₦airaland Forum

budaatum:
Really? How do you know this? And even though the fate of the saint and the sinner diverges right here on earth?

How can a person who disobeys the law God gave have a meaningful experience?

we are Gods breadth or spirit dwelling within a body made from dust of the earth....it is Gods spirit, it is pure and need no saving from anything...

'my spirit will not dwell permanently with man, because all is thought is that of evil....'

send forth your spirit and they shall be created and replenish the earth, take it and they die and return back to dust...(psalm 104:29-31)

budaatum:
Really? How do you know this? And even though the fate of the saint and the sinner diverges right here on earth?

How can a person who disobeys the law God gave have a meaningful experience?

is it not GOD who created us like this? with the ability and capacity to make choices...so what are we supposed to choose from?.he placed both life and death, good and evil in front of us...so we are expected to choose the one we want by ourselves...

he created everything, both good and evil....

TheSourcerer:
graduated in the 80's or 70's
Doesn't make you any more right or intelligeble
Than one born in the 20's or 90's

You are a child, just growning at different paces , children born in different times , still confused about the world they are in

in anyway you want to look at it...you are still a baby..spiritually or otherwise..

Dtruthspeaker i am still waiting for your answer, if none is forth coming, then there is nothing divine about Christianity. it is just a salad of ancient myth and stories, inc operated into a Jewish belief ..it is nothing but idolatry..run from it..

here are a few video for your viewing pleasure...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYqOCXrF9p4&t=13s


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Qx9QdCNoqc


KNOWMORW56... Watch this

Superpower:
But according to the bible God told us to kill adulterers too.Does that mean there is no way out of adultery

Whats the way out.. How can you undo what they had done?

Missyajoke:
Says who

Says God.. "Suffer not a witch to live"

Dtruthspeaker:
Glory be to God the Most High and to Our God, Jesus, the Christ, All is Proven and All I said is Established!

Somvayina is A Liar, An Impersonator and a False Prophet.

You are not a member of the Community of God Pretended and gave the impression, but you are indeed One of the False Prophets whom we have been Warned that shall come, with their Lies and False Doctrines to make the people fall into Destruction, Exactly As It Is Written

" But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.

After all said, I have seen the foundation of our differences.

The Bible to you is no different from "Chike and the River and other stories", Macbeth, the world in my pocket etc.

Therefore, as I said earlier, you do not believe in the Bible and you have now further confessed that "it is a story book".

Consequently, you are not a Christian neither should you be allowed to participate in the discussions founded on the basis that the Bible is True and Real.

Thus, our proper meeting place is only on discussions that have to with life in this world from our different Natural Grounds that we have.

You have your Natural grounds, I have mine, both are incompatible and are opposing to each other.

Your Unfounded belief is a great vexation to my soul, but I respect that It is Truly Your Natural Right to jump from a plane with no chute or to set yourself afire, or drink sniper!

And any who desires to do these things, can not be stopped by counsel.

I Rest Knowing that I have no fellowship with you and all your previous statements to the effect that you believe in God, His Knowledge and Power and His Commandments, ARE ALL LIES!

Be true to who you are and not ashamed. Confidently declare thyself, that the whole may know who you are may properly respond to you Rather Than Feigning and Pretending to be what you know people shall presume when you speak the way you do.

No long story jor, just show me from the old testament where God ask us to believe in the death of the Messiah in other to be saved.. Let me close this thread..

That is the purpose of this thread..

If not you are guilty of disobedience and idolatry.
Sincerely, I don't want to be part of it..

Brachaa:
You are the one that shouldn't delude yourself because I'm sure you don't know God says He's the head of all principalities and powers. Therefore has the power to arrest any witch and make them repent and do His biddings. Even the witches can attest to the power of God Almighty, that is why they mind those they toy with.

Go and look for the book "born twice".
I'm sure you grew up in the millennium era. If you grew up in the 90s, you would have heard of testimonies of witches who surrendered and gave their lives to Jesus.

Shalom.

LOL.. You are still a baby.. I had already graduated from university in the 90s..

So believe me when I open my mouth.... You get a stool or you sit on the ground and listen..

