₦airaland Forum

MaxInDHouse:
This is the wrong information passed to billions of people throughout the world but it's a lie!

The organization of Jehovah's Witnesses is the restoration of pure worship but as most people would like to believe all the existing churches today came from one that's still present which means they separated or as rightly stated protested to form another church.

Jehovah's Witnesses organization totally differs when it comes to the foundation of this church. Note that Jesus of Nazareth was baptized by John the baptist so most Jews in the first century believed that Jesus was one of the disciples of John the baptist since he was baptized by the later.
But is that the truth?
NO!
So if you are ready to know the difference between restored pure worship and man-made religions around you let me know and i will expatiate more.

God bless you and may you have peace!

See dribbling

It's a well known fact that Russell who founded Watchtower was a member of Seventh Day Adventist.

The most well acceptable doctrine by Watchtower today which is "1914 Christ invisible return" was a well formulated doctrine of SDA before being discarded.

Or are you not the one who claimed that Jesus bought Watchtower from Russell?

Janosky:
The OP is very correct .
@ Proverbs 8:22-30, Wisdom personified is a being created by God.
That created being is Jesus Christ @ 1 Cor 1:24, the wisdom of God.

You throw the first confusion by saying "WISDOM PERSONIFIED"

If Prov is a personification it means it wasn't REAL. So, how come something PERSONIFIED can still be A REAL PERSON?

Also, according to Prov 8, God was the one carrying out the very actions of Creation, so when did God later use Jesus to create ALL OTHER THINGS?

God his Father (meaning Senior) gave Jesus life, John 5:26.

But Jesus is the very ETERNAL LIFE so, how can life be given to Eternal Life Himself? 1 John 1:2

Screenshot evidence, for clarity read Psalms 139 & Genesis in the screenshot.....
God is the Source of Wisdom (Jesus Christ).
In like manner ,God is the Source of Life, including yours & mine. [/b]

You don't even know how it sounds that Jesus is the WISDOM OF JEHOVAH.

Which means without Jesus Jehovah doesn't have wisdom.

Jesus is the very ETERNAL LIFE.

Who breath the breath of life into Adam, Jesus or Jehovah?

Janosky:
According to Emusan A.I screenshot evidence.
Jesus Christ is a creature ,the firstborn of every creature .

No be rocket science.

No wonder you couldn't answer the question I thrown at you since.

Here is it again.

Do you mean what you understand from that screenshot is that AI claimed Jesus is a created being or you're just being sarcastic?

gohf:
accusing me falsely doesn't change the truth available and evidence provided but you can continue doing what you are good at 👍🏾

This is my post.

Can you point to anything that looks like FALSE ACCUSATION there?

Yet you couldn't provide the said God's word to back your claim.

Are these the scriptures that says God CREATED Jesus to be His exact image?


Do Trinitarians ever told you that there are TWO/THREE ONLY GODS Or you didn't know that Trinitarians also agreed that there's ONLY ONE GOD?

This question is very important:

Do Trinitarians ever told you that there are TWO/THREE ONLY GODS Or you didn't know that Trinitarians also agreed that there's ONLY ONE GOD?

gohf:
you shouldn't but then what stopped you from accepting those statements backed up by God's word.

There's no statement in God's word that I ever rejected.

John.17.3 Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.
Mark.12.32 The teacher of religious law replied, "Well said, Teacher. You have spoken the truth by saying that there is only one God and no other.

Yes! There's ONLY ONE GOD.

would you not look for another excuse to reject the truth? That there is only one God and that Jesus is the son of God, whom God brought to life and says, this is my son and I am his Father.

I have never denied that There's NO ONLY ONE GOD.

I've never denied that Jesus isn't God's Son.

Can you point me to where I ever made such statement?

gohf:
you shouldn't but then what stopped you from accepting those statements backed up by God's word.

Yet you couldn't provide the said God's word to back your claim.

John.17.3 Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.
Mark.12.32 The teacher of religious law replied, "Well said, Teacher. You have spoken the truth by saying that there is only one God and no other.

Are these the scriptures that says God CREATED Jesus to be His exact image?

would you not look for another excuse to reject the truth? That there is only one God and that Jesus is the son of God, whom God brought to life and says, this is my son and I am his Father.

