₦airaland Forum

Afam4eva:
I know the Ijebus are in Ikorodu and Epe. Whcih other part of lagos can they be found?

By land area and population, Ijebu seems to me the largest. Natively, Ijebuland also include Eti-osa and ibeju Lekki

Hati13:
I mostly see terrorist acts in Nigeria almost weekly/monthly on TV. I've learned that it mostly happen in the northern part of Nigeria. I think most of it if not almost is related to Boko Haram. Do you live in the north Nigeria? Is there also terrorist acts and major crimes in central and southern Nigeria? Do you feel safe when you walk outside your house?

Boko Haram is mostly in the Northeast of the country. Terrorism in many parts of Nigeria is negligible to nonexistent. Don't get the wrong impression from the media that all of Nigeria is Boko Haram. Nigeria is incredibly diverse and there are a lot of contrasts in different parts. The largest city, Lagos has never experienced any Boko Haram attacks. On the other hand, Maiduguri in the Northeast has had countless of attacks in the past. In many places in the Northeast affected by Boko Haran, there are curfew impose on people for safety. Other than that, It's safe to go out in most parts

Hati13:
I mostly see terrorist acts in Nigeria almost weekly/monthly on TV. I've learned that it mostly happen in the northern part of Nigeria. I think most of it if not almost is related to Boko Haram. Do you live in the north Nigeria? Is there also terrorist acts and major crimes in central and southern Nigeria? Do you feel safe when you walk outside your house?

Boko Haram is mostly in the Northeast of the country. Terrorism in most parts of Nigeria is negligible to nonexistent. Don't get the wrong impression from the media that all of Nigeria is Boko Haram. Nigeria is incredibly diverse and there are a lot of contrasts in different parts. The largest city, Lagos has never experienced any Boko Haram attacks. On the other hand, Maiduguri in the Northeast has had countless of attacks in the past. In many places in the Northeast affected by Boko Haran, there are curfew impose on people for safety. Other than that, It's safe to go out in most parts of Nigeria.

Efewestern:
i never knew Ohovworen and Ekakuro is the original word for chief, is olori also an urhobo word? have seen several urhobo answering that name

Olori is the Yoruba word for head/leader/chief.
you can almost identify a Yoruba origin in a word if it has the prefix of olu.

makizee:
You even had his time...the egub people are a sub group of the larger yoruba group, just like the ijebu's and ilaje...evun is not entirely a different tribe.

I'm not interesting in forcing an identity on others, but Eguns that I have met tell me that they are Yoruba so there is that.

dreamworld:
Lagos belongs to egun people afonjas are settlers in lagos, go and read ur history bro

Slow down there.
Badagry is originally Egun. That's why it's headed by the Akran. Most parts of Lagos is Yoruba was historically ruled by obas. Stop distorting facts.

YonkijiSappo:
Never said that.

Ok, my misunderstandings.

I was simply trying to imply that I knew beforehand that Ivbiosakon is an old term, but I used that term for that language I was referring to. In a modern/linguistic sense, the term has a more narrower definition. I believe there is another term that's used, Aoma.

I didn't really want to go into this discussion. I was simply just addressing RedboneSmith's question.

YonkijiSappo:
No, Afenmai is the term generally used to refer to all the languages of Edo-North.
Ivbiosakon is an old name to refer to the Owans. Today, they make up two Edo local governments, Owan East and Owan West. Both of these LGs also border Ondo state.

The situation is much more complex than that.
I knew Ivbiosokan was an old term, but I used it because the language that I was referring to believe it or not has no exact name. This is one of the things that many settlements in the area share. Each town just goes by its own flow. These creates ambiguity for linguists who want to classify the language. This is why Linguists often group towns that have a level of mutual intelligibility into a "dialect cluster" even though the people themselves might not recognize such since they live as separate autonomous entities. You said Afenmai is made up of Owan East and Owan West, but some will say by extension that the Afenmai region also includes Akoko Edo, Etsako West, Etsako Central,and Etsako East of Edo-North Senatorial District.

