₦airaland Forum

jln115:
- Considering there are around 700 Ratel in service, 242 Badger is not enough to replace all of them, however I have the suspicion that our Ratel 90, Ratel 80(mortar) and Ratel ZT3 are still going to be in service for quite some time!!

- Only 6 T5-52....but considering we swapped 6 G5 for 6 T5-52s it's a pretty sweet deal.

- The OPV requirement of project Biro has been differed to 2019/2020

Look not saying South Africa is making dumb acquisition, but saying Algeria and Egypt are making dumb acquisitions simply because they are making making large acquisitions is a bit ignorant!!

Rember we have 2 active duty mechnized infantry battalions that use around 100 rates. So 200 badgers means our mechnized and Armoured battalions of the active duty force can be covered. The reserver forces and other units that use rates will keep them. A lot of units from artillery, engineers, signal units, Armoured car battalions extra extra use ratels

Field0Marshall:
In case of a crash, do they equip this pilot with small arms to defend themselves ? Pls.

A pistol and knife is carried by faster jet pilots. The issue is that in a fight that not all that effective against a squad with rifels. Best thing is to not get in to a shoot out or if fighting a civilized enemy surrender if found.

Henry240:
Will you be attending AAD this year?

Nope.

SternProphet:
F35 will cost less to operate than F16. One of the justifications for F35 is low maintenance costs due to high reliability. A lot of people are operating under delusion and ignorance. To suggest that A vountry like the US will waste money $x00s in developing a costly to operate aircraft when the second main objective of the aircraft is actually low operating costs.

I have freind who is USAF aircraft mechanic and based on experience with other stealth aircraft F35 won't be cheap. You pay for stealth.

The issue with the F35 is that it will be harder to maintain needing more money, manpower and time compared to a upgraded F16 or F15 that can have everything the F35 does minus the stealth. The F35 is not a bad aircraft but it not a be all end all aircraft. You need some thing low cost to do the normal work. And to many countries want the F35 to be there primary fighter and it will only drive costs up

jln115:
as far as I know the hanger can fit 2 lynx or 1 oryx or 1 rooivalk.... Could be wrong though.

Actually scrap the above.....as someone in the navy you would probably know if an oryx can fit in the valours hanger or not.

It can, in theory but it very cramped fit. The Valor only really meant for a single lynx

61mech:
Corvette my a$$
Shame we didn't develop naval Oryxes for them.

Oryxes are naval. The issue is the size vs the size of the valour hanger. Not much space. They can land on the valor though. Only the BK helicopters has not landed on a navy ship and the rooivalk does not have flotation system in case of a ditching.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tyndzq74SsI old vid but still cool

giles14:
guys how possible is it to convert our Vickers n t55 MBT to combat support vehicle(eg russian bmpt). since our BMP 1 are very few in number.

Israel turned the old tanks in to APCs and combat support vehicles including captured T55s


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/IDF_Achzarit

lionel4power:
Concept : Deploying Army MLRS from Navy Ships for Coastal Fire Support Missions

[img]https://defensenigeria.files./2018/04/2018-04-08-00-08-37.png?w=980[/img]


The Nigerian Navy is ranked 4th in Africa by GFP (Global Firepower). It is indisputable that the main criterion for assessing the Navy of any country is in tonnage.

Nevertheless the amount of sea based firepower available to a navy can be an equally important way of assessment when each unit of investment can achieve the greatest possible positive net effect.

Unfortunately while Nigeria has invested over $1 billion in naval acquisitions in the last five years, there is no single vessel in the Nigerian navy equipped with weapons tha can deliver ordnance at ling distances. The decommissioning of NNS Aradu created a capability gap in the Nigerian Navy.

Paradoxically the solution to this problem might lie with the Nigerian army.

The possibility of putting an RM-70 MLRS on warships might not be farfetched. The two major shortcomings of the Nigerian Navy is a lack of precision land attack capability and organic unmanned ISR. Since Nigeria is reluctant to invest in missile launch systems at sea, sea based rocket artillery might not be a bad idea.
Placing RM-70 MLRS on warships will give Nigeria navy the ability to strike deep into enemy littoral territory from standoff distances out at sea, which will also enable a reduction in reliance in air power to deliver over the shore attack.