Do Trinitarians ever told you that there's are TWO/THREE ONLY GODS Or you didn't know that Trinitarians also agreed that there's ONLY ONE GOD?

gohf:
Now think about a comic artist, or a manga/manhua for those into asian sketched stories. Now if artist who is the creator of those characters in sketched up world, decides to draw a character and name that character after himself or call it, his image having a power to erase or rule in his sketched up world.

The first question is, is this image, this character given such power and authority to erase, created? Yes it is, yes he/she, the character is created.

Second question, is that character the creator, the comic artist? The answer is No


The question then is, even though without a doubt (personally) Jesus is the image of God why do some call him God, even when the creator and author did not call him or tell others to call him God?

Yet you couldn't support your statement with just single verse from God's word.

Should we then take your mere word as fact over God's word?

tctrills:
I am asking from a Christian perspective. Before our birth and our lives as humans, did we preexist? What does the bible say about this?
Many religions believe that man is an ancient being that preexists earth life does Christianity agree?

The term human means a being with flesh and blood. Which can never exist outside this physical world.

So, human only exists on earth the very moment is being given birth to.

Here is the gist, since human is only limited to the physical world, the Creator just doesn't want to leave him alone because this creature is modelled after the image of His Creator. So, the Creator put in him something unique in other to interact with him - His Spirit.

"Then the Lord God formed the man from the dust of the ground. He breathed the breath of life into the man’s nostrils, and the man became a living person." Gen 2:7

"But there is a spirit which is in man; and the breath of the Almighty giveth them understanding." Job 32:8

To your question, does human exist before birth? No! Human is just flesh and blood that can only exist in the physical world.

Janosky:
The same A.I that taught Emusan that Jesus Christ is the first born ,created by God.
Emusan AI post screenshot.

So reading that screenshot, your conclusion is that AI said "Jesus is the FIRSTBORN and created by God"

Or you're just being sarcastic?

Boomark:
I called you for a specific purpose, you left it and started discussing another thing.

You're too funny.

I made it clear in my reply to FX.

Yes! You called me and I didn't discussed that but I discussed what I observed, reason why I never replied your mentions.

Or did I?

Do you people do this to protect lies or what?

You're being emotional

How can you people understand scripture when simple things are difficult for you.

Okay the most knowledgeable person in world.

Nobody is interested in if what I said is true or false.

But you're interested in what others say as false.

Upon all my explanation it is still difficult.

Difficult for who?

I cannot be deceived by double negatives. AI said it in the video where he was tagged a deceit. I understood what he said even without the AI backup.

See another example here.

A. I wrote: Emusan

B. Someone came and said: that I denied the fact that what I wrote on the isn't Emusan.

Read it carefully and tell me if what I wrote in A is the same thing someone said in B. Are they the same? You can answer these questions to know if they are the same.

1. what did I denied?
2. Say If what I wrote isn't Emusan?

When you answer these questions you will understand that it is a false accusation. Nobody is interested in if Emusan is black, white, or yellow.

Then you can go back to that page where I called you and see it clearly.

This is a petty issue focus on your thread.

Or was this part of the point you're scoring yourself?

Boomark:
Why are things difficult for you people to understand?

This is the issue.

My reply was the cumulative of what I know that transpired between you and him.

See example what I want from you.

I wrote on a board: "the rice is brown"

Now someone came and said that, "I denied the fact that the rice isn't brown"

So I want you to tell us if what he said was actually what I wrote on the board. Did I deny anything from what I wrote on the board. Use this illustration and check again. Did it match what I said or was I falsely accused of denying what I never denied.

If this is what you want, then I read his reply to FX about how he used two NEGATIVE words to show what he meant. Well I don't have much to say on that.

I am only interested in the false accusation not the AI experience on trinity.

https://www.nairaland.com/8486945/bible-challenge-trinity-boomark-image123/3#136388655

I will advise you to focus on your thread and don't stretch much on this.

False accusations is a strong word, remember you also claimed "AI default program favors TRINITY" which is also false.

Should AI demand apology for this or will you be willing to tender an apology to AI?

To me this is just misunderstanding that needs not to be stretched.