1. Living in Afenmai region is different from speaking Afenmai, which is a complete language on its own. The Afenmai region is extremely diverse linguistically and we can't generalize.

2. The Afenmai language is also known as Yekhee, however many people don't use this term and use Etsako, especially further East.

3. The "language" I was referring to has no exact name. It's known as Emai-Uleha-Ora and it's spoken in parts of Northwest Edo state in a section of Afenmai region. The name is derived from the combination of the towns that share the similar or related lects. Of course these three communities aren't the only ones that are classified under the cluster. Other communities include Ivhimion, etc. There is no name for this "language" as it is just a classification of collection of communities who speak similar dialects.

4. Even though, both the Emai-Uleha-Ora and Afenmai (Yakhee) languages are classified under the North-central Edoid languages, they are also different.

5. There are many other non-Afenmai/Yakhee language speakers in the Afenmai region. Afenmai is a generic term which encompasses all speakers of not only the language itself, but also speakers of often related languages.

YonkijiSappo:
Okay I thpught the discussion was linited to Ondo though- because that was the premise of the discussion.
Also I only know of Okpameri like languages spanning the border along the Akoko axis- which language in Akoko sounds Ivbiosakon- ish?

I'm not quite sure. It is more like a general term for the related dialects spoken in different communities with the vast majority in Edo state. Apparently, their language is a bit influenced by Yoruba.

YonkijiSappo:
Sorry, I meant to highlight Igarra ("Ebiroid"

There's no Ebiroid language in Ondo, except by migrant speakers.

I never said there is an Ebiroid language in Ondo. Igarra is spoken in Akoko Edo.

YonkijiSappo:
that is in Edo state though

No, it's well in Ondo state, very close to Isua. Its alternative former name is Ukpe located in Akoko SE local government. I also only mentioned Akoko region which is continuous with parts of Edo state as well. There are several Edoid languages spoken that spans both state like Ivbiosakon and Okpamheri.

Anyways you also have stand alone languages that form independent branches like Akpe and Ukaan languages. These languages are very hard to classify. Ukaan is spoken in Ikakumo but the language is considered endangered due to the use of Yoruba especially by the younger generation.

RedboneSmith:
The classification places Akoko in the South East Yoruba (SEY) category. How?

Akoko language (or Akokoid languages) is not even Yoruboid.

Yes there is a lot of confusion with the Akoko region. This is even more complicated because of the Akoko umbrella. The truth is that there is a Southeastern Yoruba dialect spoken in Akoko region in addition to the many often unrelated languages. The Akoko dialect is similar to that spoken in Owo. Here is a general break down of the languages in Akoko.

Yoruba (Akoko): These are spoken natively in Ikare-Akoko, Akungba, Supare, Oka, etc

Akokoid- Oke Agbe (Owan varieties), Arigidi(Arigidi language), Erushu, Oyin, etc

Akedoid/Edoid- Ipe, etc

Ebiroid- Igarra

Ahanoid- Ahan, ayere

.

Ersan:
Who gives a damn about which term is more common? You keep dodging the issue at hand.As far as nigeria is concerned, the agbada is a yoruba clothing inspired by hausas.

When Yorubas were wearing agbada, there was nothing like Nigeria. If the Europeans had drawn the Nigerian boarder a few kilometers North, then groups like Songhai would also be in contention. My point is Hausas were not the only Sahelian traders Yorubas had contact with.

And? is there anything wrong with saying something is for instance asian? btw, the sahel is a region. Islam is practised in hausa land due to the influence of songhai teachers, the agbada is worn by yorubas and other a few other non sahelian ethnicities due to influence from hausas and other sahelian people.

No, I just admitted that onion is from Asia for example. Like I said before, Yoruba also had ties with other Sahelian tribes. Let me ask you this, where did you get your babban riga from?

