We Are Saved By God Grace Throug Faith And Our Good Works In Christ Jesus For Christ Jesus Nd With Christ Jesus.

If I Say I Blive In Jesus Bt Fail To Do Good, Is Dead

Pastor olu T am really disappointed to see a writeup such as this emanating from you,, is it that you have backslidded and now trying to find justification for the pleasure which sinful lifestyle offers,,please never justify sin for any reason which satan have tried to convince you with, its not too late to rise again, dust yourself , pick up your cross and continue the journey to heaven on the narrow road..our salvation is now nearer than we ever knew. The rapture is now nearer.

vest:
We Are Saved By God Grace Throug Faith And Our Good Works In Christ Jesus For Christ Jesus Nd With Christ Jesus.

If I Say I Blive In Jesus Bt Fail To Do Good, Is Dead

Are you serious? Can't you differentiate between works before faith and works after faith?
God only accepts works after faith.

PastorOluT:
It is of a great concern in the Christendom today, the great harm the so called "prosperity and name it and claim it" preachers are doing to the body of Christ, but it is also to be noted that the so called "holiness" preachers are doing equal harm. This set of men propound man made rules and doctrines which brings fear and bondage, because their adherents can never measure up.

We are saved by grace through faith in Christ Jesus, and not by works which is just a manifestation of our new kind of life. Our works is just like the fruits of a tree, the tree makes the fruit and not the other way round. So also our new life in Christ Jesus makes us do good works, but our good works can never make us have the life of Christ.

Christianity is spiritual and not sensual or a set of dos and don'ts as some makes it look, we received and live a new kind of life as we are being constantly led by the spirit, which is superior and unlike the first life.

So anything that now keeps us under the elemental forces of this world into the bondage of rules and doctrines of men is contrary to the new God kind of life we received.

(Touch not; taste not; handle not; Which all are to perish with the using) after the commandments and doctrines of men? Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances, Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh.

Colossians 2:20-23

Stay blessed and remain rapturable

God bless you pastor Olu t, finally a balanced perspectve.

clean2:
Pastor olu T am really disappointed to see a writeup such as this emanating from you,, is it that you have backslidded and now trying to find justification for the pleasure which sinful lifestyle offers,,please never justify sin for any reason which satan have tried to convince you with, its not too late to rise again, dust yourself , pick up your cross and continue the journey to heaven on the narrow road..our salvation is now nearer than we ever knew. The rapture is now nearer.

Don't be too quick to judge sister/brother, the OP never justified sin. Go through it again. The bible implore us to be slow to speech and quick to thinking.

Nice one OP

Italo, you still havent changed.

Bidam:
Italo, you still havent changed.

Can an Ethiopian change his skin or a
leopard its spots?...Jere.13:23

Dux01:
@pastorkun if you were asked to speak is that the way you will openly call them CHARLARTANS" on television.

Yes I would.

italo:


So a good man who dies without hearing of Jesus will go to hell?

Is anyone qualified to be called 'good'! Job realised the hard way that no man is good, he was ready to charge God to court if he was given a chance for a fair hearing. He later realised his folly by retracting his words and accepting God's judgement as the best judgement regardless of whatever interpretation his senses conveyed.


We are all deserving of death but saved by God's mercy by the blood of the lamb. Any man that finds himself in a house without the blood on the lintels and doorpost is already condemned, more like a walking cadaver.

italo:
Olodo pastor. See how St. Paul makes a fool of you. The passage below clearly shows that:

1. People who don't believe in Christ can go to heaven.

2. It is not you hearers that will go to heaven, but DOERS!

12 All who have sinned apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who have sinned under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but the doers of the law who will be justified. 14 When Gentiles, who do not possess the law, do instinctively what the law requires, these, though not having the law, are a law to themselves. 15 They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, to which their own conscience also bears witness; and their conflicting thoughts will accuse or perhaps excuse them 16 on the day when, according to my gospel, God, through Jesus Christ, will judge the secret thoughts of all.

