₦airaland Forum

johnydon22:
Obviously many Christians, muslims and atheists etc will be too scared to engage in such exercise - i understand your sentiment

I'm happy that you indicated that that was just your own understanding of my statement.

hopefulLandlord:
HELL YEAH!!!!!

How then is the society morally right since it denies me my personal choice(of becoming a slave to someone), which does not harm anybody in anyway?

hopefulLandlord:
our societal law takes better care of such

slavery IS abolished, something YOUR god didn't do, WE HUMANS figured it out ourselves; we didn't need your holy book to tell us its wrong

morality EVOLVED to a point where slavery had NO PLACE in it

if you beat ANYONE and he dies due to the beating, you'll be charged to court for manslaughter or murder, it doesn't matter what the person is to you OR how long he/she survives after the beating; so long it's a direct result of your beating him/her


let me reiterate this

"There's NOWHERE in the bible that says slavery is wrong"

it is wrong by societal law

What if I willingly want to become someone's slave today? Will the "societal law" prohibit me?

I hope any Christian doesn't fall for this.

hopefulLandlord:
"GOD strongly frowned at beating slaves to death"

I fully agree with this but it isn't complete

he frowns on it but finds nothing bad in it so long the slave lives for more than 2 days after the incident

For you to think that GOD is comfortable with the death of a slave as a result of violence from his master, it shows that you don't really know GOD's character.

Anyway, what do you want GOD to do with the person whose slave dies after 2 days due to the beating he gave him/her?

hopefulLandlord:
erhm I can't find any uncivil word I used up there

if you do kindly point it out, I didn't say YOU'RE idiotic, I said that verse sounded idiotic

as for bringing it up, I did because you said the bible dictates what you find right and wrong 100% and the society you're in doesn't in ANY way influence it

its only proper to show that society you're in actually influences it some way or another

I'm sure you'll find it cringeworthy or even extremely angry if a Mr Appleby beats another "human" to death but gets away with it just because that "human" happens to be his slave and survives for 3 days before dying

GOD strongly frowned at beating slaves to death.

If GOD had His way, the subhuman state of slavery wouldn't have reared its ugly head up. He doesn't even want Masters to beat their slaves unnecessarily.

However, you still have to concede that slaves are like properties to their masters, and often times, man is not a good master/owner.

I really don't know if atheism confers some form of bigotry on its adherents.

They raise topics, and when you present aptly tailored logic, they either start using barbaric words, or they concoct some conclusions and then try to force it down your throat.

Aren't you just tired of these "enlightened" people?

hopefulLandlord:
Hahahahahahahahaha

did you see what you just did?

it sounded so so idiotic to you that you had to find a way of defending it


let me make this clear

"God is in support of slavery going by the Bible"

he gave instructions on how to buy and sell humans, how to beat them

did you even take a few seconds to digest what that verse means?

“And if a man beats his male or female servant with a rod, so that he dies under his hand, he shall surely be punished. Notwithstanding, if he remains alive a day or two, he shall not be punished; for he is his property."

that means you can beat the slave to death, so long the human survived for more than two days

look bro, I don't wanna go over this again, its been discussed at length many times all over Nairaland but if you're interested in defending this indefensible, be my guest

Can you, at least, be civil and use civil words?

If it has been treated before, why did you raise it again?

hopefulLandlord:
interesting

like

“And if a man beats his male or female servant with a rod, so that he dies under his hand, he shall surely be punished. Notwithstanding, if he remains alive a day or two, he shall not be punished; for he is his property."

I have many more such and I'm sure even YOU are aware of many such verses where your God commanded slaves to be "treated like fellow human beings"

I believe you know what a slave means.

If you want to go by that logic, a slave shouldn't do more work, then, than his master's children do. Eh?

It also gets clearer when you consider that some people sold themselves, of their own will, to become slaves to other people.

You really cannot argue that GOD is in support of slavery.

hopefulLandlord:
interesting

tell me your stance on slavery

It, equally, wasn't GOD's plan from the beginning. Man was to have dominion over the fishes, and the fowls of the air, and over every creeping creature but not over his fellow man.