Again you still dont get me? what if i admit to that? what is wrong with it? this is the insecurity and inferiority complex i speak of.

Not really. I admitted that the goje and danshiki were borrowed by the Yorubas from the Hausas. It's literally in the name so it's not inferiority.

Good excuse

I didn't want to go into details, but in short if you must know the first mosque under Oyo was built to facilitate its immigrant population. Yoruba had known Islam for long, but it did not gain hold until many centuries later. Islamization grew when cities funded the construction of mosques. It took local effort for Islam to gain a hold. It was too late that by the time it was starting to gain hold, the colonists had already arrived with Christianity. That's why you see the split you see today. On the other hand, the Nupe and Bariba who both border Yoruba were almost completely Islamized in comparison.

Exactly, for example, the durian (worst fruit in the world) though can be grown in nigeria is not indigenous to nigeria. just like the onion wasnt until it was introduced by traders to hausa who by extended the favor to the people of the southwest.

Thanks for the onions. You and I must then extend gratitude for who ever brought it to West Africa.

hausas--nupes--yorubas. it all leads back to us. As for the songhai empire, you should know there was a time they incorporated part of
hausaland, kano to be more specific to their kingdom. Though it didnt last long as kotal kanta of kebbi sent them packing a short while later, my point is it is no surprise we are at the center of everything.

Not necessarily, so many aspects of culture like Islam in Yorubaland and your own writing does not lead back to you.
Yes, I know the extent of the Songhai spread. I even know that parts of Kebbi state were occupied by the Songhai for a while.
Center of what? Onions?

The true point here is whether we invented it or not, we influenced you and the clothing you are so proud of today. You are welcome.

Well, I guess we both know the truth. It wasn't you who invented it. You said it yourself, multiple Sahelian groups are known for the style as well. Glad we can end at that.

Ersan:
Lol! As far as nigeria goes everyone knows who that symbol represents.

That still doesn't change the underlying facts. And as far as the world is concern, the symbol is overused and not unique to any group. And as far as Nigeria is concerned, the agbada is Yoruba. Agbada is a more common term in comparison to babban riga.

Sahelian people refers to certain ethnic groups that live and established kingdoms in and around the sahel. These ethnic groups include hausas, kanuris, fulas and tuaregs to name a few.

That still doesn't change what I have said earlier. You are still attaching culture to vegetation. The same way Islam is practiced below the sahel, is the same way that type of clothing is found below the sahel. Yoruba remains the exception.

This is all i ever wanted to hear, im glad you are able to admit it. I am not claiming cultural superiority here, like i said earlier theres nothing wrong with influencing each other, just like your women have influenced ours with the head ties.

I admitted nothing since I used a conditional if, meaning I'm merely speculating. You on the other hand, have clearly admitted to something I didn't even know about.

And i am curious as to how you think this islamization took place.

I don't have time to go into details, do your own research.

This is indeed very true. But vegetables like onions arent originally found in the south. Its no wonder you lot call it the same thing we do, arabs call it basl, hausas call it albasa, and yorubas alubosa.(one of many words yorubas adopted hausas?

I don't care what the name comes from, onion is not culture and it's not even native to Africa, it's from Asia. Onion is grown in Yorubaland and any vegetable that's grown in the North can be grown in Yorubaland than vice versa.

And where do you think the nupes got their horses from?

You are so predictable. I know you are going to go there. I could care less where the Nupe got it from. Facts remain that Yoruba didn't get it from the Hausa. Horse in Yoruba in Esin derived from Arabic Hesan. Before Yoruba had the calvary, there were horses used by kings for centuries. Yoruba interaction isn't limited to Northern Nigeria. The first mosque in Yorubaland was built by the Malians, the first Islamic scholars in Oyo were Malians, the first mentioning of Yoruba in any text was by the Songhai. I just want you to know that Yoruba's interaction to the North isn't limited to Hausa.

Great, i am very happy you have all these modes of dressing, again i am not denying, nor am i claiming cultural superiority. The questions remains, where did yorubas get inspiration for agbadas from?

