₦airaland Forum

jln115:
No I mean the M23 which were destroyed by the UN FIB with support from Rooivalk.

During WW1 campaign we Single-handedly drove Germany out of SWA(now Namibia) also google battle of Delville wood of the 1st WW

Stop quoting ancient world wars I and II as your South African war history, even Ghana and Nigeria fought against mighty Germany in Europe, and Japan in Burma battles of those two wars.

Oh ! I see South Africa has NO war history of fightng alone as a single nation apart from the Angolan Bush War where Cuban teenage army beat up SADF, so you now quote world wars and United Nations multi-national missions in Congo .

SHAME ON SOUTH AFRICAN MILITARY

mzilakazi:
Brown water navy that does not have submarines and frigates is nothing to be marched to our navy. Such navies will perish and kneel down before us in tears of asking for forgiveness. We will surely have your military for a breakfast. We are surely not BH.

You have 3 Exocet missiles per Valour corvette, old 1970s gun on your ships, short 15 km range and short 8 km ceiling Umkhonto missiles on your now downgraded Valour Patrol Corvettes.

We have two stealth ships with anti-missile defences, modern stealth gun with longer range, and NAF will sink your lone submarine when it snorkels every two days.

Your frigates just got downgraded to mere VALOUR PATROL CORVETTES officially downgraded by your own South African navy....fake blue water force !

jln115:
1 Sub, and its bye bye Nigerian Navy!!

Your sub will be sunk by NAF when it is forced to snorkel after 48 hours underwater.

jln115:
If it wasn't for the gun, these two ships would look Identical!!

Bwhahaaha

You finally proved me right and shöt yöursëlf in the hëad !

The two ships photos you posted clearly shows the modern stealth diamond shaped 76mm Super Rapid gun on the Algerian Meko frigate and the obsolete 1970s round shaped 76mm Compact gun on your South African Meko Corvette.

# Suicide Post......

....its not good to tell lies at random, God don catch you for us dis time

Henry240:
I used to think they were some sort of enlarged variants of Proforce MkII's. However, i'm no longer so sure, seeing that Proforce exported their vehicles to an entirely different country.

Black Scorpion APC, made by Carat Company of Belgium

http://www.army-technology.com/contractors/vehicles/carat-security-group/carat-security-group4.html

jln115:
Their exocets are the same length, weight and radius. Their 200 Meko are near identical to ours, they use the same radar, combat suit, SAMs ect ect and are also the exact same weight and length

Different Exocet variant, different 76mm gun, navionics not same, CIWS gun not same.....South African Meko corvette is NOT same as Algerian Meko FRIGATE....liar
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Patchesagain:
Stop repeating yourself like an i.diot.

You say that your decoys will waste of 13 missiles? Prove it, provide a citation.

This i.diot thinks that decoys are 100% effective... if they were... why would people still be making ASM's?

Clown

You are the one questioning and disputing decoy HPJ effectiveness, so the burden of proof is on you...

Prove to us with citation that they are not 100% effective, prove your claim now !
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jln115:
"Fitted for, but not with" A200 meko can carry 16 ASMs, our Valours carry only 8 missiles and instead fitted the Davit system in place of the 8 extra missiles.

Patchesagain:
8 that can be increased to 16 - Algerians chose to fit all 16 on theirs.

Algeria is NOT South Africa, their own Exocet is different from yours and has 180km range not 73km like your old Southie Exocets. Their Meko warship is also custom built and is a frigate fully armed with stealth guns that SAN does not have.

Show proof that SAN Valour patrol corvettes can carry 16 Exocets on one ship, prove it
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Patchesagain:
Who says we have 13?

Ok, manufacturer says it defeats missiles... but how many? What percentage success rate? Did they work in the Falklands?

That entire paragraph is complete B.S, which ships did the Iraqi's hit? Fact is in Falklands 5 exocet were fired... 3 ships hit, 2 sunk. You can do math right?

No, your ships will be wasted by a hail of missiles. Fact.

You bought ONLY 17 Exocets, your people claimed you test fired one on each ship, so how many Exocets do you have left ? Tell us with proof !

NNS centenary and NNS unity HP-J anti-missile decoys will waste your 13 Exocets and gun battle starts, then superior Nigerian 76mm stealth guns will sink Valour corvettes and your ancient 1970s rusted shorter range 76mm compact model guns that your foolish navy repainted from scrap yard putting non stealth gun on a stealth ship.....Nation of Zulu ïdïots !!
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[size=13pt]
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LOL....South African Navy officially classifies Valour as a mere Patrol Corvette NOT even up to Frigate, talk less of Destroyer class !