Two RM-70 on a frigate or coastal craft makes for a potent 120 nm range projectile. Just imagine multiple launchers firing multiple rockets on area or multiple target being from a Nigerian Navy ships !


https://defensenigeria.com/2018/04/07/concept-deploying-army-mlrs-from-navy-ships-for-coastal-fire-suppirt-missioms/
==========================

pragmatic approach to deterring foreign aggression but the writer did not explain to us how he intends to solve the inherent accuracy issues.

firing rockets blindly might saturate or overwhelm the target when in close range but anything longer than 5km the rockets salvo strike cone would increase dramatically.

maybe you meant guided projectiles which is plausible However, Close in weapons systems like the Phalanx mounted on ships negates such concept.

I could be wrong though.
Cc nemesis4u tdayof 61mech frumentius odunayaw patches689 etc

This was done in ww2 and it was not nearly has effect has planed.

Frumentum:
You mean your unit never used them? I know and that's not what I meant. Recces, 32Bat and I think Parabats in the early days used them.

The Recces and Parabats still use them for training together with the East Bloc captured stuff, to burn through the old stocks and to get the troopies proficient in operating without the modern accoutrements.

Speaking of which, where's andrewza to tell us when the Navy subs will be firing their old remaining torpedo stocks?

I don't see us shooting the old stock. Torpedoes are costly and unlike missiles don't have a hard expiration date.

Frumentum:
I cannot ever recall a time when the allocation to the Recces ever decreased!!!
FY2018/19 is a first.

Could be due to the fact they not haveing a selection or training this year. I mean that training cost a lot of money.

Frumentum:
I'm inclined to agree. I asked around and everyone was just as surprised. The Logs guys seem to have gone on a frolic of their own.
The whole point to Projects Vistula and Sepula running concurrently was that the replacements for SAMILs, Casspirs and Mambas would have the same drive-line (engine, gearbox, axles, tyres and suspension). This would ease maintenance and reduce component replacement cost.

POSTSCRIPT: Someone's just suggested they are for testing and evaluation, judging by the prominent Bell branding on the sides.

I don't think they for the SAMIL replacement. They could just be engerinering vehicles that are at ASB Kimberly.

ActivateKruger:
But assaulting flanks or cutting-off heavy armour from being reinforced by medium or light armour would also work with the kat, for that a bigger gun would also help. Doing 4 Rooikats behind enemy lines has its disadvantages, they're big and noisy and would leave too much dust no go unnoticed, you'd honestly scout better with a minibus taxi coz you'll look the part.


As for the Ingwe ATM, let's be honest here, how many missiles do you think could be used in a conventional war? Just 50 of those fired would leave the Army with no money for the rest of the operation, unless your objective is to fire less than 10 and scare the enemy to surrender.

That's a different type of recon. The Kat is rookat by fire. The mini bus style is the more covert style that the scout troops, pathfinder and Recce, s would do.


A platoon is 4 to 5. It does not mean all of them are in a convoy behind each other.

The 76mm gun means more ammo witch is useful behind the lines doing raids and it still packs enough punch to deal with most threats.



Do you expect us to fire 50 ATGMs. If we fighting a full on war our budget would get a boost. The worst case intervention right now is a civil war or some kind of intervention. None of our neighbors have any real armor in numbers. Really only the Angolan army has enough tanks and good enough tanks to warrant 50 ATGMs. They all so a close ally.


If we had to do a intervention like the French did in Mali the 76mm would be more than enough. The lighter ammo means more could be flown to front for example.

Henry240:
If you took photos of the Hornet RDRV, kindly post them.

I have pics of 4 different types.

