "My food is to do the will of him who sent me and to accomplish his work."
John 5:30: "I seek not my own will, but the will of the Father who sent me."
Matthew 26:39: In the Garden of Gethsemane, he prays, "Not as I will, but as you will."

Too much rants and babbling!

I never knew U are this slow in thinking
Everything you are and will become in this world came from your Father and Mother.

Your genetic sequence, your life, your personality, the way U were raised came from them.
Are U then a slave to your parents for giving you life?

Father bequeath wealth to their Sons
Father give inheritance to their sons.
Does that make sons slave to their Fathers.

Imagine saying when a son obeys his Father, then he's a slave.
Are U a slave to your Father because U obey him and follow his instructions?

This is what Paul that U have been quoting has to say about son obeying their fathers.


Ephesian 6
Children, obey your parents in the Lord, for this is right.

Does that make children slaves to their parents?

In the old covenant, children who disobey their parents are stoned to death according to law of Moses.

According to antiMuslim, that makes children slaves to their Parents.

Your reasoning is upside down.

Antichristian2:
You should know i'm very intelligent than you!

Jesus said so many things in your Bible!

A slave does not do things of himself but does the will of others. A slave totally obeys the master and submits to him!

1. For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will, but to do the will of Him who sent Me. John 6:38

2. Jesus explained, “My food is to do the will of Him who sent Me and to finish His work. John 4:34

3. I can do nothing by myself; I judge only as I hear. And my judgment is just, because I do not seek my own will, but the will of Him who sent me. John 5:30

4. He who sent Me is with Me. He has not left Me alone, because I always do what pleases Him.” John 8:29

5. I have not spoken on my own, but the Father who sent Me has commanded Me what to say and how to say it. / And I know that His command leads to eternal life. So I speak exactly what the Father has told Me to say.” John 12:49-50

Paul Confirms the slavery!
1. Paul allegedly said in Romans 6:16:
Don’t you know that when you offer yourselves to someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey—whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness?

This means if we obey God then we are God's slaves!

2. Paul continues later in Romans 6:22:
But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the benefit you reap leads to holiness, and the result is eternal life.

Here we see that those who have been set free from sins become slaves of God!

So U this is what U wasted a whole day researching b4 U could respond!!!
It's dead on arrival.

Jesus was never a slave to sin, so he couldn't be set free from sin to become a slave of God.
He is sinless. Jesus is the one that sets u free from sin. He said so himself.
If anything, you are slave to Jesus!!!!! If U choose to be a slave. Thank Jesus and tell him U want to downgrade your status to slavery instead of sonship.

2. If the Father and Son work together, they have the same goal and purpose.

John 10
29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. 30 I and the Father are one.”

John 5
17 In his defense Jesus said to them, “My Father is always at his work to this very day, and I too am working.”

Jesus cannot be a slave of God, he works independently without any supervision.
John 5
21 For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son gives life to whom he is pleased to give it.

Jesus can never be a slave, Jesus said he should be worshipped same way you worship his Father.

John 5
22 Moreover, the Father judges no one, but has entrusted all judgment to the Son, 23 that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. Whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father, who sent him.

Jesus can never be a slave, he has aseity- life in himself. And has the authority to judge.

John 5
26 For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son also to have life in himself. 27 And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man

What's funny here is Jesus never said he's a slave. But clearly said unambiguously that he's a Son of his Father.
But dishonest Muslims like antichristian are pushing words into Jesus mouth misinterpreting verses to claim he's a slave.

Now when we Christians do similar exegesis of Jesus' words to claim Jesus is God, these confused Muslims will reject it and insist we bring unambiguous verse that says Jesus is God.

Now we have clear cut verses saying Jesus is the Son of his Father, Muslims ignore them to start forcing slavery into passages so as to please their Ignorant Master- Mohammed, the first person to say Isa is a slave.

Bunch of stinking hypocrites

John 10

what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’? 37 Do not believe me unless I do the works of my Father.

Antichristian2:
Do people worship their father?
Jesus worshipped the father! He did pray to Him many times!
Jesus made many reference of him doing the will of his father and not his own will!

A slave has no will of his but does the will of his master! A son on the other hand has the will of his and can at times contradict the father!
Jesus said he can of himself do nothing!

