Tithes And Offerings - Religion (120) - Nairaland
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"Stop Giving Offerings In Redeemed Churches If....." - Pastor Adeboye / Tithes And Offerings Are Eternal Principles / Give Your 'Tithes' And Offerings To The Less Fortunate In Church (2) (3) (4)
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| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Image123(m): 9:35pm On Jul 31, 2014 |
DrummaBoy: Amennnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn, lol. Hope it's not on health grounds sha or doctor's advice? Keep to your words oh, you sabi contradict yourself and rush talk you know. And don't be 'keeping malice' with someone like me, my Father no dey take am funny. justsaying# |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Candour(m): 10:11pm On Jul 31, 2014 |
Image123: The likes of Goshen, Drumb, Candor etc avoided that my long post up there like a plague. Before that, they were all over me like flies until i took some time and space to talk. They'll come in future some pages away or some other thread asking what they should learn here and keep to memory, and blame me for not being interested in the charade. So predictable they leave no room for the precious gift of prophecy. Haba!! Bro image, your long post lacked any substance. Full of words but empty on truth. It answered no question.....as usual but don't worry. I won't blame you again for not being interested. You have every right not to be. However whenever you develop interest again, those unanswered questions will be waiting. Cheers bro. 2 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Image123(m): 11:03pm On Jul 31, 2014 |
Candour: ALL your questions have being answered Candor. Perhaps you were not paying attention or you refused to see them. Please do post your questions again, i'd like to incorporate them with the other ones i'm considering, thanks. Also since you say my long post was devoid of truth, please point out at least three lies there. |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Candour(m): 7:26am On Aug 01, 2014 |
Image123: No my friend. You and I have a long history on tithe discussions and the threads are there for folks to see. We had a 58 day discussion on this same issue some months ago. Believe it when I say I'm not interested in convincing you to change your position because most likely, you won't. You can also conclude same about me and you won't be wrong. You can see then that a discussion on tithe between you and I will be an exercise in futility. What will we talk about that we've not talked about before? That said, there are a lot of questions that tithe promoters can't answer honestly but I believe honest seekers of truth will ponder and wish to find answers to them. My resolve henceforth then is to show up with some of these questions in any thread where I see the progenitors trying to pull the wool over the eyes of brethren who have not being able to study their bibles properly. I'll post some of those questions shortly. Cheers bro 2 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Candour(m): 8:19am On Aug 01, 2014 |
Some truths we can comfortably accept based on our knowledge of the bible. Jesus never collected tithe as he wasn't a levite, neither did he pay tithe as he was a carpenter and much later; an itinerant preacher. The bible records him as living on freewill donations. Did he break the law so doing? The apostles never collected tithe because none was a levite working at the temple neither did they pay tithe because none was a farmer and even if they were, after their call by Christ, they became itinerant preachers like him and also lived off the bag of freewill donations and free meals from generous folks. Did they fail God so doing? The early church never paid tithes to the apostles neither did the apostles demand tithes from anybody. Folks who had gave willingly and freely to a common fund and it was used strictly to cater for the needs of those in need: they had all things common. Are they sinners for not tithing? When Paul came on the scene, he continued the same process of collecting freewill donations from Christians that had to succour those that didn't have. It was freewill with no stipulated percentages. Did the gentile church sin by not paying tithes to Paul? The Jewish temple was destroyed in 70AD when general Titus overran Jerusalem hence preventing the Jews, for whom tithe laws were instituted from observing it till this day. When then did tithing enter the picture as a cardinal christian doctrine? Catholic history has it that tithing for the Christian church was first mooted at a council in 585AD before becoming canon law in 787AD: over 700 years after the birth of the church and even then, it remained strictly farm and animal produce according to the dictates of the Mosaic law setting it up. Does it mean all the Christians that lived in that era including the apostles are doomed to eternal damnation because they didn't tithe? (If some prominent tithe pastors are to be believed). What do tithe promoters know today that the early Christians didn't? Consider also that the catholic church that imposed it on Christians have even retraced their steps and now advocate freewill giving. 6 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Candour(m): 8:42am On Aug 01, 2014 |
Most tithe preachers hammer on Malachi 3:8-11as if that is the only portion of scripture that talks about tithing but worse is the fact that they make it look like that is the portion of scripture where God gave the tithe laws. Prophet Malachi did not institute the tithe laws. He only wrote a reminder of the tithe laws God gave Moses for the children of Isreal and these laws can be found in the following scriptures Lev 27:30-34 Num 18:21-32 Deut 14:22-29, Deut 26:12-15 A reminder was given when the Israelites came back from captivity by Nehemiah even before Malachi Nehemiah 10:37-39 A honest seeker would endeavour to do a study of those listed scriptures and ponder on them. 6 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by MarkMiwerds(m): 3:18pm On Aug 01, 2014 |
