₦airaland Forum

FreeIgboho:
God can do anything he wishes to do. You're trying to understand him from human perspective

How do you know this when you say we can have no foggy idea of the nature of God.
What if God does not do anything at all?

I can equally tell you that you are only creating your own human ideas.

FreeIgboho:
READ what I wrote! Do you read at all? READ!!!
Who prophesied Olumba for hundreds of years as God comming, which worldwide has worshipped him for 2000 years??

See above. Who made you the creator of a list of God's attributes when you say no one can know God?
I can create my own list you know?

FreeIgboho:
Who else has been prophesied as God comming hundreds of years before he came, when he came said he was God, and has been worshipped as God for over 2000 years!
No one even comes close

First and foremost what gives you the right to create a special list of things that apply to God, when you say God is unknowable?
There you go. See the contradiction?

So I have no reason to respect your list.
Many things there are just meaningless. Such as saying that he claimed to be God. Many have claimed that. Such as saying his words are alive today. What is the Quoran? Such as saying that he was prophesied - most religions claim the same of their founders. Such as saying a Dove came over his head. Thousands if not millions of similar stories exist about religious figures. Such as saying he was resurrected. Not a shred of proof of that. If we are to take what is written in the Bible as proof of something like that, be ready to take all the fantastic events recorded in other books as well.

Ensure you attend to this post, especially the red.

FreeIgboho:
I don't know what you're talking about. Please read the above carefully then come and repeat what u said clearer

Take it one at a time. If God can work through his creation, why cant he be working through an ant right now?

As to fundamental nature of man, we said that man is not the creator of all.
And indeed he is not.

You simply are trying hard to say that one specific Jewish man is the creator of all simply because you have been indoctrinated.
Same claim is made by Olumba Olumba Obu right here in Nigeria.
Same claim is made by Abd Ru Shin, the writer of the Grail Message.
And countless others.

FreeIgboho:
This is a blatant lie. Only Jesus has all this happened with and if it happens with any other person I'll also believe the person is God the second Son or such

I cant teach you history. Or theology. All these have been said of many people.
And I repeat, how do you know anyone ressurected?

FreeIgboho:
I guess you didn't read the first part of the original post. Here it is. Read it and say if you still think any other person in human history has been like Jesus.


Reasons why Jesus is DEFINITELY God the Son of God:

1) Thousands of years before he was born prophets prophesied that God was coming to visit us. Old Testament (OT) is full of references to his coming.
No other person in the history of mankind has this happened with.

2) Before he came a mighty prophet was sent to prepare his way. John the Baptist (JohnTB) said that was all he came to do. And that he (a mighty prophet) was not fit to untie Jesus' shoe.

3) At his baptism a dove descended on him and a voice from heaven (identified as God the Father), proclaimed, "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased," (Matthew 3:17)

4) When he finally came, he himself said he was the long-awaited God and did things God would do - he was after people's souls not money, he forgave sins, accepted worship, raised people from dead, and said he himself was the truth, the life, and the righteousness, and no one came to his Father except through him.

5) He said you'd know he's truly God the Son because his words would never pass away

6) He said he'd raise himself from the dead, and did just that and in such a way that the wrappings used to wrap the body were NOT disturbed

7) Thousands of years after his death he's being worshipped as God and his words have never passed away - exactly as he said!

8} He is worshipped interchangeably with the Father. No other person has been so worshipped
in human history.

9) The Father has been pleased with his worshippers and showered them with blessings. They also worship and call on the Father constantly and he accepts their prayers.

10) He is alive and active in people's lives TODAY!
----------------

All of these are claims also made by and about many other figures.
PS: You have no proof of any ressurection.

FreeIgboho:
And the creator of the universe doesn’t have the power to do all things or have a part of himself do all those things. Wehdone

OK, so why dont you also call an ant God?
Remember that you are not attributing GODNESS to all creatures. You are attributing it to ONE specific man.
Basically because someone told you so.

Understand that we are discussing the fundamental nature of man, and saying he is the creator.
You will thus be saying that fundamentally, each man, each creature is GOD.

Thats not a Christian idea.

FreeIgboho:
Yet you believe God is in each one of us and everywhere AND at same time localized only in heaven! And you believe God can listen to a billion prayers at once. Yet you can't believe that God has the power to temporarily reduce or drop his Godness and that he can have manifestation or offshoot of himself visit earth!