GOD didn't create any human being to become a slave to another. But slavery is simply one of the results of man's fall. Even then, the Bible is richly sprinkled with rules from GOD on how slaves are to be treated with care, and as fellow human beings.

hopefulLandlord:
so you're telling me that without the man/woman story (I'm just letting this slide because the purpose of the thread is already achieved) for instance, you wouldn't know if its right to give your 5 year old daughter in marriage to a 20 year old guy?

We don't assume anything. The Bible tells me pedophilia is not GOD's plan for man.

I'm happy to know and obey GOD's will.

hopefulLandlord:
your answer makes sense

but you made this by discernment which isn't bad in itself

you don't even need to think deep or need the Bible to know that an underage child's body isn't developed enough for sex especially it's consequences

this same discernment made some of us (atheists) to be against Bestiality and incest

this thread was made as a response to Christian apologists who opened threads asking us what we find right or wrong saying THEY depend on the bible 100% to dictate morals for them

DoctorAilen, let me ask you this and I want a sincere answer

does Society in ANY way influence YOUR morals?

I was able to discern that pedophilia is not GOD's plan for man.

To your question I would honestly answer NO: because I hold the Bible as my only creed. And all the moral obligations you see me carry out are contained in the Bible: either directly stated, or easily inferred.

For us to get a proper view of GOD's take on pedophilia, we take a look at the first marriage ceremony which GOD conducted: that between Adam and Eve.

1. Was Eve created a little girl? No. She was called woman in the Bible.

2. Was Adam a little boy? No. He was a man.

3. Therefore, the first marriage on earth was between a man and a woman, and not between a Man and a little girl, or a little boy and a grown-up woman.

And since this union between Adam and Eve reflected GOD's ideal for marriage, a discerning Christian will know that GOD does not want His people to take underaged children as spouses.

Also, Eve was a help meet for Adam. That means she satisfied Adam in every way possible, including his need for interaction. This was because Eve was as mentally mature as Adam. I'm very sure that I would have little to nothing to discuss with an underaged girl, if I married one today, being a grown-up(or even old) man. And so how can she by my help meet?

Papist:
Good evening sir. Your proof that the Catholic Church created Islam would be most welcome. You could recommend some books. I disagree with you but I am willing to learn why you believe this. Thank you.

There is a link behind the words "this article" in the first sentence of my post which you quoted.

Just click on the words "this article".

Islam was created by the Catholic church for selfish purposes, as this article proves.

I know that rebuttals to the article will surely come, but I'm not here for argument. I simply go about enlightening people.

You can believe it. You can choose not to: I have nothing to gain(except maybe a soul from ignorance.) But a wise man discerns the truth, and can differentiate it from propaganda.

MizyB:
I appreciate this, thank U brother.

Jesus the Lamb of God slain from the foundations of the world. I noticed how God showed forgiveness to mankind, after the burnt offerings of Noah. Gen8:21-22

Romans 3:25 FOR GOD PRESENTED JESUS AS THE SACRIFICE FOR SIN. People are made right with God when they believe that Jesus sacrificed his life shedding his blood. This sacrifice shows that God was being fair when he held back and did not punish those who sinned in times past.

Exactly sister. As far as they obeyed the instructions meant for persons who have sinned against GOD, Christ's sacrifice was to blot out their own sins too.

[url=www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Religions/Jehovah%20Witnesses/jw.htm]Interesting article about the JWs here.[/url]

It's either the title of this thread was meant for another article, or the author doesn't know how to caption threads.

I have gone through this article over and over again, and I'm yet to see the "lessons religious people should learn" from an election going on in a country.

What view is compatible? One that sees real moral obligation as grounded in its Creator, that sees moral obligation as rooted in the fact that we have been created with a purpose and for an end. We may call this view, with deliberate generality, "the religious view." But however general the view, reflection on the fact of moral obligation does seem to confirm it.