From my Blog, boldproclaimer.: (slightly tweaked) Do It By The Book by Ronald W Robey Leviticus 10:1-2 And Nadab and Abihu, the sons of Aaron, took either of them his censer, and put fire therein, and put incense thereon, and offered strange fire before the LORD, which he commanded them not. And there went out fire from the LORD, and devoured them, and they died before the LORD. In the above text, two of Aaron’s sons were struck dead because they offered “strange fire” to God upon the altar of the Lord. What exactly was this “strange fire” that they offered that so displeased the Lord? We are not told. But we are given a special insight as to how precise God wants our offerings to Him be. Nadab and Abihu had offered something that God had not commanded. Now, one would think, “Hey, at least they were offering something to God. What wrong can be in that?” But God said they offered something that was not commanded. A lesson should be learned by all from the reading of the account of Nadab and Abihu. That lesson is, “Do It By The Book”. God has given us His Word as an instruction manual. This “manual” tells us what God expects of us as His dear children. If we are disobedient, God’s chastening hand will be upon us. Is surely was upon Nadab and Abihu when they offered strange fire upon the altar. The manner in which we are to live is laid out for us in the New Testament section of the Holy Bible. Now, please don’t go off on a tangent, saying I don’t like the Old Testament. I do. I cherish both the Old and the New. I read them both and learn from the both. But the fact is, the New contains the pattern by which God wants us to live today. Hebrews 8 tells us that in AD 66 the Old Covenant was ready to pass away and that God was bringing us into a New Covenant. We cannot live in the Old Covenant promises, curses, edicts, laws, statutes, and ordinances. God doesn’t expect us to. In AD 51, the Apostles met in Jerusalem with the religious leaders of the day. Their order of meeting was to discuss Gentiles who had been recently converted to faith in Christ. The religious leaders of Jerusalem were insisting that the Gentiles had to keep the Law of Moses or they could not be saved. Peter spoke before them all, rebuking them for placing a yoke upon the Gentile Brethren that neither the Jews of that day, nor their ancestors could keep themselves. Peter told them they were tempting God in their demands. At the close of the meeting, the Apostle James wrote a letter to the Gentile Believers and sent it to them in the hands of Paul and Barnabas, telling the Gentiles that the Apostles had given no such command that they keep the Law. He also sent Judas and Silas with the same words, but not written… they were to speak to the Gentiles, telling them that they were not commanded to keep the Mosaic Law. The Mosaic Law was part of an Old Covenant that was soon to pass away. It was given to the Israelites living in the promised land. In many Churches around the world today, there is a doctrine being taught that could be called “strange fire”. That doctrine is the monetary tithe requirement doctrine. Pastors will stand in their pulpits and preach from the Old Covenant the command to tithe that was given to Israel. But, they replace the tithe God commanded, an agricultural tithe, with a tithe consisting of money. It no longer is the tithe that God required of Israel. It has become “strange fire.” No longer the agricultural tithe that was commanded by God for the children of Israel in Mount Sinai, (Leviticus 27:30-34) it is now a monetary tithe. No longer a tithe that was to be given to Levites, to widows, to orphans, to strangers in Israel, (Numbers 18:21,24,26,28; Deuteronomy 14:22-29; Nehemiah 10:37-38) it is now given to pastors of Churches around the world. The “tithes” were good when God had control of them, but modern-day Nahab’s, modern-day Abihu’s have turned them into a “strange fire” which God never commanded. He is the same yesterday, today, and forever. Many pastors today are tempting God and putting a yoke upon their congregations that God never authorized them to do. Search the Scriptures. When you do, you will find that God’s holy tithe was never carried to the Church, never commanded of the Church, and never controlled by the Church. Pastors would do well to set aside this sin of preaching a strange fire and offering it to God in the Sunday prayers. Seek out what the New Covenant says concerning the saved and their giving. They are not to be coerced into giving, they are not to be made to fear a curse from God. Rather, they should be taught to give simply because “they love Jesus.” Teach them as the Apostle Paul taught the saints and brethren at the Church in Corinth… as they purpose in their hearts to give, give cheerfully and willingly God will be honored more by a loving offering than by “strange fire” Do it by the Book People, If you insist that God requires you to tithe, that you are being obedient to God and His Holy Word, at least have the decency and respect for God and His Holy Word to do it in accordance to what He has written in His Holy Word. When you tithe, don’t take it to a Church in a Gentile land. God never commanded such. Instead, do it by the book, as God commanded, and take it to the Promised Land. ( Deut. 12:1,10-11 ) When you tithe, don’t give it to a Gentile preacher. God never commanded that. Instead, do it by the book, as God commanded, and take it to the Levite, the widow, the orphan and the stranger (which would include yourself) in the Promised Land. ( Deut 14:22-29 ) When you tithe, don’t tithe money. God never commanded such a tithe. Instead, do it by the book, as God commanded, and tithe agricultural products that are grown in the Promised Land. ( Leviticus 27:30-33) If you insist on tithing, don’t tithe that which comes from Gentile hands on Gentile soil. God never commanded it. Instead, do it by the book, as God commanded, and move to the Promised land Israel so you can cultivate the land and have the tithe that God required in the Mosaic Law. But remember… .Galatians 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. If you are not going to “Do It By The Book”, don’t try to convince me that you are being obedient to God in tithing. It is just the opposite… you are being rebellious to what He had stated concerning how His Holy tithe was to be observed and kept. 4 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Image123(m): 10:24pm On Aug 03, 2014 |
