Budaatum's Posts
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Maynman:I did not post a link to authors of the New Testament, May. We are not talking about who wrote the New Testament, but the language it was written in. As for what is written in the Bible, it is not necessarily so, as would be sung in Porgy and Bess. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kP5O_NUhrK0 |
Maynman:The New Testament is not a continuation! It is rather a dumb down version for the masses of some Greek and Egyptian and elsewhere philosophy of the time. Here's a link to Paul's use of his Greek knowledge. https://biblethingsinbibleways./2013/07/14/paul-and-his-use-of-greek-philosophy/ |
Maynman:I've posted links to many sources in this thread, May. And I never said logos was Paul's statement! In fact, if you asked, I'd say Paul who was active in the writing of Luke and Acts along with many letters that make claims about Jesus, never even met him, and is responsible for the whole idea of Jesus worship, as opposed to understand Jesus teaching, of say, James. "Faith", below, implies mere belief. James is asking you to test them to see if they are true or not.
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Maynman:The writers of the gospel spoke Koine Greek, and that was what the New Testament was written in with lots of Greek philosophy. |
Maynman:john did not write a book in the New Testament! It was put together by many authors over many decades long after Jesus is written to have been dead. |
Maynman:The Hebrew Bible has a lot of godification in it that was not present in Greek philosophy. Kill God, and you might understand what I'm saying. In the link posted, you'd see logos referred to as reason, and not just word, as some claim. You'd also see the origin for the Idea expressed in John's prologue. Once you've read both the connection would be made. |
Maynman:I did not do the relating. John did in his prologue, which he borrowed from Heraclitus who knew neither Yahweh nor Jesus. |
Maynman:Heraclitus wrote extensively about logos. And while it may be common for Nigerian education to start with God and Bible, some of us were fortunate to not have that sort of education. https://www.britannica.com/biography/Heraclitus |
Maynman:Please step out of your Bible. Logos did not start with the Bible, nor did the idea of logos start in Hebrew. The Greeks and Egyptians were logoing long before John stole it for his gospel. |
Maynman:Did you miss KnownUnknown say this was my own interpretation and understanding and meaning, and me agreeing with him? I'm not here to fulfill any thought you may have, May, nor am I claiming any knowledge of a history of Jesus, who as far as I'm concerned may have not even existed. Fact is, Logos predated any story about Jesus, and someone decided to infer in the Gospel of John that the two are the same thing. Now, a reasonable thinking person would know that logos is not a human being nor a God, so the question I ask is why combine the two, and what does the combination mean or imply. Answering such questions would surely stop one bowing to idols called Jesus. Or logos, for that matter. |
Maynman:Logos is not Jew, nor is it Hebrew, and it predated Jesus, whom we read in the Gospel according to John, is Logos, which he literally plagiarised in part from Heraclitus who wrote like 500 years before Jesus. https://mindrenewers.com/2014/12/26/word-made-flesh-the-logos-philosophy-falls-short/ |
sonmvayina:Oh so amazing Egypt where some Almighty God calls his son, Israel/Jacob and some writer years later decided to apply it to an individual called Jesus. Is that not a sufficient allegory directing you to go seek there, Son? |
Maynman:In Buddhism, we call what you are doing, focusing on the horse and not on what it brought in on its back. Let me know when you move past the story that personified the human ability to reason and comprehend. |
sonmvayina:See you accusing me of singling out what you singled out. Did you miss me plural out these others? budaatum:Note the inclusion of non-existant Thoth, please, and Atum. |
Maynman:"Got the story", yes, from ideas that evolved out of Egyptian and Greecian ideology and philosophy. The blind focus on the story and fail to see the philosophy and the ideology. It's why Jesus is their God. |
Maynman:Sorry, I don't speak Hebrew, but I'm sure Google translate would help you. |
Maynman:I learnt about Jesus from Greek and Egyptian philosophy, Mayn, and from Buddhism too. It's not about an individual called Jesus, but about what Jesus represents, which is the ability to use one's own senses instead of merely believing. As I keep repeating, one should not read only one book! |
Maynman:May, we are talking of two different things. You are focused on a person called Jesus, while I am focusing on what a person called Jesus represents. They are not the same thing. Logos has no nationality, and Jesus is a representation for those incapable of using their own minds. |
