₦airaland Forum

mantraa:
Ok. here's a couple of possibilities.

1.Steady-state expanding : Matter creation rate maintains constant density. Continuous creation out of nothing from nowhere. Exponential expansion.

2. Eternal Inflation (a multiple universe model): A multiverse, based on the concept of cold inflation, in which inflationary events occur at random each with independent initial conditions; some expand into bubble universes supposedly like our entire cosmos. Bubbles nucleate in a spacetime foam.

There are many other hypothesis, but like i said earlier, i do not know the answer, nobody does. There is so much more to learn

These could explain the existence of matter and its continous movement, BUT NOT -

1. Customised planetray engineering including the planetary water cycle and the botanic-planetary respiratory cycle

2. The patterns on a Butterfly's back.

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=328706.msg4611780#msg4611780 date=1253904243]I do have a problem with perverse logic.[/quote]Good, so you do not have a problem with proper logic (common sense).

We'll carry on. . . (Maybe the Universe popped out one day while you were in the loo, Tudor. . . )

NOW YOU TELL ME WHAT'S THE PERVERSE LOGIC IN THIS STATEMENT:

"Earth was engineered by I[b]ntelligence[/b]."

BUT I AM SURE WE CAN ALL SEE HOW LAUGHABLE THIS STATEMENT IS:

"Since i do not know what caused the Earth, I am therefore certain it could never have been caused by an intelligent mind" OR

"The Earth popped out of my break fast cereal."

Give it up mate. . . you are not really putting together much logic, you see.

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=328706.msg4611675#msg4611675 date=1253903242]Havent you heard the quote " There's order in chaos".[/quote]Really? There's order in chaos? And that's your answer for spiral DNA, red blood cell clotting, the planetary water cycle, the botanical-planetary respiratory cycle, the cross-continental migration of new born birds, and the patterns on the back of a butterfly.

That's your answer for these things - simply - "There is order in chaos"?

That's lame, and you know it.

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=328706.msg4611675#msg4611675 date=1253903242]Common sense told us disease were caused by evil spirits. . .basic intuition led us to believe the earth is the center of the universe. . .like I said, perverse and ridiculous logic. Science is our ONLY hope, all others are thoughtless ramblings.[/quote]Common Sense never told you diesease was caused by evil spirits. Fear told you that.

Intuition never told you the earth was the centre of the universe. A mis-interpretation of some old documents told you that.

Besides, Commonsense, in case you did not know, Tudor, is another word for LOGIC?

Do you have a problem with logic?

agathamari:
ok well that fits those who are literal translation of the bible but what about thos christians who believe god created the bulding blocks of life and that evolution happend?

http://www.religioustolerance.org/ev_publi.htm

Yes. That's the way i see it. Clearly God doesn't zip around making things appear suddenly.

He works through laws and processes, and evolution must be one such process.

Atheists:
The first pope is St Peter a disciple of Jesus

Source: Wikipedia

Gosh, this guy is such an unbelievable coward. Cannot even define Atheism, and he calls himself an atheist. Running away from simple questions for THREE DAYS NOW.

Even if we can take the other atheists on Nairaland seriously, this one we must surely ignore.

The guy is clueless.

Last chance, mate:

1. Please define the term "Atheist"

2. Please give us your personal reasons for calling yourself an Atheist.

3. Please explain to us why in your view, people who believe that the Universe was created by a Supernatural Mind are deluded/ suffering from a virus.

4. Please indicate what you might think of people who suppose that elements such as DNA, staggering in their complex customization for purpose, could have emerged by chance, or as the product of a universe without a mind.

mantraa:
@deep sight
That is a truly beautiful photo.

Doesnt it make you think why? what caused it to exist? How did all those  billions of stars come together to form that amazing galaxy? How many planets are in there? Is there other life forms in there? are they intelligent?
We need to keep on searching for answers to understand this fantastic universe that we are a part of.
20 years ago we could not even have seen an image like this if it was not for the scientists who refused to stop searching for the answers and built the space telescopes. We are literally infants in our evolution on this planet and are just begining to find out about our universe like a child that has just left his house for the first time and realises he is in a huge city, with other cities and countries to discover and explore.

Who knows what we will find?
Why limit yourself to just 2 possibilities. Just be patient, and dont jump to conclusions.

the answer is out there

I am all for this.

But let me ask you a question: If God exists, do you think scientists will ever find him? Perhaps create a ship advanced enough to traverse non-material realms and advanced dimensions until they find the primordial light, which is what God is?

Do you think this question can ever be resolved by SCIENCE?

Don't you think basic intuition and common sense can sometimes give best directions to simple answers?

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=328706.msg4611427#msg4611427 date=1253900720]Same old perverse logic from deepsight. . .look at a picture and magically conclude a magician created it.[/quote]Really? Perverse logic? Tell me what you would think of a man who came across the Mona Lisa and insists it had no painter. Perverse? Think deeply, Tudor.