Candour:You are one funny fellow you know? So after haranguing me all the while for my loss of interest in tithe talk WITH the usual suspects, i then succumb to your yearnings only for you to tell me what i have being telling you all these while. BTW, are these the touted unanswered questions? Jesus never collected tithe as he wasn't a levite, neither did he pay tithe as he was a carpenter and much later; an itinerant preacher. The bible records him as living on freewill donations. Did he break the law so doing?Some fallacious questions, none the less, you will be answered AGAIN. Jesus didn't collect tithes physically as man because there were temple workers in place for that. He submitted to that. However, He collected it from ages as God so your point is mute. If anyone didn't bring the tithe when Jesus was on earth, he was deemed as robbing God i.e Jesus. About Jesus paying tithe, that as being told you before na. It cannot be established as a matter of fact, one can only assume that. Scribes paid tithes, pharisees paid tithes. It was no big deal for non full time farmers to have land or farms or harvest for instance. The Bible does not record ALL that Jesus did. i hope you know that He must have given animal offerings and sacrifices even though not recorded? Joh 21:25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen. Heb 8:4 For if he were on earth, he should not be a priest, seeing that there are priests that offer gifts according to the law: The apostles never collected tithe because none was a levite working at the temple neither did they pay tithe because none was a farmer and even if they were, after their call by Christ, they became itinerant preachers like him and also lived off the bag of freewill donations and free meals from generous folks. Did they fail God so doing?The apostles never collected tithe because none was a levite working at the temple, very correct. At least when they became apostles, i can't say for certain if anyone of them was a levite though. i however agree with the bolded point. You can't say for sure that they did not pay tithe on the same basis i gave above about Jesus or any Israelite. Even old testament prophets like Elijah, Daniel and co did not receive tithe, it was not their calling, so i don't get where you came up with the concept of failing God for not collecting tithe. The early church never paid tithes to the apostles neither did the apostles demand tithes from anybody. Folks who had gave willingly and freely to a common fund and it was used strictly to cater for the needs of those in need: they had all things common. Are they sinners for not tithing?The early church didn't have to tithe to the church for two obvious reasons. - They gave far above 10% to the church. Logic simply follows that if i am depositing 100% or something close to 100% with you or anyone, you/recipient should not be asking me where is 10%. If i earn 10,000rupees and i give my family 10,000rupees or even 5,000rupees, it becomes insane for them to ask me for 1,000rupees, i already give far above. Act 2:44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common; Act 2:45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need. 2Co 9:1 For as touching the ministering to the saints, it is superfluous for me to write to you: - Many of the jews among them were zealous of the law still, meaning they probably gave a tenth at the temple to the same God. The real question here should be "Are we sinners for tithing?" We both know that Paul and many of the early church were REGULAR at the temple, even bringing offerings and observing temple rites. Act 2:46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart, Act 3:1 Now Peter and John went up together into the temple at the hour of prayer, being the ninth hour. Act 5:20 Go, stand and speak in the temple to the people all the words of this life. Act 5:42 And daily in the temple, and in every house, they ceased not to teach and preach Jesus Christ. Act 21:20 And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law: Act 21:26 Then Paul took the men, and the next day purifying himself with them entered into the temple, to signify the accomplishment of the days of purification, until that an offering should be offered for every one of them. Act 6:7 And the word of God increased; and the number of the disciples multiplied in Jerusalem greatly; and a great company of the priests were obedient to the faith. Please present the full truth, Goshen has told us that half truths are like lies. One can give 10% every month or year as a freewill donation anywhere, i do it and other stipulated percentages. i do the stipulation duh. 1Co 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come. (GNB) Every Sunday EACH OF YOU MUST put aside some money, IN PROPORTION TO what you have earned, and save it up, so that there will be no need to collect money when I come. The Jewish temple was destroyed in 70AD when general Titus overran Jerusalem hence preventing the Jews, for whom tithe laws were instituted from observing it till this day. Tithing does not have to be a law, like prayers it can be by grace. Abraham my daddy demonstrated that  When then did tithing enter the picture as a cardinal christian doctrine? Catholic history has it that tithing for the Christian church was first mooted at a council in 585AD before becoming canon law in 787AD: over 700 years after the birth of the church and even then, it remained strictly farm and animal produce according to the dictates of the Mosaic law setting it up. Does it mean all the Christians that lived in that era including the apostles are doomed to eternal damnation because they didn't tithe? (If some prominent tithe pastors are to be believed). Tithing should not be, sorry NEVER be a cardinal christian doctrine. Heck, even under the law, it was not considered a weighty matter like judgement, faith and mercy were.