Maynman:Ancient Bible speak written when eyes were dim and the gods were responsible for all things. Indian your eyes of the gods and you might comprehend. Maynman:Even if he stayed a day, the "calling out of Egypt" would have significance to one like me who, as stated, began with Greek and Egyptian Gods. It should at least make one go find out how gods are made in Egypt, no? They did have long experience of God making after all. Are you aware Moses got his understanding of God from Egypt too? Pity we do not have an older testament out of there, but those who would ask and knock and seek would go looking in Egypt. |
Maynman:No it wasn't, May. But if you wish to believe so I'm not fussed. As mentioned, there is a reason for "out of Egypt I called my son". |
Maynman:You don't understand what I am posting here, May. You are limiting yourself to what is written in only one book, and you think I am limited too. The New Testament clearly states that “Out of Egypt I called my son.” The question to ponder would then be, what exactly is "my son", along with who the "I" doing the calling was, and what exactly Egypt has to do with anything, and is where I'd expect Sonmvayina to come explain what this allegory means. |
Maynman:The idea of Jesus was cobbled together from numerous sources. Happypagan, I think it was, recently posted a list of numerous individuals who were messiahs like Jesus, and rose up on the third day like Jesus, and only those who read one book would claim what you are claiming here. Below is Ptolemy being the saviour long before Christ, as was Alexander before him. Until the day when he openly assumed an independent kingship as Ptolemy I Soter, on November 7, 305 BCE, Ptolemy used only the title satrap of Egypt, but the great hieroglyphic Satrap stela, which he had inscribed in 311 BCE, indicates a degree of self-confidence that transcends his viceregal role. It reads, “I, Ptolemy the satrap, I restore to Horus, the avenger of his father, the lord of Pe, and to Buto, the lady of Pe and Dep, the territory of Patanut, from this day forth for ever, with all its villages, all its towns, all its inhabitants, all its fields.” The inscription emphasizes Ptolemy’s own role in wresting the land from the Persians (though the epithet of Soter, meaning “Saviour,” resulted not from his actions in Egypt but from the gratitude of the people of Rhodes for his having relieved them from a siege in 315 BCE) and links him with Khabbash, who about 338 BCE had laid claim to the kingship during the last Persian occupation.She'd, is another. As for Logos. Aristotle and Heraclitus died long before Christ.
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Maynman:I am not only using the New Testament, or the Old! Those who read only one book will be ignorant and malnourished! |
Maynman:
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KnownUnknown:I do agree, yet you see meaning in my interpretation. No? If I believe the story that suggests I should not eat fruits that nourish one with knowledge, I will be ignorant and a slave to those who do nourish themselves with knowledge. They will be my master and I will labour in their garden for pittance. Not even clothing, the story suggests. You nourish yourself with fruits of knowledge, which is why you are not a believer in what you are told. No?
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Maynman:He is written to have gone to school in Egypt where Aramaic was not the language. |
Maynman:That would be lazy, and the result would be ignorance. The Jesus story is way more than about Jesus just as Things Fall Apart is more than about Okonkwo. |
Maynman:I don't think understanding had got so far as Logos during Christ time. You yourself translated it to mean word, which is very far short of its intended meaning. Perhaps see it more as the other way round, that Logos was interpreted to mean Jesus. It might help you see past the actual person named Jesus. |
KnownUnknown:Unknown! I thought it would be obvious. My bad Everything I write is my own understanding and interpretation, and I am in no way claiming it must mean the same to you as it does to me since you may interpret it differently. And if you study the gospels, you'd see Jesus presenting his own meaning and understanding and interpretation. It's what people do with their own minds instead of just accepting what they are told. |
Maynman:I guess this is where you start doing that thing you do. Not understanding the answer given to your question so you keep repeating it. Sorry, but I am not playing your game this time. |
Maynman:Whether Jesus spoke Greek or not is not the point, May. Fact is Greek philosophy had pervaded Egypt long before Jesus is written to have fled there, and most of what we read today about Jesus has a lot of ancient Egypt and Greek philosophy in it, though dumbed down for the masses who were not expected to understand but merely believe. You'd know this just by reading some Plato. It's why the teachers of his time did not see things the way he is written to have seen things. He did not learn in their schools. |
Maynman:My logos was not refering to a god, but to a human ability to think and reason with the senses. I'll post it again in case you missed it.
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