Maybe you should revisit this below from the front page of the thread:

Before you dispute any of these remember:

1) You don't have the foggiest idea what God is like, nor can you imagine what he is like.

2) You don't have the foggiest idea what God's attributes are. So forget all the attributes you have in your head - they were assigned by man. You simply don't have the foggiest idea what God's attributes are or are not. So forget all attributes you assign to God!

3) If God is explained to you as straight forward and quite uncomplicated, you can be sure they are giving u man's version of God, NOT God as he is.

4) God exists in a dimension you can neither visualize, explain, nor comprehend.

5) So how do you know God? The ONLY way is the way it happened with Jesus. ANYONE that all those things happened with is God the Son of God. You can't know him any other way. You can't know him by logic, reasoning, or attributes. THAT IS THE ONLY WAY!!

The red and the blue are contradictory.
If we cant ever have the foggiest idea of what GOD is, how can you then know that it can be known through Jesus.
What is the evidence that GOD in fact did so?

As for the green, the total cannot be encapsulated in a minuscule infinitesimal part. Also what does it even mean? How can you say you have no idea what GOD is, and then claim that the source of existence can reduce or drop itself? That means you know its nature already. The idea is also absurd. The ocean cannot empty into a teacup.

Aside frm this, anyone can claim so, as many have. I am sure you know Jesus is not the only one who that has been attributed to.

In general, many question remain. Why cant I say i am the one God temporarily dropped his divinity to reside in? Any one can claim so. Its nothing beyond a fantasy very common in the world.

As for your first line I never claimed I believed any of that.
I have only been using the presumptions of Christians to combat their logic. I dont know that there is any place called heaven.

Face it - God, if IT exists, is completely unknowable.

Gabrielshow24:
Was Jesus not "completely like a man" in every way? 😂 Shey Jesus no be "full man" before🤣?

Guy, go and sit down. You're still proving the point why Jesus is fully man and fully God! 😂—If you can't see it then I can't help you 😂.

Men are not the creators of the universe, men are not eternal, men are not self existent.
Worst of all, men are not born by Holy Spirit knacking.
Neither is it like them to be any such thing.
Good night.

This Trinity indoctrination is a serious problem.

For two millenia, supposedly educated people twisting themselves in knots to say why "full man" is the creator and "full God" is the created!
Explaining why it is human to be the creator of the universe!
And why it is divine to also be a created being!

And why it is human to be perfect and eternal and self existent!
And why it is divine at the same time to be imperfect, and contingent!

Just because someone told them God knocked up a girl in Judea!

Gabrielshow24:
And that's how you have proved that Jesus is fully man and God!😂

Hybrid😂...Wonders shall never end🤦🏾‍♂️!

You are the one who used the word hybrid.
You then described it as Christ's hypostasis with God.

Which normal man is either?

When we say "full man" we mean completely like a man in every way. So stop being pedantic by running to whether he slept or ate. Serious issues are -

Can a normal man be the creator of the universe?

Normal men are eternal in the past?

Normal men are uncreated?

Normal men are self existent?

Abeg. GO and sit down.

Gabrielshow24:
I must have missed the memo on your definition of hybrid. Wonderful stuff😂. What then shall we say of Jesus that exhibited the full extent of human attribute and the full extent of the divine🤦🏾‍♂️.

In the logic of Deepsight, Hybrid—The first of his kind 😂. Such adult toys indeed👀.

Once again. Bye! We will resolve our differences some other day.

For the sake of the reader, Christianity posits an hypostatic union not a mixture as our Good friend here demands.

In the context of "fully God", this bears essence to his divine nature and the "fully man" bears essence to his earthly dispositions. He ate, he drank, he slept and possibly went to rest rooms👀, although some contend this".

Jesus encapsulates both under one being not as a mixture nor hybrid😂!

Do normal men have a hypostatic union?

IS it in the nature of man to have a hypostasis like that?

Can a normal man be the creator of the universe?

Normal men are eternal in the past?

Normal men are uncreated?

Normal men are self existent?

Abeg. GO and sit down.

Gabrielshow24:
In conclusion, Jesus is an hybrid😂! Wisdom of Deepsight.

We won't agree and I won't waste my time again! Every attribute of both divine and nature was fulfilled by Jesus. He was fully man and God!

Bye!

Full men are not hybrids of God and Man.

I am sure you have learnt not to play with toys for adults.