"Valour Class Patrol Corvettes - with images from the SAS Amatola, SAS Isandlwana and SAS Spioenkop."

http://www.navy.mil.za/vtour/default.htm

SAN Classifies It's Valour Warships As Patrol Corvettes Due to Poor armament
.[/size]

Patchesagain:
space for up to 46 missiles
http://www.navy.mil.za/equipment/valour.htm

8 Exocets anti-ship missiles only. Other missiles are short range anti-aircraft Umkhonto missiles

Quote where your navy says 48 missiles, quote the text and weblink, liar !

Patchesagain:
You said they will defeat ALL 17 missiles.

Prove it.

Exocet has an 80% hit rate, battle tested and proven.

Until you prove your claims, your corvette stands no chance.

You have only 13 Exocets NOT 17.

Manufacturer says HP-J defeats missiles. Fact !

There is no official record of 80% Exocet hit rate, and it is a bad missile notorious for failing to explode, just lucky to cause fire and sink two ships in its 35 year history. Many Iraqi exocets hït ships in gulf war and none of the ships sank. Exocet hit British ships in Falkland war and bounced off into the air wasted, ships just got hull metal dent repaired. Exocet has poor combat success rate in 35 years of many dozens fired in combat, sank only 2 ships, that is a 10% success rate realistically.

NNS centenary and NNS unity will waste your 13 Exocets and gun battle starts, then superior Nigerian 76mm stealth guns will sink Valour corvettes and your ancient 1970s rusted shorter range 76mm compact model guns that your foolish navy repainted from scrap yard putting non stealth gun on a stealth ship.....Nation of Zulu ïdïots !!
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jln115:
"The Navy operates a small number of 76mm Oto Melera 76mm/62 Super Rapid medium calibre automatic cannon on its Valour-class frigate and Warrior-class offshore patrol vessels"

http://itweb.co.za/mobilesite/defenceweb/home/item_id-17755/

"The OTOMelera 76mm/62 Super Rapid automatic cannon is a standard medium calibre gun aboard South African ships, serving as the primary weapon of the Warrior-class offshore patrol vessel and main gun aboard the Valour-class frigates"

http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=6642:fact-file-otomelera-76mm62-super-rapid-medium-automatic-cannon&catid=79:fact-files&Itemid=159

According to your own South African Navy official website, your Valour ships have 1970s 76mm Compact NOT Super Rapid....

Name Number Builders Laid down Launched Commissioned

SAS Amatola F145 Blohm+Voss Hamburg 02 Aug 2001 06 June 2002 25 Sep 2005
SAS Isandlwana F146 Howaldtswerke Kiel 26 Oct 2001 05 Dec 2002 19 Dec 2004
SAS Spioenkop F147 Blohm+Voss Hamburg 28 Feb 2002 02 Aug 2003 15 Mar 2004
SAS Mendi F148 Howaldtswerke Deutche Werft, Kiel 28 Jun 2002 Oct 2003 15 Jun 2004


Displacement, tons: 3,590 full load
Speed, knots: 28.
Range,miles: 7,700 at 15 kt
Complement: 92 plus 8 aircrew plus 20 spare
Missiles: SSM: 8 Exocet MM40 Block 2; SAM Umkhonto 16 cell VLS
Guns: 1 OTOBreda 76mm/62 compact
2 LIW DPG 35mm (twin). 2 Oerlikon 20mm Mk1.
Combat data systems: Thomson-CSF.

http://www.navy.mil.za/equipment/valour.htm

Your own source proved you to be a liar on Sunday morning

Go to church and repent of your random lying and falsehood

Patchesagain:
Who says that the missile decoys are 100% effective?

Who says they are not 100% effective ?
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mzilakazi:
Can you give us a prove of your claim that the valours are only armed with 13 Exocet missiles?

We don't need a total of 32 missiles to sink Nigerian corvette, only one will be enough.

Your navy is small and is only capable to fight pirates and cannot stand SAN. Your Navy cannot project force anywhere outside Nigeria and can never stop SAN in attack.

Patchesagain:
1. You arent buying anything

2. 13 active missiles for SAN v 0 Active missiles for NN... who wins?

Nigeria wins ! NNS Centenary and NNS Unity HP-J 14 anti-missile decoys will waste your Valour Patrol Corvettes missiles, then gun battle starts, Nigerian ships have a modern stealth 76mm gun with superior range to South African 1970s obsolete shorter range guns !
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RooiBoi:
I think you are pretty stupid.

Number 1, naval gun technology has not advanced so much in the last 50 years that a gun in 1970 is not useful today. Similar to M2 50 cal it was designed and first built in 1933. Is it obsolete today?