I don't think you are mischievous. The underlying fact is that you did not invent the style. Just as babban riga is exclusively Hausa, the agbada is exclusively Yoruba. Traditionally, both groups didn't use the same fabric and the style also differs.

Ersan:
Granted you were using it before we adopted it yeah?


And we have always been using it, our afinity to that symbol is why the sardauna chose it as our emblem.

But i would love to see these pictures for research purposes. Please endeavour to attach them to your next post.

Here is a Yoruba agbada pre-1950. Notice the different multiple designs of the eternal knot. I'm sure the knot is an important symbol to the North from a cultural sense. The fact is that the eternal knot is one of the most overused symbols ever. The Chinese, Europeans, Malians, and Saharawi arabs use it. No group can claim the sole ownership of the symbol.
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/77/58/24/77582495b619035066ccab9244563171.jpg

Yorubas have no stake in this whatsoever to begin with, they are not sahelian

You have to be Sahelian to have a stake? So vegetation now determines cultural affinity? There is always an outlier in any cultural relationship and Yoruba just happen to be the special case here. Yes they can have a stake if it's an integral part of their history and culture just like you. You didn't invent the style, so you are in no position to lay ownership.

So its more plausible you got something from from another region rather than your neighbours that are right above you? it may not be completely hauss likr the earlier person claimed but you without a doubt got that from us.

Even if it's from the North, the Yoruba agbada differs greatly to the Hausa babban riga in many ways. Danshiki on the other hand is more acknowledged as coming from the north. Typically, things of Hausa origin in Yoruba carries the original name like goje for example. The agbada case however is more contentious. The babban riga name did not stick.

Yorubas did not get islam from hausas but hausas are responsible for a significant amount of islamization in yoruba land. Most of your trade northwards was with us, slaves, vegetables you never heard of, and we improved your military given how you got your cavalry from us.

Not really. I won't even claim significant amount. Most of the Islamization took place from Yoruba to Yoruba after the initial contact with Islam. Some of the kings were the earliest converts, others follow suit. If Hausa were responsible for a significant islamization of Yoruba like you said and they had trade contact for centuries, then how come most Yoruba weren't Muslim by the time of the British arrival. Islamization actually took place much later around the 19th and 20th century even though the first contact with Islam go back as far as the 14th century.

Speaking of trade, most of the things that can be grown in the North can actually be grown in the South. The same can't be said vice versa. I don't know what special vegetables you are talking about other than ginger (which is also grown in Oyo state). On the other hand, kolanut (goro) which is abundant in the South is one of the major export commodity, that is highly valued by the North.

As for the calvary, Oyo adopted the calvary after the destruction of Oyo-ile by Nupes. To claim that the Yorubas got the calvary from the Hausas is a bit far fetched. Oyo learned from the Nupe attack and adopted the calvary.

But im curious, if yorubas got the danciki and babban riga from hausas, what were they wearing before that? Do you care to clue in? Maybe you dressed like the edos?

You must feel very proud. Yoruba have tons of other clothing aside from the agbada, so to ask what Yoruba were wearing before agbada is naive, so let me enlighten you a bit. Yoruba are heterogeneous and some subgroups have their own unique attires in addition to also wearing the general common attires. The people of Ondo and Ijebu have like 50 different types of clothing alone that are native to them only and typically not worn by other Yoruba groups. For example, there is a style of clothing worn by men in Ondo state that's like a drape and it's tied from the shoulder down and worn with sokoto. There are some outfits that are only worn by certain people, some are worn on special occasions or for special purposes. Aside from the regional variations, the general clothing that all Yoruba people are familiar with include buba, kembe, sulia, dangodo, gbariye, ibora, kaamu, gbaanu, Sooro, sokoto elemu, iborun, oyala, ipele, oja, gele, among others. There are also tons of hats like gobi, alagbaa, oribi, tinko, bentigoo, abeti-aja, onide, labankada, and many others. I really don't need to go into details anymore. Also, my list are just styles and components and that's excluding fabric that are used. Agbada is just one of the many clothing that exist in Yoruba culture. So there you have it.

