₦airaland Forum

john107: When i went thru dis thread, i felt lyk weeping. Why are christians so divided? You call urself a Christian, yet u utter abominable words against ur fellow brethren. Can clean water and brackish come forth from d same source? The road to heaven is indeed narrow. By their fruits we shall know them. If only we could abide in love for love is indeed God is love.

Candour: OK by me.

Mark Miwerds: For the duration of the Discussion, providing no underhanded manipulation by opponents, I will agree.

Image123: Fine. i don't like too many rules. Make i go prepare jare. i'm suggesting the discussion starts on a new thread and a working NL mod be available or at least agreeing to help with necessary clean ups.
What next?

Image123: Fine. i don't like too many rules. Make i go prepare jare. i'm suggesting the discussion starts on a new thread and a working NL mod be available or at least agreeing to help with necessary clean ups.
What next?

Mark Miwerds: Thanks, Brother! Just sent you a Reply to your Reply.

[size=16pt]Proposed Rules, Regulations and Format of Presentation for the Tithe Discuss:[/size]

1. During the discussion there shall be no insults, name calling, maligning, critic of churches or ministers, or any intentional bid to make an opponent look bad. The discuss shall be done with the utmost respect of each person involved - conveying the Christian spirit of love. If anyone feels insulted, he shall be reporting the matter to the moderator; who holds the right to call the other person to order. If this is repeated by the same individual who does not take to correction, the discuss shall be suspended to allow for a replacement of that person.

When someone has been proven to have insulted another, he will be required to make an unreserved apology to the other party. The term of replacing a participants will be when he refuses to make this apology.

2. So as to avoid time wastage, posters will be required to state when they will be making their presentations; and if there arise some unforseen circumstance, they should inform the house about it.

3. Let us keep the aim of the discuss at heart: it is not to win an argument but to present the facts that are behind our position on "tithing" or "not tithing".

4. Both sides in one post shall be presenting 10 points each on thier position on tithing. Each point shall be named after the lead discussants on each side. Thus for Rhymeyjohn, his points shall be listed: R1, R2, R3,...., R10. Miwerds, his points will be M1, M2, M3,...., M10. Here is an example for the post by Rhymey

Example:

R1: Tithe is an Eternal Principle (Heb 20:20; Mark 24:2; ....)

R2: Tithe is compulsory (John 25:1; Ezekiel 60:70;....)

Then Miwerds shall make his own presentation in one post M1,...; along with their scriptural positions.

This is neccesary so that we do not repeat points already discussed. Also, if in the procees of discussing point R2, point R7 had been trashed out, by the time you get to point R7, the two groups could agree to skip it.

When a group makes a presentation and the four steps of response is exhausted, the other group will make their own presentation. So for this discuss, I suggest that Ryhmejohn presents his R1 first; to be followed by Miwerds M1; and the discuss will continue in that manner.

5. Presentation will be in this format

a. Presenting a point, say R1 by Ryhmey, titled Presenting R1. When you are done with your presentation, you should state "end"

b. A rebuttal of R1 by Miwerd/Candour titled Rebutting R1.

c. Then a Response to Rebuttal by Rhymey, titled Response to Rebuttal R1.

d. Then a response to response by Miwerds/Candour titled Response to Response R1.

This way each post on the discuss has a name and can be refered to easily later if there is a need to do so. Also, after a point has been trashed out in this four steps outlined above, it should not be revisited again. Not that the point cannot be mentioned in a latter discuss, but that this particular discuss will be considered finished at this point and there will be no need to refer to it again. This is to discourage un-ending hammering of a point. Therefore participants are expected to do a thorough work in the two opportunities they have to present on a point.

6. Time must be permitted for each group to make their presentations. If anyone is handicapped and cannot make his/her presentation as quickly as possible, he/she may refer to the other to help him do it or tell the house when he intends to come and make the presentation.

7. Anybody among the two can make a presentation, however, he/she is expected to title his presentation properly.

8. This discuss is not intended to last a few days; it will probably take some months; so participants are expected to make the required sacrifice.

9. All points to be presented must be backed up by the Holy Bible, the one accepted by most non-Catholic churches.

10. The moderator shall be DrummaBoy. If any of the participants is uncomfortable with my manner of handling things, a change can be agreed upon. Please note that only participants can make suggestions for rules to be changed.

11. Participants hold the right to drop out of the discuss if they want to: due to fatigue or some or unforeseen circumstances. He/she is however advised to nominate a replacement of himself/herself.

12. While participants are not stopped from engaging the "audience", we would like to discourage this; so they can concentrate on the matters being discussed at hand. If such "engagement" does occur, we advice that it should not be to spite another participant or you will be penalized. Opportunity shall be given to the audience to ask questions but only after the discuss is concluded.

13. Participants are requested not to post on any tithe thread that is currently running on the religion section of this forum in the duration that this discuss will hold.

14. To curb excessive waste of time, we hereby request that when the discuss begin and participants are requested to make their presentations, the very first presentation should not take more than 24 hours to be done (with correction and editing). Subsequent responses to that presentation (that is the next three steps) should not take more than 12 hours to be done. If these rules are not adhered to the moderators will have to come up with a commensurate act of penalizing the participants.

Please visit this post over and over again, because in the course of the discussion, amendments will be made as we all agree to them, and we are expected to keep abreast of what the rules are.

So over to Rhymeyjohn, Image123, Mark Miwerds and Candour. What do you guys make of the above?

Mark Miwerds: DrummaBoy, I just sent you an email with my concerns.

Please respond as soon as possible.

Thanks!

