₦airaland Forum

At that point it occurred to me to ask what this priest looked like. She gave me an exact description of the great Tibetan ECK Master, Rebazar Tarzs!

I suggested that perhaps he was one of the ECK Masters of the Order of Vairagi that I had told her about.

Some weeks went by before we talked again, at which time she said, "Joyce, it's the most amazing thing! I was looking through the ECKANKAR Journal, and there was a picture of the priest. His name is Rebazar Tarzs!"

Cont'd

The next time I talked to Jane, she had been through her first court appearance. She mentioned that she had repeated that phrase, "HU—Mahanta," over and over to herself.

It seemed to keep her mind off the negative situation. I said I was glad to hear that and asked if she could remember any helpful dreams.

"Well, it's funny. I can't seem to remember my dreams, but my friends have gone out of their way to tell me theirs.

And people have been helpful. I especially remember this unusual priest. I first noticed him looking at me in the courtroom. Later, when I went downstairs to fill out some papers, he was there too.

He came over and put his hand on my shoulder and said, 'I know the trouble you are going through. It will turn out for the best.' How would he know that, since I've never seen him before?"

Cont'd

"The ECK Masters are dedicated to helping Souls through this dark night of Soul. They often appear in dreams, so examine your nightly adventures closely.

I am enclosing a copy of the [url]ECKANKAR Journal—be sure to read the article by Sri Harold Klemp in which he recommends softly singing 'HU—Mahanta' for spiritual help."

Cont'd

In our phone conversations (Jane lives in another state), I could hear the exhaustion and discouragement in her voice.

She didn't know if she could get through a court appearance with lawyers hurling accusations at her. "Joyce, even though I'm innocent, I'm afraid I'll break down emotionally, which will make me look guilty."

That conversation prompted me to write her a letter with a message that came from deep within myself. I told her about the dark night of Soul—a time of desolation we experience for our spiritual benefit. I explained that it was often a turning point in our lives.

Cont'd

An Appearance by the
Tibetan ECK Master Rebazar Tarzs
By J. C.

Source: https://eckankar-hu.org/Masters/Rebazar/Story05.html


For nearly two years my sister Jane, who is a psychiatrist, had been going through the experience of being publicly maligned by the press.

Quite by mistake her secretary had incorrectly billed a patient, and one of the large health insurance companies decided to use Jane as a legal test case. They took her to court and let her have it with both barrels.

Her lawyer extracted more and more money from her only to drop the case at the last minute.

Upon investigation Jane found that her case was indeed indefensible and that he had been leading her down the proverbial garden path.

Cont'd.

When I woke up the next morning, the white barrette was really in my hand!

I began thinking about my parents, especially my mother. If she saw me with this barrette she would want to know where it came from.

She wouldn't understand that a man in my dreams gave it to me. Before anyone else awoke, I snuck out of the house. I went out to the backyard, dug a hole, and buried the barrette.

But I only let go of the barrette's physical aspect. The true meaning of the gift never left me.

That gift gave me the understanding of the true reality of our inner and outer lives. It proved that dreams are real.

I'll never forget the wonderful man who taught me in my dreams. At the time, I didn't know his name. Years later when I found the teachings of Eckankar, I discovered he was the ancient Chinese ECK Master, Lai Tsi.

When our eyes met, he nodded at me. Then he was gone.

I didn't think to turn around to my girlfriends and say, "Look at that man over there! He is the man from my dreams!" For some reason it seemed best to keep silent.

That very night he came to me again in my dreams. He said, "Tonight will be the last time I meet with you. I have to leave you now. I have to go away."

I replied, "Oh, but I'm going to miss you! I wish you didn't have to leave."

He said, "I have to do what I have to do, but just so you know that dreams are real, I have a gift for you." He placed a white plastic barrette in my hand and curled my fingers around it. Then he was gone.

Cont'd

A Gift to Remember
A Master from Her Dreams Gives the Gift of
Love
By F. B.

Source: https://eckankar-hu.org/Masters/Lai/Story04.html


When I was nine years old, I began having visits in my dreams from an old Asian man. He had a long white beard and the most beautiful eyes.

They seemed to look right through me. He wore a funny little hat on his head and had a beautiful smile. Every night he would talk to me about life and explain the meaning of different things I wondered about.


One afternoon I went to a movie with my girlfriends. We were standing in line waiting to buy our tickets, laughing and being silly like normal nine-year-old girls.

Suddenly I felt something. I looked past the booth where they sold the tickets. There stood the man who had been in my dreams for almost a year.

Cont'd

triplechoice:
I'm not surprised you failed to understand what I explained about scientifically proven.

I admit as individuals or groups, one can use the methods of science to prove one's claims, but in the main body of the sciences before anything is accepted or tagged as scientifically proven it must pass through certain criteria, if not , nobody takes you serious

Identify this "main body of science" please. Give it a distinct identity if you can.

It is not true that "nobody takes you serious" if any of your work does not pass through the criteria of "main body of science". A dead giveaway on this is your statement on a certain "higher self" and "Soul", at least we have one irrefutable guest to this as your person. You make me laugh all the time, I give you that.