What's the name/location of Jesus's church and who were the congregation?

This is Jesus response to your stupid claim if being a slave.

John 8
34 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, everyone who sins is a slave to sin. 35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever. 36 So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.

You are the one who is a slave. Jesus is a Son, he said so himself.
He never told anyone he was a slave. Muhammed is the one who said ISA is a slave.

And Jesus as the Son is saying he has the power to set U free!!!!

People see as he will come with another moronic argument.

sonmvayina:
In the Tanakh, when it speaks of salvation, it always from physical danger.
Sin was a breaking of God's commandments. And he has already provided a solution for the problem of sin. It does not involve a human sacrifice. In multiple places, He said he hates human sacrifice and even calls it an abomination.
Where the early church fathers got the idea of a human/god sacrifice from is way over me.

The only god that is known to accept human sacrifice was moloch.
I am beginning to think that he has something to do with Christianity.....

I told in the past what Jesus did is self sacrifice. Where did U see human sacrifice.
Are U dumb or what?

Antichristian2:
I don't think you understand the question. Let me rephrase it. John came and was calling out people to repent! If they repent won't they be admitted in Paradise when they die? Of cos they will.

And Jesus did forgave someone without dying while on earth!

He promised the criminal paradise without him believing in his death or trinity!

So why the need for the death of Jesus if all these can be achieved without his death?

All forgiveness b4 Jesus was predicated on his death and resurrection.
Without his death, all forgiveness of sin was invalid.

No one went to heaven prior to the death and resurrection of Jesus. They were in a place called Abraham's Bossom.

Antichristian2:
What religion did Jesus practice on earth? Definitely not Christianity! Christianity started after Jesus.
Which God did he worship and pray to?

Those who follow Christ in truth before the Prophethood of Muhammad are Muslims.
Those who follow Moses in truth before the Prophethood of Jesus are Muslims.
Same for Noah and others!

Mr Man stop disturbing us with your recycled gist. All these claim has been thoroughly thrashed in the past here.
U no get shame?

Jesus can't be a Muslim, he called his God FATHER
No born Muslim dare open his mouth to call their Allah Father.

Jesus came to establish the church. Jesus left behind the church. If U a member of his church, then U are a follower of Jesus.
If U are not a member of the church of Jesus, U don't follow Jesus

Omalicious1:
Indeed, anyone with N30m in his or her account and wants to japa, shouldn't say that is because Nigeria is bad that's why...with such money in your account, u could start a lucrative business in nigeria and make good profit...the grass isn't always greener as we think it is...after reading Lord Lugard's book...the man really understood how an average Nigerian behaves...we are still in modern day colonialism

Forget it. None of these japarians have 30 million swimming in their bank accounts.
They raise that money when they need to relocate by selling their cars, land or house or borrow from friends/families.
I repeat nobody has 40 million lying in one bank account and then decide to waste it on relocation.
U guys don't even know what 40 million is. Only politicians and yahoo/shady dealers have such amount in their account.

99% of genuine hustlers do not even have 50 million lying dormant in one account just like that. They know what to do with the money if they have one.

fullclub:
Even with receipts i showed oya suggest your owb bill
Even my house rent of 700 is the cheapest as its a tiny space.

A friend in London pays 1800 for same type of 2 bedroom. We do same type of job.. Only he works more hours

Guy e calming down and listen to what people are telling U.
UK is not only London.
There are plenty places where house rent is around 800 pounds per month for a good 3 bedroom house.

Saying an average 3 bedroom goes for 300k is strange.
That's the price for a new property in solid upper middle class estate in most midland and Yorkshire. U can get a 6-10 yr old house for 180k in most cities in UK.
U need to be asking the right question and be open minded. UK is not for the weak but if U understand the system well, U will take a good chunk out of it.

Finally if U agree with Dele Momodu, simply work your ass for 15, 000 pounds which is 30 million and come back to Nigeria.
If U are saving 500 pounds per month, U should do it within 3 yrs. Take 30 million and relocate back to Nigeria, simple.

And stop sending money home if U think U don't have enough. Save towards your 30 million and quick relocation. Trust me Nigerians at home will be fine.

All these money U send them is just jara. They will survive without it.