Gabrielshow24:
Thanks for the offer but I will pass. I have already made my point likewise the bible has provided answers to this. "HE took on flesh" 🤤

Hhahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Fear!

You know the truth! You have already seen ahead! Impossible questions to answer!

The so called taking of flesh cannot answer anything. It would not cease to make him THE CREATOR, eternal, self existent, perfect, incorruptible, and born by the Holy Ghost - none of which NO MAN can ever be.

For the record (not for you, for future readers), man cannot be -

Both eternal and not eternal.

Both created and uncreated.

Both self existent and not self existent.

Both perfect and imperfect.

Both corrupt and incorrupt.

Both capable of sin and incapable of sin.

And both natural born and born by the Holy Spirit.

You know these are inescapable contradictions and thus Jesus can never be full man and fully God.

OFF with you now!

Next time dont prance around with what you dont know.

Gabrielshow24:
I didn't concede in freewill. I exemplified my reconciliation of both systems. Whether you intrepreted it as a concession, is your own problem!

Now, nice points but I suppose that Komodo dragon that give birth that way are likewise God. Since they too can be born through immaculate conception. Let me also add a few above your head for you.

Man can use the restroom, man can sleep etc.
Jesus did all this! He was asleep when the ship wanted to capsize🤔.

Like I have said before, infinity contains all finite sets. God, Jesus, having infinity means he can limit himself based on his will. He slept, he ate, he drank etc he was perfect, he did not sin, he was not corruptible, he died! —Physically for the purpose of salvation!

I suppose based on your logic, he is not fully man and he is not fully God. Perhaps an hybrid😂!

If you like get into theoretical knowledge of infinity, you will meet me there. Like I said earlier, I majored in the STEM field! Even the fact I use "set" consistently should have hinted that I have solid background knowledge on STEM concepts!

You know what, lets take it one by one and be brief so we can see how far you run.

1. Is it the full nature of natural man to be the creator of all that exist.

That is, can any man, who is a "full man" be the creator? Be brief because I want you to answer all. One liners are best. I will not argue, we will leave the answers there for posterity. Go on.

VinnyBaba:
In my Delta State where Obi won, is it Igbos that made him win?

Abuja nko? Plateau nko?

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Gabrielshow24:
🤦🏾‍♂️My God, how is wisdom so hard to find? I argue for the coexistence of free will and pre-determined systems.

In the set of universality of choices both are within this! In the set of shapes, both circles and squares are within this! How is this hard for someone to understand?

In the set of infinity both (infinity👀 and finity exist with it). Talk about someone not using logic! 😂

That's why Jesus can be God and fully man. Man is a finite "representation of the divine" and God's fullness is infinite. Hence if Jesus willed he would exhibit finite concepts and if he wanted infinite concepts. When he wanted to ascend to heaven, he subverted Gravity the same with Death!

God have mercy! 😂

Forget freewill, that ship has sailed. You conceded. Also leave infinity because we will enter theoretical mathematics and that I certainly will not do with your limitations. I gave you several pointers as to why God cannot be fully man. You ran away. Here again. -

Man can sin, God cannot.

Man cannot raise himself from the dead, God cannot even die.

Man is imperfect, God is perfect.

Man is corruptible, God is not.

I can go on and on.

To claim that anyone is fully man, he must have all the frailties, weaknesses and limitations of man. Which man knows that when he dies he will rise in three days? Which man says before Abraham was I AM? Which man does a transfiguration? Which man says he sat by the right hand of the Father? Which man was born by a virgin? This last one in fact ends the discussion because if anyone's mother was impregnated by the Holy Spirit, that is simply not a man at all.

You didnt touch these. No creature which is "fully man" can have these qualities.

However let me add a few far above your head.

Man is not eternal in the past. But God is.

Man is not self-existent. But God is.

Man is created. God is not created.

For these reasons no entity you say is completely God can ever be completely man.

It is impossible.

Kukutente23:
Obi will be the most foolish politician ever in Nigeria if he joins PDP
As in PDP of Wike and Damagum?
I've said it. The only viable way forward for him is the coalition
Any other thing is setting himself up for embarrassment
Don't be surprised they if he makes the mistake of joining PDP, they'll make sure he loses the party ticket to Makinde. Which leg will he now use to waka after losing primaries?

If he is not careful, he will have no platform at the end of the day.

Gabrielshow24:
Talk is cheap brother. If you want to do so well, prove to us that all what you wrote up there isn't yours!👀

You can't argue against the existence of something when its effects slaps you in the face! Once more there is a coexistence between both and nothing you say can change this!

