Obinoscopy:

Please I have this innocent question which has been bothering me:
Why did God allow us to have our Puberty at a young age of 16 when the ideal age for marriage is arround 25-27 years for we guys and girls.
Does it mean we have to endure our sexual activity for a whole 10 years!

The ideal age for marriage I would view as a worldly opinion. Marriages in the current world are moving towards being for love and this idea is backed by the Bible whereas in the past they have been for other reasons like lineage. Love doesn't depend on time, although the Bible does declare love as patient, it will come about when it is right, so therefore aspiring to reach an age before marrying, I think, potentially limiting. If you think you are in love with someone, pray and wait upon God for instruction, He knows what is right.

Interesting the average age of marriage has risen according to this webpage http://www.wisegeek.com/how-has-the-average-age-at-marriage-changed-over-time.htm.

The Oxford English Dictionary is a respected dictionary and it added 'muggle' after the Harry Potter books. http://www.cracked.com/article_17408_15-words-you-wont-believe-they-added-dictionary.html

The point I'm trying to make is fornication is not clearly defined and in its commonly accepted defintion becomes contradictory against other parts of the Bible.

BenSays, I dont need to follow your link, because even more idiotic words from the senseless poem, Jabberwocky, have crawled into English.

Everyman &his dog knows that human language evolves, but God's language, so to speak, is constant; so you are just touting semantics.

The English dictionary, Greek & Hebrew concordances, whatever, they can only prove to be pointers. God's heart in the matter has never changed.

So if Christ says LOOKERY is adultery & a sin, how much more the many things that can follow after lookery, let me refrain from a graphic list?!

You can cling to the words, extract the juice and wash out your mouth with the essence. It doesnt change anything cos human language is flawed. Even if i call it Althermbiration, who gives a pink rat's a$$? Its still what it is, before God. 1 Sam 16:7

BELOVED SISTER TRINI,

GOD LOVE US AND DESIRES THE BEST FOR I AND YOU. IT WILL BE TO ONE'S OWN DETRIMENT IF SUCH ONE DESIRE TO WILFULLY GO AGAINST HIS COMMAND. EVEN HUMANITY ABHOR SUCH ACT THOUGH MANY ENGAGE IN THE ACT.

MANY ENGAGING IS SUCH ACT IS SIMPLY BECAUSE THEY ARE YET TO CRUCIFY FLESH THAT ALWAYS CRAVE FOR IT.
GOD EXPECT US TO ALLOW HIS SPIRIT TO RULE OUR LIFE SO AS NOT TO GRATIFY THE DESIRES OF THE FLESH. THE FLESH AND SPIRIT ARE CONTRARY TO THE OTHER.

ONE NEED NOT COME UP TO ANALYSE A WORD WITH THE MIND TO CARRY ON IN HIS OR HER EVIL DESIRE, I PUT IT TO YOU AND ALL THAT WHAT IS POPULAR IS NOT NECESSARILY WHAT IS RIGHT.

PRE-MARITAL SEX & FORNICATION IS AN EVIL BEFORE GOD. HE COMMAND THAT YOU ABSTAIN FROM ALL APPEARANCE OF EVIL.
BEING IN RELATIONSHIP WITH A PERSON HAD NOT MADE THE PERSONS MARRIED OR WILL GET MARRIED TOMORROW, SOMETHING MAY COME UP AND THE TWO FRIENDS WILL PART, HOW COME ONE WILL GIVE TO PRE-MARITAL SEX IN A RELATIONSHIP?
THINK ABOUT IT.

GOD LOVES YOU ALL.

BELOVED SISTER TRINI,

GOD LOVE US AND DESIRES THE BEST FOR I AND YOU. IT WILL BE TO ONE'S OWN DETRIMENT IF SUCH ONE DESIRE TO WILFULLY GO AGAINST HIS COMMAND.  EVEN HUMANITY ABHOR SUCH ACT THOUGH MANY ENGAGE IN THE ACT.

MANY ENGAGING IS SUCH ACT IS SIMPLY BECAUSE THEY ARE YET TO CRUCIFY FLESH THAT ALWAYS CRAVE FOR IT.
GOD EXPECT US TO ALLOW HIS SPIRIT TO RULE OUR LIFE SO AS NOT TO GRATIFY THE DESIRES OF THE FLESH. THE FLESH AND SPIRIT ARE CONTRARY TO THE OTHER.

ONE NEED NOT COME UP TO ANALYSE A WORD WITH THE MIND TO CARRY ON IN HIS OR HER EVIL DESIRE, I PUT IT TO YOU AND ALL THAT WHAT IS POPULAR IS NOT NECESSARILY WHAT IS RIGHT.

