Compulsory education whether they like it or not.Its so easy

God save us in Nigeria

Princek12:

Americans investment and influence of western culture predominantly contributed to the development Dubai, which was built for tourism and business. Dubai also aimed to copy western culture. Many western investors said from the outset that if the strict Islamic laws were not relaxed, then they will not invest in Dubai. In any event, it is noteworthy that Dubai is still run by Muslims, many of whom were educated in the Europe and America, which is what we are advocating for. In any event, you can see that educated Muslims fare better than uneducated Muslims, and are less susceptible to be swayed by Imams who interpret the Quran from an extremists view. This is why we are advocating educating those Almajiri kids.

Dubai is found in the United Arab Emirates and not in Texas.bring american engineers and professionals to build a city like Dubai in northern Nigeria.are the almajiris tying your hands?why dont you do it?

islam has nothing against education.many in the north have the wrong perception that western education is used to trick their children into christianity because of the bad record the missionaries have set with their perfected art of deception.in my first post here (see page no. 2) i cited well educated muslim scholars like Ahmad Deedat and Hassanain Rajabali who had western education and speak english fluently.these are two men that can cause nightmare for any christian missionary.if you give western education of those two men who defend islam in english to the almajiris,they will be more than grateful.if you give the almajiris good education that would be the solution.dont use western education to trick them because you feel they are backward and not intelligent.i even suggested in my first post that you can also give these people scholarship to study in progressive muslim countries.

the kind of attitude that is displayed in this forum when tackling issues concerning the north is not one aimed at finding the solutions.you're only good in condemning others and pushing the blame.then what?has the problem disappeared?

you also keep talking about "imam" or muslim leaders.do you know that there are more intelligent and educated imams than there are pastors?its all about education.is Pastor Terry Jones not educated?is he not christian?is he not a fanatic?you can watch here and see the difference between an educated imam and an educated pastor and judge for yourself:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQyBvT66lPM

In Lagos, the area boys commit atrocities for their own personal gain, not because they are defenders of Christianity. There is no biblical verse supporting their action. One of the fundamental principles of Christianity is not to commit violence or revenge, even if you were a victim of violence. Vengeance, the Bible says, should be left to God. Maybe Islam has verses that could be interpreted by extremists to support their violent actions.

if extremist can find the energy to "interprete" or rather you should say "misinterprete" verses,then is Islam to blame?you are providing my answers with your expressions.

Below are some of the verses in Islam that could be used to justify violence:

Bottom line is that Islam has verses whose interpretation could be broad and extreme, and which has been used by extremists and Jihadists to support violence. Christianity denounces and repudiates violence in any form, shape, or fashion.

i have explained by using the analogy of "knife" to explain islam.see my previous post.

of all the verses presented,i can read no where to kill innocent people.in all the verses you presented,we are told to defend ourselves and fight those who fight us.but if they want peace we must also incline to peace.just the way there are verses which talks about defence,there are also verses which talk of peace and when not to fight.all the verses you presented and all the battles fought by the early muslims and led by our beloved Prophet (pbuh),not one was offensive in nature.all were defensive.of all the verses you presented,the people the muslims were fighting were fought because they had lauched attacks on muslims.the guidelines are clear.if anyone wants to simply enter a church and start killing people because they are worshipping a man,then that is not islam.

pro01:

I'm always amused at how you muslims just love to use the word 'ignorant' to impugn individuals who question your exclusive use of violence for religious ends. Okay, assuming (but not conceding) that I am indeed ignorant, how else can you shame me if not by CLEARLY refuting the 'ignorant' claims I made in the earlier post? Again, I have to question your education or your honesty. It's either you cannot comprehend the written word, or you deceitfully prefer to use diversionary tactics to deflect attention from the simple questions I earlier asked - for which you obviously have no answers.

By the way, It's very funny that you cited MEND as a counter example of southern violence. Lol. Nobody claimed that violence (in general) is an exclusively northern phenomenon. What I am saying, and for which I DARE YOU to cite a counter example, is that: Religious violence (or violence with a religious undertone, e.g. burning of churches) is an EXCLUSIVELY Islamic phenomenon. What has MEND got to do with that? Our bad leaders or corrupt government has NOTHING to do with the perennial and idiotic violence of northern muslims. Afterall, the effects of poverty and bad governance are felt in the South as much as in the North, so what gives? Have you ever heard of the hungry and unemployed youths in the South waking up one morning in frustration to attack Hausas living in their midst, or burn down Mosques? Smh. The fact remains that Northern Muslims are violent beasts with a fatally potent blend of religious extremism, illiteracy and poverty - underpinned by deep-rooted inferiority complex mixed with emotional instability. They need help, serious help.

If you think and analyse objectively, you would know that these almajiris also attacked the Emir, the Vice president (who  muslim), many other muslims and non-muslims they perceived to be the reason why they are suffering. Remember these ppl lack education(bcs of gov neglect) to be able to know what is right from wrong; I CAN TELL YOU THAT AT THAT POINT IN TIME, IF JOHN MOMMOH(CPC chairman) or YINKA ODUMAKIN(CPC spokeperson) should near them, THEY WOULD NOT HESITATE TO LYNCH THEM TO DEATH!

ALSO, HAVE U WONDERED WHY THE ALMAJIRIS SEE BOMB PRODUCTION AS JOB AND MEANS OF LIVELIHOOD -If you don't know it is simply bcs there is no job to survive on.

Or don't you think there are muslims in the south; and how many times have they attacked you or your churches? So why should you condemn the entire muslim if not that you lack knowledge about what is called FALLACY, which you have committed by GENERALISING. Education does not automatically makes your IQ improves, it only expose you to the world and get you enlightened. SOLUDO IS A PROF OF ECONOMICS ( and our banking industry almost collapsed while he was there), while SANUSI(Almajiri), WHOM I'M NOT SURE HAS PHDCAME TO THE SCENE AND FIXED SOME STUFF. SOME OF THESE ALMAJIRIS HAVE BETTER IQ THAN YOU, BUT THEY ARE NOT OPPORTUNE TO HAVE EDUCATION.

If you remember, you would know that the IGBOS went into civil war with Nigeria bcs they were aggrieved; the YORUBAS went on rampage and started burning houses, cars and killing ppl(mostly Hausas) in 1993 bcs they felt cheated for annulling and subsequently killing MKO in 1995. The same way the likes of Asari Dokuboh, Tom Atake etc were leading ppl to wreck havock on oil installations bcs they felt that gov is cheating them. WAKE UP TO THESE FACTS BRODA!!!

FOR ME, YOU HAVE NOT ANALYSED ANYTHING HERE THAN CONDEMNING THE MUSLIMS WHICH IN ITS OWN SELF IS INCITING VIOLENCE, RATHER THAN LOOKING AT THE PROBLEM AND SUGGESTING POSSIBLE SOLUTIONS.

LagosShia:

Dubai is found in the United Arab Emirates and not in Texas.bring american engineers and professionals to build a city like Dubai in northern Nigeria.are the almajiris tying your hands?why dont you do it?

islam has nothing against education.many in the north have the wrong perception that western education is used to trick their children into christianity because of the bad record the missionaries have set with their perfected art of deception.in my first post here (see page no. 2) i cited well educated muslim scholars like Ahmad Deedat and Hassanain Rajabali who had western education and speak english fluently.these are two men that can cause nightmare for any christian missionary.if you give western education of those two men who defend islam in english to the almajiris,they will be more than grateful.if you give the almajiris good education that would be the solution.dont use western education to trick them because you feel they are backward and not intelligent.