YonkijiSappo:
Igbo has more alphabets than Edo

Yes, it would seem that the alphabet system is more extensive. My conclusion was based on assumption due to the number of unique letters and blends in Edoid languages.

"Why colonial master described Igbos As superior Negro"

If you can't see that there is so much stuff wrong with this title, then you are part of the problem.

pazienza:
Ipe is in no way related to Yoruba language. Ipe language is 100% distinct from Yoruba. I know this because I'm conversant with the area. I lived amongst the indigenes for months.

No Yoruba man can understand any iota of Ipe language. Ipe people speak Yoruba as a second language to enable them communicate with Yorubas from within or outside Ondo.

If you are truly an Ipe indigene that lives or lived in Ipe, you would know this very fact.

I'm well aware that Ipe claims Ife origin, but we know how politicized oral history are these days.
Any neutral examining Ipe would come to the conclusion that the people are rather Edoid people than Yoruboid people, judging by their language.

Yeah you are right, I retract from my claim. The Akoko region is very complex. The language does sound Edoid, but they use Yoruba as a lingua franca. The rest of the towns I mentioned are primarily Yoruba-speaking. .

pazienza:
Ipe speak an indigenous language that is not Yoruba or even Yoruboid, yet they claim Yoruba with every fibre in them.
It's really interesting.

[s]No, actually they do. That's a misconception.[/s] There are many dialects and languages spoken in Akoko region. A number are actually dialects of Yoruba or Yoruboid in nature, some are language isolates and others are Edoid. The dialect spoken in Ipe along with settlements like Ikare-Akoko, Oba and Oka is actually similar to that of Owo with Ipe being more distinct. Apart from the language connection, Ipe folks tie their origin story to Ife. So there you have it.

Nice story. The history of the Akoko region is very fascinating.

In Yoruba culture, respect is key attribute of an omoluabi. The gesture greeting is ingrained into every Yoruba since childhood that it actually becomes an instinctive habit. Of course, you have those who are disrespectful, but disrespect is not tolerated at all. Respect is also mutual not only from young to old, but also old to young. It's not uncommon to see the old praise a young omoluabi through praise poetry (oriki) attributed to his/her name or origin.
Although, I won't go far as to say respect is necessarily prescribed to just one ethnicity. I will say though that respect as well as hospitality are two very important values in Yoruba culture.

mars123:
im sorry i don't feel the same way you do. Its not only igbos that don't have a sense of entitlement. Every suffering Nigerian doesn't. Its no surprise that igbo political office holders don't speak in this manner because they have their own share of the national cake.

And Nigerians are not alone in fighting each other. If you were exposed you would know that this world is not a perfect place.

What this country needs my brother is a functional system of government working for ITS PEOPLE. only then too will having your own separate country as igbos be easily realizable.

Thank you brother. Even Togo and Sierra Leone are all colonial creation, Nigeria is not unique. Countries like the Philippines, Indonesia, Singapore, and United States are all colonial creations, multi-ethnic, but they seem to be doing better.

The political establishment benefit from the tension between people because if they are busy fighting each other, then they can't unite together to stop them.

If we unite together and fight the people who have sold the future of the country, then we can talk about restructuring.

YonkijiSappo:
And what are the population of major ethnic groups in Nigeria according to Joshua project and Ethnologue

I'm saying exactly what you are saying, I'm just providing more adequate evidence. The Yoruba population is larger in both. What I find fascinating is that Joshua project and ethnologue actually separated the Fulani population from the Hausa. The urban Hausa-speaking Torobe Fulani was separated from Hausa. In doing that, it showed that the number of ethnically Yoruba is significantly higher.

