plappville:


No bro, the bible did not said the Angel is God. But that He was Christ.

Not according to the bible ,here the angel says otherwise.

Then he said, “I am the God of your father,[a] the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob.” At this, Moses hid his face, because he was afraid to look at God. Exodus 3:6

Richirich713:


Wrong I don't agree with JW who mistranslate the bible.

Hehehehe , see hypocrite .. Jesus is an ANGEL , YES OR NO ?

John 1:1 says jesus is God yet they mistranslate as always.

And how does that make Jesus Equal with the only true God Pls ... Even humans are called God . Does that make them the Almighty ? Start thinking

Richirich713:


Catholics didn't created the doctrine of the trinity.

If they did I wonder why Justin Martyr (100-165). Who knew the disciples of the apostles of jesus thought jesus was God.

And why Ignatius of Antioch (A.D. 35-110) who knew the disciples of jesus also thought jesus was God.

Clement of Rome (A.D. ?-101) Also knew paul and Peter agrees with the trinity

So saying that the catholic church invented the trinity is a false statement cuz those who were disciples of the apostles of jesus believe jesus was God, jesus apostles believed jesus was God.

You cant prove it from the Bible. None of his diciples believed He was God. When Jesus asked his diciples who do people say "i am." They all say what they think of Him. It was only Peter that got it Right. This could have been the occasion for Jesus to tell them that He is God Almighty. instead He salut Peter for Peter Declares that Jesus Is the Messiah. None mentioned him to be God.

Luke 9:18-20
18 Once when Jesus was praying in private and his disciples were with him, he asked them, “Who do the crowds say I am?”

19 They replied, “Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, that one of the prophets of long ago has come back to life.”

20 “But what about you?” he asked. “Who do you say I am?”

Peter answered, “God’s Messiah.”:

plappville:


This means you are ignoring John 14:24

"He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me".

No I ain't ignoring that cuz that agree with the trinity. Just like the following verse shows:

Then you will know that the YAHWEH Almighty HAS SENT ME. Shout and be glad, O Daughter of Zion. FOR I AM COMING, AND I WILL LIVE AMONG YOU,’ declares YAHWEH. ‘Many nations will be joined with YAHWEH in that day and will become MY people. I WILL LIVE AMONG YOU [/b]and you will know that [b]YAHWEH Almighty HAS SENT ME to you.(Zechariah 2:7-13)

Again agreeing with me, here Yahweh sends Yahweh which can only mean God send a manifestation of himself to his people.

Richirich713:


That means jesus must be GOD!

Cuz only God is eternal. Thank u for agreeing with The true christian views of jesus.

According to the previous verse you misinterpreted it. Thats why i showed you what the Apostle Paul said. That Christ was Rock that Followed them. Sow how does that means Jesus to be God? I asked you if God send God a message and if God's name is in God. You did not respond to that. All u fo is tell me Jesus is God.. what view are u talking about?

Richirich713:


No I ain't ignoring that cuz that agree with the trinity. Just like the following verse shows:

Then you will know that the YAHWEH Almighty HAS SENT ME. Shout and be glad, O Daughter of Zion. FOR I AM COMING, AND I WILL LIVE AMONG YOU,’ declares YAHWEH. ‘Many nations will be joined with YAHWEH in that day and will become MY people. I WILL LIVE AMONG YOU [/b]and you will know that [b]YAHWEH Almighty HAS SENT ME to you.(Zechariah 2:7-13)

Again agreeing with me, here Yahweh sends Yahweh which can only mean God send a manifestation of himself to his people.

So who is the sent in this verse ? Do you mean Prophet Zechariah is Yahweh ?


This is serious .

[quote author=plappville post=38848718]


•1) You cant prove it from the Bible. None of his diciples believed He was God

•2) Instead He salut Peter for Peter Declares that Jesus Is the Messiah.

•3)None mentioned him to be God.

1) •In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.(John 1:1)

•Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”

2) •Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God

•Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen. me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.

•HERE JESUS SALUTE THOMAS FOR CALLING HIM LORD AND GOD

3) • same as the above.