There has never been any perverse logic. We said seeing effects demands a cause. We sought to determine some basic attributes of that cause.

The painting example is one thing. If you consider that the earth is not just a painting, but a beautiful, custom made home for living things, exhibiting astonishing planetary engineering, you just might want to reconsider which is perverse:

It was engineered by Intelligence OR

It popped out of Tudor's cereal breakfast. . .

Perverse? Think again, brother.

Mr Atheists! Come on! Such cowardice? Shall i assume you DO NOT EVEN KNOW THE MEANING OF THE WORD ATHEIST? WHY STILL EVADING THESE QUESTIONS? LAZY? IS THAT ALSO THE SOURCE OF YOUR ATHEISM - LAZINESS?

Mr Atheists - This is becoming very embarrasing. I have THREE TIMES presented to you these questions and you keep running away. sTOP RUNNING AWAY. Unlike Huxley, Tudor, Mazaje and other atheists, you seem afraid to answer these VERY SIMPLE questions. If you cannot answer these questions, please call it a day and sign-off Nairaland.

I am still waiting for the answers to these questions.

1. Please define the term "Atheist"

2. Please give us your personal reasons for calling yourself an Atheist.

3. Please explain to us why in your view, people who believe that the Universe was created by a Supernatural Mind are deluded/ suffering from a virus.

4. Please indicate what you might think of people who suppose that elements such as DNA, staggering in their complex customization for purpose, could have emerged by chance, or as the product of a universe without a mind.

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-328706.0.html

Does this embody a thought? Who's thought, then?

Or does it appear "thoughtless"?

mazaje:
The problem with you is that you present the universe as the evidence for your elusive god. . . Other religions at least do not do that. . they have gone further to try to tell us how their various god's created the universe. . .

There are so many creation myths out there. . .I at least give other religions credit for making such claims. . your deist on the other hand do not give any creation accounts for people to see and know if its true but just claim that everything that is in existence is as a result of your god. . .everything that exist is an evidence for the existince of that thing not an evidence for your god. . .

I dont know what you mean by "your god"

I state: A CREATOR created the universe.

That is like stating: "x effect had a cause"

Tell me you have a problem with that? ? ? ? ?

Good Mantraa, i actually agree with you - and for me this has nothing to do with Jesus or Mohammad.

ALL the traditions you have pointed out agree on the existence of a creator.

? ? ? ? ? ?

mazaje:
You will find such statements in the koran, ancient geek religious books and other religious text of the hindus, buddist etc. . .Humans are very poetic and this kind of expression is not found only in the bible. . .The problem is that all the religions claim that their god is responsible for the existence of the heavens and the earth. . .

Absolutely correct, you will find such statements everywhere. That in itself should make you think.

It is not a question of "my god" or "your god" - the truth is that every human tribe has always had a perception of a Universal Deity - a Creator, and they ascribe names to that Deity.

The mere fact that the names are different, and the characteristics differ, should only be expected given the diverse cultures and histories of the peoples.

You know very well that even if you and i saw a living person, we would likely give different descriptions of that person. How much more will the characterizations of the Creative Element differ from tribe to tribe!

Thus it really is a recognition that A CREATOR (name irrelevant) created the Universe. Period.

"The heavens are proclaiming the glory of God, and of the work of his hands, the expanse is telling" - The Bible

I'm just wondering why of all the options, you choose to EXCLUDE the deistic option.

Why is it not an option?

Deep Sight:
Mr Atheists - This is becoming very embarrasing. I have THREE TIMES presented to you these questions and you keep running away. sTOP RUNNING AWAY. Unlike Huxley, Tudor, Mazaje and other atheists, you seem afraid to answer these VERY SIMPLE questions. If you cannot answer these questions, please call it a day and sign-off Nairaland.

I am still waiting for the answers to these questions.

1. Please define the term "Atheist"

2. Please give us your personal reasons for calling yourself an Atheist.

3. Please explain to us why in your view, people who believe that the Universe was created by a Supernatural Mind are deluded/ suffering from a virus.

4. Please indicate what you might think of people who suppose that elements such as DNA, staggering in their complex customization for purpose, could have emerged by chance, or as the product of a universe without a mind.

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-328706.0.html

Mr Atheists: Come on, be a man, stop hiding your face from these SIMPLE questions.

JeSoul:
^hehe my thots exactly.
You have just done the electric slide around the question.

Even if science has not "discovered" this elusive cause, it would still fall under one of David's categories:

Either

1. Chance

or

2. Deity

we can scratch man since we know he didn't, and lets add

3. Aliens

which is it?

He's going to add a fourth option: an equation or principle inherent in existence. He'll forget to ponder the rationality of such an impersonal equation ever producing very personal feelings that humans have today: love, hatred, conscience, spiritual longing, to mention but a few.

So what do you suppose the Quoran meant with its opening line - Praise be to Allah, Lord of the worlds"

Notice the plural? ? ?