FxMasterz:
In all honesty, Boomark posited that ChatGPT does favour Trinity, while Image123 claimed It doesn't.

Image123, please kindly admit as a true child of God that you wrongly accused Boomark. I know it might be an oversight. It wouldn't have been deliberate but be mature enough to admit it and apologize.

Since Boomark has been tagging my mention on this issue, I didn't reply because I don't understand his main point.

But with this, I think we need to understand something.

Firstly, No AI outside there condition with any benefits or bias ideas. Anyone with little background in Software Engineering will know AI only pulls information from different ACCESSIBLE sources and make it readable in well organized way.

So, the claim by Boomark that AI FAVOUR TRINITY isn't true and I think that was the impression that image123 tried to correct.

AI will only output what you feed it with.

Secondly, image123 claim that AI doesn't favour Trinity is correct.

For instance, If you ask AI Does God exist?

It will answer what the Theist claims, what Atheist claims and what philosopher claims and I'm very sure no AI will outrightly say "Yes! God does Exist or No! God does not exist."

Lastly, I will use this to address how I do deal with AI when it comes to most debatable topics i.e Bible & Christianity.

For instance, I post a verse in the Bible and I ask AI to explain... The reply will come with most widely acceptable explanations and those who opposed such view example Christ Divinity. With this only verse the AI can conclude that Yes Jesus is God but when I push further with another verse, it's view of Jesus being God will change and vis a vis.

So, the best way of using AI about Jesus Divinity which I've done is this:

1. I ask AI, if God should exist what and what attributes must a Being have before considered being be God? The AI listed attributes like UNCREATED, ETERNAL, All Knowing e.t.c

2. I ask the AI to go through Matthew to Revelation and pick where those attributes appeared.

3. I then ask it to explain those verses.

4. It's explanation will still try to be most acceptable vs most opposed but I'll push further by saying something like "I don't want explanation based on Theology, I want open-mind explanation i.e if I'm reading those verses without a background on any Theological theories."

5. It's explanation will a little bit different from the first explanation and if you're not bias at least the person should agree with the AI 70-80%.

6. The last thing I do also, is to ask the AI to go through the Hebrew or Greek manuscripts itself and explain those verses based on it's understanding of those languages without Theological theories.


In conclusion, I've tried to use some verses in the scripture to prove to the AI that Jesus isn't God and it agreed and I've also used some verses in the scripture to prove to the AI that Jesus is God and it agreed as well.

That is why I said, AI isn't favour Trinity it depends on how you put your question or statement.

I know the reason why Boomark made that claim is because he has done that many times and the results he got wasn't pleasant to his ears.

My two cents!

achorladey:
@ MaxInDHouse religious publication......

The fact that Jehovah has a place of dwelling indicates that he is not in all places at all times. How, then, can he be aware of what is happening? (2 Chronicles 6:39) One way is through his holy spirit, or active force. The psalmist wrote: “Where can I go from your spirit, and where can I run away from your face? If I should ascend to heaven, there you would be; and if I should spread out my couch in Sheol, look! you would be there.”​—Psalm 139:7-10.

To understand the pervasive effect of God’s holy spirit, picture the sun. It is at a specific location but distributes energy to a vast portion of the earth. Similarly, Jehovah God has a place of dwelling. But he can perform whatever his will is anywhere in the universe. Furthermore, Jehovah can use his holy spirit to perceive what is happening anywhere and at any time. Thus, 2 Chronicles 16:9 states: “As regards Jehovah, his eyes are roving about through all the earth to show his strength in behalf of those whose heart is complete toward him.”


When David said where can I go from your spirit, was David running away from active force (inanimate or not a being) or from God(a being)?

cc: Emusan

See this primary pupil's logic.

God can't be everywhere yet He can BUT through HIS HOLY SPIRIT.

So according to Watchtower Holy Spirit can be EVERYWHERE but God HIMSELF can't be EVERYWHERE.

That is wonderfully serious

MaxInDHouse:
You just want to argue but i'm sorry that is in the past

Yes! To keep exposing your lies and how you hate God's word.

because the OP has gotten my message

When you didn't even address the OP in the first place.