Gerrard59:
Yes, the "doing it for my children" is absolute nonsense unless the person gets a good job in the abroad. The only country I can accept such is the US and maybe Canada due to its proximity. Elsewhere, the chances aren't that good. UK even try sef. Countries like Spain, Northern Europe and elsewhere are dead ends for second-generation black people. Look at France? Apart from Tidjane Thiam, I am to yet to read about any stellar black person who went through the system compared to the US. Another unfortunate one is Belgium!

Anything aside scholarship or getting directly employed or transferred by an organisation in Nigeria to the branch in the abroad is nonsense. Covenant University is there, ditto good universities in South Africa.

No matter what people say about UK, this is an area I will give it kudos.
The opportunity is open and accessible for future generations be it black, Indian or white and it's the same.
I've met British Nigerians in high top level jobs like gold exchange, oil trading companies, investment banks etc. tech is even becoming norm for minorities.
Kemi Badenoch was in tech for a long time b4 she went into politics. This was when tech was just new and people rarely understood the opportunity in the sector.
Lots of Nigerians now own up to 5-10 properties including residential, nursing homes, commercial properties. Home care is now becoming a regular turf for our naija people and it's crazily lucrative if U have good management and organisational skills.

Look out for british Indians in the future, they will be the ones running that country. They now have their own rich elite neighbourhood.
Europe is a different ball game entirely. Quality of life may be better than UK but they just want U to stay at home and be having kids while they pay U or U working some semi- skilled Job with average pay.

That's why most times, blacks in Europe end up moving to UK.

It's just a pity UK had been mismanaged by recent shortsighted politicians, careless mass immigration, bad policies, impact of unrestricted globalization, and Brexit.

That country offers great opportunity. Unfortunately, it's on its way to become the next 1st world country to become 2nd world.
UK is a case of what useless politicians cannot destroy doesn't exist.
Canada is next on the block unless they retrace their downward self destructive movement.

RealityKings1:
Women themselves don't worry about these things. They see men complaining about whoringg as a nuisance.

Let them do what they like with their body, it's non of your business

Above is the main issue that most men don't get.
Most women naturally gravitate towards casual sexuality it they are allowed to determine their own morality.
It's the masculine and patriarchal dominated society that place high premium on women's sexuality.
Men are the ones that attach honour and dignity to a woman's body.
Most women simply see sex as a means to an end, not the end itself.
Western society that allowed their women to determine their morality, we can see how it's turning out for them. Most of their women are shamelessly embracing porn and onlyfans recklessly.

While we may say male dominated society is better for women sexuality, Unfortunately these authority inevitably leads to excessive control and abuse of women by men.
It doesn't stop at controlling their sexuality, such society also wants to control a woman's voice, her choice, her character and her life.

That's why only Christianity has the perfect answer to these problem.
Christianity places objective non partial morality on both man and woman equally.

Both men and women are called to shun any form of sexual immorality.
Whatever punishment or condemnation meted out to women for sexual immorality is also be adjudicated to men Christianity.

Whether it should be celebrated publicly is left for the couples.
What should be mandatory is that dowry should only be paid on virgins.
I just don't understand the concept behind paying dowries to a woman who's not a virgin.

This is something that we should look into as a people.

Eagba:
If your country is running on trillions of dollar in debt and huge clunky trade deficits, what would you do?

Continue giving money out because you care for their opinions or you reduce most unnecessary spendings to cut loopholes

You continue in the path of trade deficit or you bring your allies to the table to buy more goods from you?
My advice for trump is to calculate a way to make American goods cheaper while keeping quality high.

Remove oil and USA has a trade surplus with Canada.
Remove sentiment and see the reality.

Forcing Canadian factory isn't going to help USA. How much will be added to American trade by this tariff...maybe some 10 billion dollars. What would that change.

China is America's biggest problem, not it's neighbours. Canada actually lost a lot in manufacturing when American companies decided to relocate their factories to China. Most Canadian companies integrated as supply chain to American factories folded up.

Trump knows he can't do anything about china. He's even scared of hitting china with tariff because he knows the severe consequences- their agricultural export will collapse.

Since he can't bring manufacturing back from china, he's bullying American allies to send their factories to USA.
Europe and Canada did not steal American jobs. China did, Trump should face China if he's really serious bringing manufacturing back.