PRE-MARITAL SEX & FORNICATION IS AN EVIL BEFORE GOD. HE COMMAND THAT YOU ABSTAIN FROM ALL APPEARANCE OF EVIL.
BEING IN RELATIONSHIP WITH A PERSON HAD NOT MADE THE PERSONS MARRIED OR WILL GET MARRIED TOMORROW, SOMETHING MAY COME UP AND THE TWO FRIENDS WILL PART, HOW COME ONE WILL GIVE TO PRE-MARITAL SEX IN A RELATIONSHIP?
THINK ABOUT IT.

GOD LOVES YOU ALL.[color=#000099][/color]

BELOVED SISTER TRINI,

GOD LOVE US AND DESIRES THE BEST FOR I AND YOU. IT WILL BE TO ONE'S OWN DETRIMENT IF SUCH ONE DESIRE TO WILFULLY GO AGAINST HIS COMMAND.  EVEN HUMANITY ABHOR SUCH ACT THOUGH MANY ENGAGE IN THE ACT.

MANY ENGAGING IS SUCH ACT IS SIMPLY BECAUSE THEY ARE YET TO CRUCIFY FLESH THAT ALWAYS CRAVE FOR IT.
GOD EXPECT US TO ALLOW HIS SPIRIT TO RULE OUR LIFE SO AS NOT TO GRATIFY THE DESIRES OF THE FLESH. THE FLESH AND SPIRIT ARE CONTRARY TO THE OTHER.

ONE NEED NOT COME UP TO ANALYSE A WORD WITH THE MIND TO CARRY ON IN HIS OR HER EVIL DESIRE, I PUT IT TO YOU AND ALL THAT WHAT IS POPULAR IS NOT NECESSARILY WHAT IS RIGHT.

PRE-MARITAL SEX & FORNICATION IS AN EVIL BEFORE GOD. HE COMMAND THAT YOU ABSTAIN FROM ALL APPEARANCE OF EVIL.
BEING IN RELATIONSHIP WITH A PERSON HAD NOT MADE THE PERSONS MARRIED OR WILL GET MARRIED TOMORROW, SOMETHING MAY COME UP AND THE TWO FRIENDS WILL PART, HOW COME ONE WILL GIVE TO PRE-MARITAL SEX IN A RELATIONSHIP?
THINK ABOUT IT.

GOD LOVES YOU ALL.[color=#000099][/color]

ancel:

@Obinoscopy: Why did God give you hands and feet at birth since you are not yet ready to use your hands to make money, and your legs to go from place to place in the name of business?

@ ancel God gave us hand and feet primarily to be able to move from one place to another and secondly to be able to grasp/hold something. Children do that almost immediately after childbirth. The once you mentioned are not the main reasons God gave us hands and feet because the animals that God gave hands and feet use theirs for movement and grasping and not for naira making

Obinoscopy, thats the same way he gave you your dongle to use in urinating straight from birth. So it has other uses apart from sexual use, too; the same way your hands and feet have other uses apart from business.

So who defined the ideal marriage as 25 or 27? Did God tell you that? 

In life, great things are achieved after proper attention and nurture over a period of time. I can say that maybe He allowed you to reach an early puberty so that you can PREPARE for settling down a short while later (define a short while. it may be one year or even 15, it's your boot). Or would you want to be (or have) a spouse who is still having mixed-up feelings about sex, pubescent confusion and emotional urges? 

ancel:

Obinoscopy, thats the same way he gave you your dongle to use in urinating straight from birth. So it has other uses apart from sexual use, too; the same way your hands and feet have other uses apart from business.

I did not ask why did God give us dongle or whatever u call it. I asked why did God make us have Puberty at a young age

ancel:

In life, great things are achieved after proper attention and nurture over a period of time. I can say that maybe He allowed you to reach an early puberty so that you can PREPARE for settling down a short while later (define a short while. it may be one year or even 15, it's your boot). Or would you want to be (or have) a spouse who is still having mixed-up feelings about sex, pubescent confusion and emotional urges? 

Don't know if I got your message but everyone (say 95%) reaches puberty before the age of 20 and that age is not ideal for a man to get married. Lets face the fact and not bring the bible into it, I don't think men marrying immediately they develop fertility is right or OK morally. Most guys can impregnate a girl at the age of 15 or so. Do you advise a 15 yr old boy to get married? Haba!