I did give credit to the Muslims whose effort helped to create Dubai, even if it meant that they had to bring in American engineers to help them do so. I also said that many of the Muslims who run Dubai are educated, and that we need to provide western education to these Almajri kids as well as Islamic education. You do not have to trade one for the other. I don't think anyone would use western education to trick them. To alleviate this issue, they may even hire Muslim intellectuals and teachers to teach them. And, yes, foreign engineers and investors, for example, Asian, German, and American engineers are in Lagos helping to build the city. The leaders in the North can take a cue from Fashola and start developing the North.

LagosShia:


you also keep talking about "imam" or muslim leaders.do you know that there are more intelligent and educated imams than there are pastors?its all about education.is Pastor Terry Jones not educated?is he not christian?is he not a fanatic?you can watch here and see the difference between an educated imam and an educated pastor and judge for yourself:

I never said the Imams or Muslim leaders are not educated. As a matter of fact, My argument pointed to the fact that they are educated and do not want the same education for the Almajiri children so that the children will not have the educated minds to form an informed opinion about certain issues. That way, these educated Imams can easily control these kids and use them to commit violence in furtherance of their own financial or political interests or the like.

LagosShia:


of all the verses presented,i can read no where to kill innocent people.in all the verses you presented,we are told to defend ourselves and fight those who fight us.but if they want peace we must also incline to peace.just the way there are verses which talks about defence,there are also verses which talk of peace and when not to fight.all the verses you presented and all the battles fought by the early muslims and led by our beloved Prophet (pbuh),not one was offensive in nature.all were defensive.of all the verses you presented,the people the muslims were fighting were fought because they had lauched attacks on muslims.the guidelines are clear.if anyone wants to simply enter a church and start killing people because they are worshipping a man,then that is not islam.

As someone who has also studied the Quran, you are right in that the Quran advocates using those violent acts in self-defense and fighting against those who wage war against Islam; and that some of the verses chronicled historical events of battles fought by Muslims. One problem, however, is that the meaning of self-defense and fighting  the oppressed are not defined in the Quran. Osama Bin Laden claimed he was defending Islam when he killed over 3,000 innocent Americans in the September 11 attacks. Osama claimed he was fighting the U.S. because the U.S. waged war against Islam. Boko Haram claimed they are fighting those who wage war against Islam and that it was defending Islam when it killed innocent Nigerians who were supposedly reading western education--that western education is anti Islam.

The recent Almajiris who amputated 150 corpers claimed the corpers waged war against Islam by helping Jonathan win against over Buhari, which was their Islamic candidate. The Almajirs most likely used 5:36 to justify their actions, which says that the punishment for those who wage war against God and his disciples is that their hands and feet be cut, among others.

Another problem, however, is that the Quran did not restrict the timeline of the events to the time it happened. Many extremists think that those commands are open-ended and can still be applied today. Neither the Quran nor Islamic scholars have said that those events are an anachronism of modern rules of engagement.

kokogee:

If you think and analyse objectively, you would know that these almajiris also attacked the Emir, the Vice president (who  muslim), many other muslims and non-muslims they perceived to be the reason why they are suffering. Remember these ppl lack education(bcs of gov neglect) to be able to know what is right from wrong; I CAN TELL YOU THAT AT THAT POINT IN TIME, IF JOHN MOMMOH(CPC chairman) or YINKA ODUMAKIN(CPC spokeperson) should near them, THEY WOULD NOT HESITATE TO LYNCH THEM TO DEATH!

ALSO, HAVE U WONDERED WHY THE ALMAJIRIS SEE BOMB PRODUCTION AS JOB AND MEANS OF LIVELIHOOD -If you don't know it is simply bcs there is no job to survive on.

Or don't you think there are muslims in the south; and how many times have they attacked you or your churches? So why should you condemn the entire muslim if not that you lack knowledge about what is called FALLACY, which you have committed by GENERALISING. Education does not automatically makes your IQ improves, it only expose you to the world and get you enlightened. SOLUDO IS A PROF OF ECONOMICS ( and our banking industry almost collapsed while he was there), while SANUSI(Almajiri), WHOM I'M NOT SURE HAS PHDCAME TO THE SCENE AND FIXED SOME STUFF. SOME OF THESE ALMAJIRIS HAVE BETTER IQ THAN YOU, BUT THEY ARE NOT OPPORTUNE TO HAVE EDUCATION.

If you remember, you would know that the IGBOS went into civil war with Nigeria bcs they were aggrieved; the YORUBAS went on rampage and started burning houses, cars and killing ppl(mostly Hausas) in 1993 bcs they felt cheated for annulling and subsequently killing MKO in 1995. The same way the likes of Asari Dokuboh, Tom Atake etc were leading ppl to wreck havock on oil installations bcs they felt that gov is cheating them. WAKE UP TO THESE FACTS BRODA!!!

FOR ME, YOU HAVE NOT ANALYSED ANYTHING HERE THAN CONDEMNING THE MUSLIMS WHICH IN ITS OWN SELF IS INCITING VIOLENCE, RATHER THAN LOOKING AT THE PROBLEM AND SUGGESTING POSSIBLE SOLUTIONS.

Throwing darts at my IQ cannot and will not deflect attention from your (manifestly low) comprehension ability. Again you are clutching at straws and citing ludicrous counter-examples - having failed miserably to prove my 'ignorance'. Any Emir or whatever Hausa/Muslim figure that was attacked by these senseless zombies after the elections was attacked because of their supposed 'support' for the PDP candidate Jonathan - who is a Christian, and therefore an "Infidel". According to the pathetic doctrines propagated by Arab/northern Muslims and their Koran, He who supports an 'infidel' ought to be treated as an infidel (I suppose). That punctures your woeful attempt to de-emphasize the religious/tribal coloration of the senseless violence in the MUSLIM NORTH (and I emphasize MUSLIM NORTH, because I know Yoruba/Southern Muslims to be devoid of such extremist nonsense that has afflicted their northern counterparts). Also, your claim that Tony Momoh (Chairman of Buhari's party) would have been "lynched to death" had he been "near" the rioters is at best speculative, and therefore inadmissible. My fair guess, however, is that he would not have been attacked if the zombies realize that he is pro-Buhari; he would only be attacked in the ignorance of the zombies - if they do not know who he is, and see him as another random Southern 'infidel'. But then, all of that is speculative.

Furthermore. the so-called rampage by the Yorubas in protest against the June 12 Annulment was not targeted at Hausa people. I was in Lagos during that period and I can tell that no community of Hausas was specifically targeted, nor was any Mosque burnt. It was simply an outbreak of civil disturbance (akin to that witnessed recently in Tunisia and Egypt); it was not sectional/ethnic, neither was it religious. Maybe you are too young to have witnessed what happened during that period, or maybe you did witness it. . .but your selective amnesia leads you to distort facts.