What did you do to merit that? Any particular mis-statement?

That's really sad. Does that mean one can no longer see all your past posts?

That's really really sad.

JeSoul:
Yes sir, I dabble a lil bit 

Great,

what happened to noetic, see above

JeSoul:
Perfect in circumstance

every single inch of her

down to the deepest crater

like a symphony they play together

atomic notes testifying to a brilliant creator

the envy of her siblings in the universe

she the definition of excellence

some allege coincidence, something of a big bang

her children insist the absence of a shaping Hand

she laughs

in slient amusement

wondering if they ever considered the evidence

if they ever considered the facts

but they seem instead to prefer theories

apparently

harder it is to accept the existence of a God

than it is to not.

Jesoul. . . are you a writer, then, you write poetry?

So since nobody gave us info to avert 9/11 and it went ahead to happen, can we now receive that info after it has happened and unhappen it? ? ? ? ? ?

This is getting inconguous, surely?

Noetic, what happened? Have you been banned? Why have you changed to noetic4 or is this some one else masquerading as you?

How come you are now comfortable in "Allah's paradise"?

I know you would never say such, so this must be an imposter.

Mr Atheists - This is becoming very embarrasing. I have THREE TIMES presented to you these questions and you keep running away. sTOP RUNNING AWAY. Unlike Huxley, Tudor, Mazaje and other atheists, you seem afraid to answer these VERY SIMPLE questions. If you cannot answer these questions, please call it a day and sign-off Nairaland.

I am still waiting for the answers to these questions.

   1. Please define the term "Atheist"

   2. Please give us your personal reasons for calling yourself an Atheist.

   3. Please explain to us why in your view, people who believe that the Universe was created by a Supernatural Mind are deluded/ suffering from a virus.

   4. Please indicate what you might think of people who suppose that elements such as DNA, staggering in their complex customization for purpose, could have emerged by chance, or as the product of a universe without a mind.

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-328706.0.html

Like a pearl, a gleaming jewel in the night of space it hangs. . .

Beauty beyond compare. . .

In her hills, in her seas, in her winds. . .

The bounty of life revere. . .



Just look at her. . . some very strange people declare she was made by nothing. . . and happened by chance. . . and for some very bizzare reason, they imagine every person who thinks otherwise is stupid. . . or has no reasons for thinking otherwise. . .

Really, let's define stupid.

Forward soldiers! The Deist war is here. . .! ! !

No: averting something deals with events that have not yet happened.

Unhappening, deals with already completed events.

Very very very different, Allta

Atheists:
My fellow comrade the virus of faith is a hard one to remove.

Mr Atheists - i have TWICE presented to you these questions and you keep running away. Unlike Huxley, Tudor, Mazaje and other atheists, you seem afraid to answer these VERY SIMPLE questions. If you cannot answer these questions, you cannot join Huxley in demanding answers from others.

I am still waiting for the answers to these questions.

1. Please define the term "Atheist"

2. Please give us your personal reasons for calling yourself an Atheist.

3. Please explain to us why in your view, people who believe that the Universe was created by a Supernatural Mind are deluded/ suffering from a virus.

4. Please indicate what you might think of people who suppose that elements such as DNA, staggering in their complex customization for purpose, could have emerged by chance, or as the product of a universe without a mind.

No problem with remote viewing, i ask only CAN AN ALREADY CONCLUDED EVENT BE "UNHAPPENED"?

That's really different from knowing something about to happen and averting it as per Minority Report

Absolutely. A ravenous wolf in sheep's clothing. What is so sad is the gross stupidity of the congregations that follow these jokers called Pastors. By the way, who anointed him a "Bishop"? That is not a title any joker can just pick up as a by-line.

^^^ So events that have already happened can be unhappened? Is it really thinkable that already completed events can be wiped out on any dimension.

Because at some point or the other in space-time: the event already took place.

M_Nwankwwo -

Thank you always. You always go the extra mile and take the time to carefully try to explain and enlighten. You are one of the few whose participation on this Forum is wholly constructive and up building.

To assist further can you clarify for me:

   1. The place of the authour of the Grail Message within the Trinity if any (is he the Holy Spirit?)

   2. Who is Parsifal? Is Parsifal God? Is he perhaps the highest image of God? Is he part of the Trinity or is the Trinity Embodied in him?

   3. What's the relationship between Jesus and the Authour of the Grail Message?

   4. Do Parfisal & Jesus worship the father? If they do, can they be called God?

Thanks.

Allta:
What if truely extraterrestials exist, what if they already have built their own TTMachine 1000years ago, what if we can use such machine someday and send information back in time to warn the Titanic Captains or prevent the 9/11 attacks?

If this happens, will the 9/11 event now unhappen, and all the dead therein spring back to life?

Will the Titanic dead re-emerge or perhaps their descendants?

It's unthinkable. If time travel is possible, then certainly changing events in the past is not.