I can imagine the seriousness in opting for the game plan in using this angle of argument that since the Eck Masters have not been scientifically proven, they are false, so you expect every one to fall for this. It is so naive as to draw derision.

Science if anything is 80% theories. This is what drives science literally: unverified OBSERVABLE phenomena!!! Big Bang, Evolution, and so many others!!!

Digest the below and marry it with the above.

The conditions that must be met is to ensure
that the public is not deceived by anyone claiming science . And one of the conditions is that your findings must be published in a peer review journal for other scientist to validate it .

1: In science, it's called a 'Theory' if not yet a 'Law' or Formula. For it to be one, it must pass through a verification process relative to expected outcome that are usually 'Substrate Neutral and according to certain 'Guidelines'. This however changes with the branch of science in question and applications of it.


2: You need to get how the system works--the Peer Review System.

It's basically an assessment of your work to check if it meets certain standard (Relative to the Guide' IN YOUR FIELD. This could be anything like the study of the Paranormality of ECK Masters!!! In other words, the Peers are people who are equally versed in what you do. So you can't take Peers from Microbiology to review Parapsychology!

A field of study is Pneumatology. It is a branch of theology that deals with the study of the 'Holy Spirit'. Left to your "body of science", it's "lie lie lie". I suppose you will send in a letter of reprieve and 'rubbishment' that a certain "body of science" had not yet "scientifically verified" this thing called "Holy Spirit".

3: More to open your consciousness: An intrepid maverick by the name Maxwell Chikumbutso invented a power generator that runs out of 'nothing'. Your "scientifically approved" guys went to check it out here in Africa Zimbabwe, they are Peers.

They did all manner of tests and couldn't identify any point where the 'laws of conservation of energy' held sway. Even for this reason, the guy can't yet secure a patent on this because he has no "Peers". Still, the generator powered cars non-stop, he fitted it into a TV that connects to no grid. The tech is featured in the documentary "Thrive 2" where world-acclaimed physicists where the Peers. I suppose since your "body of scientists" could not make anything of how the tech works, he was deceiving people. .

This still doesn't mean as individuals you cannot publicly or privately prove your claims scientifically if you know how to use the scientific method. But have you done that here? No. You haven't. But just sharing stories.

Lol, "scientific methods" are just yardsticks that some folks agree between themselves. They are not static but dynamic, the yardstick keeps changing to absorb new knowledge because we "we learn everyday".

Science has branches, "scientific methods" that applies in Chemical Engineering does not apply in Sociology or Economics. This is why it beats me to see you running the little antic of introducing the "scientific body" game just so to say Eckankar claims are not verified in one lab likely in the USA

Anyone can form a new religion or come up with anything, and just declare it's sciencei or scientifically proven . How can we be sure? That's the question.

Guess how "scientifically proven" is done in disciplines like psychology and sociology for instance? Same way you have people who experience something like the ECK Masters in Eckankar.

It a no brainer!!! Random sets of people come in and identify these Masters often years before finding out they are real and there are others who continue to work with them DAILY. Not just daily, but PHYSICALLY, often with distinct scents that accompanies the presence of these guys who do some real stuff like giving them stuff in the dream and the wake up to find it with them, or healing them of diseases that awon "scientifically proven" can't heal!!!

Funny man!

People who sell fake medicines or other substandard products usually make the false claim
of having some approval to sell when they don't, or their products is scientifically proven to work in order mislead the public to buy from them

If it works, there goes the 'Scientific Proof', No Peer review needed. If it doesn't, then it is a theory that needs subjecting to methods laid down by the manufacturers on how to use the supposed fake medicine. If it fails, it is fake. Follow the manufacturer's method that led to their claims, if the effects are reproducable, there is your 'science'!

The Igbo traditional healers use steam from some plants to cure Iba. Those are the procedures, use " the steam and cover yourself in it", Iba is gone! USA people don't have that in their "procedures" and no one needs a "body of science" for that.

Honestly you're behaving like someone living far away from civilization, and because of that cannot understand how things work in the real world.

You claim to be good in the sciences, yet don't know the criteria for judging what's scientifically proven and what makes something a part of the sciences. You have a layman understanding of the technical term, scientifically proven.

Lol, refer to the above.

You just cannot claim science without proof. That's the truth. You can only deceive the uneducated or the gullible public that Eckankar is a branch of physics. Not me.

The stories shared in this thread as I have told you earlier is proof. There is no such a thing as randomity in nature as it where. People just can't have inner and outer experiences with distinct and specific set of Non-existent set of people called the ECK Masters as you try hard to make people believe.

Studies have been conducted on the matter of death, it's not under a microscope as you have us reason, they ask people their experiences lol, same thing you try hard to rubbish here. What these people report is what most set of the group report: "Passing under a tunnel of darkness to a light".

Who conducted these researches: "A body of Scientists" lol.

What was the yardstick or 'Guide': The oral reports of people who where once clinically "dead".

What was the outcome? Same "Tunnel... light"

The didn't go through or see the rainboots of Superman, or the Mainland bridge, their reports had a single thread running all of them!!! Science MR!!!