Richirich713:


No I ain't ignoring that cuz that agree with the trinity. Just like the following verse shows:

Then you will know that the YAHWEH Almighty HAS SENT ME. Shout and be glad, O Daughter of Zion. FOR I AM COMING, AND I WILL LIVE AMONG YOU,’ declares YAHWEH. ‘Many nations will be joined with YAHWEH in that day and will become MY people. I WILL LIVE AMONG YOU [/b]and you will know that [b]YAHWEH Almighty HAS SENT ME to you.(Zechariah 2:7-13)

Again agreeing with me, here Yahweh sends Yahweh which can only mean God send a manifestation of himself to his people.

Wrong!! You are interpreting it wrongly. Why dont you allow scripture to interpretate scriptures? What manifestation? Jesus was with God in Heaven before He came and before He came to earth. He was subjected to God. There are two persons here not with same authorities. One give the other authority to carry out.

That verse clearly says. Jesus does not speak words of his own. And you are saying no. He does he was only pretending to be someone else..

I only brought up the disciples of the apostles of jesus cuz u said the catholic church invented the trinity doctrine.

Which is false cuz the earliest christians who were taught by the disciples of jesus believe he was God nd jesus disciples believed he was God.

plappville:


Wrong!! You are interpreting it wrongly. Why dont you allow scripture to interpretate scriptures? What manifestation? Jesus was with God in Heaven before He came and before He came to earth. He was subjected to God. There are two persons here not with same authorities. One give the other authority to carry out.

That verse clearly says. Jesus does not speak words of his own. And you are saying no. He does he was only pretending to be someone else..

U JW are the ones who don't allow scripture to speak for its self.

Don't u JW mistranslate John 1:1?

And also the above verse supports the trinity not ur JW beliefs cuz the verse says Yahweh is sending Yahweh.

If it ain't a manifestation Then what does the verse mean when it says Yahweh send Yahweh.

Why are 2 yahweh speaking? Plz explain since u say it ain't a manifestation.

plappville:


Wrong!! You are interpreting it wrongly. Why dont you allow scripture to interpretate scriptures?

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god." John1:1)

Is this allowing scripture to speak for itself?

Mistranslating a verse just because it says jesus is God.

Richirich713:


"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god." John1:1)

Is this allowing scripture to speak for itself?

Mistranslating a verse just because it says jesus is God.

Nonsense , if saying "a god" is mistranslation , The KJV also mistranslate Act 28:6 because it said Paul Is God (theos) ! It was rendered

" a god " ? is that right ?

Richirich713:


U JW are the ones who don't allow scripture to speak for its self.

Don't u JW mistranslate John 1:1?

And also the above verse supports the trinity not ur JW beliefs cuz the verse says Yahweh is sending Yahweh.

If it ain't a manifestation Then what does the verse mean when it says Yahweh send Yahweh.

Why are 2 yahweh speaking? Plz explain since u say it ain't a manifestation.

Empty talk * ... After supporting the JW's that Jesus is an Angel .

[quote author=Richirich713 post=38849168][/quote]


In john 1:1? The WORD can mean “the expression of a thought.” It can be thought of as the total message of God to mankind (Acts 11:1; 1 Thessalonians 2:13). Jesus embodied that total message, and that is why He is called the “WORD,” of God (Colossians 1:19; 2:9).

God cannot be with Himself again two persons in this verse. Since God is one, it is unscriptural to say Jesus is God Almighty/Yahweh. Since God cannot be seen, die, or Tempted it is evident that Jesus is not Yahweh.


27Then He said to Thomas, "Reach here with your finger, and see My hands; and reach here your hand and put it into My side; and do not be unbelieving, but believing." 28Thomas answered and said to Him, "My Lord and my God!" 29Jesus said to him, "Because you have seen Me, have you believed? Blessed are they who did not see, and yet believed."

Thomas has proclaimed he will not believe until he sees and feels. Now he sees and confesses. Jesus those who did not see him are blessed. Was there anywhere in the bible when those who believed him called him God? The fact that He called Jesus God was not the issue here but just because he finally believe like others do. Jesus was called a LAMB too. That that made him an animal LAMB? No its just a symbol.

Richirich713:


U JW are the ones who don't allow scripture to speak for its self.

Don't u JW mistranslate John 1:1?

And also the above verse supports the trinity not ur JW beliefs cuz the verse says Yahweh is sending Yahweh.

If it ain't a manifestation Then what does the verse mean when it says Yahweh send Yahweh.

Why are 2 yahweh speaking? Plz explain since u say it ain't a manifestation.

