₦airaland Forum

You say,

Please sir, madam, I am getting married today. Please remove yourself if you are not here to celebrate with us. Pastor, let us proceed. I don't see how anyone, other than the actual people getting married could stop a wedding.

donnie:
Allonym,

It may suprise you , but many of those who are sick do not want to be haeld.

Jesus in his day, did not heal every sick person he met.

The crippled man at the gate of the temple had been there for 38 long years. Jesus went through that gate in to the temple several times but never attempted to heal the man.

He went to the pool of Bethsaida where there were several sick folk and healed only one man.

I was in a heling meeting with pastor Chris at the National Syadium Lagos where i saw something that amazed me. While thousands of sick folk struggled to get places in front there was this girl who went about with a paper saying 'DEAF and DUMB'.

Amazed at her, i asked her when she approached me with as much sign language as i could why she was not in the front waiting to be healed.

I tell you, the look she gave me told me and those around me that she hated me for that suggestion and she immediately left me and continued begging around.

Those beggars on the streets.i tell you give one of them a million naira, and you'll see him back there the next day. The same with the sick and crippled.many don't want to be healed.

Anyone who comes to Jesus in faith will not leave disappointed!

It seems to me that it is you who will encounter surprise in your life.

Really, here is the problem. There is a man who currently has a leg problem and comes to the church praying for help confessing that he believes he will be healed.

If he is not healed either:
1) He did not truely believe
2) His prayers or those of others were not sincere
3) God has decided it is not his time
4) He was being selfish
5) God has already decided he is never to be healed
6) He will learn to be content and thus go away "satisfied"

If he is healed:
1) God answered his prayer and granted him a miracle.

For many people, those are their explanations. Maybe you cannot see it, but I see this as total bs.

i thought in the bible, if you did not make up to a certain amount, you did not pay tithes?

This is one reason I don't think most churches have the tithes thing right. If you are going to tell me that the tithing part of the old testament still applies though you would say that Jesus' coming frees us from the "Law" then why not tithe exactly the way the bible says we should. If I cannot afford to tithe, according to the old testament, I shouldn't be tithing.

goodguy:
Those who pay tithes are not complaining. It's you who doesn't pay that is lamenting here.

Just like its mainly women who don't suffer from spousal abuse who are the main ones who do advocacy work in that area.

Those who suffer seem to be the most quiet. For many, they don't think it is wrong. There is nothing new about that.

gospelman:
Holy brethren,this is my contribution:
those who are in support of the ban, when they get sick, and the doctor has given up on them,they will look for miracles and none of these guys who have criticized the miracles can help them.
And their pride will not let them go to those they have criticized.So what? They will have two options:
1.Lay down your pride,feel sorry for yourself for criticising, and go to be healed,or
2.Remain in your pride and die of the sickness.

That's the bottom line.Then we would know who be the fake.

If this were true, most of the world would be cured of any maladies since most of us would have swallowed our pride (if we were against miracle workers before) to go and be "cured" after exhausting what medical science has to offer. Since Africa is the continent with the greatest number of AIDS and new HIV cases EVERY DAY, I seriously doubt the "miracle" workers are really doing much.

terdoo:
It is absolutely wrong for both husband and wife to be in the same profession or carreer,

because they will not have the time for their children for example if both husband and wife

are doctors by profession you could imagine what the children will undergo, infact they will

not even have a single time for their chilrden.

The father may be oncall today then next the mother of which the parents are maent to

spend much of their time on the children istead of leaving the job for the hose girl to do.

I know that it is absolutley wrong for both of them to be in the same profession.

This is not correct. Personal and anecdotal evidence shows that both parents can be medical doctors and still find time for their children. Perhaps you don't have children yet, and thus cannot imagine what you would do for them.

yemstrad:
Damsel indeed. @allonym...please give your reasons for saying the man has done anything bad. Is it because there is no modern law that kick against it?
If that is your rationale for supporting the old fool, then where do you place moral values that is supposed to be entrenched in our day-to-day living irrespective of civil laws

Well, at the moment, I cannot think of any moral values which I believe in which are not supported by some law or which are contradicted by another law.