We learn daily!

Is it not the same Eckankar I know that you only joined recently from being exposed to it on Nairaland?

Hahahaha, na you we suppose ask you o, you so many years there yet here you are and someone who joined Eckankar from Nairaland is giving 'disturbing' updates .

Actually, Jesus has a parable on that. It's found in the Book of Matthew 13:1-23.

We learn everyday!

You're the one on a long thing if you think Eckankar is a branch of physics and that scientists are now ',doing a form of soul travel.

Just imagine the crazy talk. You make it seem scientists everywhere have now accepted ' a form of soul travel' as part of what must be done to discover truths.

Lol, it's basic use of English where ones application of Semantics and Pragmatics could have been of help. It means the people who use a form of Soul Travel are 'Scientists', simple!

Meanwhile, till today, scientists are still bringing counter arguments on established scientific facts like on 'photons' for instance. You on the other hand are fixated on some beef. If science have branches, how can someone say all scientists adopt what other scientists adopt? Crazy indeed.

Finally, scientist are just not admitting the scientific methods of enquiry has its limitation. They already know that for long.

There goes several answers to your affront on Eckankar!!! First, science study the body of ECK which forms the physical. In other words, any material thing is a condensate of the ECK at the highest level and the Atom or Matter at the coarse or base level.

Current apparatus with earth scientists are limited to the material atom indeed and people who know what they are doing admit this limit, when would you yours?

Scientists however have made headway in going beyond the atomic level with new machines I hinted on earlier.

If you have not yet grasped the above, invite me to a thread so we can go into the Eckankar-Physics relation. This thread is already over-derailed.

triplechoice:
Not only Paul. Muhammad the founder of Islam was an Eck master.

Sango, Orunmila and others were also Eck masters.

Eckankar really can mess up with people's minds

Yea

triplechoice:
Trying to hide with the above after you were asked to provide proof of the alternate moniker you claimed I have?

SHM




All of these are not relevant. Just provide proofs that the Eck masters are real beings , and also that RUmi, Shamus, Pythagoras were once Eck masters who taught Eckankar. It's as simple as that.

Lol. You don't know anything about my Eckankar past. You're Just speculating to find something to hang on to. I had experiences in Eckankar you can only dream of having. So don't go there. .

Forget about me for now and ask yourself ,why a former RESA, A former president of Eckankar, and other numerous higher initiates above the fifth level have all left Eckankar.

Is it because Eckankar failed them, or they too, according you, were unable to have any experiences of meeting with the Masters?

Instead of proving your claims made on this thread, you choose to attack my personality.


If you want links to websites and Facebook pages of former eckist sharing their experiences about Eckankar, just let me know.

When you visit those pages, you will meet with former eckist who have shared their Eckankar experiences of 'meeting' phantom Eck masters and travelling to illusory Eckankar higher worlds or heavens . You will also get to read why they finally choose to leave after all those wonderful experiences . When you're done, come back here to brag again or talk about my own experiences you know nothing about.

I'm aware Eckankar has barred you from visiting such sites. It's not just barring you alone, they have also threatened you with karma or being cut off from Eckankar and the master. Have no fear . The truth is that, they're afraid you would leave them, hence the threat.

Eckankar need your money to survive.



Changing the goal post again. It started on this thread when I ask how many times you' severally' mentioned Gopal Das.
Now you have shifted to another thread I don't know anything about.


The same thing I was also made to believed in the past untill the deception was exposed.

You just regurgitated one of the false narratives in Eckankar: that those who meet with Eck masters had some connection with them in the past or are sincere seekers of truth.

The irony of it all is that the religion telling you about sincere seekers of truth is actually lying to you.

And which past?

Is it the one with fictional Rebazar Tarz or Gopal Das Paul Twitchell created in the 60s?



Where did I rubbish it? Show me?

I said such experiences are not unusual for soul to have. How is that rubbishing it?

And where is the ignorance I displayed on the subject of imagination'?

Because of your poor understanding of what Eckankar teaches about imagination, you wanted to make me believe that once you imagine anything, then it must already be existing somewhere in the physical plane . if not, you wouldn't have been able to imagine it in the first place.

But when I challenged you, you then shifted to astral plane where you said cartoon characters can exist as if the astral plane and physical plane are the same kind of place.

Is spider Man existing in a material form anywhere in this world that you and I occupy?


FYI, Paul Twitchell copied Eckankar teachings from other spiritual paths where they're correctly taught. I know you're ignorant of this because they always tell you that he came to gather the teachings of Eckankar that were scattered in different spiritual paths and religion in different parts of the world. Lies, lies and lies.

Continue sharing your stories, but Just know they are unverified stories of people , which cannot serve as proof of anything at this time.

Scientists don't prove their theories with personal stories. You said Eckankar is science and I branch of physics. Where's the science? You have not been able to demonstrate or prove it. Just empty talk all the time.

You accept those stories as evidence because you have know way of explaining why people have those experiences .
Also because ,it was put together by Harold from stories sent to him.
Harold is God representative to you and cannot deceive you.