Allow the OP to tell you he has gotten the message or are you his spokesperson?

so if you are not satisfied go and figure out for yourself what God meant at Genesis 18:20-21
Enjoy your day!

Gen 18:20-21 has not solved your confusion.

The Eyes of Jehovah are EVERYWHERE, WATCHING at both the bad and the good.

This is directly from your own translation.

God KNOWS ALL THINGS
GOD is ALL POWERFUL

Meaning of:
Omniscient = ALL KNOWING
Omnipotent = ALL POWERFUL

Reason why you're afraid of those questions

MaxInDHouse:
"The eyes of Jehovah"

Is what confused you because Genesis 18:20-21 says God decided to go down to Sodom and Gomorrah to see whether the reports brought to Him is exactly as reported.

Confused me ke or it only exposed your lying mouth.

So, the author didn't know the difference between the Eyes of Angels and the eyes of Jehovah that is why you have to get a balance view

So how do we get a balance view?

The balance left for you are just your conjecture.

It's written boldly in the scripture that THE EYES OF JEHOVAH is on both the bad and the good.

You can deny it but can't remove that from God's word.

It was revealed to Ezekiel that there are angels given the ability to see everything around them.

Funny thing about God's word denial is the ability to raise anything above God.

You agreed Angels have the ability to "SEE EVERYTHING" around them but God doesn't have the same ABILITY.

Can you imagine that?

Anyways, why are you not answering my other questions.

1. Is there in the scripture a direct phrase like God KNOWS ALL THINGS?
2. Is there a direct phrase in the scripture that says God is ALL POWERFUL?

MaxInDHouse:
Three questions are raised by this topic:

1. Can God see everything and is He seeing everything now?

2. Can God be present everywhere and is He present everywhere now?

3. Can God do all things and is He doing all things now?

Ask a Muslim these questions and you will get "YES" all through but as believers in Christ we must be wise as serpent and harmless as dove {Matthew 10:16} the wise answer to each question is "YES" to part a but "NO" to part b.

WHY?

Even though God can see everything but He chose not to because humans have become sinners and so the things they often do irritates Him {Genesis 6:6} this means He won't like to be everywhere for the same reason since He is incapable of seeing evil deeds {Habakkuk 1:13} to the third question ability to do all things doesn't exclude evil things which exempt God because He is Holy. James 1:13

That's why no inspired writer used any of those terms and translators avoided it too.

You are welcome!

Firstly, you lied again, the point which you started on this topic was OMNISCIENT (God KNOWS ALL THINGS)

You asked questions and answered the same questions yet you go further to contradict yourself.

You agreed by saying "Even though God can SEE EVERYTHING"

1. Did scripture say God KNOWS ALL THINGS?
2. Did scripture say God is ALL POWERFUL?
3. Did scripture say God is EVERYWHERE?

These are simple questions you can answer "YES/NO" by providing where the scripture rejects those phrases.

because your initial objection was that God is not OMNISCIENT, OMNIPRESENT & OMNIPOTENT.

When OMNISCIENT simply means ALL KNOWING.

Also you lied that because of human sins God chooses not to see them but here is a verse about how God's watching individual "The eyes of Jehovah are everywhere, Watching both the bad and the good." Prov 15:3 - NWT

How long will you keep lying against God and His word?

MaxInDHouse:
Go and publish your own translation and include those adjectives but for now no single Bible translator used such adjectives for the Bible God!

I don't need to publish a Translation because even Watchtower who did that to justify their doctrines still couldn't insert "Theocracy" or direct phrase "Jesus is Michael" into their translation and that doesn't stop them from using them.

But the key here is that you lied when you claimed you don't believe in what is not found in the Bible.

You believe THEOCRACY & Jesus is Michael without such word/phrase in the Bible.

But it will be intellectual dishonesty to claim a word with a meaning can't be used because it's not found in a book.

So far, you can't answer the straight question.

Did God KNOW ALL THINGS according to scripture OR can we find in the scripture where it is written that GOD KNOWS ALL THINGS?

MaxInDHouse:
Imagine a furniture maker who made a stool then someone came claiming the woody stool can be used in a house of fire can the furniture maker predict the outcome?

You truly have problem with English language.

Prediction can be true or false.