You see? What made you think am a JW? by the way, what made you think they misinterprete and u no? I am not a JW. I worship with Baptist church but i dont follow thier trinity doctrine. My pastor told me that. One must believe that Jesus is God to be saved. I asked him to prove it. He couldnt. He said its a fact. So u see. I only look at the word of God not some kind of historical dogmatic doctrine from the mother church.

Richirich713:


"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god." John1:1)

Is this allowing scripture to speak for itself?

Mistranslating a verse just because it says jesus is God.

Psalm 82:6 "I said, 'You are "gods"; you are all sons of the Most High.'

You see, Jesus is not the only one called god in the bible neither the only one called son of the Most high/Almighty God.

Richirich713:


Not according to the bible ,here the angel says otherwise.

Then he said, “I am the God of your father,[a] the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob.” At this, Moses hid his face, because he was afraid to look at God. Exodus 3:6

Sorry, i didnt see this. WAS IT AN ANGEL THAT SPOKE WITH MOSES IN THE BURNING TREE?

Deut 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one.

 1corinthians 8:6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.

God Almighty is from whom while Jesus is Through whom. You see that Paul is not a Trinitarian?

Notice somethin in this verse...

The LORD says to my Lord: “Sit at my right hand, until I make your enemies your footstool.” The LORD sends forth from Zion your mighty scepter. Rule in the midst of your enemies! (Ps. 110:1–2)

The LORD with capital letters stands for God Almighty. While the Lord with small letters stands for Jesus. This old testament verse says it all. If you say there are two gods in Heaven then you are contradicting deut 6:4.

1 Corinthians 15:24–28
24 Then comes the end, when he delivers mthe kingdom to God the Father after destroying nevery rule and every authority and power. 25 For he must reign ountil he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be pdestroyed is death. 27 For “God has put all things in subjection under his feet.” But when it says, “all things are put in subjection,” it is plain that HE IS EXCEPTED who put all things in subjection under him. 28 When all things are subjected to him, then the SON himself will also be SUBJECTED to him(GOD) who put all things in subjection under him, that God may be ALL in ALL.

Jozzy4:


Nonsense , if saying "a god" is mistranslation , The KJV also mistranslate Act 28:6 because it said Paul Is God (theos) ! It was rendered

" a god " ? is that right ?

1st context determines how a verse should be translated from one language to another.

2nd if "a god" is right (which it is not) it directly contradictions (Isaiah 45:5) where God says there are no gods beside him.

3rd - No Greek new testament scholars agree with JW translations.

4th if jesus was a god, he should have corrected Thomas for saying he is " the God of me", he should have said to Thomas I'm not the God I'm a god.

[quote author=Richirich713 post=38837039][/quote]
Pls re arrange the quotes so one can know where you said what .

Richirich713:


That's the problem wit u so called christians. U pick nd choose.

Again if jesus was not the true God, he should have not have allowed people to call him God.

Since he allowed people to call him God either shows he was God in the flesh or was a false prophet who deceive many.

He should not be taking titles of God for himself.

He should not have been telling his disciples to pray to him.

The issue is not about god, the issue is about "almighty god.

We already know there are many gods, even Satan is one of them.
do we have more than one almighty god? No! .

Richirich713:
Clearly the Angel of Yahweh is a self-manifestation of Yahweh, for He speaks as God, identifies Himself with God, and claims to exercise the prerogatives of God.

And Yes I'm saying I believe jesus is that messenger who is an manifestation of God in the old testament.

Is the angel of god yaweh, or another person with how own will representing yaweh.?

plappville:


Sorry, i didnt see this. WAS IT AN ANGEL THAT SPOKE WITH MOSES IN THE BURNING TREE?

There the angel of the Lord appeared to him in flames of fire from within a bush. Moses saw that though the bush was on fire it did not burn up. 3 So Moses thought, “I will go over and see this strange sight—why the bush does not burn up.”

4 When the Lord saw that he had gone over to look, God called to him from within the bush, “Moses! Moses!”

And Moses said, “Here I am.”

5 “Do not come any closer,” God said. “Take off your sandals, for the place where you are standing is holy ground.” 6 Then he said, “I am the God of your father,[a] the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob.” At this, Moses hid his face, because he was afraid to look at God.

plappville:


Psalm 82:6 "I said, 'You are "gods"; you are all sons of the Most High.'