Lastly, your examples on Asari Dokubo and Ateke Tom are asinine to say the least. DID THEY DESTROY OIL INSTALLATIONS IN THE NAME OF ANY RELIGION? DID THEY ATTACK HAUSA/FULANIS IN THE NIGER DELTA  (who are after all the parasitic ethnic group that feasts on the South South's oil without giving nothing back)? ? ? ? ? ?  I believe you are literate enough to read that my primary concern has to do with frequent resort to violence in the name of RELIGION and ETHNICITY; something that is EXCLUSIVELY attributable to the MUSLIM NORTH! Gosh. I wonder whether some of you are just too dense to reason contextually. If you can't address the main issues/questions I raised in the initial post, then I suggest we quit the chit-chat. I have some rice and chicken to eat this Easter. . .Off I go.

@ziccot, u thought i wud waste  my time providing evidence to brainwashed islams who need brain transplant to retain information buhahaaaaaaaaa

You seem to have misunderstood me or you purposely chose to misrepresent what I have written. I did not in anywhere state that the "the Almajiris went Sharia" but rather the states with a lot of Almajiris went Sharia to try to frustrate OBJ. My response was to the effect that the federal government has been trying for a long time to help the states with these Alamajiris since the 1970s. You were quick to chip in MEND in your comment and they started getting special treatment from the federal govt only within the last five years while these Almajiri states have been benefitting from the federal govt for decades.

a) States did no such thing ,  . .  Sharia was not to frustrate Obasanjo. For one, States cannot out of the blues decide on sharia and then implement it, it has to be made part of the constitution, which they did back in, I believe 1999/2000.

b)The federal Government, has been trying in much the same way it has been "TRYING" to fix the Education system in Nigeria. It is one thing to try and another to actually DO SOMETHING to fix the problem -- that is the Nigerian dilemma and this is no different

c) Please go back and re-read my comment. I don't believe I included the MEND acronym anywhere in it to you.  You must be responding to the wrong post, if u

My point is, the state Governors (who incidentally are predominantly non PDP by the way) went Sharia to frustrate any effort by the govt to try to dig into their activities. They hide under the cloak of religion to frustrate any effort. Sharia do exist and it has everything to do with the current condition up north. No other law can supercede the sharia (according to the islamic teachings). Western education is taught to be hated because it is supposed to undermine Sharia (hence Boko Haram meaning "Education (western in this case) is a sin". When these Almajiris are raised to accept this teachings how can you make them accept western education? Religion and politics is a dangerous mix and it will be better to seperate religion and state. I schooled in Nigeria and had the opportunity to mix with northern students and you need to know how much they get as scholarships from their state governments while the other students can only dream. 

a) Again, when Sharia was installed, majority of the state governors were PDP -- but I don't see how that should still be the issue NOW when it is clear that the situation is not about Sharia

b) No other law can supersede Probably stems from the fact that SHARIA IS CONSTITUTIONALLY accepted?

c) Could you please stay away from the assertions that are not even connected to this discussion?

d) The poor and helpless in society have these schools available to them because the schools tend to cater to their feeding, sheltering and religious needs. Unless you are about to tell us that the western designed schools in the North do exactly the same, then I suggest you please stop with the round-aboutr debating.

For the record, there are a lot of other poor people in the north that are not Almajiris and are not muslims. You do not hear them causing all these troubles. I am sure you have heard of the Jukuns.

This thread is on almajiris. But in general you have a huge population of poor people up North -- almost 80% of the population in some states. That you know that there are non muslims as well who also number among the poor, should clue you into the fact that these debates on Islam/Sharia etc is NOT the SOLUTION. The solution would be more with programs that help educate and equip the millions of poor in these societies so they can better contribute to their communities. Right now they do not have em.

Princek12:

The recent Almajiris who amputated 150 corpers claimed the corpers waged war against Islam by helping Jonathan win against over Buhari, which was their Islamic candidate. The Almajirs most likely used 5:36 [size=18pt]to justify their actions[/size][/color], which says that the punishment for those who wage war against God and his disciples is that their hands and feet be cut, among others.

Another problem, however, is that the Quran did not restrict the [color=#990000][size=18pt]timeline of the events [/size] to the[b] [size=18pt]time it happened[/size][/b]. Many extremists [size=18pt]think[/size] that those commands are [size=18pt]open-ended [/size] and [size=18pt]can still be applied today[/size]. [size=18pt]Neither the Quran nor Islamic scholars have said[/size] that those events are an anachronism of modern rules of engagement.

HOLY QURAN 2:190:

[size=18pt]Fight[/size] in the way of Allah [size=18pt]against those who fight against you[/size], but[b] [size=18pt]begin not hostilities[/size][/b]. Lo! [size=18pt]Allah loveth not aggressors[/size].

I think one fundamental fact which we have to consider here is that the Quranic education of the Almajiris hardly prepares them to be productive members of a modern economy.   This basically means that  a large part of Nigeria's  human resource base made up of millions of these young men, is not contributing anything to our economic growth, and is in fact a negative factor.  As such our leaders must now take steps to address this shameful and senseless state of affairs by setting up an independent commission solely dedicated to resolving the problem.  Muslim leaders must also be made to understand that these young men are Nigerians first and foremost and the fact that they are also muslims should be secondary in a secular state like Nigeria.   As such while they can receive religious instruction and training if they so wish,  they should also receive training and vocational education that would qualify them to make a decent living for themselves while at the same time also making a meaningful and positive economic contribution to the society in which they live.   There is a time and place for everything and it appears that the Almajiri educational system has outlived its usefulness. In this regard one only has to look at even Saudi Arabia the birth place of Islam to realise that they have moved on and embraced the modern age and Western education with its emphasis on the acquisition of analytical and critical thinking skills that prepare young men and women for the job market and allow them to pursue careers that have nothing to do with religious teaching and instruction.  This reform  process, known as the Tatweer project was started in 2006 by the Saudi monarch  King Abdullah bin Abdulaziz.  If the Saudis can do it, why not Northern Nigeria?

^Very Good Points!

@Lagosshia

there is something totally wrong in islamic teaching and dat is absence of fundamental law on life and blood.
When u include the fundamental law of love and respect for life in your teachings, then u will learn not to indulge in war with your fellow humans. and this is where christianity is far ahead of islamic religion.

are you sure on that?

HOLY QURAN 5:32:
whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely.

(SHOW ME ONE VERSE FROM THE ENTIRE BIBLE LIKE THE ABOVE!)

^^^^Imagine the rubbish you wrote here above?


HOLY QURAN 2:190:
Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you, but begin not hostilities. Lo! Allah loveth not aggressors.

HOLY QURAN 7:55:
(O mankind!) Call upon your Lord humbly and in secret. Lo! He loveth not aggressors.

HOLY QURAN 8:61:
"But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace, and trust in Allah: for He is the One that Heareth and Knoweth (all things)."

HOLY QURAN 5:2:
" ,  and let not the hatred of some people in (once) shutting you out of the Sacred Mosque lead you to transgression (and hostility on your part). Help ye one another in righteousness and piety, but help ye not one another in sin and rancour: fear Allah: for Allah is strict in punishment."

HOLY QURAN 41:34:
"Nor can Goodness and Evil be equal. Repel (Evil) with what is better: then will he between whom and thee was hatred become as it were thy friend and intimate!"

HOLY QURAN 4:135:
"O ye who believe! stand out firmly for justice, as witnesses to Allah, even as against yourselves, or your parents, or your kin, and whether it be (against) rich or poor: for Allah can best protect both. Follow not the lusts (of your hearts), lest ye swerve, and if ye distort (justice) or decline to do justice, verily Allah is well-acquainted with all that ye do."