If there was a way out, God will not ask you to kill them..

budaatum:
It is presented the best way those who presented it understood at the time to.present it hoping you will develop the ability to understand their presentation in due time. But instead of gratitude for their bothering to write the book the best they can and placing it in your hand for you to read to understand and gain knowledge and wisdom, you can't be bothered because some lazy people just like you say you must lazily believe it, and you are saying, those who bother to read it and understand and acquire the knowledge and wisdom therein shouldn't have bothered to gain such wisdom while at the same time refusing to admit if reading said book has benefitted you or not.

What do you understand I mean by "ye, sonmvayina, shut up the kingdom of heaven against humans: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in"?

This is one of the deception of Christianity that I am talking about. We are God's breadth or spirit dwelling within a body made of dust.. When we die the breadth returns to God who gave it and the body back to dust who gave it.. Is that not why God gave us the laws so we can each and all have a meaningful human experience..the same fate awaits the sinner and Saint..

Brachaa:
They can.

Don't delude yourself... You don't know what kind of initiation ritual they do...

So believe me when I tell you, the only way out of witch craft is death..

Answer is No..

The only way out of witchcraft is death..

budaatum:
You must not understand that you are saying there was no need for more book. That all the book that was needed was the Torah, the same Torah that the Israelites use just to learn how to read the millions of other books that they write and read, which is precisely the evil that Christ was written to heal by having fantastic and fabulous stories attached to the Word of God so other Words of God can be placed in your own hands to be read so you learn and your eyes open with understanding of the immenseness of God.

But you, sonmvayina, can not be bothered, because you can not see it benefit others just as you refuse to confront yourself with the answer to the question I asked you.

I wonder why, as you will no doubt.

C.f.: https://www.nairaland.com/5978597/skepticism-vs-zombiesm-which-good/3#92124496

The gospel might contain some good advice and story I am not disproving that but why insist it was Gods plan or he is God son or messiah or sin sacrifice.. When none of these was ever prophesied by any prophet..

Why not present it like the vedas or the metu neter.... It will make more sense..

Dtruthspeaker:
Is this not Your Confession?



Re: Jesus And The New Testament : A Closer Look. by sonmvayina(m): 9:30pm On Aug 13
DappaD:


Oh so you can believe and even quote the words of a man–this emperor Julian who you're not sure existed abi? undecided

OK!

So what made you so sure that the OT isn't full of these “monstrous tales” as well? undecided undecided
If it's part of these “tales”, why believe in them since you also have no solid proof of those events which unfolded in ancient Israel?

I don't believe the story, I learn the messages in the story.. All the stories in the Bible are all lies, the letter killeth.. I learn the messages in them.. The Torah is not a history textbook.. It is a manual to guide my step. Like a lamp..
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I don't really know how to teach you again.. The stories in the Bible are not based on actual story that is not the intention of the writers, the messages in the story are true...
I concentrate on the messages the writers are passing not dwell on the story because the story is a lie..there was no Adam, Adam simply means man and eve means woman.. Ir is a retelling of an ancient Babylonian tale about how man lost the chance to live indefinitely on earth..

Do you understand now, or do I have to draw you a picture..

DappaD:
Since when did any Roman become the Messiah/Anointed One?

Since when did Romans carry out sacrifices for God?

Maximus69:
What i've noticed in him is the zeal to correct the impression of others around him but he doesn't want any specific standard so instead of asking for who are doing God's will he just want to tell everyone "i'm OK, don't come telling what to do or what not to do"

You mean I should join you to do what God NEVER COMMANDED.. And incure God's wrath with you?..

God never ask anybody to pray or go through the Messiah to get to him.. And he definitely does not require a human sacrifice hence he warned you. THOU SHALL NOT KILL.

DappaD:
Oga all these your copy and paste is not necessary.
What does Daniel 9:24-27, especially verse 27 say regarding the cessation of guilt offerings and sacrifices?

It is well explained... Read it again..

DappaD:
It's not everything you see online you copy and paste!
Imagine saying Daniel 9 is talking about two Messiah's
Are you aware of how dense you sound right now?
Crosscheck what you copy pasted and see if everything makes sense to you.