You see, Jesus is not the only one called god in the bible neither the only one called son of the Most high/Almighty God.

6 I said, "You are gods, sons of the Most High, all of you;
7 nevertheless, like men you shall die, and fall like any prince
8Arise, O God, judge the earth; for you shall inherit all the nations!

Clearly in context God calls these judges false gods who will die and fall like any prince.

Is jesus like these wicked false so called gods according to the bible? Definitely not, jesus is eternal

plappville:


Sorry, i didnt see this. WAS IT AN ANGEL THAT SPOKE WITH MOSES IN THE BURNING TREE?

"There THE ANGEL OF THE LORD appeared to him in flames of fire from within a bush" (Exodus 3:2)

... Go, assemble the elders of Israel and say to them, "The Lord, the God of your fathers—the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob—APPEARED TO ME and said: I have watched over you and have seen what has been done to you in Egypt. (Exodus 3:16)

Jesus is almighty god, yet he does not his own will but that of another who incidentally sent him.

Jesus is almighty god, yet he himself said he has a god,a god that is superior to him.

Jesus is almighty god, yet he recieves authority from another.

Jesus is almighty god, yet he is still subjected to another.

Jesus is almighty god, yet when he went back to heaven, he sat at the right hand of another.

Jesus is almighty god, yet he himself called someone the only true god.

You say jesus is the almighty god, yet you cant explain the things said above.

Jesus is what the angel told Mary, "the son of god", "the beginning of the creation of god", the "messiah" , the mediator between man and himself? No! The mediator between man and god.

Jozzy4:


Hehehehe , see hypocrite .. Jesus is an ANGEL , YES OR NO ?



And how does that make Jesus Equal with the only true God Pls ... Even humans are called God . Does that make them the Almighty ? Start thinking

Mere Humans are not called mighty God!
Humans are not uncreated.
Humans are not called the Lord of sabbath.
Humans do not called themselves the 1st and last.
Humans definitely don't call themselves the God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob etc.

dolphinheart:
Jesus is almighty god, yet he does not his own will but that of another who incidentally sent him.

Jesus is almighty god, yet he himself said he has a god,a god that is superior to him.

Jesus is almighty god, yet he recieves authority from another.

Jesus is almighty god, yet he is still subjected to another.

Jesus is almighty god, yet when he went back to heaven, he sat at the right hand of another.

Jesus is almighty god, yet he himself called someone the only true god.

You say jesus is the almighty god, yet you cant explain the things said above.

Jesus is what the angel told Mary, "the son of god", "the beginning of the creation of god", the "messiah" , the mediator between man and himself? No! The mediator between man and god.

Jesus is not mighty God but he is actually a god.
Jesus is not God yet he allows people to calling the God.
God the Father says there's no God besides but John 1:1 disagrees cuz u say a god.
God the Father says he is the 1st and last but jesus a mere man(according to u) says the same.

dolphinheart:


You say jesus is the almighty god, yet you cant explain the things said above.

The trinity explains all this.

How do u explain jesus is not God yet he is eternal and uncreated, the 1st nd last.

Jozzy4:


So who is the sent in this verse ? Do you mean Prophet Zechariah is Yahweh ?


This is serious .

FOR I AM COMING, AND I WILL LIVE AMONG YOU,’ declares YAHWEH

Where do u get that Zechariah is Yahweh.

"For this reason they could not believe, because, as Isaiah says elsewhere: ‘He has blinded their eyes and deadened their hearts, so they can neither see with their eyes, nor understand with their hearts, nor turn—and I would heal them.’ Isaiah said this because he saw Jesus’ glory[/b]and spoke about him." (John 12:37-41)

Isaiah agrees with me also.

"In the year that King Uzzi'ah died [b]I saw the Lord sitting upon a throne,...................

"And I heard the voice of the Lord saying, ‘Whom shall I send, and who will go for US?’ Then I said, ‘Here am I! Send me.’ And he said, ‘Go, and say to this people: "Hear and hear, but do not understand; see and see, but do not perceive." Make the heart of this people fat, and their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their hearts, and turn and be healed.

Richirich713:


The trinity explains all this.

How do u explain jesus is not God yet he is eternal and uncreated, the 1st nd last.

Take the points I listed one by one and show us how the trinity explains it. Dnt just say " the trinity explains all these without showing how.
Handle the points one by one