(cf Matthew 23:23) Perhaps those fellows in history had their priorities misplaced, i guess the Dark Ages affected them adversely  i believe the Bible, plus i have yet to hear ANY prominent pastor say that folks are doomed to eternal damnation because they didn't tithe. IF they say so, i believe they are wrong as the Bible doesn't say so. i'm not the Judge anyway, neither are they. 1Co 4:5 Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God. What do tithe promoters know today that the early Christians didn't? Consider also that the catholic church that imposed it on Christians have even retraced their steps and now advocate freewill giving.Google, Wiki and BBC. Heb 8:13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away. The early church was in limbo as it were, the temple was there and the church was there, the levites were LEGALLY there and so were the pastors. The temple guys vanished in 70AD or so you said, making way for the New where there is STILL the service of the tabernacle of the congregation. That was one reason the tenth was for. Most tithe preachers hammer on Malachi 3:8-11as if that is the only portion of scripture that talks about tithing but worse is the fact that they make it look like that is the portion of scripture where God gave the tithe laws.i don't listen to 'most tithe preachers', i listen to the Bible, the complete Bible. i encourage you to do same. Heb 13:7 Keep in mind those who were over you, and who gave you the word of God; seeing the outcome of their way of life, let your faith be like theirs. Heb 13:8 Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and for ever. (BBE) Prophet Malachi did not institute the tithe laws. He only wrote a reminder of the tithe laws God gave Moses for the children of Isreal and these laws can be found in the following scripturesTeachings, doctrines and knowledge of Scriptures are to be taken CUMULATIVELY. That is, in its wholeness, totality, ALL Scriptures, EVERY Word. Doctrine is not to be formed from just one particular chapter or part of the Bible, but the bringing together of its teachings and references from the whole complete Bible. This is one sure way to maintain balance, proper context, right perspective and truth. What the Bible teaches about tithes is an accumulation, especially from all the passages that refer to it. Would that be all Candour? Like was stated earlier, ALL these have already being answered before, nothing new there. You may not LIKE or AGREE to our answers but it is misinformation and a lie to state that folks are running away from your questions or avoiding them. 1 Like |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Candour(m): 7:09am On Aug 04, 2014 |
Image123: You're one clownish fellow you know? So after telling you a number of times that I'm not interested in getting you interested again in tithe discussions, you succumb to your innate inclination to twist scriptures and bend biblical events out of shape then turn round and blame me for your inability to remain true to your resolve? How childish? Anyway I'm happy I gave you an excuse to indulge once again in your favourite enjoyment: twisting scriptures to your satisfaction. You and I have had so many debates, discussions and arguments on tithes so much so that its an exercise in futility to attempt a correction of each others mindset. My interest is on genuine truth seekers on this issue and I'll keep posting questions and perspectives to sharpen their curiosity and get their consciences pricked. For readers, below are some threads where we all have had opportunity to write epistles on the tithe matter. I'll post more as I remember them https://www.nairaland.com/1548047/theological-discuss-tithing-rhymeyjohn-image123 https://www.nairaland.com/1456343/tithes-offerings-eternal-principles https://www.nairaland.com/1430102/old-vs-new-covenant-revelation |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Candour(m): 8:12am On Aug 04, 2014 |
Some verses in the bible having something to do with tithes Genesis 14:20 KJV And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And he gave him tithes of all. The below tell us what Abraham tithed from. No ambiguity. Hebrews 7:4 KJV Now consider how great this man was , unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils. Below is the second place in scripture where we encounter tithe even if it was simply called a tenth. Jacob made a vow to give a tenth to God if God fulfills a request he made. He was obeying no law because no law was given. He made a voluntary vow which wasn't binding on even his immediate children. It was a strictly personal decision. Genesis 28:20-22 KJV And Jacob vowed a vow, saying, If God will be with me, and will keep me in this way that I go, and will give me bread to eat, and raiment to put on, [21] So that I come again to my father's house in peace; then shall the Lord be my God: [22] And this stone, which I have set for a pillar, shall be God's house: and of all that thou shalt give me I will surely give the tenth unto thee. Here's the third place where tithe was mentioned