As for Mexico, Trump will be very stupid to place tariff on that country. America needs Mexico more than mexico needs America.

If manufacturing is to return to USA, Mexico has the be integral part of the value chain system or else it won't work.

No American will work in one assembly line earning 10 dollars per day. Those days are gone.
Someone has to do that job.

beardedboy:
You're a waste of time.

Anyway let me give U a free lesson on WHO GOD IS ACCORDING TO THE SCRIPTURE

1. Divine simplicity
Divine simplicity mean God is one and indivisible.
He has no parts, God is not composed or made up of parts, be it physical, non physical or metaphysical.
He is one in his entirety and has no distinct attributes separate from him.

Characteristics such as omnipresence, goodness, truth and eternity are identical to God's being, not qualities that make up God.

God's very essence cannot be separated from his own very existence.
HE IS ONE.

That's why He told Moses ' I AM WHO I AM'

beardedboy:
Battle? You are more or less a pesky fly.

🥱🥱🥱🥱🥱🥱🥱🥱

Someone that cant even defend his own religion.
Making mouth....

Mr Man answer my question, I answered yours.

Can I find Allah under his creation or beside his creation or adjacent to his creation.
Or the only place to find Allah is above his creation?

Let's find out why Allah can't enter his creation.
Other Muslims can try to help out.

beardedboy:
You're a waste of time.

I guess as much. When U hit a truck, U go silent.
Next time pick your battle wisely.

beardedboy:
Beating your chest will do you no good.
An insect has a head, you have a head, a snake has a head. They're all heads but are they the same? Is saying you have a head tantamount to likening you to an insect or snake?

Does Your God have head that cannot be compared with the heads in this physical world?
Does Allah have a shin and face that cannot be compared with anything physical known to man.
If the answer is Yes, then U are applying anthropomorphism to description of your God.
Case closed.
Anthropomorphism doesn't belong to Arabic language, U guys cannot steal it in attempt to redefine it.

beardedboy:
God doesn't have human parts, so what's his so-called son? I believe God has no human parts but I'm only mentioning this to show you the contradiction of your claims.

Oga rest. Son of God is a word the Jews coined for The Messiah. No Christians believe God has a literal Son.
Na Muhammed we should ask how he got the idea Allah must have sex with a goddess to have a son.

beardedboy:
All these metaverse and alien gymnastics you're doing is baseless. The laws of physics are universal and that's why space shuttles from earth can land on other planets. Stop delving into what you have no knowledge about.

Oga rest. My message is clear. Nature is not the same in celestial bodies. Space shuttle that can't even near mercury not to talk of Sun.
Aliens that don't use oxygen for life will not embrace it simple because they arrive on earth.
That God entered his creation doesn't mean he will be bound by time. He's timeless.

beardedboy:
I don't think you realise how many versions of your God you've mentioned in this thread.

[/quote]Finally we can now diagnose your problem.
Just say U don't know the God of Abraham, Moses and Jesus, them we will teach U.
Your problem was bringing the description of Allah in the Koran and extrapolating it to the bible.

God described himself in the scripture and his self description encompasses the FF qualities

Divine simplicity, immutability, ultimate transcendent reality, aseity, eternality and impassibility.

If your understanding of God is limited to just one of his characteristics. Don't blame me, blame the writers of Quran who did a shoddy job describing Allah and claiming he's the God of the previous scriptures.

beardedboy:
1. Anthropomorphism is an actor disbelief.

U gotta be kidding me. The description of your Allah falls into pieces and collapse without anthropomorphism.
U Muslims will claim Allah is not like anything of his creation. That the shin of Allah isn't like the shin of humans or anything imagined, the hand of Allah is not like anything imagined, the face of Allah is unlike his creation, If U can conceptualise the shin, then it can't be shin of Allah because the shin of Allah is unlike anything known or imagined.
That's anthropomorphism my friend- ascribing human characteristics to things of alternate reality. We do this in order to conceptualise abstract non human entities.

You Muslims run under anthropomorphism to hide the flawed description of Allah
Yet U claim anthropomorphism is unreal. The joke is on you.


No Christian ever believe God has human parts whether real or imagined.

The bible makes it clear God is invisible. Different persons in the bible assert the invisible nature of God because he's a spirit.



1 John 4:12
No one has seen God at any time. If we love one another, God abides in us, and His love has been perfected in us.