So who am I that you should listen to . Someone just making noises on Nairaland.

Some more grist for your mill: Paul of the bible is an ECK Master today

New Story Loading...

...All he did was stare directly at her without uttering a word. But what he was giving her was the Blessing of the Ancient One. This is the Power of Spirit channelled through the Saint to the lucky Soul.

Physical Appearance of Guardian Saints.

Some have reported having physical encounters with a Guardian Saint who appears physically but posing as either beggar or a casual passerby or wayfarer. In these cases, the person they are visiting do not recognize them. And, of course, they will not come to you and say, "Hi I'm a Guardian Angel, and I've come with a blessing." That would probably freak you out, and you would take off or call the police to have the 'cranky' fellow arrested.

However, if you believe it is an Angel, you would probably be too excited, too emotionally convoluted to be receptive to whatever they have come to give you. Invariably, the best option is what the Saints adopt when making a physical appearance--they disguise.

Unless you have the spiritual stamina to remain detached in the presence."

-The end
Excerpted from 'Soul-fullness' By Tosin James ( (https://a.co/d/d16jDiO)

triplechoice:
I don't have any other active Nairaland moniker apart from triplechoice. You always imagine things and want to believe them without confirmation.

Its not me per se, It walked and quaked like a duck...

And no, you didn't mention the name Gopal Das at first. . In the screenshot you shared below, there's no mention of the name Gopal Das yet, you still want to imagine it's there.

I understand you cannot take it that I met Gopal Das even as a kid and recognized him in an Eckankar publication. I also get the 'inspiring' angle you chose to interprete my dad's meeting with the current Living ECK Master. I know...

I also get how you joined Eckankar to no success, whereby this failure to get such experience was your verification of the falsehood that the 'Paid Actors' vis Harold Klemp, Paul Twitchell, Phil Morimitsu, Hundreds of other writers, Me, My Dad and all the ECKists who study ECK and make it work for themselves in their daily lives from time immemorial to today. I get all this. I suppose you're having a good time in your current path which is all that matters?

The screenshot mentioned an experience with a master "not here in the physical plane...". The statement sounds like someone who knew more than he mentioned. Moreover, the statement which led to all this digging and me revealing more, even that of my dad's, was that i said "you must have read where I wrote elsewhere my experience with Gopal Das". I indeed I have written it elsewhere. a guy here on Nairaland called Temple333 was the person I mentioned this to, asides the different instances I had mentioned this experience.

Accept your lot in good faith and move on. People whom the ECK masters chose to reveal themselves to are merely old friends from past lives, had shared a bond, where students of these guys or are more open to truth or Love basically. Others who met them by intent are sincere in their search for truth about this.

Please let's end this. iI's leading to no where. I already suggested you hold on to your convictions as long as they benefit you.

Everyone believes something. There's nobody without something that they believe in. Even scientists have what they believe too.

I have shared what I believe on this board too.

Now you know? Did you even for one second turn to look at yourself trying to obfuscate and rubbish a Soul Travel experience of someone in one sentence and then bringing in the subject of "Soul" or "The Higher Self" in another? Do you know how much ignorance you further let out around the subject of "imagination"?

[quote

But each time I do so, I always issue a disclaimer that what share doesn't yet find scientific support amongst scientist in the main body of the sciences. With that, I'm always free to share with the public the truth in life I have discovered.

Not every truth in the world is supported or proven in the sciences.

One can use ones knowledge of objective science to validate or explain personal or group truths to the public. But it's deception to then declare next that such truths have become scientifically proven.[/quote]Beat the drum and dance to it as usual. Left to you, science is when one dons a white gown, gloves and kits in place usually under an (organizational or institutional) umbrella inside a lab.

The person who put in time identify 'ugu' leafn for food is a scientist! You naively mistake Organized or Institutional Science for what science actually is. More worrisome for someone who had went to the Eckankar school but whom Eckankar didnt go through them is that you sound like truth only becomes one when some institution or group of people make a formal announcement of "scientifically proven", like we should wait till scientist fully grasp say telepathy before we should use or accept them . Does this not worry you?

Lets put a pin through your balloon sir: Gravity existed right before the scientist who 'discovered' it did . It was not when the 'Scientific Journal' was updated that gravity began. This is your line of reasoning...

Things that are accepted has scientifically proven in the sciences are always published in a peer review journal. That's the only time it's accepted has scientific facts, and not before.

Lol, there you go again

One funny thing is that science and scientist have long moved on, away from publishing textbooks which becomes the source of information for Eckankar beefers. The Journals are now coveted as 'Classified' and you only see the discoveries as consumables. That's all you get.

Eckankar truths are not scientifically proven nor is it a branch of physics as you once declared. It that were true, it would be taught in public schools everywhere .


Nobody likes to be deceived. .

Good morning.

Lol, Scientists now do a form of Soul Travel! The things they see and find in this science is what finds its way in (admittedly some) cartoons, sci-fi, tech, medicine etc without some public *ss journal! This man, where do you stay na, and what have you been doing? .