ActivateKruger:
That's not how they're being used today. It might have been developed for long range recorn but that's not really possible in the 21st century, warfare has changed. A lone Rooikat inside a fully capable enemy would be dead meat and the SANDF generals new that as soon as the Bush War ended. No one bothered with the 105 Rooikat because in the 90s we were certain that we were getting those 100+ MBT with the Arms Deal. The new MBTs never came, then we would have to supplement the Olifants with something and the Kat is the only thing that can fit the 105 turret without falling on weight. Truth be told, it's highly needed so it be used on flanks in a tank vs tank war.

It won't be a lone roikat. It will be at least 5. There mission and role has not changed. The job the 105mm would do in South Africa is done better by the Olyphant and ingwene launchers of the rate and badger.


We not excepting the roikat to attack defended positions alone.

kikuyu1:
No the 105,specifically made for anti armour as seen in the first pic. IIRC,an APS has been developed.

The 105 is not used by sandf. We use the 76 and it is used primarily as a recon vehicle and raider. Not anti Armour.

ActivateKruger:
Our navy guy never posts pics, I'm starting to think he eats calamari and snook fish all day long

I don't want to end up like a certain member here that get in to trouble with the int guys. They mountoir all sites that reference the SANDF. But the pics from armed forces day are fine. Only 10 things I did not get a pic of that I wanted.

Frumentum:
You owe this thread some pics!

I am 570km out from Simon's town. In a bus. I will post pics tommorow

ActivateKruger:
Here's a short military/alien film shot in Johannesburg and Witbank. Forget it says Texas.

There's the Denel Iklwa and RG series vehicles doing an alien chase down. Pretty much dark but it's cool.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjQ2t_yNHQs

Most Oats videos are filmed 100% in South africa. Seeing how it is a south African studio. These videos are basically them showing what they can do.

Not like I expected any thing but a cut. Hopefully the sandf can recover funds through other means.

ViceAdmirlAgain:
Looking forward to the pics of the Recce static display

Took pics of the Wahoo and 4 hornets. I can take pics of there guns but really they have strange list of guns even a ww2 mg34, Lee Enfield to m16.

Still want to get a interior pic of the wahoo but I have only a few minutes free each day and wahoo is all full of kids from school groups.


You want pics of there survival stuff, like a condom filled with water to be a magnifying glass to make fire and all that fun stuff

Sorry no pics from armed forces day yet. I took pics of static display stuff for the most part. If there is any thing some one wants a pic of say now. I will upload them when I get back home. Just wanted to add. The Army engineers assembled there 10 meter Bridge in 11 minutes.

lionel4power:
Correction

till date there haven't been any real confirmation of the M27 replacing the M16 in USMC inventory. the M27 was supposed to replace or complement the M249 light machine gun in suppressive fire role.

http://www.military.com/news/article/corps-to-replace-saw-with-automatic-rifle.html

The M27 is essentially an HK416 with accessories, the M27 is carried by only one member of each infantry fire team: the automatic rifleman.

They want to do it. Though coinciding the cost they might only get certain units to use the M27.

61mech:
Theirs a lot of myths around the M-16 and the Vietnam war. Here's what actually happened.
A pantagon official decided to use leftover propellant for the ammo used when the rifle came into service. Remember, the 5.56 round was just as new as the rifle. This was against the recommendations of the team that developed the M-16. The AR uses a direct gas impingement system. Gas is bled off the barrel and then sent back into the operating system. I've attached a pic of it bellow.
The old propellant burned very dirty and this caused big problems. When they changed the propellant to what the designer spec'd , the problem went away.
The troops weren't issued cleaning kits or trained to properly maintain the rifle either , but the ammo was the real cause of the issues.
The M-4 is actually more mud resistant than the AK. It has a dust cover that stops dirt from getting in to the operating system in the first place were as the AK is a much more open system. Especially with the safety off.
I own 6 AR's and 4 AK variants including a Galil (which I was trained on in the Army). I also shoot AR's in competitions and believe me , a properly maintained AR is just as reliable as a AK.
The lack of killing power of the 5.56 is also a myth. It has more to do with US policy regarding the Hague convention than anything else. The US military can produce a much deadlier round in that caliber, but they constrict themselves to the idiotic Hague treaty. The US is actually not a signatory , but follows the convention voluntarily. Their is much more deadlier ammo available on the civilian market. So much so, that you can actually hunt deer and pigs with it in certain states.