Obinoscopy:

I did not ask why did God give us dongle or whatever u call it. I asked why did God make us have Puberty at a young age

Don't know if I got your message but everyone (say 95%) reaches puberty before the age of 20 and that age is not ideal for a man to get married. Lets face the fact and not bring the bible into it, I don't think men marrying immediately they develop fertility is right or OK morally. Most guys can impregnate a girl at the age of 15 or so. Do you advise a 15 yr old boy to get married? Haba!

My point is that, just like a young mango tree that hasn't yet started giving fruit, has everything necessary within it to produce yield but it doesn't start yet, the same way humans reach puberty first before they are ready to start using it. Maturity is not all about the body, that's just a little part of it. Maybe God expects you to learn how to control the growth stage with your mind and spirit, just like trees too wait patiently until they are ready to start fruiting. Just my opinion.

ancel:

My point is that, just like a young mango tree that hasn't yet started giving fruit, has everything necessary within it to produce yield but it doesn't start yet, the same way humans reach puberty first before they are ready to start using it. Maturity is not all about the body, that's just a little part of it. Maybe God expects you to learn how to control the growth stage with your mind and spirit, just like trees too wait patiently until they are ready to start fruiting. Just my opinion.

Think I'll go with your final response

ancel:

BenSays, I dont need to follow your link, because even more idiotic words from the senseless poem, Jabberwocky, have crawled into English.

Everyman &his dog knows that human language evolves, but God's language, so to speak, is constant; so you are just touting semantics.

The English dictionary, Greek & Hebrew concordances, whatever, they can only prove to be pointers. God's heart in the matter has never changed.

So if Christ says LOOKERY is adultery & a sin, how much more the many things that can follow after lookery, let me refrain from a graphic list?!

You can cling to the words, extract the juice and wash out your mouth with the essence. It doesnt change anything cos human language is flawed. Even if i call it Althermbiration, who gives a pink rat's a$$? Its still what it is, before God. 1 Sam 16:7

I agree! I'm not clinging to worldly definition, quite the opposite I'm pointing at how there is a lack of grounding for the worldly view on fornication. I've always felt Bible study must be coupled with prayer otherwise it becomes a rather useless endevour.

Christ did deem lookery adultery but we must observe that he called it adultery and not fornication. Now again, I imagine adultery could have the same definition minefield that fornication has but if we go on the accepted meaning surely Christ was referring to looking at a married woman? Otherwise, there is little reason to have the words adultery and fornication when they are just the same?

I really am not trying to be awkward here I just think as a world we cling to man made definitions way too much!

P.S. I enjoyed the 'everyman and his dog' phrase, very underused these days yet still fantastic!

Obinoscopy:

Don't know if I got your message but everyone (say 95%) reaches puberty before the age of 20 and that age is not ideal for a man to get married. Lets face the fact and not bring the bible into it, I don't think men marrying immediately they develop fertility is right or OK morally. Most guys can impregnate a girl at the age of 15 or so. Do you advise a 15 yr old boy to get married? Haba!

I think a benchmark ideal marriage age is a rather odd topic to argue about as a 'one size fits all' idea with age for marriage is flawed. Age does not determine whether marriage is feasible between a couple it may in a small way contribute but it shouldn't compared to the opinion of God.

I find your plea for us to 'face the facts and not bring the bible into it' very bizarre, what do we have to gain through leaving out the Bible from a discussion?

If a 15 year old asked me for advice on whether to marry or not the only thing I would advise him to do is to seek God's answer.

BenSays:

If a 15 year old asked me for advice on whether to marry or not the only thing I would advise him to do is to seek God's answer.

Please be truthful to yourself, if your son is 15 years who is about writing his WAEC says he has seen his missing rib and wants to get married. What would you tell him?

BenSays:

I find your plea for us to 'face the facts and not bring the bible into it' very bizarre, what do we have to gain through leaving out the Bible from a discussion?

I'm a devout christian but also a realist. There is a popular slogan which says heaven helps those who helps themselves. Sometimes we become so religious conscious that we loose focus on reality. The bible as we see it can be used to lead some people astray. Mind you the devil is well versed in the bible so he can use it as his weapon. What we should ask for is divine wisdom to be able to make the right decisions. I made that statement because some people were making wrong statements and were using the bible as their source.

I have got the drift. but i will like to say that the aim of word origins is to accurately determine the exact thought and intent of the speaker. do you think that the bible writers had ur definition of fornication in mind?

I have got the drift. but i will like to say that the aim of word origins is to accurately determine the exact thought and intent of the speaker. do you think that the bible writers had ur definition of fornication in mind?