How about you define obsolete first? Define what it means for something to become obsolete.

According to you Obsolete weapons become good when it is South Africa using them. If it was Nigerian stealth ship using a 1970s gun repainted from scrap yard, will you still be saying the gun is good? Ask yourself and judge yourself....Goat Brained Mörön !
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mzilakazi:
Bwahahaha… that is for political reason and we are fully aware of it. When the most scandalous arms deal took place all expected SANDF would acquire corvettes but instead frigates were procured. Due to all the afore mentioned circumstances SANDF incorrectly labeled frigates as corvettes because were acquired under a project meant for corvettes. However, valour is indeed a frigate and not a corvette. Look at the size and the armament.

According to South African navy authorities, you have Valour patrol corvettes NOT frigates, your navy has now downgraded their class due to poor armament, missile shortages, and obscolete combat suites plus 1970s rusted gun.

"Valour Class Patrol Corvettes - with images from the SAS Amatola, SAS Isandlwana and SAS Spioenkop."

http://www.navy.mil.za/vtour/default.htm
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mzilakazi:
Can you give us a prove of your claim that the valours are only armed with 13 Exocet missiles?

We don't need a total of 32 missiles to sink Nigerian corvette, only one will be enough.

Your navy is small and is only capable to fight pirates and cannot stand SAN. Your Navy cannot project force anywhere outside Nigeria and can never stop SAN in attack.

Nigerian navy has published plans to refit Aradu frigate and buy guided missile fast attack crafts this 2016, we are in a buying mood and the whole world can see that. SAN will have a problem when our missile vessels are put to sea later this 2016.

SIPRI records 17 Exocets for SAN, thats all you bought, your Southy mates here said your navy t?st fires missiles every few years, so after test firing 4 Exocets on 4 Valour frigates in 10 years, how many missiles do you have left ? 17 - 4 = 13 you fool !

FighterPilot:
NO EVIDENCE THAT NIGERIA HAS C803 ANTI MISSILE ON ITS ARSENAL. THE LAST TIME I CHECKED, THE C803 MISSILE WAS SAID TO BE NON-EXISTENT http://www.defensemedianetwork.com/stories/chinas-eagle-strike-eight-anti-ship-cruise-missiles-the-yj-83-c803-and-the-family-tree/

MOREOVER, IT WAS SAID THAT CHINA WOULD NOT OPT FOR IT SINCE IS A POOR MISSILE AND THAT THERE ARE ALREADY PLENTY OF MISSILES WHICH ARE MORE ADVANCED THAN C803.

CONCLUSION.

NIGERIA DOES NOT HAVE C803. NO EVIDENCE AND SO WE CANNOT ENTERTAIN THIS TOPIC OF A WISH LIST.

Nobody ever said Nigeria has C-803 anti-ship missile as at now, but it can be acquired for our stealth OPVs if war arises, same way your guys claim South Africa can buy more Exocet missiles.

You dont have monopoly of buying new weapons. Every country can do that.

C-803 and C-802 misssiles exist, C-803 developed but not yet exported, C-802 already exported. JF-17 Thunder jet carries the C-802 missile just like warships
.

[size=13pt]

jln115:
If you take the Valour class With its armament it could easily be classified as a Destroyer.

LOL....South African Navy officially classifies Valour as a mere Patrol Corvette NOT even up to Frigate, talk less of Destroyer class !

"Valour Class Patrol Corvettes - with images from the SAS Amatola, SAS Isandlwana and SAS Spioenkop."

http://www.navy.mil.za/vtour/default.htm

SAN Classifies It's Valour Warships As Patrol Corvettes Due to Poor armament
.[/size]

jln115:
1. Yes we do have Super-Rapid, they are fitted on our Valour and Warrior class, I can provide sources if you like!
.

Show us a photo of South African navy Super rapid gun on a Valour frigate, show us the gun on your valour and post the photo of a Super rapid from manufacturer's source beside it ....liar, you will end up in hell.

jln115:
Prove that project Biro is 20 years old!!

Did I say it is 20 years old?

I mean from it's inception to it's 20th year ahead, it will give SAN no single OPV. Simple.

Patchesagain:
1. Super Rapid

2. Valour Class can carry up to 16 SSM's and 32 SAMs

3. Why would we need torps when we are the only ones in SSA who operate subs?

4. Nigerian Corvette has no missiles - it will be target practice for a valour class

1. Stop telling lies about Super Rapid gun, SAN has NONE ! Your Valour ships have 76mm Compact, the obsolete 1970s gun model.