God didn't predict but know for certainty how the outcome will be and tell exactly how each step will happen.

The furniture maker cant.

That is why you use the word "PREDICT" instead of ACCURATELY KNOWING.

God created man and said it's not man's job to rule over man it won't work and for thousands of years no human government is successfully all has been ending with one trouble or another.

That's why GOD IS ALL KNOWING if God is not ALL KNOWING as you're trying to stipulate man can change which will see happened, so for God to know FROM BEGINNING that Man can't govern themselves is what NO OTHER BEING can know and that makes God to be ALL KNOWING (OMNISCIENT).

Very simple English.

That's it.

Alpha and Omega the beginning and the end. God created intelligent beings and knew they can't rule over themselves in peace so try any system of government it will surely fail that's what it means!

@color_red is the main point.

For a being to KNOW something from BEGINNING TO END MEANS the being is ALL KNOWING.

MaxInDHouse:
That doesn't mean Omniscient first of all you need to know the context of what God is saying before you can understand what He meant by knowing the end from the beginning.
The theme of God's word (Bible) is "God's Kingdom" in simple English "God's Government"
Satan challenged God's sovereignty in the garden of Eden claiming humans can rule themselves successfully without God's guidance and God who created us knew that humans weren't created to rule over themselves {Jeremiah 10:23} so from the beginning of that accusation God knew what will end it because humans will continue to rule over their fellow humans dominating them while their subjects are suffering! Ecclesiastes 4:1; 8:9

That's what God meant in that verse!

Can you imagine this pure lie.

According to you "God knew what the challenge of Satan will end with FROM BEGINNING" but to you this doesn't mean ALL KNOWING. Waoooooo!

Ọmọ see how wrong teaching is distorting your reasoning.

MaxInDHouse:
The fact that no Bible translation used any of those three even though they are students of the Bible and have done lots of research shows something is wrong in using those terms.

No, it's not that something is wrong but you being clinical with the truth.

You belief that:

1. Jesus is Michael something you can never produce directly from Bible.

2. Watchtower teaches Theocracy the word you can never found in the Bible.

Yet you lie with bare face that you don't believe whatever that isn't found in the Bible.

Omniscient, Omnipotent & Omnipresent are just words with MEANINGS.

OMNISCIENT = All Knowing! Are you saying God doesn't KNOW ALL THINGS?

OMNIPOTENT = ALL POWERFUL! Are you saying God is not ALL POWERFUL?

OMNIPRESENT = EVERY WHERE! Are you saying God isn't everywhere?

God can see and be anywhere when He choose to

You see why it's evident that you're just a liar and pretending to be wise.

This shows that God HAS THOSE ATTRIBUTES but you just decided to be lying about it.

The @color part shows you don't abide with God's word because the scripture revealed that God KNOWS ALL THINGS, ALMIGHTY (ALL POWERFUL) AND EVERY WHERE.

I know you have problem with Omniscient, Omnipresent, Omnipotent because Watchtower told you to not that you don't see the evidence in the scripture.

but the fact remains that as creatures given freewill Adam and Eve have both agreed to alienate themselves from God and it means a lot to Him so it's only when their descendants decides to be close to God that He too will be close to them {James 4:8} as for those whose heart are complete towards God He is closer to them than they can imagine {2 Chronicles 16:9} but those who aren't His worshipers it's His angels that are moving throughout the earth to report back to Him what they are doing that's why He uttered what we are reading in Genesis 18:20-21.
Out of all those dwelling on planet earth in the days of Abraham the patriarch proved to be outstanding and loyal that is why God chose him as His friend but it was when this man chose to sacrifice His only son that God knew how much Abraham cherish their relationship.
For your information the idea to sacrifice Isaac doesn't come from God as it was revealed to James because God doesn't test anyone with evil things {James 1:13} Satan must have been the one accusing Abraham before God that the patriarch was loyal because God has given him what he wanted! Revelations 12:10 compare to Job 1:9-11
So that statement God uttered is like a response to Satan {Proverbs 27:11} that Abraham is a worthy friend! James 2:23

Thanks for your time!

All these is just your conjecture, the fact remains God:

1. KNOWS ALL THINGS
2. ALL POWERFUL
3. EVERY WHERE.

As supported by the Scripture.