John 6:46
Not that anyone has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father.


John 1:18
No one has ever seen God; the only God, who is at the Father's side, he has made him known.

John 4:24
God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.”

1 Timothy 6:16
Who alone has immortality, who dwells in unapproachable light, whom no one has ever seen or can see. To him be honor and eternal dominion. Amen.

Colossians 1:15
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.

beardedboy:
2. Aliens would be bounded by the laws of physics.

Only if that laws of physics is the same in both world. If not, aliens would be bound by the law of science from their own world not that of earth.
If their law of nature is non applicable here, they would either perish or leave.

For example, the concept of time is different in some metaverse- scientist believe time is measured differently in those reality, while some metaverse are believed to be timeless.
Aliens from such extraterrestrial environment cannot be bound by the concept of time here on earth even if they visit.
God created physics, he cannot be bound by laws of physics bocs it doesn't operate in his realm.

beardedboy:
3. How can you base your argument on sci-fi?! Sci-fi is a fancy name for "things that never happened".

U don't get it, do U?
As I said earlier, Aliens that need quasi crystals or metallic hydrogen for life won't suddenly embrace oxygen simply because they now live on earth. Laws of natures governing territorial and celestial bodies are different.

That's the point I'm trying to make with superhero, not telling U they are real. Gosh.

Let me ask U a simple question.
If space travel becomes a possibility tmrw and humans travel to a planet that has inhabitants who communicate naturally via wavelengths. How will humans living on this new planet communicate with each other?

beardedboy:
4. "The earth is my foot stool" clearly implies that He's above the earth. Think, you'll see.

U really don't know how ridiculous your argument sound.
One of the reason I believe the Quran is false is this assertion that Allah is above the earth yet not inside his creation.

If Allah is above the earth, it shows he's in a position determined by space and spatial orientation. He's in a position relative to space. He's inside his creation becos space is created.

Let me ask another question? If I develop the intrinsic ability to look for Allah.
Will I find him under his creation or beside his creation? Or the only place to find Allah is above his creation?
Note I said 'if' so don't bring up mind games.

Natasha should have known better. This is naija, all those sexual harassment accusations no dey fly for here.
Naija no send U. Me too movement is dead here.
U will even get punished for raising such sexual harassment allegations.
Funny thing he say na your own female gender go fry u.

beardedboy:
So many inconsistencies in your submissions. But I'll highlight only one for now because I don't have time to type epistle.
You quoted: "The heaven is my throne and the earth is my footstool" thinking it buttresses your point but it completely destroys all your arguments.

What exactly is the inconsistency because don't understand your point. Be clear.
The verse is talking about expanse and vastness of God's presence stretching from the heaven to the earth. It's not literal!!!
No Christian thinks God has a foot. I sincerely hope U know what is anthropomorphism?

beardedboy:
You know it's one thing to quote and another thing to understand what you're quoting.

Finally, you're saying things that contradict logic. God exists outside of time and space yet he exists in all places. That implies he also exists in time and place.

Too much inconsistency.

God's physicality exist outside of time and space.
God's existence outside of time and space means he's not bound by those dimensions in anyway. He's not subjected to the rules of time and space even if he enters his creation. That's why God can be outside and inside his creation at the same time because those factors doesn't define him.

We as humans are bound by the laws of nature which consist of time and space. because our existence orientation is defined by space, we can only be at one specific location at a time. God is not bound by that rule because he's a spirit- he can be everywhere and anywhere he choose to at the same time. That essence is not lost because he entered his creation.
U dictate the rules for something U create, not the other way round.
That U and I decide to pretend play as animal or a child or a car doesn't make us one. Isn't it?

Look at it this way, I want to assume U watch sci-fi movies.
Now if aliens enter our world today from wherever in the universe. They would not be bound by the laws of nature on earth because their existence is not from here.
Even though they are here on earth, their existence would still be based on the laws governing the nature of their own world not this world.
That's why superheros like superman or
wonder-woman doesn't age even though they live on planet earth because their existence is not from earth.

Do you get it now!!!!

Btw, don't they teach U guys basic metaphysics of theology in your masjid.