Eckankar, you didn't follow, Science, you're not taken along.

Scientist now agree that 'Material Science' is limited. They drop the material body to use machines to propel their consciousness using what is referred to as the 'astral' in other climes and interact with Matter, doing science where the scope of the microscope stops . I know all hell of 'na lie' is let loose where you are right now . If you're pointed in a direction, you will say they are "paid actors". Contrarianism spurred by apparent lack of success in Eckankar!

I recall I told you Physics is Eckankar, albeit a rather dumped-down form of Eckankar, you said "na lie"! If you now see the gains of science on the subject of Eckankar, I wonder what you will say. Science and Eckankar meet as Quantum Physics (QP), where QP still is just a nursery stage of the gains made in establishing that the building blocks of Matter is not actually the Atoms and most likely not 'Quarks', but are entirely 'non-local' to our domain.

You are here waiting for someone to publish a journal right? D'banj has the word for what you're in for, and its somehow long

...This is not a collection of jumbled scenes we call dream. It is as real s being awake.

She had been at what looked like a school with many classrooms. She felt at home since I was there too. To her observation, the class members looked younger, fresher, with glowing skin.

This is the nature of the First Heaven. But what struck her the most was a slim, tall grey-haired, and bearded man who looked at her with loving and powerful eyes she had ever seen. "It's like he's divine", Anna gushed.

Saint of the Book of Revelations


She is lucky to have been invited to one of the temples in the heavenly worlds, where the Saint who gave John the Book of Revelation teaches the ways of Spirit to those who open their arms, ready for Holy Embrace. Anna was never the same again.

From her account of what transpired in this vivid journey into the heavenly world, no word was ever spoken between her and the Saint.

Con'td.

Anna's Heavenly Encounter
Excerpted from 'Soul-fullness' by Tosin King James (https://a.co/d/d16jDiO)

"Anna was born a Catholic and a devoted one she grew up to be. She knew of Saints and Guardian Angels, but she had never met any. A thing of faith and belief it was for her.

We used to talk about divine helpers. They are God's people, not limited by faith or philosophy, but once you open your heart to God, to love, they will come to you.

"More real than a Dream"

One morning, Anna called to say she had a remarkable dream "looked more real than a dream". This is a conscious journey to the Heavens while asleep.

Cont'd.

Tomorrow, we look at the experience of others with these Masters of the Divine current how they have fun doing the things they love to do.

See you then.

She has capacity to become the first female governor perhaps

Now some twenty years later, when Kay Lee related her story to the group after the ECK introductory talk, she got a nudge to check the date of the first printing of The Tiger's Fang. It was 1967. That was a full four years after the experience with the blond stranger.

Again came the wonderful feeling of God's love for her.

Excerpted from
'Those Wonderful ECK Masters'
Harold Klemp

She enjoyed a clear field of vision right to the door of the classroom and was certain no one had left the room. The bell rang then, marking the end of class. Though she watched everyone file from the room, the youth with the golden hair was nowhere to be seen.

Puzzled, Kay lee hurried to her next class. Yet the name of that book, The Tiger's Fang, remained strongly in her mind. She later learned that the book, written by Paul Twitchel, is an account of his journey into the highest heavens of God. And it was this book that eventually brought her the teachings of ECK.

Years later, as an ECKist, she finally recognize the mystery man from the classroom as the ECK Master Gopal Das.

But there was more to come.


Con'td.

Unaccountably, there came a wonderful feeling of God's love for her. Kay Lee felt an instant liking for the young man who'd spoken, and his strong, yet gentle face.

His shoulder-length flaxen hair was light and shining. She didn't remember ever seeing him in class before. Strangely, no one else showed interest in him or his statement.

The instructor, however, shot Kay Lee a disapproving glance for her obvious lack of attention. So she feigned interest in the lecture for a moment before looking back to where the young man had been. But he was gone!


Cont'd.

Mystery Messenger

"The ECK Masters may at times blend events on the Time Track for the benefit of an individual....

Kay Lee told her story:

Way back when she was in high school, she heard mention of Paul Twitchell's book The Tiger's Fang. She'd been sitting in the back of the room during a literature class on Dante's The Divine Comedy. .

The discussion was on the first part which tells of his journey through the regions of hell. Kay Lee was thinking , who would want to go through the lowers worlds? If I were to make such a journey, I'd rather travel in the higher planes..

At that moment, a voice spoke from accross the room. "There is a book about the higher worlds" it said. "its called The Tiger's Fang".

Con'td.

"Eck Masters have quietly existed in society as agriculturists, astronomers, jewellers, painters, business people and even sheepherders. They keep often adopt low-key profiles. In communities where they live, rub shoulders with ordinary people as well as leaders of society whose spiritual needs they attend to.

It all depends on the mission of the ECK Master."

-Those Wonderful Eck Masters
Harold Klemp

So we will be continuing with this thread letting everyone know they are never alone. More stories coming soon

yo, you can login triplechoice now.

triplechoice:
It's enough.
I won't reply again, unless it's necessary for me to do so.

Thank you.