and we see it made an inviolable law for Isreal and clearly from farm and animal produce. Leviticus 27:30-34 KJV And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the Lord's : it is holy unto the Lord . [31] And if a man will at all redeem ought of his tithes, he shall add thereto the fifth part thereof. [32] And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passeth under the rod, the tenth shall be holy unto the Lord . [33] He shall not search whether it be good or bad, neither shall he change it: and if he change it at all, then both it and the change thereof shall be holy; it shall not be redeemed. [34] These are the commandments, which the Lord commanded Moses for the children of Israel in mount Sinai. Below is the fourth place tithe is mentioned in scripture and we see God transfer the tithes to the levites who had the sacred charge of the temple and served the Aaronic priesthood. The caveat: relinquishing their rights to any inheritance in Isreal Numbers 18:24 KJV But the tithes of the children of Israel, which they offer as an heave offering unto the Lord , I have given to the Levites to inherit: therefore I have said unto them, Among the children of Israel they shall have no inheritance. Below God further shared the tithes between the levites and the priests. The priests (Aaron and his descendants) got a tenth of the tithes while the levites kept nine-tenth of the tithe Numbers 18:26-28 KJV Thus speak unto the Levites, and say unto them, When ye take of the children of Israel the tithes which I have given you from them for your inheritance, then ye shall offer up an heave offering of it for the Lord , even a tenth part of the tithe. [27] And this your heave offering shall be reckoned unto you, as though it were the corn of the threshingfloor, and as the fulness of the winepress. [28] Thus ye also shall offer an heave offering unto the Lord of all your tithes, which ye receive of the children of Israel; and ye shall give thereof the Lord's heave offering to Aaron the priest. We see another mention of tithes below where the Israelites are clearly asked to bring their tithes, burnt offerings etc to eat before the Lord (obviously at the temple in Jerusalem). Once again clearly edibles. Deuteronomy 12:6-7 KJV And thither ye shall bring your burnt offerings, and your sacrifices, and your tithes, and heave offerings of your hand, and your vows, and your freewill offerings, and the firstlings of your herds and of your flocks: [7] And there ye shall eat before the Lord your God, and ye shall rejoice in all that ye put your hand unto, ye and your households, wherein the Lord thy God hath blessed thee. In the same chapter as above, we see God continue with instructions on the tithe to the Israelites. We see him command that they MUST eat their tithes in the place designated. Once again clearly food items. Deuteronomy 12:11-12, 17-18 KJV Then there shall be a place which the Lord your God shall choose to cause his name to dwell there; thither shall ye bring all that I command you; your burnt offerings, and your sacrifices, your tithes, and the heave offering of your hand, and all your choice vows which ye vow unto the Lord : [12] And ye shall rejoice before the Lord your God, ye, and your sons, and your daughters, and your menservants, and your maidservants, and the Levite that is within your gates; forasmuch as he hath no part nor inheritance with you. [17] Thou mayest not eat within thy gates the tithe of thy corn, or of thy wine, or of thy oil, or the firstlings of thy herds or of thy flock, nor any of thy vows which thou vowest, nor thy freewill offerings, or heave offering of thine hand: [18] But thou must eat them before the Lord thy God in the place which the Lord thy God shall choose, thou, and thy son, and thy daughter, and thy manservant, and thy maidservant, and the Levite that is within thy gates: and thou shalt rejoice before the Lord thy God in all that thou puttest thine hands unto. When last did you hear a message from these portions of scripture in your church? 2 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Candour(m): 8:58am On Aug 04, 2014 |
We see God ask the israelites to tithe the increase of their farm and animal produce. If any Israelite was involved in any of these trades, then they had to obey this injunction. The command was for them to EAT their tithe at a feast at the temple. Deuteronomy 14:22-23 KJV Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed, that the field bringeth forth year by year. [23] And thou shalt eat before the Lord thy God, in the place which he shall choose to place his name there, the tithe of thy corn, of thy wine, and of thine oil, and the firstlings of thy herds and of thy flocks; that thou mayest learn to fear the Lord thy God always. If the temple was too far to carry the tithe of that years increase, then and only then could they monetise it on the condition that they buy back edibles when they got to the holy city. The tithe was strictly for eating. Nothing more, nothing less. Deuteronomy 14:24-26 KJV And if the way be too long for thee, so that thou art not able to carry it; or if the place be too far from thee, which the Lord thy God shall choose to set his name there, when the Lord thy God hath blessed thee: [25] Then shalt thou turn it into money, and bind up the money in thine hand, and shalt go unto the place which the Lord thy God shall choose: [26] And thou shalt bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, for oxen, or for sheep, or for wine, or for strong drink, or for whatsoever thy soul desireth: and thou shalt eat there before the Lord thy God, and thou shalt rejoice, thou, and thine household, Every three years, ALL THE TITHES of that year (including the one tithe merchants have cunningly appropriated to themselves) were to be strored in the towns by the tither and used purely for the purposes of charity. If they