Seriously if they do, U would know Quran doesn't make sense.
Do not see this as insult, rather statement of fact.

beardedboy:
1. The problem with you is you like God to man. Unlike humans, His power and knowledge are absolute and omnipresent so His physical presence adds nothing to His power and greatness. Afterall, we humans need to be physically present because our knowledge and authority are limited by our physical presence or absence.

First and foremost, let's clarify. when we say God is omnipresent, what we are saying is the presence of God is every where.

The omnipresence essence of God is the very reason God created man in the first place. God created Man to have a direct relationship with him. That will not be possible if He's not omnipresent. Right from the garden of Eden, God was seen having 1-1 fellowship with humanity.
That's the core of the biblical theology which is oblivious in Islam.
God himself told the Patriarch He shall be with them and also revealed this thru the prophets.

Genesis 26:24
The Lord appeared to him the same night and said, “I am the God of your father Abraham; Do not fear, for I am with you. I will bless you, and multiply your descendants, For the sake of My servant Abraham.”

Haggai 2:4
But now take courage, Zerubbabel,’ declares the Lord, ‘take courage also, Joshua son of Jehozadak, the high priest, and all you people of the land take courage,’ declares the Lord, ‘and work; for I am with you,’ declares the Lord of hosts.

The Lord's presence also descended upon the tabernacle and was physically present felt by the Israelites.

Exodus 40
34 Then the cloud covered the tent of meeting, and the glory of the Lord filled the tabernacle. 35 Moses could not enter the tent of meeting, because the cloud settled down upon it and the glory of the Lord filled the tabernacle.

beardedboy:
2. As a Muslim, we don't believe Moses or Abraham or Isaac saw God. They only communicated with Him. Even Moses, who spoke directly to God only saw His Light, not His actual essence.

well, evidence in the Torah refute this. Moses physically saw God. Not only Moses, but the 70 elders of Israel. They saw God on Mount Sinai.

Exodus 24
9[b] Moses and Aaron, Nadab and Abihu, and the seventy elders of Israel went up 10 and saw the God of Israel.[/b] Under his feet was something like a pavement made of lapis lazuli, as bright blue as the sky. 11 But God did not raise his hand against these leaders of the Israelites; they saw God, and they ate and drank.

Now I know u will say these verses are corrupt or whatever which I can easily refute with your own Islamic faith. But what I want u to ask yourself is why would the ancient Jews who wrote the Torah make up such stories. If God is not omnipresent, why would they write such. What exactly do they want to achieve by claiming God is omnipresent when he's not.

Here is what David and Jeremiah has to say about God's omnipresence.

Psalm 139:7-10
Where can I go from Your Spirit? Or where can I flee from Your presence?
If I ascend to heaven, You are there; If I make my bed in Sheol, behold, You are there.

Jeremiah 23:24
“Can a man hide himself in hiding places, So I do not see him?” declares the Lord.
“Do I not fill the heavens and the earth?” declares the Lord.

2 prophets of God who lived more than 500 years apart both confirmed the omnipresence essence of God. If God didn't reveal this to them, why would they conjure it. Why would they make such mischievous claim. And how come other Prophets didn't correct such blasphemy by claiming God is in one fixed location.

beardedboy:
3. If you think well, you'll see that your claim and understanding of God revealing Himself to those prophet's actually negate your claim of God's physical omnipresence. If He is fully present in one location, then He is not fully present elsewhere. That would limit Him, which contradicts the concept of an infinite God.

What you wrote up there is the exact problem with the description of God in the Quran. The book got it wrong right from the word go.
God is a spirit, he's not in any fixed location. God exist outside of time, space and matter; he cannot be defined with any of those spatial orientation.
The Bible makes it clear God can be in inside and outside his creation AT THE SAME TIME. none of them can define him. He can choose to be in gazillion number of places at the same time if he wants to. HE'S A SPIRIT NOT A COMPOSITE BODY. It's only a composite body like humans or Allah that move with his body whenever he's in motion.

Isaiah 66:1
Thus says the Lord, “Heaven is My throne and the earth is My footstool.
Where then is a house you could build for Me? And where is a place that I may rest?

beardedboy:
4. If your God is omnipresent, then he's also in cow dung, and pig butt? If He is truly everywhere in a literal sense, then He must be in the lowest and most impure places too. This logic goes against the very concept of divine majesty.