HOLY QURAN 16:90
"God advocates justice, charity, and regarding the relatives. And He forbids evil, vice, and transgression. He enlightens you, that you may take heed."

HOLY QURAN 16:126:
"And if ye do punish them, punish them no worse than they punished you: but if ye show patience, that is indeed the best (course) for those who are patient."

HOLY QURAN 21:107:
"And we have not sent you but as a mercy for the world"

^^^^^^^^^
LagosShia: Lovely quotes but the problem is that these Almanjiris and their Teachers dont PUT THESE LINES INTO PRACTICE and going by what you've written, l doubt IF YOU WOULD PUT SAME INTO PRACTICE, if you were in their shoes right now.



@PrinceK12

Americans investment and influence of western culture predominantly contributed to the development Dubai, which was built for tourism and business. Dubai also aimed to copy western culture. Many western investors said from the outset that if the strict Islamic laws were not relaxed, then they will not invest in Dubai. In any event, it is noteworthy that Dubai is still run by Muslims, many of whom were educated in the Europe and America, which is what we are advocating for. You can see that educated Muslims are less likely to be brainwashed into Islamic extremism than uneducated Muslims, and are less susceptible to be swayed by Imams who have an extremist view of the Quran. This is why we are advocating educating those Almajiri kids.

In Lagos, the area boys commit atrocities for their own personal gain, not because they are defenders of Christianity. There is no biblical verse supporting their action. One of the fundamental principles of Christianity is not to commit violence or revenge, even if you were a victim of violence. Vengeance, the Bible says, should be left to God. Maybe Islam has verses that could be interpreted by extremists to support their violent actions.

^^^^This is absolutely spot-on

Below are some of the verses in Islam that could be used to justify violence:

The following are only some of the verses in the Qur'an that can and have been used in the history of Islam in support of violence in the name of God and the glories of martyrdom in a holy war.

2:190-193 "Fight in the cause of God those who fight you ,  And slay them wherever ye catch them ,  And fight them on until there is no more tumult or oppression and there prevail justice and faith in God , "

2:216 "Fighting is prescribed for you and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But God knoweth and ye know not."

2:224 "Then fight in the cause of God and know that God heareth and knoweth all things."

3:157-158 "And if ye are slain or die in the way of God, forgiveness and mercy from God are far better than all they could amass. And if ye die, or are slain, Lo! It is unto God that ye are brought together."

3:169 "Think not of those who are slain in God's way as dead. Nay, they live finding their sustenance in the presence of their Lord."

3:195 ",  Those who have ,  fought or been slain, verily I will blot out from them their iniquities and admit them into Gardens with rivers flowing beneath; a reward from the presence of God , "

4:101 ",  For the Unbelievers are unto you open enemies."

4:74, 75 "Let those fight in the cause of God who sell the life of this world for the Hereafter. To him who fighteth in the cause of God whether he is slain or gets victory, soon shall we give him a reward of great (value). Those who believe fight in the cause of God and those who reject faith fight in the cause of evil, so fight ye against the friends of Satan, feeble indeed is the cunning of Satan."

4:89 "They but wish that ye should reject faith as they do, and thus be on the same footing as they. But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of God. But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them…"

4:95 "Not equal are those believers who sit at (at home) and receive no hurt and those who strive and fight in the cause of God with their goods and their persons. God hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than those who sit (at home).

5:36 "The punishment of those who wage war against God and His apostle and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land. That is their disgrace in this world and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter."

5:54 "O ye who believe. Take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors. They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them. Verily God guideth not a people unjust."

8:12-17 "Remember thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): "I am with you. Give firmness to the believers. I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers. Smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger tips off them. This because they contend against God and his apostle. If any contend against God and his apostle, God is strict in punishment ,  O ye who believe. When ye meet the unbelievers in hostile array, never turn your backs to them. If any do turn his back to them on such a day, unless it be a stratagem of war ,  he draws on himself the wrath of God and his abode is Hell, an evil refuge (indeed)."

8:59-60 "Let not the unbelievers think that they can get the better (of the godly). They will never frustrate (them). Against them make ready your strength to the utmost of your power, including steeds of war, to strike terror into (the hearts of) the enemies of God and your enemies and others besides, whom ye may not know, but whom God doth know , "

8:65 "O apostle! Rouse the believers to the fight. If there are twenty amongst you, patient and persevering, they will vanquish two hundred. If a hundred they will vanquish a thousand of the unbelievers, for these are a people without understanding."

9:5 ",  fight and slay the pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war) , "

9:14 "Fight them, and God will punish them by your hands, cover them with shame , "

9:29 "Fight those who believe not in God nor the Last Day nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by God and his apostle nor acknowledge the Religion of Truth (even if they are) of the people of the Book, until they pay the Jizya [religious tax] with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

47:4 "Therefore, when ye meet the unbelievers, smite at their necks, at length when ye have thoroughly subdued them, bind a bond firmly (on them) ,  but if it had been God's will, he could certainly have exacted retribution from them (himself), but (he lets you fight) in order to test you, some with others. But those who are slain in the way of God, he will never let their deeds be lost."

61:4 "Truly God loves those who fight in His cause in battle array, as if they were a solid cemented structure."


Worthy of taking note is 5:36, which has allegedly been used recently by Almajiris to support their amputation of150 Youth Corpers in Kaduna State. See http://www.talkofnaija.com/news/150-youth-corpers-amputated-kaduna-state.
This bastardly act should be repudiated by any sane human being.


Bottom line is that Islam has verses whose interpretation could be broad and extreme, and which has been used by extremists and Jihadists to support violence. Christianity denounces and repudiates violence in any form, shape, or fashion. You cannot deny the existence and prevalence of terrorist groups within and beyond the shores of Nigeria, all of which justify their actions with the Quran.
As someone who has also studied the Quran, you are right in that the Quran advocates using those violent acts in self-defense and fighting against those who wage war against Islam; and that some of the verses chronicled historical events of battles fought by Muslims. One problem, however, is that the meaning of self-defense and fighting  the oppressed are not defined in the Quran. Osama Bin Laden claimed he was defending Islam when he killed over 3,000 innocent Americans in the September 11 attacks. Osama claimed he was fighting the U.S. because the U.S. waged war against Islam. Boko Haram claimed they are fighting those who wage war against Islam and that it was defending Islam when it killed innocent Nigerians who were supposedly reading western education--that western education is anti Islam.

The recent Almajiris who amputated 150 corpers claimed the corpers waged war against Islam by helping Jonathan win against over Buhari, which was their Islamic candidate. The Almajirs most likely used 5:36 to justify their actions, which says that the punishment for those who wage war against God and his disciples is that their hands and feet be cut, among others.

Another problem, however, is that the Quran did not restrict the timeline of the events to the time it happened. Many extremists think that those commands are open-ended and can still be applied today. Neither the Quran nor Islamic scholars have said that those events are an anachronism of modern rules of engagement.

I read both post, having read the previous “spirited defence” of these callous and mindless murders by Northern Youths (Almanjiris) by LagosShia and l am shocked that despite what happened, some Muslims still think it can be justified?
ALL Muslims are not bad or violent, for one. The Religion itself, which is the same practiced by Muslims in the South, did not put the knife or Gun in their hands to kill: THESE MURDEROUS CREATURES ARE JUST BLOOD-THIRSTY, AB-INITIO!
Let us condemn what is patently EVIL, instead of wasting energy on silly and obviously senseless arguments. NO ONE SHOULD KILL ON BEHALF OF GOD, HE DOES NOT NEED HELP BECAUSE HE IS POWERFUL THAN ALL THE MOST POWERFUL ARMIES COMBINED.