Suppose we say it is rooted in nothing deeper than human willing and desire. In that case, we have no moral standard against which human desires can be judged. For every desire will spring from the same ultimate source— purposeless, pitiless matter. And what becomes of obligation?
According to this view, if I say there is an obligation to feed the hungry, I would be stating a fact about my wants and desires and nothing else. I would be saying that I want the hungry to be fed, and that I choose to act on that desire. But this amounts to an admission that neither I nor anyone else is really obliged to feed the hungry—that, in fact, no one has any real obligations at all. Therefore the atheistic view of reality is not compatible with there being genuine moral obligation.

Now given the fact of moral obligation, a question naturally
arises. Does the picture of the world presented by atheism accord with this fact? The answer is no. Atheists never tire of telling us that we are the chance products of the motion of matter—a motion which is purposeless and blind to every human striving. We should take them at their word and ask: Given this picture, in what exactly is the moral good rooted? Moral obligation can hardly be rooted in a material motion blind to purpose.

1. Real moral obligation is a fact. We are really, truly, objectively obligated to do good and avoid evil.

2. Either the atheistic view of reality is correct or the "religious" one.

3. But the atheistic one is incompatible with there being moral obligation.

4. Therefore the "religious" view of reality is correct.

We need to be clear about what the first premise is claiming. It does not mean merely that we can find people around who claim to have certain duties. Nor does it mean that
there have been many people who thought they were obliged to do certain things (like clothing the naked) and to avoid doing others (like committing adultery). The first premise is claiming something more: namely, that we human beings really are obligated; that our duties arise from the way things really are, and not simply from our desires or subjective dispositions. It is claiming, in other words, that moral values or obligations themselves—and not merely the belief in moral values—are objective facts.

akintom:
Na only you waka come? Doctoralien, felixomor

1. How is atheism just emotional laziness and self indulgence?

2. Do you know who to give credit of nature to?

I really don't know why I was mentioned.

I don't have time for irrelevant arguments.

Let us first hear what the Bible tells us to do with our enemies:

"But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;" Matt. 5:44

The Bible does not encourage us to call fire of any sort to destroy our enemies.

Holy Ghost fire(as it is commonly perceived) is not in the Bible, and even if it were, it cannot be at the disposal of vengeful people who do not practise the love and peace which Christ teaches.

tartar9:
In the eyes of the jews and their holy book which you fraudulently use-He was antithesis of long established jewish beliefs.How can you be sure then if he wasn't just another false prophet

Can you point out a single biblical criterion which Jesus does not fulfil as the Messiah?

But He does not exist, right?

Lennycool:
You need video proof of every step?
You know what you're asking is illogical. The transition was unexpected and hence not recorded. You really need to learn more about science.

Red herring.

What did the fruitfly change into? Can I see it?

Can anybody give me a good reason why I should ever interact with the person who posted this comment above me?

jonbellion:
lol no you're not getting the point I'm all about forgiveness but it doesn't make sense that me a mere unbekiber would be punished for eternity while people that were really terrible on earth won't even get any divine retribution even for a small time

Nobody will burn in fire forever.

Lennycool:
Actually it has been observed in the case of certain fruit flies in America that evolved into a new specie.
I wanted to show you the one you can easily observe.

What did the fruitflies evolve into? Can you show me the video documenting all the steps they took in going from being fruitflies to being entirely different species?

jonbellion:
DoctorAlien why should a perfect being care about worship
That is why it is perfect
Its not supposed to be egoistical
And why would a perfect being punish unbelievers like ourselves in an eternal fire for lack of belief but allow someone like Joseph Stalin into heaven if he repents on his deathbed?
If this is the being that did create everything it is obviously not intellegent
Your works matter most not belief

Whether you worship GOD or not, it changes nothing. You can at least be truthful enough to admit this.

The problem here is that you're trying to make your own perception of "perfection" universal.

It is also not hard to see that your ideology lacks any epitome of forgiveness in it: why do you think murdering somebody is far more grave than denying the existence of GOD and living in rebellion against Him?