This is very funny. It's interesting how you Muslims attributes human characteristics to your God but when we say Allah has a composite body made up of parts, u get angry and consider it an insult.
So u telling me Allah can't be in a cow dung or toilet because his eyes will see dirty poo or his nose will perceive bad odour, his brain will then send neural signals to his senses that he shouldn't be in those places because it's not dignifying for his composite body.
My friend your God has a composite body, which is like humans...whether u want to accept it or not.

The true God is a spirit, he's not bound by any human 5 senses or human characteristics of MR NIGER D. God work based on his will not by any human action or activity. He's beyond that. If God wants to be in the lowest of the lowest, he will be there, nothing can stop him, not any cow dung.
Jesus descended into the hades to snatch the key of death from the devil and declare victory over death once and for all. 1000 demons couldn't stop him. HE EMERGED VICTORIOUS.

This is what the ancients prophets has to say about God being in the lowest of places.

Isaiah 57:15
For thus says the high and exalted One, Who lives forever, whose name is Holy, “I dwell on a high and holy place, And also with the contrite and lowly of spirit. In order to revive the spirit of the lowly, And to revive the heart of the contrite.

Psalm 113:4-6
The Lord is high above all nations; His glory is above the heavens. Who is like the Lord our God, Who is enthroned on high, Who humbles Himself to behold the things that are in heaven and in the earth?

Zechariah 9.11
As for you, because of the blood of my covenant with you,
I will free your prisoners from the bottomless pit.

This is the God you should be serving, This is the God worthy of worship. A God ready to go all out for you no matter the circumstances. His presence is sure and ready for you at all time.
Not a god who's irritated by toilet or cow dung because he doesn't want his fine apparel be soiled with poo.

See how David described God- nothing can stop him when he's on the move. absolutely nothing

Psalm 24
Lift up your heads, O ye gates; and be ye lift up, ye everlasting doors; and the King of glory shall come in.
8 Who is this King of glory? The Lord strong and mighty, the Lord mighty in battle.

beardedboy:
5. You never answered any of my questions. You only did mental gymnastics that every sensible person knows lacks substance.

Mr Man I already answered your question. I'm not the one who quoted John 14.6 but if that's what u looking for, let me respond.

Jesus as the Son of God is saying he's the only way to the Father. You cannot get to the Father outside of him.
Now does this make him God?
Yes, because the Son of God is God himself. It's not about what Jesus said or did that made him God, He's God because he's the Son of God.
His personal designation (noun) is The Son of God but can also be called God because he possess the same divinity as his Father who is God.
John 1
18 No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known.
I quoted the injeel and u rejected it claiming it was written by John. So what do u want me to do?


Guy sit down and think. As u can see I deliberately didn't quote from the New testament because u will claim it's we Christians that's corrupting the word of God.
I quoted from the TANAKH from ancients Prophets who knew nothing about Christianity. But they believed and confirmed God is omnipresent.
Multiple prophets of God 1000 years apart testified and affirmed God is omnipresent. Only one prophet claimed God is not omnipresent, only one.
If u are not a Muslim, who would u think is right.
The problem is not even that this prophet denied omnipresent essence of God, he simply didn't know God is omnipresent. Muhammed didn't know other prophets said God is omnipresent.
Because he had no such knowledge, he simply fixed God in one position- above a throne.
Na so problem start

Think my friend, think.

beardedboy:
He is omnipresent with his power and knowledge. But not omnipresent in his essence.

Mind you, I clearly noticed how you shifted the debate topic again but once again I'll let you have fun with your L.

If Allah is not omnipresent, then he's not God that revealed himself to the Patriarch- Abraham, Isaac and Moses.

The God of Abraham and Moses we call Father is not Allah.

End of discussion.

I answered your question, whatever it is. Your response was U don't understand it.

beardedboy:
1. You said it's in the Qur'an but when asked for reference you're saying it's in the injeel.

2. What you have with you is the bible not the injeel revealed to Jesus. After all, the book of John you quoted was written by John not Jesus himself. And it wasn't written during Jesus' lifetime.

3. Every other thing you wrote is an epistle of nothing. Nobody with a working intellect will give it any attention.

U are too shallow for me to waste my time on ..I don't have what it takes to engage in any sound theology.