So, to answer the question, why do I support his decision:

1) There is no law against it
2) Everyone has a right to marry whom they wish - with the exception of incest. Now, if you define this as incest (which many people in another thread would) then I can understand being against the man's decision.
3) Some suggest that the old man killed his son (somehow) to get the wife. Assuming that the son did not die under suspicious circumstances, the it is equally likely that anyone on this forum killed him as well.
4) I don't see anything wrong with an "old" man marrying a "young" woman. Are old men for some reason not allowed to have wives in nigeria anymore? Or is it that old men are rare, and thus him having a wife is a strange thing, let alone him being alive?
5) I cannot think of a single thing (based on the original story) that the old man (or his wife) have done wrong. There is nothing in the bible that suggests I should look down on their actions. So, why should I?

So, for those who disagree with me please answer one or more of the following:

1) What law if any is there against this situation?
2) Is this a case of incest?
3) If you think the man killed his son to get the woman, what experience do you have that allows you to draw this conclusion based on no evidence to suggest it?
4) Do you think "old" men should not be able to marry "young" women?
5) Is there something in the bible or some other moral code which prohibits their relationship?

actually, what is wrong with a man wearing women's clothes and vice-versa? Beyond any weird revulsion people would feel about it, what is fundamentally wrong. Clothes are just pieces of cloth.

I wouldn't mind giving my SO my paycheck. As long as I can pursue my projects and I know my SO is managing our money wisely and paying bills on time, I could care less about giving my entire check away.

Helly:
That's going to be a very difficult decision to make for one who find's him or herself in that situation. Well if God forbid i happen to be in that situation, all i'll have to do is to buy a kidney for them both, but if it's not possible to do that , then i'll donate for my dad and look any of my husby's relation to donate for him afterall mine may not even match his since we're not of the same blood, but i must look for an alternative to see that he survive's it.

If your kidney didn't match, there would be no point to this question. Also, if there were other available matches, there would similarly be no point. The point is you have to make a decision that would save the life of one person you (supposedly) love over another. So, given that assumption, what would you do?

Personally, I know what chuck norris would do. Chuck Norris is so tough he smoked 12 cartons of cigarettes a day for 2 years and acquired 7 types of cancers, he cured himself by simple flexing for 10 minutes…

yemstrad:
I am particularly sad that some people still believe the old fool has not done anything wrong. That is why we don't have any explanation for the calamities befalling our nation today. Every other things that provide solutions to similar national problems in other countries are constntly being defied in Nigeria because of our sins.

Ok, then explain what is wrong with what he did. I've been asking that. The best answer that has been given so far has been: Its wrong because my culture says its wrong. And that is not a real answer to a question to a person who needs a response other than because that is the way the world is. I'm above the age of 6. At this point, I need better answers.

SO, the bible does instruct women not to wear men's clothing and vice versa. The bible also instructs us not to wear clothes of mixed fibers. Funny how nobody cares about the second.

In any case, your attire for the most part is up to you. However, if specific attire is required for a particular location, until you can convince the rule setter otherwise, you must adhere to it. If your church requires women NOT to wear pants, then women can't wear pants in that church. It doesn't mean they can't wear pants elsewhere.

There a restaurants that enforce dress codes, parties which require strict formal wear. Nobody finds those out of place.

If someone is telling you that you cannot wear pants in your normal life, then you are free to listen to or dismiss them. I would say dismiss them, but that is my view.

The bible was written by humans and there has only been one pure human in history. Therefore, we must be careful where cultural views of the times have been "inserted" into the bible.

panthress:
IF MY brain is dead then im no longer alive, then i can be buried, da heart can't function withhout the brain. da brain runs tingz

Not quite. Its postulated that the brainstem actually controls much of the bodies . . . ahh unconscious activities - i can't think of the word now but - its stuff that you do without having to think about it like breathing, your heat beating, etc. So, maybe with your head cut off, your body could no longer do that. . but I'm sure there are situations where a person could become brain damaged to the point where their mind cannot return, though the brainstem is still intact and functioning perfectly.

easy choice, my spouse.

layi:
...thats just an assumption. Younger yes but that has nothing to do with how long they both got left. We've had mothers who outlived their children.

