₦airaland Forum

I almost wonder if a reason for the braiding was to distinguish in some way the King from his subjects?

Ife Buddha

https://charlesstinson.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/IfeBuddha-200px.jpg
http://charlesstinson.com/?p=598

You got it!
You posted a comment elsewhere and I took it up as sort of a challenge; I asked the Source for the same page promoter and the divine response I got was the Dawodu-David name. Getting the to the root of the name Dawodu will really help us to understand better the person of Oba Dawodu.

I have wondered if he had the same mother (Edomite?) as his brothers and his name could have been his actual name from birth (naming as seems to be widespread today is quite different from the way it was done back then).

Those in the middle east today say that David means beloved, now I ask myself if the name Dawodu implies that many of them are not the original speakers of the tongues they speak today.

An/The Igbo version is Anochie meaning royal heir.
Do Edo people also bear Dawodu?

For the adherents of Orisha worship:

Aren't the Orisha saints rather than attributes?
Isn't worship of the orisha like telling the Everlasting Father that HIS arm is shortened? Note that the Word of God is the Arm of the Everlasting Father.
If they lived close to the arctic circle, would they have called the northern lights (aka aurora borealis) a deity and goddess as well?

tpia@, my comments are within the domain of this thread!

I doubt if they were to attach crowns or bead-like decorations as such would have been excavated alongside the figurines. However, if hair were attached then it would have decayed over time underground or when exposed to the elements.

Furthermore it strongly supports the Orun Oba Ado claim:
If it was a standard practice from Ife then the heads of Benin kings could truly have been taken to Ife for the sculptors to produce the bronze replica with the hair attached and sending such to Benin. This can be verified by finding out if Benin royal bronze heads had similar holes and if any of their rulers had braided hair.

These figurines include holes around the fringes of the scalp, moustache and beard. A certain Biblical anthropologist asserts that figurines excavated from the city of David (Dawodu) included such perforations in which hair from the dead (deified?) ancestor/ruler was woven. My argument was that if the hair was kinky that would pose challenges. however, the response I got was that rulers at that time had their hair braided. Previously I had thought Sango's was an exception and that the perforations had to do with the casting technique. Also, the records of Yoruba rulers we seem to have are not distant from the period of Sango's reign.

Do you know of any other Yoruba ruler whose hair was plaited/braided?
Are there any other reasons for the perforations?

anonymous6:
https://jamesbrantley.net/2%20ife%20head%20of%20a%20king.jpg
http://jamesbrantley.net/chapter_two.htm

https://img.artknowledgenews.com/files2010apr/Obalufon-Dynasty-and-Divinity-Ife-Art.jpghttp://www.artknowledgenews.com/2010-04-25-20-45-27-museum-announces-us-tour-of-ife-art-in-ancient-nigeria-exhibition.html

https://www.africanart.org/uploads/products/images/final_ife_frontbookcover_tiny_copy2.jpghttp://www.africanart.org/products/228/dynasty_and_divinity_ife_art_in_ancient_nigeria

[img]http://hum.lss.wisc.edu/hjdrewal/Ife5.jpg[/img]http://hum.lss.wisc.edu/hjdrewal/Ife.html

I got this from 234next.com in which was listed a Nigerian professor with Nok as surname:

Five academicians qualify for Nigerian National Order of Merit Award
Only five of the 90 nominees short listed for the 2010 and 2011 Nigerian National Order of Merit (NNOM) Awards qualified for the honours.


Prof. Oluwafeyisola Adegoke, the Chairman, Governing Board of the Nigerian National Merit Awards, disclosed this in Abuja on Tuesday at a news conference.

According to Adegoke, the nominees are Professors Andrew Nok, Isidore Okpewho, Ebiegberi Alagoa, Francis Idachaba and Ibok Etukudo.

``It gives me great pleasure on behalf of the members of the governing board of the NNMA to welcome you to another memorable celebration of the intellectual and creative achievements of Nigerians.

The rest of the story can be seen at http://234next.com/csp/cms/sites/Next/News/National/5748362-147/five_academicians_qualify_for_nigerian_national.csp

That is not the focus of this thread. Rather, can you confirm whether or not Dawodu is a name indigenous to the Yoruba or whether it was imported?

Go and find out the name of Fela Anikulapo-Kuti's parents and if they were muslims. His dad's name was Dawodu and his mother's was Beere - they were called by those names respectively for being the first 2 students of Abeokuta Grammar School. Beere is the female version of Dawodu. Whether you accept it or not is not my problem. The Truth remains the Truth whether or not you agree.