Very well, that is the response a rabbi gave me when I also inquired.... Do I have to argue with him...? Chech his response at www.aish.com.

Dtruthspeaker:
Since you say that the Bible is a Lie, you can not use a Lie to Discredit Either the Truth or a Lie!

That is the obstacle between us!

And to think of it, You, who does not Know God nor understand His Ways, is attempting to teach others about the contents of the Bible, Which you say is a lie, does that not already show that you can not found your assertion of knowledge, on the lie, that you have said that it is a lie?

You are not in a position to make your case or speak on these matters having Openly Declared that the Bible lies.

I therefore repeat, that you can not use a lie to either discredit a Truth or a lie.

Neither should you call on me to use what you have already Pre-Judged and without valid representation, a lie, to establish my position.

Same Rule Applies, "It is Not Valid To Use A Lie to Establish the Truth: They Are incompatible and it shall not stand"

I never said the Bible was a lie.. I said there was no need for the Jesus story..

Prove me wrong..

Job 34 is talking about God punishing evil, even if they hide in the dark.. Psalms are not prophecies. They are songs mostly written by David to be sung in the temple..

DappaD:
On that note, could you check whether Job 33:24, Psalms 45:7-8 and Daniel 9:24-27 are in your Bible? Let's see what we can make of it as regards the bolded.

Or you believe you can cherrypick your way out of everything?

This is a very lengthy topic, especially because those verses in Daniel are so cryptic. However, before summarizing the Jewish interpretation, I’d like to point out a few difficulties with the Christian one. First of all, the term “mashiach”, which literally means “anointed one,” is never used in the Torah in reference to the Messiah as we think of it today. That word appears 39 times in the Torah, and the intention is always for a High Priest, a King, or someone designated by God (“anointed”) for some special mission. See for example Leviticus 4:3, I Samuel 12:3, 24:6, 26:11, Psalms 20:7, Lamentations 4:20, and Isaiah 45:1.

In fact, Rabbi Tovia Singer points out that in every other place where the word “mashiach” appears in the Torah, Christian Bibles interpret it accurately as “anointed one” and only the two times that it appears here do they translate it as “the Messiah” – both with the definite article “the” in front of it (which does not appear in the Hebrew), and with the word Messiah capitalized – although Hebrew has no capital letters.

Secondly, Daniel 9 clearly speaks of two anointed people – one after 49 years (7 weeks), who will begin the rebuilding of the Second Temple. And a second after 62 weeks (434 years), when an anointed person will be cut off. The first one predates the Second Temple and clearly does not refer to Jesus.

The second anointed one, who did live around the time of Jesus, does not seem to be a very righteous person. Daniel writes that he will be “cut off” (“yikarait”). Karet, which means excision, always has a negative connotation in the Torah. It is most commonly used for the punishment of excision which one incurs for the most serious transgressions.

Daniel also states that that this mashiach will be cut off “and there will not be to him” (“v’ain lo”). It is a cryptic term, but seems to say that he will have nothing left or there will be nothing left of him. Christians interpret this expression as meaning “he will die but not for his own sake” – namely, the Messiah will die for our sins. But that is simply not what the Hebrew means.

Lastly, Christians believe that the Messiah was to be cut off in the middle of the final 7 years (the final “week” of v. 27) and at the end of that week the Temple was destined to be destroyed. But according to Christian tradition, Jesus was crucified in the early 30’s C.E. which was well over the half week (24.5 years) before the Temple’s destruction in the year 70. It is also difficult to understand when to begin the count of 490 years according to Christian interpretation. Four hundred and ninety years before Jesus’s death does not seem to correspond to any significant event, making it unclear what starting point Daniel’s vision had in mind.

To begin understanding these verses according to Jewish tradition, as always, it is important to see the verses in context. In the beginning of Chapter 9, Daniel is profoundly worried about the prophecy of Jeremiah. Jeremiah foretold that Jerusalem’s destruction would last 70 years (see Jeremiah 25:12 and 29:10). He thought the 70 years had come to an end already, and in fact the Babylonian Empire had recently been overtaken by the Persians, yet the return to Jerusalem had not occurred. He feared that they were not worthy of the prophesied redemption and that it was going to be delayed. He began fasting and praying, beseeching God for His forgiveness, until the angel Gabriel came to him and clarified the future events – when the Second Temple would be rebuilt and how long it would stand.