What more can a government do, despite all the scholarships that Northern children are "gifted" and there Southern counterparts are not, yet the ones in the South are always eager to embrace education while the ones in the North are discouraged by their parents from taking advantage of these opportunities! It is no secret that "all you need to do as a Northerner, is to manage and just complete the schooling-cycle and you're made for life! Same cannot be said of Southern, educated Youths! Yet, we are deceiving ourselves like these Northern kids and their parents are interested in Western Education  

Enough of these stupidly-silly justifications and defense!

@kulutempa

TRUE TALK MY BROTHER. THIS PEOPLE MUST LEARN TO EMBRACE THE MODERN CIVILIZED WORLD AND CEASE FROM BACKWARDNESS, HATE, INTOLERANCE, RETROGRESSION, MURDER AND BARBARISM IN THE NAME OF THEIR RELIGION.

THEY SHOULD ALSO LEARN TO CONDEMN VIOLENCE IN ANY FORM AND STOP JUSTIFYING IT BY QUOTING FROM ANY BOOK.

THIS COUNTRY SHOULD MOVE FORWARD AND NOT DRAWN BACK BY A SECTION OF CIVILIZATION, IN THIS COUNTRY, THAT IS SLOW TO EMBRACE WESTERN EDUCATION.

GOD BLESS US ALL. OUR DESTINY IS IN OUR HAND

lastpage:

I read both post, having read the previous “spirited defence” of these callous and mindless murders by Northern Youths (Almanjiris) by LagosShia and l am shocked that despite what happened, some Muslims still think it can be justified?

you really mis-read.you should read again.

rafhell:

@kulutempa

TRUE TALK MY BROTHER. THIS PEOPLE MUST LEARN TO EMBRACE THE MODERN CIVILIZED WORLD AND CEASE FROM BACKWARDNESS, HATE, INTOLERANCE, RETROGRESSION, MURDER AND BARBARISM IN THE NAME OF THEIR RELIGION.

THEY SHOULD ALSO LEARN TO CONDEMN VIOLENCE IN ANY FORM AND STOP JUSTIFYING IT BY QUOTING FROM ANY BOOK.

THIS COUNTRY SHOULD MOVE FORWARD AND NOT DRAWN BACK BY A SECTION OF CIVILIZATION, IN THIS COUNTRY, THAT IS SLOW TO EMBRACE WESTERN EDUCATION.

GOD BLESS US ALL. OUR DESTINY IS IN OUR HAND

"these people MUST learn", how do they learn if they are not taught?

you sound like a dictator with your "should" and "must".you dont sound normal,am sorry to say.you are not talking like someone interested in finding solutions.if you've followed the posts so far,you should be able to come up with solutions.all you do is to bring in confrontation.no one is interested in fighting you here with verbal attacks and insults.

I HAVE TO PUT THIS IN CAPITALS TO MAKE A BOLD ADVICE TO ALL WHO REALLY WANT TO KNOW THE TRUTH.

ALL NYSC MEMBERS FROM THE SOUTH SHOULD NOT GO AND SERVE ANYWHERE IN THE NORTH IF YOU TRULY VALUE YOUR LIFE.
YOU DO NOT NEED THE NYSC TO SUCCEED IN NIGERIA.

THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT CANNOT GUARANTY THE SECURITY OF ANY NYSC MEMBER.

I RECEIVE REPORTS FROM CORPS MEMBERS WHO HAVE DENOUNCED THE PROGRAMME AND IT IS A WASTE OF PUBLIC FUNDS.

ALMAJIRIS HAVE BEEN IN EXISTENCE SINCE THE PROPHET MUHAMMAD (PBUH) AND FORGET ALL THE LIP SERVICE AND EYE SERVICE OF ISLAM AS A RELIGION OF PEACE AND ALL THAT JAZZ. IT IS FUNDAMENTAL FOR MUSLIMS TO SEE AND TREAT NON-MUSLIMS AS INFIDELS AND AS IGBOS KNOW, THE EASIEST WAY TO UNLEASH TERROR ON IGBOS OR NON MUSLIMS IN THE NORTH IS SIMPLY TO ACCUSE ANYONE OF THEM OF INSULTING THEIR PROPHET OR THEIR QUO RAN AND THEY WILL LYNCH THEIR TARGET PUBLICLY.

THE RECURRENT MAYHEM WILL NEVER END.
THE PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION WAS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THEM TO ATTACK NON-MUSLIMS AND THEY WILL FIND OTHER OPPORTUNITIES TO DO SO IN FUTURE.

MAJORITY OF THEM STILL LIVE AS IF THEY ARE IN THE DARK AGES AND THEIR QUO RAN IS THE ONLY THING THEY ACCEPT AND ANY TRUE CHRISTIAN WHO HAS READ IT KNOWS THE TRUTH THAT TO ACCEPT THE QUO RAN IS TO REJECT JESUS CHRIST. BECAUSE THE QUO RAN WAS WRITTEN TO COUNTER THE HOLY BIBLE AND TO SUBSTITUTE WHATEVER IS IN THE BIBLE WITH THEIR OWN DEFENSE.

THE SAME ALMAJIRIS WHO COLLECT MONEY AND FOOD FROM YOU TODAY CAN SLAY YOU TOMORROW WITHOUT REMORSE.


WHEN THE INEC OFFICE IN SULEIJA WAS BOMBED, THAT WAS ENOUGH SIGNAL THAT THE FG HAS FAILED TO SECURE THE LIVES AND PROPERTIES OF INNOCENT INEC STAFF.


THE PROBLEM WITH NIGERIANS IS THAT THEY LOVE FOOLING THEMSELVES.  

WE SHOULD STOP FOOLING OURSELVES AND SAVE OUR PRECIOUS LIVES.

DEVIL PUNISH ALL OF YOU THAT KEEP JUSTIFYING YOUR EVIL BROTHERS IN THE NORTH. MAY ALL OF YOU FACE THE SAME FATE AND EVEN WORSE AS THE INNOCENT YOUTH COPPERS AND SO CALLED "INFIDELS" KILLED THAT WERE MURDERED UNJUSTLY.

DEVILS!!

Orikinla:

I HAVE TO PUT THIS IN CAPITALS TO MAKE A BOLD ADVICE TO ALL WHO REALLY WANT TO KNOW THE TRUTH.

ALL NYSC MEMBERS FROM THE SOUTH SHOULD NOT GO AND SERVE ANYWHERE IN THE NORTH IF YOU TRULY VALUE YOUR LIFE.
YOU DO NOT NEED THE NYSC TO SUCCEED IN NIGERIA.

THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT CANNOT GUARANTY THE SECURITY OF ANY NYSC MEMBER.

I RECEIVE REPORTS FROM CORPS MEMBERS WHO HAVE DENOUNCED THE PROGRAMME AND IT IS A WASTE OF PUBLIC FUNDS.