2. Valour can only carry 8 SSM Exocets NOT 16 you liar. STOP TELLING RANDOM LIES, TRY FEAR GOD A LITTLE BIT.

3. NNS Aradu has torpedoes, it is standard for frigates, means SAN Valour frigates are NOT full multi-role, the lack ASW capabilities.

4. You said SAN can buy more missiles for your ships, so I said same for Nigeria, we too can arm our P18N with missiles as frigates
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Henry240:
I used to think they were some sort of enlarged variants of Proforce MkII's. However, i'm no longer so sure, seeing that Proforce exported their vehicles to an entirely different country.

Rwandan president visited Proforce factory. Rwandan police are now under UN in Bangui. Just trying to connect the dots...

Can anyone I.D. this APC or APV in C.A.R Bangui battle zone ?

http://news.yahoo.com/un-probes-deadly-shooting-rwandan-peacekeepers-c-africa-151059119.html
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jln115:
"Gan jou in die rede val, maat"(dont know the English expression hehe), I think its more fair to classify modern ships, in terms of their armament instead of tonnage, If you take the Valour class/ for example, its armed with 16/32 SAMs, 8/16 ASMs, 1x 76mm Gun, 2X 20mm guns, 2X 12,7 remotely operated guns, 1X Denel 35mm dual purpose gun, 4 324mm topedo tubes... With its armament it could easily be classified as a Destroyer.

Type 056 on the other hand is fitted to carry only 8 SAMs, 4 ASMs , 1X76mm gun, 2X30mm guns, 6torpedo tubes, thus would rightly be classified as a corvette.

Destroyer ? With only one 76mm gun from 1972 scrap yard? Fool.

Stop lying, South African navy Valour frigates have only about 13 Exocet missiles instead of the 32 missiles required to equip 4 ships.

All your Valour frigates have ZERO torpedoes.

Valour frigate Exocet has range about 70 km, Type 056 has C-803 with 250 km range....Nigerian corvette will sink your frigate
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jln115:
Ironic coming from a guy, who's navy sail in 60 year old cutters.

Ultra-Modern NNS Centenary stealth OPV is brand new, about one year old, and her sister ship NNS Unity is almost ready brand new built.

Project Biro cannot even give South African navy one Stealth OPV in 20 years

Patchesagain:
"mere SARs"


- It incorporates an all new integrated "glass" cockpit with a colour liquid crystal display system provides the crew with state-of-the-art technology increasing crew and mission effectiveness.
- Complemented with a Full Authority Digital Engine Control (FADEC) delivers low maintenance, enhanced performance and excellent economy with over 30% more power.
-The Telephonics Ocean-Eye radar is the aircraft's primary mission sensor and allows the crew to detect and track small to large surface contacts at long ranges.
-Complementing the radar is the Sysdel Sea Raven Electronic Support Measures (ESM) suite, which is used for passive target detection and identification.
- A Denel Optronics Argos 410-M Electro Optic Sight System with a forward-looking infra-red (FLIR) sensor and a day camera is used for passive target identification and recording.
- Target tracks and video images can be transmitted to the parent ship in real time using the Datalink unit supplied by Thales Advanced Engineering.

South African components include:

- a Sysdel electronic warfare suite,
- a Saab Grintek Avitronics EW countermeasures system,
- an Aerosud armoured flight crew seats
- as well as an infrared exhaust suppression system
- Denel is supplying an electro-optical sighting system (EOSS) and Tellumat an Identification Friend or Foe system.
- Thales Advanced Engineering was contracted to supply a datalink as a well as a "video grabber", a dedicated bit of hardware that allows the transfer of video material taken by the EOSS to be transmitted to the mothership for further action.
- Reutech Defence Industries and Saab Grintek Communications Systems provided the HF and V/UHF radios.

[size=13pt]Nigeria has no helo that compares!! Most advanced in SSA! I can taste the jelousy! [/size]

[size=13pt]

Nigerian Navy has superior long range SAR AW-139 helicopters you dummy !


With Navy pilots, and under Nigerian Navy aviation wing, something South African navy CANNOT do.....SAN has no pilot and no aviation wing ! Obsolete naval doctrine ![/size]


►Fastest cruise speed and highest power to weight ratio in its category worldwide !