The only question for you is, is God not ALL KNOWING according to the scripture?

AngelahFlo:
I won't quote what I know to be wrong
To do that will be sinking to your level of reasoning. I gave you some instances another brother gave you scriptures backing my claim on the Unlimited nature of God and you said he's writing epistles. I don't have anything to say again. Even the scripture you're quoting is not a proof of God's limitedNess and even IF IT IS It's just one "scripture against many of rhe ones that supports God's Omni attributes. Guy you really shock me!!!

Had it been you pay attention to his first post, you could have caught him pants down.

He quoted Rev 21:6 which says "God knows the end from the beginning"

After this he affirmed in the same post by saying "The truth is that God can see everything and can KNOW EVERYTHING (capitalize by me)"

After reading this from the same person who is claiming that GOD ISN'T OMNISCIENT. You should have asked him, what is the meaning of OMNISCIENT?

He claimed the word OMNISCIENT was never found in Bible but the same Bible says GOD KNOWS ALL THINGS.

Simply ask him what is the meaning of OMNISCIENT and see how he will be dancing around.

The most funny thing about you is this pride in ignorance of you.

MaxInDHouse:
There is no where God claim to be any of these (especially Omniscient - in this case)

What you need to ask yourself is whether God is Omniscient according to what most people say.

This is the question you asked by yourself.

The Bible God told us that He knows the end right from the beginning {Revelations 21:6}

After you asked the above question, you boldly said what God says in the the BIBLE which happened to be that "God knows the end from the beginning"

Omniscient simply means KNOWS ALL THINGS - (knows from end to beginning)?

this led many to conclude that God is Omniscient

If you're not the confusionist here God knowing the end from the beginning means what?

but then they failed to note what He said in the Bible book of Genesis Chapters 18 & 21

You claimed they FAILED but you don't address what it means to "KNOW THE END FROM THE BEGINNING"

This verse proved that the Bible God is not Omniscient nor Omnipresent

According to Rev 21:6, what does it mean that God knows the end from the beginning?

And if He is Omnipresent there is no need going to ascertain what they told Him.

Here you admitted that God HIMSELF went down to Sodomy and Gomarah.

Well, that's a point for another day.

Now how do we reconcile Revelations 21:6 with Genesis 18:20-21?

But you never reconcile the two verses rather you jumped around and play your usual hide and seek game.

To reconcile these verses we need more than just reading but studying and the help of God's Holy Spirit to unravel the sacred secret.

See perambulation instead of reconciling the two verses he is bringing MORE VERSES

The truth is that God can see everything and can KNOW EVERYTHING (capitalize by me)

After all your ramble ramble and how people became Atheist and Agnostic because they were deceived with the word Omniscient and how God isn't OMNISCIENT.

You finally agreed with them that God is actually OMNISCIENT, though trying to play smart by using "CAN"

The scripture claimed GOD KNOWS ALL THINGS and Omniscient means KNOWING ALL THINGS.

Back to this question from you "What you need to ask yourself is whether God is Omniscient according to what most people say."

Well God sent some angels throughout the earth whose wings are full of eyes {Ezekiel 10:12} these are the ones serving as God's eyes {2Chronicles 16:9} they are the ones reporting to Him what humans are doing to one another on this planet! Genesis 18:20-21

Even though, you never addressed the OP but just play words around as usual one thing I can pick from this is that, after God got all the reports, God HIMSELF have to go down and confirm the report, is that right?

FreeIgboho:
You make a good point. Can you please explain the FIRSTBORN part more.

Firstly, FIRSTBORN is different from FIRST CREATED and both words have their root in Greek language.

Secondly, loose meaning of the term FIRSTBORN is just "Number one, Senior, eldest, First in Position"

So to understand the term FIRSTBORN as used by Paul, we need to look at how it was used before him.

For instance, God said in Exodus 4:22 that "Then you will tell him, ‘This is what the Lord says: Israel is my firstborn son" but we all know Esau is the FIRSTBORN. It means God has chosen Israel(Jacob/the Nation of Israel) as HIGHER than Esau/Other Nations.