ALMAJIRIS HAVE BEEN IN EXISTENCE SINCE THE PROPHET MUHAMMAD (PBUH) AND FORGET ALL THE LIP SERVICE AND EYE SERVICE OF ISLAM AS A RELIGION OF PEACE AND ALL THAT JAZZ. IT IS FUNDAMENTAL FOR MUSLIMS TO SEE AND TREAT NON-MUSLIMS AS INFIDELS AND AS IGBOS KNOW, THE EASIEST WAY TO UNLEASH TERROR ON IGBOS OR NON MUSLIMS IN THE NORTH IS SIMPLY TO ACCUSE ANYONE OF THEM OF INSULTING THEIR PROPHET OR THEIR QUO RAN AND THEY WILL LYNCH THEIR TARGET PUBLICLY.

THE RECURRENT MAYHEM WILL NEVER END.
THE PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION WAS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THEM TO ATTACK NON-MUSLIMS AND THEY WILL FIND OTHER OPPORTUNITIES TO DO SO IN FUTURE.

MAJORITY OF THEM STILL LIVE AS IF THEY ARE IN THE DARK AGES AND THEIR QUO RAN IS THE ONLY THING THEY ACCEPT AND ANY TRUE CHRISTIAN WHO HAS READ IT KNOWS THE TRUTH THAT TO ACCEPT THE QUO RAN IS TO REJECT JESUS CHRIST. BECAUSE THE QUO RAN WAS WRITTEN TO COUNTER THE HOLY BIBLE AND TO SUBSTITUTE WHATEVER IS IN THE BIBLE WITH THEIR OWN DEFENSE.

THE SAME ALMAJIRIS WHO COLLECT MONEY AND FOOD FROM YOU TODAY CAN SLAY YOU TOMORROW WITHOUT REMORSE.


WHEN THE INEC OFFICE IN SULEIJA WAS BOMBED, THAT WAS ENOUGH SIGNAL THAT THE FG HAS FAILED TO SECURE THE LIVES AND PROPERTIES OF INNOCENT INEC STAFF.


THE PROBLEM WITH NIGERIANS IS THAT THEY LOVE FOOLING THEMSELVES.   

WE SHOULD STOP FOOLING OURSELVES AND SAVE OUR PRECIOUS LIVES.

dont you think that with all the garbage you've spilled,we muslims must blame ourselves?dont you think its our fault?

dont you think all the garbage you've spilled against our religion (islam) muslims must blame themselves because if all of us think about "muslim and christian",all muslims should have voted for a muslim to become president (buhari).dont you think you're giving us cause to blame ourselves for voting for a christian and not a muslim?

remove the 5 million muslim votes GEJ got in the northern states from his 22 million votes=17 million.remove another 5 million from 17 million for the muslim votes in kwara,kogi and the south-west=12 million.add 10 million votes to buhari's 12 million=22 million=====>buhari becomes president and then you can show us your "christian almajiri" ignorance and we will blame it all on christianity and GEJ.

[size=18pt]YOU'RE NO DIFFERENT FROM VIOLENT ALMAJIRIS, IGNORANCE IS THE SAME WHETHER IT COMES FROM A MUSLIM OR A CHRISTIAN![/size]

what do you think?

They are animals in human form. When they start their madness, you would think blood don't flow in their vein, They came to my compound on monday and started scattering everywhere, threatning to break into our flat. I don't know who their informants are, they usually know where southerners are staying. Because am wondering how they got to know we stay in that building despite the fact that we are the only non-hausa there, and its barely one year we parked into the house. Thank God the building belongs to a very popular figure in kano, they would have burned down the building with the aim of burning us in it. The most annoying thing was that, they were chanting "allah hu akuba" (like it was their god that sent them).You need to see how we were smuggled out of the house in disguise. I have never worn an ijab in my life. I did that day o

Beync:

@ziccot, u thought i wud waste  my time providing evidence to brainwashed islams who need brain transplant to retain information buhahaaaaaaaaa

Nope. This is not about wasting 'your time', it is about you don't have facts. My take is that you should let us have mutual respect for one another. A religion, as I understand it, doesn't have any shortfall whatsoever except your religion is man-made.

Any negative thing you may conjured, uttered and practiced about a religion of GOD will always be a fallacy and lie, as HE creates this universe and knows what is best for you.

those pics shows these muslims are controversial arround the globe. the world knows u.

kofsy:

They are animals in human form. When they start their madness, you would think blood don't flow in their vein, They came to my compound on monday and started scattering everywhere, threatning to break into our flat. I don't know who their informants are, they usually know where southerners are staying. Because am wondering how they got to know we stay in that building despite the fact that we are the only non-hausa there, and its barely one year we parked into the house. Thank God the building belongs to a very popular figure in kano, they would have burned down the building with the aim of burning us in it. The most annoying thing was that, they were chanting "allah hu akuba" (like it was their god that sent them).You need to see how we were smuggled out of the house in disguise. I have never worn an ijab in my life. I did that day o

God hav mercy!

What we need at this juncture is a forum to re-negotiate our continual existence as a country.
It is dangerous to keep playing the ostrich.
All these debates & recriminations flying about on NL and nation-wide are not new.
They always feature after every cycle of MADNESS & WANTONESS and then time passes
and we forget, and carry on, until BOOM!!!!!!!! and the cycle continues.
This is simply one massacre too many!!!
Urgent & decisive actions needs to be taken NOW!!
WE NEED TO CONVOKE A SOVEREIGN NATIONAL CONFERENCE NOW!!!!!!

LagosShia:

HELLO?

You really want to know the facts of Islam?

Answer the following questions:

1. WHERE, WHEN AND HOW WAS PROPHET MUHAMMAD CONVERTED?

2. HOW DID AISHA BECOME HIS WIFE AND AT WHAT AGE DID HE SLEEP WITH HER?

3. HOW OLD WAS AISHA WHEN PROPHET MUHAMMAD DIED?

4. WHY WAS AISHA UNABLE TO HAVE ANY CHILD?

5. HOW OLD WAS PROPHET MUHAMMAD WHEN HE DIED?

6. HOW DID HE DIE? NATURALLY OR WAS POISONED? AND IF POISONED, BY WHOM?

7. WHAT CAUSED THE HOUSE ARREST OF AISHA AND HOW MANY PEOPLE WERE KILLED IN THE BATTLE OF CAMEL (JAMAL)?

“Magic was worked on Allah’s Apostle so that he used to think that he had sexual relations with his wives while he actually had not.”

~ Aisha (Bukhari 7,71,660)

FROM MY BOOK "UNVEIL ME MY LOVE" A FACTION ON THE FOUNDER OF ISLAM.
THE BOOK IS AVAILABLE ONLY UNDERGROUND.

Sopono:

What we need at this juncture is a forum to re-negotiate our continual existence as a country.
It is dangerous to keep playing the ostrich.
All these debates & recriminations flying about on NL and nation-wide are not new.
They always feature after every cycle of MADNESS & WANTONESS and then time passes
and we forget, and carry on, until BOOM!!!!!!!! and the cycle continues.
This is simply one massacre too many!!!
Urgent & decisive actions needs to be taken NOW!!
WE NEED TO CONVOKE A SOVEREIGN NATIONAL CONFERENCE NOW!!!!!!

 My brother, thanks a lot for making my day with this wonderful post of yours. The recurrent violence that usually left scores of dead bodies of fellow human being on its trail is condemned and nonsensical no matter the who be perpetrators, the reasons and gains behind such an action. No religion in the world condone such a barbaric act.

 In as much as people failed to dissociate Islam from this barbaric acts and think such an act is actually entrenched in Islam, this type of discussion would always result to hot arguments.

