₦airaland Forum

truthislight:
Here we go, the link below is a thread that handled all those Scriptures and beyond, feel free to proceed there and refute the evidences:


https://www.nairaland.com/1446860/archangel-michael-jesus-christ/12#1830555

You have been directed to a thread where your worries was addressed, but since you don't learn very fast, you are still here posting those.

Since the thread is there, go read it up, one cannot be repeating himself every now and then because of your not learning easily.

This is not a matter of desperation, relaxed, chill. the Bible calls Jesus a messenger.

Your lack of proper comprehension or misunderstanding/misapplication of those Scriptures does not change what the Bible says.

johnw74:
you are so confused, being a messenger doesn't necessarily make one an angel
and you don't believe the verses posted showing that Jesus Christ was not an angel
and you don't believe scriptures showing that Jesus Christ is God, but change those scriptures, at your-jw's grave peril



pharacee hypercrite

But Malachi even Called Jesus Angel nah!

It calls him the Messenger of the covenant/Angel of the covenant, depending on the translation you use.

Sorry, the issue here is not me or the Bible, but rather, your long cherished tradition that is the problem.

anyway,

Peace.

What was this all about if not a struggling to find a means of denying that Jesus continued with the work of a messenger even while back to heaven?

Why was Rev. 1:1 quoted by me if not to show that Jesus continued doing errands even when he was elevated and back in heaven?

What is the reason for the below struggling if not to refute what is written in Rev.1:1?

johnw74:
Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

God gave Jesus Christ a revelation, and Jesus Christ sent it by His Angel



Jesus Angel was talking to John:
Rev 1:12 And I turned to see the voice that spake with me. And being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks;
Rev 1:13 And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man,

Jesus is the Son of man
Jesus Angel is not the Son of man,
Jesus Angel is one like unto the Son of man.

You really need to free yourself.

I have simply allowed the Bible to speak here, but you, yes you, not wanting to hear that Jesus is a messenger of Yahweh have been undergoing serious heart ache.

You even forgot that the word Angel mean messenger and the word messenger means Angel.

With turmoil, you have come round to say that Jesus is a messenger, but in your confused state, said Jesus is not an Angel. Lol.

johnw74:
you are so confused, being a messenger doesn't necessarily make one an angel

How can that ^ be? seeing that the Word Messenger=Angel and Angel = messenger?

SMH. you really need to cool down and think properly be for you make statement henceforth.

johnw74:
Duh, I will tell you what you think an Angel is,
you think an Angel is a messenger, and that's it

Angels are much more than messengers,
Angels are God's warriors, they perform God's Judgments
and they do whatever God wants of them
Angels are not humans, Angels are not God
the Word Jesus Christ created the Angels, of which lucifer was the most brilliant
and probably the first of Jesus creations



In Exodus it is the angel of the Lord of course, that from the front led them
in 1 Corinthians the rock is Christ that followed them
by your question you didn't know them simple facts



I have told you before that I don't discuss with those who don't believe the Bible
and who change what it says

have discussions with your fellow sectarian non believers,
you and me, a Christian are like chalk and cheese.



I

From your post, Jesus the rock followed the Nation of Israel, who sent him?.
He sent himself?

Well, even when he was elevated on going back to heaven, he was still going on errands to Yahweh, So, it is obvious who sent Jesus to follow the Nation of Israel in the wilderness then, doing the work of a messenger.

If you wish, keep living in denial

Peace though.

truthislight:
Here we go, the link below is a thread that handled all those Scriptures and beyond, feel free to proceed there and refute the evidences:


https://www.nairaland.com/1446860/archangel-michael-jesus-christ/12#1830555

Do proceed to the above thread if you have anything to offer.

Peace.

johnw74:
Talk about dishonest heart, jw doesn't believe the bible and change what is says

Rev 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

God gave Jesus Christ a revelation, and Jesus Christ sent it by His Angel



Jesus Angel was talking to John:
Rev 1:12 And I turned to see the voice that spake with me. And being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks;
Rev 1:13 And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man,

Jesus is the Son of man
Jesus Angel is not the Son of man,
Jesus Angel is one like unto the Son of man.

OK, I see. you can run along now.

You must have a terrible conscience. You are saying that Jesus at Rev. 1:1 is not doing the work of a messenger. Suit yourself.