You might want to go through VoodooDoll's link once again:

VoodooDoll:
Dawodu in Yoruba has a meaning and normally refers to the eldest son.

No good online sources other than Wikipedia.

But you can find a reference to Dawodu in this Nigerian Supreme court case.

http://www.nigeria-law.org/Alhaja%20Suara%20Yusuff%20%20v%20%20Mrs%20Yetunde%20Dada%20&%203%20Ors.htm

"being the eldest surviving son is the Dawodu and head of late Chief J. O. Laniyonu family under native law and custom."

Search for the name "Dawodu" in the above link.

PAGAN 9JA, Isn't the Maker/Possessor of heaven and earth the Ruler, and Oduduwa the ancestor?

I didn't say they were not to be taken as serious research, neither did I say otherwise.

We can try this - is there any name similar to Nok/Enoch/Enosh/HanochNod in Igboland?
There is the name Anochie in Igbo which means replacer or to replace. Does the name have to do with royal descent? In what context is it used?

The Ashante have the word ano kyi (Ano Junior) which has been thought to have to do with a line of succession.

VoodooDoll, the link you provided is very educative; thanks. The way the name was addressed as the Dawodu almost made it portrayed as a title. I guess the name is in the same category as Taiye/Taiwo and Kehinde which are regarded by the Yoruba people as names of the bearers as given directly from heaven.

Can't we derive the actual meaning by breaking it down into syllables as is done for other names like Opeyemi etc? In my opinion eldest son seems like scratching at the surface. My Yoruba is not yet okay else I would have made some attempts.

tpia@, are you arguing that Dawodu is meaningless in Yoruba or that Dawodu is an imported name amongst the Yoruba?
Is it not true that the Yoruba meaning has to do with the heir or royal first-born son?
Isn't there a female version of that name - Beere (Funmilayo Ransome-Kuti)?

don't you mean Dauda?

What I've experienced was: the cooler the weather the lesser the itch. Similarly the itch increased in intensity when bathing with warm water. I learnt to avoid groundnuts, noodles, and corn-based products (including pap, corn flakes and golden morn), but use sponge for privates and quick baths though! I've also had a history of allergies and recently Yehve (God) healed me from SLE.

The itch seemed to be induced also with the presence of heat/humidity, change of clothes, certain clothing fibres, contact with some kind of furniture covering, loofah sponges, and smacks.

For now I'll go with bayomaks' and some of agathamari's. I eat a lot of ewa agoyin and I hope it isn't a culprit.

I received a revelation that Dawodu is the original Yoruba name for David instead of Dafidi as transliterated from English-language Bibles. I have recently wondered at the kind of formula used to transliterate Biblical names eg Miriam - Mary - Meri - Moremi, Joshua - Jesus? - Yoshua - Yahushua, Jebus - Jebu and many others. Anyway, below is the proof of Dawodu for David as currently displayed on the wikipedia sites for David and Daud respectively:

David (Hebrew: דָּוִד, דָּוִיד, Modern David Tiberian Dāwîḏ; ISO 259-3 Dawid; Strong's Daveed; beloved; Arabic: داوود‎ or داود‎[note A] Dāwūd)

Daud (Arabic: داوود‎) is a male Arabic given name corresponding to David. The Persian form is Dawood. Other variant spellings in the Latin alphabet include Da'ud, Daut, Daoud, Dawud, Davud, and Davut.

My take is that since many of the people occupying the Levant today may not be the original speakers of the languages therein then they just might not know the actual meanings of the words they use. The name David is an example as it is said to mean beloved - probable guesswork.

I now pose a challenge here on Nairaland.

What is the meaning of Dawodu?
What is the oriki for those bearing Dawodu?
Who will do the honour of editing the wikipedia pages for Dawodu and David accordingly with information gleaned from the answers to the first 2 questions and possibly using this thread as reference?