Their is a good Youtube channel called InRangeTV that does dirt and mud testing on various rifles if you are interested in seeing how different rifles cope.

Thanks for the detailed info. I know the Vietnam issue is no long relevant. Every American solder I know only speaks praise about it. Just come short in long range shootings like in mountains.

abiodunalasa:
Sir..

Maybe that friend of yours in the US Armed Forces is saying what he did not know or did not know what he is saying... That's even if that friend is actually a Uniform man.

After Vietnam war, there was lot of complains from veterans and researchers alike about the experience of M16 in the heat of battle.
This led to the decision to create another weapon. Just like M16 was created in 1960 based on the experience and complaints of World war 2 veterans.

So in 1980 M4 was created. And gradually till now M4 is the STANDARD combat rifle of the US forces especially the Marines.

M16 was relegated to Training and Boot camp purposes.

Read this... https://www.at3tactical.com/blogs/news/10951661-m16-vs-m4-vs-ar15-a1-a2-a3-or-a4-understanding-the-different-types-of-ar15-rifles.

Now presently among veterans and Researchers alike... The M4 rifle is responsible for more death than necessary in the Middle east.
Thus, there's a heating debate to either change the rifle completely or modify its Ammo.

Read this... https://www.range365.com/m4-rifle-is-terribly-flawed-weapon.

Have a nice day

The issues with the m16 in Vietnam was due to cheapen manufacturing and training. The m4 is a short barreled m16 it is the. Both are still used along side each other. The American solders I have spoken to don't see issues with the ar15 platform has it is now.

abiodunalasa:
Ok bro.
I know most of you guys on this Military thread have some Ego issue. You hate to be told that you are wrong. Even upon compelling evidence you will still keep arguing.
So if you will excuse me, I am tired of this side talk already. Case close.

As for you Krak... I dont reply people without credibility. Now run along and get some.

So the fact that I point out your mistakes you want to run away?


You presented zero evidence, you present a false fact when you stated the M4 replaced the M16, you then mentioned the whole plan to replace the the current AR15 based rifles. A plan that been on and off for years.


I then pointed out how I know this from talking to people since that's how you get the real info.

abiodunalasa:
That's the spirit bro...

Did you put on American Army Uniform and land boots in their barracks before you get what you just wrote up there ?
No!
You read all online.

So now you see, not until you become Uniform man before you gain Military knowledge about weaponry.

Now run along bro... Read some more and be humble
Good luck.

I did not read any of this online. I have freinds in the US armed forces.

abiodunalasa:
Oh oh
So what are you feeling like right now ?
John Rambo on Nairaland !

How convenient !

You miss understand. Any one would struggle to be accurate at that range.

abiodunalasa:
Americans move from M16 to M4... That decision was informed by books and researches written by Veterans and Civilians alike.
Presently, on the table of American Congress is the debate about whether or not to continue using M4... The argument for and against are all based on books and researches by Veterans and Civilians alike.

And yet here you are sir on Nairaland forming John Rambo

So because you are a Uniform man means you know every goddamn thing about the military ? And "Ununiformed" people's view is a non grata ?
If this is your mentality, dear sir you gonna have a very stagnant military career.

Knowledge is in phases.
No body has a monopoly of knowledge, nor an exclusive right to a given public topic. Period. Full stop.

America has not replaced the M16 with the M4. This alone is a fact that you got wrong. A big fact.

America has through the years tried to replace the M16 and M4 and it was dropped every time.


I suggest you get some knowledge on this fact.

abiodunalasa:
Putting on the uniform does not mean a thing when it comes to knowledge about war fare.

Information is power... Not uniform.

And you don't have the knowledge since you have never been in the uniform. The internet and books leave out a lot of details, lie or simply are outdated.