 To other forumites: all the happenings all over the world today that are being anchored on the neck of Islam are lies, barbaric and calculated attempts by the enemies of Islam to paint the Religion of Allah black. These people have failed because Allah in His Majesty is the one protecting Islam-His religion. We all remember the crusade and what happened to the Muslims. If not for this fact Islam would have been faced out.

 It is only a fool that would want to join these people in castigating Islam. If you don't know do some research. Internet is not alone about downloading movies.  

I am off this thread.

Orikinla:

I HAVE TO PUT THIS IN CAPITALS TO MAKE A BOLD ADVICE TO ALL WHO REALLY WANT TO KNOW THE TRUTH.

ALL NYSC MEMBERS FROM THE SOUTH SHOULD NOT GO AND SERVE ANYWHERE IN THE NORTH IF YOU TRULY VALUE YOUR LIFE.
YOU DO NOT NEED THE NYSC TO SUCCEED IN NIGERIA.

THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT CANNOT GUARANTY THE SECURITY OF ANY NYSC MEMBER.

I RECEIVE REPORTS FROM CORPS MEMBERS WHO HAVE DENOUNCED THE PROGRAMME AND IT IS A WASTE OF PUBLIC FUNDS.

ALMAJIRIS HAVE BEEN IN EXISTENCE SINCE THE PROPHET MUHAMMAD (PBUH) AND FORGET ALL THE LIP SERVICE AND EYE SERVICE OF ISLAM AS A RELIGION OF PEACE AND ALL THAT JAZZ. IT IS FUNDAMENTAL FOR MUSLIMS TO SEE AND TREAT NON-MUSLIMS AS INFIDELS AND AS IGBOS KNOW, THE EASIEST WAY TO UNLEASH TERROR ON IGBOS OR NON MUSLIMS IN THE NORTH IS SIMPLY TO ACCUSE ANYONE OF THEM OF INSULTING THEIR PROPHET OR THEIR QUO RAN AND THEY WILL LYNCH THEIR TARGET PUBLICLY.

THE RECURRENT MAYHEM WILL NEVER END.
THE PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION WAS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THEM TO ATTACK NON-MUSLIMS AND THEY WILL FIND OTHER OPPORTUNITIES TO DO SO IN FUTURE.

MAJORITY OF THEM STILL LIVE AS IF THEY ARE IN THE DARK AGES AND THEIR QUO RAN IS THE ONLY THING THEY ACCEPT AND ANY TRUE CHRISTIAN WHO HAS READ IT KNOWS THE TRUTH THAT TO ACCEPT THE QUO RAN IS TO REJECT JESUS CHRIST. BECAUSE THE QUO RAN WAS WRITTEN TO COUNTER THE HOLY BIBLE AND TO SUBSTITUTE WHATEVER IS IN THE BIBLE WITH THEIR OWN DEFENSE.

THE SAME ALMAJIRIS WHO COLLECT MONEY AND FOOD FROM YOU TODAY CAN SLAY YOU TOMORROW WITHOUT REMORSE.


WHEN THE INEC OFFICE IN SULEIJA WAS BOMBED, THAT WAS ENOUGH SIGNAL THAT THE FG HAS FAILED TO SECURE THE LIVES AND PROPERTIES OF INNOCENT INEC STAFF.


THE PROBLEM WITH NIGERIANS IS THAT THEY LOVE FOOLING THEMSELVES.

WE SHOULD STOP FOOLING OURSELVES AND SAVE OUR PRECIOUS LIVES.

VERY CORRECT

it appears that there is a systemic approach in this forum to spread propaganda against islam.i would not be suprised if i'm told that there are people paid by christian missionaries and evangelicals to spread falsehood about islam as part of a package to convert people to christianity and change Nigeria's demography by making christians a majority.

it seems logic and reasoning and intellect does not work with animals.ive tried to reason out and present things as they are and identify the problem and look for solutions.but all that is not enough.this is a political forum but people want to drag us into religion.that is what why i say the forum smells missionary.nontheless,i will reply to every insult and attempt made to blackmail islam and muslims in this particular thread.my message to the mercenaries of the missionaries is to give up on this thread.you will not succeed but you will fail here.so better run!

Orikinla:

HELLO?

You really want to know the facts of Islam?

Answer the following questions:

1. WHERE, WHEN AND HOW WAS PROPHET MUHAMMAD CONVERTED?

what does the above have to do with politics and the elections?why dont you go to the religion forum? shei na islam dey pain your belleh?that pain nor go stop!!! i will answer you still,

if you can tell me where and when Jesus was converted,i'd answer you.oh i forgot,your small "god" was converted by John the baptist.right?

2. HOW DID AISHA BECOME HIS WIFE AND AT WHAT AGE DID HE SLEEP WITH HER?

the age of Aisha is not certain.while sunni hadith books put her age as low as 6 years in for known reaons,it is historical recorded by historians and not hadiths compilers that Aisha's age was no less than 16 and she could have being up to 19 when she was married.the attempt to make Aisha look like a "child-bride" was to project an image of her that portrays innocence and that of a child brought up by the Prophet who could not harm a fly.this is perhaps an attitude which stems from her later actions after the demise of the Prophet and to cover up for her.if they could,they would have said Aisha was married to the Prophet from her mother's womb,all in a bid to make her look innocent and possibly divine.this topic on Aisha's age and the marriages of the Prophet have being discussed before on nairaland.i will quote an excerpt and provide the link (see post no.5 in particular):

Notes: (AISHA WAS NOT 9 YEARS OLD OR A CHILD WHEN THE PROPHET MARRIED HER)

[8] The popular version of ‘Ãisha’s youth age has been exploited by the anti-Islamic groups to attack the Prophet “for marrying a child”. The fact of the matter is that Lady ‘Ãisha was not a child when she was married in 2 AH to the Prophet. At-Tabari, the famous Muslim historian, writes that Abu Bakr’s first two wives and their children were all born in the pre-Islamic era. (Ta’rīkh at-Tabari, vol. 2 [Beirut: al-A‘lami, n.d.] p. 616.)  Based on this, even if she was born a year before the commencement of Islam, ‘Ãisha would be 15 or 16 years old at the time of her marriage to the Prophet – an age in which marriage is common in most cultures. Ibn Kathīr, in his al-Bidãyah wa ’n-Nihãyah (vol. 8, p. 381) states that Asmã’ bint Abu Bakr, the sister of ‘Ãisha, was ten years older than ‘Ãisha. He also reports that Asmã’ died in the year 73 AH at the age of 100. Based on this calculation, ‘Ãisha was 18 or 19 years old at the time of her marriage.

[9] For more details on the Islamic perspective, see my article, “Adoption in Islam,” which is available on-line at www.jaffari.org  (Section: Resources/ Resident Alim) and at www.al-islam.org

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-53711.0.html

3. HOW OLD WAS AISHA WHEN PROPHET MUHAMMAD DIED?

do the maths.

4. WHY WAS AISHA UNABLE TO HAVE ANY CHILD?

God only blessed the Prophet with chiildren from his widow-wife,his first wife,Khadijah,whom he married while he was younger than her with 15-25 years old.during her life time,he never took another wife for a period of 25 years.even after her death,he still used to praise her so much to the admiration of his wives.

5. HOW OLD WAS PROPHET MUHAMMAD WHEN HE DIED?

do you know that if not that i recall reading from here or there,this would not even bother me and i happen to be muslim while you're not?

he was about 62.