Aargh! the anti-spam bot,

Negro_Ntns, Ive edited it accordingly. I know that the Ijebu were absorbed and I suspect that the people of Sabe who have the Onisabe as Oba are in fact the remnant of the Sabeans. The excerpts from the book in this link seem to give accounts of the spread of various cults from one Yoruba kingdom to another.
http://books.google.com.ng/books?id=-U70Ts7CgEYC&pg=PA54&dq=nago+uprising&hl=en&ei=uPTTTtHYDabN4QTv66FL&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CDIQ6AEwAQ

mbatuku2, there might have been another word for king which could have fallen into disuse. Yet I'm sure you'll agree with me that a traditional ruler in various or all parts of Nigeria is seen more as the father of all his subjects than the state itself ("L'Etat, c'est moi" ("The state, it is I")

It seems a very important detail has been left out and it has to do with the orientation of the gele. If girl/woman wears the gele with the knot in front that indicates virginity and or spinsterhood. If it is at the back it indicates that the wearer is married. I'm not sure if this is entirely correct but for sure the position of the knot is supposed to be significant. Also, if what I've mentioned is accurate then it means women nowadays advertise absence of chastity.

The Yoruba people call their kings OBA, which is equivalent to Abba as mentioned in Mark 14:36. In Nigeria where there is one of the largest concentrations of Yoruba people, kings are generally referred to in the English language as royal fathers. This is an apt translation of Oba as the royal father is regarded as a father on a grander scale than the father of a family. Since a nation can be regarded as a family or a unit and the family head or husband who is a male accordingly regarded as the father, the Oba or royal father is the father of all the people (his subjects). It is not then surprising that the Yoruba people observe a taboo that regards an attempt to number the children of the family head and Oba especially as an abomination as his children are a blessing from YAHWEH that are supposed to be too numerous to count. Hence the Yoruba saying,

A kii ka ọmọ fun ọlọmọ.
We do not count the children for the owner of the children.

Likewise, since Yahushua (known by many as Jesus), the Son of GOD, calls YAHWEH “Our Father”, “Father” and “Abba”, and since Abba is the same as Oba, Abba must mean “Our Father”, “Father of Man” and “Father of All”. The earthly Oba is seen as YAHWEH’s representative.

The background of this taboo seems to have been forgotten among the Yoruba people just as those for many taboos have been noted in Africa with no tangible background. Nevertheless, to get more evidence of this particular Yoruba census taboo’s roots we would have to look at the Israel and the Bible as some Yoruba peoples are thought in some quarters to be descendants of Israel.

The taboo was as a result of the punishment Israel received for the national census that Dawodu (David in the Yoruba language) carried out as recorded in 2 Samuel 24 and 1 Chronicles 21 from which 70,000 men died. From this account it almost seems that Joab was more righteous and fearful of YAHWEH than Dawodu in this matter. However, Joab’s stance seemed to have been borne out of gut instinct or listening to his Ori Inu (Inner Head or Guardian Angel or Ego or the principal architect of our fortune both in heaven and on earth) as he was not able to provide reasons to convince Dawodu that the planned national census was abominable as he rightly expressed – my speculation. The punishment meted out to Dawodu was the beginning of the observance of the taboo.

But what is wrong in carrying out a census? Other censuses of Israel had been carried out before the one just mentioned. For example, censuses were mentioned in Numbers 1: 1-3 and 1 Samuel 15:4. Perhaps the taboo-resulting one opposed by Joab was at a time when the nation of Israel was mature, well-defined and settled. In Genesis 46: 26-27 we see the number of persons of Israel that migrated to Egypt where and when Joseph (also known as Joseph) was Vice-Gerent. This migration can be thought of as the infant stage of the nation of Israel, much like a sower knowing the number of seeds sown in a particular location but not knowing the number of seeds and/or fruits that are reaped upon maturity and harvest.

Sowing that is countable or in singles followed by reaping in multitudes is derived from YAHWEH’s promise to Abraham (Genesis 12:3; 13:16; 15:5; 17:5-6; and 24:60), Isaac (Genesis 26:4) and Jacob (Genesis 28:3,14 and 34:9-11) of descendants that are too numerous for man to count.

Understanding the heart of YAHWEH on this census taboo would necessitate the question,

Why does YAHWEH want HIS people to be as numerous as the stars in the sky?

The answer is quite simple and is seen in the command HE gave to man when HE created them (Genesis 1:28) and to Noah and his sons (Genesis 9:1, 7), that is, to be fruitful, multiply, and bring forth abundantly on earth. HE is using HIS people to accomplish HIS will on earth.

The essay was originally posted here but was modified for the Nairaland audience.

Amujale:
I'm not going to go into the semantics of either Lemba or Mobalufon's connection with the Ijebu's but will say this; there's more to Semitics than meets the Unclad eye (would like for you to make an Afrocentric research into this area); the notion that Obanta migrated from Wadai is as accurate as the supposed migration of Odua from Mecca, both are just simply impossible; out-rightly inaccurate and completely unfit for purpose.