When Paul said Jesus is the FIRSTBORN of all creatures, Paul was talking about SUPREMACY. That is why Paul went further to say EVERYTHING WAS CREATED THROUGH CHRIST (Col 1:16-17). If ALL THINGS were created through Christ then Christ can't be the FIRST CREATED being. Big reason why Watchtower has to dubiously INSERT the word "OTHER" which was never found in the Greek manuscripts into Col 1:16-17 multiple times to alter it and deceive their members.

Which now read "because by means of him all OTHER things were created in the heavens and on the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All OTHER things have been created through him and for him. Also, he is before all OTHER things, and by means of him all OTHER things were made to exist" - NWT

Remove the word "OTHER" from these verses and see Christ as The Creator.

Born by which mother?
Born how?

The only time Jesus was born by a mother is when He became Human and was born by Mary.

Just like I explained above, Paul saying Jesus is the FIRSTBORN OF ALL CREATION is about SUPREMACY. In fact, without dishonesty and bias view of Col 1:15, Paul himself explained the reason why Jesus is FIRSTBORN (NOTE: Paul also said Jesus is the FIRSTBORN from the death) in verse 18 "...so that he might become the one who is first in all (OTHER) things" - NWT

Notice how the word OTHER is missing here but I have to insert it to show how bias the translator of NWT are.

Boomark:
Please take note of the rules and post only in the discussion thread here.

https://www.nairaland.com/8484151/bible-challenge-prove-trinity-falsehood#136238868

Tags: Arian, FxMasterz,
jimRohn or Kobojunkie , maynman, Dtruthspeaker, Image123, JessicaRabbit, DeepSight, SIRTee15, TheSourcerer, Busybrain2233, Fourthpredator,
bobestman, Lorrayne, HardMirror, Hahn, SlawG, albreezy4eva, Muslim, Dominique, Mrbroke, EnemyofGod2, Wilgrea7, A001, Maynthemayn, achorladey, Jozzy4, MightySparrow, NowYouKnow, TemmyT002, johnw47, Emusan, Gabrielshow24, rottennaija, Janosky, LordReed, DeepSight,
tctrills, Dtruthspeaker, Everyday247, Ruke1990, sonmvayina, MeetDx DrJones109, Jesusjnr2022, Jaephoenix, Knownunknown, BBIA HellVictorinho6, SIXFEETUNDER, OkpaNsukkaisBae, Bacteriologist, FRANCISTOWN, Aemmyjah, 1Sharon, TakeNigeriaBack,
Botragelad, isan,
seun, hopefullandlord, bobestman, Lorrayne, HardMirror, Hahn, SlawG, albreezy4eva, Muslim, Dominique, Mrbroke, EnemyofGod2, kkins25, Wilgrea7, Maynthemayn, Ken4Christ, Steep, Chibuezem. gohf, TenQ, Ohyoudidnt, WeirdAlien, Linaloca7, Explore2xmore, armchairscholar, BIBLESPEAKS,

Do you want me to be a spectator or add my own point?

Anyways, since you're using AI, I love that but with all honesty, can you copy any version of the Holy Scripture of Colossians 1:16-18 into your AI and ask it for explanation of it?

achorladey:
There is no 1900 old faithful and discreet slave

Jehovah and Jesus did not need the no 1900 faithful and discreet slave to prepare the Bible. What is the one reason Jehovah needs them now?

The most astonish part is that the "Faithful and Discreet Slave" is in SINGULAR form not in plural.

The Watchtower knows this as can be seen from their various publications that that illustration of Jesus was about just single SLAVE not SLAVES.

The question to JWs is:

If scripture talks about single SLAVE, how come Watchtower is interpreting it as MULTIPLE SLAVES despite acknowledged that it's just a single SLAVE?

binary123:
I don't know how an airplane ✈️ fly despite such heavy weights.

Simply the principle of "LIFT" which is as result of difference in Air pressure on the wings that generated LIFT through Airfoil.

chimex38:
Hmmm..quite plausible.

So what i picked is that the First and the Last used in Isaiah and Revelation are context based and not literally same meaning. Cuz I know revelation talks more about spirits, the dead, judgement and the likes.

Ok. Thank you.

You didn't see how he purposely ignored the @red-color part because he has to twist the scripture to suit his own agenda.