Image123: i'm asking for Rhymejohn's permission. He showed interest. i do not get/understand the ally thing. Is it that Mark will say his own, then candour will say his own, then the tither will say his own. How does it work? If anyone is interested in being the ally, no qualms. i'm not using my preferences but theirs. i do await Rhymej's approval though.

Mark Miwerds: DrummaBoy,

Now you should see why I requested the thread be closed to those who are not part of the discussion.

I have to listen to all the barbs and false accusations. One shouldn't have to wade through a cesspool to swim in clean water. The Bible says "Neither give place to the devil."

Give him an inch, and he will do his best to destroy the saints.

Their agenda is not that truth be known. If it were, they would not come in falsely accusing as they do. Their agenda is to wear down the saints of God.

Image123:
No mind them. See soliciting oh.
Okay @drumb, no wahala. i'll take it up so far as my conditions still stands i.e the concessions Mark and candour are making/made not to talk about tithe in any other thread for the period of the discuss. That includes me and my "ally" BTW. And of .course, also good now is Rhymeyjohn's permission since he is interested. Dunno how this ally thing works and if my tithing ogas will have the time. Its obvious we are all tired of endless tithe talk, don't know how it is such an obsession for the average antitiher here to want to talk about tithe. So, my tithe friends, if you're interested in ally work, oya oh start jogging, lol. If not, i'll do just fine with these fellows, i truly understand your stance.
Let's hear from Rhymeyj, if he agrees, i'll bring in one or two things and then we start.

Goshen360: @ Gombs,

Okay. We kick it off then!

I stand on the new testament teachings to the church and from that truth, tithe was never mentioned nor taught to the church. On the contrary, tithe was abolished in Hebrews 7. However, this discussion is gonna be lengthy, so we can look into all angles of tithe. I understand you people claim tithe was before the law but you still run to Malachi to curse me and other Christians if we don't tithe according to the law.

So, I take it that your claim that tithe was before the law is just deception if you will have to resort to tithe of the law to issue threat and curse. Why do you teach or think Christians should 'pay' or 'give' mandatory monetary 10% of their monthly or weekly income to religious organization today while the Apostles never taught it to the Church?

Rhymeyjohn: @Drummaboy, lets make it 5 point once. Am a student, busy, with irregular internet, i would try be here everyday. You could also contact m.k.o.2005 and always true for me. thanks

Gombs: ^^
Fine

Gombs: ^^
While not add these?

7. The audience members shall not ask follow-up
questions asked by the audience or the answers of the
candidates during the debate.

8. HBG would moderate

And the idea of 20points poured out at inception makes this less of a discussion/conversation but a debate.

Rhymeyjohn: I'll want m.k.o 2005 or alwaystrue as an ally in the discuss.
The issue i raised is rearing it ugly head even in the pre discuss thread, folks being accused of being 'lover of money' for the stand they hold. Let people restrain themselves cos it determines my participation

Rhymeyjohn: Hello folks, good evening all, this thread started on a very sound note, but is almost ending up in the usual unloving banter. i wonder what a discussion would look like, but i'd say, bring it on, lol. no conditions atall from me,my only fear are the end result of such discussion, i dont want anyone to tag me 'fraud' 'theifing pastor' 'charlatan' or all the uncomplimentary remarks that usually follow for making my stand in a discuss. A wonderful christian discussion should end (no matter the opposing views) with love, and heart felt prayer to the other person is what i'd like. Lest remenber that doctrine has not saved anyone, Let all things be done with love. Am in, can we begin tomorrow? Bless you all.

Pastor Kun: Why are you wasting your time with Image123? Is it not glaringly obvious that he lacks the balls to engage in an organised tithe discussion because he knows he would be thoroughly humilated and exposed to be a charlatan Those so called conditions he gave was just to create an escape route for him to avoid the discussion and put the blame on the other party for not accepting his manipulative/fraudulent conditions.

Image123: Okay, okay, drumboy. You know what. i'll enter the DISCUSSION on one condition, that the discussants do not engage in any other tithe thread, or[b] introduce tithe into other threads for the next two months[/b] apart from this thread. i no get time, i don tire for this tithe tithe talk all the time, but i go try sha. My brothers are simply tired, it is antitithers that are taking this thing as a do or die, like an addiction.
So, i await their agreement(Mark and Candour).
BTW, i do not think myself a theologian. Thanks.

Goshen360: As for me, I agree to your terms and conditions. Mine is for YOU or any tithe teachers to AGREE to answer the intelligent questions I will submit to you and ANSWER THEM WITH SCRIPTURE BACKING. DO NOT DODGE ANY QUESTION OF MINE AND I WON'T DODGE ANY OF Y'ALL.

Mark Miwerds: Why do you falsely accuse as you do? We do not have "false hopes." Our hope is anchored in Jesus Christ, who loved us and gave Himself for us. He who abolished in his flesh the commandments contained in ordinances. He who, in His great love, opened the door to Salvation for the Gentile nations after that the Jews rejected Him.

Why discuss it? Because there are many false prophets in the world. Many false prophets who have set up their own dominions, deceiving the simple into handing their monies over to them... all in the name of God They teach their own commandments, deceiving the hearts of the simple with their man-made commands that are not from God.

Those who are Christ's are His voice in the Earth today, and must speak out when such deceitful leaders are robbing the hearts of the simple through their "good words and fair speeches".

Image123: Okay, okay, drumboy. You know what. i'll enter the DISCUSSION on one condition, that the discussants do not engage in any other tithe thread, or introduce tithe into other threads for the next two months apart from this thread. i no get time, i don tire for this tithe tithe talk all the time, but i go try sha. My brothers are simply tired, it is antitithers that are taking this thing as a do or die, like an addiction.
So, i await their agreement(Mark and Candour).r
BTW, i do not think myself a theologian. Thanks.