(In truth, the two 70’s of Jeremiah 25 and 29 were separate prophecies. Babylonia would fall 70 years after its ascension (25:12) – and this had occurred the year before the events of Daniel 9, while the return to Zion would not occur until 70 years after Jerusalem’s destruction (29:10), which occurred 18 years after Nebuchadnezzar’s ascension.)

As to the precise interpretation of the verses, there are a number of slightly different approaches among the commentators. In the interests of simplicity, I will follow primarily a single approach below.

The 490 years (70 weeks) refer to the entire time period from the destruction of the First Temple until the Destruction of the Second. Gabriel outlined this entire period to Daniel. Some explain that this was in part a response to Daniel’s anxiousness over the 70 years of Jeremiah. The angel explained that in addition to the literal 70 years of Jeremiah’s prophecy – the 70 years of punishment Israel would require before the building of the Second Temple, Jeremiah was hinting to a longer 70 – 70 weeks of years – which would be required to fully expiate the sins of the nation during the First Temple. Thus, apart from the 70 years of actual exile, there would be 490 years total in which Israel would suffer other forms of unrest and deprivation, even as the Second Temple stood (Abarbanel, Malbim).

Based on this, verse 24 states that a full 490 years would be required to completely wipe out the sins of the First Temple era. At that point, sin could be removed totally and a period of everlasting righteousness and the fulfillment of prophecy could ensue. I.e., after the full atonement of the 490 years, the Messianic era could have ensued, and the Third Temple could have been built shortly after the Second. (Sadly, though, the Jews sinned further during the Second Temple, pushing off the ultimate redemption even further away.)

Verse 25 speaks of an anointed prince appearing after 7 weeks, after which “a street and moat” will be built, standing for 62 weeks, but in troubled times. The anointed prince was Cyrus (whom God referred to as his mashiach (Isaiah 45:1)) who was to grant the Jews permission to rebuild the Temple. This occurred in the 52nd year after Jerusalem’s destruction – longer than 7 weeks, but the final fraction of a week was not counted.

As that verse continues, afterwards would commence the building of the Second Temple. That period would span in total 62 weeks = 434 years, plus the 4 years remaining from the eighth week begun before Cyrus ascended the throne. (Note that the 7+ weeks together with the 62+ total 70 full weeks.) Thus, this period would last 438 years in total – the 18 years from Cyrus’s command until the Temple was inaugurated, together with the 420 years the Second Temple stood. This, however, would be in troubled times – under the rule of the Persians, then the Greeks, and finally the Romans, with much oppression throughout.

Verse 26 describes what will happen at the time of the Second Temple’s destruction. An “anointed one” will be cut off. This either refers to King Agrippa II, the Hasmonean King at the time of the destruction, the High Priest at that time, or the notion of priesthood in general. The Temple will be utterly destroyed by the Roman legions of Vespasian and Titus (“the people of the prince”). Jerusalem will be utterly “washed away” (“its end shall come in a deluge”). And it will remain so until “the end of war” – the final battles in the time of the Messiah.

Verse 27 adds some interesting details of those final years and beyond. The Romans will make a covenant of peace with the “great ones” of Israel for the final seven years. However, they will not abide by their covenant but for the final half a week before the Temple’s destruction they will abolish the offering of sacrifices. Also, an idolatrous temple with mute abominations would later be built on the high place of the Temple (by Hadrian) – until destruction will be poured out upon all such abominations in the End of Days.

Dtruthspeaker:
I understand your query but the reason I am hesitant in supplying the answer is because I am Barred by the fact that it is already your settled belief that the Bible is lying.

And all I am going to say is contained in the Bible which you have already in the truth of your soul, ungroundedly condemned to be a lie (which of course you want it to be even though it is not).