Just answer a simple question

Is Allah omnipresent?

danvon:
Chinua Achebe, failed doctor-turned-writer, well we celebrate mediocrity in this country too much.

dont ever in your life associate Chinua Achebe's work with mediocrity. u this hopeless bigot
I'm Yoruba btw

beardedboy:
What's this salad you wrote.
He is son of God and he is God. This statement defies all logic but you're a Christian so I'm not surprised.

The Qur'an explicitly condemns any insinuation of sonship for God. Stop deceiving yourself.

Well it's in the injeel so I don't know what U mean by salad, I didn't make it up- read John 1.18.

U are best ignored, But for sake of others, I will give more exegesis.

Jesus is not another God. He's simply referred to as God because he has the same divinity as his Father.
His personal designation is the Son of God.
It's the same divinity in both of them, one divinity not 2.

Let's assume the Father's divinity cease, the Son's divinity automatically disappears. The divinity in both the Son and Father is the same. THE DIVINITY IS NOT DIFFERENT.
Same as existence, the existence of father and Son is One not Two.

HOW THIS IS DIFFICULT TO COMPREHEND BY EDUCATED MIND IS WHAT I WILL NEVER UNDERSTAND.
ITS SIMPLE LOGIC.

It's one thing to reject a principle because U don't believe in it. It's another thing to lack the basic cognitive reasoning to comprehend simple things.

It's like saying the air in Sokoto is different from the air in Lagos. Air is Air my friend. Whether in kafancha or kontagura. The composition of air is the same anywhere and anytime so long as it AIR.

The problem is with the Quran.

There's a serious foundational knowledge gap in Quran which is the genesis of this unnecessary argument.

The writers of the Quran were oblivious of the omnipresent nature of God. They didn't know God can be in multiple places at the same time.

When God was described in the Quran, the writers commited a serious blunder by tying God to one location which is above his throne. This inadvertently means his divinity is fixed and immobile.

This definitely contradict the previous scriptures- both old and new testament which confirms the omnipresent nature of God and the manifestation of his divinity in multiple places at the same time.
These include

presence of God in the tabernacle,
the glory of God in the holy of holies of the Israelite temple,
The Angel of the Lord who spoke to the Patriarch including Abraham and Moses
The spirit of God as described in the tanakh and Talmud.
The One like a Son of Man who spoke to Ezekiel.
The memra of the Lord as described in the Targum scriptures.
Finally Jesus Christ who is the word of God in flesh.

It's then embarrassing to say the least that the so called final revelation had no knowledge of this attribute. It's not like the Quran denied God as omnipresent, Quran simply didn't know God is omnipresent.

This defective knowledge gap in the Quran shouldn't be overlooked but should be questioned.
This is the reasons Muslims find it difficult to conceptualise that the divinity of God can be in Jesus Christ.
This is also the reason Muslims say Allah cannot enter his creation because they are afraid if Allah does enter his creation, then his throne in heaven will be empty and abandoned.

InvertedHammer:
/
Are you living better than non-Christians?
The toothpaste you use and the Bible you hold were produced by those who just finished worshipping Buddha in his temple.

/

The way some of U reason, U go fear.
No wonder I put a brake to journey of atheism. It was too obvious it doesn't make sense.

When we tell U read the bible, Una go dey insult us. The question U posed is answered in the bible.

God is a fair God. He pours the same rain to the righteous and wicked, the same sun shines on both the righteous and wicked.

He told Israelites they should submit to the power and might of pagan Babylonia. He warned them rebelling against Babylonia would be very disastrous for them.

InvertedHammer:
/
If the story of Jesus originated from Osun or any other African state, none of you would believe it. Heck! You even believe that the story of Ifa, Ogun, Amadioha or Sango is a fairytale But Jesus(fake name by the way) is not?

The original Knights of the Christians did good jobs by forcing people to accept Christ under threats of murder. Handed down from generation to generation, it has been generally accepted as a way of life and some hold it as the absolute truth.

/

Stale. U are free to worship amadioha or Sango. Nobody stops U. It's your believe.

What we are telling U is they are false gods. It's up to U to produce evidence they are not false gods.


Christian knights forcing Christianity down throats of people is another fabulous story.

The Ethiopians already compiled their gospel called Garima at a time 90% of Europe was stark pagan.