You are telling us that the message that God gave to Jesus to show to his slaves magically went to the Angel without Jesus transferring it over, forming a chain of messengers. Keep deceiving your self.

But we can all See what the Bible says there clearly..

We can also see clearly who is denying what the Bible says now.

Unfortunately, here is not your church that you cajole and compel people to belief a lie. You can't hoodwinked any body here online,.What is written at Rev. 1:1 is written.

Peace.

johnw74:
You must either, don't believe those Bible verses, or change what they say,
to believe what you say.

The writer of Hebrews made it clear that Father God never said "thou art my Son" to an Angel
Father God never said "sit at my right hand" to an Angel.
Father God, calls the Son "God"

You agree with a dictionary that Angel means merssenger
and you disagree with the Bible(Hebrews) that Jesus Christ is not an Angel.






1. satan was made more brilliant than any other Angel
it's highly likely he was an arch Angel.

2. There are many Bible verses showing Jesus Christ is the exact image of Father God.

Here we go, the link below is a thread that handled all those Scriptures and beyond, feel free to proceed there and refute the evidences:


https://www.nairaland.com/1446860/archangel-michael-jesus-christ/12#1830555

However, if there is anyone that so wish to discuss on Jesus being the Archangel, there is a thread that this issue was extensively discussed, I will gladly send the link to the person to proceed hence and refute the evidences there.

peace.

MuttleyLaff:
I however am curious to know what your take is on the word GOD
What is your understanding of what the word GOD means
and/or what the word, GOD is all about?

Good day @Muttleylaff.

As much as I do wish to give an answer to the above question, I am keenly aware that it may derail this thread, hence, I beg to withhold my comment for now.

While reading through your post, I observed that you and the OP have arrived at the same conclusion as to the fact that the lack of a direct reference to Satan as an Angel in the Bible is no hindrance to drawing the conclusion that he was formerly an Angel(a messenger).based on the available evidence.

So then, why is the absence of a direct reference to Jesus as an Angel a hindrance in deducing from the abundance of Bible passages that the Entity Arc'Angel' mentioned in the Bible is same person Jesus. Considering the fact that they both have/share similar responsibilities. (almost all the task assigned to Jesus are the same things that Angel Michael will/assigned to do also).

So, the thread's argument is this: Why is it allowable to see a parallel from the Bible and deduced that Satan was an Angel though no direct reference to him being such was made and the same deductions can not be made to deduce that Jesus was an Angel/messenger and is still doing the work of messenger down till this day ?

On going back to heaven he continued going on arrand for the father:

Revelation 1:1.

A revelationa by Jesus Christ, which God gave him, to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place. And he sent his angel and presented it in signs through him to his slave John.
..........................................................

NB: Even the act of Christ rulership as king on going back to heaven is still an assignment by Yahweh, A message, while a king, he will carry out certain assignment.

So, Your critical mind has lay to rest a fact inherent in the bible that some dishonest heart finds difficult to say, owing to strongly held notion and tradition.

Thank you.

Peace.

MuttleyLaff:
Re-read the topic yourself, then follow how the original post was broken down with my relevant responses about what ANGEL is really about or what it means, before asking about the word GOD, as the original post obviously has a misconceived idea of what the word God means or is, which is why angel and God is "abused" in the original post.

Here(in Nairaland), we do appreciate evidence, like quoting what you are referring to to buttress your point and drive home your msg, hence, our minds will not be running halter skelter.

So, where does the above referenced abuse mentioned by you took place?

plappville:
You can call it whatever u like. I dont have time to discuss with you. All you do is insult people whenever catholic is discussed. I dont know if you are a pope self.

italo:

Sorry ma, if you feel offended.

"Misrepresentation" is not an insult.

It simply means that another meaning was given to what the Pope said...other than the true meaning.

Hmmmmm! Why am I surprised! Well, wonders they say shall never end.

One of such will be seeing a polite Italo. OK.

That is, if the love for Yahweh is their interest, and not just what they will get from God, then they will consider his interest.

frosbel:
Well said !

But my question to the religious is this : can one take a contrary position to the pastor of a church and still be correct or is the church/pastor the final authority on all doctrinal matters ?

As long as there is no contrary evidence from the Bible to what you have, you stick with the Bible.