After my spouse gets the kidney, mom may not be in a position to outlive anyone. . .

Seun:
There is no way that there'll be 49 plane crashes in one year. After the third plane crash the president will declare an emergency and ground all the airplanes. If after the arplanes are allowed into the air they start crashing again, then people will know that there's a "curse" on them and they will be permanently grounded. So it is not possible. Plus, how many planes fly in Nigeria really?

I made a similar statement and was told that the prophecy (well, hind-phecy) did not specify in which country the 49 planes would crash.

there are many things that have been unheard of that have been introduced to nigerian cultures in the past 50 years. Heck, many of those things were unheard of in western culture. That argument is not sufficient.

The argument that Edo culture forbids a man to marry the widow of his son is a different thing. That, I will have to research and if correct as stated, serves as motivation enough to explain the out of hand condemnation of the man, though it does not reveal why anyone feels this is wrong - unless that too is revealed in my research into Edo culture.

Also, this does not explain why the woman faced no such condemnation from anyone.

I think one problem that keeps coming up in discussions here is this:

Arguments are being made based on the assumption that your side is correct.

For example, arguing that God exists because he created the world does not further your argument. Or saying that I will know God exists once he comes to me in a dream doesn't really help either.

nicetohave:
what/who you believe in? not your church......

as to your quest for proof of the testimonies i lay claim to, remember i do not lay claim to it being done through me, but i lay claim to it having witnessed it, you will have to remember that patients records are confidential.it cannot be made public via any other means than priviledged viewing of the records in the hospital, meaning you will have to visit the facility where the records are and get a priviledged access to it, but i'll tell you this;

The man healed of blindness from glaucoma was a patient at UCH, ibadan where i trained, he walked into one of our teaching sessions and confronted Dr. Ajaiyeoba my consultant Ophthalmologist, who had proclaimed him clinically blind.........he was reexamined, and corroborated by other ophthalmologists, the man can see!

The case of the man with the advanced renal cell carcinoma occured where i work here in trinidad, he was sent home because he couldnt tolerate the rigors of anesthesia because he had a flu and other lung pathology (from metastasis) making him unfit for aneasthesia at the moment, he was reshceduled, he came back for the surgery two months later and a repeat pathology report showed no trace of the cancer, he now walks about a healthy man the streets of trinidad.

Their testimonies? the man healed of glaucoma claimed he attended a crusade and was prayed for by an evangelist (i wont mention the name)

The man healed of renal cell carcinoma never went to be prayed for, he said every sunday after he was diagnosed he went to church with a positive faith to survive it, he not only did so but invite other cancer patients along to church every time, he was never prayed for but he kept believing God, he never knew he was even healed................the pathologists report confirmed it,he was sent home to be reexamined in a year (now you don't send home a man with advanced renal carcinoma to be reexamined in a year unless he no longer has cancer!) his health has since been rejuvinated.

Now my statements can't be proven here because i can't make a patients note available on the internet but they are true, those ones i witnessed, million others are present..............what are we doubting here? the fact that these men were healed or the fact that it is not medicine that healed them ?(because it has written them off) who then did it? well i submit it is my God of default, he has been doing it for ages and he does it even as i write these words.

I have the same problem with Get Rich if you buy my book and follow my method things that pop up on various tv shows. The "people" they show who supposedly benefitted, you can never track them down. No real names or locations are given. They're like Ptomkin villages. (I wonder if you've heard of these Nferyn?) I'd think if I had such a miraculous recovery, I'd want lots of people to know without any shadow of a doubt. The only ppl who seem to make any such effort are those whose miracle cures were verified and recorded by the Vatican.

nicetohave:
I'm sorry to disagree with your last statement allonym, before i agree that there are no contradictions between your statements and your faith, i need to ask; what is your faith? what do you believe in? being a christian is a blanket to cover a lot of things, what is your faith my allonym?

Umm, US Baptist? Is that what you're asking?

prettyH:
Allonym, given your responses i'd never have thot u were a Christian

I've never thought being Christian meant that I should banish all possible doubt or questions I'd have concerning the veracity of the religion. Since Christianity (or at least my denomination/branch/whatever) encourages me to study myself, I don't see contradictions between my statements and my faith.