didn't do this, obviously God would withhold his blessings from them according to the bolded portion. Deuteronomy 14:28-29 KJV At the end of three years thou shalt bring forth all the tithe of thine increase the same year, and shalt lay it up within thy gates: [29] And the Levite, (because he hath no part nor inheritance with thee,) and the stranger, and the fatherless, and the widow, which are within thy gates, shall come, and shall eat and be satisfied; that the Lord thy God may bless thee in all the work of thine hand which thou doest. We see God repeat the instruction of this third year tithe to the Jews and it could only be because it was extremely important to him. ALL THE TITHES OF THE THIRD YEAR WAS FOR THE LESS PRIVILEGED. Deuteronomy 26:12 KJV When thou hast made an end of tithing all the tithes of thine increase the third year, which is the year of tithing, and hast given it unto the Levite, the stranger, the fatherless, and the widow, that they may eat within thy gates, and be filled; It was so important that they could use it to remind God of his promises and even ask for more Deuteronomy 26:13-15 KJV Then thou shalt say before the Lord thy God, I have brought away the hallowed things out of mine house, and also have given them unto the Levite, and unto the stranger, to the fatherless, and to the widow, according to all thy commandments which thou hast commanded me: I have not transgressed thy commandments, neither have I forgotten them : [14] I have not eaten thereof in my mourning, neither have I taken away ought thereof for any unclean use , nor given ought thereof for the dead: but I have hearkened to the voice of the Lord my God, and have done according to all that thou hast commanded me. [15] Look down from thy holy habitation, from heaven, and bless thy people Israel, and the land which thou hast given us, as thou swarest unto our fathers, a land that floweth with milk and honey. When last did you hear a sermon on these portions of scripture from your pulpits? Don't you think its beautiful when we allow the bible speak for itself? You know Malachi doesn't have the monopoly of blessings associated with tithes so why don't pastors preach the third year tithe like they do the Malachi tithe which they've even twisted out of shape? Is it that they don't want their members to get the blessings of this third year tithe? Is it not robbery to deny the poor of this third year tithe? Is it not disobedience to the clear commandments of God to ignore the third year tithe? I leave you to think and decide while I post some more 3 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Candour(m): 10:32am On Aug 04, 2014 |
We see king Hezekiah come in with reforms because Israel had abandoned the law of Moses (including tithing). He gave them no new tithe laws but commanded them to go back to obeying the law of tithing which Moses gave and which I reproduced in the previous posts. 2 Chronicles 31:5-7 KJV And as soon as the commandment came abroad, the children of Israel brought in abundance the firstfruits of corn, wine, and oil, and honey, and of all the increase of the field; and the tithe of all things brought they in abundantly. [6] And concerning the children of Israel and Judah, that dwelt in the cities of Judah, they also brought in the tithe of oxen and sheep, and the tithe of holy things which were consecrated unto the Lord their God, and laid them by heaps. [7] In the third month they began to lay the foundation of the heaps, and finished them in the seventh month. We see Hezekiah command storehouses to be made in the temple for purpose of storing the tithes and other things that had been offered to God. This is the same storehouse Malachi mentioned. 2 Chronicles 31:11-12 KJV Then Hezekiah commanded to prepare chambers in the house of the Lord ; and they prepared them , [12] And brought in the offerings and the tithes and the dedicated things faithfully: over which Cononiah the Levite was ruler, and Shimei his brother was the next. After the Israelites came back from a 70yr captivity in Babylon, the people had forgotten much of the law including that of tithes so Nehemiah reminded them and they obeyed. Note the difference in the tithes to the levites and the tithe of tithes to the priest which was taken into the storehouse mentioned by Malachi. Nehemiah 10:37-38 KJV And that we should bring the firstfruits of our dough, and our offerings, and the fruit of all manner of trees, of wine and of oil, unto the priests, to the chambers of the house of our God; and the tithes of our ground unto the Levites, that the same Levites might have the tithes in all the cities of our tillage. [38] And the priest the son of Aaron shall be with the Levites, when the Levites take tithes: and the Levites shall bring up the tithe of the tithes unto the house of our God, to the chambers, into the treasure house. And here too Nehemiah 12:44 KJV And at that time were some appointed over the chambers for the treasures, for the offerings, for the firstfruits, and for the tithes, to gather into them out of the fields of the cities the portions of the law for the priests and Levites: for Judah rejoiced for the priests and for the Levites that waited. And here too. Note that its still strictly agric produce Nehemiah 13:5, 12 KJV And he had prepared for him a great chamber, where aforetime they laid the meat offerings, the frankincense, and the vessels, and the tithes of the corn, the new wine, and the oil, which was commanded to be given to the Levites, and the singers, and the porters; and the offerings of the priests. [12] Then brought all Judah the tithe of the corn and the new wine and the oil unto the treasuries. Going on to Amos, we see another mention of the third year tithe in his castigation of the false piety of Isreal. Something which the lord also did in the new testament. Amos 4:4 KJV Come to Beth-el, and transgress; at Gilgal multiply transgression; and bring your sacrifices every morning, and your tithes after three years: When last did you hear a message on these portions of scripture from the pulpit? As can be seen from Hezekiah command and Nehemiah's actions, the storehouse was a place situated in the temple of Solomon at Jerusalem for the purpose of storing hallowed items including tithes. Every believer knows he's now the temple of God, so what's all the noise about Malachi and the storehouse if the believer is now the temple where God dwells? 1 Like |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by femicyrus(m): 11:03am On Aug 04, 2014 |