►Two powerful Pratt & Whitney Canada PT6 engines, with FADEC and an advanced rotor system provide superior ‘hot and high’ performance and exceptional One Engine Inoperative (OEI) capability for unparalleled safety (Cat. A Class 1 performance at Maximum Gross Weight at 40°C at Sea Level) and handling for SAR operations in confined areas

►State-of-the-art Honeywell Primus Epic® VFR / IFR low workload NVG compatible integrated glass cockpit with 4-axis digital autopilot, advanced avionics and systems provide excellent situational awareness and maximise mission effectiveness

►Optional mission equipment, including multi-band radios, radar, Electro-Optic / Infra-Red (EO/IR) device, mission console, video down-link, searchlight, loudspeakers, rescue hoist and cargo hook

►Largest cabin volume in its class, with accommodation for 2-4 stretchers with up to 5 seats

►Large sliding doors and flat-floor cabin enable use of hoist and rapid entry / egress on ground

►The only helicopter in its class to fully satisfy the latest FAR29 and AIROPS regulations, incorporating crashworthiness and survivability features

►Mission equipment including multi-band radios, radar, Electro-Optic / Infra-Red (EO/IR) device, mission console, video down-link, searchlight, loudspeakers, rescue hoist and cargo hook, internal weapons and modular ballistic protection for cockpit and cabin

►Largest passenger cabin in its class maximises working room and mission flexibility 8 m3 / 283 ft3 of cabin space can accommodate up to 15 passengers or 8 deployable law enforcement officers and 2 armed crew for aircraft protection

►Redundant systems, crashworthiness and self-sealing fuel tanks for survivability and safety

http://www.finmeccanica.com/-/aw139

https://geospatialworld.net//Admincms/Filemanager/connectors/ashx/images/AW139.jpg

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Patchesagain:
"mere SAR helicopter"

- It incorporates an all new integrated "glass" cockpit with a colour liquid crystal display system provides the crew with state-of-the-art technology increasing crew and mission effectiveness.
- Complemented with a Full Authority Digital Engine Control (FADEC) delivers low maintenance, enhanced performance and excellent economy with over 30% more power.
-The Telephonics Ocean-Eye radar is the aircraft's primary mission sensor and allows the crew to detect and track small to large surface contacts at long ranges.
-Complementing the radar is the Sysdel Sea Raven Electronic Support Measures (ESM) suite, which is used for passive target detection and identification.
- A Denel Optronics Argos 410-M Electro Optic Sight System with a forward-looking infra-red (FLIR) sensor and a day camera is used for passive target identification and recording.
- Target tracks and video images can be transmitted to the parent ship in real time using the Datalink unit supplied by Thales Advanced Engineering.

South African components include:

- a Sysdel electronic warfare suite,
- a Saab Grintek Avitronics EW countermeasures system,
- an Aerosud armoured flight crew seats
- as well as an infrared exhaust suppression system
- Denel is supplying an electro-optical sighting system (EOSS) and Tellumat an Identification Friend or Foe system.
- Thales Advanced Engineering was contracted to supply a datalink as a well as a "video grabber", a dedicated bit of hardware that allows the transfer of video material taken by the EOSS to be transmitted to the mothership for further action.
- Reutech Defence Industries and Saab Grintek Communications Systems provided the HF and V/UHF radios.

[size=15pt] It CANNOT FIGHT a simple Nigerian Shaldag gunboat
.[/size]

jln115:
1.No you can't , because they were never fitted for it, our Valours were fitted to carry 16 anti ship missles, and they also already have torpedo tubes unlike your OPVs.

2. Yes they are fitted with Super-Rapid, multiple sourc have been provided.

Stop lying, we discussed this issue last year. SAN official naval website says they are NOT super rapid, and the photos show they are NOT super rapid that is stealthy in architecture with straight edges, those round shaped edges 76mm guns are NOT super rapid.

Why don't you honour honesty for a few times in your country, do you South Africans even go to church? You tell lies toooooo much !!!!!!
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Henry240:
- 2, according to available data, yours use obsolete combat suits.


- 3, your bought bare, simple SAR helicopters for 13 million a unit. Pathetic!

They bought mere SAR helicopters for $ 40 million each, price of the Super Lynx....it can buy an ATR-42...British rip off on South Africa !

jln115:
1. Super-Rapid my friend

2. F100, Layfette and Charles De Gaulle class all use the same combat suit.

3. Ever heard of the phrase "Fitted for but not with" Our Lynx still have their mountings attached when the need arises for torpedo's, the Mokopa SAM have also been integrated on to them, the mountings for Sonar dippers are also still fitted. Our Valour class can also be fitted with an extra 8 Anti Ship missiles in place of the davit system, which is currently fitted were the missile silos would've been fitted(Refer to pic)

Nigeria too can fit torpedoes and missiles on NNS Centenary and NNS Unity stealth warships.

SAN Valour frigate does NOT have Super Rapid 76mm guns, we have debated that topic here last year, go see SAN official website, your ships have obsolete old 1972 guns removed from scrap yard and repainted. DON'T drag us back to old topics that have been thrashed and proved with credible sources in 2015, it kills the thread.