So seeing that you have Falsely and Ungroundedly Condemned the Bible, how then shall I establish the Truth of a fact contained in the Bible, by using the same Bible which you have condemned already to establish it?

It is not possible and it shall amount to a nullity and I hate doing nullities.

It first has to be established and settled with you that the Bible tells No Lies but that it you who Lie in thinking and saying that the Bible lies.



The Prophecy, not Instruction was delivered by the Prophets, severally and continuously and you have been notified of them here, yet you disregarded them, as is within your power to do.

I have explained to you before why it is wise and proper to follow The Instruction and You Could Not Answer or Rebut. You rather resorted to ridicule and I then laid this Law.

"People resort to ridicule when they can no longer lay a valid point!"



I discredited Mohammed because I saw that he conducted himself unrighteously and The Good and Holy Lord Can Never Issue Out such unholy, unjust and unrighteous commands Neither shall the Holy God Ever Appoint an Unrighteous Person to be His Prophet.

All the True Prophets of God, Are Righteous People for the Holy, shall Do No Unrighteousness Neither Shall He Accept Any Unrighteous Person Nor Shall He Command that Any Unrighteousness, be done.

For the Kingdom of God Is Established in Righteousness and not in Unrighteousness!

And Mohammed failed in all of these things, which is why I do not and I will never follow or even listen to him!

No Sensible Person Uses a Dirty Cloth in order to
Effectively Clean a Dirty Surface. It is A Clean Wipe, that will Properly Clean a Dirty surface.

Whilst All, not some but all the Admonishings in the Bible and the Prophets Are Indeed Righteous and Good, leaving no wickedness or evil behind.

Let me quote Amos 3:7 for you "7For the Lord God does nothing unless He has revealed His secret to His servants, the prophets.. God will first of all reveal it, before it happens, if he wanted to send his son as sin sacrifice he will tell his prophet.. So it won't be a controversy..

safepaulooo:
One of such LONG HELD VIEWS...."Just a change of world". Well, agreed at death we return to DEFAULT which I call INEXISTENCE.

Gen 2 vs 7 says God blew the BREATH OF LIFE into the nostrils after forming with dust and he became a living person or soul. Eccl 12 vs 7 says when we die the dust returns back to the ground where it came from and the SPIRIT (called BREATH OF LIFE IN Gen 2 vs7) returns to the true God who GAVE it. In order words the SPIRIT in us is the BREATH OF LIFE from God. It can also be referred to as the POWER OF LIFE. It is NOT A CONSCIOUS ENTITY THAT THINKS. It came from God and returns back to him when we die. Even all animals have same (Read Eccl 3 vs 18 -20). In essence we RETURN back to how we were before being created. So ask yourself truth lover, where were you 200 years ago? That is what you RETURN to immediately after death, INEXISTENCE.

THAT WHICH DOES NOT EXIST CANNOT SUFFER PAIN OR TORTURE.

A man of knowledge spotted.

safepaulooo:
One of such LONG HELD VIEWS...."Just a change of world". Well, agreed at death we return to DEFAULT which I call INEXISTENCE.

Gen 2 vs 7 says God blew the BREATH OF LIFE into the nostrils after forming with dust and he became a living person or soul. Eccl 12 vs 7 says when we die the dust returns back to the ground where it came from and the SPIRIT (called BREATH OF LIFE IN Gen 2 vs7) returns to the true God who GAVE it. In order words the SPIRIT in us is the BREATH OF LIFE from God. It can also be referred to as the POWER OF LIFE. It is NOT A CONSCIOUS ENTITY THAT THINKS. It came from God and returns back to him when we die. Even all animals have same (Read Eccl 3 vs 18 -20). In essence we RETURN back to how we were before being created. So ask yourself truth lover, where were you 200 years ago? That is what you RETURN to immediately after death, INEXISTENCE.

THAT WHICH DOES NOT EXIST CANNOT SUFFER PAIN OR TORTURE.

A knower spotted.

budaatum:
God never instructed anyone to believe anything at all, not since Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden.


Bravo, except the "lies" bit, which is due to your misunderstanding.