Again, I ask.

You believe that people who dont know Jesus but do good will go to hell while those who believe in Jesus but do bad will go to heaven

Paul was in no way negating the fact that no one sees God except through Christ. He made it clear that 'all have sinned' and none is righteous. The man with the law of moses is as bad as the man without the law.

Verse 16 says even those without the law could be accused or excused when all men shall not only be judged by what they do but by their secret thoughts. No man will see God if we all face God to present some of our secret thoughts.

Paul broke the bubble of the religous man in chapter 3 where he hit the nail firmly on the head.


20 For no one is declared righteous before him by the works of the law, for through the law comes the knowledge of sin. 21 But now apart from the law the righteousness of God (although it is attested by the law and the prophets) has been disclosed— 22 namely, the righteousness of God through the faithfulness of Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction, 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. 24


No man, no work is righteous outside the faithfulness of christ that is available to all who shall believe. Salvation is God's gift bestowed on us and not a wage we have to get by works or by doing good.

shdemidemi:


Paul was in no way negating the fact that no one sees God except through Christ. He made it clear that 'all have sinned' and none is righteous. The man with the law of moses is as bad as the man without the law.

Verse 16 says even those without the law could be accused or excused when all men shall not only be judged by what they do but by their secret thoughts. No man will see God if we all face God to present some of our secret thoughts.

Paul broke the bubble of the religous man in chapter 3 where he hit the nail firmly on the head.


20 For no one is declared righteous before him by the works of the law, for through the law comes the knowledge of sin. 21 But now apart from the law the righteousness of God (although it is attested by the law and the prophets) has been disclosed— 22 namely, the righteousness of God through the faithfulness of Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction, 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. 24


No man, no work is righteous outside the faithfulness of christ that is available to all who shall believe. Salvation is God's gift bestowed on us and not a wage we have to get by works or by doing good.

Tell them oooo. We don tell them tire. Dem no dey gree!

PastorOluT:


Did u go to school at all, can't u see the context of Romans 2 that Paul was speaking to the Jews who trusted in the law?

I can see u are not just dumb bt lost in deceit n can never be helped.

Paul was writing to the Church in Rome. Christians!

He was only using the Jew-Gentile argument to prevent them from judging anyone the way you are judging non-Christians.

Bobbysworld28:


Agreed. 90% sha.
But pls go on

what is the 10% you disagree with?

PastorKun:


Answering questions with irrelevant questions is "Evasive tactics 101". answer my question first before derailing the thread.

seems like you have nothing meaningful to say.

1. If you have faith, and no works, can that faith save you?

2. If you have so much faith that you perform miracles in Jesus' name, can you go to hell?

3. If you believe Jesus is Lord but do not do good to your neighbour, can you enter heaven?

4. A person is justified by WORKS, not by FAITH ALONE. Yes or No?

Please answer these "yes or no" questions.

dein77:





Bro, Ephesians 2 : 8-9 is your answer. It's fruitless arguing over what's crystal clear.

italo:


what is the 10% you disagree with?

Faith AND good works!

The capitalized is my issue

italo:

1. If you have faith, and no works, can that faith save you?

2. If you have so much faith that you perform miracles in Jesus' name, can you go to hell?

3. If you believe Jesus is Lord but do not do good to your neighbour, can you enter heaven?

4. A person is justified by WORKS, not by FAITH ALONE. Yes or No?

Please answer these "yes or no" questions.

1. You are saved by faith already. Righteousness is imputed to u as u become born again. Ur salvation is not later after ur works are judged. Reconciling with God (in & thru Christ) is salvation. Good works doesnt even come into play in this transaction. If it did, there would hv been no need for Jesus

2. Yes! Jesus said so

3. We are already citizens of heaven now! The life we have received is an outpouring of love. We cannot NOT do good. Once u receive the Holy Spirit, like Jesus, u go abt doing good! It is an offshoot of this marvelous fellowship we have with the Father through his Spirit.