I would have been tired, but I'm more of bored than tired...

triplechoice:
So, why do you now expect me to believe completely your claim that your father met Harold in a dream , and has a perfect drawing of him.
If there were such drawing, by now ,it would be news in Eckankar because you would have snapped it, at least with your phone camera, and posted it, either here or sent to Eckankar headquarters in America. You just added salt and pepper to your father's experience to make it palatable. A lot of eckist do that all the time when they share their encounters of meeting with the so called Eck masters. I know that very well from my time there.

This really isn't an effort to convince a triplechoice is it? How would you have know if this hasn't been done?

So now it indeed sounded convincing finally right and it's "salt and pepper"?

I repeat, the man drew Harold, kept that in his diary. I repeat again, he and Harold may most probably never ever meet physically.

I also repeat, the man will never ever join Eckankar in this life time. He does his thing .

"Harold does not exist", "my old man's meeting with Harold was likely inspired by very imaginative mind of a youth". I give you all of this for free. You are very very right, the Eck masters are figments of imaginations and you understand what imaginations really are.

triplechoice:
You lie. You never severally mentioned you met with Gopal Das on this thread At first you only claimed you saw an Eck master in a dream . It was only recently, after much back and forth, you revealed the identity of the person as Gopal Das. The thread as not gone far. Anyone following can go through our conversation to confirm for themselves. It's clear you have been lying to me to prove your points.

I don't know...I can only be sorry for having an experience with Gopal Das way before I knew how to read and write.

This is the beauty of personal experience: NO ONE can take away your experience!

I wish someone without 'vested interest ' would understand that the attached image is of someone speaking of someone they know and recognize their name even if they didn't mention it.

Besides, I did told you "I mentioned his name earlier". This would be about the third time I was mentioning their name and the experience here on Nairaland.

Not to impose Gopal Das and the "phantoms" as you call them directly here or via your alternate Moniker I always ignore, keep your convictions while I keep my experience.

Can we agree on this?

triplechoice:
You keep changing what you said before. First you never met or know the person, later it became Gopal Das, and now, it's an American.Was Gopal Das an American?
You're not humble when you refer to yourself as humble. That's pretended humility.



You misinterpreted my words as usual, not the first time.
I only said cartoon characters appearing in dreams doesn't mean they become real in the waking state. Read it again .
Cartoon characters are real? Really?
You want to blur the lines between fiction and non fiction to create confusion in people's minds so they accept without thinking anything you say is real to be real?
You need to try something else. That won't work with me.
Getting ideas from dreams doesn't mean Harry Potter is real and existing in a physical location we can meet with him.




I'm doing very well? Almighty Eck master chieveboy who knows it all. Thank you.

It's not only real people we meet in dreams. We also meet cartoon characters or anything not real.Don't forget that too.


I never said every dream is real. Show me where I said so?
And I also never said dreams with Eck masters are the exception. I said they're the same kind of dreams but different content. You continue to miscontrue my words and this the reason it's better this conversation ends. It's either you're doing this deliberately or find it difficult to understand me. I suspect the former as it's becoming too much.





Here you go again.

Go back to read what I wrote again. I said one can see anything, real and not real, in their dreams and get to experience it later. I never said it's only true if Eck masters are not involved. Show me where I said so?


Also, remember I said in a dream, a statue or an image in a picture can come alive and start talking to us. People can also see parts of a movie they have never seen before and later get to see the full movie later in their waking state.





I never talk of any dream world. I only said when we sleep whatever our unconscious perceives during that period is relayed to the brain for storage. Dreams scenery and imageries are created from the impressions we receive during this time.

Yes, in the context of a dream certain things becomes real to us, but when we wake up and realise we were dreaming, we no longer regard them as real. Cartoons characters can become real in dreams, but not real in the waking state because they don't exist in a material form we can physically meet with. Have you ever met with a real spider man who flies and rescues people in times of emergency? No, you haven't,


Where is the location of the dream world?
The Eck masters like cartoon characters are products of imagination. They don't yet exist materially. At best they only exist as phantom beings which some people can see.

You should also realise that every cartoon character is not from dreams. People sometimes create then using their imagination in full waking consciousness.





You're vague here.

'people with a beef with Eckankar do not think or proven that Eck masters have existed since before time existed? What are trying to say here?

I believe you omitted something which has made what you wrote difficult to understand.






How can she be fake.
You met with a physical person you later married You see them everyday after that time. Except in movies or magazines, you don't get to meet cartoon characters you saw in a dream just like you do with wife. You deliberately removed carton characters in this instance to confuse me.

Just look at what you're trying to do here.

The physical realm where people meet their wives and your astral realm where people meet your Gopal Das are not the same kind of place.
The comparison is inappropriate. Try another.


You're a strange fella. Your father met with Harold in a dream and till today he doesn't know if Harold is real?

What is stopping you as an eckist from telling him who Harold is?
You want me to do that on your behalf?

You can see that the story about your father meeting with Harold doesn't make sense.