The entire Bible is "a manual to guide my step. Like a lamp". It is not for believing, but for one to help one seek understanding, but your assumption of already knowing it all, which is more than you actually do know, is a barrier to your learning, which makes you a sort those who read the Gospels have read a lot about and would know you are going to Damascus to develop the abilities that will make you understand.

Hold on to your illusions.. There was never any need for the gospel..

All we need to do is set some laws and adhere to them.. So we can have a good and fruitful human experience.. And prevent chaos..

Every other thing is idolatry..

Life and death are one and the same thing.. Death is just an illusion.. Just a change of world..

This physical body was created as an abode for the spirit.. At death it returns to default..

John's Jesus did not even die... Joseph and Nicodemus brought myrrh and aloes, about a hundred pound weight.. Those herbs are used for healing.. Not for embalming..

Something to think about..

Dtruthspeaker:
There are many many Instructions and information, God our Mighty Creator has issued and passed towards man even before the Christ came.

The question is, are you bound to Obey or Listen to Any Instruction which comes from the Lord or is said to come from the Lord?

Are you bound to Obey them All or Selectively as you please?

For if you do not understand the Instruction of the Lord, how are you going to obey and keep it?

If you do not know the Lord, how are you going to Obey All His Instructions?

Or are you going to select at your will and pleasure which Instructions you are going to keep and which ones you shall dispense with, whether you know the Lord or Not?

Or are you going to altogether, dispense with the obedience to God's Instructions?

These are the Foundations of your knowledge of God which you must resolve, one way or the other depending on whether you love your soul to Acquire Life and Live or whether you do not care getting into Trouble with the Most High!

I already perceive your decision but it is for you to Always make while ye are alive, as Solomon Rghtly said Truly said,

Ecclesiastes 9:4
"For to him that is joined to all the living there is hope: for a living dog is better than a dead lion."



There many Instructions to that effect but as you already know, it is in thy power to Obey or Disobey, to Heed it or Disregard it!

My Knowing and Knowings to heed it does not obligate you to be bound by it, because whether I know or not, you have power to disregard it altogether exactly as when Moses told his brethren that He was Sent by God to them and they did not believe him nor believed God either, until Moses did something remarkable.

The people did not even really believe God and Moses for they, by their own pleasure, power and doing, greatly suffered "Momentary Belief" in God, Severally.

And Neither did God accept their kind of belief! They all died in their offences.

You are still not understanding my query, when did God ask us to give our life to the Messiah, or believe in the death of the Messiah to be saved?.

The instructions had to be given by an old testament prophet, if none said so.. Why are you blindly following what God never commanded..

How did you rule out Islam.. Muhammed could also Be right.

privaldo:
Suarez Goal!!!

Barca 2 - Bayern 4

Is this the start of a comeback.

This game is not over yet..

solite3:
Yes of course,
The queen of heaven, also known as inanna/venus is an idol

Jeremiah 44:25
Thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel, saying; Ye and your wives have both spoken with your mouths, and fulfilled with your hand, saying, We will surely perform our vows that we have vowed, to burn incense to the queen of heaven, and to pour out drink offerings unto her: ye will surely accomplish your vows, and surely perform your vows.

Exodus 20:5
Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

Psalms 96:5
For all the gods of the nations are idols: but the LORD made the heavens.

1 Corinthians 10:20
But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils.

Not necessarily an idol.. She is also known as osun in yoruba mythology...

solite3:
mary the mother of Jesus is not Lucifer.
Lucifer is a demon cast out of heaven

Lucifer is the queen of heaven.. She is venus or inanna.. Google is your friend..

One of her epithet is Mary the mother of Jesus..

According to Beyonce.. Girls..

solite3:
The Catholic Song to Lucifer
There is this prayer the Pope has called for in which all his clergy must sing a song in mass called Exultet. It is sung in Latin and its English translation is the following:


“Flaming Lucifer finds Mankind. I say: Oh Lucifer who will never be defeated. Christ is your son who came back from hell, shed his peaceful light and is alive and reigns in the world without end.”

Have I not been singing it here that Mary the mother Jesus is lucifer.. The light bearer.. The morning star..

Una dey find light.. Una know no say light dey blind person eye too..