4. No sir!

PastorOluT:


Did u go to school at all, can't u see the context of Romans 2 that Paul was speaking to the Jews who trusted in the law?

I can see u are not just dumb bt lost in deceit n can never be helped.

Please take it easy with him. He is speaking from what he has been exposed to probably for the most part of his life, nothing else seem to make sense. It can be frustrating atimes but we must squelch such frustration with the mind set that it's all a service for God, which is the primary reason why we were created.

dein77:


Its wisdom to know when to quit a discussion, especially when its obviously headed nowhere.

Sir, you need to actually carefully study James 2, from whence you have taken your first question. Apostle James was discussing various kinds of faith.

As for your third question, according to Gal 5:21-22, one of the fruits of a Christian is GOODNESS. A Christian cannot not do good; its his nature to do good. We have the Spirit of Christ. Christ went about doing good; we must also do good.

As for your fourth question, i say NO......No man can be justified by works; his works are dirty before God. No good resides in a man who is unregenerated.

If you still hold on to your opinion of justification by faith+works, then you need to discuss it with your pastors in your local assembly.

I have done the little i can to enlighten you on this issue.

Besides you are no position to calling a fellow Christian a Pharisee.......

So you just played around questions 1 and 2 without answering them...while you totally avoided question 3

You answered only the 4th question. You said "NO: no man can be justified by his works."

The Holy Spirit says through St. James in James 2:24: "do you see that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only?"

You see that you and all your fellow protestants are heretics...contradicting the Holy Spirit!

Now can you answer the other questions, let me show you how you false doctrine is from satan himself.

italo:


Paul was writing to the Church in Rome. Christians!

Pasor olu is right sir, if we go by the context of the letter. It was a letter to the church in Rome which had a mix congregation- jews and Gentiles. Chapter 1 seem to be addressing the gentiles and chapter 2 the jews who trusted so much in the way God used to deal with them before the death/resurrection of Jesus.

italo:

He was only using the Jew-Gentile argument to prevent them from judging anyone the way you are judging non-Christians.

No, the purpose of chapter 2 was to point the jews that they are also sinners. Everyone is equally drenched in that miry of sin. Observing the law isn't the solution, been circumcised in the flesh isn't the solution, being an earthly offspring of Abraham would not suffice either.

All sinned with or without the law, none is fit to be called righteous.

Bobbysworld28:



1. You are saved by faith already. Righteousness is imputed to u as u become born again. Ur salvation is not later after ur works are judged. Reconciling with God (in & thru Christ) is salvation. Good works doesnt even come into play in this transaction. If it did, there would hv been no need for Jesus

2. Yes! Jesus said so

3. We are already citizens of heaven now! The life we have received is an outpouring of love. We cannot NOT do good. Once u receive the Holy Spirit, like Jesus, u go abt doing good! It is an offshoot of this marvelous fellowship we have with the Father through his Spirit.

4. No sir!

2. You say a man can have faith in Jesus and go to hell. Yet you say all that's needed to be saved is faith. You are contradicting yourself.

What is it that can make a man of great faith go to hell, if not lack of good works?

4. You say 'no,' but God says 'YES!' A man is justified by works, not by faith ALONE!

Why are you guys bent on contradicting God?

!

Bobbysworld28:


Faith AND good works!

The capitalized is my issue

James 2:24 says the opposite of what you say.

Why should I believe you and disbelieve the Holy Spirit?

Bidam:
Italo, you still havent changed.

You want me to change and start disbelieving what the Holy Spirit says in James 2:24?

Never!

italo:


So you just played around questions 1 and 2 without answering them...while you totally avoided question 3

You answered only the 4th question. You said "NO: no man can be justified by his works."

The Holy Spirit says through St. James in James 2:24: "do you see that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only?"