Stop tithe in the Church now and watch if the Church will grow In terms of structures, materials things, jeeps, jets etc the Church will diminish in 7years, pastors will reduce then men shall know the truth and the truth shall set Them free and will no longer be entangled with any Law or bondage. We ære saved by grace. Christ had paid the price. Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. If your religious leaders should miss heaven then what is your hope You blind follower? it is better to focus on Jesus the author and finisher of our Faith. He forsake All in heaven to die for mankind. His disciple were killed for the sake of the gospel, they value not thier own life unlike what we have in this modern Gospel where they pick a Law 'tithe' which favør thier pocket and forsake other laws of the prophets. Let every one work and earn a leaving while we preach the gospel. That is when we can have All things in common like the apostles. GOD wants salvation of souls not structures, material things etc 3 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by DrummaBoy(m): 11:15am On Aug 04, 2014 |
Truth is that subjects like sabbath and circumcision have greater argument running for them than the tithes in the bible. We need to listen to the argument of an adventist on sabbath to appreciate this. Candour, I found your interaction with the OP of this thread on his other thread on Sabbath, I mean OLAADEGBU, very interesting. How he was able to support that conclusion on sabbath but would not do the same for tithes, beats me. OLAADEGBU: Words of Comfort: Keeping the Sabbath. Compare this with the OP on this thread: OLAADEGBU: Tithes and Offerings Does OLAADEGBU realize that Malachi 3:10 is a Jewish law, ordinance and commandment? I don't know, but do we realize that it was a bondage to the sabbath that Jesus contended the pharisees with; while Paul contended the religious leaders of his day on circumcision? Why do we then find it surprising that Satan would ruse up another Jewish religious practice to blind God's people from true devotion to God like he did in the past? There are no new tricks in the devil's bag. 3 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by BabaGnoni: 11:42am On Aug 04, 2014 |
DrummaBoy: Truth is that subjects like sabbath and circumcision have greater argument running for them than the tithes in the bible. We need to listen to the argument of an adventist on sabbath to appreciate this. OLAADEGBU: Words of Comfort: Keeping the Sabbath. DrummaBoy: Christians have incredible liberty —no one can tell us what we must eat or drink, or what days we must observe. - OLAADEGBU Famous quote which incidentally is applicable to tithing Christians have incredible liberty, no one can tell us to tithe 4 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by OLAADEGBU(m): 11:47am On Aug 04, 2014 |
DrummaBoy: Truth is that subjects like sabbath and circumcision have greater argument running for them than the tithes in the bible. We need to listen to the argument of an adventist on sabbath to appreciate this. If you can see the principles behind the Sabbath why can't you see the principles behind tithes in the Church age? What did Jesus say about the Sabbath, if you know? |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by OLAADEGBU(m): 11:49am On Aug 04, 2014 |
BabaGnoni: There are scriptures that buttress my point. Can you tell us where in Scriptures the Church is told that tithes and offerings have been abolished? 2 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Candour(m): 12:10pm On Aug 04, 2014 |
DrummaBoy: Truth is that subjects like sabbath and circumcision have greater argument running for them than the tithes in the bible. We need to listen to the argument of an adventist on sabbath to appreciate this. Actually, tithe for christians is the easiest to debunk among the three for the simple fact that it was a specific people that had the privilege to receive it. I've heard some new arguments on NL that the apostles didn't request tithes from the early church because that church gave up all they had. That is a lie and could only have emanated from an ignorant person or the heart of a thief and a criminal who benefits from tithe collections. The Jerusalem church was birthed when the temple and its levitical functions were still in full swing. How can any honest human being claim that the exclusive preserve of the levites and priests would be usurped by the apostles and there wouldn't be dire repercussions? Woe betide any apostle that was criminal enough to mention payment of tithes to the early Christians, the Jews around would have stoned him to death. It was bad enough that they were preaching a gospel that usurped the authority of the religious rulers of the day, they'll now be corrupt and bold enough to appropriate the source of sustenance of the corrupt and vindictive priests? Those cruel people would have ensured that whoever tried it paid with his life. Its like a Jew loathed in Hitler's Germany now trying to steal from a German, what do you think would have been his fate? When even honest Jews were being gassed to death? Any wonder then that it only crept into the christian church over 700 years after the destruction of the temple and dispersal of Jews and their priesthood from Jerusalem? Whether the Jerusalem church gave 100% or 0%, the apostles had no right in heaven or on earth to ask tithes from the flock. If they did, death was sure and I'm sure God would ask them to tell when he gave them that right and privilege. They preached freewill giving. Simple and short. 5 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by BabaGnoni: 12:12pm On Aug 04, 2014 |