The bible says 'to avoid fornication let everyman have his own wife'.This implies that fornication according to the bible means having sex outside marriage. Premarital sex is a sin!

trini_girl, goodday, pls dont be confused, and dont allow any foul dicussion to make u abominable to God. Pls quit this discussion or arguement and bring another issue that would be useful and helpful to ur "Life" and ur growth. If u are not yet satisfied with ds ademonition, you may continue with ds futile discussion. But remember JESUS DIED FOR U. Goodday

Its a sin ooh

Obinoscopy:

Please be truthful to yourself, if your son is 15 years who is about writing his WAEC says he has seen his missing rib and wants to get married. What would you tell him?

I'm a devout christian but also a realist. There is a popular slogan which says heaven helps those who helps themselves. Sometimes we become so religious conscious that we loose focus on reality. The bible as we see it can be used to lead some people astray. Mind you the devil is well versed in the bible so he can use it as his weapon. What we should ask for is divine wisdom to be able to make the right decisions. I made that statement because some people were making wrong statements and were using the bible as their source.

To be honest I would have to be in the situation to tell you what I would do. I do think my secular opinion would be like dust compared to God's guidance in that situation. Please can you tell me what a 'WAEC' is?

I think the another phrase is 'too heavenly minded to be of any earthly use'. The Bible is a fixed intelligence, we know God is in the Bible and seeks to speak to us through the Bible. It should be used in conjunction with prayer and cultivated with discussion.

The devil can mimic everything in this world but not holyness, he runs scared of it. But yes the Bible is misinterpretted however sometimes we do not realise these misinterpretations until too late.

ladgentle:

The bible says 'to avoid fornication let everyman have his own wife'.This implies that fornication according to the bible means having sex outside marriage. Premarital sex is a sin!

Depends on the version, most include the word 'should' before the 'have' inferring a strong advisement. It can be seen to imply such things but then again it fits as well, and I'm not saying fornication means this, if fornication meant homosexual sex.

yes it is.

BenSays:

To be honest I would have to be in the situation to tell you what I would do. I do think my secular opinion would be like dust compared to God's guidance in that situation. Please can you tell me what a 'WAEC' is?

WAEC means West African Examination Council, its an exam that secondary school students have to write to be able graduate from school and seek university admission. Its a tough exam thus someone who is distracted or who is not academically sound will fail woefully

Can someone explain what this Bible verse is trying to say:

I Corinthians 7: 36

But if any man think that he behaveth himself uncomely toward his virgin, if she pass the flower of her age, and need so require, let him do what he will, he sinneth not: let them marry. (KJV)

This, to me, tends to suggest that pre-marital sex could be allowed under some circumstances.

GBAM! BIBLE and the evil doctrine

Learn to use your brains when thinking/reading i believe you are all intelligent

I Corinthians 7: 36 tells them to marry and not to fornicate
and if you want to argue you should tell me what "marry" in the sentence is for!

Learn to use your brains when thinking/reading i believe you are all intelligent

I Corinthians 7: 36 tells them to marry and not to fornicate
and if you want to argue you should tell me what "marry" in the sentence is for!

@karo93:

Don't move from the answer to the question.

The Bible says, "let him do what he will". He wanted intimacy.
It then absolves him from the guilt of sin when it says, "he sinneth not". If he were referring to marriage as you suggested, there was no need to assure him that it is not a sin.
It then went ahead to say "they should marry" afterwards.
Any other interpretation is your personal view and does not change what has already been written.

No need to go for insults. It belittles you.

There is no God, no man that lives above the clouds and is invisible, there is nobody that is watching everything you do, except maybe the tax man 

On that note, who cares have szex when you want to have szex. Don't listen to these deranged and frankly crazy bible bashers. Their heads are so full of SH1T that they should be ground up and used as fertilizer.

Live your life as you like and not as others try and brainwash you into, after all you only have one and when you die only the worms in the ground are waiting.

So enjoy yourselves, have some good old stress reducing fun and loving szex today. Whether you are married or not 

It's not fornication just participation. ODE!

karo93:

Learn to use your brains when thinking/reading i believe you are all intelligent

I Corinthians 7: 36 tells them to marry and not to fornicate
and if you want to argue you should tell me what "marry" in the sentence is for!

Insults, the last resort of a man who has lost an arguement!

If you are so keen on why 'marry' is in the Bible verse, please first tell us the definition of 'marriage' because I am sure there are many different, most of them secular, definitions of the word!