You see that you and all your fellow protestants are heretics...contradicting the Holy Spirit!

Now can you answer the other questions, let me show you how you false doctrine is from satan himself.

You can make ur point known without insults. Not everyone who disagrees with u is a 'protestant'

Back to ur point. I see it! If u go back a bit to start reading frm James 2:21. As proof, Apostle James said Abraham was justified by his works. What works? He BELIEVED in God and it was credited to him as righteousness. So the 'works' James was telling u was to believe God!
Feel free to share your own view without insults pls

italo:


James 2:24 says the opposite of what you say.

Why should I believe you and disbelieve the Holy Spirit?

Do u believe dt only one person has revelation? Arent we all children of God? I believe this is iron sharpening iron. I am willing to learn from u, but r u willing to hear from me?

Bobbysworld28:



1. You are saved by faith already. Righteousness is imputed to u as u become born again. Ur salvation is not later after ur works are judged. Reconciling with God (in & thru Christ) is salvation. Good works doesnt even come into play in this transaction. If it did, there would hv been no need for Jesus

2. Yes! Jesus said so

3. We are already citizens of heaven now! The life we have received is an outpouring of love. We cannot NOT do good. Once u receive the Holy Spirit, like Jesus, u go abt doing good! It is an offshoot of this marvelous fellowship we have with the Father through his Spirit.

4. No sir!

Tell him. Tell him!

You protestants just enjoy deceiving yourselves.

James 2

21 - Was not Abraham our father justified by works, offering up Isaac his son upon the altar?

22 - Seest thou, that faith did co-operate with his works; and by works faith was made perfect?

See the work that v21 says. He offered up his son!

Why are you bent on contradicting God and clinging to the heresy called protestantism?

Come out of that LIE. It is from SATAN!

Bobbysworld28:


You can make ur point known without insults. Not everyone who disagrees with u is a 'protestant'

Back to ur point. I see it! If u go back a bit to start reading frm James 2:21. As proof, Apostle James said Abraham was justified by his works. What works? He BELIEVED in God and it was credited to him as righteousness. So the 'works' James was telling u was to believe God!
Feel free to share your own view without insults pls

Bobbysworld28:


Do u believe dt only one person has revelation? Arent we all children of God? I believe this is iron sharpening iron. I am willing to learn from u, but r u willing to hear from me?

I am already learning from you.

I am learning that you are many protestants hypocritically cling to lies so that they can practise their own customized christianity in which there is no sacrifice, only benefits.

The Holy Spirit says "a man is justified by works, not by faith alone." Learn from him, even if you dislike me or the Catholic Church.

I know that the next thing you will be looking for is not how to humble yourself and accept the truth, but another way to twist the truth to fit into your lie.

Dominus vobiscum.

The next question would be- was it an evil spirit that said:

Ephesians 2:9

New International Version
not by works, so that no one can boast.

New Living Translation
Salvation is not a reward for the good things we have done, so none of us can boast about it.

English Standard Version
not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

New American Standard Bible
not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.

King James Bible
Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
not from works, so that no one can boast.

International Standard Version
and not the result of actions, to put a stop to all boasting.

NET Bible
it is not from works, so that no one can boast.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
Not of works, lest anyone should boast.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
It's not the result of anything you've done, so no one can brag about it.

One will ask, is James saying the same thing as paul? Over all, I don’t think any portion of Scripture has raised so many questions for us regarding the Grace Age, as this book of James has (because of its legalism). And, consequently, many people get confused. People will say, "James says you can’t have faith unless you’ve got works. And Paul says you have faith without works.

Well, what’s the deal?" We know that Scripture never contradicts for the sake of contradiction, so there has to be a logical, as well as a spiritual, answer for that dilemma.

There is no dilemma.

Nobody here said we are saved by works.

The Catholic Church says we are saved by the grace of God but faith and works are our necessary response.

Both passages fit well into that doctrine but your false doctrine contradicts James 2:24.