Only those who don't know the scripture can be swept under a false doctrine.

Can you imagine him saying "So Jesus is here talking about a spirit son of God who once lived for uncountable years in the spirit realms but once died and was raised back to live forever."

Jesus being The FIRST and The Last as Yahweh claimed in Isaiah proved that Jesus is God Almighty but they must twist the scripture because they are never a friend of God's Word.

Else where in Revelation Jesus also called Himself "The Alpha and The Omega" something no CREATURE can ever claim.

If you even do a little online check, you won't be surprised that Watchtower the body that is in charge of doctrine of Jws never gives that verse such explanation the way he's trying to explain that verse. Which makes it obvious that he's contracting the so called body he believes Jesus his directing.

MaxInDHouse:
Argumentator i don't have your time today!

Whether you have time today or not, it won't change the fact that you once claimed on this forum that Charles T Russell isn't a JWs.

So whenever you have the time, tell this forum how a person who isn't a JWs can sit right beside Jesus in heaven.

Also, how Charles T Russell who worshipped Jesus, celebrated birthday, and did many things modern day Watchtower classified as IDOLATRY van be sitting right beside Jesus in heaven.

I re oo

MaxInDHouse:
Charles Taze Russell that's sitting right beside Jesus Christ in heaven.
Ọmọ learn the truth and stop deceiving yourself!

Ahah but you once claimed Charles is not a Jehovah Witness, so how come he can sitting right beside Jesus in heaven.

Also, Charles who worshipped Jesus, celebrated birthday, and did many things the modern Watchtower has classified as IDOLATRY is the one sitting right beside Jesus in heaven.

It means those you called idolaters today will surely sit beside Jesus in heaven as well.

Gabrielshow24:
Well said brother, this is a question that has "plagued" them all. From gohf that used months to avoid it to Janosky among others! They can't give a definition without contradicting their stance!

Also, don't hold him in high intellectual esteem!

That is very true.

Reason you see them randomly jumping from one scripture to another without establishing a point.

I remember when @gohf acknowledged that only God is Alpha and Omega when I then pointed his attention to Revelation where Jesus addressed Himself as Alpha and Omega. His story changed.

Boomark:
Bro I am tired of people telling what they think from their own minds. I use scriptures alone.

If you can't agree to what Jesus said in 2 different scriptures then you have no business saying anything about him.

Go to the question I asked and answered A or B. If you think he is not right, then chose B and state your reasons. Don't dodge the question and come behind to tell me what you think because you are afraid.

I can see, you can't openly declare your stand if Jesus is a FALSE GOD or not.

I answered your questions but you dodged mine.
We're saying the same thing.

Do you agree with Jesus on this or is this my own word?

"so that everyone will honor the Son, just as they honor the Father. Anyone who does not honor the Son is certainly not honoring the Father who sent him." - John 5:23

And my question still remains, what makes God to be God?

Boomark:
Indirectly you are saying that what Jesus said is useless because of the context you manufactured.

Anytime I read something like this, I'll just laugh because the same you who accused people of ignoring Jesus statement is also doing the same thing.

You don't even understand the few scriptures you posted and you are talking about reading the whole bible.

He doesn't understand it.

Then who understands those scriptures?

Show me the context that shows that what Jesus said is useless. Focus on the key points

1. The Father is the ONLY TRUE God. John 17:3

2. The Father IS HIS God. Rev 3:12

You think these are points that refute Jesus being God but I tell you, they are not at all.

Why?

No one will deny that Jesus was on earth to teach man about God.

So, Jesus on earth calling The Father ONLY TRUE GOD or said The Father is His God is a way of teaching us how to relate with God.

I'm very sure you won't be able to answer this simple question.

If The Father is the ONLY TRUE GOD and the scripture says Jesus is God, does that mean Jesus is a FALSE GOD?

Show us scriptures that nullify his words.

Many scriptures are but take this.

John 5:23 "so that everyone will honor the Son, just as they honor the Father. Anyone who does not honor the Son is certainly not honoring the Father who sent him."

Whatever you are showing should be able to tell us that the Father is NOT the only true God. That the Father is NOT his God. Any other thing outside this will be off point and off context.

What make God to be God?