OLAADEGBU: OLAADEGBU, my good friend and brother, can't you see that we are going back to Eden? Can't you see we've gone back to how it was in the beginning? As about you asking:"Can you tell us where in Scriptures the Church is told that tithes and offerings have been abolished?" Tithing was nailed to the cross (i.e. Colossians 2:14 dealt with Malachi 3:7) Tithing just like the sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath or tithing In the beginning it was never so OLAADEGBU, it was more of liberty, freedom of choice and no coercion, more like that "Christians have incredible liberty" sentiment you raised Whatever the offerings given, it is to be freewill and cheerfully done, with no sorrow or compulsion added or joined with it 5 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by MarkMiwerds(m): 12:13pm On Aug 04, 2014 |
OLAADEGBU:Hebrews 7:18 (KJV) 18 For there is verily a disannulling (canceling out) of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof. What commandment was disannulled? The only commandment mentioned in this chapter up to this point is the command to take tithes. 5 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by OLAADEGBU(m): 12:39pm On Aug 04, 2014 |
BabaGnoni: MarkMiwerds: "Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He said not, And to sees, as of many; but as of one, And to your seed, which is Christ. And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that is should make the promise of none effect. For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise" (Galatians 3:16-18.) Epic fail! The 430 years from the Abrahamic promise until the giving of the law to Moses which was again confirmed to Jacob as he and his family were leaving Canaan for Egypt (Genesis 46:1-4) could not be disannulled. So you can see that the Mosaic law cannot disannul what had been promised to Abraham and confirmed to Jacob who both paid tithes before this was sanctioned into the Law 430 later. Get your facts right. 2 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by MarkMiwerds(m): 12:50pm On Aug 04, 2014 |
OLAADEGBU:the "Epic Fail" is on your part, Olaadegbu. The promises concerning Abraham had absolutely nothing to do with his once mentioned tithe of war spoils. Nice try though. You may want to practice what you preach and "get your facts right." 3 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by PastorKun(m): 12:55pm On Aug 04, 2014 |
OLAADEGBU: Stop being a fraudster, God's promise to Abraham had absolutely nothing to do with the one off voluntary tithes he gave to Melchizedek based on the customs of his people at that time. 6 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by BabaGnoni: 12:56pm On Aug 04, 2014 |
^^^ @OLAADEGBU antics SMH 3 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by BabaGnoni: 1:02pm On Aug 04, 2014 |
OLAADEGBU: OLAADEGBU, why, why, why Why did you stop at verse 18? Why did you stop shy of verse 19 and not continue on to the end? Chai, these verses you were sharing from Galatians 3:16 and then stopped conveniently at verse 18, chai diaris God ooo The whole passage was making a case debunking the law, (i.e. 19Why, then, was the law given at all? It was added because of transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come. The law was given through angels and entrusted to a mediator - Galatians 3:19) and centering it on the promise (i.e. Christ, the Abraham’s seed) Galatians 3:16-18, your trump card, has nothing to do with validating tithing talkless the law OLAADEGBU 3 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Goshen360(m): 2:36pm On Aug 04, 2014 |
We all know this Ola got talent to twist scripture to the point of "reading into the text"  2 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by trustman: 3:25pm On Aug 04, 2014 |
I assure you that OLAADEGBU will soon 'disappear' again, even if for a while. I doubt if he has any more arsenal for responding to these posts. 4 Likes |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Image123(m): 9:59pm On Aug 04, 2014 |
Oh poor Candour, he wants me to create a thread in his name. Not gonna happen, hehehehehehehehe. |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by Image123(m): 1:01pm On Aug 05, 2014 |
Candour: |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by OLAADEGBU(m): 4:53am On Aug 09, 2014 |
trustman: Sure. The cycle turns again. OLAADEGBU: 1 Like |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by brocab: 10:41pm On Aug 14, 2014 |
Tithing was a law from the past, the lord clearly says you can't worship mammon and God at the same time, you either love one and hate the other. Look at the birds of the air they neither sow, nor reap, or put into barns, but yet the Lord feeds them, how much more are you. I'm no tither but I do give, and I give alot of my time into the word of God. I want truth, no more lies or even false doctrine; first seek the kingdom of the lord, and all things shall be added to you, recently My Harley was knocked over in a shopping centre, I didn't see who done it, and I didn't get angry about it, but I prayed. I rode the bike home damaged and the lord seen my needs, and recently I was blessed with amount of monies, to fix my bike. I'm blessed. And yet I don't tithe. but seek the truth. Gombs: |
| Re: Tithes And Offerings by OLAADEGBU(m): 11:59am On Aug 29, 2014 |
Another post on the truth of tithes and offerings. OLAADEGBU: |
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