6. HOW DID HE DIE? NATURALLY OR WAS POISONED? AND IF POISONED, BY WHOM?

you're a fool.

well for those unsuspecting minds who dont know about the tactics of the missionaries,here is the gist about the Prophet's death:

there exist one nonsensical hadith which claims that the Prophet died as a result of the poison he consumed during the battle of khaybar.khaybar was a jewish fort that was conquered by the muslims after several jewish assaults on muslim traders,women and their (jewish) collaboration with pagan mecca against the muslims.when khaybar was conquered,a jewess prepared roasted meat and served to the Prophet.in her conscience,she wanted to know if Muhammad (sa) was a true prophet.according to jewish tradition a prophet cannot be killed.when she served the Prophet and a companion of his.the companion ate the meat.while the meat was served to the Prophet,he refused to eat.another version says the Prophet consumed the meat but spat it out and asked the woman why she poisoned his meat? he knew!the woman said she wanted to know if he was a true prophet.the woman was pardoned and she embraced islam.the Prophet survived yet another assasination attempt.

from the incident of khaybar to the time of the Prophet's death is about two and half years.the Prophet lived for more than 2 years after the incident that took place at khaybar.dear fellow human beings,please ask this "christian almajiri",which human being on the surface of this earth would consume poison today and live for 2 and half years?which human being would eat poison today and after more than 2 years,the cause of his death would be considered as "food poisoning"?this "christian almajiri" is more ignorant than the person who fabricated the nonsensical hadith that the Prophet died of poisoning while he survived the attempt.

7. WHAT CAUSED THE HOUSE ARREST OF AISHA AND HOW MANY PEOPLE WERE KILLED IN THE BATTLE OF CAMEL (JAMAL)?

Aisha was arrested by women sent by the 1st Imam of the Shia and son-in-law of the Prophet,Imam Ali (who is also the 4th caliph).the issue of Aisha is a contentious issue between sunnis and shia.i as a Shia Muslim,do admit the rebellious nature of Aisha and we infact dislike her character and everything about her.while to sunnis,her image is still panel-beated and respected since she happens to be the daughter of the 1st sunni caliph,abu bakr,who the shia consider to be a usurper and an illegitimate ruler who grabbed power after the death of the Prophet.i hope you now understand the issue surrounding the age of Aisha.

Orikinla:

“Magic was worked on Allah’s Apostle so that he used to think that he had sexual relations with his wives while he actually had not.”

~ Aisha (Bukhari 7,71,660)

FROM MY BOOK "UNVEIL ME MY LOVE" A FACTION ON THE FOUNDER OF ISLAM.
THE BOOK IS AVAILABLE ONLY UNDERGROUND.

you are more ignorant than "Bukhari".you should know that while the muslims revere the Holy Quran as the infallible word of God,and we believe you can find no reason to doubt that,the hadiths literature has gone through many hands.the hadiths literature can be compared to the bible.it is not infallible.it is the work of many hands and its has gone through many hands.there exist in islam a science on its own for sorting out the hadiths and examining which can be accepted and which should be rejected.while muslim scholars are honest enough to scrutinize their hadiths,christians are still living in more than 2000 years of denial about their bible.their bible attribute In.cest,ra.pe and prostitution to biblical prophets.we are still hoping that christians will come to see the light and reject the many nonsense included in your "holy" bible.

What a damn shame. LagosShai please stop trying to explain Islam to us. Actions speak louder than words. There is plenty of evidence around the world that there is a problem why not address that instead of justifying the unjustifyable!

Kobo,

You got it wrong. They don't give birth to many children for economic reasons. They give birth to so many because they do not believe in birth control, marry many wives, and easily shirk responsibility for taking care of the kids by dumping them as almajiris.

These children are abandoned; virtually fatherless and motherless. The mallam is their care-giver, but he can't take care of himself so he sends them out to beg and do menial jobs.

If we do not as a matter of urgency implement strict childcare laws that would ensure that parents cannot dump their children anyhow, the problem will continue. You talk about free education, but believe me, the State governments will not want to spend that kind of money on free education. The corruption is so bad, that by the time the State government shares the loot to whom the loot is due, the almajiris are not in a state to be considered.

Surely, you know that State governments are the ones that provide free education in the government schedule of Nigeria today


Kobojunkie (f)
Columbus, OH
Posts: 23153

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Re: Almajiris - Nigeria's Ticking Time Bomb
« #12 on: Today at 01:36:49 AM »

Quote from: jerryben12 on Today at 01:31:40 AM
If these present Almajiris are taken care of, what happens to the yet unborn? The problem should be address from the source and not from the middle. The parents of these guys should be educated on the consequences of having children they can not take care of.

How do you do that when some of the main reasons they have for having so many children is the believe that the more of those they have, the greater there chances of surviving? I mean it's like the poor farmer who cannot afford machines to help him on the farm -- he goes and has 10 sons, why? So his sons can help on the farm and so increase yield so he can better feed his family.

Lagos Shia

At the end of the day, I don't think it is good for any religion to encourage people to, for example, go to war against the enemies or to cut off the "enemies" hands, even if they were done in self defense or directed against people who purportedly waged war against Islam. That is not a religion that supports peace. That is why you have all the problems with Islamic extremists such as Boko Haram and Al Qaeda. These extremists believe that they are killing for Allah.

Christianity promotes that vengeance should be left to God, and if someone slaps your left cheek, you should turn your right cheek for them to slap. Peace under every circumstance.

The best way for the Islamic community to quell this nonsense is not by justifying their acts but by repudiating and condemning these groups, and for Islamic scholars to preach that those Islamic passages used to justify violence are an anachronism in modern life. All these killings must stop.

Princek12:

Lagos Shia

At the end of the day, I don't think it is good for any religion to encourage people to, for example, go to war against the enemies or to cut off the "enemies" hands, even if they were done in self defense or directed against people who purportedly waged war against Islam. That is not a religion that supports peace. That is why you have all the problems with Islamic extremists such as Boko Haram and Al Qaeda. These extremists believe that they are killing for Allah.

Christianity promotes that vengeance should be left to God, and if someone slaps your left cheek, you should turn your right cheek for them to slap. Peace under every circumstance.

The best way for the Islamic community to quell this nonsense is not by justifying their acts but by repudiating and condemning these groups, and for Islamic scholars to preach that those Islamic passages used to justify violence are an anachronism in modern life. All these killings must stop.

self-defense is a human right.the violence in the north got nothing to do with islam as ive stressed and i have condemned it.but some christian missionaries want to kill a bird with two stone.they want to use the violence in the north both to score political goals and make their attack against islam.

as for telling us that vengeance should be left for God according to your christianity,you should stop preaching and start practicing.how many of your christian fanatics have called for genocide against notherners just on this forum alone?and the problem they generalize and exaggerate against all muslims forgetting that millions of muslims voting for GEJ and fresh air.is this the fresh air you're giving us? i think you need to teach them.otherwise you should stop the hyporcrisy.

any nonsense that will be posted in this thread to attack islam and muslims unjustly,i will counter the arguments with demolishing facts and destructive arguments to expose the liars.i am ready in this thread.if you insult,i will not insult.but i will present facts about your religion that will make you feel ashamed of it.its not a threat but a promise to the ignorant "christian almajiris" in this forum who are used to saying nonsense.