Obanita couldn't have migrated from Egypt because the ancient Egyptian community didn't even exist during the time depicted. Prior to the first Egyptian Dynastic period, most of the communities in the Yoruboid, Edoid and Igboid communities were already established civilizations and or authorities.

In a sense, we are talking of periods that depict the times before records began; and the chronology of the Ooni's is known to a particular percentage of accuracy because history makes mention of those that are of greater significance. More importantly, the dates that are matched against the kings of Ife are completely and utterly inaccurate.

When Oranmiyan was King of Ile-Ife, ancient Egypt wasn't even a dream in the mind of mankind never-mind an after thought. The argument is which part of the South of the Sahara first came into existence, Ethiopia?, Nigeria?, Chad?, Ghana?, Niger? e.t.c take your pick


Eridu is the earliest city in mesopotamia, and mesopotamia was born out of the Ubaid period (6500 to 3800 BCE); lets put this into its proper perspective, the Pre-dynastic periods of ancient Egypt begins in periods 9500 BCE and we already aware that the communities of Southern Nigeria and elsewhere not only predates this but were among those that provided influence towards the making and building of the nation.

Therefore, the entire lists of cities in the regions of the Yoruboid, Edoid and Igboid communities predate Eridu in years that would amount to hundreds of thousands of years. The fact that much of the literary proof has been destroyed, stolen and or confiscated doesn't mean we still cannot prove this beyond reasonable doubt.

We have so much material, evidence and or proof that points towards these simple truths. Many myths have been disproved, debunked and proved wrong with regards to African history and most had to do with the commentary of Eurocentric and Asiatic writers.

We have a chronology of flow in human personnel moving from Africa towards Asia, Europe and Americas during periods that depict an era whereby the only ethnicity on the entire planet were that of black Africans. We are able to prove that Arabs came out of Africa; the period they were supposed to have migrated; their ethnicity at the time and their state of mind and much more. . .

We are also aware of the science of genetics that supports the idea that the black genes is more or less point zero; a yard stick to every other human genetic make-up. Are aware of the periods whereby Africans inhabitted the area we know to be Europe and much more. . .

Would you care to let us know how you arrived at the impossibility of the migration?
Can you provide us with a list of Ile-Ife kings and/or notable residents since 4,000BC?
Are you saying that Ife has had only 50 Oonis (Kings) since 9500 BCE?
Are you saying that what the people of Eredo believe about Sungbo is impossible, that the queen did not return to that site with all her people (Yoruba?)?
Yoruba oral history includes the account of an extraordinary flood - What would have happened to human settlements and their locations before, during and after the flood?

[quote author=Negro_Ntns link=topic=797242.msg9617700#msg9617700 date=1322068190]Anonymous,

That's a beautiful piece. I wonder how many of these arts are held in museums and private collections by people who have no clue of their values or the meaning in them. Europeans should stop whining about 419 scammers that empty their banks. . . . . they looted our arts ad cultural artifacts and are still adamant on holding onto it.[/quote]What if the artworks were deliberately mislabeled?

We are not denying that humans emerged from Africa. What we are however contesting is that the Yoruba migrated from the region of the Levant or thereabout to this part of West Africa. If you still refuse to acknowledge that, what then would you say about the migration of the Lemba and the Ijebu peoples?

Has it not been mentioned in the recent past that the present Ile-Ife isn't the original one? perhaps the eight

Can you provide us with a list of Ile-Ife kings and/or notable residents since 4,000BC?

The first city in the world is said to be Eridu in the land of the Sumerians; where was Ile-Ife then?

Can you explain the reason for the name of the town called Oke Eri? What is the major achievement associated with Sungbo (Eredo)?

Can you help me with the meaning of Anochie?

so, aren't there any pre-1960 pictures?

Effurun - Ephron?
Orisha - Orissa (in India)?

Amujale, isn't snow mentioned in the Ifa literary corpus? If so, how come?

David is not Dafidi but Dawodu. Similarly, Eredo might have been named thus in remembrance of Eridu which is reputed in some quarters to be the first city on earth.

I'm grateful.

any examples?

Negro_Ntns, I did not necessarily allude to you or yours.

I feel wary of the response to your question since the supposed custodians haven't taught us the reason for the names of the weeks and months of the solar calendar. Also, do they remember the names of the 13 months of their lunar calendar?