Maybe he told you a white man appeared to him a dream and you just concluded it was Harold. You know the truth but just want to imagine it's Harold.
If the story is true, your father doesn't need to meet with Harold physically. He can in the future, if that has not happened already, see his photograph hanging somewhere, and then remembers it is the person he saw in a dream. Or may not even recognize he is the same person.


I'm afraid your story is not adding up. You earlier said your father doesn't know the identity of person he met in a dream.
Now, he dreamt Harold is the living Eck master.

As for meeting with Harold physically,it doesn't need to happen because he dreamt about him.

Football fans sometimes dream of their favourite player scoring a spectacular goal, and don't need to be present physically in a stadium for the dream event to happen or see it. They may not watch the live match when it happens, but watch a replay or even see the picture of the player scoring the goal just like in their dream.



If your dad already know about Harold as the Mahanta in a dream, why do you want us to believe he has still not heard of Eckankar all his life?

And you're an eckist. So your father doesn't know about the religion his son is part of?


Neophyte is a word used in some spiritual circles to describe those considered ignorant or just starting. But this description is misleading. What people say, do and can be aware of is what actually reveals their state of consciousness and not because they're not members of Eckankar

There are some children operating from a higher level of awareness, and this is seen from the things they do and say which their peers are incapable of.

The word Neophyte is for power and control within certain groups.No true master would refer to anyone as Neophyte. They know better.

I never said my friend's wife is big spiritually whatever you mean my that.

You're speaking from the position of power.


Talk is cheap. You have proven to be a believer and nothing else. I asked for proof, but you have been sharing stories which you have been made to believe are true. Morever, you haven't provided any outside sources to confirm if Shamus and Rumi had anything to do with Eckankar in the past, yet you say you don't believe.


She never claimed to be 'grand' or boasted she has any special powers. She only reported what she experienced while there.
Morever it was her husband who took her there for the first time. She never went there on her own. So keep your talk of 'misled' to yourself. This comment of yours, as once more confirmed you're not taking your time to read me. Her husband was the exist that took her there.


Not only Eck masters, anything else including the thoughtforms people carry about.

The stories you said I avoided are unverified, except by your master whom you respect, and that I know is the reason you don't question anything.

I never said they generated the masters for her to see. What's wrong with you!
I said eckist believe the masters are always present especially when the hu is sung. And that's not a lie.

I said she pick on the thoughtforms in that environment. Nothing was
was deliberately directed at her.


What do you know about this person to know she has not seen or experienced Jesus or the holy spirit?

I never categorically stated she's pyschic. I only said instead of your calling her a Neophyte, it's better to refer to her has pyschic since she's sentitive enough to perceive those kind of things. It was my own suggested description of her, but you're now running away with that.
SMH
I ask again, what do you know about the person you have never met before.

This your psychological gimmick won't work.You want me to to call her about something that happened more that 15years ago. What for?

Her husband who was an eckist then ,at the moment doesn't want to ever hear of Eckankar again. And you want me to call her?

Besides she's not the only person I know that has shared that kind of experience. Some were even eckist, but they have left the path after knowing the truth about such experiences.




What beef?

You're pathetically now sounding like Christians who often like to accuse non believers of hating God. Lol

My friend your guilt tripping is dead on arrival.
Zadok the Eck master in the time of Jesus who also taught him? Another Eckankar fictional tale. Lol

What secular sources confirms that there was an Eck master called zadok who taught Jesus?
Later ,you will boast you confirm things for yourself and don't believe like others.



If only you knew the person you discussing with right now, you would not say the above.

I know Eckankar is not like the normal everyday rellgion, but that doesn't make it objective science.
I knew of Eckankar when there was nothing like Eck worship service. So what are you talking about. You don't know me at all.
You failed woefully. I only pity you here. Pythagoras was never an Eck master. Eckankar only made you believe that. It's the same elsewhere. Amorc, also tell their members that Pythagoras and others were once Rosicrucians in the past.


The above is meaningless. I can choose to parody it for you to see how.

' Yamayama' means the light and sound of God or whatever name you feel is right for it'

First of all, prove that what you're talking about exist or is real before trying to describe it.

And what are the 'basic facts' in Eckankar you think I don't know
Registered as pseudoscience, you mean?


You are on a vahana,lol, connecting Buddhism , Christianity and others with Eckankar.



Na wah. Physics is now a branch of Eckankar.


Normal talk one regularly hears from eckist. Nobody hates Eckankar. Just tell people the whole truth, and let people decide whether to join or not. Eckankar is not a perfect religion. It also contains lies and deception like every other path or religion out there






FYI, I don't subscribe to holy ghost fire .

And now, afraid you're no longer coherent.

It's my description of her. There may be other explanations. But you haven't come up with anything reasonable.


You're pathetic and an embarrassment to other eckist I know. Where did I say the eckist conspire to beam off images so she could see them?

Just look at you. SMH.

Pyschic in the context I used it, mean being sensitive enough in that instance to perceive what was happening unconsciously. I never said she posses pyschic powers. The real meaning of a word is determined by the context which it is used.

The funny thing about all this back and forth is this:

1: Indeed mentioned severally even to you that I met Gopal Das. You rubbished that.