YonkijiSappo:
Well then, the CIA world factbook and UN Population clock for Nigeria are "Euro-American" "guesstimates", so I suggest you go take a look at them.
And a 2016 European guesstimate in an age of information and advanced demographic tools thumps a 1921 European guesstimate in an age of general ignorance anyday.

I don't rely on CIA world factbook that much because they are meant to give a general overview and nothing concrete. For example they said that Nigerians are 50% Muslim, 40% Christian and 10% traditional adherents. These are clear cut numbers they've been using since almost two decades ago that they haven't update. This is why I rely on Ethnologue-Nigeria, especially for maps.

I also like to use Joshua project Nigeria.
https://joshuaproject.net/countries/NI

They actually give a list of all the ethnic groups in Nigeria, the number and religious breakdown. It's amazing what they've documented. It maybe not perfect, but it's far reliable than our own census irregardless of the organization's objectives. They even have some recordings of the languages.

bigfrancis21:
The 40% estimated population is just about right. You can deny that all day but the reality of Lagos points to that up to the extent that Oba Rilwan was scared that the Igbo population could vote in the PDP candidate, Agbaje, against the Yoruba preferred candidate. Yes it's that real.

Igbos being in Lagos political power or not does not negate their population in Lagos. Just as it is in other Nigerian states, the power of the state lies in some select group of people.

If Lagos is about 40% Igbo, then what's left of ethnic groups like Hausa and others? If we were to say that Igbos are the largest minority, and the rest of the non-Yoruba population is 10%. That doesn't look that bad until you now consider that Yoruba will now be 50% which would mean that the population of Igbos and Yorubas in Lagos would be almost the same.

I don't think that's right. Even if the percentage is that high, there is no way of knowing without a proper census. Nigerian census is a shame based on my own personal accounts.

tobida:
Which language is Ogbono? It sounds like Ogbonna people.

Ogbono (similar in texture to okro soup) is a delicious concoction made from the most magical seeds birthed from the tree of life itself nurtured on the richest of all soil.

Trina0936:
No wonder we love Fayose so much!!

No be stomach infrastructure

The SW state with the highest percentage of Catholicism is Ekiti, and it's not even that high in comparison to the SE. It's due to its high rate of Christianity. I can't really say why SW doesn't have higher rate of Catholicism. Some Yoruba have negative perspective of the church. It may also be because missionary weren't as concentrated in the region. Local or native churches are very common in the SW though.

akpasubi777:
So young people should be ruling while old people sit at home and debate? My friend will you run back to the house... If you are serious minded solve the current puzzle. Who is the Pharoah holding us from entering into the land flowing with milk and honey?

I was waiting for someone to quote me. Here is the thing though, you read all of what I posted and then you nitpicked the littlest thing that I said regarding young leaders. You mean to tell me that you disagree with all the things I said because I said young leaders for crying out loud. Obviously you didn't see that I also paired that with newer revolutionary leaders.
As for your question, you have your answer. People elect government officials, people have the power to change political landscape if they band together on a collective idea. But first, people have to stop playing the political divide and focus on a common interest or shared struggle. Then they can make a change happen.

We need to cut it with the constant republic creation: first republic, second republic.... CRAP. They will say they create a new republic, but it will be filled with the same corrupt and recycled politicians. These same people have no shame and they continue to say "youth are the future and leaders of tomorrow" blah blah blah, but will never get off the throne. What Nigeria needs are young/newer revolutionary leaders with a progressive vision and strategy to move the nation forward. We don't need recycled corrupt politicians. Create a proper federation, effective regionalism that doesn't marginalize, give states more power to control their resources to reduce the federal dependency, purge all the branches of government (They are all corrupt, even the Judiciary), stop with the committee this committee that (actions speak better than words). Build enough refineries in the country for God's sake. There is no reason for Nigeria be exporting oil. Create jobs for the unemployed and diversify the economy (do it, don't just say you'll do it), stop with the ceremony every time you commissioned a road or flyover (infrastructure is a basic amenity, you are not doing us a favor).