No man or pastor can reward himself with eternal life, let alone reward another person.

As long you keep on seeking, knocking and there is no contrary evidence, why should one leave the msg from God the giver of life to accept the one from a Man, be it a pastor or Pope ?

"If a blind man leads a blind man, they both will fall into a pit", the Bible says.

The only source of light is the word of God. it should not be left for any other thing. any other thing aside the Bible, the written word of God will mean grouping in darkness.

frosbel:
But what if what I heard from God is different to what you heard and we then go off on two different tangents with respect to a particular doctrine , how do we know which one is the right one ?

So, God talks to you literally ?

JMAN05:
Neither have we claimed that a dubious person can't fabricate a story and include it in his copy of the bible.

Don't forget the op's point, an error or fabrication making the entire work false. If that was so, Plato's works are all false. Think.

If without the autograph, you view Plato's works as being his, why the noise about the bible? Did those fabricated works crumble the real ones?

Thank you @Jman.

Your whole argument is legit.

Peace.

How can @Jman05 be the silly person from the below lines of responses:

plaetton:

To boast that the original does not contain fabrications, you would need to show the original. Not so?
So, have you ever seen the original bible, and, where is it?

If you have neither seen nor can produce the original bible, directly inspired by god, then your arguments are null and void.,, just the same ol "make-it-up-as-you-go" worldviews that we have been used to.

JMAN05:
The piltdown man didn't get u thinking?

You can present us with the original copies of Plato's writings, let's know which one is truly spurious.

You tell us why you scientist use his work when there is no autograph and when fabrication of his works exists?

plaetton:

You're getting silly here.

This op is not about pluto's writings. I never said, nor have I heard that pluto's writings are the infallible truths inspired by god.

Why are you being so shifty?

Focus on the issue.

The above is a classic example why your lot has a standing tag by the psamist.

keep wallowing.

JMAN05:
The piltdown man didn't get u thinking?

You can present us with the original copies of Plato's writings, let's know which one is truly spurious.

You tell us why you scientist use his work when there is no autograph and when fabrication of his works exists?

Any book that he has ever red that has error is invalid.

forgetting that humans are allowed to express their freewill and hence will be judge based on that.

If the hands of all evil men on earth were held back from carrying out evil, then, all of mankind would have been perfect. but No. every man is allowed to show by his actions what sort of person he is.

why then should someone that wishes to alter God's word be prevented from doing so while the murderer next door was allowed to kill ?

meanwhile, the both of them will be judge by their deeds. is that not partiality?

plaetton:
To boast that the original does not contain fabrications, you would need to show the original. Not so?
So, have you ever seen the original bible, and, where is it?

If you have neither seen nor can produce the original bible, directly inspired by god, then your arguments are null and void.,, just the same ol "make-it-up-as-you-go" worldviews that we have been used to.

Yeah! yes, just like you showed us 'Big Bang' evidence on the 31st of Dec. last year as evidence for your belief.. SMH foy you.

plaetton:
Pls kindly present us with the original version of the bible, that way, we can dispel and dispense with the erroneous Versions forthwith.

Till then, the bible cannot be relied upon as an arbiter of any truth.
Simple.

Continue remaining, and keeping yourself in your comfort zone and continue 'imagining' that the world starts and end with what you think and know.

what can I tell you? you that knows all ?

plaetton:
First, if there is even one fabrication in the bible, it Proves that bible is definitely not the truthful words of god.
And if so, then it is not a reliable arbiter of truth nor of reality.

Therefore, once You find one fabrication, then the entire edifice of faith begins to crumble.

Yeah! in your world, if you are a CEO, you dictated a msg to your Secretary to a media house, and the secretary or the press, along the process deliberately or by omissions, or error, added or subtracted some part of your msg, that should automatically makes you a liar.

have you seen your life and reasoning ?

if you subsequently, over time published a rejoinder to that effect, No! you must be tagged a liar to suit the ulterior motive of your detractors, owing to that initial action. I hope you will be very happy if you were the CEO.

some of us are not like you you know ?

Image123:
They get destroyed again.

Lol.

Image123:
where would the sinner perish if not in hell?

So, what happens when Hell again is thrown into the lake of fire if those in there are there to be burn in fire ?