2: I told you my dad met Harold, as an artist, he drew perfectly Harold Klemp. He didn't say "I saw a white man" as you villainously presented it, he drew the man lol. Still You will not have anything 'good' scribed to this experience.

Note again my old man will never meet or become an Eckist. Why urging me to go tell him of Eckankar na? So your theory will become fact by fire by force? . Eckankar evangelises not.

3: You keep hammering on Secular sources, perhaps you can tune into CNN's BBC evening program lol. Why:

I mean it's basic! Where else to study or get information about say Zoroastrianism if not in circles of interest on that particular subject?

Let's take the Man Peter of the Bible. Do you know where he was born? How old he was? Now, that we do not have sufficient information on Peter, do we now begin to declare that Peter was lie?

I posted recently the village where Rebazar grew. It's is a an existing geographical location still existent. I will take you serious as not just a tantrum thrower if you could take a trip. You're the one with a problem after all.

4: The stories Harold shares are experiences of everyday people sent him. I am not sure how he "manufactures" all of that.

Take mine for example. If you had read that or that of my father's (assuming he joins Eckankar), we will still have same result. Is it not you again? I am sure you can't wait for me to go 'convert' my father to Eckankar just so your contrivances will come to pass

5: Lol, you didn't say "they generated the thought forms" but you said "she picked up the thought forms". Lol. There is a subject known as 'Semantics' and 'Pragmatics'. Buhari was the one who generated the thoughts I guess.

6: You know Eckankar for long, that you didn't know that Horses, Cartoons and cartoonish characters and ANY of your wildest imaginations exists as REAL characters in especially the astral speaks volumes of that your "knowledge".

You were even like "you don't know am" with due respect, I understand who you are to a fault as far as your romance with Eckankar is concerned!

I was surprised you didn't know that no one can imagine anything outside existence or creation and that imagination isn't really "imagination".

You presented imagination as if it was the "imagination" of the mainstream. From there, I knew you merely window-shopped Eckankar with nothing much made of the spiritual stuff.

People like that often leave disappointed, and I am sorry.

Who is Rebazar Tarz ?

"Rebazar is a Tibetan who was head of the ECK community many years ago. Tibet was then the spiritual mecca, and the ECK teachings passed by word of mouth, from teacher to pupil....

...Rebazar Tarzs was born in 1461. His childhood home was Sarana, a mountain village in northern Tibet. His physical trips where limited. Yet there were followers of ECK all around the world, as there are today. These celas (spiritual followers) had a strong connection with the ECK teachings by way of the Inner Master because Rebazar Tarzs came to them in the Soul body...

But the travels of Rebazar ranged still wider. He also taught the age-old gospel of ECK to followers in Central America, South America, Australia, China and what today is Russia. And he met ECKists throughout Europe and Africa.

He could accomplish all this because the Mahanta, the Living ECK Master, like all ECK Masters, knows the ins and outs of Soul Travel. Its one of his special talents."

Excerpted from 'Those Wonderful ECK Masters' by Harold Klemp

This man was mistaken for the REC and beaten because they look alike.

The actual REC had earlier declared Binani winner without any result sheets and with collation still ongoing.

INEC had since declared the REC's declaration null and void.

Binani had earlier been seen on NTA and other media giving an "Acceptance speech" meanwhile.

triplechoice:
You can counter what I have explained without all these unnecessary emotional reaction.



What length will I go to? You're imagining things and want to project it ion me.

I haven't downplayed anything. I only said it the way it's. The difference between your dream and those of others is the content. If precognitive dreams only involved Eck masters, then we can begin to really look at it as something special

But they don't.So how is that downplaying anything.

The stories you have shared so far only contains single individuals, either in public or private claiming to have met with the Eck masters. The encounter that happened in public appear ivery doubtful .

How is it possible for only one person amomgs a crowd of people to sight a strange being without anyone else taking notice?

I noticed you modified your reply.

Please provide secular sources for what you're explaining concerning Shamus so one can corraborate them as true. I don't need history according to Eckankar alone.

This is the era of the internet. A little Google search will expose you to how Paul associated past historical figures with the religion he founded in the 60s and how he also invented the others Eck masters like Rebazar Tarz and the others.
This is the main thing if you want the know the truth. What beef? You're the one already beefing me through some of your comments.

I have said enough.

I am responding only because you said I had a beef with you. I mentioned you have a beef with Eckankar owing to a glaring fact!

I on the other hand am a distinct entity and personality, Eckankar is more or less an ideology. I do not see how I will pick a beef with someone who for instance says the third law of motion is fake because of his own perceptions and convictions.

I would simply try to point you to facts. Beef to what end really?

Eck masters have been verified severally by non Eckists and people who will never hear of "Eckankar" in this lifetime.

I respond so that falsehood and especially prejudice will not be presented baselessly as fact. Baseless in the sense that of all glaring evidences from people with personal experience with them especially mine and your friend's wife, you will at all cost rubbish and push your contrived contrarian views to manipulate any objectivity around that subject.

Isn't this a form of desperation?