I have nothing to prove. I am 16 years on this board, you can find out yourself past discussions.
With what you have shown, it wouldn't be worth my while.

A person has to grasp basic logic for a discussion to be useful.

You argue that square circles exist, that a man existed who was fully man and fully God you will probably also say that 2 plus 1 is one.
If you want to face something, face the red in this post.

Kalulu44:
Well said jare

Another person has suggested that the invisibility extends to passing through doors and walls and all sorts of extraordinary powers. It makes sense because invisible tends to be intangible in an immaterial sense.

So theoretically you are not dealing with matter and can even teleport.

Can you just imagine if you even shout on anyone in front of you? Yaba Left straight.

Adewale1603:
the guy doesn't know what he's saying. And if you've worked in bank before, there's way bank used to bundle strap their cash, you will just pack it inside a small bagco bag and japa. The bag would still be invisible once you are carrying it in your hands. So nobody will even see any floating cash around

Abeg lets even say the money is visible. Who wan near money wey dey float for air?
Someone even said one slap from you will chase him away - and he will probably run mad.

Gabrielshow24:
It emphasizes divine configuration—I like to see it this way—of circumstances. Nothing more, nothing less.

In the same way, the star that led the three wise men was configured to glow at that said moment! If your entire refuttal is based on this then 😂😂😂my friend, you have to do better!

I didnt even start. I wrote little or nothing. I dont need to since you have ceded.
Freewill is a matter that can take zillions of academic papers.

But i will not waste energy when you are clearly not up to it, capacity-wise/ no offense.
The admissions are enough.

Kalulu44:
Which one is vaults, keys combination and biometric kinikan kinikan. Being invisible means you can enter anywhere. And who in his right senses will want to go and stop a cash floating in the air moving when the invisible person can just slap him and he will run away

GBAM!!!!

MarkNsukkaBread:
So you think all the cash in the CBN will be outside waiting for you abi?

Even if you manage to get into the CBN office all the cash are in vaults and you will need a combination of keys and biometrics to unlock them...if you manage to get the money out you still have to figure out a way to take it out because the money is visible so if you're carrying it people will see it moving

Anyone who sees money floating by itself in thin air will run away fast.

Gabrielshow24:
What damage control? —observer bias at Its peak.

I know its hard living with your own words -

Gabrielshow24:
As long as I know all circumstances, I can ensure that one specific circumstance will occur.

Man up. It will be here forever.

Gabrielshow24:
Any one can infer a statement as an admission because of their bias. I am not interested in such frivolities, I have accounted for both perspectives. Be it divine or physical.

All these that are talking are exhibiting their freewill at this moment but yet they are proponents of the "lack of it"! It's a coexisting system! As simple as that. The lack or abundance of it doesn't change this!
That's my admission! Not whatsoever was interpreted to fit their narrative!

Too late for damage control man.

Walk away silently if they didnt see you. And never return. Your life is at risk.
If seen, back away carefully, and walk away.

If possible, get a shot (picture), but not at risk of your quick and safe exit.

BY ALL MEANS WALK AWAY.

Its a moment at which you may be killed.

Globad:
What's today's plain English connotation?

i still think there ought to be membership of a kind. From a group, etc.
You see, its insufficient to say that simply ceasing communication with anybody is excommunication. What if that person was not even talking to you as well? Your usage would make it appear that if you block someone on your line, thats excommunication too. What if they had already blocked you or died?

I believe there must be current membership of a sort.

See links -

https://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/excommunication

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/excommunication

FreeIgboho:
Oh the discussion ended before that, just that my brother Christian, Gabrielshow24, refuses to be intellectually honest. Simply put, between external constraints you never chose and internal constraints within the brain that you also never chose, there's simply no space for freewill

I know. Its just that even where he wrote a clear admission he didnt know it. Then wrote a second admission and still didnt know it. That i cant handle.

Gabrielshow24:
You can bold whatever clause you want, it won't change the coexistence of both systems.

I don't care whether you used minimal effort, what I am interested in is the congruence of your posits. I even asked you to disprove that the set of actions exclusive physical constraints were not own —something you didn't do by the way.

Thanks, it's nice knowing people like you exist.

Have a nice evening.

Globad:
Must someone be registered with you before excommunicate him?

He only has to be known to you or have communicated with you before. No?

Excommunication has an old connotation from the Roman Church.