God created this world. And it was good. God created man in His image. Therefore, until the Fall, man was also good. God said "be fruitful and multiply" before the fall of man. Therefore, sex is also good. Evil in this world only comes from man and the choices men make to separate themselves from God. I personally have never understood why Paul encourages the men of Corinth to never touch a woman. True, relationships can distract people from God, but only if someone lets earthly relationships become more important than his or her relationship with God. God created relationships, and therefore relationships are good, it is our choice to put relationships before God that is evil. Perhaps the people of Corinth were allowing their lives to be dominated by sexual relations and fornication, and this was distracting them from their relationship with God. Too much of a good thing, in a sense. Paul wrote to certain communities to help them with the specific problems they were facing. If people were having casual sex with everyone and anyone, then yes, that is what Paul would focus on. Like I said, too much of a good thing. Paul had to teach them how to put God first.

That said, Jesus preached a message of love. If you are in a loving relationship with someone, I do not see a problem with sexual intimacy, as long as you realize that it is a gift from God and do not let it dominate your life. The Bible does not directly state that pre-marital sex is a sin. In fact, most of the verses translated "fornication" in the King James version are a misinterpretation of the word "porneia," which is re-translated in more recent Bible translations as "sexual immorality." What is "sexual immorality?" Personally, I do not think sex with a person you love is "immoral." Maybe bestiality, rape, incest, pornography, prostitution, even homosexuality could be "immoral." In the Old Testament, David and Solomon have numerous wives and concubines and they are never condemned for having sex with unmarried women. David is only condemned for having sex with another man's wife, but never for having sex with his concubines.

What am I saying? Do I think that it is good to have casual sex with anyone and everyone? No. This is allowing lust to dominate your life and distract you from the way of the Lord. Do I think it is good to have sex with someone you are intimately in love with? Yes. It is a way to express your affection toward that person and guess what! Love for another person is GOOD! That's how God made us! And he gave us sex as a way to express that love! Do I think sex is reserved for married people? No. Perhaps that is sex in its purest form, but that does not mean that pre-marital sex is a sin. As I said earlier, most of the time "fornication" is used in the Bible it is a misinterpretation of "sexual immorality." Additionally, there are countless cases of Old Testament people having premarital sex and not getting in trouble for it. Only adultery was punished.

But all that aside, the most important aspect of Christianity that people seem to be forgetting is forgiveness. Does that mean we have a free ticket to sin? No, it does not. However, there are many cases where the Bible is not exactly clear on right and wrong, and I think this debate shows that pre-marital sex in a loving monogomous relationship is one of them. Even Paul says that we don't always know right from wrong, and so we need forgiveness because sometimes we don't even know when we sin. Maybe that is why we have the Holy Spirit in us to help guide us. Follow your heart, I know in my heart when I am showing affection to my loved one, although I'm not married to Him, all I can think of is how grateful I am to God for giving me this amazing person to spend my time with and such a wonderful way to be close to him and show him I care. Nothing about it feels wrong, and I know I have the Holy Spirit in me to tell me what to do.

We should try to do right and be better people. We should always remember that anything good on this Earth comes from God, that God is good, and that things are only bad when we let them separate us from God. We shouldn't fret about the details about right and wrong because there are so many interpretations and translations and the only way to know is to trust the Holy Spirit and follow your heart. Try to do Good. Love God first and then love others. Love one person intimately and show them that you love them. Be loyal. If things don't work out, don't be afraid to fall in love again. God wants you to be happy unless He has a darn good reason for you not to be. And above all, know that if you accept Christ, your sins are forgiven. It's not a free ticket, and we should try and follow Jesus's guidelines to live better lives, but when things aren't clear, know you are forgiven if you are wrong, and follow your heart.

God bless all of you.

"The bible says 'to avoid fornication let everyman have his own wife'.This implies that fornication according to the bible means having intimacy outside marriage. Premarital intimacy is a sin!"

Not necesarily. Fornication could mean having multiple partners at the same time, or casual sex. Giving every man a wife would solve this problem. I think this statement was directed at people who couldn't limit their sex to one partner, and so the marriage was in there to tie the people to one sexual partner. Some people are prefectly capable of having just one sexual partner outside the bonds of marriage.

This is so funny to me. People don't argue whether or not lying is a sin because the Bible clearly states "Thou shalt not bear false witness." Don't you think if sex before marriage was such an extreme sin it would have been stated more clearly and we wouldn't be having this debate? Most of the support against it comes from the words of Paul, which in my mind is not the same as the words of God or Jesus. True, it is divinely inspired, but Paul was not perfect, he was human. Usually when Paul wrote to communities, such as Corinth, condoning fornication, the communities had a reputation for having orgies in the streets. That's pretty extreme, and I'm sure that's why Paul felt he had to address the problem.

the bible says it all